N&W 611 Class J Struggles HARD on Linden Hill + Runby's!
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- Опубліковано 6 чер 2016
- Watch as we chased the beautiful class J steam locomotive N&W 611 through the countryside of Virginia on the NS B Line! There are a total of 4 runbys from 2 of the 3 trips the engine made this past weekend. Make sure to check out the 3rd shot from atop a bridge at Linden where 611 has a lot of trouble making it up the steep grade! Thanks for watching!
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I can remember Laying in the bed at our house here in southeasttern KY...In the late 1940's hearing ...That lonesome.....Whistle blowing....Comeing out of Harland Kentucky loaded with Coal....Just after my Mom tucked me in the Bed....An turned out the light..Hanging down from the center of my bed room ceiling...Back then our house had just ben wired for electric lights...One for each room...Anyway....Just at 12 O'CLOCK ..Every night a 12 i could here that old steamer Whistle echoing thru the hill back in that place....When I was a child....Sad to say but all of that is gone now.....And almost me to...For I am old now...Thanks very much...!
yes that golden age when we were kids now a memory with cherished images on the inner eye.
Wished I could of been there to hear it
@@danhill6298 Yaa it was...A different time for sure..Seen a lot stuff over the years...Anyway ....Thanks..!
@@654Geoff Yes for sure...Thanks...God bless...!
I remember it in the 80s and 90s. I’d run to the track to watch it go by. I especially remember it climbing the mountain from Anniston Alabama through Heflin. On one day in particular, the weather was cold, low overcast, and a light rain. It could be heard from a few miles away. I just made it to the crossing as it thundered by. I’m so glad the 611 is going again so that my kids can know what that is like. Nothing is closer to a time machine than steam locomotives, Radial engines on airplanes, and tall ships.
Pulling 20 plus the extra stores tender. Great job by the engineer and fireman on that steep grade.
Running a mighty "clean stack" while pulling such a steep grade! Good job by the fireman! Norfolk and Western would've been proud...
All these people are volunteers.
Incredibly beautiful looking and sounding rolling mechanical piece of American art!!!!
That is one skilled engineer. I can imagine how relieved he was around 8:15 when she started picking up some speed again. Steam locomotives are notoriously difficult to manage when starting and at low speeds, but once they take off they really take off.
There’s an old saying. A steam engine can pull what a diesel electric can’t, but a diesel electric can start what a steam locomotive can’t.(not exact phrasing, but it’s close enough)
Luckily 611's low factor of adhesion doesn't completely hold back this masterpiece of a machine's performance. Plus sand helps out, so.. another job well done by 611 and her high tractive effort prevails!
And the skilled crew
Long consist, mean grade, lot of torque on those tall wheels, takes a good hand on the throttle...well done.
@@EvilTurkeySlices Give an old lady some credit...she was designed to pull twelve cars, not twenty (per an N&W shop movie in the 40s.)
@@haroldwilkes6608also meant to run 70 MPH and not hit a grade at 45 MPH maximum. Even with a heavy train if they had speed limits like they did in the hay day of the N&W she probably cruises over the grade
Truly amazing job by the engineer, fireman and the good ole girl on that hill! Wonderful work! I would truly love the privilege to ride one day!!
Btw.... the sound of the young mans voice on the video.... thank you sir! You are the hope and prayers for the future of these beautiful works of art... Never lose interest or love for these and do not ever be afraid to step up and be there when the need calls to keep the beautiful history of these alive
Well, why don't you? It's still running.
I love the slip/slog of a steam engine doing a big pull like this. This is where experience of the engineer and firman are put to the test. These guys know what their doing. And the old girl never gave up. She knew. Love this video.
What a beautiful loco!
The pop off valve is going nuts
I'll bet that whistle sounds awesome in real life.
When I was a kid, my family was visiting relatives in southern Ohio. As it happened, the paddle wheel steamboat Delta Queen was steaming up the Ohio river so we went to watch it. As it hove into view there was a Calliope playing and I just sort of shrugged. But as it got closer, the captain started blowing the steam whistle. It was mind-altering. I'd never heard anything like it. The sound filled the air so heavily I felt like I could almost touch it. That was over forty years ago and I've still never heard anything like it again.
It is an absolutely beautiful sound. Almost as if the 611 was singing.
Then you must be excited about the Delta Queen possibly returning to service soon.
It does. I haven't yet had the pleasure of personally seeing her under steam since 1994 (I was eleven years old then) when they stopped at the old N&W station here in my hometown in Southwest Virginia. I believe others have used the same whistle or something similar, but I also believe the shrouding on 611 alters the sound. I can, however, tell you this about her whistle; I distinctly remember my vision shaking when she announced her departure from town. I'll never forget that and hope to see her on this district soon.
@@Joeybagofdonuts76 It is a "Steamboat Whistle" for this engine only.
It really is beautiful in real life. Deep and melodic.
This is awesome. I rode the 611 back in 1986 when I was 16 years old, with my parents.
05:50, that look on the front. 'I am hurting bro, its tough.'
I love hearing engines spinning their wheels.
Isn't it funny though how that one steam engine can pull that train like that. But it would take 2-3 diesel engines to pull the same train.
Kevin Benecke false. 5000 hp is impressive but she has 3000lbs less tractive effort than a sd40-2
wrong, one sd70ace will pull anything behind it.
Ikr, they need two diesels to make the same power but the starting practice effort is better but the 611 has better raw power
Anything? Lol some foamers.
Diesel vs steam is less about power than it is about maintaining them and cost. No one can deny steam is powerful but it's extremely expensive to maintain.
That’s true, but it’s easier/cheaper to buy, maintain, and run 3 diesels than 1 steamer.
Really beautiful engine, and it's whistle is awesome.
One of the most frustating things as a Driver is when you know the Engine will lift the train, but you have to get the Drivers onto the sand to get her to start. Most of our Steam Locos here in Queensland Australia never had reverse sanders fitted and I have had to get down on serveral occassions to pour sand on the rail with shovel fulls taken while the train is running tender first. This Engineer/Driver sure had her working well up the bank.
i love watching theses. my uncle was a big on the trains. it makes me think of him and how much i miss him
Love the sound of the steam engines.
I THINK I CAN... I THINK I CAN.... I THINK I CAN., She is still one bad-ass loco, and we all love her death
"I *know* I can.....shake the Earth under your camera." 10:43
She's not "The Queen of Steam" for nothing.
i know i can, i know i can, i know i can
@@clintonjones294 I just made a similar comment on another video in response to someone that admitted they weren't a railfan, but thought it was the best locomotive they had seen. "She ain't called the Queen for nothin'." Most powerful 4-8-4 ever built and still running hard. Pulling twice the consist unassisted, in hills and curves, than those PR babies out west on flat and straight track.
@@j.christopherlindsey8933 you call them or babies but at least the living legend 844 also a 4-8-4 was never retired
Linden is the place John Lederer and John Catlett are credited with "Officially Discovering" the Shenandoah Valley. (Sorry Native Americans who were there for thousands of years.) So Old 611 is pulling that train over the Blue Ridge Mts at that point. Thousands drive on Rt 66 through that gap daily and never know where they are. You can also take Rt 55 and enjoy the scenery and trains. Love that J Class Long Live 611.
OMG, that engine is on its knees, but somehow made it. Only steam can pull that off.
Great video!
What a steam beauty!
This is an accurate depiction of me going up a hill
Me more like the second five minutes walking around Walmart...
me going up a slight incline of stairs
this is heaven
what an amazing sound .
When the going gets tough - the tough gets going
Twenty one cars, in that terrain, is really awesome.
Nice video!
Amazing. 20 cars!
Thank god 611 didn't give up while she climbed that steep bank.
the current problem:the gradient angle.This train complete may weight 1000 tons with a 1,5% gradient the locomotive may do a force approx 15tons (very high) and the slip possibilities are big. and if the rails are wet,worse.too. In gradients are necceeary two units for climb,in flat roads one unit working,the second in stand by
I'm going to guess the total weight is around 1,500 tons
@@ecoRfan All no, 19 Passengers weigh 1900 tons. and she was stopped on a curvy hill.
You know, maybe she wouldn't struggle so much if railroad regulators didn't limit her top speed to 40mph. Then she would have the momentum to get herself over the crest of these grades without falling to her knees.
I have two questions. 1) Is the issue on the hill traction, or not quite enough power 2) why is so much steam being vented on the hill?
More than enough power, just a heavy train on a grade and rails that are wet.
It would be the limit of adhesion the drivers had on the wet rails to dig in and not slip, or spin, the drivers.
If dry rail,well no problem. 611 could've peaked the summit at speed. 5,000 h.p. 80,000 lbs tractive force. The old girl can pull hard, and pull fast..
As for the escaping steam. Simply the pop-off safety valve.
Fireman had a nice hot fire, making tons of available steam for power .
Just, at that crawl uphill, engineer was only using a fraction of available steam, thus pop-off valve was relieving excess steam not being directly used for pulling power.
2. Excess steam vented means, the boiler is at maximum and has to exaust this maximum. This safety feature is on all steam engines.
Needs some sand and dry rails then no problem at all.
Life isn't a zero-sum game where everyone and everything must be divided in to winners and losers, the best or the rest. Go cheer for your football team and just appreciate this beautiful machine for what it is.
And this, "the lightest string of rail cards any locomotive could ever pull steam or DE", makes zero sense. You've never seen a locomotive pull fewer than 20 rail car(d)s?
Pullman cars are anything but light... And those times it has stalled are not in easy situations.
@kamphwagon1 helpers to push uphill were common durring the time 611 was in revenue service
Robert McGuire The Flying Scotsman is limited to 75mph
@@Texassince1836 In revenue service this engine did not pull this many cars, to run track (unlimited) it only pulled about 8 cars.
Being a steam train, where is the generator giving electric power to the carriage lights etc?
the engineer release steam pressure for more steam control to the pistons . Is a disadventage release pressure .but better control.
Thanks for the explanation. I was wondering why they were dumping steam.
There was no lack of power, just a lack of traction.
He is blowing moisture out of the cylinders.
Awesome just doesn’t cover it. Thank you for posting.
What does one of these passenger cars weigh compared to say a loaded 3 bay coal hopper?
Three bay loaded hopper weighs 70 tons, these passenger cars weigh 100 tons.
The wheels on the train go round and round
That whistle...
i think i can, i think i can, i think i can
lotta wheel slip - cool
doesn't she have sand boxes? Used to be a guard when they existed and have seen a train stopped by a line of ants on the track.
or wet leaves
no diesel assist needed. in fact the steam can assist the diesel. UP 844 pushed a stalled diesel
That's right, but the Diesel was overloaded.
Cool.
How steep was that bank?
From Petersburg up this hill is a 2% grade.
@@jamesvance8456 For reference, Saluda is 4.24% for 2.6 miles and maximum is 4.9% for about 300 feet and 611 pulled that one too but I think it had diesel help. Either grade is rough.
I can hear the wheels slipping
If I had not got out and pushed, it would not have made it.
I wish they would repaint all the coaches to the same color
That is "Tuscan Red" In the heyday all the N&W Psgr trains were painted this color.
Back in the Day, they were all "Tuscan Red"
Noooooo...each of those cars has a history.
@@haroldwilkes6608 didn't really think about that two years ago tbh
@@ChadwickThunderCrocs No problem, I've just been a railroad nut fo 78 years so pay more attention to things like that.
Lindo 💟😍
I think I can, I think I can........
No sanders on this unit to add grit?
she is a passenger locomotive, that's what it was built for. im not sure if they had sanders...... its also very streamlined. this girl is capable of 110 mph, speeds unheard of in diesel land.
Andrew Donohue even though I love 611 to death, ever heard of Amtrak? They have sections of track where their engines can do 110 easily.
@@NOVARailandWeatherEnthusiast 611 was doing those types of speeds back in the 1940's
@@NOVARailandWeatherEnthusiast a steam engine?
@@The.Real.Timmii 111mph topspeed. At that ancient time
Whistle seems not loud enough. What an unfortunate steamboat-sounding whistle.
My great uncle's 4-8-4 freight locomotive whistle had three or was it four tones.
5:45 how much of that steam is wetting the rails??
The J's have the most beautiful sounding whistle to ever be mounted on a locomotive. It was literally a point of pride for the N&W.
@@joshandkorinna What pitches did the J-class whistlesound?
@@robertgift I don't know. I'm not an expert. I just know it sounds beautiful to my ears. I grew up listening to that whistle. Also, I remember reading in one of my N&W books that the whistle they chose is very similar to the style of whistle the UP used on its 4-8-4's, basically an off the shelf whistle that many RR's used, but N&W wanted their own unique sound so they lowered the pitch just a tad and also changed the tone somehow or another and ended up with a one off sounding whistle that only N&W passenger locomotives used.
@Josh I prefer the multi-tone whistles. So much more interesting than the boring "steamboat" whistle which belong on steamboats, not locomotives.
I tune pipe organs. The pitch is lowered by making the whistle longer. Capping thend makes it an octave lower.
Multi-chime whistles are better heard by hearing-impaired individuals.
Some people may be deaf at a particular frequency and not hear the tone. Multi-tone whistles have a better chance of being heard.
(Denver Fire had their Q-siren peaked at a steady pitch. If someone were deaf athat frequency, they would not hear it. Sirenshould go up andown through many frequencies. Wife and I thought we heard brake squeal from a truck slowing nexto us. It was Denver Firesponding with siren peaked.)
At peak RPM, my Federal Signal 2t22A tornado siren creates pitches D5 and F5 - a perfect minor third musical interval. They happen to produce a Bb2 Resultantone. The three frequencies have a better chance of being heard.
@@robertgift The whistle on N&W passenger locos was anything but boring. Just cause you don't like it doesn't mean it isn't important to others. Also, the 611's whistle is a multitone whistle. Anyhow, I did some research and the whistle N&W passenger locos used was a Hancock 3-chime long bell whistle which blew a chord B-D-F#. Beautiful sounding.
Only in America could that happen. Amazing.
The USA has been blessed with historically rare, Individual Freedom and it's resultant Prosperity. May that blessing continue to allow individual freedom and continued prosperity, the 'grease', that keeps these magnificent machines and wonderful scenes in lasting appreciation and public view.
Is it just me or are a lot of the videos of this amazing loco, of her struggling and with a lot of wheelslip? They always put a long consist of full cars behind her with no second steam or diesel helper. This set had 20 cars which I’m sure were all full, not including her coal car and water tender.....I don’t know a lot about these old girls but is it just me or are they asking too much of this beautiful old piece of history?
I think the class J is just so powerful, and built for high speed, that she requires a lot of finesse at such low speeds. She's a 5,300hp musclecar with a very sensitive throttle and no gearbox; it's probably difficult to not spin the wheels at the lights. And she's probably always loaded light too, missing traction because of it. They're trying to find that balance between putting power down to get up the hill and not spinning the wheels. You can tell that they're not stoking and are actually not using much power. So little that they need to blow off all that steam. I don't think this can hurt the engine. But she is meant to go like a bat on a long haul, crawling through the hills isn't her ideal track.
Josh Leffers If they allowed the engine to achieve its posted top speed then she would have more momentum going through steep sections. But because she is limited to 40 mph she can struggle on damp/rusty tracks.
@@calebcurfman4415 In revenue service this engine did not pull this weight.
You see videos like this because they are what people want to see. This isn't any stress or effort that the train wasn't designed for.
It's a photo runby. They stop the train back from the photo shoot spot and then start it up and "run by" the crowd. They love doing this engine on a steep grade because it can actually start the train.
Steam locomotives don’t like curved tracks.
Somebody failed to fill the sand hoppers.
3:10 the fuckin harley is soooo loud I can hear it over a steam train! ! Noisy piece of crap !😄😄😄
She might look good, she might be fast, but the factor of adhesion isn’t all that impressive as compared to 844 and 4449. #tinydrivers
First off. Bigger drivers give you less tractive effort. That's the reason the J's where chosen to have smaller drivers than other 4-8-4's, specifically because of the mountainous terrain of western VA.
Secondly the 611 has more tractive effort than either the 844 or 4449. Either of those loco's would have stalled out well before the 611. Nothing against those loco's as they're masterpieces of engineering and art as well.
Josh and thirdly factor of adhesion - 844 4.18, 4449 - 4.16, 611 3.39 A common rule is that a good factor of adhesion exceeds 4, but not by too much. A locomotive with a factor of adhesion below 4 will have a tendency to wheelslip, especially on starting, and will require careful driving and lots of sand in slippery conditions.
@@regal105 So she's more difficult to operate. But she can still pull a longer train 😉😁
Josh yes if you have enough sand and level ground 😉
@@regal105 Level ground vs a grade doesn't change which loco is able to carry the longer train. The TE is still the most important indicator of how long of a train you can pull. So while a J's wheels might be spinning, they won't grind to a halt before the 844's. Only problem is getting them to stick. That's where the talent of your engineer is important. And also, yes, lots of sand.
69th Comment. I love this train
Racing Fan For Life 18 nice
Still Love this train
I can't do it! I can't do it! I can't do it!
Too much weight
cosgrove notts It’s called Physics. Trains don’t like damp rusty rails.
@@calebcurfman4415 If you put sand down they do.
@@calebcurfman4415 not to mention the steep grade she was fighting against
I feel bad for the trees there just being blasted with smoke and steam AL the time
They only run 611 or any steam loco on rare occasions for the past 40 yrs or so. This line sees 20+ modern freight trains daily to inland port in Front Royal, Va just west of the mountains.
Really??
How about all the animals? What about peoples clothes on the line?
And the Bears
Great video!!