Wander, as a game designer currently working on an incremental game (Incremental Bullet-Heaven), please never stop rambling about incremental game design. There're so few creators talking about Incremental games, and even fewer with the amount of perspective and first-hand experience as you, and it's immensely helpful to hear other's perspectives on different mechanics, features, or paradigms. It gives so many ideas, and helps refine my own project a lot quicker than I would be able to otherwise.
You know a game has a lot of potential when wanderbots goes spitballing about ways it could be better. When someone enthusiastically gives their ideas and opinions, it's not an indication the idea is bad and need improvement, it rather shows it caught someone's interest in a deep way and made them think a lot about your idea.
For anyone wondering, the game got patched the day this video released to fix the asteroid despawn range, as the arrow freaking out was indeed due to the despawn being too close.
Pretty sure the multiplier at the end of a harvest is not based on the number of generators like you theorized but based on how many asteroids destroyed or resources picked up, so more energy would allow a larger multiplier! More multiplier means more resources so more generator upgrades and generator upgrades mean more bits to by ship upgrades.
28:40 I know it's not a rogue-like, but the Learn to Fly flash-game series has the progression loop you are talking about. Very short rounds where you earn bonus cash by earning records and achievements in the round, then buying upgrades that let you survive longer and go further to make more cash.
Arrow freakout seems easy to fix, if there's already a system in place to identify the closest asteroid then a few lines of code making the closest asteroid never despawn and that nothing can spawn closer than the identified closest should be enough.
Or something like number of asteroids destroyed. Either way yes, going down the power line does give you an efficiency boost in its own way. Which, kudos to the developer. Clearly they put some real thought into the game because they accounted for exactly the sentiment that Wander had. They created a reason why you would want to stay in the level longer
You know... The thing I like least in this genre is actually the feeling of everything being a bit too samey... I know it's fun to see number up, but things like Gnorp Apologue showed how creative such games can be too. That game was so good I replayed it recently, which for other games in the genre I'd frankly never consider. I played that Widget Inc. demo too, and I felt like I already saw everything that game had by the time the demo ended. I could well imagine how the game might be, and I'd already had my fill there.
I always like to believe that a gamer's perspective and experience of what they think makes a great game is important even though making a game is obviously quite different and a bit difficult, they are the audience the devs must appeal to, after all. In any case the game looks pretty good for something that players may be looking for something easy and simple to get into.
You talking about build variety and incremental rpgs honestly makes me wish hero clicker had gotten some some real support. They had a game come out a long time ago that basically set you up to go flying through enemies with some relatively interactive elements to really make your build work. I honestly could see someone putting out an Incremental game that takes the lessons from its automation and reworks it closer to a final fantasy or pokemon format. Where you just set up what your people will do within the 30 seconds or so they have to kill as many enemies as possible. Prestige is pretty much written into the game too, most upgrades on that tree could refund time, reduce mana cost, unlock multi-actions, and all sorts of other things that really tighten up the gameplay loop.
So to the effect of the run lasts so long and you do more in that amount of time is very “Increlution” the story based incremental game where you build up instinct levels by doing tasks and when you start back at the beginning you do it faster than the last time. Actually I’m pretty sure you played it a good while ago. I think you would enjoy it if you came back to it for a while. They kept updating the chapters you progress through.
Chokepoint-based leverage like you were talking about (engineering yourself out of a specific need or task) (all into one and one into all) is an interest of mine.
in case you decide to play more, one thing I feel you underestimated here, is how extra power capacity would actually help you. It's not just "a longer run", it's also more time to build up that multiplier it gives at the end of every run.
I suspect that since the asteroids are constantly spawning, and that the arrow points to the nearest asteroid, a large amount of the arrow changing direction is that a new asteroid spawning may cause the arrow to change direction
I am so sick of these awesome games that take 2 hours to beat. I get that its basically free but the frustration of not getting to play these games endlessly isnt worth starting them for me D:
There is an incremental tower defense game on mobile called The Tower, tho it kinda sucks as it takes months to get anywhere, even with the no ads bundle and an auto clicker to restart rounds. The amount of currency you need for upgrades becomes horrible to gain.
@@Staladus May I suggest to you: > uBlockOrigin - ad blocker plugin for PC > Revanced - modified youtube client thingy for phone (android, dk abt ios) which blocks ads and such
it makes me miss the older flash castle defense games where you got hordes of stick figures walking towards your castle and you had to shoot the enemies with various weapons like bows and guns, and stuff.
My favourite incremental game is weirdly enough a Roblox game called Circle Incremental. It feels like there’s always something to do and different tiers of progression make it feel like you’re playing multiple games. They came out with a second one called Circle Grinding Incremental which isn’t as fun, but still has some of the same charm.
So to the effect of the run lasts so long and you do more in that amount of time is very “Increlution” the story based incremental game where you build up instinct levels by doing tasks and when you start back at the beginning you do it faster than the last time.
Hey @Wanderbots, will you try an interesting game which released a couple of days ago? It called Loco Motive. It's an interesting pixel point and click murder mystery. I am looking forward to play with it as well.
Between incremental games and roguelikes lies the undiscovered depths within the Roguelite genre Edit: now that I think about it, Rogue Legacy 2 kinda falls into that category
wander: i dont like making the run long because incriase the time betwen upgrades run ends* wnader:HMMMMMM lets do another run ksakskskaskaskskas(me laughing in brasilian)
1:25 and if its not linear it will be balancing hell 9:25 there's a game in early access/build called Nomad Idle and so far it was really good idle incremental RPG. Says it will come out in march and I think you at least should have it on your radar
i always wanted to tell someone about a game its called {caves rougliek} on mobile its one of the best game ever its just not getting its far view just because its a mobile game and i dont think the dev is making a pc one for a resoan its a bit graindy but very cool gameplay alots of deferant game satyl and over all good
I don't think asteroids are despawning. The indicator is just showing asteroid very far away. The arrow freaking out seems to be caused by an asteroid spawning closer than the one arrow indicates. Which is still annoying and I think they can just fix it by making it so that asteroids can only spawn near you not million miles away.
I started Journey to Incrementalia recently and there are points where is essentially says the build I want to use is invalid. My Poison-Rupture build clearly has explicit support but not enough to actually get through certain walls. Support for many builds is good but if clearly supported builds don't work that is not good design. I like to use weird builds but Poison-Rupture is not one of them.
Eh, I'll be honest, there's so much royalty free music on the market now, I don't think devs who don't do their own music have to rely on commercial songs. It's a bit lazy.
I'm not so sure that pushing people to review the game is the right call. It will skew the game's sales to reviews ratio but it might not have the sort of boost in Steam visibility you'd hope for. Content creators like yourself making the video is the big push for visibility that these games need and it will increase the sales and reviews naturally if the viewers got interested. Having the game's Steam page linked and directing traffic to it is one vector that can increase the visibility of the game in Steam. Steam tends to start recommending games that receive external traffic.
Having a high review:sales ratio is good from what I've heard from every single developer I've ever talked to. Especially since the Steam algorithm promotes games further at certain review thresholds (10, 100, 500, etc...)
Disgaea incremental game lol.. No way it's tactical rpg. Nothing in the game is really automated. Leveling up and such is also pretty normal for standard RPGs and you don't need to do reincarnation to even beat the game just for some post game stuff.
Sounds like you've never beaten/attempted Baal. It's definitely incremental when you're aiming for that, especially with the new automation mechanics in 6 & 7.
some of your commentary really triggers me. It almost feels like you’re saying “man this would be so much more fun if roguelike!” for damn near every game you play and every time it irritates me to no end
![Merciless Alien Zombie Outbreak Roguelite - [REDACTED] [Sponsored]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/GY2ILrqXvVE/mqdefault.jpg)
![Merciless Alien Zombie Outbreak Roguelite - [REDACTED] [Sponsored]](/img/tr.png)
Wander, as a game designer currently working on an incremental game (Incremental Bullet-Heaven), please never stop rambling about incremental game design. There're so few creators talking about Incremental games, and even fewer with the amount of perspective and first-hand experience as you, and it's immensely helpful to hear other's perspectives on different mechanics, features, or paradigms. It gives so many ideas, and helps refine my own project a lot quicker than I would be able to otherwise.
Yooooo that's right up my alley! Can I have a bit more info about your game or help you with testing?
You know a game has a lot of potential when wanderbots goes spitballing about ways it could be better. When someone enthusiastically gives their ideas and opinions, it's not an indication the idea is bad and need improvement, it rather shows it caught someone's interest in a deep way and made them think a lot about your idea.
These games are exactly why I’m subscribed to you
For anyone wondering, the game got patched the day this video released to fix the asteroid despawn range, as the arrow freaking out was indeed due to the despawn being too close.
I watched half of the video, bought the game and finished it in one sitting. It takes about 3 hours, not bad for 1 dollar.
Stopped watching the video after 5 minutes, bought the game, and beat it in one sitting as well.
Pretty sure the multiplier at the end of a harvest is not based on the number of generators like you theorized but based on how many asteroids destroyed or resources picked up, so more energy would allow a larger multiplier! More multiplier means more resources so more generator upgrades and generator upgrades mean more bits to by ship upgrades.
Gnorp Apologue definitely has it's own "I do my own thing" vacuum and it worked flawlessly. What a banger of an incremental game :D .
I love node busters. I'll have to check this out!
28:40 I know it's not a rogue-like, but the Learn to Fly flash-game series has the progression loop you are talking about. Very short rounds where you earn bonus cash by earning records and achievements in the round, then buying upgrades that let you survive longer and go further to make more cash.
Arrow freakout seems easy to fix, if there's already a system in place to identify the closest asteroid then a few lines of code making the closest asteroid never despawn and that nothing can spawn closer than the identified closest should be enough.
the multiplier of resoucres seems to be based on time spent in level, so energy upgrades are huge
Or something like number of asteroids destroyed. Either way yes, going down the power line does give you an efficiency boost in its own way.
Which, kudos to the developer. Clearly they put some real thought into the game because they accounted for exactly the sentiment that Wander had. They created a reason why you would want to stay in the level longer
You know... The thing I like least in this genre is actually the feeling of everything being a bit too samey... I know it's fun to see number up, but things like Gnorp Apologue showed how creative such games can be too. That game was so good I replayed it recently, which for other games in the genre I'd frankly never consider.
I played that Widget Inc. demo too, and I felt like I already saw everything that game had by the time the demo ended. I could well imagine how the game might be, and I'd already had my fill there.
Yeah, the genre is best when it's based around some weird and cool idea, and doesn't take itself too seriously or try to be a "forever game"
I always like to believe that a gamer's perspective and experience of what they think makes a great game is important even though making a game is obviously quite different and a bit difficult, they are the audience the devs must appeal to, after all. In any case the game looks pretty good for something that players may be looking for something easy and simple to get into.
The song was "Stuck in The Apocalyptic Vision" by "At The End Of Times, Nothing". Love your content and got into PostRock because of your videos
More specifically on the Gnorp Apologue series, couldn't stop listening to Firebird for a week!
You talking about build variety and incremental rpgs honestly makes me wish hero clicker had gotten some some real support. They had a game come out a long time ago that basically set you up to go flying through enemies with some relatively interactive elements to really make your build work. I honestly could see someone putting out an Incremental game that takes the lessons from its automation and reworks it closer to a final fantasy or pokemon format. Where you just set up what your people will do within the 30 seconds or so they have to kill as many enemies as possible. Prestige is pretty much written into the game too, most upgrades on that tree could refund time, reduce mana cost, unlock multi-actions, and all sorts of other things that really tighten up the gameplay loop.
So to the effect of the run lasts so long and you do more in that amount of time is very “Increlution” the story based incremental game where you build up instinct levels by doing tasks and when you start back at the beginning you do it faster than the last time. Actually I’m pretty sure you played it a good while ago. I think you would enjoy it if you came back to it for a while. They kept updating the chapters you progress through.
Reminds me of progress knight, loved that game
Pretty damn good for a dollar, wish it went on a bit further, 2 hours in and all the increments seem to be done
Chokepoint-based leverage like you were talking about (engineering yourself out of a specific need or task) (all into one and one into all) is an interest of mine.
in case you decide to play more, one thing I feel you underestimated here, is how extra power capacity would actually help you. It's not just "a longer run", it's also more time to build up that multiplier it gives at the end of every run.
I suspect that since the asteroids are constantly spawning, and that the arrow points to the nearest asteroid, a large amount of the arrow changing direction is that a new asteroid spawning may cause the arrow to change direction
I am so sick of these awesome games that take 2 hours to beat. I get that its basically free but the frustration of not getting to play these games endlessly isnt worth starting them for me D:
There is an incremental tower defense game on mobile called The Tower, tho it kinda sucks as it takes months to get anywhere, even with the no ads bundle and an auto clicker to restart rounds. The amount of currency you need for upgrades becomes horrible to gain.
Lmao I keep getting ads for that
It also has hundreds of near exact clones
Basically it is a cash grab spending more on ads than making a FUN game
@@excursor4296 Yeah like 60% of the damn ads I get on youtubr are about the Tower
@@Staladus May I suggest to you:
> uBlockOrigin - ad blocker plugin for PC
> Revanced - modified youtube client thingy for phone (android, dk abt ios) which blocks ads and such
Bought the game on your recommendation. And beat it. Wrote a review as well :3
it makes me miss the older flash castle defense games where you got hordes of stick figures walking towards your castle and you had to shoot the enemies with various weapons like bows and guns, and stuff.
My favourite incremental game is weirdly enough a Roblox game called Circle Incremental. It feels like there’s always something to do and different tiers of progression make it feel like you’re playing multiple games. They came out with a second one called Circle Grinding Incremental which isn’t as fun, but still has some of the same charm.
So to the effect of the run lasts so long and you do more in that amount of time is very “Increlution” the story based incremental game where you build up instinct levels by doing tasks and when you start back at the beginning you do it faster than the last time.
I'll be waiting on DF to do a vid on this game, especially since it's $1.
Wander, you mention wistfully that you'd like to learn Godot, and I think you could benefit from joining game jams, as a variant. =)
Go for that game man!! You have the experience already!! Better start failing soon! The sooner the better!! Cheers!
Hey @Wanderbots, will you try an interesting game which released a couple of days ago? It called Loco Motive. It's an interesting pixel point and click murder mystery. I am looking forward to play with it as well.
On my to-do! I'm just horrendously busy.
Between incremental games and roguelikes lies the undiscovered depths within the Roguelite genre
Edit: now that I think about it, Rogue Legacy 2 kinda falls into that category
The concept described in the first 30s reminds me of starblast io, similar base concept, but online PvP
Last I played, it was pretty decent, just use an ad-blocker lol
I remember that game
nice timing, i had a really freaking hard test yesterday and did someone say incremental? power would suck me in. Fortunately it went pretty well
wander: i dont like making the run long because incriase the time betwen upgrades
run ends*
wnader:HMMMMMM lets do another run
ksakskskaskaskskas(me laughing in brasilian)
Damn was Deep Space Mine already taken
1:25 and if its not linear it will be balancing hell
9:25 there's a game in early access/build called Nomad Idle and so far it was really good idle incremental RPG. Says it will come out in march and I think you at least should have it on your radar
The Fox Knocks makes great games, I can't wait to see how Nomad Idle turns out!
I think you also blew some asteroids up off screen.
Edit: And of course that's mentioned maybe a minute later into the video.
Why outer space is green is probably only obvious to insiders 😀 But seriously, I don't like the graphics, but I like the gameplay
Now imagine this but with Nova Drift screen warping instead
awww it seemed to start getting really good with the high spawn rate near the end of the video...
I'll have another video in a day or two.
i always wanted to tell someone about a game its called {caves rougliek} on mobile its one of the best game ever its just not getting its far view just because its a mobile game and i dont think the dev is making a pc one for a resoan its a bit graindy but very cool gameplay alots of deferant game satyl and over all good
I’m surprised the game is $1, seems a little too cheap like it’s sus where did they cut costs lol looks fun for a couple hours tho
By being a couple hours of playtime lol
I don't think asteroids are despawning. The indicator is just showing asteroid very far away. The arrow freaking out seems to be caused by an asteroid spawning closer than the one arrow indicates. Which is still annoying and I think they can just fix it by making it so that asteroids can only spawn near you not million miles away.
@wanderbots when will there be more wholesomeverse astroneer?
Disgaea mentioned \o/
I started Journey to Incrementalia recently and there are points where is essentially says the build I want to use is invalid. My Poison-Rupture build clearly has explicit support but not enough to actually get through certain walls.
Support for many builds is good but if clearly supported builds don't work that is not good design. I like to use weird builds but Poison-Rupture is not one of them.
Everytime I try and watch this video I fall asleep- Kick in the doom music please~~ 💀 I didn't make it 10 minutes
Eh, I'll be honest, there's so much royalty free music on the market now, I don't think devs who don't do their own music have to rely on commercial songs. It's a bit lazy.
Pretty early, but for you, i wish i was earlier ❤
I'm not so sure that pushing people to review the game is the right call. It will skew the game's sales to reviews ratio but it might not have the sort of boost in Steam visibility you'd hope for. Content creators like yourself making the video is the big push for visibility that these games need and it will increase the sales and reviews naturally if the viewers got interested. Having the game's Steam page linked and directing traffic to it is one vector that can increase the visibility of the game in Steam. Steam tends to start recommending games that receive external traffic.
Having a high review:sales ratio is good from what I've heard from every single developer I've ever talked to. Especially since the Steam algorithm promotes games further at certain review thresholds (10, 100, 500, etc...)
This sounds dumb you don't have to make a movie to know how a good movie should be made like. Same thing with video games
Disgaea incremental game lol.. No way it's tactical rpg. Nothing in the game is really automated. Leveling up and such is also pretty normal for standard RPGs and you don't need to do reincarnation to even beat the game just for some post game stuff.
Sounds like you've never beaten/attempted Baal. It's definitely incremental when you're aiming for that, especially with the new automation mechanics in 6 & 7.
some of your commentary really triggers me. It almost feels like you’re saying “man this would be so much more fun if roguelike!” for damn near every game you play and every time it irritates me to no end
meh....