My guess is that conventional bass trombone mutes probably work with this instrument, because while the flare is quite large, the throat of the bell, where the mute corks sit while inserted, doesn’t seem too different from other basses. That would cover all but the bucket mute, which, yes, would definitely take some extra work to track down if you had to look for a 10” version…
I bought a conn 112H as a 'mid life crisis ' gift to myself ( with the blessing of my wife as it's safer than a motorbike!) The 1 1/2 G mouthpiece that it came with is probably more use as a fishing weight so I changed to a Dennis Wick 1AL Heritage style mouthpiece - that improved the richness of the lower register and also surprisingly made it easier for me to hit notes in the higher register.. a great instrument all round 👍😎 🎵🎶
Congrats on the new monster! I myself also switched to a Wick after posting this video, although it was a 0AL. The 1-1/2G is certainly divisive, but I do see its merits. Nonetheless, I wish I’d recorded the playing samples in this video at a time when I (a) was better at the instrument and (b) had the Wick at my disposal.
Fun hack - "Big belled trombone" is an easy to hunt around for cheap bass trombones from unsuspecting sellers. I found a nice bass trombone that way once before. xD
It really depends on the player, the amount of time spent on each, and the goals of doubling. I managed, sure, but I don’t advocate that most brass players double. It can harm some players’ trumpet chops to try to play low brass frequently, and moreover, even if it *doesn’t* harm their chops directly, it still takes away practice time that would otherwise be spent on the trumpet. It also depends on how adaptable one’s chops are to differing mouthpiece sizes. I ended up developing a completely different embouchure for low brass than for trumpet. This took a lot of trial and error, and can make it harder for some to return to the trumpet after playing low brass. All in all, I’m not here to stop anyone from pursuing what makes them happy, but doubling is a significant challenge and it’s Important for potential doublers to be aware of the risks and difficulties of doing so.
Bach trombones are my favorite. (Side note ~ I like your channel Samuel, and find your commentary in this video to be valuable.) I am fortunate to have been able to go to the Bach factory and select 4 different horns when I was in my peak playing condition. My bass trombone is a 50B2 ~ dependent F and Eb valves. This is decidedly an old school set up with limited potential. Having said that, depending on what music you play, and what kind(s) of groups you play in, it may be all you need. Consider that for a very long time bass trombones had only one valve. Consequently there was very little if any music written that called for a B below the staff. IF you're 'just dipping your toe' in the waters of bass tromboneage, chose wisely. Consider also that a used 50B2 in good condition will cost you FAR less that any new bass trombone.
Thank you for your kind words and your own insights. My preference tends to be for Conns over Bachs in terms of both tenors and basses, but admittedly (a) I've really enjoyed most Bach trombones I've tried and (b) I have never gotten to try several of the same model side by side to hand-pick, as did you. The ability to do so might have swayed my opinion more in favor of Bach, given that their 'holy grails' that account for about 10% of what comes off the assembly line are said to be unparalleled in terms of sound. I think your observations about how much an independent second rotor is truly 'needed' are accurate. However, it's important to consider all the possible uses of the setup. For instance: I picked up the trombone in eighth grade after three and a half years of playing the trumpet. I was, at this point, aware of the fact some of my friends were stepping up to 'trigger trombones' which expanded the potential for low register and technical passages. However, I figured I'd never play trombone at the level where I would 'need' or get frequent use out of a trigger, and I worried that it would just be an extra cost to my parents. Consequently, they got me a very nice straight tenor, though with raised eyebrows. Mere months down the line, especially being short of frame, I was discovering the limitations of my decision and regretting not choosing a solid, mid-range trombone with an F-attachment rather than such a nice jazz horn. The example with the single-valve Bb/F or dependent Bb/F/Eb bass trombone is admittedly far less severe. You're right: the majority of bass trombone music is by all means performable on such instruments. I personally struggle on such instruments, though, because one again my short arms get in the way. I benefit hugely from the reduced slide movement that a second valve, and moreover an independent one, provide. There's more to learn, but the learning curve is decreased significantly for people like me. That's why I tend to advocate strongly for independent valves when it comes to students who might not yet be fully grown. Anyway, statistically speaking, I can all but guarantee your arms are longer than mine (my total wingspan is under five feet despite being 5'4" in height), so I'm sure the Bach 50B2, being built on the same solid foundations as the 50B3 which I play thanks to my school, has treated you very well. I'm not here to deny that. Thanks again for your comment and for sparking this discussion!
Another bass trombone that has the bell flare close to you like the conn 72H and the 112H is the Reynolds contempora, both the T0-01 and T0-02 which I have personally both owened.
Nice breakdown, I look casually at bass trombones every once in a while. My main concert horn now is a Conn tenor with an F attachment, and I'm using a Conn Director for marching band. I guess I could round out the trifecta with a Conn bass. Then I'd just need an alto...
I also had a Conn trinity: 14H Director small bore, 50H Director medium bore, and my true love the 88H large bore. I’ve sold the 14H in favor of a King 606 and will probably be selling the 50H just for the sake of clearing out my rather ridiculous collection and putting that money towards tuition. On the topic of Conn altos, check out the 36H-pretty awesome stuff! Eb alto with Bb-attachment. Christopher Bill used to play one quite a bit.
Trombonists or low brass specialists in the audience: what is your bass trombone of choice? I’m interested to hear what the trend is nowadays!
@fupathegreat8318 Getzen Custom basses are amazing! I just wish their Eterna was up to the same standard…
One that I can afford 😭
I use a shires George Curran artist model
@@msewell763 Hence why I don’t own one myself :/
@@SamuelPlaysBrass if I had the money I would get a Jupiter xo
Have no idea how this ended up in my recommended, but this man is handsome
Consider me flattered.
The Conn 112H and 110H were designed by Larry Minick, a great trombone innovator.
That bell flare must make finding a mute an adventure.
My guess is that conventional bass trombone mutes probably work with this instrument, because while the flare is quite large, the throat of the bell, where the mute corks sit while inserted, doesn’t seem too different from other basses. That would cover all but the bucket mute, which, yes, would definitely take some extra work to track down if you had to look for a 10” version…
Really great and interesting video Samuel!😁👍👏👏
Thank you!
You're so welcome Samuel!😁
I bought a conn 112H as a 'mid life crisis ' gift to myself ( with the blessing of my wife as it's safer than a motorbike!) The 1 1/2 G mouthpiece that it came with is probably more use as a fishing weight so I changed to a Dennis Wick 1AL Heritage style mouthpiece - that improved the richness of the lower register and also surprisingly made it easier for me to hit notes in the higher register.. a great instrument all round 👍😎 🎵🎶
Congrats on the new monster! I myself also switched to a Wick after posting this video, although it was a 0AL. The 1-1/2G is certainly divisive, but I do see its merits. Nonetheless, I wish I’d recorded the playing samples in this video at a time when I (a) was better at the instrument and (b) had the Wick at my disposal.
Fun hack - "Big belled trombone" is an easy to hunt around for cheap bass trombones from unsuspecting sellers. I found a nice bass trombone that way once before. xD
Great video!
Thanks James!
Awesome video! Love bass bone
Bass bone supremacy 😎
Do you think it would be hard for a trumpet player to learn tenor trombone? Id rearly like to learn it but i can only play valves
It really depends on the player, the amount of time spent on each, and the goals of doubling. I managed, sure, but I don’t advocate that most brass players double. It can harm some players’ trumpet chops to try to play low brass frequently, and moreover, even if it *doesn’t* harm their chops directly, it still takes away practice time that would otherwise be spent on the trumpet. It also depends on how adaptable one’s chops are to differing mouthpiece sizes. I ended up developing a completely different embouchure for low brass than for trumpet. This took a lot of trial and error, and can make it harder for some to return to the trumpet after playing low brass. All in all, I’m not here to stop anyone from pursuing what makes them happy, but doubling is a significant challenge and it’s Important for potential doublers to be aware of the risks and difficulties of doing so.
@@SamuelPlaysBrass well the only low brass i can curently play is tenor horn. What brass instroment did you start of on?
@@rodneytrotter8436 trumpet
I believe You can do it I’m a French horn who switched from trumpet and managed to learn trombone
Bach trombones are my favorite. (Side note ~ I like your channel Samuel, and find your commentary in this video to be valuable.)
I am fortunate to have been able to go to the Bach factory and select 4 different horns when I was in my peak playing condition. My bass trombone is a 50B2 ~ dependent F and Eb valves. This is decidedly an old school set up with limited potential. Having said that, depending on what music you play, and what kind(s) of groups you play in, it may be all you need.
Consider that for a very long time bass trombones had only one valve. Consequently there was very little if any music written that called for a B below the staff. IF you're 'just dipping your toe' in the waters of bass tromboneage, chose wisely.
Consider also that a used 50B2 in good condition will cost you FAR less that any new bass trombone.
Thank you for your kind words and your own insights. My preference tends to be for Conns over Bachs in terms of both tenors and basses, but admittedly (a) I've really enjoyed most Bach trombones I've tried and (b) I have never gotten to try several of the same model side by side to hand-pick, as did you. The ability to do so might have swayed my opinion more in favor of Bach, given that their 'holy grails' that account for about 10% of what comes off the assembly line are said to be unparalleled in terms of sound.
I think your observations about how much an independent second rotor is truly 'needed' are accurate. However, it's important to consider all the possible uses of the setup. For instance: I picked up the trombone in eighth grade after three and a half years of playing the trumpet. I was, at this point, aware of the fact some of my friends were stepping up to 'trigger trombones' which expanded the potential for low register and technical passages. However, I figured I'd never play trombone at the level where I would 'need' or get frequent use out of a trigger, and I worried that it would just be an extra cost to my parents. Consequently, they got me a very nice straight tenor, though with raised eyebrows. Mere months down the line, especially being short of frame, I was discovering the limitations of my decision and regretting not choosing a solid, mid-range trombone with an F-attachment rather than such a nice jazz horn.
The example with the single-valve Bb/F or dependent Bb/F/Eb bass trombone is admittedly far less severe. You're right: the majority of bass trombone music is by all means performable on such instruments. I personally struggle on such instruments, though, because one again my short arms get in the way. I benefit hugely from the reduced slide movement that a second valve, and moreover an independent one, provide. There's more to learn, but the learning curve is decreased significantly for people like me. That's why I tend to advocate strongly for independent valves when it comes to students who might not yet be fully grown.
Anyway, statistically speaking, I can all but guarantee your arms are longer than mine (my total wingspan is under five feet despite being 5'4" in height), so I'm sure the Bach 50B2, being built on the same solid foundations as the 50B3 which I play thanks to my school, has treated you very well. I'm not here to deny that. Thanks again for your comment and for sparking this discussion!
@@SamuelPlaysBrass +
Another bass trombone that has the bell flare close to you like the conn 72H and the 112H is the Reynolds contempora, both the T0-01 and T0-02 which I have personally both owened.
Contemporas are very cool! Never tried a Reynolds bass trombone but I’ll keep an eye out.
I've owned both a 72H and a Reynolds Contempora bass. Both are extremely similar. I currently play on a Olds S-22 which is also amazing!
Nice breakdown, I look casually at bass trombones every once in a while. My main concert horn now is a Conn tenor with an F attachment, and I'm using a Conn Director for marching band. I guess I could round out the trifecta with a Conn bass. Then I'd just need an alto...
I also had a Conn trinity: 14H Director small bore, 50H Director medium bore, and my true love the 88H large bore. I’ve sold the 14H in favor of a King 606 and will probably be selling the 50H just for the sake of clearing out my rather ridiculous collection and putting that money towards tuition.
On the topic of Conn altos, check out the 36H-pretty awesome stuff! Eb alto with Bb-attachment. Christopher Bill used to play one quite a bit.
Nice Video
Thanks Juan!