1. Abandonment, Fear of Abandonment, change in patterns that could suggest abandonment. 2. Being alone. Feelings of loneliness. Sudden isolation (friends out of town, recently moved). Out of relationship to self. People pleasing. Self-betrayal. 3. Feeling Rejection or Feeling Rejected. From breakup to someone not being available to hang out. 4. Feeling not good enough or disliked. 5. Being dismissed.
Totally spot on. At the same time, it makes me sad because as AP's we're so dependent on other peoples love, time, appreciation and commitment. Unfortunately, a break-up triggers all those wounds at the same time. When you're already feeling "alone" at your core, and the person you connected deeply with rejects and dismisses you (in my case an FA), feelings of loneliness become unbearable.
Literally!! I thought i had found someone who finally made me feel seen and then i was so so wrong it felt like our whole relationship didnt even happen like i dreamt the whole thing up
@@angelalomeli8620I'm going through those exact feelings right now. I feel totally discarded by the one woman who totally got me and gave me everything I needed. And she wasnin another mans bed the day after she left. Seemingly living her best life as they say.
I am a recovering FA and I just went on 1 date my first AP. Dear god!!! We texted for a few hours one night. We went on date the next night. By the 3rd night I was told I was inconsistent and he didn't want to date me anymore. I told him on the first date that Sunday was for football (we went out on a Saturday). We had a great date. He texted after the date and I responded tha/mt I had a good time. I texted him first in the morning. I figured that should be enough to indicate that I was interested and everything was cool. I was thinking from my perspective of how I would like to be treated. The early dating stages can be a little nerve racking because you don't know if the other person like you. I texted and let him know that I was heading out to watch the games. To me, this means I am unavailable for the next 11 hours. He sent a text asking how it was going. I responded and expressed my excitement about my team's game later that night. I was mildly annoyed but I wasn't really interested in the other games so it didn't bother me that he was trying to engage. When my game was starting, let him know. To me, it was like saying I am going to a movie or a concert. I'm going to be busy for the next 3 hours. You might text and ask how it is going but you shouldn't expect a response. He sends a text, 30 minutes later trying, to tell me something about the date. Like legit trying to have a full text convo about something serious. My face is like🤨🤨🤨 Mind you, I am at a watch party with 200 people screaming, yelling, and enjoying the game. I legit got pissed. I was reminded of the trope about how women always want to talk to men when the game is on. I decided to ignore him because I wanted to set a hard boundary and let him know that this attention seeking behavior would not be rewarded. In retrospect, I probably could have said I was setting a boundary. But damn, I wasn't thinking about best practices in communication during the football game. I'm not expecting to put relationship levels of consideration of his feelings into effect, after date 1. I responded at halftime. After that I was told I was a BPD and I was inconsistent. I cannot explain the level of rage I felt at the audacity. The audacity to try and diagnose someone with a mental illness because they aren't paying enough attention to you. I was already hesitant and expressed to my friend that this guy seems needy. He definitely reeked of severe codependency (self admittedly). However, I wasn't sure if it was my FA issues that were making me look at him sideways. I have a push/pull thing. Especially, I get nervous. My corrective action is to lean in and focus on connecting instead of disconnecting. That was my plan with him. This took the cake though. Even if we were in a 10 year relationship, Sunday is for Football. I feel bad because I was shown grace when I was in my crazy. I didn't want to cut him off but this was after 1 date. I didn't even put that thang on him! Early dating is the best it will ever get. He'll be million times worse later. Watching this video confirmed what he was experiencing and I empathize tremendously. However, I cannot date someone who is this early in their healing journey. I cannot be the center of someone's world. It is too much emotional labor. I have my baggage to carry. I legit feel attacked by this experience. I would imagine that APs end up with a lot of cluster B personality types or those that display the cluster b traits, because they give so much attention and want to be whatever YOU want them to be. The instant infusion of time and attention feeds them. Ironically, before I started my healing journey, this would probably have worked for me. As a matter of fact, I used to have weekend long dates. Very intense. I would then of course feel the crash of panic and pull away. Now that I'm on the other side of it, I understand that extreme highs and instant fusion is toxic. I'm more measured. I don't internalize things. I am patient and check in with myself. Sex is off the table. I understand that something can feel good but be bad. Sorry for the rant but damn. This was an unbelievably uncomfortable experience.
I understand your feelings. I lean FA. I'm learning that the part that could make a difference is to communicate your expectations so at least the other person knows. Like saying how important Sunday football alone time is for you and that you'll be in touch Monday then affirm that you like them. I enjoyed your story. Helped me learn also.
The abandonment vs. betrayal wound was how I knew I was FA and not AP, even when I have certainly have felt incredibly anxious in relationships with DAs and/or narcissistic people. I am very hyper-vigilant in the honeymoon/early dating phase, but abandonment is not my core fear. I've never really been afraid or triggered by being alone. My closest friend, on the other hand, appears to be a classic AP according to this list. She becomes very anxious and frightened when she is alone, and when plans are changed and/or cancelled and she isn't sure if her attachment needs will be met. She isn't skilled at self-soothing. Sometimes I trigger her myself with my need for alone time and not always being available when she needs--which she can express in a very sporadic and often intense way. Through this relationship, I have developed more empathy for DAs than I ever thought I would have (lol), as I can see how the needs of the AP can sometimes feel overwhelming to a person who leans avoidant and/or doesn't know how to soothe them. I'm very interested in advice on how to avoid triggering my AP friend, and to how to create a really secure relationship without me feeling like I have to bust my boundaries frequently in order for her to feel safe.
I feel you on this! I dated a FA now long ago, but previously I tended to be drawn to DA types. I now empathize a bit more with DAs because I felt more overwhelmed by the anxious tendencies that I sometimes have myself with other partners. I think as much as you can provide consistency, reliability, and direct open communication with anxious types, that's really helpful for them. If you need alone time, you can reassure them that you would love to spend time with them in the future once you feel more recharged after your solitude. And as much as possible, try to avoid agreeing or overcommitting to plans if you have a tendency to flake or cancel last minute. Really check in with yourself about your commitments before you make them, and when you do agree to a plan, stick to the commitment unless some other reasonable issue interferes with that (you're sick, e.g.). I had issues with my ex-partner b/c he had impressions that we had plans when I felt that our plans were more tenuous and not solidified. So when making plans, make sure you're being *very clear* about whether this is a tenuous or a solid plan. Hope that helps!
The video triggered me - in the exact way I needed to be. Thank you. This trigger list combined with the Emotional dumping video help me understanding some of my behaviors.
Haha, I correctly guessed what most of the triggers in video would be based on the AP courses within the school and how I've felt through my life and this journey. Thank you so much Thais, for giving an explanation and a solution to what I've perceived to be deeply ingrained and permanent "faults" for far too long. You have no idea how empowering it is to have realized that this isn't the way relationships have to be!
I use to be secure attached but by being rejected by family and then in romantic relationships I turned into AP. Now I need more reassurance that the person is gonna be there for me and won't leave once I have developed feelings to them.
The last third of the video felt like she was talking to me personally. Feeling like I'm not good enough ever is a huge part of what I am fighting on a daily basis and even the tiniest thing can send me into a spiral of self doubt and loathing because I'm not perfect and never will be. And by tiny i mean someone not responding to a text message in whatever arbitrary time frame i deem appropriate that day. It's exhausting and it's frustrating to be fully aware of it and unable to get ahead of it when i know it's coming.
I was in a relationship for almost 5 years with an AP and as an FA-leaning DA in this relationship it took me almost 2 years to get over the guilt of pain I have caused her. And now knowing what their core wounds are make me feel even more horrible about myself, I can't imagine the pain I caused her. I remember, every time she would attempt to have a talk about some issue, Id' just say sorry right away and that I will change for the better and then go to sleep, wake up the next day like nothing happened, I can't imagine the loneliness and frustrations and pain that she couldn't get through to me. I hated myself for hurting her, she didn't deserve any of it. She is lesbian and one thing I really never wanted to make her feel is she is less of a man/person because of what she is. I just pray and wish and hope that she finds a more secure or another AP that will love her like they deserve.
Yeah, nothing searious. After an abusive relationship of 5 years I ended up with a DA. It was only half year, but almost half year of therapy now to recover. All the emotional unavailability, the gaslightings, the walking on eggshels, stonewalling, lack of empathy... Now when a female collegue asked mento maybe buy her a candy, if I go to buy some soda, she was so thankful and kind. I went out, and just started crying in the evelator. Why I couldnt get all these warmness from my girlfriend.. Just kills me inside.
As an AP, I get triggered when the DA pull away for no good reason. It's impossible to make that AP-DA dynamic work long term if both aren't working on their attachment issues.
All this, plus throw into the mix an abusive environment and manipulative people who feel entitled to your soul and to take from you and want you to be nothing but a yes man for their selfish desires, really makes it vital for you to untangle yourself from this belief and see the beauty in becoming self involved.
my question is, how do you not harbor anger toward your caregivers for creating these insecure attachment wounds in the first place? they were "doing the best they could" has not worked for me.
@@SD-vw8jd this is true. This thought process helped me to sympathize more. My mother actually took the attachment quiz as well. Turns out we have the same style. That was definitely a mind fuck. The thing that has allowed me to forgive and move on, is her acknowledgment and ownership of what she did and her efforts to be better. She wasn't always like that. So if you are talking to your caregivers about what you experienced and they're dismissive or they will continue to engage in the same behaviors that hurt you as a child, then You need to create boundaries and distance yourself from them.
My dad actually abandoned me - left the house, left us. He would come pick me up and we'd have good times together on an unpredictable basis, but he wouldn't be there most of the time. But he always said he loved me. Words feel nice but they're cheap. So I'm always looking for signs that my boyfriend doesn't find my needs important... and I know it's wrong but it's also just.. so hard when he pulls away.
My dad left us too. He came & went for several years during childhood but I saw him for the last time when I was 9 years old. I was so confused because he said he loved us but wouldn’t be coming back. I had no idea these ugly memories could come up in later adult relationships. But its so true, the fear of abandonment happening again is very real. At least now I know its there and learning how to work through things.
@6:00 fragile sense of self is the perfect definition of someone who goes to church, either that or they become arrogant, highly fraudulent, narcissists.
Double pain Lol thanks thias once again hahah I'm determined to do shadow work and the rejection courses haha Motivation music eye of the tiger 💓🤸♀️😏🤣🤣
Wow, it's like you read my mind Thais! This must be how my DA husband feels when I send him your videos! XD He recently moved out of state for a job and it has touched literally every single one of these triggers. I didn't want to hold him back from a great opportunity, but him moving away has been excruciating. I feel abandoned, alone, rejected, and dismissed. I felt like we were already struggling because he did the classic DA "I can't give you what you want" pull away back in the summer, and that's when we were living in the same house! I'd like to get through this with my sanity intact... do you have any recommended books about abandonment issues and healing those wounds?
I’m journaling about times in the past I was triggered. As I’m journaling, I’m having trouble discerning rejection from dismissal. What’s the difference?
Thias, your videos are very helpful. I also have your book and it’s really helping me to see what I need to work through ❤️ thank you ❤️
thank you so much for your support :)
-PDS team member
I absolutely agree, this is so carefully and genuinely explained, you definitely have a lot of knowledge and are passionate about what you do. Thanks
1. Abandonment, Fear of Abandonment, change in patterns that could suggest abandonment.
2. Being alone. Feelings of loneliness. Sudden isolation (friends out of town, recently moved). Out of relationship to self. People pleasing. Self-betrayal.
3. Feeling Rejection or Feeling Rejected. From breakup to someone not being available to hang out.
4. Feeling not good enough or disliked.
5. Being dismissed.
@Chris Dabb thank you!
Basically rejection at its core.. That's me
Feeling like #1 & #3 right now with the lady I'm talking to.
@@ShadrockMarcianoSame here … Seem completely secure with everyone else in my life, though. I realize I have work to do. Always more to do 😢❤
I spend about 4 hrs a day on UA-cam in the past 10 years and still haven’t found anyone as helpful as you. You are an angel.
Here here
I second that!
Totally spot on. At the same time, it makes me sad because as AP's we're so dependent on other peoples love, time, appreciation and commitment. Unfortunately, a break-up triggers all those wounds at the same time. When you're already feeling "alone" at your core, and the person you connected deeply with rejects and dismisses you (in my case an FA), feelings of loneliness become unbearable.
Literally!! I thought i had found someone who finally made me feel seen and then i was so so wrong it felt like our whole relationship didnt even happen like i dreamt the whole thing up
@@angelalomeli8620I'm going through those exact feelings right now. I feel totally discarded by the one woman who totally got me and gave me everything I needed. And she wasnin another mans bed the day after she left. Seemingly living her best life as they say.
That's how I felt.@@angelalomeli8620
I’ve just learnt more about myself over those 10 minute then I have in the last 4 decades.....
I am a recovering FA and I just went on 1 date my first AP. Dear god!!! We texted for a few hours one night. We went on date the next night. By the 3rd night I was told I was inconsistent and he didn't want to date me anymore.
I told him on the first date that Sunday was for football (we went out on a Saturday). We had a great date. He texted after the date and I responded tha/mt I had a good time. I texted him first in the morning. I figured that should be enough to indicate that I was interested and everything was cool. I was thinking from my perspective of how I would like to be treated. The early dating stages can be a little nerve racking because you don't know if the other person like you.
I texted and let him know that I was heading out to watch the games. To me, this means I am unavailable for the next 11 hours. He sent a text asking how it was going. I responded and expressed my excitement about my team's game later that night. I was mildly annoyed but I wasn't really interested in the other games so it didn't bother me that he was trying to engage.
When my game was starting, let him know. To me, it was like saying I am going to a movie or a concert. I'm going to be busy for the next 3 hours. You might text and ask how it is going but you shouldn't expect a response. He sends a text, 30 minutes later trying, to tell me something about the date. Like legit trying to have a full text convo about something serious. My face is like🤨🤨🤨
Mind you, I am at a watch party with 200 people screaming, yelling, and enjoying the game. I legit got pissed. I was reminded of the trope about how women always want to talk to men when the game is on. I decided to ignore him because I wanted to set a hard boundary and let him know that this attention seeking behavior would not be rewarded. In retrospect, I probably could have said I was setting a boundary. But damn, I wasn't thinking about best practices in communication during the football game. I'm not expecting to put relationship levels of consideration of his feelings into effect, after date 1. I responded at halftime. After that I was told I was a BPD and I was inconsistent.
I cannot explain the level of rage I felt at the audacity. The audacity to try and diagnose someone with a mental illness because they aren't paying enough attention to you. I was already hesitant and expressed to my friend that this guy seems needy. He definitely reeked of severe codependency (self admittedly). However, I wasn't sure if it was my FA issues that were making me look at him sideways. I have a push/pull thing. Especially, I get nervous. My corrective action is to lean in and focus on connecting instead of disconnecting. That was my plan with him. This took the cake though.
Even if we were in a 10 year relationship, Sunday is for Football. I feel bad because I was shown grace when I was in my crazy. I didn't want to cut him off but this was after 1 date. I didn't even put that thang on him! Early dating is the best it will ever get. He'll be million times worse later.
Watching this video confirmed what he was experiencing and I empathize tremendously. However, I cannot date someone who is this early in their healing journey. I cannot be the center of someone's world. It is too much emotional labor. I have my baggage to carry.
I legit feel attacked by this experience.
I would imagine that APs end up with a lot of cluster B personality types or those that display the cluster b traits, because they give so much attention and want to be whatever YOU want them to be. The instant infusion of time and attention feeds them. Ironically, before I started my healing journey, this would probably have worked for me. As a matter of fact, I used to have weekend long dates. Very intense. I would then of course feel the crash of panic and pull away.
Now that I'm on the other side of it, I understand that extreme highs and instant fusion is toxic. I'm more measured. I don't internalize things. I am patient and check in with myself. Sex is off the table. I understand that something can feel good but be bad.
Sorry for the rant but damn. This was an unbelievably uncomfortable experience.
I understand your feelings. I lean FA. I'm learning that the part that could make a difference is to communicate your expectations so at least the other person knows. Like saying how important Sunday football alone time is for you and that you'll be in touch Monday then affirm that you like them. I enjoyed your story. Helped me learn also.
The abandonment vs. betrayal wound was how I knew I was FA and not AP, even when I have certainly have felt incredibly anxious in relationships with DAs and/or narcissistic people. I am very hyper-vigilant in the honeymoon/early dating phase, but abandonment is not my core fear. I've never really been afraid or triggered by being alone. My closest friend, on the other hand, appears to be a classic AP according to this list. She becomes very anxious and frightened when she is alone, and when plans are changed and/or cancelled and she isn't sure if her attachment needs will be met. She isn't skilled at self-soothing. Sometimes I trigger her myself with my need for alone time and not always being available when she needs--which she can express in a very sporadic and often intense way. Through this relationship, I have developed more empathy for DAs than I ever thought I would have (lol), as I can see how the needs of the AP can sometimes feel overwhelming to a person who leans avoidant and/or doesn't know how to soothe them. I'm very interested in advice on how to avoid triggering my AP friend, and to how to create a really secure relationship without me feeling like I have to bust my boundaries frequently in order for her to feel safe.
I feel you on this! I dated a FA now long ago, but previously I tended to be drawn to DA types. I now empathize a bit more with DAs because I felt more overwhelmed by the anxious tendencies that I sometimes have myself with other partners. I think as much as you can provide consistency, reliability, and direct open communication with anxious types, that's really helpful for them. If you need alone time, you can reassure them that you would love to spend time with them in the future once you feel more recharged after your solitude. And as much as possible, try to avoid agreeing or overcommitting to plans if you have a tendency to flake or cancel last minute. Really check in with yourself about your commitments before you make them, and when you do agree to a plan, stick to the commitment unless some other reasonable issue interferes with that (you're sick, e.g.). I had issues with my ex-partner b/c he had impressions that we had plans when I felt that our plans were more tenuous and not solidified. So when making plans, make sure you're being *very clear* about whether this is a tenuous or a solid plan. Hope that helps!
The video triggered me - in the exact way I needed to be. Thank you. This trigger list combined with the Emotional dumping video help me understanding some of my behaviors.
Haha, I correctly guessed what most of the triggers in video would be based on the AP courses within the school and how I've felt through my life and this journey. Thank you so much Thais, for giving an explanation and a solution to what I've perceived to be deeply ingrained and permanent "faults" for far too long. You have no idea how empowering it is to have realized that this isn't the way relationships have to be!
So happy you've had this wonderful realization Charlotte :)
-PDS team member
My thoughts exactly!!! I thought so many thing were me. Now I know they just responses to truama. I ha e new tools and feeling great!
Feelings.... feelings trigger them.
Yeah, that's me... Somehow i lately understood about myself.. But i have started working on myself...
I use to be secure attached but by being rejected by family and then in romantic relationships I turned into AP. Now I need more reassurance that the person is gonna be there for me and won't leave once I have developed feelings to them.
same!!! i only became this way the past few years
Sheesh just saying the word dismissed and I’m already feeling yucky
All of this is very very painful 🥺
It’s valuable to listen to you, Thaïs. Thank you so much!
thank you!
Liked last one. You don't hear "Dismissed" and unseen a lot.
The last third of the video felt like she was talking to me personally. Feeling like I'm not good enough ever is a huge part of what I am fighting on a daily basis and even the tiniest thing can send me into a spiral of self doubt and loathing because I'm not perfect and never will be. And by tiny i mean someone not responding to a text message in whatever arbitrary time frame i deem appropriate that day. It's exhausting and it's frustrating to be fully aware of it and unable to get ahead of it when i know it's coming.
I was in a relationship for almost 5 years with an AP and as an FA-leaning DA in this relationship it took me almost 2 years to get over the guilt of pain I have caused her. And now knowing what their core wounds are make me feel even more horrible about myself, I can't imagine the pain I caused her. I remember, every time she would attempt to have a talk about some issue, Id' just say sorry right away and that I will change for the better and then go to sleep, wake up the next day like nothing happened, I can't imagine the loneliness and frustrations and pain that she couldn't get through to me. I hated myself for hurting her, she didn't deserve any of it. She is lesbian and one thing I really never wanted to make her feel is she is less of a man/person because of what she is. I just pray and wish and hope that she finds a more secure or another AP that will love her like they deserve.
Yeah, nothing searious. After an abusive relationship of 5 years I ended up with a DA. It was only half year, but almost half year of therapy now to recover.
All the emotional unavailability, the gaslightings, the walking on eggshels, stonewalling, lack of empathy...
Now when a female collegue asked mento maybe buy her a candy, if I go to buy some soda, she was so thankful and kind.
I went out, and just started crying in the evelator. Why I couldnt get all these warmness from my girlfriend..
Just kills me inside.
Really good video Thais!! You hit on all the triggers that I continue to work on that impact my life and relationships. Thank you so much!😘👏👏🙏♥️
As an AP, I get triggered when the DA pull away for no good reason. It's impossible to make that AP-DA dynamic work long term if both aren't working on their attachment issues.
All this, plus throw into the mix an abusive environment and manipulative people who feel entitled to your soul and to take from you and want you to be nothing but a yes man for their selfish desires, really makes it vital for you to untangle yourself from this belief and see the beauty in becoming self involved.
Didn’t expect the second video. Thank you ❤️
She's probably not making one tomorrow on Indepence Day. I feel like she lives in America.
@@Katrica670 no she lives in Canada =)
@@mer-ced-es oh wow alright i never heard her say any country. :-)
my question is, how do you not harbor anger toward your caregivers for creating these insecure attachment wounds in the first place? they were "doing the best they could" has not worked for me.
To me what helped was and still is to think that they were also operating from their own attachment style and from their traumas.
Wow your comment resonated with me. I absolutely want to understand this too!
@@SD-vw8jd this is true. This thought process helped me to sympathize more. My mother actually took the attachment quiz as well. Turns out we have the same style. That was definitely a mind fuck. The thing that has allowed me to forgive and move on, is her acknowledgment and ownership of what she did and her efforts to be better. She wasn't always like that. So if you are talking to your caregivers about what you experienced and they're dismissive or they will continue to engage in the same behaviors that hurt you as a child, then You need to create boundaries and distance yourself from them.
2 videos?? Why are we so lucky today?
'Cause we are worthy! ☺
My dad actually abandoned me - left the house, left us. He would come pick me up and we'd have good times together on an unpredictable basis, but he wouldn't be there most of the time. But he always said he loved me. Words feel nice but they're cheap. So I'm always looking for signs that my boyfriend doesn't find my needs important... and I know it's wrong but it's also just.. so hard when he pulls away.
My dad left us too. He came & went for several years during childhood but I saw him for the last time when I was 9 years old. I was so confused because he said he loved us but wouldn’t be coming back. I had no idea these ugly memories could come up in later adult relationships. But its so true, the fear of abandonment happening again is very real. At least now I know its there and learning how to work through things.
Ty for your work .. I understand him better. So draining to me tho ..
Thank you so much 😊
I love you ❤️❤️❤️❤️
@6:00 fragile sense of self is the perfect definition of someone who goes to church, either that or they become arrogant, highly fraudulent, narcissists.
SPOT ON
Feeling all of these really hard right now
Spot on.
I'm not crying youre crying... 😅😭
Spot on! This describes me
wow this hit way to close to home
Double pain Lol thanks thias once again hahah I'm determined to do shadow work and the rejection courses haha Motivation music eye of the tiger 💓🤸♀️😏🤣🤣
@3:11-3:26 shadow self? Shadow work?
I desperately need the course but it’s too pricey
Wowww I have all of these triggers lmaooo 💀 I'm trying so hard to change these before I catch another person's eye so I don't mess it up lmao
Soooo helpful! 👍🏽
Wow, it's like you read my mind Thais! This must be how my DA husband feels when I send him your videos! XD
He recently moved out of state for a job and it has touched literally every single one of these triggers. I didn't want to hold him back from a great opportunity, but him moving away has been excruciating. I feel abandoned, alone, rejected, and dismissed. I felt like we were already struggling because he did the classic DA "I can't give you what you want" pull away back in the summer, and that's when we were living in the same house!
I'd like to get through this with my sanity intact... do you have any recommended books about abandonment issues and healing those wounds?
I’m journaling about times in the past I was triggered. As I’m journaling, I’m having trouble discerning rejection from dismissal. What’s the difference?
So can you be AA and introverted I.e find relief on some level with time alone?
When an FA gets close future fakes and leaves.
Accurate asf.
Maybe they're just not that into you. Happens.
Wow 🥴
I am triggered by this video 🥴🥴 drag me
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