Forging a drawknife - part one - blacksmithing project
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- Опубліковано 12 чер 2018
- Forging a draw knife from two pieces of steel, mild steel body with a W1 steel cutting edge. This is part 1 of the series and will complete the actual forging of the draw knife
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www.piehtoolco.com/
www.centaurforge.com/
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kensironstore.com/
Blacksmithing and related activities can be hazardous. These videos are not a substitute for competent professional instruction. Your safety is your sole responsibility. Always use appropriate safety equipment including eye and ear protection when working in the shop. Follow manufactures safety guidelines for the use of all equipment. In the event something shown in one of these videos seems unsafe, it is up to you to make the appropriate changes to protect yourself.
"All floppy and weird" describes so many things.
Its sort of a way of life
Don’t forget “use just the tip of the pien”
I little hard for me to keep up with this one, but that's just me lol
Another GREAT Vid😇
Who needs the "new " additive manufacturing? In my mind making metals plastic and hammering them to the desired shape as well as forge welding is the ORIGINAL ADDITIVE MANUFACTURING method. Thousands of years old. Thanks for taking the road less travelled in your demos, yet again. Cudos and thanks to you.
I loved the "chalkboard " it explained alot!
I REALLY appreciate your "how to" style. So many people just do it, without explaining anything. Best video I've seen on how to actually go about making a tool. Thank you Sir! Keep up the good work!
Thanks for your effort John of making all these very informative videos, your thorough approach and relaxed attitude make you an excellent teacher. You add true value to the community of people with an interest in blacksmithing. Greeting from Maastricht Holland. 👍
For welding , I think it is better to sprinkle borax on a clean surface previously heat up to 500F. Return to the fire an adds more borax at a higher temp.
Great info John. Thank you. I'm not even a woodworker and I'm not sure why drawknives have always fascinated me
As someone who (eventually) wants to get into making draw knives and other woodworking tools, I would dearly love to see information on how to attach the handles to the drawknife. While making the handles is woodworking, it's still a part of the tool itself and I know that there are options on how to attach the handles to the tangs.
I will plan to show most of it without making it a how to turn wood video. I am not the guy to tech turning even though I manage to get by for my own purposes.
I thourouly enjoyed this whole process. So many memories of being with gramps at the forge and anvil. Thanks a bunch fella !
very good job
John, please make the video showing the handles. It’s not about being the “best” at anything. Your method of instruction helps all of us. Seeing how you complete the draw knife would be nice. Thanks again.
truegeekified Please!
.y.
@@billy19461 ny
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I believe this is titled “part one” so would assume there would be videos finishing the project so the handles
Thanks John. That was very useful information about how to ensure the tools steel ends up where it needs to be.
I'm glad it helped
John, to teach and explain the way you do defiantly shows the experience you have in traditional blacksmithing. Thanks for great content.
I really enjoyed this video. Heat?....yeah, summer in muggy Mississippi here. I kind of laughed the other day while watching another UA-camr when he said "Man its hot...got up around 80 today".
80? That's mild! I'm from Texas and grew up with 90+ heat and with heat index getting up 110s easily. It finally got to my health and I moved up to s. Wisconsin so the 90s is highest we get now but 80s is average for June. I've got used to the difference in temps, but we had a unusually cold spring (set new record) and after going through nearly 6 months of cold, finally going from 40s to 80s in 2 weeks time makes it seems hot
LOL
Llived in Iowa seldom got 90 and 15 mph breeze almost all summer,But winter still windy 15 mpf is chilli.One winter 45 days in a row temps never reach 0 degrees.
Now hotter and happier back again in OH
This is why every morning I get up and hope to see a new video from you John! The content, the how to do it’s, and the why’s! Though I do not get to spend a lot of time in the shop, I do know when I do get to go I am a little more knowledgeable at what I am doing. And the rest is all practice to make it perfect! If you ever consider an apprentice please let me know I would love to work with you even if for a short time! Thanks again for sharing your skills with us!
Ai un stil de lucru țigănesc !
I'm pretty sure you could just draw out the ends of a flat bar to make the handles and you'd end up with a draw knife without any forge welding, although this might not work with larger blades that well.
It amazes me how fast you draw a taper!
Working at a high heat helps
Great video. Thanks John. Yes sir would love to see you put the handles on. That is a weak point for me. Stay cool. Oh and happy Fathers day!
I love this video not that I need a draw knife but the info on welding tool steel to mild steel seems to be a very useful thing for my ideas that I’ve put off not sure I cud do it at all now I have the confidence to at least try
Another great video. I'm looking forward to making a drawknife. Green wood woodworking is an interest of mine, and so making my own tools was the initial spark of interest that got me into blacksmithing. Tools like the drawknife or spokeshave really come into their own when used with a shaving horse.
Good tips. Thanks. Send the knife my way and I'll test it ha,ha,ha.
Thanks for sharing. I always enjoy your videos.
Thanks John i've seen other people making drawknifes and yours is surely one of the nicest! Informative,clear,concise thank you mate
An unknown belgian starting blacksmith ^_^
Thanks
Nice demonstration! Love the diamond technique for moving the tool steel to the flat!
And thanks for the southern hemisphere shout out...likely to snow here on Sunday (central west, NSW)
You should also make a fleshing knife for hide processing. Similar to a draw knife, but still different enough that I'd love to see you make one... 😁👍
Nice bench. Love those knives. First again. One procedure my Grandpa insisted on was when there was a tang formed there must be a radius at the intersection of the tang and the blade. I was told leaving that shoulder square is a weak spot and it may fail. Thank you for that instruction.
Abby Babby, your right about the corners, but since he basically fullered them in, he didn't cut the grains of the steel, they are, on the granular level, radiused.
That is a good point. It is one of the reasons an anvil should have radius-ed edges. That creates a nice transition as opposed to a sharp corner.
YOU HAVE VERY GOOD TASTE, I HAVE THAT FOLDER IN MY LIL COLLECTION
thank you
nice job
Very nice. I have made a small draw knife out of a rusty wood rasp that I saw laying on the ground at a friends house. I'll see if I can find it and post it later. It uses the tangs for the handle.
Looking foward to the rest of this. Looking good John!
Awesome video, John. Keep teaching us.
I made a draw knife totally out of D2 not long after I started blacksmithing, that taught me a few unwanted lessons I can tell you! Needless to say there was a bit of welded on mild steel for one of the handles by the time I finished, not that you could tell looking at the final tool.
Obviously being D2 the heat treat was easy, just air cooled it. Been using it over a year for the odd job every week or two, and not had to sharpen it as yet.
D2 is tough stuff. But as long as the finished product works
Neat been wanting to make one of these for a while.
Enjoyed the video, thanks for that.
I would appreciate seeing the "woodworking part 3" if you don't mind. Blacksmithing is closely related to other crafts - such as woodworking - so in my opinion this crossover on crafts was traditionally extremely common. Whether the blacksmith would fit the hinges to the door, or the carpenter would pick them up and do it himself, etc.Therefore - please do share the lathe video!
I will plan to include it as part of the project even though it may not be very instructional. I am certainly not the one to teach wood turning
New to your channel. Very much enjoyed this video as well as exploring the great content on your channel. 👍
I am glad you are finding it helpful. Enjoy
Thanks for sharing and take care. 👍
Great project.
Loving this! Mahalo John!
Very imformative, thanks.
Whilst watching these great videos you put together so naturally I realised how awkward playing to the camera is with the discombobulated under-over-upside-down hammering so you get a good shot while relaying the story, in addition, the enormous loss of efficency in using a jouncing hardy tool.
You are so much better at your craft than these excellent demos depict. It's very humbling, really.
Just FYI there is company that makes a vest for people that have to work in the heat. The company is sta-cool can be found on the internet not cheep but i have been using one for a number of years and can work 100% longer with it on than with it off. I find it a must here in Arizona. The temp. in the summer may be 110 at 3 a.m. and upwards of 120 in the day time.... be well and be safe.
Let me start by saying I love your videoes.i will follow up with a question, do you have a video on how to make these tongs. Please and thank you
Here is a playlist with some videos on tong making ua-cam.com/play/PLHta7NIJ9npZXYDsfx0p_zVUBtD07xX5l.html
I have a few Mustad Red Tang farrier rasps that I would like to make into a draw knife. I have not really gotten in to blacksmithing very well. I keep trying but just can't seem to get going. Would you be up to making a video where you turn a farrier rasp into a draw knife with hardening and tempering or make anything else out of a rasp?
Another good one John! I would like to see you turn the handles. I am a novice turner and am sure I would learn something from watching you.
I shot that part today, but won't get them on the knife until tomorrow
Amazing that you can get that steel wire to hold through the weld process. I've been trying that all day and the wire melts in seconds
It needs to be back out o the highest heat area.
👍👍👍👍
That shaving horse is pretty cool too.
Interesting to get the tool steel to move into one corner by hitting it on the edges after working it into the mild steel. Am guessing here, but that should help with prevent hitting to much vertically on those weld lines whilst forming the cube? Well also once you draw out the knifes edge again you are not working directly down those weld lines. If you had left the O1 tool steel on one leading edge initially, then the O1 would perhaps de-laminate on you? Plus you end up with more tool steel where it is needed, than having only hardenable steel. You did say that they also move at different rates. Just wondering if those are also reasons for that way of doing it as you can't get it all into video? Another good one!
I hadn't really thought of any of those reasons. But they certainly sound reasonable
John I must check back on my questions or comments in the future because even though I got notifications + bell on I did not get a message. Was interested in what you thought about it.
John why not use some leaf spring, that's what I made mine from, it's a little beauty.
Lenblacksmith, I think he may have been making one for sale, so he needed to know what kind of steel he was working from, a personal tool I would use an old wore out lawnmower blade
Leaf spring would make a fine drawknife. But I chose to use forge welding for a number of reasons. I will try to explain all of those in the final video. Kind of a cliff hanger so everyone sticks around.
Ok gotcha mate.
I'm really enjoying seeing this traditional approach.
Have you ever considered making fleshing knives for trappers, they're similar to the drawknife in shape but there's not actually a sharp edge on them, similar to a froes edge
I have made the traditional Lakota style flesher, but not the two handled style.
@@BlackBearForge being a hobbyist smith and a trapper I get people asking me to make them often. I currently dont only due to it's a hobby and I am just starting out with building my tooling. But due plan on it in the future, this video series is a great guideline to construct them
I forge outside using a fit as a forge. I have an old 14 inch Nicholson USA double cut bastard that is too dull to go to work. This file is nearly 1/4 inch thick and spark tests well. I have seen a few of these things made from old files, would you grind off the teeth so the don't form cold shuts or should I leave them in?
It is certainly best to grind the teeth off, especially near the cutting edge. But leaving some in near the back of the blade can look good and helps tell the story of its past use.
@@BlackBearForge I know that need to get the back nice and clean. Would with file work better as a bowie or should I make an 8-10 inch draw knife?
Not sure if you still get notifications from video's that you did 2 years ago.. but just in case... What are the drawbacks of just drawing the bar out beyond 1 inch so that you can just do the bevel with a grinder instead of forging out the bevel? I assume there is a reason you do it this way, but I didn't catch it in the video. Sorry for being late to the party, but thank you for all of the amazing videos!!
I do see most of the new comments. Drawing the blade out to form the bevel should save time grinding and perhaps save money on abrasives. But in the end, I doubt the completed blade will care which way it was done.
If the 01 or W1 was the same width as the mild steel would you not have a better edge? The cost may be a little more but the fiddling will be reduced ?
As long as there is enough material to have hardened steel right at the edge, everything else doesn'e matter. The only issue at that point is making sure you don't grind away all of the tool steel in the finishing process. Historically edged tools used an absolute minimum of tool steel.
Hey John, thanks for your vids. For my reference, the colour of the steel when it comes out at welding temp, is it about the same (bright white) as in the video or a duller in reality? Thanks
It is a little cooler more of a bright yellow
Great video John. You don't happen to have plans for the draw horse you were using at the beginning of the video do you?
I'm afraid I didn't build that horse.
John, I love your videos. Thank you. Can you comment on using leaf spring steel instead of w-1? I seem to pull a lot of leaf springs out of the local junkyard..thank you:)
The down side to leaf spring is that it is often stressed and may fail in use. But it is generally a good steel for tools.
@@BlackBearForge Thank You!
@@BlackBearForge Would going through welding heats and being welded to another bar as tool steel (like here) be a good way to mitigate risk with unknown (pre-stressed) steel, or is there still a pretty good risk of cracking/ fracturing/ chipping in use even with the backing if there were flaws? For that matter, if you had nothing but time and used leaf springs (and a power hammer) would it potentially help to forge weld and fold them, or are you stuck with those flaws being significant until you melt the steel? Sorry, this just popped out as an obvious set of follow up questions to this answer. I don't work with a lot of leaf springs or used steel, but people seem to like them.
Does the beveled side ride the wood? Or the flat side? When in use?
For long flat cuts or convex surface the flat goes next to the wood. For concave surface the bevel. Its common for the handles to be tipped so the knife works best one way or the other, so more than one draw knife is common
@@BlackBearForge thank you so much for the help
Nice Klein linesman I’ve been using that type for 30 years with the yellow handle and the crimper. Another great video John
Should the knife be annealed before hardening and tempering??
Thx....Paul..
Either annealed or normalized. Annealing will make it easier to grind and file. But there should always be a stress relieving step of one form or the other. It is also a good idea to repeat the stress relief after grinding since that may introduce some stress as well.
On the heat treating app sometimes it said to temper twice I guess that will release a lot of the stress
Every steel has a bit different recommendation.
Hi, first comment, what gas pressure are you running to get to weld temps? I haven’t tried it yet but I’m concerned that my forge won’t get up there. Any feedback would help. Thanks
Gas pressure is only relevant for forges with the same forge and burner design running at the same altitude. While the current forge runs at 25 psi for welding, there are some that can weld as low as 1psi and others that never make it to welding heat. Gas pressure is also not a reliable indicator of fuel consumption.
So, in your opinion, where do I start troubleshooting? Any help is greatly appreciated!
Lathe!
Ya
What you poured on the drawknife?
welding flux
is that sawhorse your design?
No, this is one from a woodworker
Another great video John, and I look forward to part 2
But I really wish you wouldn't refer to "traditional' blacksmithing techniques. How do you define what is traditional? The original blacksmith using a rock for a hammer and a stump as an anvil to shape a piece of bronze? Like any other craft, Blacksmithing has evolved. A modern blacksmith, such as yourself, uses tools and materials that a blacksmith from 300 years ago couldn't have dreamt of. Saw dust was once used as a flux I believe. I'm pretty sure that as soon as O2/C2H2 was discovered, almost 200 years ago blacksmiths would have grabbed hold of it. Just as they would have done when electric arc welding was discovered over 100 years ago. I understand your point about showing how things "can" be done without resorting to modern tools available now, but "traditionally" a blacksmith probably wouldnt have had some W1 to forge weld to a piece of 1/2" stock anyway.
Please dont take this the wrong way, I love your vids, and your style, but just reconsider what might be "traditional"
Phil Menzies, While I agree with your sentiment, Traditional means pervasive in the culture, you are referring to a more Historical, ie beginnings of
You make an old argument and one I disagree with quite passionately. Traditional techniques would be recognized by blacksmiths from any part of history even though the specific tools and materials may not be. Early iron age blacksmiths had to be familiar with the same basic techniques that a well rounded blacksmith today needs to be familiar with. Heating, drawing out, upsetting, cutting, punching, bending and forge welding. The exact tools and materials may change, but the techniques are still essentially the same. Our predecessors may not have had W1 and pre-made 1/2" square bar but they did have steel with a higher carbon content and wrought iron that they forged to an appropriate starting size for the project at hand. You are correct that blacksmiths adopted new equipment such as the torch and arc welder it is the adoption of those newer methods that caused the near loss of the art and the craft of blacksmithing. Blacksmiths quit being blacksmiths and started being welders, machinists and mechanics.
"Blacksmithing is not defined by time period or motif. Blacksmithing is defined by process alone" - George Dixon
So it's all good and we don't have to agree on the terminology. But I will continue to use the term traditional because I feel it is the right word to convey my view of the art.
how many hours a day you forge
It depends on the day. I tend to spend 6 - 8 hours in the shop. Sometimes that is forging and some times it is grinding or other bench work. Then I spend another 6 hours or so on the office side of the business. Packing, shipping, customer correspondence, book keeping and of course UA-cam
hi how hot is welding tamp in degres
About 2300 for many led steel. A bit lower for tool steel
What is the name of the device/machine? That you're sitting on using your draw knife?
Shaving horse
Couldn't you have ground the bevil instead of drawing it out?
I always learn something from you, every time you post a video 👍 - John, what would be the chances of you doing a video on forging a sickle or a scythe in the future?
It may be slim. I have never tried to forge either of those tools.
A sickle wouldn't be a million miles from a draw knife, indeed, it was watching you make a draw knife that made me think of a sickle - just a thought. 🙂
This one was a bit curvy wasn't it