Hopefully you were inspired by this video, I look forward to my future with fighting games and hopefully it can help inspire some new comers into the scene! Social links are all in the description
For me after tutorials and learning your character's kits, learning a basic combo and a safe blockstring is the next best thing to do. And it's still ridiculous that Strive doesn't have a frame advantage display option in training, but GBVS Rising and SF6 do lol.
As someone who played SF2, Budokai and brawl. I will tell you my expeirence. Those were the only games i played without any community or online resources. As soon as i paid for Dragonball FighterZ, i played online and kept losing and losing and losing. I had to learn Everything from scratch and i still lost. Even when I asked for help, someone said "why are you doing SD on Wake up and DPs and attacks at FullScreen?" and my response was "what do all those words mean? I dont understand your question" and they freaking Laughed! My word of advice is to find a friendly community that has people who are actually nice and patient. I eventually learned how to play Guilty Gear Strive. the community is more friendly, but jesus it took a very long time to re-wire my brain and when i asked questions or had assumptions, they thought I wasn't listening. I WAS. but I was trying to Understand the WHYS and HOWS of the mechanics. ALSO. The wording of fighting game lingo is SO DAMN HARD to understand
This definitely brings up some concerns I had myself and kind of why I wanted to start making these kinds of videos. The biggest points of inspiration for me really are the fact that TYPICALLY in any “competitive” community, the better the player is… it tends to very unfortunately coincides with a larger ego and less welcoming personality. Ideally I’d like to harbor the helpful and good information, as well as just generally promote patience as a whole.
After the tutorial and character moveset. I'd recommend a BnB combo and learn some Oki. If your character has a blockstring that is similar to your BnB combo, that'd even be better, so you can actually autopilot a little bit and focus more on making up a game plan, and apply some of your Oki. The rest should come naturally as you play. This is enough for most people to easily reach floor 8-9. For anti airing, just make sure you are actively thinking about it and it's probably better people learn anti airing ingame than in the labbing room. Playing more passively should help with learning anti air(beginner only advice, duh). You don't learn a whole bunch from a long session of playing, taking a break to remove any bad habit of that day is good, it also help with muscles memory. The more you play the more situational awareness comes to you, then you start understanding fighting game, and then you will be able to learn fighting game by yourself, at your own pace. There is no need for long optimal combos yet, but learning them can help improve your execution., so there's no need to shy away from them. Strive shouldn't give you any problem with most combos though 😅
while that's good advice, I dont a beginner would know the concept of a BnB and OKI, or Blockstrings either. I think beginners need to know what they mean and Why they are effective and How they work. I dunno. That's just how i felt when i tried to learn fighting games. The lingo is what held me back. Yes i know there is a dictionary out there and I have used it, but for Actual beginners who just played a fighting game for the first time, Dont learn any combos. Just learn the basic controls first
It's definitely one of my new favorite games atm! The grind has been a ton of fun the whole way through. I'm chilling at 702 +143 in puddle farm, my super short term goal was breaking 1000 just for self esteem reasons really. See you in some online tournaments! 😅
Leverless >>> D-pad controller >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stick. Unless you have some sort of special condition, Stick is objectively the worst option. The only reason they have been used so much is because they mimic the original arcade machine interface, but that design was never good either: imprecise, expensive, not ergonomic, prone to fail, hard to repair. Choose a leverless if you can, or keep the normal control pad, wich is already super good.
I would have to still argue that if top players competing are still using arcade stick and winning, the gap between the "best" controllers I can't imagine are THAT vast. I do definitely agree with the order of controllers, but I think generally this will matter significantly less for any players who want a competitive atmosphere but generally play casually. which is pretty fairly what you mentioned about it mimicking arcade machines.
Well hopefully I can help make them seem less difficult for new players, I think they’re personally no more difficult than any other game to learn once the general fundamentals are elaborated or explained in an understandable form. 😅
@@Nightwatertv only issue with fighting games compared to other games is that you need hundreds of hours before the game becomes 'playable' most casual/new players just wont invest that time if there isnt active enjoyment from it immediately, most other games give you a fun enjoyable experience while your learning however fighting games don't do that
@Raynfgc Idunno, league is sheer torture for the first couple hundred hours. I think the major thing that fighting games have for new players to deal with compared to most other fighting games is the reality that they’re actually not good… but they can’t avoid the truth by shoving blame over to team mates. It’s just you and your enemy in fighting games. If you lose, it’s because of you and only you. And I think that’s really difficult for a lot of players to internalize tbh. Also, Sajam had one of the best takes on this topic in a video recently, in my opinion.
@@Nightwatertv 100% this is super true a lot of people can't handle they aren't good and don't enjoy being punished because of that. League while it does have a learning curve like other games it has a 50% winrate matchmaking meaning you have a coinflip chance of winning, if you lose more the game compensates by giving you stronger teammates to make the games as balanced as possible, you can be one of the worst league players and still win 40% of the time where in fighting games if you're bad you literally will never see a victory screen, and with the improvement being 'sit in a training mode for 200 hours and learn x y z' doesnt incentivise people to play and continue past that beginner hump, i think lots of fighting games stuggle with this which will make 2xko interesting to see as its going to be super casual friendly and entertain people over the hump to the expense of things like motion inputs which people enjoy etc whole debacle (appreciate your responses) xoxo
@Raynfgc agreed, fully. I’m stoked to get my hands on 2XKO personally. And hopefully even outside of that I can help some of the new players feel less daunted by the “entry cost” of the time needed to get progress they can recognize. It’s a lofty goal, but I think I can at least help with inspiration if nothing else. 😅
It feels ROUGH that first time. They dropped me in as fresh blood at floor 6... I WAS NOT READY lol Don't let it keep you down though! You'll fluctuate a ton, and some days you'll play way better than others. those early floors are all about getting clean inputs out, and intentional inputs. around floor 4 and 5 it's more all about stringing moves together, figuring out roman cancels, block strings and whiff punishing... AKA just general Bread and butters and a game plan. Everything above that from what I understand is just slowly perfecting it all and nailing down consistency. Just gotta take it one step at a time.
lol hey I appreciate it. But, I've got to earn them first, but I really appreciate the support :) If there's any topic you think I should cover, definitely let me know, either here or in my discord.
Numpad notation is not universally good. Street fighter has its own notation that works comparably well, and for Tekken numpad is plain horrible. Numpad is important for reading dustloop and anime games content, because those communities have already adopted it as their standard... But I think the Tekken notation is fundamentally better: - it works for both player sides. - you only need 4 basic english words you already know if you use internet.
Very good to know, I have really mostly been surrounded by just the 2D fighter sphere, so this is news to me. I can definitely see how Numpad notation would be fairly ineffective for a game like Tekken though. the directional inputs are slightly different for the moves in that game right? more double taps of the same direction and such, is that correct?
The thing about numpad notation is that it can be applied to any motion. How would you denote Goldlewis’s moves without it? You could, but it would be cumbersome and would cause people to adopt numpad notation as a result anyway.
I'd especially agree when utilizing a visual representation of the motion isn't viable. Verbally is one thing, but in a lot of instances typing out a 412364 is easier than finding the correct arrow keys when typing things out rather than backwards half quarter circle + tap back or inaccurate ↺+←
lol this is definitely a take. I think coming at them from a new players perspective there's definitely an air to them that makes them seem more difficult than they are. I would tend to agree that they are not any harder than any other game, and are arguably EASIER to pick up and learn. I think that Sajam's videos talking about this topic is a great watch and hits the nail on the head for sure.
@ let's see. Just for comparison, here are some older titles: -Marvel vs Capcom 2. -Street fighter III Third Strike. -Skullgirls. -Guilty Gear +R. Those are all older games, and still arguably much harder than newer titles today with tight, complicated, or long combos; difficult tech to master and struggle with; specifics of gameplay depending on the way the opponent wakes up; and cohesiveness amongst player types. Take for example, Guilty Gear: Strive - the move-sets, skill ceiling (more recently and with season 4 patch), game pace, and ranking system, are all designed around a modern era of semi-simplicity to entice more people to play the game. Yet people are still having a hard time. Learning fighting games is not intuitive, and most people fall off because when they enter online modes and get slammed by someone with 800+ hours, it is highly discouraging for the average casual to want to go back because you can't blame anyone else for the mistakes you have made in a match except yourself.
@@j2thedissle304 I agree that the older games are difficult for their own reasons, but arguably it feels like the reasons these older games were difficult was because of overall rougher controls, imbalances and strange movement. Now I can only speak from a perspective of watching these games and ingesting content from others about the topic, but I will say, I’d have a much lower likelyhood of wanting to learn a game if the controls in general didn’t feel intuitive. Another big facet that may be causing issues with players not wanting to get into fighting games is that these older games had been this way for so long, that even up until recently, it was my understanding that fighting games still felt the way these older games do, which initially turned me off of wanting to even try to play and learn in the first place. I feel like we’re still in the fairly early days of these “modern” fighting games and their easier inputs, and I think the sooner more people get their hands on them and realize it’s not as difficult to input combos as it once was… we may have a lot larger of a fighting game community.
Hopefully you were inspired by this video, I look forward to my future with fighting games and hopefully it can help inspire some new comers into the scene!
Social links are all in the description
For me after tutorials and learning your character's kits, learning a basic combo and a safe blockstring is the next best thing to do. And it's still ridiculous that Strive doesn't have a frame advantage display option in training, but GBVS Rising and SF6 do lol.
Great tips for sure, and yeah it's super frustrating not having it.. just gotta go off feel or DustLoop I guess, pretty lame lol
This is super high quality content, excited for more FGC stuff in the future
Hey thanks! I appreciate it a lot. 🙂
As someone who played SF2, Budokai and brawl. I will tell you my expeirence. Those were the only games i played without any community or online resources.
As soon as i paid for Dragonball FighterZ, i played online and kept losing and losing and losing. I had to learn Everything from scratch and i still lost. Even when I asked for help, someone said "why are you doing SD on Wake up and DPs and attacks at FullScreen?" and my response was "what do all those words mean? I dont understand your question" and they freaking Laughed!
My word of advice is to find a friendly community that has people who are actually nice and patient. I eventually learned how to play Guilty Gear Strive. the community is more friendly, but jesus it took a very long time to re-wire my brain and when i asked questions or had assumptions, they thought I wasn't listening. I WAS. but I was trying to Understand the WHYS and HOWS of the mechanics.
ALSO. The wording of fighting game lingo is SO DAMN HARD to understand
This definitely brings up some concerns I had myself and kind of why I wanted to start making these kinds of videos.
The biggest points of inspiration for me really are the fact that TYPICALLY in any “competitive” community, the better the player is… it tends to very unfortunately coincides with a larger ego and less welcoming personality.
Ideally I’d like to harbor the helpful and good information, as well as just generally promote patience as a whole.
After the tutorial and character moveset. I'd recommend a BnB combo and learn some Oki. If your character has a blockstring that is similar to your BnB combo, that'd even be better, so you can actually autopilot a little bit and focus more on making up a game plan, and apply some of your Oki. The rest should come naturally as you play. This is enough for most people to easily reach floor 8-9.
For anti airing, just make sure you are actively thinking about it and it's probably better people learn anti airing ingame than in the labbing room. Playing more passively should help with learning anti air(beginner only advice, duh).
You don't learn a whole bunch from a long session of playing, taking a break to remove any bad habit of that day is good, it also help with muscles memory. The more you play the more situational awareness comes to you, then you start understanding fighting game, and then you will be able to learn fighting game by yourself, at your own pace.
There is no need for long optimal combos yet, but learning them can help improve your execution., so there's no need to shy away from them. Strive shouldn't give you any problem with most combos though 😅
This is great advice all very good points!
while that's good advice, I dont a beginner would know the concept of a BnB and OKI, or Blockstrings either.
I think beginners need to know what they mean and Why they are effective and How they work. I dunno. That's just how i felt when i tried to learn fighting games. The lingo is what held me back. Yes i know there is a dictionary out there and I have used it, but for Actual beginners who just played a fighting game for the first time, Dont learn any combos. Just learn the basic controls first
floor 5? Easy prey.😈 Seriously though, keep up with Guilty Gear. I'm over 1K hours into Strive and I love it.😊
It's definitely one of my new favorite games atm!
The grind has been a ton of fun the whole way through.
I'm chilling at 702 +143 in puddle farm, my super short term goal was breaking 1000 just for self esteem reasons really.
See you in some online tournaments! 😅
Leverless >>> D-pad controller >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stick.
Unless you have some sort of special condition, Stick is objectively the worst option. The only reason they have been used so much is because they mimic the original arcade machine interface, but that design was never good either: imprecise, expensive, not ergonomic, prone to fail, hard to repair.
Choose a leverless if you can, or keep the normal control pad, wich is already super good.
I would have to still argue that if top players competing are still using arcade stick and winning, the gap between the "best" controllers I can't imagine are THAT vast.
I do definitely agree with the order of controllers, but I think generally this will matter significantly less for any players who want a competitive atmosphere but generally play casually. which is pretty fairly what you mentioned about it mimicking arcade machines.
yes (:
Well hopefully I can help make them seem less difficult for new players, I think they’re personally no more difficult than any other game to learn once the general fundamentals are elaborated or explained in an understandable form. 😅
@@Nightwatertv only issue with fighting games compared to other games is that you need hundreds of hours before the game becomes 'playable' most casual/new players just wont invest that time if there isnt active enjoyment from it immediately, most other games give you a fun enjoyable experience while your learning however fighting games don't do that
@Raynfgc Idunno, league is sheer torture for the first couple hundred hours.
I think the major thing that fighting games have for new players to deal with compared to most other fighting games is the reality that they’re actually not good… but they can’t avoid the truth by shoving blame over to team mates. It’s just you and your enemy in fighting games. If you lose, it’s because of you and only you. And I think that’s really difficult for a lot of players to internalize tbh.
Also, Sajam had one of the best takes on this topic in a video recently, in my opinion.
@@Nightwatertv 100% this is super true a lot of people can't handle they aren't good and don't enjoy being punished because of that.
League while it does have a learning curve like other games it has a 50% winrate matchmaking meaning you have a coinflip chance of winning, if you lose more the game compensates by giving you stronger teammates to make the games as balanced as possible, you can be one of the worst league players and still win 40% of the time where in fighting games if you're bad you literally will never see a victory screen, and with the improvement being 'sit in a training mode for 200 hours and learn x y z' doesnt incentivise people to play and continue past that beginner hump, i think lots of fighting games stuggle with this which will make 2xko interesting to see as its going to be super casual friendly and entertain people over the hump to the expense of things like motion inputs which people enjoy etc whole debacle (appreciate your responses) xoxo
@Raynfgc agreed, fully. I’m stoked to get my hands on 2XKO personally. And hopefully even outside of that I can help some of the new players feel less daunted by the “entry cost” of the time needed to get progress they can recognize.
It’s a lofty goal, but I think I can at least help with inspiration if nothing else. 😅
8:40 exactly what happened to me I was put on floor 4 I am now a floor 1er lol
It feels ROUGH that first time. They dropped me in as fresh blood at floor 6... I WAS NOT READY lol
Don't let it keep you down though!
You'll fluctuate a ton, and some days you'll play way better than others. those early floors are all about getting clean inputs out, and intentional inputs. around floor 4 and 5 it's more all about stringing moves together, figuring out roman cancels, block strings and whiff punishing... AKA just general Bread and butters and a game plan.
Everything above that from what I understand is just slowly perfecting it all and nailing down consistency. Just gotta take it one step at a time.
oh hell naw bro you deserve more subs
lol hey I appreciate it. But, I've got to earn them first, but I really appreciate the support :)
If there's any topic you think I should cover, definitely let me know, either here or in my discord.
Numpad notation is not universally good. Street fighter has its own notation that works comparably well, and for Tekken numpad is plain horrible.
Numpad is important for reading dustloop and anime games content, because those communities have already adopted it as their standard...
But I think the Tekken notation is fundamentally better:
- it works for both player sides.
- you only need 4 basic english words you already know if you use internet.
Very good to know, I have really mostly been surrounded by just the 2D fighter sphere, so this is news to me.
I can definitely see how Numpad notation would be fairly ineffective for a game like Tekken though. the directional inputs are slightly different for the moves in that game right? more double taps of the same direction and such, is that correct?
The thing about numpad notation is that it can be applied to any motion. How would you denote Goldlewis’s moves without it? You could, but it would be cumbersome and would cause people to adopt numpad notation as a result anyway.
I'd especially agree when utilizing a visual representation of the motion isn't viable.
Verbally is one thing, but in a lot of instances typing out a 412364 is easier than finding the correct arrow keys when typing things out
rather than backwards half quarter circle + tap back or inaccurate ↺+←
The games aren't harder to play. The new people are too weak willed to spend time learning and perfecting the craft of the FGC.
lol this is definitely a take. I think coming at them from a new players perspective there's definitely an air to them that makes them seem more difficult than they are. I would tend to agree that they are not any harder than any other game, and are arguably EASIER to pick up and learn. I think that Sajam's videos talking about this topic is a great watch and hits the nail on the head for sure.
You got to play way simpler old games compared to the new overly complex bloated ones, its apples and oranges
@ let's see. Just for comparison, here are some older titles:
-Marvel vs Capcom 2.
-Street fighter III Third Strike.
-Skullgirls.
-Guilty Gear +R.
Those are all older games, and still arguably much harder than newer titles today with tight, complicated, or long combos; difficult tech to master and struggle with; specifics of gameplay depending on the way the opponent wakes up; and cohesiveness amongst player types.
Take for example, Guilty Gear: Strive - the move-sets, skill ceiling (more recently and with season 4 patch), game pace, and ranking system, are all designed around a modern era of semi-simplicity to entice more people to play the game. Yet people are still having a hard time. Learning fighting games is not intuitive, and most people fall off because when they enter online modes and get slammed by someone with 800+ hours, it is highly discouraging for the average casual to want to go back because you can't blame anyone else for the mistakes you have made in a match except yourself.
@@j2thedissle304 I agree that the older games are difficult for their own reasons, but arguably it feels like the reasons these older games were difficult was because of overall rougher controls, imbalances and strange movement.
Now I can only speak from a perspective of watching these games and ingesting content from others about the topic, but I will say, I’d have a much lower likelyhood of wanting to learn a game if the controls in general didn’t feel intuitive.
Another big facet that may be causing issues with players not wanting to get into fighting games is that these older games had been this way for so long, that even up until recently, it was my understanding that fighting games still felt the way these older games do, which initially turned me off of wanting to even try to play and learn in the first place.
I feel like we’re still in the fairly early days of these “modern” fighting games and their easier inputs, and I think the sooner more people get their hands on them and realize it’s not as difficult to input combos as it once was… we may have a lot larger of a fighting game community.