Excellent information. I'm 71 and like most of us, have always struggled with the driver. Lots of videos proposing cutting the shaft down. Instead, on the driver and my other longer clubs, I just choke down on the club (a full 4" on my driver) and I get great results. Also, if I cut all these clubs, they'd be impossible to sell later whenever I tire of them. Thanks again. It's good to know for a guy like me, there is no difference between cutting and choking down.
This is exactly the video I’ve been looking for. At the range yesterday I chocked down on my 45.5 inch driver and found that suddenly I was no shorter but my ball speed was far far more consistent. My old driver a titleist 910D3 had a 44 inch shaft and I was driving it nicely. I switched to a ts3 with a 45.5 inch shaft and I’m so inconsistent.
Makes sense to me , the carbon fiber shafts are so lightweight to begin with I couldn’t understand why so many people were making a big deal about cutting an inch of feather weight off the butt end of the shaft!!!!😁 thanks for clearing this up ! I found that choking down made for better control with no loss of distance that was noticeable!!!!👍👍 I’m installing a new shaft on my 3 wood and was considering a length of 43 inches instead of 43.5 inch, as I am 5 feet 6.5 inches tall!!!
Last 2 years Ive used a Driver head that I can use regular head weights without hot melt or lead tape and it has made my life much easier from the fairway!! Finding the right set up, you can never go wrong.
I cut a half inch off my driver. I then put led tape around the butt to keep the overall weight the same. This naturally stiffens the driver cutting it, so I added a few grams to the head to keep the same type of flex/reaction with the shaft. Now I don’t have tools or machines telling me this, i just go by feel. It feels good and can’t wait to try it!
Thanks for sharing your expertise and insight. Also admire your practicality and inventiveness in jerry-rigging the"grip down". Just coincidentally I was watching some golf highlights and it struck me how much Lydia Ko grips down on all her clubs for all swings (full and half shots)....also noticed that Justin Thomas has quite a bit of butt end showing when he is set-up w his driver. Again, thanks, most useful as I am having some swing weight struggles having put on heavier jumbo grips because of arthritic pain
Very helpful, thanks! Trying to find a driver now to replace my old ancient hand me down from my grandfather. I realized today that my driver is 44" where as the ones i have been testing are all around 45.5" I'll remember this next time i go in! it seemed like my slice was more pronounced but a longer club will do that.
It's harder to square up that longer club so you will often see a bigger slice vs a shorter shaft. Would definitely try choking down a little and seeing what that does. Just remember you may need to add some weight back to the head if the club is or plays shorter (gripping down) to get the balance right for you.
I bought a Cobra F9 "tour" which has a 44" shaft. I did notice the weights were boosted to 18g rear and 6g front I think to get the swing weight back up.
I cut my driver down from 45 inches to 43.75 inches. Being only 5 ft 6inches it made sense to me. I was getting better results when I would grip down so I said lets cut it down. Turned out to be a great thing. I didn't even add any weight to the head. I am hitting the ball just as far and some shots go further then what I was getting at the longer length. My accuracy has jumped as I am finding the sweet spot consistently. I am sure results will vary from one person to another but I look forward to hitting the driver now. Whats the point of a driver if your not able to consistently hit fairways?
I had an old Aldila shaft that I cut down to make my driver into 7 iron length. I put it in a Cobra LTD for which I had an extra port cover. I used epoxy to glue lead tape inside the cover to get a D3 swing weight. I lost some yardage but that thing hit the fairways. Outdrove some of my golfing buddies on a couple of holes.
Thank you AJ. Always find your content very informative. So I have a 10.5 degree driver and a Regular flex 50 gram shaft that is mid spin , M/H Launch. I can see from the flight , the ball is launching too high with a steep decent angle. On the launch monitor, I see my attach angle is actually 5 degree up, so the issue is not caused by hitting down and spinning the ball. Here is the question, if you had to change one thing, would it be better to change the head to a 9.0 degree loft or change the shaft to a low spin/low launch. Current Driver is a Sim Max Driver 10.5 with a Ventus Red Regular flex and lowering the loft on the current driver to 9.0 opens face. I would like to play a draw. Do you think is the driver or the shaft that is causing the high launch.
Probably some of each but the head will always have the most direct effect on launch. Changing loft will change launch angle. Changing shaft might but it's not a guarantee or by how much. Also pay attention to strike location on the head as that greatly impact launch and spin as well.
Great comparison here. I would say though that if you are going to start playing it shorter, I would add weight to the head to get the swing weight somewhat close to where it was at the normal length. For me it made a huge difference in playability and overall carry distance. Just my 2 pennies....
I think perhaps the bigger point you didn’t mention from the start is that most people don’t understand that gripping down effectively lowers the swingweight. People grip down and say the swingweight doesn’t change. Well, it obviously doesn’t change on the scale until you actually measure it from the shorter point like you did. Gripping down makes the driver head feel lighter. That may or may not be a problem for someone. I play my driver shorter than standard but I adjust the weight back up with lead tape or hot melt or a bit of both.
Right now, only my right pinky finger is left on the grip of my driver (I hit right handed). The index finger is off the grip on my irons. Since choking down, my game has improved dramatically. I was nervous about cutting them down because of all the “experts” and their advice. I am not a good golfer. I just like to play and would like to do so more comfortably. Thanks for the video and the confidence to play my own game.
Is the effective stiffness of the shaft the same with both of these options? I normally cut my driver down and add head weight back. I'm wondering if gripping down (still adding head weight) would have the same minimal effect on stiffness.
If you butt cut the shaft, the stiffness will increase according to a frequency meter until you ad weight back to the head to return the swing weight. I did a video about this where I try to explain it. ua-cam.com/video/Juw6aCNlgDE/v-deo.html
Short question when removing / swapping shafts: How to prevent ferrules from melting when using the hot air gun -- they are plastic, right? So I guess they melt?
You can wrap the ferrule with damp towels to try and keep from melting. A butane micro torch can also be helpful as you can direct the heat more precisely.
You have made fundamental errors. Essentially SW is determined by mass and balance point. In a static machine this is essentially a know factor. By lopping off a section you have changed both mass and balance. When choking down, you have s different dynamic. The excess weight acts like a sword pommel, and changes things. I would consider this a negative mass. You tried to use your machine adapting for the choke above the nesting spot…. This is not the design. You would be better off using a SW calculator. So Im saying choking is not the same as lopping off, and your method was in error trying to compare. Close but no cigar. Good topic but more calculations and testing is required.
Just came across this video, very informative - I am looking to shorten a TS3 with Tensei Blue 55 to 44", all over the internet I am reading that I will need to add weight to the adjustable port - is this the case and if so how much weight to I add back in? Or do you think that the change is unnoticeable and leave well enough alone?
The weight will change depending on how much length you cut off. Just like the video said, the feel will be similar to choking down that same amount so that can help you decide if you need to add weight back to the head.
I’m 5’1” tall and recently got fitted for pings 425 irons, Jason at Lakeshore GC in Taylorville, Illinois. My irons are custom fit and short, how long should my woods be? Help
Woods should also be shortened up a bit most likely, however since the "standard" length for woods keeps going up, the amount can vary. I would start out assuming an inch on them as well. If you have concerns about it and are buying new woods, I might buy them at factory standard so you can play around with the length yourself. Once you find that sweet spot of how much if any to choke down, you can then cut them down to that point. Also remember to have swing weight in the back of your mind, as you get shorter, you might need to add some weight to the head in order to get the feel and consistency of strike you are looking for.
So I'm trying to fit my 13-year-old son into a driver. He's around 5'7" and still growing obviously. I just got him a Stealth 2 Plus driver and I want to cut the shaft down. Do you think if I just cut the butt end off like an inch and do nothing else to the head (add weight etc) that he would benefit? Having him grip down is affecting his timing so I'm thinking a shorter shaft is the way to go. I just want to avoid having to drop some $ on a new shaft. I was also watching another video by The Golf Nerd and he made it seem like there are many other variables to deal with. But if it's only .1 difference in swing weight.. i think that would be fine. Just would love to get your thoughts.
Having him grip down will give a very good approximation of what the cut shaft will feel like. The swing weight will be very close, as will the feel of the shaft flexing. Biggest difference will be the smaller grip diameter from gripping down. His timing being off when gripping down could be from the grip size, or from the lighter SW. Would need to test with adding back some head weight to isolate the cause.
Great video, I have been wondering whether choking down really helps to reduce the swing weight. So gripping down actually works. And it seems that for every one inch the swing weight changes about 6 points, half an inch 3 points. Thank you.
@@EFGMC What's more surprising is that choking down on the grip actually reduces even more swing weights than cutting the shaft short (even though it's only about 1 point). Amazing, thanks for the experiment! Much appreciated.
@@wilsonhung8654 It came out that way in my measuring method however I don't know if they're some slight variations that can happen based on how I position the shaft above the scale back stop. It is basically the same result using either method except for the smaller grip diameter when gripping down.
@@EFGMC Thank you for your fast reply. Yes, definitly i will need to do that, I've watched your video how to check lie angles already 😉. Watching max out driver and accuracy video now. Amazing content you have in your YT channel.
If you are only wanting to change the length, you will cut from the butt end. Also check out this video I did if you have questions about how it works. ua-cam.com/video/Juw6aCNlgDE/v-deo.html
To me, you cut down clubs for fit based on your height and swing. You grip up or down to control distance and flight. I'm sure swing weights are important to some and honestly I don't know enough to argue one way or the other. What I do know is that shaft torque matters to me. Lower torque typically means lower spin rates and a lower dispersion from left to right, plus a more penetrating ball flight.
Force=mass x acceleration When we reduce the length of the driver and add weight to the clubhead to maintain our preferred Swing Weight, we effectively increased the Force we put on the ball, assuming the same or greater acceleration of the clubhead with the shorter driver length.
Definitely an option, but the number of light weight grips is limited so you may not be able to find what you want, and if you need a midsize or jumbo it gets even harder to find.
Question kind sir... How much loft is lost per 1 inch of shaft removal on a 9.5 degree driver (45" 3/4 to 44" 3/4)? Say i removed 3 inches off a 40" 22 degree hybrid (and added weight to equal original swing weight)...what would the be the estimated loft of that? 1/2 a degree per 1/2 inch?
@@EFGMCSorry, I experimented on an old hybrid (17 degree) that was collecting dust from the garage. I cutt it down to a 7i length and added weight to reach d3. The experiment was a success as the ultimate controlable rescue club for bad lies ...however the ball flight is like an 8 degree driver now and the distance is obviously shorter. The shaft stiffness is now probably at xstiff. I'm assuming the change in shaft dynamics are the main cause of the low flight. I need to swap in a 7i shaft so it flexes as designed.
@@brotharuss By adding the weight back to the head, you soften the shaft so it probably is not as stiff as you might think. And if you cut from the butt end, you are removing the stiffest portion of the shaft so the remaining portion is again going to be softer. My guess on the trajectory is coming from your AoA and dynamic loft from your hands. I have found if I play a very short club, (junior length) my trajectory is very low by comparison. I think flattening my angle into the ball is the main reason.
@@EFGMC your right the club doesn't seem overly stiff..probably playing like a reg flex with added weight like you said and it probably is the hands delofting the ball flight. The lack of club head speed generated at 37" doesn't help a 17 degree either. It sure is a fun rescue club to swing thou.... Fairway finder for sure.
@@Concern_Citizen I tied all the clubs onto the swing weight scale allowing me to have the butt end of the shaft hang off past the end of the scale thereby replicating gripping down.
@@EFGMC - Interesting! I thought Swing Weight is measured on a 14" fulcrum? You believe tying the butt end allows the scale to measure the untied portion on the 14" fulcrum?
We don't usually apply swing weight to putters because the lie angle is too upright and the weights of components are so different. However the basic rules would still apply.
Will add that to my list. Reducing swingweight is tricky because the only options are reducing head weight (difficult), shortening club length, or adding grip end weight. This last option is my least favorite.
The bending stress on a golf shaft with consistent tip diameter of 0.335 inches(industry standard) reaches its limit at 45 inch long driver. There is a physical limit for every diameter of a given shaft. That means at or over 45 inch driver length, (assume graphite tip 0.335 inch diameter) will bend inconsistently at or above 45 inch driver length. It is the mechanical properties of graphite, not the ability of the golfer.
i have a set of old macgregor tourney irons that dont have any kind of plastic ferrul piece. i think the shafts may some sort of custom size but i also have no idea. wondering if you have any experience reshafting clubs like these.. my dream is putting 2020 graphite shafts on them
There are some older irons with non standard hosel diameters. Not sure with Macgregor, last time I did anything with them was many years ago. Simple way to figure it out would be using a caliper and measuring the shaft diameter right above where it enters the hosel. Even better would be to pull one of the heads and measure the shaft tip or inside hosel. No reason you can't put carbon fiber in them assuming they are not an odd diameter. FYI you would need to bevel the top of the hosel, as those older irons usually had straight walls that can cause stress points for carbon fiber shafts leading to breaks.
@@EFGMC seems beyond my skill level.. thanks for the response and information. i saved up for a while for my new irons and will save up to have my macgregors renovated next year
@@LaidBackGolf I promise it's not that hard and would only require one extra drill bit to do the bevel, but you might want to experiment with a cheap junker club first.
The only difference would be the feel of the grip. Because the grip and shaft have taper, when you grip down you're also effectively reducing the size of your grip. If you cut it down and re installed the grip you'd be pretty close to the same grip size as before.
That is true. Depending on the grip type it will have some taper in it, some more than others. But it's still a good way to figure out if trimming a shaft down will work before you actually do it and pass the point of no return.
@@EFGMC yeah I'd probably never cut one down, Id just re grip it and build up the lower hand more and continue to choke up. Probably Much better resale value at full length than one cut down by an amateur haha.
This video clearly shows why the advice "just choke up" to those that want to shorten their drivers is stupid advice. Sure, choking up and JUST shortening the driver will take your swing weight to C7 or C8. But shortening a driver and not adjusting swing weight is plain stupid. Does anyone think for a PGA pro playing a 44" driver (that is sold to the public @ 45.5") the tech truck chops off 1.5" and hands over a driver with a swing weight of C8??? Of course not, the easy part of shortening a driver is chopping the shaft; to complete the job you NEED to add weight to get the swing weight to something playable (in the range of D2 to D4). For all of the "adjustability" of modern drivers, I continue to scratch my head at why manufacturers don't design drivers that allow for significant weight adjustability to support different shaft lengths.
You do have a couple options with putting that weight back besides just lead tape. If the club has moveable weights, you can find a 3rd weight to bring back the head weight. Rory I recall had 3 weights in his M5 driver. If the driver has a weight screw in back, you may be able to find either a OEM heavier replacement or an aftermarket version. Just be aware, just because the driver was D4 at 45.5 inches, doesn't mean automatically go straight back to D4 if you cut it down to 44 inches. You may find at the new length, you have better results going slightly heavier or lighter. All very golfer dependent.
@@EFGMC I have a lot of experience with shorter drivers/adding weight. For example, I've been playing a Nike SQ Dymo cut to 44". I worked with a PGA pro (ex-tech for Adams on the Senior Tour) and we hot melted the heads (I have two identical drivers - one for my US house & one in my Italian house) to D3. Great driver - been playing it for years. I am switching to a Cleveland HB Turbo and playing that at normal length (44.5"). The counterbalanced shaft really helps with the extra length. Am also playing with an old Srixon Z 745 (430cc head) where I am cutting the shaft and using the weights to try to get back to D3 (OEM it was D5).
My reason for leaving the Nike is low strike. Mid/high I get 2400 spin which is fine but low strike jumps to 4000. These newer, lower CG drivers are more consistent with spin and ball speed across the face. Playing with the Z745 because I actually prefer a smaller driver head/face (I love my 3W) but even after tuning I think the Z745 won't be as easy to hit well as the Cleveland.
@@EFGMC large head helps but low cg more (my Nike is 460cc).problem with ls drivers now can be too low spin. When you see knuckleballs you know your getting low (sub 1000) spin. I definitely saw that with some drivers
You need to add weight back to the head because the swing weight will have dropped and after a certain point, most golfers will loose control of the club. The weight will soften the feel of the shaft but it more or less counters the stiffening effect when shortening any beam.
@@EFGMC That's good to know, but (blankety blank) said that butt cutting could possibly be cutting off the stiffest part of a shaft (therefore - a less stiff shaft) ... I've cut a lot of shafts and can't really tell much about flex. Not like swing weight, which is huge.
Well, I don’t completely agree. If you can consistently grip down exactly the same every time you use the club then go for it. Personally, I find that impossible to do because I always want to grip at the end of the shaft. So if I cut off an inch I don’t have to remember to grip down all the time. It’s just one less thing to think about. Besides, a shorter shaft means more accuracy.
![ПОЛНАЯ ИСТОРИЯ ЭКЗОРЦИЗМА [Топ Сикрет]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/qBySr6Bt0B8/mqdefault.jpg)
Excellent information. I'm 71 and like most of us, have always struggled with the driver. Lots of videos proposing cutting the shaft down. Instead, on the driver and my other longer clubs, I just choke down on the club (a full 4" on my driver) and I get great results. Also, if I cut all these clubs, they'd be impossible to sell later whenever I tire of them. Thanks again. It's good to know for a guy like me, there is no difference between cutting and choking down.
This is exactly the video I’ve been looking for. At the range yesterday I chocked down on my 45.5 inch driver and found that suddenly I was no shorter but my ball speed was far far more consistent. My old driver a titleist 910D3 had a 44 inch shaft and I was driving it nicely. I switched to a ts3 with a 45.5 inch shaft and I’m so inconsistent.
Fantastic video! Thanks so much, it was very enlightening. Saved me a lot of trouble also
This is pretty frickin awesome information to have as I consider altering some clubs. Thank you!
Makes sense to me , the carbon fiber shafts are so lightweight to begin with I couldn’t understand why so many people were making a big deal about cutting an inch of feather weight off the butt end of the shaft!!!!😁 thanks for clearing this up ! I found that choking down made for better control with no loss of distance that was noticeable!!!!👍👍 I’m installing a new shaft on my 3 wood and was considering a length of 43 inches instead of 43.5 inch, as I am 5 feet 6.5 inches tall!!!
I saw a video of tips how to hit more straight the drive by griping down a little and it works for me . great video
Last 2 years Ive used a Driver head that I can use regular head weights without hot melt or lead tape and it has made my life much easier from the fairway!! Finding the right set up, you can never go wrong.
I cut a half inch off my driver. I then put led tape around the butt to keep the overall weight the same. This naturally stiffens the driver cutting it, so I added a few grams to the head to keep the same type of flex/reaction with the shaft. Now I don’t have tools or machines telling me this, i just go by feel. It feels good and can’t wait to try it!
Great video!!
Thanks for watching.
Thanks for sharing your expertise and insight. Also admire your practicality and inventiveness in jerry-rigging the"grip down". Just coincidentally I was watching some golf highlights and it struck me how much Lydia Ko grips down on all her clubs for all swings (full and half shots)....also noticed that Justin Thomas has quite a bit of butt end showing when he is set-up w his driver. Again, thanks, most useful as I am having some swing weight struggles having put on heavier jumbo grips because of arthritic pain
Seems like I see many of the women gripping down. Don't know if that's a result of playing longer clubs when younger?
@@EFGMC Could also be that smaller female hands prefer the slimmer part of the grip.
Great information 👍 👌
Very helpful, thanks! Trying to find a driver now to replace my old ancient hand me down from my grandfather. I realized today that my driver is 44" where as the ones i have been testing are all around 45.5" I'll remember this next time i go in! it seemed like my slice was more pronounced but a longer club will do that.
It's harder to square up that longer club so you will often see a bigger slice vs a shorter shaft. Would definitely try choking down a little and seeing what that does. Just remember you may need to add some weight back to the head if the club is or plays shorter (gripping down) to get the balance right for you.
I bought a Cobra F9 "tour" which has a 44" shaft. I did notice the weights were boosted to 18g rear and 6g front I think to get the swing weight back up.
Good to know! Thanks
I cut my driver down from 45 inches to 43.75 inches. Being only 5 ft 6inches it made sense to me. I was getting better results when I would grip down so I said lets cut it down. Turned out to be a great thing. I didn't even add any weight to the head. I am hitting the ball just as far and some shots go further then what I was getting at the longer length. My accuracy has jumped as I am finding the sweet spot consistently. I am sure results will vary from one person to another but I look forward to hitting the driver now. Whats the point of a driver if your not able to consistently hit fairways?
Really interesting!
I had an old Aldila shaft that I cut down to make my driver into 7 iron length. I put it in a Cobra LTD for which I had an extra port cover. I used epoxy to glue lead tape inside the cover to get a D3 swing weight. I lost some yardage but that thing hit the fairways. Outdrove some of my golfing buddies on a couple of holes.
What loft was it?
Wait, tell us more about this creation. And what is a port cover?
Thank you very much
Thanks for watching!
Thanks this was helpful
Thanks for watching!
Thank you AJ. Always find your content very informative. So I have a 10.5 degree driver and a Regular flex 50 gram shaft that is mid spin , M/H Launch. I can see from the flight , the ball is launching too high with a steep decent angle. On the launch monitor, I see my attach angle is actually 5 degree up, so the issue is not caused by hitting down and spinning the ball. Here is the question, if you had to change one thing, would it be better to change the head to a 9.0 degree loft or change the shaft to a low spin/low launch. Current Driver is a Sim Max Driver 10.5 with a Ventus Red Regular flex and lowering the loft on the current driver to 9.0 opens face. I would like to play a draw. Do you think is the driver or the shaft that is causing the high launch.
Probably some of each but the head will always have the most direct effect on launch. Changing loft will change launch angle. Changing shaft might but it's not a guarantee or by how much.
Also pay attention to strike location on the head as that greatly impact launch and spin as well.
@@EFGMC thank you
Great comparison here. I would say though that if you are going to start playing it shorter, I would add weight to the head to get the swing weight somewhat close to where it was at the normal length. For me it made a huge difference in playability and overall carry distance. Just my 2 pennies....
I think perhaps the bigger point you didn’t mention from the start is that most people don’t understand that gripping down effectively lowers the swingweight. People grip down and say the swingweight doesn’t change. Well, it obviously doesn’t change on the scale until you actually measure it from the shorter point like you did.
Gripping down makes the driver head feel lighter. That may or may not be a problem for someone. I play my driver shorter than standard but I adjust the weight back up with lead tape or hot melt or a bit of both.
💯
Right now, only my right pinky finger is left on the grip of my driver (I hit right handed). The index finger is off the grip on my irons. Since choking down, my game has improved dramatically. I was nervous about cutting them down because of all the “experts” and their advice. I am not a good golfer. I just like to play and would like to do so more comfortably. Thanks for the video and the confidence to play my own game.
Thank you. That sums up this channel. Figure out what works for you, not what someone else says should fit.
Is the effective stiffness of the shaft the same with both of these options? I normally cut my driver down and add head weight back. I'm wondering if gripping down (still adding head weight) would have the same minimal effect on stiffness.
You need to watch the torque rating of the shaft. Its always over looked
I shortened a spare 8 iron to putter length no need to grip down just bump and run, nice and easy
Interesting video, thanks. How is the flex of the shaft effected by shortening ?
If you butt cut the shaft, the stiffness will increase according to a frequency meter until you ad weight back to the head to return the swing weight. I did a video about this where I try to explain it.
ua-cam.com/video/Juw6aCNlgDE/v-deo.html
@@EFGMC Thanks for the swift answer sir, I look forward to watching the video.
Short question when removing / swapping shafts: How to prevent ferrules from melting when using the hot air gun -- they are plastic, right? So I guess they melt?
You can wrap the ferrule with damp towels to try and keep from melting. A butane micro torch can also be helpful as you can direct the heat more precisely.
999/1000 golfers wouldnt notice..... cutting a driver down hits more fairways
You have made fundamental errors. Essentially SW is determined by mass and balance point. In a static machine this is essentially a know factor. By lopping off a section you have changed both mass and balance. When choking down, you have s different dynamic. The excess weight acts like a sword pommel, and changes things. I would consider this a negative mass. You tried to use your machine adapting for the choke above the nesting spot…. This is not the design. You would be better off using a SW calculator. So Im saying choking is not the same as lopping off, and your method was in error trying to compare. Close but no cigar. Good topic but more calculations and testing is required.
Just came across this video, very informative - I am looking to shorten a TS3 with Tensei Blue 55 to 44", all over the internet I am reading that I will need to add weight to the adjustable port - is this the case and if so how much weight to I add back in? Or do you think that the change is unnoticeable and leave well enough alone?
The weight will change depending on how much length you cut off. Just like the video said, the feel will be similar to choking down that same amount so that can help you decide if you need to add weight back to the head.
Hi, why cut diwn shaft, just grip down and play shorter?
Start half inch and so on until it feels ok!
Wouldn’t it be more of a torque spec of the shaft vs the weight?
I’m 5’1” tall and recently got fitted for pings 425 irons, Jason at Lakeshore GC in Taylorville, Illinois. My irons are custom fit and short, how long should my woods be? Help
Woods should also be shortened up a bit most likely, however since the "standard" length for woods keeps going up, the amount can vary. I would start out assuming an inch on them as well. If you have concerns about it and are buying new woods, I might buy them at factory standard so you can play around with the length yourself. Once you find that sweet spot of how much if any to choke down, you can then cut them down to that point. Also remember to have swing weight in the back of your mind, as you get shorter, you might need to add some weight to the head in order to get the feel and consistency of strike you are looking for.
So I'm trying to fit my 13-year-old son into a driver. He's around 5'7" and still growing obviously. I just got him a Stealth 2 Plus driver and I want to cut the shaft down. Do you think if I just cut the butt end off like an inch and do nothing else to the head (add weight etc) that he would benefit? Having him grip down is affecting his timing so I'm thinking a shorter shaft is the way to go. I just want to avoid having to drop some $ on a new shaft. I was also watching another video by The Golf Nerd and he made it seem like there are many other variables to deal with. But if it's only .1 difference in swing weight.. i think that would be fine. Just would love to get your thoughts.
Having him grip down will give a very good approximation of what the cut shaft will feel like. The swing weight will be very close, as will the feel of the shaft flexing. Biggest difference will be the smaller grip diameter from gripping down. His timing being off when gripping down could be from the grip size, or from the lighter SW. Would need to test with adding back some head weight to isolate the cause.
Great video, I have been wondering whether choking down really helps to reduce the swing weight. So gripping down actually works. And it seems that for every one inch the swing weight changes about 6 points, half an inch 3 points.
Thank you.
That's correct. It can vary slightly based on shaft balance and grip, but 5-6 points per inch with the driver is a good estimate.
@@EFGMC What's more surprising is that choking down on the grip actually reduces even more swing weights than cutting the shaft short (even though it's only about 1 point).
Amazing, thanks for the experiment! Much appreciated.
@@wilsonhung8654 It came out that way in my measuring method however I don't know if they're some slight variations that can happen based on how I position the shaft above the scale back stop. It is basically the same result using either method except for the smaller grip diameter when gripping down.
@@EFGMC Alas, perhaps it's because of the counterweighting effect when gripping down!
🤠Nice to know, no cut on shaft first!
Hi, even when I choke down on my golf clubs, golf club head toe won't sit flat on the ground. Is this a big issue?
Thanks! Keep it up
Doesn't matter how it sits at address, what matters is how it is at impact. Check your dynamic lie angle to see if it is off.
@@EFGMC
Thank you for your fast reply.
Yes, definitly i will need to do that, I've watched your video how to check lie angles already 😉.
Watching max out driver and accuracy video now.
Amazing content you have in your YT channel.
Do i want to?? Cut but end or tip end as i want- half a inch to 3/4'' of inch off the shaft many thanks
If you are only wanting to change the length, you will cut from the butt end. Also check out this video I did if you have questions about how it works.
ua-cam.com/video/Juw6aCNlgDE/v-deo.html
To me, you cut down clubs for fit based on your height and swing. You grip up or down to control distance and flight. I'm sure swing weights are important to some and honestly I don't know enough to argue one way or the other. What I do know is that shaft torque matters to me. Lower torque typically means lower spin rates and a lower dispersion from left to right, plus a more penetrating ball flight.
See I’m 5’4 so I have the grab the beginning of the grip and the driver still seems way too long for me. I cut down and it feels so much better
Force=mass x acceleration
When we reduce the length of the driver and add weight to the clubhead to
maintain our preferred Swing Weight, we effectively increased the Force we put on the ball, assuming the same or greater acceleration of the clubhead with the shorter driver length.
wouldn't you recommend after cutting down set a lighter grip, i.e. Dri-Tac Lite?
Definitely an option, but the number of light weight grips is limited so you may not be able to find what you want, and if you need a midsize or jumbo it gets even harder to find.
@@EFGMCwinn dritec lite is available in all sizes and is almost the same weight
Can a set of Ping Eye2 in beCu be bent to modern lofts.
I would contact Ping. Bending old Pings is no fun and I always default to them.
With all the talk of adding weight to the head , does this only apply to cutting down a stock shaft, rather than reshafting with an upgraded shaft?
If the reshaft is the same length as the cut down shaft, then you still probably need to add some weight to get the SW where you want it.
Thank you
Question kind sir... How much loft is lost per 1 inch of shaft removal on a 9.5 degree driver (45" 3/4 to 44" 3/4)? Say i removed 3 inches off a 40" 22 degree hybrid (and added weight to equal original swing weight)...what would the be the estimated loft of that? 1/2 a degree per 1/2 inch?
Do you mean "lie" change or swing weight change? The loft will not change based on length, however the lie and swing weight will.
@@EFGMCSorry, I experimented on an old hybrid (17 degree) that was collecting dust from the garage. I cutt it down to a 7i length and added weight to reach d3. The experiment was a success as the ultimate controlable rescue club for bad lies ...however the ball flight is like an 8 degree driver now and the distance is obviously shorter. The shaft stiffness is now probably at xstiff. I'm assuming the change in shaft dynamics are the main cause of the low flight. I need to swap in a 7i shaft so it flexes as designed.
@@brotharuss By adding the weight back to the head, you soften the shaft so it probably is not as stiff as you might think. And if you cut from the butt end, you are removing the stiffest portion of the shaft so the remaining portion is again going to be softer. My guess on the trajectory is coming from your AoA and dynamic loft from your hands. I have found if I play a very short club, (junior length) my trajectory is very low by comparison. I think flattening my angle into the ball is the main reason.
@@EFGMC your right the club doesn't seem overly stiff..probably playing like a reg flex with added weight like you said and it probably is the hands delofting the ball flight. The lack of club head speed generated at 37" doesn't help a 17 degree either. It sure is a fun rescue club to swing thou.... Fairway finder for sure.
thank you for this information, as someone who is shorter, i tend to choke down on my clubs
Glad it helped. Thanks for watching and please consider subscribing if you haven't.
@@EFGMC - How did you measure swing weight for gripping down?
@@Concern_Citizen I tied all the clubs onto the swing weight scale allowing me to have the butt end of the shaft hang off past the end of the scale thereby replicating gripping down.
@@EFGMC - Interesting! I thought Swing Weight is measured on a 14" fulcrum? You believe tying the butt end allows the scale to measure the untied portion on the 14" fulcrum?
@@Concern_Citizen The numbers matched up within 1 SWP of the cutting numbers which makes sense, so I feel pretty good about the method.
would the same principal apply to a putter?
We don't usually apply swing weight to putters because the lie angle is too upright and the weights of components are so different. However the basic rules would still apply.
Basically can grip down and add head weight without cutting shaft, looks like I have some experimenting to do!
Hi AJ, Big Fan of your shows. Just UA-camd "how to reduce swing weight" and got nothing, 0. Perhaps you can touch up on that?
Will add that to my list. Reducing swingweight is tricky because the only options are reducing head weight (difficult), shortening club length, or adding grip end weight. This last option is my least favorite.
The bending stress on a golf shaft with consistent tip diameter of 0.335 inches(industry standard)
reaches its limit at 45 inch long driver. There is a physical limit for every diameter of a given shaft.
That means at or over 45 inch driver length, (assume graphite tip 0.335 inch diameter)
will bend inconsistently at or above 45 inch driver length.
It is the mechanical properties of graphite, not the ability of the golfer.
i have a set of old macgregor tourney irons that dont have any kind of plastic ferrul piece. i think the shafts may some sort of custom size but i also have no idea. wondering if you have any experience reshafting clubs like these.. my dream is putting 2020 graphite shafts on them
There are some older irons with non standard hosel diameters. Not sure with Macgregor, last time I did anything with them was many years ago. Simple way to figure it out would be using a caliper and measuring the shaft diameter right above where it enters the hosel. Even better would be to pull one of the heads and measure the shaft tip or inside hosel.
No reason you can't put carbon fiber in them assuming they are not an odd diameter. FYI you would need to bevel the top of the hosel, as those older irons usually had straight walls that can cause stress points for carbon fiber shafts leading to breaks.
@@EFGMC seems beyond my skill level.. thanks for the response and information. i saved up for a while for my new irons and will save up to have my macgregors renovated next year
@@LaidBackGolf I promise it's not that hard and would only require one extra drill bit to do the bevel, but you might want to experiment with a cheap junker club first.
Surely total weight must be more important than swing weight.
YOu don't have to had weight (led tape) to the head when you cut the butt down???
You would want to add lead tape if you want to return the swing weight to what it was originally. Same if you were just consistently gripping down.
Depends how tall you are. My driver is 41" and I hit it like a iron
Myself, I wouldn’t like that light swing weight.
The only difference would be the feel of the grip. Because the grip and shaft have taper, when you grip down you're also effectively reducing the size of your grip. If you cut it down and re installed the grip you'd be pretty close to the same grip size as before.
That is true. Depending on the grip type it will have some taper in it, some more than others. But it's still a good way to figure out if trimming a shaft down will work before you actually do it and pass the point of no return.
@@EFGMC yeah I'd probably never cut one down, Id just re grip it and build up the lower hand more and continue to choke up. Probably Much better resale value at full length than one cut down by an amateur haha.
This video clearly shows why the advice "just choke up" to those that want to shorten their drivers is stupid advice. Sure, choking up and JUST shortening the driver will take your swing weight to C7 or C8. But shortening a driver and not adjusting swing weight is plain stupid. Does anyone think for a PGA pro playing a 44" driver (that is sold to the public @ 45.5") the tech truck chops off 1.5" and hands over a driver with a swing weight of C8??? Of course not, the easy part of shortening a driver is chopping the shaft; to complete the job you NEED to add weight to get the swing weight to something playable (in the range of D2 to D4). For all of the "adjustability" of modern drivers, I continue to scratch my head at why manufacturers don't design drivers that allow for significant weight adjustability to support different shaft lengths.
You do have a couple options with putting that weight back besides just lead tape. If the club has moveable weights, you can find a 3rd weight to bring back the head weight. Rory I recall had 3 weights in his M5 driver. If the driver has a weight screw in back, you may be able to find either a OEM heavier replacement or an aftermarket version. Just be aware, just because the driver was D4 at 45.5 inches, doesn't mean automatically go straight back to D4 if you cut it down to 44 inches. You may find at the new length, you have better results going slightly heavier or lighter. All very golfer dependent.
@@EFGMC I have a lot of experience with shorter drivers/adding weight. For example, I've been playing a Nike SQ Dymo cut to 44". I worked with a PGA pro (ex-tech for Adams on the Senior Tour) and we hot melted the heads (I have two identical drivers - one for my US house & one in my Italian house) to D3. Great driver - been playing it for years. I am switching to a Cleveland HB Turbo and playing that at normal length (44.5"). The counterbalanced shaft really helps with the extra length.
Am also playing with an old Srixon Z 745 (430cc head) where I am cutting the shaft and using the weights to try to get back to D3 (OEM it was D5).
My reason for leaving the Nike is low strike. Mid/high I get 2400 spin which is fine but low strike jumps to 4000. These newer, lower CG drivers are more consistent with spin and ball speed across the face. Playing with the Z745 because I actually prefer a smaller driver head/face (I love my 3W) but even after tuning I think the Z745 won't be as easy to hit well as the Cleveland.
@@jirimondo The newer drivers definitely have better numbers when you get low on the face. It's another benefit of having a larger driver head.
@@EFGMC large head helps but low cg more (my Nike is 460cc).problem with ls drivers now can be too low spin. When you see knuckleballs you know your getting low (sub 1000) spin. I definitely saw that with some drivers
If you trim the butt why do add weight to the head? should'nt you add weight to the butt? wouldn't adding weight to the head change the flex?
You need to add weight back to the head because the swing weight will have dropped and after a certain point, most golfers will loose control of the club. The weight will soften the feel of the shaft but it more or less counters the stiffening effect when shortening any beam.
@@EFGMC That's good to know, but (blankety blank) said that butt cutting could possibly be cutting off the stiffest part of a shaft (therefore - a less stiff shaft) ... I've cut a lot of shafts and can't really tell much about flex. Not like swing weight, which is huge.
(blank blankon) might have been talking about redistributing the kickpoint...I don't remember exactly...can't find the article.
@@eggsmann594 Agree. Point here is that whether you cut the shaft or just grip down, the feel and results will basically be the same.
They make a tool that removes the grip without destroying it.
Well, I don’t completely agree. If you can consistently grip down exactly the same every time you use the club then go for it. Personally, I find that impossible to do because I always want to grip at the end of the shaft. So if I cut off an inch I don’t have to remember to grip down all the time. It’s just one less thing to think about. Besides, a shorter shaft means more accuracy.