He was looking in the wrong place... he should have followed the valley running on the west side of the Appalachias down through Pikeville, TN into Chattanooga, TN (lookout mountain) then on into Alanama through little river canyon and on down into Talladega, AL... there are plenty of signs that he did in fact make it to America. Jefferson was obsessed with the legend of madoc and had been told by an Indian chief that many of the fortifications in the area were not built by his people, but instead were built by white Indians who came across the great water. He went on to tell Jefferson that the white Indians had been slaughtered and their forts taken over by his tribe and others. I have seen a lot of things hiking that have convinced me...pics to prove it
The tale of Madoc ‘became politically convenient’ but, not for the Tudors given that they were not from the same royal line. Madoc was the brother of the last Arthur (who was killed ‘by a native’ in North America) - late sixth century. Another ‘Madoc’ had to be identified as being an ancestor of the Tudors and more conveniently dated. This is why there are no records for him being a son of Owain Gwynedd. The records do exist in the late sixth century - following Arthur’s death, his body was returned to Wales while Madoc remained in America. He was the brother of Arthur and also Marchell verch Meurig. Marchell married an Irish prince and their son was Brychan of Brecon who is also known in Welsh records. (This possibly explains the Irish claim to Camelot).
That is the Madoc that I had read of - 600's or so! I believe the problem is the destruction & rewriting of history by those who wished to define their preferred story in the 1800's. By then the English Colonials were in charge in a huge part of the world so what they decided was reality is what was written in standard history books. All other versions of history have been called legend or merely 'stories' ever since!
This set of comments made me laugh, only because of the serendipity of it. I am descended from a Salish tribe from WA and also Welsh ancestry but currently reside in Missouri. It all comes full circle?
@@sorelyanlie2784 actually cymru does go full circle with Galilee - which means circuit 😉🕊️ The truth will set us all free 🧙🏻♂️🤴🏻 Y gwir yn erbyn y byd
I’m not one of those who believes that the welsh are the lost tribe, but I am quite convinced that the the Israelites knew of them and had dealings with them. You might be interested in the works of Chuck Missler, he doesn’t spend a lot of time on those things, but his bible studies are very in depth and he really takes the time to look into all those theories and doesn’t discount things out of hand like most. The reality is that most legends come from some grain of truth, which is often even more fascinating and incredible than the legend itself.
Here's the reality and most likely theory: It's derived from the Anglo-American and Appalachian Scots-Irish who used it to describe the exotic sound of the Native American languages. The few Gaelic speakers amongst them wouldn't even understand Welsh being a different Branch, P Celtic derived from Gaulish rather than Celtiberian. The Algonquin however supposedly have Gaelic loan words- this is not true to my knowledge however as I've compared Irish Gaelic to few Nipmuc and Narragansett words we have learned. But there are numerous stone chambers, especially the Upton Chamber, which are built like Irish stone tombs in New grange and across Ireland and former Dal Riata Scotland. Fun Fact, the first slaves brought to North America with Vikings, as recorded in the Vinland and Greenland Sagas, were Scottish Gaels named Haki and Hækja.
@@LesNouvelle-Angleterreur Thanks for that interesting comment. It is an odd part of the story that the people who apparently reported on the use of the Welsh language probably knew nothing of it. A story sometimes takes hold and gets amplified, no matter that there is an absence of evidence.
I’m a descendant of James Murray Yale, he married a Nlaka’pamux Woman Named T’soscia Pelek. James is a descendant of the Yale family of Wales & Descendant of Llywelyn Ap Gruffydd “Last Prince Of Wales” or “Tywysog Cymru”
THE LAND OF MY FATHERS IS ALSO GODS LAND, FROM THE HILLS TO THE VALLEYS UNITED WE STAND. A RARE PLACE OF BEAUTY IS WALES TO BEHOLD, SO REMEMBER TO VISIT BEFORE YOU GROW OLD. 🙂
Well done. I discovered through the ancient Welsh Chronicles, that there was no such person as Madog, son of Llywelyn. There was no Madog who sailed away at anytime from Wales. Sorry. It just didn't happen. Bruce Howard, retired historian, professional genealogist.
Your right. Cause we most certainly have every record from every people and know almost to a person who lived, when, and what they did in life. We know NOTHING.
@@ron1836 speak for yourself, what they tried to kill and hide has been revealed to me 🕊️ through Christ, in the land of revival Cymru. Saved by grace through faith. With verifiable signs and wonders. Y gwir yn erbyn y byd
He was looking in the wrong place... he should have followed the valley running on the west side of the Appalachias down through Pikeville, TN into Chattanooga, TN (lookout mountain) then on into Alanama through little river canyon and on down into Talladega, AL... there are plenty of signs that he did in fact make it to America. Jefferson was obsessed with the legend of madoc and had been told by an Indian chief that many of the fortifications in the area were not built by his people, but instead were built by white Indians who came across the great water. He went on to tell Jefferson that the white Indians had been slaughtered and their forts taken over by his tribe and others. I have seen a lot of things hiking that have convinced me...pics to prove it
Not Madoc ap Owen
He was Madoc ap Meurig - late 6th century.
Found out about my grandmother's Welsh and Native American ancestry and that it connects to West Virginia
Prince Madog is on my ancestry chart. Born in 1175 in Montgomeryshire, Wales. King Owain Gwynedd is too. Born 1087. Did they sail back and forth?
It has them as Grandparent/grandson. I am American and also of Plantagenet and Stewart lines.
Thank you for the comment. You can count me as a sceptic about the multiple ocean crossings. It seems to have been an invention by a later writer.
Yes, very well could have. I am just diving into all of this and it’s very interesting. Thanks for making a video about it.
Thank you for sharing such an interesting piece of history!
Thank you for your comment. I’m glad you liked it.
The tale of Madoc ‘became politically convenient’ but, not for the Tudors given that they were not from the same royal line.
Madoc was the brother of the last Arthur (who was killed ‘by a native’ in North America) - late sixth century. Another ‘Madoc’ had to be identified as being an ancestor of the Tudors and more conveniently dated. This is why there are no records for him being a son of Owain Gwynedd.
The records do exist in the late sixth century - following Arthur’s death, his body was returned to Wales while Madoc remained in America. He was the brother of Arthur and also Marchell verch Meurig.
Marchell married an Irish prince and their son was Brychan of Brecon who is also known in Welsh records. (This possibly explains the Irish claim to Camelot).
👍
Thank you for adding to the debate.
That is the Madoc that I had read of - 600's or so! I believe the problem is the destruction & rewriting of history by those who wished to define their preferred story in the 1800's. By then the English Colonials were in charge in a huge part of the world so what they decided was reality is what was written in standard history books. All other versions of history have been called legend or merely 'stories' ever since!
They were killed on sand island in southern Indiana,Ohio river!studied area!lived here 57urs, Welsh heritage!
I am touring Devil's Backbone on Friday and taking video if you are interested
They're in Missouri. You're welcome. -Troy Evans
Da iawn
Some of the ones from Missouri ended up in Washington.
You're welcome.
This set of comments made me laugh, only because of the serendipity of it. I am descended from a Salish tribe from WA and also Welsh ancestry but currently reside in Missouri. It all comes full circle?
@@sorelyanlie2784 actually cymru does go full circle with Galilee - which means circuit 😉🕊️
The truth will set us all free 🧙🏻♂️🤴🏻
Y gwir yn erbyn y byd
I’m not one of those who believes that the welsh are the lost tribe, but I am quite convinced that the the Israelites knew of them and had dealings with them. You might be interested in the works of Chuck Missler, he doesn’t spend a lot of time on those things, but his bible studies are very in depth and he really takes the time to look into all those theories and doesn’t discount things out of hand like most.
The reality is that most legends come from some grain of truth, which is often even more fascinating and incredible than the legend itself.
Here's the reality and most likely theory:
It's derived from the Anglo-American and Appalachian Scots-Irish who used it to describe the exotic sound of the Native American languages. The few Gaelic speakers amongst them wouldn't even understand Welsh being a different Branch, P Celtic derived from Gaulish rather than Celtiberian.
The Algonquin however supposedly have Gaelic loan words- this is not true to my knowledge however as I've compared Irish Gaelic to few Nipmuc and Narragansett words we have learned. But there are numerous stone chambers, especially the Upton Chamber, which are built like Irish stone tombs in New grange and across Ireland and former Dal Riata Scotland.
Fun Fact, the first slaves brought to North America with Vikings, as recorded in the Vinland and Greenland Sagas, were Scottish Gaels named Haki and Hækja.
@@LesNouvelle-Angleterreur Thanks for that interesting comment. It is an odd part of the story that the people who apparently reported on the use of the Welsh language probably knew nothing of it. A story sometimes takes hold and gets amplified, no matter that there is an absence of evidence.
@@cfcinilope Thanks for that interesting comment. I was unaware of this tale.
I’m a descendant of James Murray Yale, he married a Nlaka’pamux Woman Named T’soscia Pelek. James is a descendant of the Yale family of Wales & Descendant of Llywelyn Ap Gruffydd “Last Prince Of Wales” or “Tywysog Cymru”
Im Welsh an have indigenous dna. Weird because I live in Wales too.
Having interest in the First Nations of America and being Welsh i was really hoping this story was true 🏴
🔥🔥
THE LAND OF MY FATHERS IS ALSO GODS LAND,
FROM THE HILLS TO THE VALLEYS UNITED WE STAND.
A RARE PLACE OF BEAUTY IS WALES TO BEHOLD,
SO REMEMBER TO VISIT BEFORE YOU GROW OLD. 🙂
John Evans was wrong. My 5th graeat Grandma Margaret Ellen White was a Welsh Indian.
Is there DNA evidence of the native part?
@@azborderlands DNA test
@@azborderlands why do you question the native part and not the Welsh part?
@RandomWalksWynfordEmanue-ci3sr so what? Anything you are unaware of is a lie?
Your world must be TINY.
Yeah I've had one. What's your point?
Nova Scotia Canada is where you’ll find the answer
No such thing as Welsh Indians….fact…a mixing of genes is quite a different thing when you are a bit of both or neither one or the other.
How do you know? I'm just interested
Well done. I discovered through the ancient Welsh Chronicles, that there was no such person as Madog, son of Llywelyn. There was no Madog who sailed away at anytime from Wales. Sorry. It just didn't happen.
Bruce Howard, retired historian, professional genealogist.
The celts went west to east though
Your right. Cause we most certainly have every record from every people and know almost to a person who lived, when, and what they did in life.
We know NOTHING.
@@ron1836 speak for yourself, what they tried to kill and hide has been revealed to me 🕊️ through Christ, in the land of revival Cymru. Saved by grace through faith.
With verifiable signs and wonders.
Y gwir yn erbyn y byd
@@TywysogCraig K
@@ron1836 test me, when did the gospel get to britain and who did it come to? Why?
Their in North Carolina