Favero Assioma DUO-Shi In-Depth Review: Shimano SPD-SL Compatible
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- Опубліковано 21 лип 2024
- In-Depth Written Review (with more data): www.dcrainmaker.com/2021/07/a...
Favero has launched their newest Assioma variant today, the DUO-Shi, which simply takes the existing Favero Assioma pedals, but now with Shimano SPD-SL compatibility. Sorta.
See, while that’s the end-point, the DUO-Shi product is actually just the pedal spindles (for $589USD or ~589EUR including VAT (VAT inclusive pricing varies based on exact EU country). You’ll need to go out and buy the Shimano SPD-SL compatibility pedals of your own choosing. The good news there is that makes this product roughly $500-$600 cheaper than Garmin’s Rally SPD-SL variant. The bad news is you’ve got an arts and crafts project, plus some other technical things to consider. Don’t worry, we’ll talk about that in a second.
In any case, I’ve actually been quietly testing them for more than a *year*. Yes, an actual year. On and off (literally and figuratively), compared to a wide range of power meters, bikes, and smart trainers. Quietly removing them before photoshoots, but otherwise using them just like any other Favero Assioma pedal (because they are exactly the same).
0:00 Quick Overview
2:06 Unboxing & Weight Comparison
4:09 Assemby of pedals
4:54 Installation on bike
6:06 App Setup & Features
7:08 Bike Computer Features & Riding
8:19 A conversion kit?
9:20 Q-Factor Chatter & Pods
13:20 Accuracy Data
17:52 Wrap-Up vs Rally
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#FaveroAssioma #SPD-SL #DUO-Shi - Спорт
Great review, as someone who already owns a bunch of shimano pedals and cleats, I've been waiting on these!
Thanks man, I’ve been waiting for a shimano flavoured version for years!
Don't know what I like more, this review or the stroopwafels on the desk behind you! ;o)
Great review - nice addition to the Assioma lineup (#NeverGarminAgain 🥳)
Your shirt is amazing! Love the graphs!
Just watched the video, the power meters are arriving today. Got some shiny new pedals, and Shimano have changed the design! It's no longer just a spanner to remove the axle, you need a special tool. It's only a few quid but the fastest it's getting here is over a fortnight from now. What the hell was wrong with just a regular fitting! 105 R7000 compatible pedals. Grrrrrrrr!
Unfortunately I learned the hard way that Q-Factor is indeed an important factor. Event at 90cm inseam, I started getting a weird knee pain after using these pedals for ~2 months. Went for another bike fitting session and the main cause of the issue was identified as the increase Q-Factor.
love the tshirt, great review lot different to GpLamas experience, but i now need the tshirt
Clearly a fan of TrainerRoad's Sweetspot Base plan!
Graeme Obree believed in having a really small Q factor in his "old faithful" bike. Just making a statement as he didn't have hours spent in a windtunnel to prove this was more aero or allowed him to put out more power. So it was just his belief, backed up no doubt with hours spent on the Irvine by-pass.
Thanks for the review, Ray. Glad to have discovered these. Btw, maybe this was answered somewhere below, but...love the shirt...self print or did you get it elsewhere? Very bike geek chic :)
I just ordered my shi pedals. I ordered them because I already have R8000 and cleats on my shoes. And im a single-bike bike rider. And I have a roller trainer. Im excited to test them - but im really nervous that my head is going to know about to 22mm Q difference. Im 6-4”. So being a tall guy I wonder if I’ll have more room for interpretation on how they feel. Another question I would have is what is the difference in output power from a regular 53/54 Q factor vs a 65? Exaggerating it more what if it was 165mm. It would begin to change somewhere. So I wonder that that threshold is. Excited none the less and I really enjoy your narrative skills and delivery and voice. New sub for sure. You gave me exactly what I wanted to hear without bias. Which is so hard these days. I loved it. Thank you.
Portability between systems: M520 SPD pedals fit perfectly on Duo-Shi, so it’s easy to swap between SPD and SPD-SL.
I´ve got PD M8020, would they also work?
I’m thinking this is going to make a lot of people happy. I’d be a touch worried about how wide they are or maybe I wouldn’t even notice. 🤷🏻♂️ I have that exact same shirt! #smartbiketrainers 🙌
Love the t-shirt! (And the video but that goes without saying) 😀
Thanks! Here's the link, for those interested: cottonbureau.com/products/3x10-cycling-workout
Great review Ray ... my question is this: currently in Canada these are $849 CAD, the Vector 3 pedals are $799, and the Rally RS100 are $849 - which do you buy with your hard earned cash? FWIW, I'm in already in the Garmin ecosystem sans pedals.
Awesome review as usual!
Quick question: are the ~ $100 Look Keo pedals from the Assioma Duo ($ difference between Duo & Duo-Shi) worth that amount? In other words, am I better off getting the Shi and then getting better quality ~$100 SPD-SL pedals?
DCR - First, thanks for all the great quality content!! Currently using Quarq crank power meters on two bikes (his/her - TT/road, respectively). So far, very happy/satisfied with Quarq. (PS. Using Garmin Edge 530's) Looking at buying two new bikes (his/hers - road/road, respectively). Thinking about Favero Assimo DUO power for the new bikes. Thoughts?
love the stroopwafels in the background :)))
I just love the stroopwafels in the background 🤣
I completely forgot those were there! I probably should look at what else is there!
🤣
You discussed the install of the Shimano pedals and compared them to the normal Assioma’s but I’m curious whether the normal look pedal body could be installed on the Shimano spindle IF a person decided they couldn’t deal with the q-factor?
Thanks and great video, I’ve been waiting for this one. Oh, and btw iq² sucks!
Oh, interesting thought - as to make them LOOK/KEO pedals again? In that case, the cartridge bit would be different. I think you can buy that replacement part from Favero though.
I bought a set of these November last year as I like Shimano pedals and I knew all about Faveros reputation. I had no idea at the time about Q factor or stance width and only became aware of a possible issue when seeing this and other reviews. I have now ridden around 5/6000 kilometers and I don’t think I have any issues with the width thing. It’s quite difficult to be absolutely sure as I am an older rider (71) and have quite a lot of hip and knee pain due to arthritis. The reason though that I am putting in my opinion is something that seems to be being overlooked, apparently mens hips continue to grow throughout life, that’s why us old git’s can’t get into skinny jeans anymore! I just think it would be interesting to know if anyone has ever looked into this.
Thanks for your comment. I have a lot of knee and ankle arthritis and I'm a little worried about the Q Factor issue. It's great to hear that many different bikes have different Q Factors already, and since I switch between different bikes already I'm no longer very worried about this increase with the Favero power meters.
Love my Favero Assioma PMs!
Most people already have pedals on the bike, so as long as they are compatible you dont have to by new ones. Just use the ones you already have.
So, I have the pedals. Not this new set, but it doesn't seem like from a specification standpoint they are any different.
I also did the SPD hack and changed from the LOOK pedals it had, with no issues.
So, my question which I know has been posed earlier, are you aware of any flat pedals these spindles will fit?
Based on the (eventual) review of the crank power meter on the SRAM Rival groupset I'm thinking of just going with that whole set up, but if I could use flats on those spindles I'd love to put them on another one of my bikes.
Thanks, Ray
Is the spin balance, (not spinning after you take off and try to click in) weight any better than the current Assioma pedal body?
Great review, although I expect people to have heartburn over the increased q-factor…
I was holding out to see if they were gonna release a next gen version of the Assioma Uno, since they are 3 years old. But now the they just introduced the Shimano version I am thinking they aren't gonna update the other pedals any time soon. Any Thoughts?
Can't afford the pedals, but that t-shirt 👌
Indeed, it's a good one! Here's the link: cottonbureau.com/products/3x10-cycling-workout
Now they just need an SPD version and I will happily buy it.
One can dream!
@@Dcrainmaker Doesn't seem all that far fetched given that Garmin was able to do it - even if it their price point is a bit mad.
@@Dcrainmaker Until they get rid of the pods, we will be stuck cutting chunks out of our shoes if we really want a conversion.
you can swap the old duo pedals to spd with xpedo m force 8 pedal
@@TheLadeef yeah, but thats not compatible with most of the mtb shoes
Your Q-factor stand really pushed me to buy these. Thanks!
How do you feel about them after a few months? Does Q-factor matter?
Hi. I picked up a pair of these and installed them on my existing pedals. They sync'd up to my Garmin 1030 head unit no problem, but now I am noticing that I get alerts that my Garmin Radar unit drops connection followed by the Assioma Power meters. Have you hear of this happening?? I don't know if this is a Garmin issue or an issue with one of these sensors. Any info would be appreciated. Thanks for your time.
I have 2 road bikes, both bikes stance width is about 255mm which means the q-factor of crankset is same. That make me think will i noticed the difference in my body if i increases stance 10mm or more to outward. Probably i will because i have ride with these measurements for decades. If i found a q-factor what feels comfortable with my body i try to keep that best way i can when i select components and bike. I am older man so i don't want any aches in my knee, ankle, hip etc. to change something too much. If Ray says that 10mm extra q-factor doesn't effect much as we think, how about saddle height or fore and aft adjustment 10mm one way or another. Just make me think is that wider stance width effect saddle position at all.
maybe you will, every person is different, for me not a problem, I even prefer it wider due to heel clearance. I have alll kind of bikes with various qfs and do ultra events on all of them. In general the more I cycle , the more irrelevant small fit problems are
I like Rally for the replaceable battery. I know you said in your OG review on the Favero pedals that the built in battery will last a very very long time long run, but in the back of my mind I worry about battery wear. Also I've had awful support with Favero...
Strange, they’ve been so responsive and friendly to me. My only gripe is I needed to replace the decals on the spindle as they came off, and when they finally arrived from Italy, it ended up being close to $75 with shipping, taxes, etc…. For stickers…. Still, honestly, one of the best pieces of kit i’ve ever bought.
In my written review I dive into the nuances of battery wear a bit. In short, you don't need to worry about it (still). As for support, feedback I've received is very hit or miss. I think most of the negative feedback I see is that people feel like they have to argue a bunch on theoretically in-warranty repairs. I don't know how truthful that is, as sometimes people also stretch the truth of what should be in warranty.
@@BananaChipzzz is this a joke? why do you need to replace the decals?
If the battery wear in these in like any other rechargeable battery (say a Garmin head unit), your 50 hours runtime will drop very little over years of use. But even in an extreme case where it lost say 50% of its capacity, you’re still getting 25 hours at a time, which is pretty manageable.
On the subject of Garmin, I have to charge my 520 after every ride! 😐
Out of interest did you end up getting the Assiomas?
So will the extra q-factor actually work for the MTB conversion for the shoe without having to modify the shoe.... hmmmmmmm
Are you planning a review on those stroopwafels as well any time soon?
I keep running into supply issues, namely, I run out of my supply too frequently. 🤣
Maybe we'll get one that's included with the pedal next year?
QUESTION ! I dont have shimano pedals, soo what should i buy ? Assioma favero version 1 or this new assioma duo shi + Shimano ultregra pedals ?
You know ... I just want to buy a pair of nice power meters to use those measurements in a training app. And besides - I like to have some measurements about my fitness, which help me to compare myself against my past me. Which motivates me a lot. Right now I'm not sure whether to buy these (Favero Assioma DUO-Shi) or those from Garmin (Garmin Rally; Though to be honest, I haven't found out what's the relevant difference between the rally rk and the rally rs).
But I have one question, after I look at those pedals: Can they even be used with "normal", unmodified shoes?
Any rumor/gossip/update/news (summer...) on the Wahoo SpeedPlay POWRLINK Zero ?
The crank length in your bike computer overrides the value from the Assioma app, right?
Correct.
At 16:30 you mentioned, that you prefer to use the Assioma in dual channel mode, but if I understood correctly, that only matters if I connect via Bluetooth. Does this also mean I should use Bluetooth over ANT+? This might be a newbie question, but I just started out with power meters and I found no reliable info if I should us Bluetooth or ANT+ to connect to the bike computer. I have an Edge 530 so it is compatible with both.
Thank you for the review. In the video on the official Favero Assioma website it is mentioned that a torque wrench set to 8-10 Nm should be used to tighten the Assioma spindle to the Shimano pedal body.
Wish it fit the XTR pedals... coming soon maybe?
Came wanting the spindles but left wanting that shirt!
Ask and you shall receive: cottonbureau.com/products/3x10-cycling-workout#/5760136
I‘m looking for a powermeter-spindle fitting into a Shimano XT Pedal. Any idea for a most payable solution?
I was wondering if I could put my Shimano PD-M9100; XTR; SPD Flat Bike Pedal on these? Thank you for all the great tips.
I have always wander with this kind system, how strong are they build? so in case of a crash they do not completely brake or get completely or the calibration get ruined forever.
@DC Rainmaker Is it possible to buy a set of these and share it with a friend?
My friend takes the left pedal, I take the right pedal. In the settings in the app you can choose to 'Double the Power', isn't it? If we both double the power of our own personal pedal, this would work I guess...
This would save half the costs? And half of the Q-factor problem....
@5:25 - Is it just in my head or the crankset is quite wobbly (loose or the BB is trashed?)
its looks super loose
Also, Garmin pedals have platform center offset, which is an important feature for injury prevention (or post-injury treatment) and for perfect positioning of your cleats. Does it cost additional 500 bucks? - most probably not, but a really nice feature, if you know what to do with it and you need it.
Can the new spindles plug into the Mtb platform, like the old “non approved” conversion everyone is doing?
No
I can only hope so. Funny enough many shimano spindles look all nearly identical. I am still curious if they will fit either one of the PD-M520, PD-M820, PD-T8000/M8000.
@@remcov3253 would have been advertised, too.
@@cricanwa a missed chance! Literally tens of power meters available for racing bikes, but only very few for MTB and touring. The reason is that I cycle 99% ot the time with a belt drive and a rohloff. Crank is exotic, only one old stages could fit. So left to pedals only. Reason for this bike the weather is usually bad and this configuration requires very little maintenance which is nice at 8k km a year at 250 to 300w AVG for commuting as my triathlon training.
Is there a difference between 5800 n 6800 pedals? Can I fit a 5800 pedals on this?
Interesting move by Assioma, how did they get permission from Shimano ? Q factor and pedal stance width can be an issue, can you clarify the distance versus the standard Ultegra PD-R8000 pedal axle please ? +5.5 per side = +11 total ? The PD-R8000 also comes in a "long axle" version that is +4mm longer each side (= +8 total) which I use on all my bikes. I find the wider stance helps with IT band issues.
I doubt you’d need permission to copy the shape and thread of a pedal spindle. There’s no way you’re patenting it.
The Q Factor on a standard Shimano pedal is 53-54mm per pedal. Assioma is 64-65mm per pedal. So ~22mm extra in total. The long axle Shimano is 58mm so the Assiomas add on just 12mm per side if you’ve been using those already.
@@rob-c. standard shimano pedals are 52mm to pedal centreline. The +4mm shimano pedals are 56mm to pedal centreline. Duo-shi’s are 64mm with PD-R7000/R550/R540 pedal bodies and 65mm with PD-R8000/6800 pedal bodies. Call it 64.5mm on averages. Soo, for those already using the Shimano +4mm pedals the increase to Duo-Shi’s is 8.5mm per side on average (strictly, the difference per side is: 8mm on 105 pedals, 9mm on Ultegra pedals).
Lesson. If Q is mentioned, stay away. Q-factor, iQ2.
Hi DC, What are your thoughts on using the Assioma DUO-shi / power meters in general on fixed gear bikes? Will they cope with the torque of back pedaling etc?
Dumb question but has anyone tried it with the PD-EF202 Flat Pedals? Since they are not officially listed as compatible i already found one vendor that said they are. Some confirmation would be nice though.
So, technically I COULD pull the spindle from the uno and add it to Shimono pedals? Would you expect much variant? I would much rather go that route vs dropping another $500+.
No. Uno spindles are totally different
I just wish they sold them in a bigger box!!!
Good evening
I hope is well …
Is this Assioma Shi duo will fit Durace pedals ?? Or only Ultegra pedals ?
Only 105 and ultegra
Can the Assioma spindles fit to Time pedal bodies?
very wide .How did you find them over a long distance ?
Does the favero assioma duo (look version) compatible with spd?
I’m just here for the tshirt 🙏🏼
Funny store: I ordered that shirt back in *DECEMBER*, and it took till April for supposed international shipping to arrive in the Netherlands, where it was promptly lost by PostNL. Had to wait a few months again for CB to clear it as gone, before finally re-issuing a new one to my US forwarding address a couple weeks ago. But, it's on point!
Oh, and here's the link for those curious: cottonbureau.com/products/3x10-cycling-workout
@@Dcrainmaker Oh geese... would've been much faster if I just sent you one.
I order a ton of stuff from CB, usually quarterly. This was part of a bigger shipment of things, so it’s just an odd one-off failboat. No worries!
I have the exact same shirt same color. I get tons of fun comments on it when wearing it. 👌
Do power meters work with Strava?
So youre sayin Favero released shimano pedals just after i bought the look version and switched over with all my other pedals?
Yup!
you're better off with the look version - has better q factor
Is the fact that they don’t make a pedal that’s a Shimano copy all to do with Shimano patents?
Can I put them on a SPD and which model?
I have the DUO version. I really dislike how they are difficult to clip into. Everything else, I really like.
They just seem to spin quickly around the axel and then rotate back and forth. When I start a crit I have to look down to time it right to clip in. It's annoying... It's more annoying while training on rollers...
Are the new DUO-Shi's easier to clip into?
Try a different brand of cleats. This will fix the problem.👍
@@markbradtke5962 I am using the Keos. Do you mean to just buy the Shi version?
@@Rosini2222 No. Have you tried the "genuine" Look keo cleats with the Assioma duo (keos). I find the genuine ones work well.
@@markbradtke5962 No I haven’t. I’ll have to give that a try. The issue I was having was that the pedals would go into a spin and it was hard to time the clipping in at just the right moment. Maybe a different clear geometry will fix that as you explained. Thank you.
I don’t know if you answer videos that are this old, but I’m having trouble with my Favero reading 20watts more than my jet black volt. I’m not really sure why it’s doing it and I’ve tried to callibrate, spin down, update everything
Does anyone produce power meters for flat pedals? Could the Fevaros be made to fit?
You can get plastic adapters to click into a pedal, which makes then ‘flat’. It’s only one side of the pedal,and it adds a few mm on top of the pedal. But they work fine, are cheap and easily removed if needed/regretted.
A Bit of topic, what shirt are you wearing? I like it. Grtz
Here ya go! cottonbureau.com/products/3x10-cycling-workout#/10329059/tee-men-standard-tee-vintage-navy-tri-blend-s
Why can't I use my old old spindles? Because Shimano say so.
Is it normal to apply that much torque when tightening the pedal to the crank arm?
Yes. And in fact, that was actually a fairly lightweight one. Else, it won't be accurate.
I noticed that too, mine are never tightened like that, power reading seems good.
It’ll tighten automatically with successive rides. But if you want accurate data from ride 1, then you’d want to have them properly tightened.
Does it work with Dura Ace Padals?
Will they fit DURA-ACE 9100 CARBON SPD-SL ROAD PEDALS ?
No, different spindles.
I see the list of compatible pedals does not include the shimano dura ace r9100?
Correct, the Dura Ace units have different spindle designs.
@@Dcrainmaker that's a bit of a shame for the component whores!
Q factor can be adjusted in the cleats anyway u have 4 mm adjustment.just move the cleat all the way out and toe out slightly would compensate the 11 mm difference,then come back and lie to me u can feel sub 1 cm difference with your feet.
People with hip/knee impingements might
What are the odds of my IQ2 dual sided ever being delivered?
Low. Or at least, low from IQ2. Ultimately, everything I'm hearing is that IQ2 has simply run out of meaningful amounts of money, and without money, they can't make things move fast (or at all). And likely, the reason they've run out of money is because they priced the pedals too low relative to the cost of making them (including development).
Does the shirt come with the .zwo-file?
Sadly not. But, here ya go: cottonbureau.com/products/3x10-cycling-workout#/5760136
Thanks you
Any idea if these will work with 9000/9100 pedals?
No they won't, as they don't share similar internals.
Can those spindles fit into SPD off-road pedals?
It sounds like something is up with your unit, worthwhile contacting Garmin support. If you're not getting HR data during a run, it also could be too tight. Note though that you won't get PulseOx data during a workout - as that requires you be still (as is the case on every SpO2 sensor out there).
Are those stroop waffles behind you?
Absoutely!
can you put flat pedals?
Get those small adapers, which click into pedals to make them flat. Cheap and easily removed. Adds a small bit of ‘height’, few mm, to the pedals.
But not SPD compatible. Why? Hello gravel market?
the oil cap explaination is called imbeded obsolences, Iphone have the same thing.
I jussssssssst bought the favero Assioma duo pedals to replace my shimano SPD-SL ultegra pedals because I wanted a power meter 😭
They have a 14 day return policy :-)
with the look version you have better Q Factor, soo you are ok !
@@TheSpongesa unfortunately I’m outside the 14 day window
@@oscarduarte253 by one mm 😅
For road bikes with standard BB radius then there's not a massive variation in shell width. Maybe a few mm. Moving your ankle-ankle width by 1 inch+ just to have power pedals is not close to being acceptable. It's a deal breaker. Probably a knee * hip breaker as well. Love my Assiomas. This isn't what we wanted Favero. Not close.
I get the concern, but I just don't think there's much of a basis for it. After all, plenty of athletes switch between MTB & Road bikes throughout a season, which would have a near-identical stance width as these.
@@Dcrainmaker True, but they would have distinctive setups for these bikes - saddle height, saddle fore & aft stack height & reach etc. Taking a singular instance of just a road bike then changing the q-factor by 26mm in total without a whole refit of other measurements would be enough to make any bike fitter & physio cringe. The whole point is just to be able to swap out the product with minimal impact. Bit of an own goal.
That was going to be my question. Do I need to spend 200$ for another fitting? I may as well get the Rally then
Sweet shirt, where can I get one?
Here ya go! cottonbureau.com/products/3x10-cycling-workout#/5760136
11 mm difference is something g substantial when it comes to fit. I would have hoped that the power spindles do not affect the Q factor and stance. Moreover, this would definitely affect the road bike fit and might cause challenges for most of us
Wider Q factor can be pretty positive too
I'd be interested in knowing how wide your hip joints are. You say the q-factor is no issue, but in your videos you look really wide. Other reviewers say its a no-go, and they look more typical.
I wonder if you represent the wide-jointed minority that can use these things without issue.
there has to be a hack to get this to work with my old duo pedals.
So why did Shane Miller’s review show so many inaccuracies in the data? Methodology wrong? Also I was really looking forward to these but am now unsure if the Q factor is an issue or not for me. I’ve had a bike fit done and the spd-sl pedals are what were recommended.
As Shane noted Favero noting, they found a hardware issue in a certain run/number of pedals, which they say caused those issues. I talked with Shane at length about it pre-release, comparing our data notes, and it was clear something was amiss with this pedals as he said.
Methodology is very sound! :) Verified with the Assioma DUO I’ve had for three years. True to their word the replacement set arrived today.
@@gplama nice! Was just trying to reconcile the difference in this area between two reviewers I trust!
I always say go with your gut so... I actually had these on order and cancelled and picked up the old pair new. Then bike fitter just needs your shoes and the cleats.
Nice t-shirt
Fuck lmao, I just got myself a new Duo last week and was miffed that I had to switch to Look's itty bitty ass Keo cleats.
dont forget to add import tax italy to uk!! adds 25%.
Thank you. Bacon
Any time!
Good to see that Ray is not so concerned about the Q factor.
Maybe it is a gamble but if you alread moved your feet out or used the Shimano +4mm spindle then I would guess there is no problem.
And honestly if you want a SPD-SL power meter than you have a pedal already.
Yup. I just look at the simple numbers of it. Nobody has complained about the KICKR BIKE, Stages Bike, or Wattbike. Literally, nobody. All of which increase the q-factor 10mm-25mm.
I have seen so many comments like “my knees will explode with this Q factor” below other videos about these pedals.
Yes, there will be people having a problem with it. But I doubt that so many really know. Example of the smart bikes is good 👍
the shimano pedal cost should not be relavant as this kit is most likely purchased by people who already own shimano pedals. people who new to the sport or already using keo look pedals will just buy the normal versions.