Thank you, I am learning bongos, good for an older persons brain. Tough to find nice demonstrations, like yours, my goal is to just play along to some songs, while learning more skills.
Yes. Music of all kinds is good for your brain! Learning new skills helps to strengthen brain function, making new neural connections as I understand the science of it all. ;-) I hope that you will find many years of enjoyment.
I appreciate the perspective of looking down onto the bongos as it's easier to visualize and comprehend compared to most bongo instructional videos where the player is sitting in front of the audience. Thanks.
As being new to Bongo, this is by far the best video I'v seen. Being able to look down on the bongos made it much easier. The slow motion also allowed me to get the pattern quickly.
Thanks for your comment. I did slow down on parts of it. Did you watch the whole video? In any case, I may do another bongo lesson or two in the future. ;-) I may be launching some kind of music tutorial program online. I am a multi-instrumentalist. Trumpet, keyboards, guitar, percussion and more. ;-)
it seems that you have a lot of strength in your fingers to make them roll so fast and get such a powerful sound. each of your fingers is a real little hammer
Before playing any percussion instruments, I was a semi-professional trumpet and keyboard player in bands and also play guitar. All of those instruments require building finger strength and agility. ;-) There are finger exercise devices that you can purchase that will help to develop finger, wrist and hand strength. Shop for a device called "GRIPMASTER" which is a favorite among guitar players for strengthening the power in your fingers, hands and wrist. ;-)
@@WillyWithAwhY OK, I understand better, there is no miracle, there is mostly work. I put the gripmaster on my Am... wish list - 15€ in Europe THANK YOU FOR THE TIP
Wow... looks simple, what's wrong with my hands? Guess this is where 'practice for dummies' comes in. Look forward to coordinating the 2 hands. Thank you for your video.
Great video, but quick question: for the habanera at the beginning, is there a specific reason why you're doing Left-Right-Right-Left, and not Right-Left-Right-Left, which would seem more intuitive as it gives you more time to move your right hand to the hembra, since it does not have to hit twice in a row? Just wondering, not that it impedes on the quality of your demonstration! : )
Huh? lol - Hmmmmmmm... I don't do Left-Right-Right-Left - what? It is Left-Left-Right-Right. ;-) As to you wanting to do it in some other order, hey, whatever works for you. As to your question of speed, how fast do you think that you need to do a Habanera and why would there be any problem whatsoever doing it exactly the way that I showed you? It is more about developing the coordination of the patterns first, then you work on speed. It is muscle memory training like about any other hand coordination exercise. Over time, whether it be hand drums or any percussion instrument, you will develop all kinds of different patterns over time. Take for example, the complicated hand and foot work of playing a trap (conTRAPtion) set. You are using two feet and two hands and over time you will develop ways of combining an infinite number of combinations to created various patterns. So, you would, over time, on a simple two drum setup like a set of bongos you would end up with left-left-right-right, left-right-left-right, right-left-right-left, right-right-left-left, etc. into infinity. The Habanera is taught to be played exactly as I did it. ;-) You want to do it differently? Try it any way that you like. Rhythm is an infinite universe. ;-)
@@WillyWithAwhY Yes, my bad, you indeed do Left-Left-Right-Right, when in fact it should be Left-Right-Left-Right, although once again, not a criticism, I was just wondering if there was a specific purpose behind that. Check all the tutorials out there on YT or in various manuals, and it is always taught L-R-L-R, which indeed sounds more intuitive since alternating hands as much as you can allows you to have time to move your hand around and position it for its next beat while the other one is playing. But again, I did not meant to be disrespectful, I think your video is cool, but saying that your way is how it is taught to be played is slightly inaccurate, hence my original question on whether this was done on purpose or not. : )
@@michaelgauthier4078 The words "Yes, my bad, you indeed do Left-Left-Right-Right, when in fact it should be Left-Right-Left-Right,..." are simply inaccurate, though you are welcome to BELIEVE anything you want to believe I suppose. The Habenera, specifically, was taught to me by a master - LEFT-LEFT-RIGHT-RIGHT, but yes, some may teach it LEFT-RIGHT-LEFT-RIGHT. Speed, however, is not much of a concern with the Habenera and it shouldn't be a problem for you to do it BOTH WAYS. .If you want to play drums of any kind, then it will be IMPOSSIBLE for you to go through life with an always alternating hand attitude. LOL - Let's take the full TRAP SET lessons for example. TRAP is short for CONTRAPTION or in the case of a full drum setup on stage for one person to play is a CONTRAPTION with multiple drums, cymbals, bells, blocks, etc. You can and will see all sorts of CONTRAPTIONS (TRAP SETS) with anything from a small basic set all the way up to ridiculous setups of literally a hundred or more things to strike. With a TRAP SET you will learn to coordinate two hands and two feet. You will be taught, over time, nearly every conceivable combination of hand and feet coordinated series of strikes. Sometimes you will be using one, two, three or all four striking something simultaneous or in any imaginable order. It is quite common for you to be taught LEFT-RIGHT-LEFT-RIGHT, then RIGHT-LEFT-RIGHT-LEFT as the BEGINNING strokes. If you want to play drums of any kind then that is absolute ground zero, lesson one. After that you will have all kinds of combinations - if H stands for HAND and F stands for foot, then imagine this for a moment: LH-RH-LH-RH, then RH-LH-RH-LH. Now do your feet with your left foot on a hi-hat and right foot on a bass drum. LF-RF-LF-RF, then RF-LF-RF-LF. Now do both your hands and your feet. Do LH-RH-LH-RH while simultaneously doing LF-RF-LF-RF. Now have your hands and feet doing opposites by continuing to do LH-RH-LH-RH while simultaneously doing RF-LF-RF-LF. Now change that completely and do RH-LH-RH-LH while simultaneously doing LF-RF-LF-RF. What I just illustrated was very, very, very simple first lesson for a drummer wanting to play a trap set. Alternating hands and feet, mixing it up, with these basics is first coordination. Then you will start getting more and more complicated LH-LH-RH-RH while simultaneously doing LF-LF-RF-RF - then LH-LH-RH-RH with RF-RF-LF-LF, then RH-RH-LH-LH with RF-RF-LF-LF. Along the way, you will start learning all of these combinations, doing it slow, then speeding it up. There are INFINITE patterns and combinations and ORDERS to the strikes from your INSTRUMENTS (your hands, feet and striking instruments such as drumsticks or mallets or brushes, etc.) If you think that you can excel at any percussion instrument by always alternating LEFT-RIGHT-LEFT-RIGHT, then you would be quite mistaken. With a pair of bongos or a pair of congas you are simply striking two drums, in whatever order can be accomplished to get the rhythm and the sound that you want. What about a setup where you have 4 conga drums standing in front of you and a simple pair of bongos on a stand above the conga drums? You cannot reach every drum with each hand when doing fast combinations, which is why you will HAVE TO learn to do consecutive strikes, at speed with each hand. LH-LH, LH-LH-LH LH-LH-LH-LH, etc. Imagine situations where you will be striking two drums simultaneously. Imagine a simple 4 beat measure (4/4 time) where your left hand must do this: LH-LH-LH-LH while your right hand does this: RH-0-RH-0 (ZERO MEANING NO STRIKE). How many combinations could I create with just two hands and just 4 beats. LH-0-LH-0 with RH-RH-0-RH. Now, imagine that you are playing 1/8 notes (2 strikes per beat) LH-LH-LH-LH-LH-LH-LH-LH at the same time as this: RH-0-0-0-RH-0-RH-RH. OR THIS: LH-0-LH-0-LH-LH-0-LH while at the same time 0-RH-0-RH-0-0-0-RH. Do you see how complicated this can quickly get, even with just two hands and two drums? The combinations are literally infinite. LH-RH-LH-RH and RH-LH-RH-LH are just the core, basic, very heart of the start of learning to do percussion. The purpose of any beginning, intermediate and advanced level training is to constantly improve your coordination with the goal of being able to train your mind and body to be able to do whatever is needed to create the rhythm and sound required. ;-) It is NOT intuitive to think that you could possibly accomplish everything on a set of drums always alternating hands and/or feet. In fact, it is quite IMPOSSIBLE and counter-intuitive. Your hands have to be taught how to do everything - alternating, skipping, combination hits, simultaneous hits, etc. into infinity. ;-) Now, when talking about speed of strikes, learning to finger roll will produce more consecutive hits than you could ever accomplish with alternating hands. I can create basically the equivalent of a drum roll with finger rolls. A drum roll on a snare drum is NOT alternating hands (alternating sticks). It is multiple strikes of each stick and alternating those sticks. You hit the drum with a stick and it bounces and hits again, multiple times, then the other stick, bouncing hitting multiple times. That creates a drum roll. On a guitar, a good player might make you think the guy is striking a string with his pick or finger super fast, when what is actually happening is he is striking the string once with his right hand, while HAMMERING DOWN on a string with a left finger, then PULLING OFF immediately. So, in reality that guitar player may strike a string, HAMMER ON and PULLING OFF which SOUNDS LIKE 3 strikes. One stroke, three strikes - or even one strike, HAMMER ON, PULL OFF, HAMMER ON, PULL OFF and that sounds like 5 separate strikes. I have 3 pairs of bongos, so when set up on stands that is 6 drums to get to. ;-) If I were to set up my FULL LATIN PERCUSSION TRAP SET (contraption), I have 6 Bongo drums (three pair), a small conga, a pair of timbale drums, 5 wood blocks, 5 plastic jam blocks, multiple cowbells (I have 12 of them, though that would be overkill), toss up a couple of cymbals (I have 14 of them), timbale sticks, cowbell beater, triangle, sleigh bells, guiro, and a couple of pairs of maracas, tambourine, shaker eggs, etc. Also have shakers and such that attach to fingers, wrists or even your ankle. LEFT-RIGHT-LEFT-RIGHT is going to happen a lot less often than you think as you progress in the world of percussion. ;-) Finally, there is no ONE RIGHT WAY to play music or even just one technique to accomplish any one thing. Along the way, people have mastered new techniques and passed them on. I was told by my high school concert band teacher that it was WRONG for me to play my trumpet with the mouthpiece off to the right of the center of my lips, though I had already been doing so for years. But, that's how I played it and my jazz band director was a trumpet player who also played with his mouthpiece off to the side of center all of his life. I got #1 ratings on my trumpet solos at conference, district and state band contests. I guess my way was ok. I made money playing my trumpet for over 3 decades. ;-) I mostly taught myself how to play keyboards, guitars, harmonicas, drums and many other instruments and I am quite certain that I play them all "wrong" by some people's standards. I pick up a technique here and a technique there and I do what works for me. If serious about an instrument, you will learn many things from many people, many books, etc. You will figure out what works for you and you will find your limitations - then press hard to progress past them. Percussion playing is a developing of coordination, which means, like learning to shoot basketball free throws, a journey through repetition leading to muscle memory and hand-eye coordination and such. ;-) MY BACKGROUND IN MUSIC: Minored in music in college - was taking music theory in high school and college. I played trumpet, keyboards, harmonicas and Latin percussion semi-professionally in a half a dozen professional, working bands, primarily rock, blues and soul music, but also have played in jazz ensembles and even old-style big bands, not to mention all the fun I had in concert band and marching band in school. ;-) I worked in professional bands for over 3 decades. ;-) How long have I played musical instruments? I am 60 years young and played trumpet since age 9 - I can play pretty much any brass instrument - trombone, tuba, etc. I also play keyboards, guitars, harmonicas, Irish tin penny whistles (a type of flute - think the theme from TITANIC), Vietnamese mouth harp, and the HUMBUCKER ELECTRIC KAZOO (I know that last one sounds made up, but no, it is a real thing). ;-) My mother was a pianist. My father was a guitarist and did some folk singing and such. Music was practically bottle-fed to me and MUSIC was my first love, though I never made my full-time living at it. I have taught hundreds of students on multiple instruments for decades. GOOD LUCK!
@@WillyWithAwhY Thanks a lot for the very detailed answer! As mentioned earlier, I'm a complete beginner so I'm not sure to fully understand all the examples you mention, but they help in getting your point across. Again, I did not mean to criticize your technique, just to try to understand how things are, and how and why they should be! ; )
Thank you, I am learning bongos, good for an older persons brain. Tough to find nice demonstrations, like yours, my goal is to just play along to some songs, while learning more skills.
Yes. Music of all kinds is good for your brain! Learning new skills helps to strengthen brain function, making new neural connections as I understand the science of it all. ;-) I hope that you will find many years of enjoyment.
I appreciate the perspective of looking down onto the bongos as it's easier to visualize and comprehend compared to most bongo instructional videos where the player is sitting in front of the audience. Thanks.
Thank you. Hope you enjoy your bongo world. ;-)
As being new to Bongo, this is by far the best video I'v seen. Being able to look down on the bongos made it much easier. The slow motion also allowed me to get the pattern quickly.
Great video
Thanks! Have fun!
this was fun!
Glad you enjoyed it. Good luck with your bongo dreams! ;-)
Willy!~~
thanks for the video. looking to learn some bongo ;-)
How are you coming along with your bongo playing? ;-) It is a fun little instrument.
Cool 😊👍🏾
Thanks. Something simple to get folks started. ;-)
Very good video! Will be watching this many times!
Thank you. Just have fun with it.
im having an issue on how to tuned them :(
You might find a video on here that addresses tuning of your bongo drums. ;-)
slow it down a little
Thanks for your comment. I did slow down on parts of it. Did you watch the whole video? In any case, I may do another bongo lesson or two in the future. ;-) I may be launching some kind of music tutorial program online. I am a multi-instrumentalist. Trumpet, keyboards, guitar, percussion and more. ;-)
it seems that you have a lot of strength in your fingers to make them roll so fast and get such a powerful sound.
each of your fingers is a real little hammer
Before playing any percussion instruments, I was a semi-professional trumpet and keyboard player in bands and also play guitar. All of those instruments require building finger strength and agility. ;-) There are finger exercise devices that you can purchase that will help to develop finger, wrist and hand strength. Shop for a device called "GRIPMASTER" which is a favorite among guitar players for strengthening the power in your fingers, hands and wrist. ;-)
@@WillyWithAwhY OK, I understand better, there is no miracle, there is mostly work.
I put the gripmaster on my Am... wish list - 15€ in Europe
THANK YOU FOR THE TIP
Great video ! Thank you !!!
You are most certainly welcome. Hope it helps you live your Bongo dreams. ;-)
KEEP THE BEAT!
Wow... looks simple, what's wrong with my hands? Guess this is where 'practice for dummies' comes in. Look forward to coordinating the 2 hands.
Thank you for your video.
Like anything else, it is a matter of time spent in practice to get your coordination.
Great video, but quick question: for the habanera at the beginning, is there a specific reason why you're doing Left-Right-Right-Left, and not Right-Left-Right-Left, which would seem more intuitive as it gives you more time to move your right hand to the hembra, since it does not have to hit twice in a row? Just wondering, not that it impedes on the quality of your demonstration! : )
Huh? lol - Hmmmmmmm... I don't do Left-Right-Right-Left - what? It is Left-Left-Right-Right. ;-) As to you wanting to do it in some other order, hey, whatever works for you. As to your question of speed, how fast do you think that you need to do a Habanera and why would there be any problem whatsoever doing it exactly the way that I showed you? It is more about developing the coordination of the patterns first, then you work on speed. It is muscle memory training like about any other hand coordination exercise. Over time, whether it be hand drums or any percussion instrument, you will develop all kinds of different patterns over time. Take for example, the complicated hand and foot work of playing a trap (conTRAPtion) set. You are using two feet and two hands and over time you will develop ways of combining an infinite number of combinations to created various patterns. So, you would, over time, on a simple two drum setup like a set of bongos you would end up with left-left-right-right, left-right-left-right, right-left-right-left, right-right-left-left, etc. into infinity. The Habanera is taught to be played exactly as I did it. ;-) You want to do it differently? Try it any way that you like. Rhythm is an infinite universe. ;-)
@@WillyWithAwhY Yes, my bad, you indeed do Left-Left-Right-Right, when in fact it should be Left-Right-Left-Right, although once again, not a criticism, I was just wondering if there was a specific purpose behind that. Check all the tutorials out there on YT or in various manuals, and it is always taught L-R-L-R, which indeed sounds more intuitive since alternating hands as much as you can allows you to have time to move your hand around and position it for its next beat while the other one is playing. But again, I did not meant to be disrespectful, I think your video is cool, but saying that your way is how it is taught to be played is slightly inaccurate, hence my original question on whether this was done on purpose or not. : )
@@michaelgauthier4078 The words "Yes, my bad, you indeed do Left-Left-Right-Right, when in fact it should be Left-Right-Left-Right,..." are simply inaccurate, though you are welcome to BELIEVE anything you want to believe I suppose. The Habenera, specifically, was taught to me by a master - LEFT-LEFT-RIGHT-RIGHT, but yes, some may teach it LEFT-RIGHT-LEFT-RIGHT. Speed, however, is not much of a concern with the Habenera and it shouldn't be a problem for you to do it BOTH WAYS. .If you want to play drums of any kind, then it will be IMPOSSIBLE for you to go through life with an always alternating hand attitude. LOL - Let's take the full TRAP SET lessons for example. TRAP is short for CONTRAPTION or in the case of a full drum setup on stage for one person to play is a CONTRAPTION with multiple drums, cymbals, bells, blocks, etc. You can and will see all sorts of CONTRAPTIONS (TRAP SETS) with anything from a small basic set all the way up to ridiculous setups of literally a hundred or more things to strike. With a TRAP SET you will learn to coordinate two hands and two feet. You will be taught, over time, nearly every conceivable combination of hand and feet coordinated series of strikes. Sometimes you will be using one, two, three or all four striking something simultaneous or in any imaginable order. It is quite common for you to be taught LEFT-RIGHT-LEFT-RIGHT, then RIGHT-LEFT-RIGHT-LEFT as the BEGINNING strokes. If you want to play drums of any kind then that is absolute ground zero, lesson one. After that you will have all kinds of combinations - if H stands for HAND and F stands for foot, then imagine this for a moment: LH-RH-LH-RH, then RH-LH-RH-LH. Now do your feet with your left foot on a hi-hat and right foot on a bass drum. LF-RF-LF-RF, then RF-LF-RF-LF. Now do both your hands and your feet. Do LH-RH-LH-RH while simultaneously doing LF-RF-LF-RF. Now have your hands and feet doing opposites by continuing to do LH-RH-LH-RH while simultaneously doing RF-LF-RF-LF. Now change that completely and do RH-LH-RH-LH while simultaneously doing LF-RF-LF-RF. What I just illustrated was very, very, very simple first lesson for a drummer wanting to play a trap set. Alternating hands and feet, mixing it up, with these basics is first coordination. Then you will start getting more and more complicated LH-LH-RH-RH while simultaneously doing LF-LF-RF-RF - then LH-LH-RH-RH with RF-RF-LF-LF, then RH-RH-LH-LH with RF-RF-LF-LF. Along the way, you will start learning all of these combinations, doing it slow, then speeding it up. There are INFINITE patterns and combinations and ORDERS to the strikes from your INSTRUMENTS (your hands, feet and striking instruments such as drumsticks or mallets or brushes, etc.) If you think that you can excel at any percussion instrument by always alternating LEFT-RIGHT-LEFT-RIGHT, then you would be quite mistaken. With a pair of bongos or a pair of congas you are simply striking two drums, in whatever order can be accomplished to get the rhythm and the sound that you want. What about a setup where you have 4 conga drums standing in front of you and a simple pair of bongos on a stand above the conga drums? You cannot reach every drum with each hand when doing fast combinations, which is why you will HAVE TO learn to do consecutive strikes, at speed with each hand. LH-LH, LH-LH-LH LH-LH-LH-LH, etc. Imagine situations where you will be striking two drums simultaneously. Imagine a simple 4 beat measure (4/4 time) where your left hand must do this: LH-LH-LH-LH while your right hand does this: RH-0-RH-0 (ZERO MEANING NO STRIKE). How many combinations could I create with just two hands and just 4 beats. LH-0-LH-0 with RH-RH-0-RH. Now, imagine that you are playing 1/8 notes (2 strikes per beat) LH-LH-LH-LH-LH-LH-LH-LH at the same time as this: RH-0-0-0-RH-0-RH-RH. OR THIS: LH-0-LH-0-LH-LH-0-LH while at the same time 0-RH-0-RH-0-0-0-RH. Do you see how complicated this can quickly get, even with just two hands and two drums? The combinations are literally infinite. LH-RH-LH-RH and RH-LH-RH-LH are just the core, basic, very heart of the start of learning to do percussion. The purpose of any beginning, intermediate and advanced level training is to constantly improve your coordination with the goal of being able to train your mind and body to be able to do whatever is needed to create the rhythm and sound required. ;-) It is NOT intuitive to think that you could possibly accomplish everything on a set of drums always alternating hands and/or feet. In fact, it is quite IMPOSSIBLE and counter-intuitive. Your hands have to be taught how to do everything - alternating, skipping, combination hits, simultaneous hits, etc. into infinity. ;-) Now, when talking about speed of strikes, learning to finger roll will produce more consecutive hits than you could ever accomplish with alternating hands. I can create basically the equivalent of a drum roll with finger rolls. A drum roll on a snare drum is NOT alternating hands (alternating sticks). It is multiple strikes of each stick and alternating those sticks. You hit the drum with a stick and it bounces and hits again, multiple times, then the other stick, bouncing hitting multiple times. That creates a drum roll. On a guitar, a good player might make you think the guy is striking a string with his pick or finger super fast, when what is actually happening is he is striking the string once with his right hand, while HAMMERING DOWN on a string with a left finger, then PULLING OFF immediately. So, in reality that guitar player may strike a string, HAMMER ON and PULLING OFF which SOUNDS LIKE 3 strikes. One stroke, three strikes - or even one strike, HAMMER ON, PULL OFF, HAMMER ON, PULL OFF and that sounds like 5 separate strikes.
I have 3 pairs of bongos, so when set up on stands that is 6 drums to get to. ;-)
If I were to set up my FULL LATIN PERCUSSION TRAP SET (contraption), I have 6 Bongo drums (three pair), a small conga, a pair of timbale drums, 5 wood blocks, 5 plastic jam blocks, multiple cowbells (I have 12 of them, though that would be overkill), toss up a couple of cymbals (I have 14 of them), timbale sticks, cowbell beater, triangle, sleigh bells, guiro, and a couple of pairs of maracas, tambourine, shaker eggs, etc. Also have shakers and such that attach to fingers, wrists or even your ankle. LEFT-RIGHT-LEFT-RIGHT is going to happen a lot less often than you think as you progress in the world of percussion. ;-)
Finally, there is no ONE RIGHT WAY to play music or even just one technique to accomplish any one thing. Along the way, people have mastered new techniques and passed them on. I was told by my high school concert band teacher that it was WRONG for me to play my trumpet with the mouthpiece off to the right of the center of my lips, though I had already been doing so for years. But, that's how I played it and my jazz band director was a trumpet player who also played with his mouthpiece off to the side of center all of his life. I got #1 ratings on my trumpet solos at conference, district and state band contests. I guess my way was ok. I made money playing my trumpet for over 3 decades. ;-) I mostly taught myself how to play keyboards, guitars, harmonicas, drums and many other instruments and I am quite certain that I play them all "wrong" by some people's standards. I pick up a technique here and a technique there and I do what works for me. If serious about an instrument, you will learn many things from many people, many books, etc. You will figure out what works for you and you will find your limitations - then press hard to progress past them. Percussion playing is a developing of coordination, which means, like learning to shoot basketball free throws, a journey through repetition leading to muscle memory and hand-eye coordination and such. ;-)
MY BACKGROUND IN MUSIC: Minored in music in college - was taking music theory in high school and college. I played trumpet, keyboards, harmonicas and Latin percussion semi-professionally in a half a dozen professional, working bands, primarily rock, blues and soul music, but also have played in jazz ensembles and even old-style big bands, not to mention all the fun I had in concert band and marching band in school. ;-) I worked in professional bands for over 3 decades. ;-)
How long have I played musical instruments? I am 60 years young and played trumpet since age 9 - I can play pretty much any brass instrument - trombone, tuba, etc. I also play keyboards, guitars, harmonicas, Irish tin penny whistles (a type of flute - think the theme from TITANIC), Vietnamese mouth harp, and the HUMBUCKER ELECTRIC KAZOO (I know that last one sounds made up, but no, it is a real thing). ;-)
My mother was a pianist. My father was a guitarist and did some folk singing and such. Music was practically bottle-fed to me and MUSIC was my first love, though I never made my full-time living at it. I have taught hundreds of students on multiple instruments for decades.
GOOD LUCK!
@@WillyWithAwhY Thanks a lot for the very detailed answer! As mentioned earlier, I'm a complete beginner so I'm not sure to fully understand all the examples you mention, but they help in getting your point across. Again, I did not mean to criticize your technique, just to try to understand how things are, and how and why they should be! ; )
@WillyWithAwhY - I think you answered the question....ahhh, was was the question, again?