No, see, you don't get it. A Ranger using Hunter's Mark is focusing really hard on their target, so the spell being concentration is in fact really flavorful. HM wouldn't be as fun to cast if it wasn't locking you out of all your other cool(er) stuff Yes, this is sarcasm
It's fine, the Sorcerer who has a bloodline connection to dragons can't use dragon magic themselves, they just summon a dinky little phantom dragon. Meanwhile Drakewarden Rangers get a Large, ridable dragon that becomes their Charizard best friend. It's balanced. (I hate the new Draconic Sorcerer.)
unless i have new players, or its a specific module, always start at level 3, the discrepancy between classes between 1-3 is ridiculous, a Cleric gets 4 or 5 features at level 1 and a fighter gets 2 and one of them is a one-time fighting style selection. Honestly the new subclasses at 3 really balances out the early game a bit more, its still not good because you wizard can be one shot to instantly dead by a goblin arrow but at least the features are spread out more evenly.
Im pretty sure i read somewhere thats their design ethos and they will touch on it in the new dmg; LVL 1-2 if for brand new players to get to grips with the game experienced players should ideally start at level 3
@@GrimHeaperTheOther Parties High Perception, + Infinite chances to Dispel (Not counter, they legit never said Counterspell in their Comment, just Dispel which you can do on A Glyph you can see)
I get why Wizard didn't get anything crazy with the new changes because they were really strong already, but I think that what you could do as DM's is offer to work with your Wizards to make their own spell around tier 2 or 3. It might just be me, but part of my ideal fantasy for the Wizard in DnD is stamping my magical mark on history thanks to the knowledge I've gained, and adding a spell to the world like other notable magea such as Tasha & Mordenkainen just makes sense to me.
@@Perukids123 my guess is they dont want to force people to be creative. Making the game more "casual friendly" by trying to keep stuff simple. More experienced or dedicated players and DMs usually bend, add or remove rules and features to their liking anyway.
@@alpgnr7690oh no, the horrors! Being creative in my play pretend fantasy game with dragons and wizards that I have to imagine in my head! How ever will I play my imaginary play pretend fantasy game if i have to be creative??
they didn't even bother to read the spell description, no offense to them but it seems like most people reading the changes are looking for reasons to complain first
@@verdurite tbch see invisibility seems like it would be pretty self explanatory tho, so you can only blame them so much. its not them looking for things to be upset about
Imagine being hooked up to your buddy with Telepathic Speech and you just hear them start screaming as they get assassinated or beat to death or something and then just hear “well, shit. now what? Oh, wait, you can still hear me? Uh”
lmao. i do think the purpose is so that if you get brought back up after being knocked the connection is still there and you dont have to use the feature again
@@Lazyturtle1501I wonder if they made the same change with magic item attunement and other things that stop working when you die. I bet nobody ever remembered about these whenever their character gets killed and revived on the next turn.
>Become wild magic sorceror >Take mage hand and subtle spell metamagic >Use Bend Luck and turn into a potted plant >Subtle spell Mage Hand and terrify the shopkeeper into thinking his shop is haunted >Clean out the shop after he runs out screaming
@@felixhepworth1296 subtle spell removes the verbal and somatic components of a spell. So a literal plant or a cripple with no arms can cast spells lol
Needing to cast Identify to understand another wizard's spellbook makes sense, try reading most peoples notes. You will wish you had a spell for that...
22:52 this one joke has cemented in my mind that I should allow the answers to just be simple, short answers instead of 'yes, no, or maybe' because if a player at my table ever asks if they can have cake for dinner you bet that their patron will respond with "share"
@@hearforthemusic9814 I have it on good authority that the wizards have exclusive access to the most powerful spells in the game. So they probably will be the most powerful class with good spell selection.
What's funniest about the ranger is Crawford recently admitted in the dungeon dudes interview ranger was tied with monk for his favorite class redesigns. I'm thinking that's NOT gunna age well.
"You're not just a pretty face" is absolutely hilarious and (from personal experience) one of the most entertaining phrases to say to a significant other who is smarter than you and will always get the shoulder (or in this case leg) punch
To be fair for the wild magic surge being a 20, they said in the video thing that the wild magic table will be more positive now as well as bigger so hopefully that comes through
@@harrietr.5073 spores druid is probably one of my top favorite classes. I just hate that it's so hard to use effectively, though I'm currently loving my spores druid/monk in bg3 XD
"They didn't buff Necromancy?" I felt that disappointment. Especially when the Wizard video came out and it wasn't one of the 4 subclasses to make the cut when it really needed some buffs.
One of the (imo) major things the warlock article seemingly failed to mention is that the spells from your expanded spell list are automatically unlocked when you reach the prerequisite level, and always count as prepared.
Mechanically the way I thought about this, was most veteran players I know start at level 3. Well newer players start at level one. For new players it's hard to role-play and lock in to a personality that early so waiting to level 3 to lock in I think it's kind of cool
Its definitely not as satisfying. Like I am fine reflavoring stuff and pretending I already have my subclass. I just would rather actually have it and have it be actionable. I mean what if the DM is by the books? What if they don't yet know how to handle that kind of stuff? Having it at lv1 just keeps you from those messes. The abilities are what should be at 3. The flavor should always be where it needs to be. In this case 1.
@@MeriliremOk but counter point from a DM point of view. I'm in the mind or Kadrack the Flayer. Some random asks for some of my power. Why should I trust you with it? Earn it. I'll slowly drip feed you more power (leveling up) as you prove yourself to me. In the hands of a bad or inexperienced DM anything can be bad or mishandled. Honestly I like that all classes get their subclass at the same level but I think it should be level 2.
@@Not_An_EVcounter counter point: most if not all subclasses should be at level 1 for convenience sake and for backstory sake, and it just makes sense for most of the classes. Warlock gets the ability to use magic from a patron that could come from any plane so naturally that power is different from other Warlock’s, why should we get the generic Starter Pack™️ for the first two levels? Paladins get their power from their Oaths, why do they get magic before swearing one at level 3?
@@EnjoyerOfCats7 yeah true. I'm just biased because the way I run things level 1 is always your backstory. The lowest level I ever start my players is 2.
@@Not_An_EV oh I see, no harm in that obviously. Just a personal peeve of mine that WotC thinks this os the best way to do subclasses. Not to mention the plethora of just generally bad changes in the ‘new’ PHB
"the most important guide to the changes is Tasha's, a book that i already own" and she, in a sentence, summed up the whole issue with these new rules. with a few notable exceptions its just Tasha's but worse
Crawford said recently that if you use an older subclass that wasn’t revised, you still unlock the subclass at level 3, you just would unlock any features it got at lvl 1 or 2 simultaneously when you take the subclass at level 3. Not really any necessary homebrewing there
Agreed. The text in the new book is something along the lines of "when you get this feature you gain all features of your chosen subclass UP TO this level." So if yer using an older subclass that was not updated you get the same subclass features, just at the new subclass levels.
@@catalyst9953Because if most of the campaign is spent under level 3, you don't get to play your subclass. At all. In a level 1-5 campaign, wizards kind of rely on getting their flavoring early. Because they're toothpicks. They can't afford to wait like the other classes do. A level 1-5 campaign is unplayable for a wizard under these circumstances.
WotC really needs to introduce a "produce the effect of X spell" instead of "you can cast this spell without using components" as it is arguable worse casting a spell with the no 2 spells a turn rule. Like the diviner subclass. Oh cool I can cast see invisibility as a bonus action now I can only cast cantrips.
@@ltcaphide I mean it's not spell like ability, you just produce the effect of the spell without mechanically casting it. Like the 4 elements monk, you aren't using the weave to cast, i don't know, fireball. You are using your ki, converting your life energy into an explosion. Or shadow monk's darkness or whatever. "Shadow Arts You can use your ki to duplicate the effects of certain spells" DUPLICATE the effects. Making it so you mechanically cast said spells makes them prone to anti-magic abilities such as counter-spell.
@@matth2283and people were fighting over "If it's just the duplicate you can't counterspell it" and "that's an effect of the spell and is magic, i can counterspell it" And also isn't that no 2 spells per turn rule was revised or something, i'm not really sure, i don't remember
So if you read the See Invisibility spell it basically includes the effects of ethereal sight. So now instead of a Diviner having to choose between seeing the invisible or seeing the ethereal you can just see both at once by casting the spell (which you can do without expending a spell slot).
30:00 one thing you missed about twin spell is that they also seemingly made it so that twin spell is always only one sorcery point, rather than a number of sorcery points equal to the level of the spell. That's huge, because before you might twin-spell finger of death for 7 sorcery points, but now you can twin-spell it for 1 sorcery point--a pretty massive saving. If meta-magic adept exists in the 2014 handbook and is largely unchanged then it is now a must-have for 90% of spellcasters because I think this means you could twin-spell something like power word kill for 1 sorcery point. Wild stuff
This is not how the new Twinned Spell option works. I don't blame you for misunderstanding, because the wording here is utterly psychotic and took me several minutes to be sure about. I had the same reaction to the sorcery point cost when I thought what you did. New Twinned Spell can't apply to every single-target spell anymore. It only applies to the single-target spells that have an upcast option to become multi-target, like Fly and Banishment. Spells like Polymorph and Finger of Death have no upcast multi-target effect, so can't be Twinned. Twinned Spell is now a cheaper way to upcast some spells to affect two creatures instead of one. Way cheaper and less powerful than the original. I'm guessing it was an attempt to wrangle back the meta of dumping half your sorcery points to Twin very powerful spells like Polymorph or Disintegrate (or yes, Finger of Death) in combat. I'm willing to bet that especially with all the new ways Sorcery Points are easier to preserve and recharge, there was just no cost that could keep the old high-cost-high-reward Twin mechanic balanced with the rest of the game. As with a lot of things in OneDnD, it looks like it's been smoothed over, normalized to fit in uniformly with all the other options. EDIT: And while I do have a lot of criticisms of the design philosophy of making everything smooth and uniform, and a lot of criticisms of OneDnD, I do want to say that I understand this decision as a game designer. The synergy that 5e's Twinned Spell has with so many spells can be kind of impossible to manage. You can't do anything to tweak the Sorcery Point economy without considering the knock-on effects of how much more a sorcerer could do with Twinned Spell, which also requires you to look at EVERY single-target spell, and their power levels at different levels of play and in different hands, which is a LOT. Designing anything in 5e that interacts with spells is really time- and energy-intensive, because there are a LOT to look through and hold in your head. It's a huge constraint on designing new single-target spells, because you are forced to consider their balance not just on their own terms, and not just in combination with all other spells, but also when Twinned. Now, Twinning only works on those spells which are explicitly designed to still be balanced when affecting 2 targets. It solves a LOT of design headaches and allows you to breathe easier about designing a spell that would be way too OP if it could affect two creatures, because you can just decide that under no circumstances will it do that.
@clockwork_mind ah, OK that makes more sense to me. Otherwise that would be super broken. Hate that wording tho now as it makes twin spell seem like an obvious go-to
Defently. Makes a lot of sense from a thematic stand point (most features are that you are bocmming more like a dragon) and mechincal (the class isnt really that much about summining so a self buff would fit more).
ive been saying this for years, and if they wanna balance it just give the form its own unique statblock, i dont wanna be some draconic spirit medium i want to become a dragon(we all might just be kobolds at this point). Thats the one thing i like about pathfinder, you can polymorph into a dragon later levels
@@viktorhermansson2284 exactly we already get draconic scales that protect us and late get draconic wings. To be honest i wouldnt mind having both as some people might want to play a draconic medium of sorts. But i want to be a dragon so bad, my favorite race already is dragonborn. They could give us the ability to cast true polymorph to only turn into dragons
I know the subclass moving is contentious but I like the standardized of subclasses. I hated it at first as a knee jerk reaction but It helps with balancing the classes against each other and helps mitigate balance altering dips. It also means subclass feature can be stronger and more of a central focus because you don’t have to worry about how they’ll affect balance when everyone has 8 hit points and the hitting power of marshmallows, or what it looks like slapped onto another build as a multiclass. Just because you don’t get subclass features until 3 doesn’t mean you didn’t have a patron for two levels - it just means that patron didn’t give you gifts that were specifically themed around them. You still made a deal with a devil or fae or whatever, it just doesn’t look that different from other warlocks until you gain more of their power. Eldritch blast also has always had this problem (that being why does it look the same despite different patrons providing it) but if we can handwave that we can also handwave the subclass moving up as well in my opinion.
I have an opinion about wizards and I will stand with it until the day I die: they should have combined 2 schools of magic if they're only doing 4 subclasses. For example: Abjuration and Evocation - That's a war mage. Conjuration and Necromancy - A summoner. Enchantment and Transmutation - Something about manipulating objects. Illusion and Divination - Nerd wizard(I don't have a good reason for this one they were just the only 2 left over). Thank you for coming to my ted talk
I think you could swap Transmutation and Illusion. Enchantment and Illusion could be your charismatic types while Transmutation and Divination could easily be combined with religious or noble connotations. Granted I'm a relatively new player so maybe that doesn't work well for stat reasons or another reason I'm unaware of.
@fuzzydude64 that works, the main two that started my idea were abjuration and evocation, and Conjuration and necromancy but there are many different combinations you could make for a multitude of different reasons
I feel like Necromancy has enough potential to be its own thing. Even looking at their spells only a handful of them were raising the dead. Some for sure can be merged but not all.
I really like the changes to Sorcerer and Warlock, but I loath that they are getting rid of Malleable Illusions from the Illusionist. That one offered so many cool interactions with all the illusion spells, especially Mirage Arcane.
I absolutely DESPISE the trend of new class features being "We've removed the fun class feature, and changed it so you just get extra spells prepared that kinda have the same effect."
I haven't played many spellcasters and the ones I did didn't get very high in level, what fun abilities did they remove? The overall opinion I've seen of all 3 classes has been great
@@GrimViridian The biggest one would be removing most of ranger's unique abilities and the just replacing them with more spells and the ability to not accidentally lose concentration on hunter's mark (this one is late enough to not really be useful, also). Hooray, you can be a shittier rogue that has to pre-pick who you have the ability to sneak attack.
@@Wiseman89 well that's just ranger I already knew that but he made it sound like a lot more than one class so I was curious, the only problems I know of are ranger as a whole and paladins smite which is an easy homebrew fix
I can't believe they thought "Goodberry" was a valuable replacement for literally any class feature from 5e. Try telling any Bard to stop using Cutting Words and instead cast Dissonant Whispers.
8:13 the reason why the Ethereal vision was removed is because See Invisibility just lets you see into the Ethereal Plane full stop, so otherwise it would be a bit of a wasted ability. Also, Wizards didn't have a single base class feature between levels 2 and 18 in 5e to begin with, so it's not like this is a new thing, most of their versatility comes from subclass and spell choice.
A capstone saying "is taken to new heights" is what ChatGPT spits out whenever you let it make a subclass for you. How much of the new stuff was actually designed by the team and how much was copied without a second thought? If there is a "you become an avatar of-" sentence, then it's more than just a coincidence
I like the idea that your warlock patron is a secret at first. Like your warlock had no idea what they were getting into at first, only to find out once they've already accomplished several feats that would've been impossible for them without the patron. Also paladins and bards can't just dip one level into warlock to get a weapon that uses their charisma modifier.
If it's like the Playtest, level one dip still works for charisma weapon. Pact of the Blade can be gotten at level 1 and was giving the Charisma buff. I doubt you will see it though. If they didn't change true strike from Playtest you can just get magic initiate as your origin feat and pick up either Shillelagh or True Strike and make attacks with weapons with whatever mental stat you want.
Warlock subclasses beyond level 1 is insane. "You know, after we just finished killing that band of goblins, I suddenly remember that time a couple weeks ago I SIGNED MY SOUL OVER TO THE DEVIL in exchange for these crazy magical powers I suddenly have. Can't believe that had completely slipped my mind until just now." Wizard makes more sense to me though, as it's not unusual to not settle on your college major until you've been there for a year or two.
If you just flavour it as knowing your patron, but you have to show competence before they offer you their juicy stuff exclusive to them after a probationary sign up period, it still works.
I think its pretty easy to just have it be your patron doesn't give you exclusive benefits until 3rd level. That very well could be what the flavor text for Warlock says in the book, we just don't know yet.
A warlock doesn't need a single powerful patron from the start. They could be an occultist making dealings with minor spirits to gain slivers of power.
I see it as a, “Youse wanna make a deal with the boss? Youse gotta make a deal with ME first.” kind of thing. You get minor powers from a minion for the first couple of levels, then the good stuff from your patron once you prove yourself worthy.
Does it genuinely make less sense then the monk randomly remembering their monastic tradition or the rogue that they have psychic abilities. The classes that get their sub classes at level 3 already needed you to build towards them starting from level 1 most of the time. The change is mostly for new players and retconing something for the sake of easy for a new player is pretty common anyway. Know plenty of DMs that just allowed you to change a characters entire class if you don't like it.
WotC: Sorcerers now prepare spells like everyone else Me: Oh cool, we can swap out our spells on long rest? WotC: No, only on level up Me: Oh, so the change is that we can change the whole list on level-up? WotC: No Me: Then... what changed? WotC: Nomenclature
Every caster is prepared, meaning you can have more known spells than you have active. While previously, a sorcerer could know a small bunch of spells to have at one time, now, a sorcerer can have a much bigger list of spells they know OF, and then pick out from that list what spells they are packing for that day. You get access to more total spells, but have to pick which you're carrying with you each day.
@@milokurain7293 thats not at all what it means. its literally just a nomenclature change. instead of sorcerer's having "known spells" they have "prepared spells" but it functions the same as the known spells system.
@@sillyking1991 Yes, replying to a 2 month old comment about the new release, you are correct that it's just a nomenclature change. Thanks so much for the clarification
The Illusionist being able to conjure illusionary animals and fey is a callback to some spells that illusionists had back when they were their own class. Back then they didn’t really get combat spells at low level except for things like Phantasmal Force, but once they had access to higher level spells (I think 4th or 5th) they could cast illusions that replicated the effects of non-illusion spells like fireball, lightning bolt, and summoning spells.
One thing I've said about the "all subclasses at level 3" in regards to things like Paladin and Warlock: You can consider the first two levels as the "trial package" from your respective deity or patron, and at level 3 you start getting into the meat of what they offer compared to the other deities/patrons. It isn't that your character doesn't know who they are following for the first two levels, it's just that they're making sure you can walk before you can run.
I think that works a lot better for warlocks, but not really for paladins. Since paladins don’t require a deity, I feel like they should absolutely know which oath they took since that’s where there power comes from.
Which is why they should get the subclass at 1. They know, they already chose. You do not need the powerful abilities to be tied to the flavor of having a subclass. You need the flavor at level 1 so you can play at those levels. Then at level 3 you can gain the powers after you prove yourself.
Ok, I don't think I made my point clear in the first post. Your character, at level 1, *knows* what Oath they have, what Patron, what class of Wizard, etc. You would roleplay exactly the same as you would now. The only thing that changes is when subclass specific things come online at level 3. I don't understand why people think your character just has unexplained magic for two levels and they're just wondering "How the heck am I casting these spells?" It's the same with classes that traditionally get their subclass at 3 like, say, Monk. It's not like you're just doing exercise and parkour for 2 levels and then at level 3 you're like "Hey, I'm going to join this temple specifically to learn their ways." No, you've trained a certain style since the start, it's just that the first two levels are the basics that *every* monastic tradition builds off of.
I think warlocks getting their subclass at level 3 actually makes sense. Like you need to build up to channeling the specific power of your patron instead of general power. You can actually have a cool RP moment where the patron gives extra power to the warlock.
For the lvl 3 warlock thing the only way i see it being useful is if you wanna rp that you haven't been given your patron's "full power" but I was really hoping they would do away with subclasses at lvl 3 and instead go for lvl 1 but instead they're hammering down on lvl 3.
33:20 rant was on point. I don't understand how paladin and ranger were slaughtered while sorcerer got way more spells, super state, ability to change more spells and a bloody dragon xD
I didn't even want the Dragon. That's a Drakewarden thing isn't it? Give it to the ranger and let me borrow wildshape from the druid to turn into a dragon instead! Playing a Draconic Sorcerer is about BEING a dragon. You have draconic power in your veins! I want to become a dragon. Let the Ranger have a Dragon Pet.
Does it? Because that's not how it reads. It says the level 20 version is just an improved version of this same ability... which would replace the lower version, not be added.
@@nessa-parmentier Its a cool rage equivalent to be sure. I just got focused in on the Draconic Sorcerer not getting a Draconic Wildshape. If I wanted a pet dragon I would play a Drakewarden.
@@Merilirem been saying it for years, like our cousins the kobolds most of us dont want to be draconic mediums, we want to become dragons ourselves. If you dont want it to be broken just make a custom statblock for it and voila.
Regarding the Diviner Subclass, unless they changed how the spell works, keep in mind that See Invisibility also gives Ethereal Sight. Thus, you get both for the prize of one.
"i feel like that's just the nature of a sorcerer" and you'd be wrong! the point of the sorcerer in D&D was always explicitly to not require players to reprep spells constantly.
"It does seem like they're making, overall, like, level 20 powerful...but you're not, like, god." -right after talking about a feature called Arcane Apotheosis. Definition of Apotheosis: the highest point in the development of something; culmination or climax; the elevation of someone to divine status; deification. 😄
I can explain something! The thing is tha you CAN use old sublclasses with new classes. They way the game manages this is that in the new class lets say you get your class feature at level 3, 11 and 17 (just an example). What happens is that when you hit lvl 3, you gain EVERY feature that you would have up to that level in the old sublcass. The same goes for level 11. If an old sublasses gained feature at level 3, 6, 9, and 14, when you hit lvl 11 in the NEW class you would get every feature up to that point (so the level 3 that you already had at lvl 3, and you get the features of level 6 and 9). At level 17 you would have every feature that you can get up to level 17 of the new class. I hope that I managed to explain it well
This is coming from someone who's favorite class is the wizard. New Sorcerer and Warlock are amazing! However, Wizard is still equally amazing, they didn't need much and what they got was good. (Though I would love for them to give Wizards a better capstone). I actually quite like that there is now a proper decision between these 3 instead of just Wizard best. Honestly, pretty much every class looks amazing (except maybe the ranger, but until we see the actual book I'm not 100% discounting them yet).
Paladin feels like a lateral move at best and a step backwards at worse, which is wild if you’ve had ten years of feedback on what people want from a class and you somehow either accomplished nothing/actively made it worse.
@@roguebarbarian9133Probably, but I'm reserving judgment until we get more details about how smite works. In any case, the worsening of their action economy, especially when every other class is getting more flexible, is discouraging.
@@jeffreymonsell659 I just don't like how it feels for the SMITE to become a spell. It felt like you channeled raw power before. Now it feels like your casting a spell on your hammer.
@@jeffreymonsell659I disagree with the action economy being worse. The only one that's worse is smite, but everything else is the same/better. Devotion and Vengeance had their abilities made into free actions, and lay on hands is a bonus action now. Smite spells now only require the bonus action cast on a hit, so no wasting those anymore either.
Warlock getting the subclass on lvl 3 makes nice storytelling. On lvl 1 you have a bond with your deity but it doesnt communicate with you. On lvl 3 you get a visit from said deity that rewards you with new skills (Subclass) for doing the things you are doing, whatever that may be ^^ I do like everyone getting subclasses at 3, because of that no one at the table feels left out or thinks he's special anymore. I believe that change isnt for balancing but instead more for the social aspect at the table ^^ Edit: Especially if you dont play in a private group but instead at your local game stores with random people, ego is a huge factor when having the need to feel stronger than everyone else at the table. Everyone getting it lvl 3 fixes that egoistic players minds ^^
@@ArceusShaymin You have a point there, if the story of the campaign or you maybe play a one-shot allows it then you can have a subclass on lvl 1. However,I would say the journey to lvl 3 is part of the story of the campaign you play. What you experience in the story might change wich subclass you want to go. If u start as an assasin rogue then the whole party completely misses to experience how you have become one, together with you. I would say either start lvl 1 without subclasses or you start on lvl 3 with them ^^
That isn't how those classes work is the problem. Warlocks don't have Deities for one. They make contracts, deals. You don't just get given stuff or form a vague bond. You make a pact with a specific being. Just like how Sorcerers are born with the power of a dragon in their veins. Its part of the backstory of the character.
@@Merilirem In wich case cant the pact get stronger on lvl 3 wich enables your subclass? ^^ Its a fantasy story not a lawyers book, dont be strict to everything if not necessary ^^ Edit: I know its cringe but take Wyll for example, do stuff for your deity and get rewards, aka lvl 3 ^^
@@ArceusShayminthe designers have said multiple times levels 1 and 2 are designed for introductory play, so you shouldn't get giant character defining options before you even know how to play.
See Invisibility spell lets you see BOTH invisible creatures and the Ethereal plane, so if anything now you can do both instead of having to pick one, it is an upgrade (we all just paranoid of features being replaced by spell=bad) Edit: I'm NOT defending that replacing all features with "you can cast X without consuming a spell-slots now" is a good design choice (frankly is a thing I HATE since it forces me to read the spell list and go back to the class page to figure out what that meant) all I'm saying is that n THIS particular case we didn't got screwed as seeing BOTH invisible & ethereal beings is a straight upgrade.
@@chrismanuel9768 what? We have class specific spell lists, we obviously retain "uniqueness". Paladins are the only ones that get access to Paladin spells.
divination wizards don't need more spells they already have portent. :P Edit: Also you gave it some flack, but subclass at level 3 for the warlock makes sense to me. Think of Lovecraft, you study the occult, you learn rituals and incantations, you grow in power, steal the necronomocon or whatever, and THEN once you know what you're doing you make contact with a specific entity and bargain / bind them into a contract. The way you do it, its almost an accident. 18 year old pig farmer with no magical interest or experience trips, scrapes their knee, and suddenly asmodeus is on a first name basis with them, and helping them cheat on their final exams. You gotta be interesting enough to draw the attention of your patron to begin with.
@@mayflower2765 The same way a fighter with Arcane Initiate does. They don't have a spell book, or a draconic bloodline, or a demon pact, so it's just however you imagine it to be.
I figured it was more like "trips into sharp equipment, calls for help as they're bleeding out, and gets offered a deal by Bobbicus, 400th son of Mephistopheles and 563rd in his favor, who then proceeds to act as an intercessory on the Harbinger of Beguiling Light's behalf."
Okay, I really don't mind the lack of changes to wizard. They were already just about the most powerful and versatile classes in the entire game. If it ain't broke, dont fix it.
Flavor-wise, I could see the the warlock subclass at level 3 play out like the patron is subtly helping the warlock at first, getting them used to relying on their power without them realizing it before finally approaching them and making the offer to formalize the pact for more power, at a cost
I love the new sorcerer, my only complain (besides the subclass on level 3) is that I'd prefer the draconic sorcerer to BECOME a dragon instead of summoning one
The removal of Ethereal Sight makes sense, since See Invisibility lets you see into the ethereal plane anyway. Unless the spell has been changed in the new version, for some reason.
I have a hunch that the remaining schools of magic for Wizard are going to come in a separate sourcebook as an "expansion". With how companies have been operating recently, they probably leave out some content on purpose so they can release it later with a hefty price tag on it. (Wrote the comment before finishing the video; Jacob does briefly mentions it at the very end.)
personally I dislike the Contact Patron feature cause it's so late, and it gives this vibe that you're not meant to really have much contact with your patron prior to that level, which is *rough* for a lot of campaigns (or just, subclasses, even) that want to run with a more actively involved patron that you talk to on the regular. I feel like it'd be more interesting if it was like Cleric's Divine Intervention where your patron can help you out more directly once every so often. That's really the only complaint I have about the Warlock changes though, aside from Subclass being level 3 ofc
Something I have wanted for illusionist wizard is the ability to make any of your illusions function like Phantasmal Force. I just think it'd be pretty neat to do the "The illusions are kinda real" like that, would be fun to describe and flavour, for sure.
Lots of cool updates, but I agree with the subclass level changes. especially for like sorcerer and warlock. It made so much sense that it was a level 1 choice, it was the crux of your classes flavor. It makes no sense to push it to 3, and make me really apprehensive to even want to try this new version. Sure we can start at level 3, but I don't always want to play dnd like that.
Thank you spencer for explaining it better for dum dums like me. Saves the constant head scritches from trying to understand some of the more complex or lengthy written ones.
I kinda think of Warlocks and sorcerors getting their subclass later in this way. Warlocks are already communicating with their patron, but have yet to Prove themselves worthy of a proper contract, level 3 is when they reach this worthiness. Sorcerors don't know what their blood is until level 3, as until then they are simply magically gifted and have yet to awaken the true powers of their bloodline
Wizards get SO MANY MORE SPELLS NOW I love it. My current wizard is a scribes and his whole deal is learning a lot of spells. I'd love to play that subclass with the new base wizard 🤘
I can't believe it... Has the day actually come? The day of the Wizard's reckoning, and the Warlock's rise? Suddenly, i feel a cold draft coming from... The ground...?
From level 2 to level 10 the Warlock gets 2 spell slots... so half rounded up would be 1, and from level 11 up the end result would be 2 (because half of 3 is 1.5, rounded up is 2).
honestly i think personally the worst part about sorcerer and warlock getting their subclass at level 3 is that there is now much more limited storytelling potential in picking up a multiclass level in one of them. I can no longer say that after a tough journey through the hells my rouge made a deal with a devil to serve in exchange for safe passage out as when i take the warlock level it will be literally no different than if my rogue mad a deal with a celestial or a fey or a fucking outer god literally anything could be my patron and it would only show different after potentially months if not years of game time depending on how long the next 2 levels take. it just removes a bunch of ways to tell stories with the classes as now they provide no immediate uniqueness and require significant and slow investment for the story beat to not fall flat - you can no longer have a sudden event that reveals a wild magic bloodline it now has to be an extremely slow reveal for the next 3 levels before you can actually say you have wild magic. idk if any of this is coherent i just wanted to put my thoughts in
This bullshit is exactly why they moved it to 3. Paladins with one level of Warlock has been an obnoxious powergamer move for a decade. Now you have to commit to the bit instead of just losing a mediocre capstone.
Warlock under stress signs contract in the heat of the moment and has to (insert backstory/RP) to find out who their patron is, what their vested interest is, and how to adjust their contract?
So in an interview with Jeremy Crawford, he did address some of the upset about the ranger. I don't know if it's gonna help but he did say they changed a lot of the concentration aspects of ranger spells (meaning they took quite a few concentration requirements away from ranger spells). I don't know if that helps. We'll see how the 2024 ranger is come September. I'm still not optimistic for the ranger though.
Illusion wizard with BA minor illusion is bonkers. You can obscure yourself or an ally every turn, drastically reducing the chance of being hit up to outright denying some spells and abilities, as they rely on sight. Oh and I get why subclasses are collectively moved to lvl 3 but I would prefer to have all at lvl 1 instead. It just makes more sense or is at least not nonsensical. In regards to balance I suggest basically a split table of benefits. First half is what everyone gets with 1 lvl in the class and second half is what you only get if you start with this class.
It's strange to me that WoTC seems to be putting so much energy into babying the player base and adamantly refusing to let anything become slightly unbalanced. It's 2024 can't we have fun with base D&D yet? Who cares if it's "too powerful" too powerful for what?! What's overpowered in a game with no PvP?!
I think they could've split the subclass features for classes like warlock, cleric, and paladin so that they choose the subclass at lvl 1 but only get a small boon and then they get the rest at lvl 3. Then again, I guess what they mean by "in line with other classes" is that they don't have an additional choice at lvl 1.
ok but it still doesn't make any sense. Why would a lvl 2 celestial warlock and a lvl 2 Fiend warlock work the same when they're being fuelled by distinctly different types of magic. It takes away the flavor and besides, getting your subclass at lvl 3 feels terrible anyway, all subclasses should be level 1 period
@@dokchampa9324 Because it’s game mechanics. You aren’t strong enough to use your patron’s abilities until level 3, there’s lots of ways you can explain it
@@DeathandBeeZ Because it’s easier for newer players to play if they don’t have to worry about subclass features. If you know the game well, it’s suggested to just start at level 3
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you really have gotten that low...?
@@amethysttheotter5943 But spyware pays well.
i dislike sorcerers being able to say, "Im a evocation wizard now."
really cool how Daconic Sorcery can summon a Dragon without concentration, but ranger can't have a target
No, see, you don't get it. A Ranger using Hunter's Mark is focusing really hard on their target, so the spell being concentration is in fact really flavorful. HM wouldn't be as fun to cast if it wasn't locking you out of all your other cool(er) stuff
Yes, this is sarcasm
It's fine, the Sorcerer who has a bloodline connection to dragons can't use dragon magic themselves, they just summon a dinky little phantom dragon. Meanwhile Drakewarden Rangers get a Large, ridable dragon that becomes their Charizard best friend. It's balanced.
(I hate the new Draconic Sorcerer.)
This cracked me up.
I read this as Baconic Sorcery and got really excited about Summon Bacon for a moment. Alas, maybe one day...
@@JacksonJinn Except Summon Draconic Spirit is getting reworked into Summon Dragon like the article they just read said.
I get the vibe that this couple is just the same person at different decibels
I got the impression Jacob was going for funny cringe at the end, but I just found it disgustingly cute.
@@MrSourFappleit’s just super cute flirting
@@MrSourFapple I loved it so much, they're cute as heck
Really? I always get the feeling they are super different from each other but agree on a lot of the same things 😄
we're slowly merging into our final form
Gonna have to rebrand the channel to "Just Start at Level 3"
unless i have new players, or its a specific module, always start at level 3, the discrepancy between classes between 1-3 is ridiculous, a Cleric gets 4 or 5 features at level 1 and a fighter gets 2 and one of them is a one-time fighting style selection. Honestly the new subclasses at 3 really balances out the early game a bit more, its still not good because you wizard can be one shot to instantly dead by a goblin arrow but at least the features are spread out more evenly.
Im pretty sure i read somewhere thats their design ethos and they will touch on it in the new dmg; LVL 1-2 if for brand new players to get to grips with the game experienced players should ideally start at level 3
I mean, i think the joke already was that almost noone goes to level 3 using xp
Woah, seeing your profile pic+name brought back a lot of memories. Fossil Fighters was such a good game!
9th level Glyph of Warding: *exists*
Abjurer Wizard with infinite Dispel Magic attempts: "No."
Glyph? You can't easily see it and it's impossible to counterspell. Still rather problematic since you need to roll investigation.
I cast "Nope" on 9th level infinity times.
@@GrimHeaperTheOther Parties High Perception, + Infinite chances to Dispel (Not counter, they legit never said Counterspell in their Comment, just Dispel which you can do on A Glyph you can see)
Add "if someone fails to dispel it" to the triggers.
@@auroradragen5920 Perception doesn't work.
I get why Wizard didn't get anything crazy with the new changes because they were really strong already, but I think that what you could do as DM's is offer to work with your Wizards to make their own spell around tier 2 or 3. It might just be me, but part of my ideal fantasy for the Wizard in DnD is stamping my magical mark on history thanks to the knowledge I've gained, and adding a spell to the world like other notable magea such as Tasha & Mordenkainen just makes sense to me.
yeah, they had that as a thing in the playtests and I really liked it, but I guess other people didn't? made me sad
@@Perukids123 my guess is they dont want to force people to be creative. Making the game more "casual friendly" by trying to keep stuff simple. More experienced or dedicated players and DMs usually bend, add or remove rules and features to their liking anyway.
@@alpgnr7690oh no, the horrors! Being creative in my play pretend fantasy game with dragons and wizards that I have to imagine in my head! How ever will I play my imaginary play pretend fantasy game if i have to be creative??
@@Perukids123Where can those play tests be found? That sounds really interesting.
I know it's a typo but I really like the word magæ as a plural form of mage
Note for the see invisibility spell, you can already see into the ethereal plane with the spell. That’s why removing ethereal sight makes sense.
Came to say this
my party has always ruled the ethereal sight being that you can see into the ethereal plane while on the material plane.
they didn't even bother to read the spell description, no offense to them but it seems like most people reading the changes are looking for reasons to complain first
@@verdurite tbch see invisibility seems like it would be pretty self explanatory tho, so you can only blame them so much. its not them looking for things to be upset about
@@verduriteOr how about wizard changes the name of the spell. See invisibility implies it lets you see invisible things... and that's it. 😂😂
Jacob stopping to rant about Ranger in the middle of a normal discussion is a fucking mood
Imagine being hooked up to your buddy with Telepathic Speech and you just hear them start screaming as they get assassinated or beat to death or something and then just hear “well, shit. now what? Oh, wait, you can still hear me? Uh”
lmao. i do think the purpose is so that if you get brought back up after being knocked the connection is still there and you dont have to use the feature again
I guess it depends on whether or not you can speak while Dead or Incapacitated
And whether or not your soul is still on the plane and within range
@@Lazyturtle1501I wonder if they made the same change with magic item attunement and other things that stop working when you die. I bet nobody ever remembered about these whenever their character gets killed and revived on the next turn.
[Dial tone buzz]
>Become wild magic sorceror
>Take mage hand and subtle spell metamagic
>Use Bend Luck and turn into a potted plant
>Subtle spell Mage Hand and terrify the shopkeeper into thinking his shop is haunted
>Clean out the shop after he runs out screaming
You’re a genius!
I don't think you can cast spells as a plant can you?
@@felixhepworth1296 subtle spell removes the verbal and somatic components of a spell. So a literal plant or a cripple with no arms can cast spells lol
Needing to cast Identify to understand another wizard's spellbook makes sense, try reading most peoples notes. You will wish you had a spell for that...
Doctor notes are just high level wizards notes. 😂
22:52
this one joke has cemented in my mind that I should allow the answers to just be simple, short answers instead of 'yes, no, or maybe' because if a player at my table ever asks if they can have cake for dinner you bet that their patron will respond with "share"
Wizard was already good, it didn’t need better toys.
-This is brought to you by Warlock gang. (And the Sorcerer curious)
yeah, it was the strongest class in the game and honestly it may still be depending on the spell changes.
@@hearforthemusic9814 I have it on good authority that the wizards have exclusive access to the most powerful spells in the game. So they probably will be the most powerful class with good spell selection.
That's right, can't improve perfection!
@@hearforthemusic9814Simulacrum Go brrrr
Warlock gang : )
What's funniest about the ranger is Crawford recently admitted in the dungeon dudes interview ranger was tied with monk for his favorite class redesigns. I'm thinking that's NOT gunna age well.
Crawford was comparing to 2014 while the rest of us had already dumped it in favor of Tasha's so there's an anchoring effect going on too
"You're not just a pretty face" is absolutely hilarious and (from personal experience) one of the most entertaining phrases to say to a significant other who is smarter than you and will always get the shoulder (or in this case leg) punch
"a book that I already own" hits home.
To be fair for the wild magic surge being a 20, they said in the video thing that the wild magic table will be more positive now as well as bigger so hopefully that comes through
Going to be funny to see someone roll a 20 and a 16 with advantage and take the 16 to avoid the surge.
@@BradCarletti the wild surge roll is a separate one
@@BradCarlettiadvantage just makes you take the higher doesn't it?
Alright Shadow Wizard Money Gang, it is time for our uprising.
Can we add spores druid and swords bard to the group? XD
Get in, losers, we're casting Fireball!
@@GrimViridianYASS
Legalize Meteor Swarm!
@@harrietr.5073 spores druid is probably one of my top favorite classes. I just hate that it's so hard to use effectively, though I'm currently loving my spores druid/monk in bg3 XD
"They didn't buff Necromancy?" I felt that disappointment. Especially when the Wizard video came out and it wasn't one of the 4 subclasses to make the cut when it really needed some buffs.
R.I.P necromancy
One of the (imo) major things the warlock article seemingly failed to mention is that the spells from your expanded spell list are automatically unlocked when you reach the prerequisite level, and always count as prepared.
New Sorcerer is awesome, how did this same team make Ranger,
"You can sculpt a fireball? Nice party trick, I SUMMON A DRAGON!"
If your table lets you use legacy stuff you can even follow up Summon Dragon with Draconic Transformation in the same turn
Think about the warlock like the monk, all the patrons just grant the same features until level three
All patrons got together and decided to implement a probationary period
The warlocks should unionize for more collective bargaining power against their patrons.
Or just the Paladin. Your powers come from your oath. Your oath-specific powers don't kick in until later.
Mechanically the way I thought about this, was most veteran players I know start at level 3. Well newer players start at level one. For new players it's hard to role-play and lock in to a personality that early so waiting to level 3 to lock in I think it's kind of cool
@@AnaseSkyriderOr the Cleric. You can be an "intern of trickery" until level 3 when your deity decides you're worthy of getting a duplicate.
"You were going to pretend you're with the fiend the whole time"
Funny enough, that's what my DM let me do with my Echo Knight on the first 2 levels.
Its definitely not as satisfying. Like I am fine reflavoring stuff and pretending I already have my subclass. I just would rather actually have it and have it be actionable. I mean what if the DM is by the books? What if they don't yet know how to handle that kind of stuff? Having it at lv1 just keeps you from those messes.
The abilities are what should be at 3. The flavor should always be where it needs to be. In this case 1.
@@MeriliremOk but counter point from a DM point of view.
I'm in the mind or Kadrack the Flayer. Some random asks for some of my power. Why should I trust you with it? Earn it. I'll slowly drip feed you more power (leveling up) as you prove yourself to me.
In the hands of a bad or inexperienced DM anything can be bad or mishandled. Honestly I like that all classes get their subclass at the same level but I think it should be level 2.
@@Not_An_EVcounter counter point: most if not all subclasses should be at level 1 for convenience sake and for backstory sake, and it just makes sense for most of the classes. Warlock gets the ability to use magic from a patron that could come from any plane so naturally that power is different from other Warlock’s, why should we get the generic Starter Pack™️ for the first two levels? Paladins get their power from their Oaths, why do they get magic before swearing one at level 3?
@@EnjoyerOfCats7 yeah true. I'm just biased because the way I run things level 1 is always your backstory. The lowest level I ever start my players is 2.
@@Not_An_EV oh I see, no harm in that obviously. Just a personal peeve of mine that WotC thinks this os the best way to do subclasses. Not to mention the plethora of just generally bad changes in the ‘new’ PHB
"the most important guide to the changes is Tasha's, a book that i already own" and she, in a sentence, summed up the whole issue with these new rules. with a few notable exceptions its just Tasha's but worse
*FIREBALL YOUR WAY OUTTA THIS WIZARD! HAHAHA!*
balls
@@CrypticSpoon1you’ve given me a lot to think about, thank you Spoon.
@@bigyoshi5170 balls2
@@CrypticSpoon1 that are *FIRE*
Crawford said recently that if you use an older subclass that wasn’t revised, you still unlock the subclass at level 3, you just would unlock any features it got at lvl 1 or 2 simultaneously when you take the subclass at level 3. Not really any necessary homebrewing there
Haha cool that's even worse that I would've thought. R.I.P every campaign designed for level 1-5.
Agreed. The text in the new book is something along the lines of "when you get this feature you gain all features of your chosen subclass UP TO this level." So if yer using an older subclass that was not updated you get the same subclass features, just at the new subclass levels.
@@MegaVidFan1How is that worse? Its just a way to make other wizard subclasses backwards compatable. How does that ruin your level 1-5 campaign?
@@catalyst9953Because if most of the campaign is spent under level 3, you don't get to play your subclass. At all.
In a level 1-5 campaign, wizards kind of rely on getting their flavoring early. Because they're toothpicks. They can't afford to wait like the other classes do. A level 1-5 campaign is unplayable for a wizard under these circumstances.
@@baydiacwouldn’t that be true for just about any class that gets their sub at level three? Which is most of em?
"Some of my enemies are in my blood" is a weird way to announce you're HIV positive
WotC really needs to introduce a "produce the effect of X spell" instead of "you can cast this spell without using components" as it is arguable worse casting a spell with the no 2 spells a turn rule.
Like the diviner subclass. Oh cool I can cast see invisibility as a bonus action now I can only cast cantrips.
those mechanics used to exist but they swept them away because they thought that "spell like abilities were too confusing" or something
@@ltcaphide I mean it's not spell like ability, you just produce the effect of the spell without mechanically casting it. Like the 4 elements monk, you aren't using the weave to cast, i don't know, fireball. You are using your ki, converting your life energy into an explosion. Or shadow monk's darkness or whatever.
"Shadow Arts
You can use your ki to duplicate the effects of certain spells"
DUPLICATE the effects. Making it so you mechanically cast said spells makes them prone to anti-magic abilities such as counter-spell.
@@matth2283and people were fighting over "If it's just the duplicate you can't counterspell it" and "that's an effect of the spell and is magic, i can counterspell it"
And also isn't that no 2 spells per turn rule was revised or something, i'm not really sure, i don't remember
@@yukkahiroto which I always argue back no you can't counterspell an ability.
Use dispel magic instead. 😂😂
@@Not_An_EV but ability makes you to "mimic a spell", see the word "spell" is right here, like in "counter *spell* " :)
Spencer wanting to go after Mystra with hammers is such a mood.
I advocate for more videos with Spencer yall are too cute together
This!! Also don't cut the kiss let us bask in your cuteness reeee
"I think I'd rather continue playing the 2014." - Spencer, Voice of the People
So if you read the See Invisibility spell it basically includes the effects of ethereal sight. So now instead of a Diviner having to choose between seeing the invisible or seeing the ethereal you can just see both at once by casting the spell (which you can do without expending a spell slot).
Yeah wizards really need to change the name of that spell.
30:00 one thing you missed about twin spell is that they also seemingly made it so that twin spell is always only one sorcery point, rather than a number of sorcery points equal to the level of the spell. That's huge, because before you might twin-spell finger of death for 7 sorcery points, but now you can twin-spell it for 1 sorcery point--a pretty massive saving. If meta-magic adept exists in the 2014 handbook and is largely unchanged then it is now a must-have for 90% of spellcasters because I think this means you could twin-spell something like power word kill for 1 sorcery point. Wild stuff
This is not how the new Twinned Spell option works. I don't blame you for misunderstanding, because the wording here is utterly psychotic and took me several minutes to be sure about. I had the same reaction to the sorcery point cost when I thought what you did.
New Twinned Spell can't apply to every single-target spell anymore. It only applies to the single-target spells that have an upcast option to become multi-target, like Fly and Banishment. Spells like Polymorph and Finger of Death have no upcast multi-target effect, so can't be Twinned.
Twinned Spell is now a cheaper way to upcast some spells to affect two creatures instead of one. Way cheaper and less powerful than the original.
I'm guessing it was an attempt to wrangle back the meta of dumping half your sorcery points to Twin very powerful spells like Polymorph or Disintegrate (or yes, Finger of Death) in combat. I'm willing to bet that especially with all the new ways Sorcery Points are easier to preserve and recharge, there was just no cost that could keep the old high-cost-high-reward Twin mechanic balanced with the rest of the game. As with a lot of things in OneDnD, it looks like it's been smoothed over, normalized to fit in uniformly with all the other options.
EDIT: And while I do have a lot of criticisms of the design philosophy of making everything smooth and uniform, and a lot of criticisms of OneDnD, I do want to say that I understand this decision as a game designer. The synergy that 5e's Twinned Spell has with so many spells can be kind of impossible to manage. You can't do anything to tweak the Sorcery Point economy without considering the knock-on effects of how much more a sorcerer could do with Twinned Spell, which also requires you to look at EVERY single-target spell, and their power levels at different levels of play and in different hands, which is a LOT.
Designing anything in 5e that interacts with spells is really time- and energy-intensive, because there are a LOT to look through and hold in your head. It's a huge constraint on designing new single-target spells, because you are forced to consider their balance not just on their own terms, and not just in combination with all other spells, but also when Twinned.
Now, Twinning only works on those spells which are explicitly designed to still be balanced when affecting 2 targets. It solves a LOT of design headaches and allows you to breathe easier about designing a spell that would be way too OP if it could affect two creatures, because you can just decide that under no circumstances will it do that.
@clockwork_mind ah, OK that makes more sense to me. Otherwise that would be super broken. Hate that wording tho now as it makes twin spell seem like an obvious go-to
I think it would have been cooler for the Draconic Sorcerer if you could transform into a dragon rather than just summon one.
Defently. Makes a lot of sense from a thematic stand point (most features are that you are bocmming more like a dragon) and mechincal (the class isnt really that much about summining so a self buff would fit more).
ive been saying this for years, and if they wanna balance it just give the form its own unique statblock, i dont wanna be some draconic spirit medium i want to become a dragon(we all might just be kobolds at this point). Thats the one thing i like about pathfinder, you can polymorph into a dragon later levels
@@viktorhermansson2284 exactly we already get draconic scales that protect us and late get draconic wings. To be honest i wouldnt mind having both as some people might want to play a draconic medium of sorts. But i want to be a dragon so bad, my favorite race already is dragonborn. They could give us the ability to cast true polymorph to only turn into dragons
@@Lazyturtle1501 shapechange would probaly be better, your still a caster and want to casts spells, turning knto to a dragon should be a big self buff
I know the subclass moving is contentious but I like the standardized of subclasses. I hated it at first as a knee jerk reaction but It helps with balancing the classes against each other and helps mitigate balance altering dips. It also means subclass feature can be stronger and more of a central focus because you don’t have to worry about how they’ll affect balance when everyone has 8 hit points and the hitting power of marshmallows, or what it looks like slapped onto another build as a multiclass. Just because you don’t get subclass features until 3 doesn’t mean you didn’t have a patron for two levels - it just means that patron didn’t give you gifts that were specifically themed around them. You still made a deal with a devil or fae or whatever, it just doesn’t look that different from other warlocks until you gain more of their power. Eldritch blast also has always had this problem (that being why does it look the same despite different patrons providing it) but if we can handwave that we can also handwave the subclass moving up as well in my opinion.
I have an opinion about wizards and I will stand with it until the day I die: they should have combined 2 schools of magic if they're only doing 4 subclasses. For example: Abjuration and Evocation - That's a war mage. Conjuration and Necromancy - A summoner. Enchantment and Transmutation - Something about manipulating objects. Illusion and Divination - Nerd wizard(I don't have a good reason for this one they were just the only 2 left over). Thank you for coming to my ted talk
I think you could swap Transmutation and Illusion. Enchantment and Illusion could be your charismatic types while Transmutation and Divination could easily be combined with religious or noble connotations. Granted I'm a relatively new player so maybe that doesn't work well for stat reasons or another reason I'm unaware of.
@fuzzydude64 that works, the main two that started my idea were abjuration and evocation, and Conjuration and necromancy but there are many different combinations you could make for a multitude of different reasons
They're not doing four subclasses. They've provided updates to four subclasses. The rest are compatible with the new edition.
I feel like Necromancy has enough potential to be its own thing. Even looking at their spells only a handful of them were raising the dead. Some for sure can be merged but not all.
no lol thats completely unnecessary and really thematically off base
I really like the changes to Sorcerer and Warlock, but I loath that they are getting rid of Malleable Illusions from the Illusionist. That one offered so many cool interactions with all the illusion spells, especially Mirage Arcane.
I absolutely DESPISE the trend of new class features being "We've removed the fun class feature, and changed it so you just get extra spells prepared that kinda have the same effect."
I haven't played many spellcasters and the ones I did didn't get very high in level, what fun abilities did they remove? The overall opinion I've seen of all 3 classes has been great
Sugarcoated negative reinforcement.
@@GrimViridian The biggest one would be removing most of ranger's unique abilities and the just replacing them with more spells and the ability to not accidentally lose concentration on hunter's mark (this one is late enough to not really be useful, also). Hooray, you can be a shittier rogue that has to pre-pick who you have the ability to sneak attack.
@@Wiseman89 well that's just ranger I already knew that but he made it sound like a lot more than one class so I was curious, the only problems I know of are ranger as a whole and paladins smite which is an easy homebrew fix
I can't believe they thought "Goodberry" was a valuable replacement for literally any class feature from 5e. Try telling any Bard to stop using Cutting Words and instead cast Dissonant Whispers.
8:13 the reason why the Ethereal vision was removed is because See Invisibility just lets you see into the Ethereal Plane full stop, so otherwise it would be a bit of a wasted ability. Also, Wizards didn't have a single base class feature between levels 2 and 18 in 5e to begin with, so it's not like this is a new thing, most of their versatility comes from subclass and spell choice.
A capstone saying "is taken to new heights" is what ChatGPT spits out whenever you let it make a subclass for you.
How much of the new stuff was actually designed by the team and how much was copied without a second thought?
If there is a "you become an avatar of-" sentence, then it's more than just a coincidence
I like the idea that your warlock patron is a secret at first. Like your warlock had no idea what they were getting into at first, only to find out once they've already accomplished several feats that would've been impossible for them without the patron.
Also paladins and bards can't just dip one level into warlock to get a weapon that uses their charisma modifier.
If it's like the Playtest, level one dip still works for charisma weapon. Pact of the Blade can be gotten at level 1 and was giving the Charisma buff.
I doubt you will see it though. If they didn't change true strike from Playtest you can just get magic initiate as your origin feat and pick up either Shillelagh or True Strike and make attacks with weapons with whatever mental stat you want.
Warlock subclasses beyond level 1 is insane. "You know, after we just finished killing that band of goblins, I suddenly remember that time a couple weeks ago I SIGNED MY SOUL OVER TO THE DEVIL in exchange for these crazy magical powers I suddenly have. Can't believe that had completely slipped my mind until just now."
Wizard makes more sense to me though, as it's not unusual to not settle on your college major until you've been there for a year or two.
If you just flavour it as knowing your patron, but you have to show competence before they offer you their juicy stuff exclusive to them after a probationary sign up period, it still works.
I think its pretty easy to just have it be your patron doesn't give you exclusive benefits until 3rd level. That very well could be what the flavor text for Warlock says in the book, we just don't know yet.
A warlock doesn't need a single powerful patron from the start. They could be an occultist making dealings with minor spirits to gain slivers of power.
I see it as a, “Youse wanna make a deal with the boss? Youse gotta make a deal with ME first.” kind of thing. You get minor powers from a minion for the first couple of levels, then the good stuff from your patron once you prove yourself worthy.
Does it genuinely make less sense then the monk randomly remembering their monastic tradition or the rogue that they have psychic abilities.
The classes that get their sub classes at level 3 already needed you to build towards them starting from level 1 most of the time.
The change is mostly for new players and retconing something for the sake of easy for a new player is pretty common anyway.
Know plenty of DMs that just allowed you to change a characters entire class if you don't like it.
Imagining this video being how someone found out Joe dropped out
who
@@deptusmechanikus7362biden
Hi, it’s me. I’m someone
@@deptusmechanikus7362 The 46th president of the USA, Joe Biden.
@@deptusmechanikus7362 Joe mama
WotC: Sorcerers now prepare spells like everyone else
Me: Oh cool, we can swap out our spells on long rest?
WotC: No, only on level up
Me: Oh, so the change is that we can change the whole list on level-up?
WotC: No
Me: Then... what changed?
WotC: Nomenclature
Every caster is prepared, meaning you can have more known spells than you have active. While previously, a sorcerer could know a small bunch of spells to have at one time, now, a sorcerer can have a much bigger list of spells they know OF, and then pick out from that list what spells they are packing for that day. You get access to more total spells, but have to pick which you're carrying with you each day.
@@milokurain7293 thats not at all what it means. its literally just a nomenclature change. instead of sorcerer's having "known spells" they have "prepared spells" but it functions the same as the known spells system.
@@sillyking1991 Yes, replying to a 2 month old comment about the new release, you are correct that it's just a nomenclature change. Thanks so much for the clarification
The Illusionist being able to conjure illusionary animals and fey is a callback to some spells that illusionists had back when they were their own class. Back then they didn’t really get combat spells at low level except for things like Phantasmal Force, but once they had access to higher level spells (I think 4th or 5th) they could cast illusions that replicated the effects of non-illusion spells like fireball, lightning bolt, and summoning spells.
One thing I've said about the "all subclasses at level 3" in regards to things like Paladin and Warlock:
You can consider the first two levels as the "trial package" from your respective deity or patron, and at level 3 you start getting into the meat of what they offer compared to the other deities/patrons.
It isn't that your character doesn't know who they are following for the first two levels, it's just that they're making sure you can walk before you can run.
I think that works a lot better for warlocks, but not really for paladins. Since paladins don’t require a deity, I feel like they should absolutely know which oath they took since that’s where there power comes from.
Which is why they should get the subclass at 1. They know, they already chose. You do not need the powerful abilities to be tied to the flavor of having a subclass. You need the flavor at level 1 so you can play at those levels. Then at level 3 you can gain the powers after you prove yourself.
Ok, I don't think I made my point clear in the first post.
Your character, at level 1, *knows* what Oath they have, what Patron, what class of Wizard, etc. You would roleplay exactly the same as you would now. The only thing that changes is when subclass specific things come online at level 3.
I don't understand why people think your character just has unexplained magic for two levels and they're just wondering "How the heck am I casting these spells?"
It's the same with classes that traditionally get their subclass at 3 like, say, Monk. It's not like you're just doing exercise and parkour for 2 levels and then at level 3 you're like "Hey, I'm going to join this temple specifically to learn their ways." No, you've trained a certain style since the start, it's just that the first two levels are the basics that *every* monastic tradition builds off of.
Thank you Spencer for looking up the actor it would have bothered me so much if that thought didnt come to a resolution
I think warlocks getting their subclass at level 3 actually makes sense. Like you need to build up to channeling the specific power of your patron instead of general power. You can actually have a cool RP moment where the patron gives extra power to the warlock.
Dude what the hell, it really does feel like wizard and ranger got some short sticks because sorcerer sounds awesome!
That “god-damnit” struck me to my soul. That was some blade runner/night crawler level acting.
Can't wait to put agonizing blast and repelling blast on magic stone. I'm going to throw rocks at people so hard, my guy.
For the lvl 3 warlock thing the only way i see it being useful is if you wanna rp that you haven't been given your patron's "full power" but I was really hoping they would do away with subclasses at lvl 3 and instead go for lvl 1 but instead they're hammering down on lvl 3.
33:20 rant was on point. I don't understand how paladin and ranger were slaughtered while sorcerer got way more spells, super state, ability to change more spells and a bloody dragon xD
I didn't even want the Dragon. That's a Drakewarden thing isn't it? Give it to the ranger and let me borrow wildshape from the druid to turn into a dragon instead!
Playing a Draconic Sorcerer is about BEING a dragon. You have draconic power in your veins! I want to become a dragon. Let the Ranger have a Dragon Pet.
With the Warlock spell slot refresh at levels 2 & 20, this stacks. The second full recharge is great as warlocks run out of fuel all the time.
Does it? Because that's not how it reads. It says the level 20 version is just an improved version of this same ability... which would replace the lower version, not be added.
stacks how exactly? you'd get back half and all of your expended spell slots at the same time?
that sorcerer buff at lvl 1 is insane I cannot wait to see the chaos that comes from it
yeah i'm really surprised to see nobody else talk about that
it's ridiculously powerful I can't even
@@nessa-parmentier Its a cool rage equivalent to be sure. I just got focused in on the Draconic Sorcerer not getting a Draconic Wildshape. If I wanted a pet dragon I would play a Drakewarden.
@@nessa-parmentier yeah full minute with advantage on attack rolls and increased spell dc is insane
@@Merilirem been saying it for years, like our cousins the kobolds most of us dont want to be draconic mediums, we want to become dragons ourselves. If you dont want it to be broken just make a custom statblock for it and voila.
Regarding the Diviner Subclass, unless they changed how the spell works, keep in mind that See Invisibility also gives Ethereal Sight. Thus, you get both for the prize of one.
"i feel like that's just the nature of a sorcerer" and you'd be wrong! the point of the sorcerer in D&D was always explicitly to not require players to reprep spells constantly.
"It does seem like they're making, overall, like, level 20 powerful...but you're not, like, god." -right after talking about a feature called Arcane Apotheosis.
Definition of Apotheosis: the highest point in the development of something; culmination or climax; the elevation of someone to divine status; deification. 😄
Clearly it needs to be stronger.
I can explain something! The thing is tha you CAN use old sublclasses with new classes. They way the game manages this is that in the new class lets say you get your class feature at level 3, 11 and 17 (just an example). What happens is that when you hit lvl 3, you gain EVERY feature that you would have up to that level in the old sublcass. The same goes for level 11. If an old sublasses gained feature at level 3, 6, 9, and 14, when you hit lvl 11 in the NEW class you would get every feature up to that point (so the level 3 that you already had at lvl 3, and you get the features of level 6 and 9). At level 17 you would have every feature that you can get up to level 17 of the new class. I hope that I managed to explain it well
This is coming from someone who's favorite class is the wizard. New Sorcerer and Warlock are amazing! However, Wizard is still equally amazing, they didn't need much and what they got was good. (Though I would love for them to give Wizards a better capstone). I actually quite like that there is now a proper decision between these 3 instead of just Wizard best.
Honestly, pretty much every class looks amazing (except maybe the ranger, but until we see the actual book I'm not 100% discounting them yet).
Paladin feels like a lateral move at best and a step backwards at worse, which is wild if you’ve had ten years of feedback on what people want from a class and you somehow either accomplished nothing/actively made it worse.
@@roguebarbarian9133Probably, but I'm reserving judgment until we get more details about how smite works. In any case, the worsening of their action economy, especially when every other class is getting more flexible, is discouraging.
@@jeffreymonsell659 I just don't like how it feels for the SMITE to become a spell. It felt like you channeled raw power before. Now it feels like your casting a spell on your hammer.
@@Merilirem i mean its basically just a change in sematics, the feature was basically a spell in all but name as it consumed slots.
@@jeffreymonsell659I disagree with the action economy being worse. The only one that's worse is smite, but everything else is the same/better. Devotion and Vengeance had their abilities made into free actions, and lay on hands is a bonus action now. Smite spells now only require the bonus action cast on a hit, so no wasting those anymore either.
Warlock getting the subclass on lvl 3 makes nice storytelling. On lvl 1 you have a bond with your deity but it doesnt communicate with you. On lvl 3 you get a visit from said deity that rewards you with new skills (Subclass) for doing the things you are doing, whatever that may be ^^ I do like everyone getting subclasses at 3, because of that no one at the table feels left out or thinks he's special anymore. I believe that change isnt for balancing but instead more for the social aspect at the table ^^ Edit: Especially if you dont play in a private group but instead at your local game stores with random people, ego is a huge factor when having the need to feel stronger than everyone else at the table. Everyone getting it lvl 3 fixes that egoistic players minds ^^
Sooooo why couldn't every class just get their subclass at level 1 instead then? What's so special about level 3?
@@ArceusShaymin You have a point there, if the story of the campaign or you maybe play a one-shot allows it then you can have a subclass on lvl 1. However,I would say the journey to lvl 3 is part of the story of the campaign you play. What you experience in the story might change wich subclass you want to go. If u start as an assasin rogue then the whole party completely misses to experience how you have become one, together with you. I would say either start lvl 1 without subclasses or you start on lvl 3 with them ^^
That isn't how those classes work is the problem. Warlocks don't have Deities for one. They make contracts, deals. You don't just get given stuff or form a vague bond. You make a pact with a specific being.
Just like how Sorcerers are born with the power of a dragon in their veins. Its part of the backstory of the character.
@@Merilirem In wich case cant the pact get stronger on lvl 3 wich enables your subclass? ^^ Its a fantasy story not a lawyers book, dont be strict to everything if not necessary ^^ Edit: I know its cringe but take Wyll for example, do stuff for your deity and get rewards, aka lvl 3 ^^
@@ArceusShayminthe designers have said multiple times levels 1 and 2 are designed for introductory play, so you shouldn't get giant character defining options before you even know how to play.
See Invisibility spell lets you see BOTH invisible creatures and the Ethereal plane, so if anything now you can do both instead of having to pick one, it is an upgrade (we all just paranoid of features being replaced by spell=bad)
Edit: I'm NOT defending that replacing all features with "you can cast X without consuming a spell-slots now" is a good design choice (frankly is a thing I HATE since it forces me to read the spell list and go back to the class page to figure out what that meant) all I'm saying is that n THIS particular case we didn't got screwed as seeing BOTH invisible & ethereal beings is a straight upgrade.
A feature being a spell is only bad if you are a barbarian. Otherwise it makes anti magic fields feel more reasonable which is neat IG.
If everything is just a spell, then nothing is actually significant or unique. It sucks hard
@@chrismanuel9768 what? We have class specific spell lists, we obviously retain "uniqueness". Paladins are the only ones that get access to Paladin spells.
Warlocks getting origin feats as invocations could be a great game changer
There is going to be a lot of human warlocks running around.
@@XanderHarris1023 As if there weren't before. Still I doubt it. You only need so many feats.
divination wizards don't need more spells they already have portent. :P
Edit:
Also you gave it some flack, but subclass at level 3 for the warlock makes sense to me. Think of Lovecraft, you study the occult, you learn rituals and incantations, you grow in power, steal the necronomocon or whatever, and THEN once you know what you're doing you make contact with a specific entity and bargain / bind them into a contract.
The way you do it, its almost an accident. 18 year old pig farmer with no magical interest or experience trips, scrapes their knee, and suddenly asmodeus is on a first name basis with them, and helping them cheat on their final exams.
You gotta be interesting enough to draw the attention of your patron to begin with.
exactly my point
Yeah but Warlocks get spells from *Pact* Magic so how do they cast spells when they haven't made a pact yet
@@mayflower2765 The same way a fighter with Arcane Initiate does. They don't have a spell book, or a draconic bloodline, or a demon pact, so it's just however you imagine it to be.
I figured it was more like "trips into sharp equipment, calls for help as they're bleeding out, and gets offered a deal by Bobbicus, 400th son of Mephistopheles and 563rd in his favor, who then proceeds to act as an intercessory on the Harbinger of Beguiling Light's behalf."
"they didint buff necromancy?" no they didint and it makes us all very angry and sad
Okay, I really don't mind the lack of changes to wizard. They were already just about the most powerful and versatile classes in the entire game. If it ain't broke, dont fix it.
Flavor-wise, I could see the the warlock subclass at level 3 play out like the patron is subtly helping the warlock at first, getting them used to relying on their power without them realizing it before finally approaching them and making the offer to formalize the pact for more power, at a cost
Why did they give the draconic soul sorc a dragon pet like bro just let me turn into a goddamn dragon for the love of god
Assuming the summon uses the same initiative roll as you, why not just as your DM to reflavor it as transforming into a dragon.
I love the new sorcerer, my only complain (besides the subclass on level 3) is that I'd prefer the draconic sorcerer to BECOME a dragon instead of summoning one
27:49 The cut off scream is really good. RIP ranger
The removal of Ethereal Sight makes sense, since See Invisibility lets you see into the ethereal plane anyway. Unless the spell has been changed in the new version, for some reason.
I have a hunch that the remaining schools of magic for Wizard are going to come in a separate sourcebook as an "expansion". With how companies have been operating recently, they probably leave out some content on purpose so they can release it later with a hefty price tag on it.
(Wrote the comment before finishing the video; Jacob does briefly mentions it at the very end.)
personally I dislike the Contact Patron feature cause it's so late, and it gives this vibe that you're not meant to really have much contact with your patron prior to that level, which is *rough* for a lot of campaigns (or just, subclasses, even) that want to run with a more actively involved patron that you talk to on the regular. I feel like it'd be more interesting if it was like Cleric's Divine Intervention where your patron can help you out more directly once every so often. That's really the only complaint I have about the Warlock changes though, aside from Subclass being level 3 ofc
Aint nobody ready for The Great One One warlocks coming in 2024
That end was just fantastic. 😂💗
Warlock looks SO good right now; I'm stoked. Longtime favorite class for me too.
0:24 Jacob succeesed on perusasion check
Something I have wanted for illusionist wizard is the ability to make any of your illusions function like Phantasmal Force. I just think it'd be pretty neat to do the "The illusions are kinda real" like that, would be fun to describe and flavour, for sure.
"Thank you Joe"
"Psionic/Clockwork spells can no longer be swa-" BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO THAT WAS LITERALLY ONE OF THE REASONS THEY WERE SO GOOD
Lots of cool updates, but I agree with the subclass level changes. especially for like sorcerer and warlock. It made so much sense that it was a level 1 choice, it was the crux of your classes flavor. It makes no sense to push it to 3, and make me really apprehensive to even want to try this new version. Sure we can start at level 3, but I don't always want to play dnd like that.
Thank you spencer for explaining it better for dum dums like me. Saves the constant head scritches from trying to understand some of the more complex or lengthy written ones.
Spencer is killing it in this video.
I kinda think of Warlocks and sorcerors getting their subclass later in this way. Warlocks are already communicating with their patron, but have yet to Prove themselves worthy of a proper contract, level 3 is when they reach this worthiness. Sorcerors don't know what their blood is until level 3, as until then they are simply magically gifted and have yet to awaken the true powers of their bloodline
Wizards get SO MANY MORE SPELLS NOW I love it. My current wizard is a scribes and his whole deal is learning a lot of spells. I'd love to play that subclass with the new base wizard 🤘
I can't believe it...
Has the day actually come?
The day of the Wizard's reckoning, and the Warlock's rise?
Suddenly, i feel a cold draft coming from... The ground...?
From level 2 to level 10 the Warlock gets 2 spell slots... so half rounded up would be 1, and from level 11 up the end result would be 2 (because half of 3 is 1.5, rounded up is 2).
Assuming they haven't changed how many/when you get pact slots.
Great to see Spencer again! Also facts Tash's is basically 2024.
honestly i think personally the worst part about sorcerer and warlock getting their subclass at level 3 is that there is now much more limited storytelling potential in picking up a multiclass level in one of them. I can no longer say that after a tough journey through the hells my rouge made a deal with a devil to serve in exchange for safe passage out as when i take the warlock level it will be literally no different than if my rogue mad a deal with a celestial or a fey or a fucking outer god literally anything could be my patron and it would only show different after potentially months if not years of game time depending on how long the next 2 levels take. it just removes a bunch of ways to tell stories with the classes as now they provide no immediate uniqueness and require significant and slow investment for the story beat to not fall flat - you can no longer have a sudden event that reveals a wild magic bloodline it now has to be an extremely slow reveal for the next 3 levels before you can actually say you have wild magic.
idk if any of this is coherent i just wanted to put my thoughts in
This bullshit is exactly why they moved it to 3. Paladins with one level of Warlock has been an obnoxious powergamer move for a decade. Now you have to commit to the bit instead of just losing a mediocre capstone.
Warlock under stress signs contract in the heat of the moment and has to (insert backstory/RP) to find out who their patron is, what their vested interest is, and how to adjust their contract?
NO I WANT THE 2 HOUR VOD
Wizards are still the most powerful class. You can't compete with that volume and diversity of magic over an ongoing campaign.
So in an interview with Jeremy Crawford, he did address some of the upset about the ranger. I don't know if it's gonna help but he did say they changed a lot of the concentration aspects of ranger spells (meaning they took quite a few concentration requirements away from ranger spells). I don't know if that helps. We'll see how the 2024 ranger is come September. I'm still not optimistic for the ranger though.
which interview? link?
There will be part of the PHB explaining how to use older subclasses. Backwards compatibility seems to be really easy for the majority of things.
8:10 See Invisibility Lets You See Ghosts!
Illusion wizard with BA minor illusion is bonkers.
You can obscure yourself or an ally every turn, drastically reducing the chance of being hit up to outright denying some spells and abilities, as they rely on sight.
Oh and I get why subclasses are collectively moved to lvl 3 but I would prefer to have all at lvl 1 instead. It just makes more sense or is at least not nonsensical.
In regards to balance I suggest basically a split table of benefits. First half is what everyone gets with 1 lvl in the class and second half is what you only get if you start with this class.
The banter is cute :3
Did you also catch that the summon dragon doesn't require concentration but hunter's mark will be broken if it does not require concentration
We all know that the reason subclasses were moved to level 3 is to nerf hexblade dips
but then they gave us pact of the blade at level 1 which lets you use charisma to attack.
It's strange to me that WoTC seems to be putting so much energy into babying the player base and adamantly refusing to let anything become slightly unbalanced. It's 2024 can't we have fun with base D&D yet? Who cares if it's "too powerful" too powerful for what?! What's overpowered in a game with no PvP?!
@@MegaVidFan1 worst take i have ever heard in my life
@s4muri474 okay then what's the proper take? Where SHOULD balance be? Don't just call my take mid and leave.
@MegaVidFan1 just because theres no pvp doesnt mean we can just throw balance out of the window.
I think they could've split the subclass features for classes like warlock, cleric, and paladin so that they choose the subclass at lvl 1 but only get a small boon and then they get the rest at lvl 3. Then again, I guess what they mean by "in line with other classes" is that they don't have an additional choice at lvl 1.
12:38 You get stronger and have generic class abilities until level 3 and then get specific abilities related to your thing.
Exactly!
ok but it still doesn't make any sense. Why would a lvl 2 celestial warlock and a lvl 2 Fiend warlock work the same when they're being fuelled by distinctly different types of magic. It takes away the flavor and besides, getting your subclass at lvl 3 feels terrible anyway, all subclasses should be level 1 period
why not just give us subclasses at level 1 for every class
@@dokchampa9324 Because it’s game mechanics. You aren’t strong enough to use your patron’s abilities until level 3, there’s lots of ways you can explain it
@@DeathandBeeZ Because it’s easier for newer players to play if they don’t have to worry about subclass features. If you know the game well, it’s suggested to just start at level 3