Very interesting! Good call on not cutting to the final size until after the welding... As for why it went out of true, I'm inclined to believe there are a number of factors involved: Firstly, the fitting was a slip fit, which means there will almost always be a margin of error when welding Secondly, I believe you welded both sides in one go, which could potentially drag the shadt to the side a bit, this could be ameliorated by spot welding every 90 degrees to lock the shaft in placed, then welding the whole. Lastly, I can only assume this since you didn't show your welding, but I gather you slotted them together and welded them without holding them together and true in a jig. That could also throw in multiple distortions that ultimately thjrow the shaft out of true. To be honest, I believe your decision to do the precision cutting after the welding was the best option since it made the above issues redundant!
Dear "All angles" I watched your channel for the first time with this video. One crucial point which seems to be missed in the comments; a fly cutter is a single point tool and it cuts perpendicular to the axis of rotation no matter how bad its made. I hope you catch my drift here but it's therefore unnecessary to make a precise orthogonal holder.... The collet arbor should fit perfectly to avoid play in the spindle (and chatter on the workpiece). But after that; weld away. If the arbor is not true to the holder it will theoretically have no effect on the cutting line. It will have an effect on the balance of the tool which will show in your workpiece too. But.. the added cuttin arbor added destroys the balance anyhow... If I would have to make a fly cutter on your equipment I would make a perfect arbor with a press fit in the prepared disk and leave a nice gap to weld from the bottom of the tool. After this I would mount a lathe cutter in the vice of the mill and put the "want to be" fly cutter in the spindel of the mill. Turn on the mill and face the bottom part with the cutter in the vice. This should leave you a nice result and probably faster too. Another suggestion is to calculate your speeds and feeds for the material you're working on. You speeded up some portions but especially on a large diameter like the disk the outer circumference goes fast and easy destroys your inserts pretty soon. Another suggestion, already mentioned, is to use a strong roughing tool with blunt action for the main material removal. After this change to a fresh sharp rake tool (after the part is cooled) to bring it to final dimensions. This saves you buying you new inserts and improves the surface quality. Just my two cents on how to approach a job like this. No absolute truth here; there are many ways to Rome. Keep up the good work and thank you for sharing your adventure. One extra; the heavier the fly cutter is, the better it will perform (on a small machine especially) Keep up the good work, stay safe and all the best, Job PS; cutting a thread with a tap is a neat idea if you don't have other options; chapeau!
Yea I did achwelly take a lot of thoes ideas into account like a press fit and turning it down on the mill with a lathe bit in the vice as that whould make it perfectly concentric to the bore of that mill but ultimately i just opted for welding and turning it true on the lathe ...thanks for the comment :)
I watched this for a second time, I am making a tangential fly cutter to use the same tool from my tangential lathe tool holders. I was tossing up about threading the arbor or welding. I will go with welding to save time and stress on my skills. Thanks again, very helpful.
I’ve just bought a new lathe and a milling machine. I’ve never had any formal training so I’m learning on the fly. Pun intended. Wherever I went in the military I made friends with the machinist. I think you are doing great. Thanks for being there. Ron
You are a very talented young man. Kudos to you for taking the time to learn. I can only assume that your grandfather is a tool maker, and your best friend. Either way, I’m guessing some old man has taken a lot of time with you. You have some great talent and I am really looking forward to watching your UA-cam channel grow.
Your "Dead Center" looks just like my Live one? Wonder what Killed yours? LoL Just a quick tip: instead of that crazy Home made Tap wrench you used, you know you can drive a Tap with a small 12-Point socket? Since Hex-botls are 6-sided, the 13 Point sockets also divide evenly by FOUR, you just have to dig thru your sockets till you find the right one for your tap (Metric or Inch) then you can use a Ratchet or t-Handle to better drive a Tap in Straight
Pretty interesting variety of techniques. Several I hadn’t seen. I thought you would have balancing issues, but the machine seemed happy. I might build one for my er40 collet. I like saving material with the welding. Interesting.
Hello, just a little constructive criticism if I may. Try not to use a finish tip on a face with an intermittent cut, it ruins your tip prematurely, rough it first. Get yourself a roughing milling cutter, it looks like a tap with a tight pitch,, but it removes material very quickly. Try and use a slot drill wherever possible, use your endmills for finishing. Your lathe was running too fast for the diameter of your large disc. The safety tab you installed limits the size of the cutter you can use, but I understand the idea, however, grinding it down has weakened it's integrity. I would never have thought of using a tap to thread a hole like that, really brilliant thinking. Otherwise a fantastic job. Well done
Good thinking. I would have though a HSS tool to get under the rough stuff when he first started on the rebar would have been good. Blondihacks made the point that you can always regrind HSS and indexable tips can get expensive when your starting out. He does a really good job of reusing scrap materials. If you want an explanation of using a tap like that "This Old Tony" did a great explanation of it a while back. Its actually a way machinists do threads on the inside of large diameter holes.
Been there done that. Except I put 4 bits on it and allowed each to be adjustable angularly. With that I can set them all the same and feed 4 times faster or set them in steps and cut 4 times deeper at the normal feed rate for 1 bit.
The round plate with the bolt holes proposes an interesting quick change faceplate design. To improve the clamping force, the holes can be shaped to the profile of the top step of the jaw. To prevent it from coming lose, it would also have a tapered shank or drawbar.
I enjoyed the build from beginning to end. I'm sure it works just fine but there is one tiny little criticism meant in the form of critique rather than insult. I realize the exact location of The cutting edge can vary depending on the exact geometry of the insert holder or bit that you installed in the head, but it still would have been more consistent if you had made the fixed clamping surface the forward surface of your tool instead of the rear surface of your tool. At that diameter I'm sure it still works just fine though.
Enjoyed the video. I realise you were only trying it out but the thought of the upstanding shank of the cutters catching in your clothes makes me wince. I'm sure you will cut down the tools you fit in there.
Yea I totally agree a dedicated bit whould be nice.. but I did make it with the intention of using a range of different carbide insert tooling from the lathe . It dose look a little odd but an unintended side affect is the extra weight in the tool kind balances the flycutter out at higher speeds
Vary nice! Dumb question, could you not have cut a matching taper on the shaft and bore of the circle plate? Then you could have just used a bolt to pull up the taper tight and not bothered with welding.
Yh yaknow there was manny ways to make it....... in the shell mill video I made it screw on .... I opted to weld this to try and maximize stability as the plate wasent very thick
Depending on the lights and sound, you welded them with TIG welding? I'd recommend using MAG welding there. You burn deeper into the material, it is faster and you have less risk of getting strucural failure points in your weld, especially with steel.
The only 'problem' with using rebar, you don't know the type. Majority of 'old' stuff can be medium or even high carbon steel, welding on it can make it really hard and brittle. (being able to harden it can be an advantage in some situations) 'Modern' 'Made In China' stuff may be softer than mild steel or low carbon A36 grade 'structural steel' It all came out quite well though.
That round disc looked as if it were of a quality steel with a fairly high carbon content as when he was facing the part there were sparks coming from the carbide cutter, that never happens with mild steel. I think the plate came from something like a petrochemical plant and had a higher quality steel requirement. As for the cold bluing, it's a hard thing to get right even when you have the material spotlessly clean you get those blotches on steels with a high carbon content. ( I've done quite a bit of bluing on firearms in the past and the cold bluing stuff that comes from the States, well some of it Is US lol I watch a lot of firearms related UA-camrs and the only consistent cold bluing process seems to be from Brownell's and it goes black immediately and covers consistently well, with no blotches. Which the Birchwood Casey stuff just doesn't and it seems to me that it's what you used here by the looks and results. I've not tried for a long time but thats the only cold bluing acid you could get in the UK, but I don't know about now.
The process is called cold bluing you can buy cold bluing solutions on ebay usually used for gun barrels .... think there's manny types but I used Phillips cold blue allways works well
Loved it, just what I like doing, making tools, and bits and bobs for the shop and vintage motorbike. Subscribed.👍👍👍
Very interesting!
Good call on not cutting to the final size until after the welding...
As for why it went out of true, I'm inclined to believe there are a number of factors involved:
Firstly, the fitting was a slip fit, which means there will almost always be a margin of error when welding
Secondly, I believe you welded both sides in one go, which could potentially drag the shadt to the side a bit, this could be ameliorated by spot welding every 90 degrees to lock the shaft in placed, then welding the whole.
Lastly, I can only assume this since you didn't show your welding, but I gather you slotted them together and welded them without holding them together and true in a jig. That could also throw in multiple distortions that ultimately thjrow the shaft out of true.
To be honest, I believe your decision to do the precision cutting after the welding was the best option since it made the above issues redundant!
Dear "All angles" I watched your channel for the first time with this video. One crucial point which seems to be missed in the comments; a fly cutter is a single point tool and it cuts perpendicular to the axis of rotation no matter how bad its made. I hope you catch my drift here but it's therefore unnecessary to make a precise orthogonal holder.... The collet arbor should fit perfectly to avoid play in the spindle (and chatter on the workpiece). But after that; weld away. If the arbor is not true to the holder it will theoretically have no effect on the cutting line. It will have an effect on the balance of the tool which will show in your workpiece too. But.. the added cuttin arbor added destroys the balance anyhow... If I would have to make a fly cutter on your equipment I would make a perfect arbor with a press fit in the prepared disk and leave a nice gap to weld from the bottom of the tool. After this I would mount a lathe cutter in the vice of the mill and put the "want to be" fly cutter in the spindel of the mill. Turn on the mill and face the bottom part with the cutter in the vice. This should leave you a nice result and probably faster too. Another suggestion is to calculate your speeds and feeds for the material you're working on. You speeded up some portions but especially on a large diameter like the disk the outer circumference goes fast and easy destroys your inserts pretty soon. Another suggestion, already mentioned, is to use a strong roughing tool with blunt action for the main material removal. After this change to a fresh sharp rake tool (after the part is cooled) to bring it to final dimensions. This saves you buying you new inserts and improves the surface quality. Just my two cents on how to approach a job like this. No absolute truth here; there are many ways to Rome. Keep up the good work and thank you for sharing your adventure. One extra; the heavier the fly cutter is, the better it will perform (on a small machine especially) Keep up the good work, stay safe and all the best, Job PS; cutting a thread with a tap is a neat idea if you don't have other options; chapeau!
Yea I did achwelly take a lot of thoes ideas into account like a press fit and turning it down on the mill with a lathe bit in the vice as that whould make it perfectly concentric to the bore of that mill but ultimately i just opted for welding and turning it true on the lathe ...thanks for the comment :)
Why do you only use citing oil when you aretaplg a thread and not hen you are cutting all metals?
your "plate with holes" is a blind flange, for capping off a flanged pipe connection.
Cool stuff bud.
I watched this for a second time, I am making a tangential fly cutter to use the same tool from my tangential lathe tool holders. I was tossing up about threading the arbor or welding. I will go with welding to save time and stress on my skills. Thanks again, very helpful.
Tangential? Is that one of the words the kids are tossing around 😢these days? I'm old and confused anymore.
I’ve just bought a new lathe and a milling machine. I’ve never had any formal training so I’m learning on the fly. Pun intended. Wherever I went in the military I made friends with the machinist. I think you are doing great. Thanks for being there. Ron
Thanks for the comment..... and it's allways so fun un-wrapping your first machine 😀
You are a very talented young man. Kudos to you for taking the time to learn. I can only assume that your grandfather is a tool maker, and your best friend. Either way, I’m guessing some old man has taken a lot of time with you. You have some great talent and I am really looking forward to watching your UA-cam channel grow.
Your "Dead Center" looks just like my Live one? Wonder what Killed yours? LoL
Just a quick tip: instead of that crazy Home made Tap wrench you used, you know you can drive a Tap with a small 12-Point socket? Since Hex-botls are 6-sided, the 13 Point sockets also divide evenly by FOUR, you just have to dig thru your sockets till you find the right one for your tap (Metric or Inch) then you can use a Ratchet or t-Handle to better drive a Tap in Straight
Do what you can to balance it and the surface finish will be more than you expected
Love videos when junk gets repurposed into something completely different than its original purpose.
Pretty interesting variety of techniques. Several I hadn’t seen. I thought you would have balancing issues, but the machine seemed happy. I might build one for my er40 collet. I like saving material with the welding. Interesting.
really not too bad for a first video. well done mate... very good video especially considering its your first
Nice work. We shared this video on our homemade tools forum this week 😎
Hello, just a little constructive criticism if I may.
Try not to use a finish tip on a face with an intermittent cut, it ruins your tip prematurely, rough it first.
Get yourself a roughing milling cutter, it looks like a tap with a tight pitch,, but it removes material very quickly.
Try and use a slot drill wherever possible, use your endmills for finishing. Your lathe was running too fast for the diameter of your large disc.
The safety tab you installed limits the size of the cutter you can use, but I understand the idea, however, grinding it down has weakened it's integrity.
I would never have thought of using a tap to thread a hole like that, really brilliant thinking. Otherwise a fantastic job. Well done
Good thinking.
I would have though a HSS tool to get under the rough stuff when he first started on the rebar would have been good. Blondihacks made the point that you can always regrind HSS and indexable tips can get expensive when your starting out.
He does a really good job of reusing scrap materials.
If you want an explanation of using a tap like that "This Old Tony" did a great explanation of it a while back. Its actually a way machinists do threads on the inside of large diameter holes.
The tap threading thing; saw it first on this old tony channel. They even go to the same nail saloon!
Nice job and nice setup you have enjoyed.
Saw the video recommended. Watched it,really enjoyed it. Another subscriber here. Looking forward to more.
is that a regular Katsu indicator or is it of the chicken variety?
Subscribed! I can tell this channel will be a good one! I love tool making.
This is really good. I'm getting This Old Tony vibes from the camera work.
Chuck a few dad jokes in too 😏
Nice work. New subscriber here. Looking forward to more content.
Well done bro! Great video. Subbed!
Excellent build
That is one fine fly cutter will make one my self but with NT40 /16mm draw bar! Cheers
Good work. But it’s not a good idea to use steel 3 for the cone
Thanks for sharing! Nice finish too!
Tool might be cutting crooked (with negative rake) that maybe why it push a burr on the climbcut.
15:33 cmon man😂😂👏👏
Nice work!! Subscribed
i feel your stuggles my friend
Работа супер просто песня, удачи тебе и крепкого здоровья.
Super, super sweet cutting head. Came out beautifully, now would love you to reface my 1911 Anvil
Hmmm🤔...Anvil you say ...I'm interested
Nice video shot, thank you for sharing it , keep it up:)
You know what might be good in my humble opinion? Your infill music volume a tad lower. Very good content with rather harsh music. All the best chum.
Been there done that. Except I put 4 bits on it and allowed each to be adjustable angularly. With that I can set them all the same and feed 4 times faster or set them in steps and cut 4 times deeper at the normal feed rate for 1 bit.
Good thinking, thankyou.
The round plate with the bolt holes proposes an interesting quick change faceplate design. To improve the clamping force, the holes can be shaped to the profile of the top step of the jaw. To prevent it from coming lose, it would also have a tapered shank or drawbar.
I enjoyed the build from beginning to end. I'm sure it works just fine but there is one tiny little criticism meant in the form of critique rather than insult. I realize the exact location of The cutting edge can vary depending on the exact geometry of the insert holder or bit that you installed in the head, but it still would have been more consistent if you had made the fixed clamping surface the forward surface of your tool instead of the rear surface of your tool. At that diameter I'm sure it still works just fine though.
shouldn't your drawbar be 7/16"-20TPI ??
you could use that cutter to clean up the top of an anvil to give it a smoth surface again maybe
Enjoyed the video. I realise you were only trying it out but the thought of the upstanding shank of the cutters catching in your clothes makes me wince. I'm sure you will cut down the tools you fit in there.
Yea I totally agree a dedicated bit whould be nice.. but I did make it with the intention of using a range of different carbide insert tooling from the lathe . It dose look a little odd but an unintended side affect is the extra weight in the tool kind balances the flycutter out at higher speeds
Did you make a custom wrench to drive your tap? Really like it
Yea realise when I put the tap in had no clearance for the handle so just cut a slot in the back of my spindle spanner 🤣
It’s not and end drill it’s a centre drill for obvious reason the Tailstock centre fits in it
the shaking of your hands looks not so good mate..hope your alright...good job by the way 🙂
Hybrid tapping/single-point? 'Multi-point'? I'll admit I've never seen that before!
nice
👍👍👍
New subscriber
Good
Vary nice! Dumb question, could you not have cut a matching taper on the shaft and bore of the circle plate? Then you could have just used a bolt to pull up the taper tight and not bothered with welding.
Yh yaknow there was manny ways to make it....... in the shell mill video I made it screw on .... I opted to weld this to try and maximize stability as the plate wasent very thick
number 1
ye it's very likely the heat from the welding. turning metal into bananas since [whenever welding was invented]
Depending on the lights and sound, you welded them with TIG welding? I'd recommend using MAG welding there. You burn deeper into the material, it is faster and you have less risk of getting strucural failure points in your weld, especially with steel.
The only 'problem' with using rebar, you don't know the type.
Majority of 'old' stuff can be medium or even high carbon steel, welding on it can make it really hard and brittle. (being able to harden it can be an advantage in some situations)
'Modern' 'Made In China' stuff may be softer than mild steel or low carbon A36 grade 'structural steel'
It all came out quite well though.
That round disc looked as if it were of a quality steel with a fairly high carbon content as when he was facing the part there were sparks coming from the carbide cutter, that never happens with mild steel. I think the plate came from something like a petrochemical plant and had a higher quality steel requirement. As for the cold bluing, it's a hard thing to get right even when you have the material spotlessly clean you get those blotches on steels with a high carbon content. ( I've done quite a bit of bluing on firearms in the past and the cold bluing stuff that comes from the States, well some of it Is US lol I watch a lot of firearms related UA-camrs and the only consistent cold bluing process seems to be from Brownell's and it goes black immediately and covers consistently well, with no blotches. Which the Birchwood Casey stuff just doesn't and it seems to me that it's what you used here by the looks and results. I've not tried for a long time but thats the only cold bluing acid you could get in the UK, but I don't know about now.
can you make a tikule stick
What was it u make the steel dark at the end ?
The process is called cold bluing you can buy cold bluing solutions on ebay usually used for gun barrels .... think there's manny types but I used Phillips cold blue allways works well
looks like it works ok
Making flycutter is hard work
What is the plate diameter roughly? I have a few pipe end plates of various sizes and yours looks "about right"..:)
228mm/9"in ...same width as the mill bed
@@allangles4020 Good to know thankyou!
45:38 what was the rpm here ?
donkey on beach ..thats good .
hi could you make for me one like this
What is your machine spindle taper ?
Theres formula to get the degree angle for taper
عمل متقن جدا انت رجل تحب عملك أردت أن أعرف من أي بلد انت
Uk 🇬🇧
why not press fit? rather loose fit is there an advantage.
I'm pretty sure, that's a *live* centre.
Indeed it is
@@allangles4020 The witness marks are the big giveaway. 😁
Why clock the plate up it’s of no point at all it’s going to be machined off
On a small lathe like a box Ford and all those holes it would struggle
D-d\L = taper
Very nice project video. You've ruined it, however, with your tasteless choice of torture music.