My late neighbor, Everrt Ehlmer was one of the men that kept her afloat. He was a ship's carpenter and he told me his duty station was to sit below deck wondering what the hell is happening and then rushing to patch holes.
I’ll never really understand why people add a dislike to these, they’re pretty inconsequential and well made. Add onto that that Drach doesn’t get into drama or anything. I’m going to go with the healthy guess that they simply had an aneurism whilst attempting to express their immense love for the channel.
+Chūichi Nagumo Some people just think that hitting a dislike button can be the only impact they have in real life, and I hope it gives them some relief in their (what I would assume) depressing lives. Press F to show our sympathy with them, and hope they will some day get in a better situation, with sufficient meaningful gratification, in which they can allow themselves to up-vote high quality production like these are. F
Sometimes people get absurdly offended when other people say something that shatters long held idea or opinions, or even worse suggests there are more things to know. Sometimes said people then hold a grudge against the others as they 'misinform' the audience in their mind.
I gave it a thumbs down, because I expected this to be a "traveler's guide to the wonderful city of Salt Lake". But it wasn't! Its about boats of some sort.... Lol. Just kidding.. (thumbs👍)
Drachinifel tells the Salt Lake's story in a way to make it seem as if she had mastered the knack of not sinking so well they had to nuke her. Still afloat it took a fleet gunnery exercise to finally put her down. Go Salt Lake!
McMorris was probably the best US ship captains at having almost a sixth sense for following shell splashes. However, it was only the fact that Salt Lake ran out of AP shells and had to start firing high capacity rounds in desperation that saved the task force. HC rounds are used for shore bombardment, generally are set for a low altitude air burst. and go off with a tremendous explosion. An HC shell effectively mimics a 2,000 pound air bomb. Admiral Hosogaya always seemed to have an unreasonable fear of air attack, and the constant explosions of the HC shells convinced him his fleet had been located and was being bombed by the then dreaded B-17 bomber. He broke off contact and retired from a battle he had effectively won. Hosogaya, lucky to escape execution for cowardice once the facts become known, was retired to administrative duties, ending the war as governor of the Japanese South Pacific Mandates.
@@sarjim4381 I'll beg to differ on the "then dreaded B-17", which the Japanese knew to generally bomb from high altitude with almost no chance of hitting. If this fellow was afraid of the B-17, then he was probably the only one. In fall 1942, a destroyer engaged in rescue operations didn't even bother getting under way when they spotted B-17s, and were shocked when one of the 500 lb bombs actually hit the rear deck (sinking their DD).
@@kemarisite The US did a great job of propagandizing not only the B-17, which actually was in service at the outbreak of the war, but also the B-19, the Global Bomber. It too existed, but only one of them, and it was on show all over the country in the fall of 1941. We made quite a show of the Norden Bombsight as well, mostly by making sure there were many photos of B-17's guarded by heavily armed troops, and showing bombardiers taking the bombsights off the plane in heavy locked bags while being armed with .45's. There were even special bombproof magazines to store the bombsight when it was off the plane. The Norden Company itself engaged in intense self promotion while attempting to keep the bombsight itself secret. The US certainly believed its own hype. On December 2, 1941, the acting chief of the Bureau of Aeronautics enthusiastically wrote to the secretary of the Navy, “The Norden bombsight is considered to be the principal single factor of superiority which the air forces of this country possess over those of potential enemy countries.” By 1944, enough had fallen into German and Japanese hands from shot down wrecks that it was finally shown to the American public while still blurring out certain features. Most level bombing of moving ships was conducted from 12,000 to 15,000 feet since few Japanese antiaircraft weapons had accurate effective ceilings above about 12,000 feet. When the bombsight was working right and with a well trained bombardier, the Norden was no slouch. Out of a dozen bombs dropped in practice, ten could be placed with 50 feet of the center of the aim point. This may not have been accurate enough to always put a bomb on the deck, but it was close enough to cause damaging and sometimes fatal near misses. The problem was the Norden was so complex that, in the days of vacuum electronics, it needed constant maintenance and adjustment. It was just as difficult to train comptent bombsight maintainers as it was bombardiers, both requiring eighteen weeks to learn the trade. As the war intensified, those training periods went from 18 to 14 to 12 and finally to 10 weeks. Consequently, bombers were flying with improperly maintained bombsights and poorly trained bombardiers. It was that situation that contributed the poor reputation of the Norden at the end of the war. After the war, with improvements to the Norden and time to properly train maintainers and bombardiers, the Norden was able to achieve that 50 foot CEP again. It was still our standard bombsight in the B-47 and b-52, not being retired until 1967, when radar bombsights that were more accurate and easier to use had been developed. The Norden was neither magic or junk, and the Japanese did indeed fear the combination of the B-17 and the Norden, right up until the aluminum storm of B-29's, each dropping nearly the weight of an empty B-17 worth of bombs, over the homeland.
Thousand Mile War is a book about the battle in the Aleutian Islands during ww2, the Komandorskis battle was described in detail...the account of the Salt Lake City is nothing short of awesome...that old girl refused to die and kept punching the whole time...
In the late '70's I worked with a man...Elvin A. who had survived Pearl Harbor and the sinking of the USS Shaw...and it's floating Drydock. He later found himself on the USS Salt Lake City. He went to the library at lunch one day to look through the microfilm of the Saturday Evening Post magazine. There wss an article called "My Speed Zero" about the battle of the Kommadorski. Elvin was an engineer and a wizard with an HP calculator.
Hello, My grandfather was chief navigating officer on USS RANGER CV-4. 1941-1946 I would really appreciate help getting knowledge about the vessel. I have spent the past few months researching the vessel and him. PLEASE I have watched almost all your videos. You do wonderful work!
Most people don't realize what the fog of war really is and at just how confusing combat can be, even in modern warfare. I know very little when it comes to naval warfare but I spent 11 yrs in the US army (2000-2011) with 2 tours in Iraq and one in Afghanistan, plus my dad, uncle and two brothers all served in the US army (my uncle was a Marine officer) and all of us have seen combat more than once. Situational awarness is one of the most important factors in modern warfare and will usually decide who wins and loses if both sides are equally equipped. Even with all the technology we have today combat can be very confusing and overwelming for soldiers that are trained well and don't have good SI (situational awareness). The more information one has, the more likely he wins. I have watch some Desert Stroms tank documentaries and in the comment section I have seen a few British people (usually idiots that have never served in the military) talking about how US pilots shot and destroyed some British tanks. First off those pilots were doing their job and weren't in the wrong by firing on what they thought were Iraqi tanks because those British tanks had actually wondered into those aircraft's kill boxes. During Desert Strom the whole country was sectioned off into little squares called kill boxes. Any vehicle in those kill boxes were suppose to be enemy vehicles. What happened is there was some break in communication and one side didn't know what the other was doing. Also when you have several different countries fighting together on the same side, communication can be very difficult because one hand may not always be talking to the other or on the same page so to speak.
Learning bout my hometowns flagship coming 2 days after Pearl to avenge her sister ship battleship Utah, and kick ass throughout the whole Pacific. She has miracles one after the other, and even after the war surviving 2 atomic tests. Finally buried at sea with artillery fire off the US coast on purpose decades later. Insane
„Hold your fire!“ Takes out megaphone. „Are you American or Japanese?“ „Japanese.“ „Ok, we‘re Americans.“ „Ah, good to know. Thank you.“ „You‘re welcome. OPEN FIRE!!!“ „FIRE!!!“
Great vid, always love learning more naval history. One thing though, you mispronounced the Japanese Heavy Cruiser Kinugasa's name multiple times. A tip for Japanese names (or Japanese words in general) is that all of them are made up of syllables, so if you break it down it reads Ki-nu-ga-sa, whereas you were saying Ki-nu-sa-ga, switching the last two syllables. Please keep on doing vids on smaller ships too, I liked the Fletcher one very much. I'm a destroyer guy so I absolutely love hearing about those nimble torpedo-demons.
My Grandfather Richard Edgar Simons was on that ship. He never spoke of the war, and now that he's gone and I'm older, I understand why. People believe in Hell when you die. I believe these men lived it, here on Earth.
I have a question for the Drydock. How come the Bursting Charge is such a small percentage of shell weight? I.E. approximately 40-50% of an HE aerial bomb is explosive. Like I could understand why it would be low in an AP round in so much as you need a lot of steel to penetrate up to a foot of steel and steel is heavy but why are the BCs on HE rounds so small too. Like as an example U.S.S. Texas AP round weighted 1500lbs but only had a BC of 22lbs. but their bombardment round weighed 1410lbs with a 105 lb BC. Slightly less than 10% of shell weight. Is it that the sheer kinetic energy of the shell enough to compensate for the low BC?
If I had to guess, the armorers were betting that having more penetrative power would enable a smaller burst charge to deal more damage, having penetrated the more critical sections of the target. Also, an aerial bomb can afford to have a composition of 40-50% explosive because they're not fired out of a gun with extreme pressures that would detonate the payload prematurely. I'm not aware of the gunnery procedure on the Texas, but some naval guns also use different amounts of powder charges for different types of rounds. More propellant gases means more pressure on the rounds, which means the round needs to have more steel.
@@nercksrule I thought that might be a contributing factor but left it out trying to keep the question short but that does make sense to me especially when combined with the kinetic energy of the round. Although would there come a point where the "Insulating" case of the round actually lowers its effectiveness since you have such a small charge trying to break out of a thick case?
Great job os showing just how tough allied cruisers were. They could dish out the punishment as well as take it. Many Axis ships were unable to withstand the damage Allied ships took. People rave over the German and Japanese CA's but conveniently ignore by just how wide a margin these nations broke the various treaty's. It's easy to build a badass ship if your's displace 50% more than peacetime treaty's allow. Those who boast about Prinz Eugen surviving the atomic bomb blasts need to research to see how many other ships did the same
This is a characteristic of almost all navies. Ships are (unless you are GB or the US, ) irreplaceable. So you see sailors left in the water for days because of fear of sub attacks, rather than risk ships.
Samar was just the last desperate chance the IJN had to use their surface fleet to obtain a massive victory. You're right, though, they might have done better against what was left after Halsey took the bait, but they would never have gotten their ships back out, once they went in.
lamwen03 Actually I’m not even certain that they would be able to deal with the forces in the area. Centre Force was only engaging Taffy 3, leaving Taffy 1, Taffy 2 and land-based bombers to continue launching aircraft in support. Taffy 1 and 2 even managed to rearm with some aerial torpedoes (though they didn’t have many of these) and make genuine attack runs against Centre Force. On top of that, there were several cases in this battle where general-purpose bombs (not anti-ship bombs) caused severe or fatal damage to cruisers because their torpedoes exploded in their launchers. If Kurita continued, land-based aircraft and possibly the CVEs could have killed a good chunk of his force even before Halsey showed up. I doubt they'd wipe out Centre Force entirely, but it would be in bad shape. After Halsey shows up, of course, Task Force 38 has a field day. The carriers would pretty much wipe out the whole force without the Iowas even being able to get into gunnery range (so much for the idea that Iowa vs. Yamato could ever have happened)
@@bkjeong4302 Battle opens at 0700. Kurita withdraws at 0920. Halsey's first air strike went in starting at 0800, and Halsey didn't send anything back toward the south until 1115, and then TF34 spent over two hours refueling destroyers. Halsey's carriers continued beating up on Ozawa's force for the entire day. If (big IF) Kurita accepts that the destruction of the landing force is worth the lives of every man under his command and goes after the transport area at 0920 rather than disengaging, then it will be many hours before TF34 can get back and engage him, and probably tomorrow before Halsey's carriers can get back to sink any survivors. TF34 can sink anything it can catch, but it's an open question how much of the landing force survives.
IJN hidden, but gives away position by signaling USN. USN calls for a cease fire because the commander isn't sure who is shooting at who. USN runs out of proper ammo and switches to HE, causing IJN to withdraw because they think it's coming from unseen aircraft. It would be an interesting series to look at the number of battles decided because one, or both sides misunderstood what they were looking at.
@@bkjeong4302 Hammel seems to think that Scott on Atlanta was killed by a 14" hit from one of the battleships, but Richard Frank a few years later started that the largest shells to hit Atlanta were San Francisco's 8" rounds. Testimony from Atlanta officers (cited by Frank) indicates that "one of the big shells" killed Scott, but that still leaves open the possibility that a 14" incendiary shrapnel hit was not recognized as such. Obviously Atlanta was not available for the kind of detailed damage analysis that South Dakota received its encounter with Kirishima, Takao, and Atago.
Although Utah, dispite having a notable disadvantage of zero coastlines to park her, I would imagine would have liked to see her become a museum ship. Quite the battle record. Always breaks my heart to hear the fates of some of these ships- seems rather insulting to be sunk in "tests" by her own navy
At the very least, it means she's still out there, instead of becoming soda cans and shaving razors. We just need to find her remains on the seafloor, and maybe some of her artifacts can be brought to her namesake city.
@Jefferson Tong of course the New Orleans are better, they're three classes further along. Amusingly, this is the only class of pre-war 8" gun cruisers for the US that did not lose half its number (3 of 7 for the New Orleans).
I'm strangely attracted to it in WoW. Didn't think I would be, but I like it almost as much as the Aoba. Armour's thin though-you notice it in the game alright. You always need support and need to keep enemies at range, use those guns. I really think you learn to cruiser with this ship (and the Aoba-which has decent armour, is even faster-but responds to initial turns like a pig on rollar skates tied to a cement truck [Pensi's quite agile by comparison] and only has 6 guns), like you learn to destroyer with early IJN destroyers. Unfortunately everyone knows you have thin armour, so you're even more of a target than a cruiser [which everyone shoots at, as everyone thinks they can have a go and damage it]. One of the trickier ships to use because of it. It's fast though and has great guns, which is key to surviving a round with it. Plus a bit of luck.
Thank you! My Great Uncle Clark served on the Salt Lake City! He ran away to the Navy in 1940 from a little town in Iowa, since his Mom (my great-grandmother), had a tendency to meanness and would beat him from time to time. I believe he was on the SLC before Pearl Harbor from 1941 on.
Our late neighbor was a ship's carpenter on the SLC, sit below deck, don't have a clue what is happening and then rush to stop the water or put out a fire.
Heavy cruisers like Salt Lake City, San Francisco, and others became the defacto battleships of World War II. Of course there were ships like Bismarck, and New Jersey. But such high value leviathans; actually saw surprisingly little "front line" action. Being regulated to "protection duty." Escorting Aircraft Carriers, Atlantic convoys, as well as troop ship convoys. When most naval actions took place: Cruisers formed the battle line. Supported by destroyers, and smaller escorts. Despite the fact that Salt Lake City, and her sister ship; had been denounced as. "Tinclads, armed with great hammers." Salt Lake City's war record is admirable. She deserved a better fate than being sunk, as a highly radioactive wreck.
Please tell us more about the ship canvases because I often seen them on ships especially of the late victorian era to the start of the Great war. One reason why I believed it was used was to confuse enemy range finders when you put it in-between the funnels. Additionally, please tell us the different types of paint used in the late victorian era to the start of the great war. One thing that I don't know why is for example the germans painted the super structure and upper parts of the hull in a brownish colour and the rest white e.g. SMS Scharnost. And navies such as japan,russia and france had white, black and a brownish colour painted on them. Finally, please tell us about why especially pre-dreadnoughts and ships of the great war had so many rigging and things, such as the many ropes visible on images, wire/rope fences that are erected when not in combat when compared to ships of the second world war.
Airconditioning and forced air ventilation did not exist then. So the canvases where there to provide shade and thus reduce temperatures on deck and below. This is also why older ships had lots of portholes versus more modern ships with forced ventilation.
@@Cragified Awnings are still in use today with naval vessels. Even with a/c, the sun in places like the Persian Gulf will rapidly heat up the hull without the help of awnings. It's also common to see sail-like structures mounted in front of hatches leading to non air conditioned spaces like engine rooms. These act as air scoops to direct more ventilating air below and at least reduce the tropical heat.
@@Cragified I believe so as well, and I want to know more details on it. Such as what colour when and where? Where are they put on for which navies? When are they used in which navies? The cost of them. Perhaps other uses as well. And any other interesting information.
For some reason the Pensacolas put me in mind of the British Leander class, not the biggest or most powerful of cruisers but surprisingly useful in combat.
Nice timing for this video, considering that it was just announced this week that Furutaka has been found by the late-Paul Allen's research vessel Petrel.
Thanks again Drach, i'm not sure if the ships themselves are necessarily the greatest value of these videos. Each ship had several missions. Personally i find the discussions of timing about what else is happening very interesting, and any potential effect on these missions more-so. The battles are clearly noteworthy, however it would be interesting to discuss strategy or commanding officer's decisions as well. If we find a good formula maybe we can review previous ships or specific missions from a different point of view.
No mention how this "10.000t" cruiser was actually "9000t" with pretty much all the weight missing in the hull, thus making her stupidly unstable until a whole load of ballast was added? :P
@@bkjeong4302 The USN utterly failed in designing the ships. They discovered their error when the ships where launched and turned out to be dangerously unstable. The same happened with the Northampton class. These where a little bit less unstable, but still pretty poor ships that also required ballast. Portland basically was a Northampton with 900t of amour added to get it up to 10.000t. Astoria/New Orleans got quite decent armour but sacrificed hull volume and some see keeping qualities by cutting down the hull to minimum. Then you get Wichita and the Brooklyn class. Overall good ships but still build a bit light. The hull design would be reused for the Cleveland class with Cleveland's being 2000t heavier and having less main gun firepower. Basically a much stronger hull, more room for fire-control and more powerful AA. Still these ships became very top-heavy like so many USN cruisers. You couldn't build a balanced cruiser on 10.000t with 8" guns. That always was the whole intention of the British. The RN wanted a few 8" cruisers for imperial patrol duties and the main cruiser fleet should be smaller 6" armed ships. 8" cruisers without the armour to really stand up against 6" shellfire aside from vitals was the whole point. The RN didn't want a bunch of "super cruisers" floating around that could easily kill a British 6" cruiser or commerce raid with near impunity. Hence the Deutschland class being very scary ships because they simply outclassed any 8" cruiser despite their poor armour layout. You could build decent 8" armed cruisers with 12.000t like the Italians demonstrated with Zara, the Japanese with (rebuild) Mogami and Tone. I suspect that the French cheated with Algérie which pushes her more towards 12.000t and then you have Cleveland for the USA. There is a reason pretty much everybody cheated. ;)
DaniëlWW2 So you pretty much had to break treaty limits to get a decent-to-good heavy cruiser (later American cruisers, later Japanese cruisers, Zara).....
@@bkjeong4302 Yes. :P Either you accepted top speeds lower than 30kn, reduced firepower to six 8" guns or accepted protection capable of stopping 6" shellfire at best or only an armoured box around the magazines and little to no protection around the machinery spaces. You can't have it all. 12.000t basically allowed an 150mm/6" belt and 50mm/2" deck which gave decent protection against 8" AP. Further it allowed 30kn+ top speeds and the usual eight or nine 8" guns.
One DD stayed behind to make smoke for the crippled SLC while the other three lead by DD-492 the USS Bailey did torp runs on the heavies, DD492 was the only one to get torps away and took a few 8" rounds killing some of the crew for her trouble and was just barely able to limp back to Dutch Harbor with little freeboard to spare.
My Grand Father worked at the shipyard where that ship was build (NY ship yard) in Camden NJ. Its a shame He died in the late 70's I wish i could have gotten to hear all the stories about the ships he worked on
My Great Uncle Jim “James” W. Davis was the Kingfisher Recon Plan pilot on this ship. He survived the war and I was able to speak with before he died last year. RIP
My grandfather Edward Frederick Odau was a seaman second class radio operator on the ship in 1943. He passed away when I was very young and I never got to ask him about his service. Thank you for covering this ship
My Dad was a radioman 3rd class aboard the SLC Nov 41 to Nov 42...he didn't talk much about the war...if you didn't know there is a web site dedicated to her...ussslcca25.com/
This is a report from the Fletcher video, but I'd like to reaffirm my suggestion: The japanese cruiser Izumo. It has a rich history, in my humble opinion, being part of the Russo-Japanese war as well as being present during the battle of Shanghai as the flagship of the Third Fleet. Peter Harmsen comments several times in his book "Shanghai 1937: Stalingrad on the Yangtze" how it lead a "charmed" life, remaining unscathed during the many chinese attacks on the ship.
@@ISKTR114 Izumo was copy of a Brit super dreadnought class ship which he already did, unless you ONLY want a history descriptor which is interesting in its own right. =)
@@w8stral I'm a little confused. The japanese cruiser Izumo was laid down and launched in 1898, some years before HMS Dreadnought. I'm in no way an expert on the subject, but I think Izumo was an armoured cruiser. Could it be that we're talking about two different ships?
Question for Drydock: You mentioned Japanese mistakenly took HE fire for high attitude bombing during Battle of the Komandorskis, is this a once in a blue moon type of thing or similar scenarios happened more often than people would expect. Kind of an follow up, can captain and/or officers on board determine approximately how big/small the caliber of the shells are based on they way shells land in water? (assuming they don't already know what type of ship they are dealing with)
There were marines on Guadalcanal who initially mistook the Japanese naval bombardment for aircraft. That mistake was quickly remedied when those big orange lights in the sky didn't stop getting closer.
This would be really unusual. Both sides called for air support, both sides presumably heard the radio transmissions calling for air support, but neither side's planes could intervene. The call, combined with the change in shell splashes when SLS ran out of AP, was what led the Japanese to believe they were under air attack.
If I'm not mistaken, but I believe the USS Salt Lake City was in more engagements with the enemy than any other U.S. Navy ship - to include the USS Enterprise - during WW2.
The Battle of the Komandorski Islands is one that is rarely mentioned, being part of 'The Forgotten War' (Also the title of a series of visual history books on the same topic by Stan Cohen, as another poster mentioned) but it holds the distinction as the single longest solely naval gunnery battle of WW2, with no aircraft interference. It could also be considered a turning point in the war of the north - as preventing that one convoy stopped future convoys, shortening the war for the Aleutian Island chain. As for the Swayback Maru herself, she's one of the warships to have been commanded by John Wayne's characters; the ship was nicknamed "Old Swayback" in the movie "In Harm's Way". She had a very storied life, and i do hope one day they find her remains.
Am I the only one that heard Drachinifiel pronounce Kinugasa as KinuSAGA? No? Ok. Welp, I guess it doesn't really matter, so everyone please just ignore this. Thanks!
I read somewhere that the crew called her "the Swayback Maru." Her machinery stopped during the Komandorskis because some idiot rating fed salt water to her boilers. Luckily, that got straightened out before the Japanese closed the range too much...
My Dad was assigned as a Radioman aboard the SLC November 1941 to November 1942....Dad didn't talk much about his time aboard....thank you for giving a little bit of history about her...I do remember him telling me he should of been in Pearl on the 7th but was delayed at sea because of a storm
Radar was very new, and the USN had no commanders who had trained with it. As I understand it, all pre-war USN training was done in daylight with calm seas to cut down on accidents.
Seniority, same as everyone else. However, he actually developed a plan, communicated it to his subordinate commanders, and took made an opportunity for some night firing practice. Unlike Dan Callaghan.
@Drachinifel - if you can, look up 'The Forgotten War' series by Stan Cohen. its a 4 volume pictoral history set, and it goes into considerable detail regarding the Komandorski Islands battle as well as the capture of the first intact Zero.
My question is why weren't these admirals a little more intelligent about finding out who they were fighting where they were fighting and what plan that they had just in case....
Pinned post for Q&A :)
Alaska vs Scharnhorst 15 inch, Stalingrad vs Scharnhorst 15 inch, Stalingrad vs Alaska
Another one, but this is quick. Will robotic videos make a return?
I would like to see a video or some form of coverage on the Lexington class Battlecruisers before they were converted on dock to aircraft carriers.
Did the british pacific fleet deserve the forgotten fleet moniker or did they perform a worthwhile role?
Drachinifel A bit of an odd one: Despite the infinitesimal chance, has these ever been a recorded instance of two naval shell colliding in mid-air?
My late neighbor, Everrt Ehlmer was one of the men that kept her afloat. He was a ship's carpenter and he told me his duty station was to sit below deck wondering what the hell is happening and then rushing to patch holes.
I’ll never really understand why people add a dislike to these, they’re pretty inconsequential and well made. Add onto that that Drach doesn’t get into drama or anything. I’m going to go with the healthy guess that they simply had an aneurism whilst attempting to express their immense love for the channel.
+Chūichi Nagumo
Some people just think that hitting a dislike button can be the only impact they have in real life, and I hope it gives them some relief in their (what I would assume) depressing lives. Press F to show our sympathy with them, and hope they will some day get in a better situation, with sufficient meaningful gratification, in which they can allow themselves to up-vote high quality production like these are.
F
In the case of this channel, the dislike button is the troll meter.
Sometimes people get absurdly offended when other people say something that shatters long held idea or opinions, or even worse suggests there are more things to know. Sometimes said people then hold a grudge against the others as they 'misinform' the audience in their mind.
The dislike button is not the down load button
I gave it a thumbs down, because I expected this to be a "traveler's guide to the wonderful city of Salt Lake". But it wasn't! Its about boats of some sort.... Lol. Just kidding.. (thumbs👍)
Admiral Scott: "Roger"
Everyone: Opens fire
Admiral Scott: "WAS IT SOMETHING I SAID?"
ua-cam.com/video/NfDUkR3DOFw/v-deo.html
Drachinifel tells the Salt Lake's story in a way to make it seem as if she had mastered the knack of not sinking so well they had to nuke her. Still afloat it took a fleet gunnery exercise to finally put her down. Go Salt Lake!
There's a beautiful model of the SLC in the quarterdeck of the Navy Reserve Center at Ft. Douglas in Salt Lake.
Wish I’d known that. I spent alot of time at Ft. Douglas with my father (Army Reserve) when I was a kid.
USS Salt Lake City is one of my favorite warships. Thank you for the video.
Good Old Swayback Maru. McMorris at the Komandorski's dodging shell fire and shouting, "Fooled 'em again!" after every miss.
McMorris was probably the best US ship captains at having almost a sixth sense for following shell splashes. However, it was only the fact that Salt Lake ran out of AP shells and had to start firing high capacity rounds in desperation that saved the task force. HC rounds are used for shore bombardment, generally are set for a low altitude air burst. and go off with a tremendous explosion. An HC shell effectively mimics a 2,000 pound air bomb. Admiral Hosogaya always seemed to have an unreasonable fear of air attack, and the constant explosions of the HC shells convinced him his fleet had been located and was being bombed by the then dreaded B-17 bomber. He broke off contact and retired from a battle he had effectively won. Hosogaya, lucky to escape execution for cowardice once the facts become known, was retired to administrative duties, ending the war as governor of the Japanese South Pacific Mandates.
@@sarjim4381 I'll beg to differ on the "then dreaded B-17", which the Japanese knew to generally bomb from high altitude with almost no chance of hitting. If this fellow was afraid of the B-17, then he was probably the only one. In fall 1942, a destroyer engaged in rescue operations didn't even bother getting under way when they spotted B-17s, and were shocked when one of the 500 lb bombs actually hit the rear deck (sinking their DD).
@@kemarisite The US did a great job of propagandizing not only the B-17, which actually was in service at the outbreak of the war, but also the B-19, the Global Bomber. It too existed, but only one of them, and it was on show all over the country in the fall of 1941. We made quite a show of the Norden Bombsight as well, mostly by making sure there were many photos of B-17's guarded by heavily armed troops, and showing bombardiers taking the bombsights off the plane in heavy locked bags while being armed with .45's. There were even special bombproof magazines to store the bombsight when it was off the plane. The Norden Company itself engaged in intense self promotion while attempting to keep the bombsight itself secret. The US certainly believed its own hype. On December 2, 1941, the acting chief of the Bureau of Aeronautics enthusiastically wrote to the secretary of the Navy, “The Norden bombsight is considered to be the principal single factor of superiority which the air forces of this country possess over those of potential enemy countries.” By 1944, enough had fallen into German and Japanese hands from shot down wrecks that it was finally shown to the American public while still blurring out certain features.
Most level bombing of moving ships was conducted from 12,000 to 15,000 feet since few Japanese antiaircraft weapons had accurate effective ceilings above about 12,000 feet. When the bombsight was working right and with a well trained bombardier, the Norden was no slouch. Out of a dozen bombs dropped in practice, ten could be placed with 50 feet of the center of the aim point. This may not have been accurate enough to always put a bomb on the deck, but it was close enough to cause damaging and sometimes fatal near misses. The problem was the Norden was so complex that, in the days of vacuum electronics, it needed constant maintenance and adjustment. It was just as difficult to train comptent bombsight maintainers as it was bombardiers, both requiring eighteen weeks to learn the trade. As the war intensified, those training periods went from 18 to 14 to 12 and finally to 10 weeks. Consequently, bombers were flying with improperly maintained bombsights and poorly trained bombardiers. It was that situation that contributed the poor reputation of the Norden at the end of the war.
After the war, with improvements to the Norden and time to properly train maintainers and bombardiers, the Norden was able to achieve that 50 foot CEP again. It was still our standard bombsight in the B-47 and b-52, not being retired until 1967, when radar bombsights that were more accurate and easier to use had been developed. The Norden was neither magic or junk, and the Japanese did indeed fear the combination of the B-17 and the Norden, right up until the aluminum storm of B-29's, each dropping nearly the weight of an empty B-17 worth of bombs, over the homeland.
@Frank DeMaris, the captain of the Mutsuki was not frightened.
@@kemarisite If you drop enough bombs you going to hit something. lol
Thousand Mile War is a book about the battle in the Aleutian Islands during ww2, the Komandorskis battle was described in detail...the account of the Salt Lake City is nothing short of awesome...that old girl refused to die and kept punching the whole time...
My grandfather served on this ship, Ernest E. Bick, chief petty office, R.I.P. Pop, thanks for the memories & the stories.
In the late '70's I worked with a man...Elvin A. who had survived Pearl Harbor and the sinking of the USS Shaw...and it's floating Drydock. He later found himself on the USS Salt Lake City. He went to the library at lunch one day to look through the microfilm of the Saturday Evening Post magazine. There wss an article called "My Speed Zero" about the battle of the Kommadorski. Elvin was an engineer and a wizard with an HP calculator.
Hello,
My grandfather was chief navigating officer on USS RANGER CV-4. 1941-1946 I would really appreciate help getting knowledge about the vessel. I have spent the past few months researching the vessel and him. PLEASE I have watched almost all your videos. You do wonderful work!
Most people don't realize what the fog of war really is and at just how confusing combat can be, even in modern warfare. I know very little when it comes to naval warfare but I spent 11 yrs in the US army (2000-2011) with 2 tours in Iraq and one in Afghanistan, plus my dad, uncle and two brothers all served in the US army (my uncle was a Marine officer) and all of us have seen combat more than once. Situational awarness is one of the most important factors in modern warfare and will usually decide who wins and loses if both sides are equally equipped. Even with all the technology we have today combat can be very confusing and overwelming for soldiers that are trained well and don't have good SI (situational awareness). The more information one has, the more likely he wins.
I have watch some Desert Stroms tank documentaries and in the comment section I have seen a few British people (usually idiots that have never served in the military) talking about how US pilots shot and destroyed some British tanks. First off those pilots were doing their job and weren't in the wrong by firing on what they thought were Iraqi tanks because those British tanks had actually wondered into those aircraft's kill boxes. During Desert Strom the whole country was sectioned off into little squares called kill boxes. Any vehicle in those kill boxes were suppose to be enemy vehicles. What happened is there was some break in communication and one side didn't know what the other was doing. Also when you have several different countries fighting together on the same side, communication can be very difficult because one hand may not always be talking to the other or on the same page so to speak.
The Battle of the Kormandorskis was one of the few daylight encounters of WW2 between the IJN & the USN
USS Salt Lake City, stubborn to the end
Amazing story
I suggest a video on the Yukikaze
Learning bout my hometowns flagship coming 2 days after Pearl to avenge her sister ship battleship Utah, and kick ass throughout the whole Pacific. She has miracles one after the other, and even after the war surviving 2 atomic tests. Finally buried at sea with artillery fire off the US coast on purpose decades later. Insane
I wish you would do a workup on the battles of Savo island.
Oh my gosh, salt lake is my city this is great
Is there an explanation for the unusual layout of the main armament - triple turrets above twins - in another video?
It's because the hull was too narrow for triples at the points they wanted them, so they had to go with twins
@@dubsy1026 thanks, I was curious as my dad served on HMS Blake in the early '60s.
„Hold your fire!“ Takes out megaphone. „Are you American or Japanese?“ „Japanese.“ „Ok, we‘re Americans.“ „Ah, good to know. Thank you.“ „You‘re welcome. OPEN FIRE!!!“ „FIRE!!!“
Great vid, always love learning more naval history.
One thing though, you mispronounced the Japanese Heavy Cruiser Kinugasa's name multiple times. A tip for Japanese names (or Japanese words in general) is that all of them are made up of syllables, so if you break it down it reads Ki-nu-ga-sa, whereas you were saying Ki-nu-sa-ga, switching the last two syllables.
Please keep on doing vids on smaller ships too, I liked the Fletcher one very much. I'm a destroyer guy so I absolutely love hearing about those nimble torpedo-demons.
Lolicon...
@@mayer492 I'm sorry? Where'd that come from?
@@daknight44 nothing....
@@daknight44 i just thought you might get the joke
@@mayer492 Oh, I know what you're talking about now...sorry, I don't really approve of the way Japanese media depicts Destroyers haha
A sad fate for a great ship; and a valiant warrior of the sea.
*KinuGAsa (sorry Drach)
My Grandfather Richard Edgar Simons was on that ship. He never spoke of the war, and now that he's gone and I'm older, I understand why. People believe in Hell when you die. I believe these men lived it, here on Earth.
Why do a lot of these old photos have one turret facing in some seemingly random direction?
The destroyer USS Wallace
Lind
I have a question for the Drydock. How come the Bursting Charge is such a small percentage of shell weight? I.E. approximately 40-50% of an HE aerial bomb is explosive. Like I could understand why it would be low in an AP round in so much as you need a lot of steel to penetrate up to a foot of steel and steel is heavy but why are the BCs on HE rounds so small too. Like as an example U.S.S. Texas AP round weighted 1500lbs but only had a BC of 22lbs. but their bombardment round weighed 1410lbs with a 105 lb BC. Slightly less than 10% of shell weight. Is it that the sheer kinetic energy of the shell enough to compensate for the low BC?
If I had to guess, the armorers were betting that having more penetrative power would enable a smaller burst charge to deal more damage, having penetrated the more critical sections of the target. Also, an aerial bomb can afford to have a composition of 40-50% explosive because they're not fired out of a gun with extreme pressures that would detonate the payload prematurely.
I'm not aware of the gunnery procedure on the Texas, but some naval guns also use different amounts of powder charges for different types of rounds.
More propellant gases means more pressure on the rounds, which means the round needs to have more steel.
@@nercksrule I thought that might be a contributing factor but left it out trying to keep the question short but that does make sense to me especially when combined with the kinetic energy of the round. Although would there come a point where the "Insulating" case of the round actually lowers its effectiveness since you have such a small charge trying to break out of a thick case?
IJN Yūbari please
*sigh* The 2 dirty words of naval historians, Operation Crossroads.
Great job os showing just how tough allied cruisers were. They could dish out the punishment as well as take it.
Many Axis ships were unable to withstand the damage Allied ships took.
People rave over the German and Japanese CA's but conveniently ignore by just how wide a margin these nations broke the various treaty's. It's easy to build a badass ship if your's displace 50% more than peacetime treaty's allow.
Those who boast about Prinz Eugen surviving the atomic bomb blasts need to research to see how many other ships did the same
the wreck still have radiation
everything has radiation, if you want to make a point it's the specific level you need to discuss :)
USS Wisconsin
Another example of the Japanese retreating when they should have won a battle. They were a bit cautious.
This is a characteristic of almost all navies. Ships are (unless you are GB or the US, ) irreplaceable. So you see sailors left in the water for days because of fear of sub attacks, rather than risk ships.
This is actually a much better example of the IJN giving up too soon than Samar (they really couldn’t have won Samar).
Samar was just the last desperate chance the IJN had to use their surface fleet to obtain a massive victory. You're right, though, they might have done better against what was left after Halsey took the bait, but they would never have gotten their ships back out, once they went in.
lamwen03
Actually I’m not even certain that they would be able to deal with the forces in the area. Centre Force was only engaging Taffy 3, leaving Taffy 1, Taffy 2 and land-based bombers to continue launching aircraft in support. Taffy 1 and 2 even managed to rearm with some aerial torpedoes (though they didn’t have many of these) and make genuine attack runs against Centre Force. On top of that, there were several cases in this battle where general-purpose bombs (not anti-ship bombs) caused severe or fatal damage to cruisers because their torpedoes exploded in their launchers.
If Kurita continued, land-based aircraft and possibly the CVEs could have killed a good chunk of his force even before Halsey showed up. I doubt they'd wipe out Centre Force entirely, but it would be in bad shape.
After Halsey shows up, of course, Task Force 38 has a field day. The carriers would pretty much wipe out the whole force without the Iowas even being able to get into gunnery range (so much for the idea that Iowa vs. Yamato could ever have happened)
@@bkjeong4302 Battle opens at 0700. Kurita withdraws at 0920. Halsey's first air strike went in starting at 0800, and Halsey didn't send anything back toward the south until 1115, and then TF34 spent over two hours refueling destroyers. Halsey's carriers continued beating up on Ozawa's force for the entire day.
If (big IF) Kurita accepts that the destruction of the landing force is worth the lives of every man under his command and goes after the transport area at 0920 rather than disengaging, then it will be many hours before TF34 can get back and engage him, and probably tomorrow before Halsey's carriers can get back to sink any survivors. TF34 can sink anything it can catch, but it's an open question how much of the landing force survives.
3:46 So Trump did go to war after all
Bit of a stretch
LOL!
IJN hidden, but gives away position by signaling USN.
USN calls for a cease fire because the commander isn't sure who is shooting at who.
USN runs out of proper ammo and switches to HE, causing IJN to withdraw because they think it's coming from unseen aircraft.
It would be an interesting series to look at the number of battles decided because one, or both sides misunderstood what they were looking at.
Good old Fog of War
How about First Guadalcanal? When we have one American flagship be partially responsible for sinking another American flagship?
@@suflanker45 x
@@bkjeong4302 Hammel seems to think that Scott on Atlanta was killed by a 14" hit from one of the battleships, but Richard Frank a few years later started that the largest shells to hit Atlanta were San Francisco's 8" rounds. Testimony from Atlanta officers (cited by Frank) indicates that "one of the big shells" killed Scott, but that still leaves open the possibility that a 14" incendiary shrapnel hit was not recognized as such. Obviously Atlanta was not available for the kind of detailed damage analysis that South Dakota received its encounter with Kirishima, Takao, and Atago.
@@kemarisite
I was less talking about Scott's death specifically and more about the Atlanta's loss.
Although Utah, dispite having a notable disadvantage of zero coastlines to park her, I would imagine would have liked to see her become a museum ship. Quite the battle record. Always breaks my heart to hear the fates of some of these ships- seems rather insulting to be sunk in "tests" by her own navy
At the very least, it means she's still out there, instead of becoming soda cans and shaving razors. We just need to find her remains on the seafloor, and maybe some of her artifacts can be brought to her namesake city.
If we could move whales to the salt lake we could move the ship to her namesake.
Oh no the Pepsicola class cruisers aka the floating citadel hit of world of warships
@Jefferson Tong of course the New Orleans are better, they're three classes further along. Amusingly, this is the only class of pre-war 8" gun cruisers for the US that did not lose half its number (3 of 7 for the New Orleans).
@Jefferson Tong the atlanta is better lol
@Jefferson Tong ya well so can i ;)
nah jk lol but yeah ur right but atlanta shootin over a island just blazing a battleship is satisfying
Came here to comment about Pepsicola, I hate that ship so much.
I'm strangely attracted to it in WoW. Didn't think I would be, but I like it almost as much as the Aoba. Armour's thin though-you notice it in the game alright. You always need support and need to keep enemies at range, use those guns. I really think you learn to cruiser with this ship (and the Aoba-which has decent armour, is even faster-but responds to initial turns like a pig on rollar skates tied to a cement truck [Pensi's quite agile by comparison] and only has 6 guns), like you learn to destroyer with early IJN destroyers. Unfortunately everyone knows you have thin armour, so you're even more of a target than a cruiser [which everyone shoots at, as everyone thinks they can have a go and damage it]. One of the trickier ships to use because of it. It's fast though and has great guns, which is key to surviving a round with it. Plus a bit of luck.
Thank you! My Great Uncle Clark served on the Salt Lake City! He ran away to the Navy in 1940 from a little town in Iowa, since his Mom (my great-grandmother), had a tendency to meanness and would beat him from time to time. I believe he was on the SLC before Pearl Harbor from 1941 on.
So he rather face the wrath of the Japanese Navy then his own mother. 😂
My grandpa was a gunners' mate on her during WW2. Been trying to learn more. JW Jones.
Our late neighbor was a ship's carpenter on the SLC, sit below deck, don't have a clue what is happening and then rush to stop the water or put out a fire.
Greetings,
how about the Ice cream Barges that were deployed to the Pacific in WW2.
Heavy cruisers like Salt Lake City, San Francisco, and others became the defacto battleships of World War II. Of course there were ships like Bismarck, and New Jersey. But such high value leviathans; actually saw surprisingly little "front line" action. Being regulated to "protection duty." Escorting Aircraft Carriers, Atlantic convoys, as well as troop ship convoys.
When most naval actions took place: Cruisers formed the battle line. Supported by destroyers, and smaller escorts. Despite the fact that Salt Lake City, and her sister ship; had been denounced as. "Tinclads, armed with great hammers." Salt Lake City's war record is admirable. She deserved a better fate than being sunk, as a highly radioactive wreck.
The University of Utah will honor this heavy cruiser when it plays Oregon by wearing grey Uniforms and hemets !
The "Swayback Maru" was a gallant ship that did her duty well. Stubbornness and tenacity were her watchwords.
Please tell us more about the ship canvases because I often seen them on ships especially of the late victorian era to the start of the Great war. One reason why I believed it was used was to confuse enemy range finders when you put it in-between the funnels.
Additionally, please tell us the different types of paint used in the late victorian era to the start of the great war. One thing that I don't know why is for example the germans painted the super structure and upper parts of the hull in a brownish colour and the rest white e.g. SMS Scharnost. And navies such as japan,russia and france had white, black and a brownish colour painted on them.
Finally, please tell us about why especially pre-dreadnoughts and ships of the great war had so many rigging and things, such as the many ropes visible on images, wire/rope fences that are erected when not in combat when compared to ships of the second world war.
+Hater4321
I would expect those canvases are mostly for crew comfort, as there is not a lot of shade you can find when at sea.
Airconditioning and forced air ventilation did not exist then. So the canvases where there to provide shade and thus reduce temperatures on deck and below. This is also why older ships had lots of portholes versus more modern ships with forced ventilation.
@@Cragified Awnings are still in use today with naval vessels. Even with a/c, the sun in places like the Persian Gulf will rapidly heat up the hull without the help of awnings. It's also common to see sail-like structures mounted in front of hatches leading to non air conditioned spaces like engine rooms. These act as air scoops to direct more ventilating air below and at least reduce the tropical heat.
@@Cragified I believe so as well, and I want to know more details on it. Such as what colour when and where? Where are they put on for which navies? When are they used in which navies? The cost of them. Perhaps other uses as well. And any other interesting information.
@Daniel Large Good reply, but I still want to have more information, such as which variants in different times and navies.
I don't see a Q&A post, but I'd like to put in a request for the Treasury class Coast Guard cutters, among the longest serving of all interwar ships.
I would like to see a complete video on operation crossroads, in particular how much damage the ships actually took
You tube has entire Navy films on the tests.
@@WALTERBROADDUS yeah but this guy explains stuff better imo
Excellent video 👍. And I'm glad to observe that you're referring correctly to the ships as "she" and "her". 😀.
Matthew , Bismarck and Tirpitz would be highly offended if you referred to either one as her! You do not want to see them angry, !
@@tommatt2ski Sure I would. My last ship, the John R. Craig DD 885, was a destroyed, named after sub commander killed in action by an enemy destroyer.
Q and A Could you do a video about the USS Laffey DD-724. Theres an exellent book about her. "Hell from the Heavans" by John Wukovits
Old Swayback
For some reason the Pensacolas put me in mind of the British Leander class, not the biggest or most powerful of cruisers but surprisingly useful in combat.
Omaha class Cruiser pls .
Nice timing for this video, considering that it was just announced this week that Furutaka has been found by the late-Paul Allen's research vessel Petrel.
Could you do the german battle cruiser SMS Von der Tann
The cruiser named for my hometown
One of the luckiest warships of the USN.
Her ending made me sad. It seems disrespectful to irradiate and then sink her after her service.
Thanks again Drach, i'm not sure if the ships themselves are necessarily the greatest value of these videos. Each ship had several missions. Personally i find the discussions of timing about what else is happening very interesting, and any potential effect on these missions more-so. The battles are clearly noteworthy, however it would be interesting to discuss strategy or commanding officer's decisions as well.
If we find a good formula maybe we can review previous ships or specific missions from a different point of view.
No mention how this "10.000t" cruiser was actually "9000t" with pretty much all the weight missing in the hull, thus making her stupidly unstable until a whole load of ballast was added? :P
DaniëlWW2
.....but why? Why design a ship that far under the treaty limits?
@@bkjeong4302 The USN utterly failed in designing the ships. They discovered their error when the ships where launched and turned out to be dangerously unstable. The same happened with the Northampton class. These where a little bit less unstable, but still pretty poor ships that also required ballast.
Portland basically was a Northampton with 900t of amour added to get it up to 10.000t. Astoria/New Orleans got quite decent armour but sacrificed hull volume and some see keeping qualities by cutting down the hull to minimum. Then you get Wichita and the Brooklyn class. Overall good ships but still build a bit light. The hull design would be reused for the Cleveland class with Cleveland's being 2000t heavier and having less main gun firepower. Basically a much stronger hull, more room for fire-control and more powerful AA. Still these ships became very top-heavy like so many USN cruisers.
You couldn't build a balanced cruiser on 10.000t with 8" guns. That always was the whole intention of the British. The RN wanted a few 8" cruisers for imperial patrol duties and the main cruiser fleet should be smaller 6" armed ships. 8" cruisers without the armour to really stand up against 6" shellfire aside from vitals was the whole point. The RN didn't want a bunch of "super cruisers" floating around that could easily kill a British 6" cruiser or commerce raid with near impunity. Hence the Deutschland class being very scary ships because they simply outclassed any 8" cruiser despite their poor armour layout.
You could build decent 8" armed cruisers with 12.000t like the Italians demonstrated with Zara, the Japanese with (rebuild) Mogami and Tone. I suspect that the French cheated with Algérie which pushes her more towards 12.000t and then you have Cleveland for the USA. There is a reason pretty much everybody cheated. ;)
DaniëlWW2
So you pretty much had to break treaty limits to get a decent-to-good heavy cruiser (later American cruisers, later Japanese cruisers, Zara).....
@@bkjeong4302 Yes. :P
Either you accepted top speeds lower than 30kn, reduced firepower to six 8" guns or accepted protection capable of stopping 6" shellfire at best or only an armoured box around the magazines and little to no protection around the machinery spaces. You can't have it all.
12.000t basically allowed an 150mm/6" belt and 50mm/2" deck which gave decent protection against 8" AP. Further it allowed 30kn+ top speeds and the usual eight or nine 8" guns.
Interesting point about the USN DDs at Komondorski. Smoke screens seem to be quite effective.
One DD stayed behind to make smoke for the crippled SLC while the other three lead by DD-492 the USS Bailey did torp runs on the heavies, DD492 was the only one to get torps away and took a few 8" rounds killing some of the crew for her trouble and was just barely able to limp back to Dutch Harbor with little freeboard to spare.
Hey Drach,thanks for another good video.
FYI the Japanese cruiser wasn't "KinuSAGA"...it was "KinuGASA".
You spell with an accent ;)
ahh, reminds me of the many Flat Top war games!
My Grandparents were married aboard her, My Grandfather was an original plank owner..... Thank You for the Video!!
Some say these battles are a tragedy, but why do they start out as a comedy of errors?
My Granddad was the Yoman on the Salt Lake City. He brought home alot of picturess and sone newspapers that I still have.
Its KinuGASA not KinuSAGA...
(Sorry for being a grammar nazi… :\ )
Could you please talk about USS Indianapolis CA-35 or maybe the HMCS Haida
My Grand Father worked at the shipyard where that ship was build (NY ship yard) in Camden NJ. Its a shame He died in the late 70's I wish i could have gotten to hear all the stories about the ships he worked on
my grandpa thanks yours, from Alabama.
I'm not sure why this video made me think of it, but I think USS Saint Paul would make for a good video.
How about discussing the career of USS Waddell, DDG 24?
Can you do the IJN Furutaka and her sister ship Kako next?
USS Newport News would make a good video
Great vid! Thanks for pronouncing USS Helena correctly the second time (I'm originally from Helena, MT, and it rarely gets pronounced correctly).
As in most engagement turns into a total C- F
What Country do you think had the best designed predreadnought Battleship and what was the ship class
My Great Uncle Jim “James” W. Davis was the Kingfisher Recon Plan pilot on this ship. He survived the war and I was able to speak with before he died last year. RIP
My grandpa was a gunners' mate. JW Jones.
tanks a nuke blast yet in WOWS goes BOOM easily
She just didn't want to die. Strong ship
Do hmas Australia
My grandfather Edward Frederick Odau was a seaman second class radio operator on the ship in 1943. He passed away when I was very young and I never got to ask him about his service. Thank you for covering this ship
My grandpa was a gunners' mate on at the same time!
My Dad was a radioman 3rd class aboard the SLC Nov 41 to Nov 42...he didn't talk much about the war...if you didn't know there is a web site dedicated to her...ussslcca25.com/
My father was on that ship in 1941.
This is a report from the Fletcher video, but I'd like to reaffirm my suggestion: The japanese cruiser Izumo.
It has a rich history, in my humble opinion, being part of the Russo-Japanese war as well as being present during the battle of Shanghai as the flagship of the Third Fleet. Peter Harmsen comments several times in his book "Shanghai 1937: Stalingrad on the Yangtze" how it lead a "charmed" life, remaining unscathed during the many chinese attacks on the ship.
Did he not do the Izumo? Its just a bought Brit ship.
@@w8stral Did he do the Izumo? I can't the find the video, if that's the case.
@@ISKTR114 Izumo was copy of a Brit super dreadnought class ship which he already did, unless you ONLY want a history descriptor which is interesting in its own right. =)
@@w8stral I'm a little confused. The japanese cruiser Izumo was laid down and launched in 1898, some years before HMS Dreadnought. I'm in no way an expert on the subject, but I think Izumo was an armoured cruiser. Could it be that we're talking about two different ships?
@@ISKTR114 Erm.... Most likely and which case I am probably wrong.
Is there a video on ww2 us destroyer escorts ?
Gotta love Swayback Maru.
5:08 and 5:25 - IJN Kinugasa not Kinusaga.
My states ship!!!!!
Helena = HELL-in-uh
Question for Drydock: You mentioned Japanese mistakenly took HE fire for high attitude bombing during Battle of the Komandorskis, is this a once in a blue moon type of thing or similar scenarios happened more often than people would expect. Kind of an follow up, can captain and/or officers on board determine approximately how big/small the caliber of the shells are based on they way shells land in water? (assuming they don't already know what type of ship they are dealing with)
There were marines on Guadalcanal who initially mistook the Japanese naval bombardment for aircraft. That mistake was quickly remedied when those big orange lights in the sky didn't stop getting closer.
This would be really unusual. Both sides called for air support, both sides presumably heard the radio transmissions calling for air support, but neither side's planes could intervene. The call, combined with the change in shell splashes when SLS ran out of AP, was what led the Japanese to believe they were under air attack.
thanks boss
If I'm not mistaken, but I believe the USS Salt Lake City was in more engagements with the enemy than any other U.S. Navy ship - to include the USS Enterprise - during WW2.
The Battle of the Komandorski Islands is one that is rarely mentioned, being part of 'The Forgotten War' (Also the title of a series of visual history books on the same topic by Stan Cohen, as another poster mentioned) but it holds the distinction as the single longest solely naval gunnery battle of WW2, with no aircraft interference. It could also be considered a turning point in the war of the north - as preventing that one convoy stopped future convoys, shortening the war for the Aleutian Island chain.
As for the Swayback Maru herself, she's one of the warships to have been commanded by John Wayne's characters; the ship was nicknamed "Old Swayback" in the movie "In Harm's Way". She had a very storied life, and i do hope one day they find her remains.
Am I the only one that heard Drachinifiel pronounce Kinugasa as KinuSAGA?
No?
Ok.
Welp, I guess it doesn't really matter, so everyone please just ignore this. Thanks!
I read somewhere that the crew called her "the Swayback Maru." Her machinery stopped during the Komandorskis because some idiot rating fed salt water to her boilers. Luckily, that got straightened out before the Japanese closed the range too much...
My Dad was assigned as a Radioman aboard the SLC November 1941 to November 1942....Dad didn't talk much about his time aboard....thank you for giving a little bit of history about her...I do remember him telling me he should of been in Pearl on the 7th but was delayed at sea because of a storm
I'd be interested to hear how Scott got to be an Admiral, seeing as he seemed so clueless about how to fight a war. 😉
Radar was very new, and the USN had no commanders who had trained with it. As I understand it, all pre-war USN training was done in daylight with calm seas to cut down on accidents.
Seniority, same as everyone else. However, he actually developed a plan, communicated it to his subordinate commanders, and took made an opportunity for some night firing practice. Unlike Dan Callaghan.
@@lamwen03 it felt like to no surprise the most able US surface commander with radar is none other than Admiral Lee himself
@Drachinifel - if you can, look up 'The Forgotten War' series by Stan Cohen. its a 4 volume pictoral history set, and it goes into considerable detail regarding the Komandorski Islands battle as well as the capture of the first intact Zero.
:45. The class azahole... you'd have to be more specific. My class contained several Azaholes!
oh gosh. The miscommunication in this episode between commanders and front line ships, and forces thinking HE shell splashes were airborne... haha.
I try to make videos that have pictures but after I put the thumbnail it's the same picture of this video please don't copyright me
would like to see video on the Battleship USS Missouri ( BB-63) to be made
My question is why weren't these admirals a little more intelligent about finding out who they were fighting where they were fighting and what plan that they had just in case....