Awesome explaining and review! You are always trying your best to explain your thoughts and experiences with the game and be also objective while putting your subjective aspect to it all. Thank you very much Zee for these kinds of great reviews!
The original Welcome To is like all the good ideas for this game system. Las Vegas is everything that was left on cutting room floor since it didn't work well.
Over complicated to be enjoyable. Love Welcome to My Perfect Home and thinking of buying WttM but not Law Vegas. As a solo player I think the first one was ideally suitable 😊
I loved Welcome to... and even bought it for my grandmother who is a big fan of puzzles and we've played it with great success at family gatherings, but this seems like there is a lot more going on, without anymore satisfaction or payoff. The original was pretty simplistic, and some of that simplicity was exploitable (build a lot of parks) but at least it was streamlined enough that it managed to deliver a pretty quick game with a couple of solid choices and a little bit of tension toward the end and when racing toward the bonus goals. And even with that said, the bis concept and the roundabout rule made it just a little intimidating to be really called a "gateway" type game. This game seems to add a lot more of those often avoided situational rules, but with no return on the extra investment. The game seems more complicated without being any deeper strategically. It's still "make this choice to build up points in this column" but now there just seem to be more ways that your choice can go wrong. I think I'll stick to the original.
I was super excited to just jump in to the BGA beta, figuring I love the original and how different can this be? ... This game feels like someone saw Tetris or Picross or Sudoku and figured why not add 25 more interconnected rules that loop in on each other so it's impossible to explain to someone else in one go, even if you know the game. The map is the worst offender. Blues/purples on a map you're supposed to draw on with gray pencil or black/blue pen? Why not a desert dawn color palette and have the blues of night with yellow highlights of lights be on the cards and score sheet? At least provide like 6 red/orange pens.
I've always wondered if this game would've worked better if it were a little less of a "pure" roll and write. I imagine that having cardboard chits for the debt/money stuff might help (visualizing it on your scoresheet with all the circles and crosses is messy) and maybe like a little cube to move around as your limo (Insteas of cutting an extra line through everything) could help reduce the cognitive load and help shift the focus toward just decision making
Thanks for the review. I’m a fan of the original (and it’s more engaging theme) - but this one isn’t for me. I don’t have a problem with involved and intricate rules systems - but not when they’re for playing 30 minute puzzle games.
I love the original, but found this version to be convoluted. I disagree with Zee, I don't think this game is for people who love the original, I think this game appeals to people who think the original game is too simple and want something more to chew on. I prefer the original because it's so much simpler to play, to teach, to just get out and play without any fuss. I think the other variant/expansions that have been put out are more my speed, they're just the base game with one little add-on...I don't hate this game, it's just not for me.
I remember watching this one on GameNight a few months ago and it took Rodney 30 minutes to teach it, and I don't remember him wasting a single sentence in doing so. Way too much for me and the people I like playing games with, but I imagine it'll find an audience somewhere.
I had the same feeling about how overly complicated this game feels. I don't think it's "better" than Welcome to... and I will continue playing and enjoying Welcome to... and not going to Las Vegas
The rulebook is actually pretty bad. I finally got the will to go play it solo and rereading the solo rules 3+ times i was still confused. Game would probably be less intimidating when a much better rulebook
I thought theme in Welcome To... was great, especially in combination with the 1950's retro art. I was worried about the Vegas version. I feel like Welcome To..., itself, was more fiddly than gateway.
I watched Rodney teach this to the Game Night crew and my immediate thought was Doppelt So Welcome To! Which isn't a good thing. Ganz Schon Clever is a very strategic Roll & Write, once you figure out that strategy (fill blue first!). They apparently didn't like that people figured out a strategy, so they've been trying to "fix" that, with Doppelt and the variants on the apps. It turned a strategic game into a tactical game, but tactical games work better when there are only a handful of tactics to choose from. There are DOZENS of tactical decisions on every roll of Doppelt, and due to the number of them and the luck of the dice, you can't make an informed decision where to play. Welcome to ruined the successful "handful of tactics" gameplay by turning it into "handfuls upon handfuls of tactics", which doesn't work for the same exact reason. There's such a thing as too many choices.
With all respect, a fair amount of what you described here is inaccurate. The bottom is not for solo mode, it's helpful reminders of how the rules work. The manual is not long ago all and the rules are really not that convoluted. It takes maybe 20% more effort to learn this one than the original, which feels appropriate.
Actually rules are really simple. You should try a two or three players instead of a solo game. You can also forget a few things in the game mechanics to make it easier like objectives and bank loans.
Awesome explaining and review! You are always trying your best to explain your thoughts and experiences with the game and be also objective while putting your subjective aspect to it all.
Thank you very much Zee for these kinds of great reviews!
The original Welcome To is like all the good ideas for this game system. Las Vegas is everything that was left on cutting room floor since it didn't work well.
Over complicated to be enjoyable.
Love Welcome to My Perfect Home and thinking of buying WttM but not Law Vegas.
As a solo player I think the first one was ideally suitable 😊
I loved Welcome to... and even bought it for my grandmother who is a big fan of puzzles and we've played it with great success at family gatherings, but this seems like there is a lot more going on, without anymore satisfaction or payoff. The original was pretty simplistic, and some of that simplicity was exploitable (build a lot of parks) but at least it was streamlined enough that it managed to deliver a pretty quick game with a couple of solid choices and a little bit of tension toward the end and when racing toward the bonus goals. And even with that said, the bis concept and the roundabout rule made it just a little intimidating to be really called a "gateway" type game. This game seems to add a lot more of those often avoided situational rules, but with no return on the extra investment. The game seems more complicated without being any deeper strategically. It's still "make this choice to build up points in this column" but now there just seem to be more ways that your choice can go wrong. I think I'll stick to the original.
I was super excited to just jump in to the BGA beta, figuring I love the original and how different can this be?
...
This game feels like someone saw Tetris or Picross or Sudoku and figured why not add 25 more interconnected rules that loop in on each other so it's impossible to explain to someone else in one go, even if you know the game.
The map is the worst offender. Blues/purples on a map you're supposed to draw on with gray pencil or black/blue pen? Why not a desert dawn color palette and have the blues of night with yellow highlights of lights be on the cards and score sheet?
At least provide like 6 red/orange pens.
I've always wondered if this game would've worked better if it were a little less of a "pure" roll and write. I imagine that having cardboard chits for the debt/money stuff might help (visualizing it on your scoresheet with all the circles and crosses is messy) and maybe like a little cube to move around as your limo (Insteas of cutting an extra line through everything) could help reduce the cognitive load and help shift the focus toward just decision making
This one is better than the first and I give the first a 9/10
Thanks for the review.
I’m a fan of the original (and it’s more engaging theme) - but this one isn’t for me. I don’t have a problem with involved and intricate rules systems - but not when they’re for playing 30 minute puzzle games.
that was my take as well
I love the original, but found this version to be convoluted. I disagree with Zee, I don't think this game is for people who love the original, I think this game appeals to people who think the original game is too simple and want something more to chew on. I prefer the original because it's so much simpler to play, to teach, to just get out and play without any fuss. I think the other variant/expansions that have been put out are more my speed, they're just the base game with one little add-on...I don't hate this game, it's just not for me.
I remember watching this one on GameNight a few months ago and it took Rodney 30 minutes to teach it, and I don't remember him wasting a single sentence in doing so.
Way too much for me and the people I like playing games with, but I imagine it'll find an audience somewhere.
I had the same feeling about how overly complicated this game feels. I don't think it's "better" than Welcome to... and I will continue playing and enjoying Welcome to... and not going to Las Vegas
My family found a couple of things hard to understand in the original, this just doubles down on the confusion.
The rulebook is actually pretty bad. I finally got the will to go play it solo and rereading the solo rules 3+ times i was still confused. Game would probably be less intimidating when a much better rulebook
I thought theme in Welcome To... was great, especially in combination with the 1950's retro art. I was worried about the Vegas version. I feel like Welcome To..., itself, was more fiddly than gateway.
The writing pad is a confusing mess. I think this would frustrate a lot of new players and lead to a lot of mistakes.
I disagree
I feel that Welcome To... is a little light for me. This one, however, seems like a bit much. I need something between the two.
Nathan Bredfeldt maybe Fleet The Dice Game?
Welcome to the moon.
Thanks, Zee !
I watched Rodney teach this to the Game Night crew and my immediate thought was Doppelt So Welcome To! Which isn't a good thing. Ganz Schon Clever is a very strategic Roll & Write, once you figure out that strategy (fill blue first!). They apparently didn't like that people figured out a strategy, so they've been trying to "fix" that, with Doppelt and the variants on the apps. It turned a strategic game into a tactical game, but tactical games work better when there are only a handful of tactics to choose from. There are DOZENS of tactical decisions on every roll of Doppelt, and due to the number of them and the luck of the dice, you can't make an informed decision where to play.
Welcome to ruined the successful "handful of tactics" gameplay by turning it into "handfuls upon handfuls of tactics", which doesn't work for the same exact reason. There's such a thing as too many choices.
This seems like a point salad mess. I love the original. I haven’t played this, so I don’t know by actual experience.
With all respect, a fair amount of what you described here is inaccurate. The bottom is not for solo mode, it's helpful reminders of how the rules work. The manual is not long ago all and the rules are really not that convoluted. It takes maybe 20% more effort to learn this one than the original, which feels appropriate.
Actually rules are really simple. You should try a two or three players instead of a solo game. You can also forget a few things in the game mechanics to make it easier like objectives and bank loans.
He said he didnt play it solo
@@tonkabeanicecream5698 Tonka is really good I love it in chocolate mousse
Pass. Some things (like the original) are good because they're simple.
This one is better than welcome to
The scoring is really easy, I so disagree with you