@@Sone01TheFirst Nah they had converted an entire population in to thralls of theirs over several generations and once they thought it was time they activated all of the brothers who were there thralls I'm missing several key details sorry but look it up
@@Sone01TheFirst I could see the Blood Ravens stealing Librarian aspirants from other chapters. They take them as a bonus after filching everything from the chapter vault.
@@joshbunton6424 You're talking about the Crimson Consuls. The destruction of the chapter was supposedly orchestrated by just 1 alpha Legionare, slowly destroying parts of the chapter disconnected from the rest (for instance fighting in some other part of the system or galaxy), and psycho-indoctrinating/conditioning them, without them being aware, to essentially be Manchurian candidates, destroying their own chapter and chapter fortress once activated.
@Kyros Droztamyr I've always assumed that the sex and the drugs are just entry level excesses, the kind of stuff recruiters can use on almost everyone. The worship of Slaanesh is after all first and foremost an ever escalating search of the perfect stimulus, which implies that you start vanilla and continue to push your boundaries of decency and morality.
They also sponsor community events and popular athletes. I've also heard that many of the interns they accept are offered permanent positions at the end of a trial period.
Fuck that. I'll join the normal guys before one of those chaos gods turns me into what is basically a sentient pile of shit. Please, that fate would be worse than losing my genitals. I can't risk it.
For Khorne recruitment: Bring milk for the milk flakes. For Slaanesh recruitment: Sleep with a xeno, indulge in a lot of drugs, or torture a living being. For Tzeentch recruitment: Read forbidden books. For Nurgle recruitment: find the most disgusting thing ever and eat it.
"Their constant, uninterupted chantings is drilling into my skull as if they were the immensly sanctimonious lovechild of tinnitus and a jackhammer..."
Alpha legion also recruits from every chapter/legion, with the potentiat to become alhpa legion, they come across. as demonstrated in the novel "sons of the hydra" where you have a small warband containing a former nightlord, a fallen of the dark angels and even a son of papasmurf.
You almost never see the acid spit or memory from flesh abilities used in lore unless there in a situation specific to that ability like being captured in a cage
The memory thing is used in the Carcharodon book Red Tithe, I could swear that I have seen it elsewhere but that’s the only one that I can remember at the moment
@@nurglenuggets Maybe the Ahriman novels. The spacewolves in it munch on it to track their prey. As to the acid spit, I can't actually remember it being used at all myself.
Yeah, but Space Marines don’t really need to do that. Anything they might need to dissolve slowly with acid, would probably do better with a few bolter rounds or a chainsword beating. As well, I assume most Astartes wouldn’t want to eat anyone with memories of chaos to avoid corruption, as well as not wanting to consume human flesh for obvious reasons. I also imagine an Astartes would eat anything he could before eating filthy xeno flesh.
I think uriel ventricular uses the acid spit in an ultramarines novel. One of the iron warriors eats an ork brain to learn to fly an ork 'plane' in the novel the siege of castellax
Yes, good spot in regards to the daemonculaba. (Though admittedly that seems to be a way to speed up the transformation process as opposed to overall recruitment)
@@xeonespydonum4995 na Honsou is a beast Iron Warriors are the best the emperor should have treated them better and sent the yellow cowards on the garrison missions
@@christophercombs7561 The Iron Warriors are the epitome of wasted potential. They had such high aspirations for the Imperium and they truly believed in making a glorious civilization for all of mankind, but then saw that dream being torn apart in front of their very eyes as they were relegated to menial garrison guarding, horrendous trench warfare, and siegebreaking, suffering innumerable casualties (which weren't helped by their Primarch seeing them less as sons and more as walking flesh bags with guns) which would result in widespread paranoia and backstabbing within the Legion itself, all the while everyone else hated them and most of their efforts were credited to the Imperial Fists instead. Then, after all their grueling work and effort, the ungrateful residents of Olympia, the only people that didn't completely despise them, rebelled. Perturabo, already on the brink from everything else going on, snaps and proceeds to attack his own homeworld and enslave the populace. Then came Horus' betrayal, and most of the Iron Warriors leapt at the opportunity of taking revenge against those that wronged them (even though most of their newfound allies, such as the Sons of Horus, were amongst those that looked down on them in the past as well, and others, such as the Emperor's Children, would continue to attempt to exploit them for their own benefit), turning their former once noble dream into a depraved mockery of it. Dedicating themselves to the destruction of the Imperium only to build their own twisted parody of it on top of the rubble. And even in the midst of all of this, there were still Iron Warriors that remained loyal to the Imperium, such as Barabas Dantioch, and yet despite his loyalty, he was repaid by luring the Tyranids to the galaxy, resulting in billions of deaths. Anyway, I'm getting off track here, back to the topic. Honsou is by all means, for lack of a better term, "a sick fuck", but had the Iron Warriors not deteriorated to their current state, he might not have been. Honsou is notably a very just and fair leader to his men (which is strange taking all of the above into consideration) and he is respectful towards both friend and foe alike. Had his Legion not fallen to Chaos, he might have been a valuable asset to the Imperium, and his character just adds to the overall tragedy of the Iron Warriors. But you probably already knew all of this and I'm just a broken record.
I am sick to death of people saying Fabius Bile traded his fulgrim clone off for *just* the Geneseed. He did it because he was terrified of Fulgrim, he realized that this clone was TOO perfect and had the exact same personality flaws that lead Fulgrim to becoming corrupted by Slaanesh. The was a lot more going on in Clonelord than just Fabius selling out his creation
@@Farscryer0 Thats absolutely true but I feel like I shouldn't be listening to someone with an actual demon as their pfp when they talk about the nature of Chaos
@@SHDW-nf2ki Shame you feel that way, for who better than one of the Neverborn to describe the intricacies of the Immaterial to a Material. But yes, some of the themes common to all the Powers is that you never get what you want, that your sins will be reflected upon you for all to see, and that electing to follow the Path of Glory is akin to edging yourself through mind and action into just another extension of the Great Game. Just like every other daemon.
"Why bother training new recruits when you can let the loyalist pups do it for you?" A very Tzeentchian way of thinking, and also the easiest way for Traitor Astartes to gain new members without having to actually recruit and train them.
Marked traitors are probably immortal, when they die in the material realm their patron gods just poof them into existence in the immaterium as long as they behave or the plot requires.
Yes thats right, but the issue is futher bolstering their ranks for black crusades and the unrully nature of chaos space marines. Khornate Berserkers kill their own, Dreadnaughts going insane and murdering everyone and even as sacrfices
"Immortality" isn't really what I'd call it. Traitors do die, just like Loyalists. The difference is, are you a "Grand High Muckty Muk" who burned a thousand worlds and blah blah blah blah? Or, are you Joe Nobody. Member of the "Who Are You Again?" Chapter that went rogue because of some "Incident" that happened twenty thousand years ago?
Plausible but I doubt the chaos guys would care that much to rematerialize you. Probably drag the last shambles of your consciousness from your mangled corpse and "eat" it.
Well now I'm imagining the Apothecaries overseeing the breeding program you mentioned talking about and showing off their prized bloodlines like some kind of Best in Show-style mockumentary.
Warsmith Honsou devised a horrifyingly clever method of replenishing his CSM horde. Along with the Dark Mechanicus, he merged female slaves with a sort of geneseed through the use of the warp and long-forgotten technologies. The way it worked, babies or children would be sealed inside the feminine hideosities and emerge as skinless, fully formed CSM. After being "clothed" in the flayed skin of slaves, they were ready to go out and join the slaughter.
That's why one of the things I plan on making was a Chaos Rhino or three that had the tops and rears replaced with sculpted, bloated flesh and hideous orifices for the doors, to go with a unit of still-gory and blood-soaked Chaos Marines. The implication being, of course, that it was a Daemoncaluba on wheels.
I kinda just assumed the bulk of them came from recently loyal astartes continuously falling. I was always under the impression that chaos marines, while usually showing up in great force, are extremely few in numbers in the broad picture. You know, even by astartes standards.
I have always found this topic to be fascinating and it's important to know how the legions keep up there numbers in the face of the long war. Excellent video, ty
wait, it is stated that the salamanders REMEMBER their past lives as humans in the novel nocturne, do they do the implantation differently or is it just a contradiction?
The process is probably different for every chapter. Specific types of implants, select surgeries over others, the indoctrination brainwashing is definitely different for every Chapter. But I believe, that it all comes from a prototype version of what Aspirants go through now. The process for creating Astartes BEFORE the Primarchs were located, was a uniform set up, implants, indoctrination, then told which legion to join, followed by an introductory seminar from that Legions highest ranking Astartes.
It's mentioned in the Ultramarines series that Uriel Ventris, the main characters, remembers his home world of Calth, though he's fuzzy on the details. He also remembers his training before his ascension, and can even speak the dialect of his home world if he chooses to. It can be different for each chapter, and the Salamanders in particular heavily value humility and remaining grounded, and would likely prioritize keeping their marine's memories of their former lives as vivid as possible, as to not forget where they came from.
The brainwashing primarily focuses on Chapter Loyalty, Loyalty to the Imperium/Emperor and Loyalty to the parent Legion. Only real select Chapters would probably really fuck with the minds of their Aspirants, the Black Templars, the Minotaurs, and the Marines Malevolent really come to mind, but there are probably others. Really secretive Chapters probably do some shit that might border on "Heretical" to keep specific things "In Chapter".
The only ones that _very_ explicitly don't are the Grey Knights, the rest probably have it simply pushed into the background. You gotta remember that IoM tech isn't exactly reliable nor are Chapters all the same so it's probably highly dependent.
Yeah, but wait til the Minotaur Scouts ring at your door. I assure you they did not earn that "human resource" badge just for selling their famous lemon cookies
I gotta say I don't think it is much of a mystery as to how they do that. I think cloning might be another way - if Fabius finds say a family line that is particularly successful at producing viable offspring he might just in-vitro fertilize a bunch of eggs to produce male offpsring - grow them in artificial womabs/clone tanks and get all that messy hypno conditioning out of the way as early as possible. I'm sure there are breeding factories - it's the only way to match pace with an entity the size of the Imperium.
As I told people back when I was playing, not every traitor chapter follows Chaos. Also, pretty cool hearing the music from Choas Gate. man, I wish I still had my copy of that game. Never beat it.
I think so. The alpha legion warband in Shroud of Night has one scout, as a named and prominent character/member. The same warband also used a seemingly demonic or some sort of twisted device to essentially "scout" their flight path (although it might've been just a particularly upset machine spirit). Likewise sorcery and cultists can do the trick aswell. Doubt there will be many scouts hanging around with the more chaotic/corrupted groups though. Groups like the AL have always been less heavy on a purely full fledged/typical astartes roster.
The ones that still use a type of military discipline, and actually PLAN their battles might. But I doubt they have scout units in the ones screaming "BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD!!" Or the ones who are constantly masturbating with barbed wire.
"So we helped you Imperial Curs, you'd better be grateful." "Fek u Iron Warriors!" "Okay what if we just outdo the Orks?" "Okay have some recruits then..."
Kind of wonder how Rubric Apotecharies would look like. Of course, I know that the Thousand Sons can reanimate dead Rubrics and Magnus himself can bring back dead sorcerers to life, but outside of probably calling dibs on rogue Librarians and unless they figured out the sorcerous equivalent of geneseeding, their numbers could very well still be on the lower end (though still numerous by Legion standards).
They probably get resurrected by the power of the warp. For some veteran chaos marines of the original horus heresy that may explain why they have lived for 10000 - 11000 years. Magnus the red has "died" multiple times though he is technically a daemon now. Eliphas died multiple times in dawn of war 2 (he probably faked his death though). I know for certain that yvraine resurrected some thousands son ghost marine back into a normal astartes and then proceeded to kill them to toy with ahriman. Same with plague marines. They're basically warpified zombies in power armour and hence are undead which probably can be raised from repeated deaths.
The "Gods" probably have their toys, Ahriman, Erebus, Typhus, etc. Guys whom, if they WEREN'T protected by their "Gods", would have been killed by their own men centuries ago. Then there's the "Deamon Princes", Astartes who live forever as meatpuppets for Neverborn. Magnus, and his brothers CAN'T die. They can be "Destroyed", or banished back to the Warp, but true death is beyond them. At least as long as the corpse is still on his golden potty. But Chaos Astartes do die. And they die constantly. Just not enough to get rid of them.
@@Brandelwyn no they're not zombies. Zombies are mindless. But they are undead. They are not living creatures. There is no way a creature can live with that much missing cellular tissue and infection.
@@Brandelwyn but to get rid of a pluage Marine you have to completely destroy it's body in fire preventing it from rising back from it's grave due the merciful embrace of Grandfather Murgle
@@Brandelwyn true though during the Siege of Vraks The Death Korps of Krieg didn't have any flame weapons but the plague Marines had CP-13 gas (I'm just guessing I forgot the gas's name but really nasty stuff) and it may have melted their bodies bit they would come right back especially those killed with lase and bolter fire
I always imagine they recruit the same way as normal Space Marines. More forcefully. Potential topic for next video: What if Cawl and company did successfully seal off the Eye of Terror with the Cadian Pylons?
I submit the following possibility: Perhaps Heretic Astartes initiation, while having a harsh reputation. Is actually nada or close to. Perhaps just surviving the implantation process is sufficient initiation enough and given their possibly reduced recruitment numbers it just has to be that way. Also, Astartes who have fallen out of favor or are disowned by their chapter are known to trickle in to groups as like the Red Corsairs (there is a story where as much is mentioned), so that's another way.
Doing all that implants to make a chaos space marine is just too hard, I always imagined that imperium space marines that were done an injustice joined them.
Actually Imperium itself has pirates, zealots and bloodthirsty maniacs in its own ranks enough to keep endless strife going without Chaos Space Marines. They most likely use similar methods than loyalist Astartes and maybe their methods have developed so that adults can be altered as well. Loyal, brutal and cunning cultist-veteran already knows how to fight so improving his physical abilities is smart choice.
You have to remember that the traitor legions would be stronger in number after HH Without Guilliman breaking chapters down to stop future civil wars Yeah they won't be at full strength following the defeat but without being weakened by successor chapters any new heretic/renegade chapters are just more numbers for the forces of Chaos
I think all these methods are viable. It annoys me when I read a book that suggests Chaos marines are mostly 10 000 years old.. but.. er.. mysteriously no stronger or more experienced than a new Loyalist, after 10 000 years of war you'd be such a skilled veteran you should slaughter a dozen regular marines. So, to me most chaos marines are no older than their loyalist counterparts and recruited from chaos worlds or else renegades.
Sure there was vat grown astartes or humans within the iron warriors legion. It was in one of the honsou books. Can't remember exactly as it was many years ago tho.
Warp shenanigans plays a big role in how CSM keep their numbers up. They don't necessarily have to follow the normal gene seed rules. The opening of one of the battle fleet gothic games seems to imply you can just make a chosen cultist into a space marine via demon power. The Thousand Sons codex entry on sorcerers talks about the process of transforming psykers into aspiring sorcerers by shoving organs into them and then letting them bake in the power of "just as planned". Also, do the death guard even need new recruits? They're all undead anyway. Papa Mortarion and Grandpapa Nurgal can probably just resurrect the ones they really like. Same with Magnus for the TS. (the sons which aren't dust in armor anyway). As for everyone else, the gene seed of the original legions has been altered quite a bit thanks to apothecaries like Bile, so who knows what it's really capable of after it's been spliced with stuff like the Laer.
I think the casualty rate of chaos space marines would be much higher than imperials given chaos infighting and berserk tactics often used by chaos. This combined with lesser resources and recruitment pools would make chaos marines much less numerous than their imperial counterparts.
The alpha legion used runes in the hive of a recruiting world to subvert the recruitment process and create sleeper agents within the chapter prior to indoctrination. It was the crimson consuls. And for the effort they got untainted gene-seed new battle brothers a fortress and all the equipment left in the armory.
I feel like the Alpha Legion just sits around going "So that last plan was pretty devious. Now we gotta do something even *more* subverted and devious!" all day.
I wonder how it works for the Space Wolves, then. Because Wolf Priests don't really take kids, they take great warriors who proved themselves in battle even if they were "wounded unto death", I think the old codex quote went.
In Ragnar Blackmanes book it states your considered a man at like 14 when you get an Axe and shield for your birthday coincidently that means you get to help fight for your clan during which the priests look for promising youths
Let's just hope and pray to the Emperor that none of them, least of all Bile, ever get their vile little hands on any Primaris gene seed; The day that happens, we're all doomed.
@@Shablimbles Basically because my understanding is that the Primaris are either close to or even possibly exceeding the level of the freaking CUSTODES, but with a MUCH higher success rate. And Chaos-tainted marines tend to be more powerful than the loyalists thanks to blessings from the Chaos Gods, so imagine what it'd be like fighting a Primaris hopped up on whatever the hell Khorne gives his followers.
Well if your Honsou, you grow the bastards... until the Ultramarines show up and destroy everything of course. Then you pray to Slaanesh for a very special mark that lets you downstairs bolter fire live rounds for once.
You'te in the Black Legion now, o-oh-ohhhh, you're in the legion now~ Hand grenades flying over your head --drums-- Deathstrke missiles flying over your head If you wanna survive Spell the warp-alphabet You're in the Black legion now~
Left out the Daemonculaba the Iron Warriors used in that admittedly cringey Ultramarines novel mini series McNeill wrote. Oh, and the Blood Gorgons from the Bastion Wars trilogy (Henry Zhou) seemed to have an unusual recruitment and creation process.
So looking at the chaos intro from BFGA2, it appears that if they capture a Space Marine they can harvest the organs and give it to a new recruit. Fabius Bile is also known to be an apothecary that could make new Space Marines but he was more obsessed with making Primarius Marines. In Warhammer Fantasy the chosen knight armor is some sort of cursed artifact that once worn it cannot be taken off, however the armor mutates and makes the larger and stronger. It is unlikely some sort of mutation will result in anything stable as a space marine. Being in the warp space their mortal ages are extended to a point where the attrition of centuries does not affect them. A human infected from a plague by nurgal will likely never be stable to be a space a marine. Same for Khorne Berzerkers or Slanesh Noise Marines. Odds are they have to be Space Marines before they are consecrated to a single pantheon. The Ruberic Marines from the Thousands sons are now ethereal dust sealed in an armor. It is likely if the armor be reforged than the essence of that dust could be reimbued into the armor rebirthing the Thousand son.
One thing I've never understood is now the traitor marines are still on a comparable size to the Imperiums forces. Each legion was 100k marines, 18 legions total, with an even 9v9 split during the heresy. So at best 900k marines on each side. 4 of the trailer legions needed to destroy the loyalists in their legion at the start which would have reduced their numbers by even a small fraction. Then on Istvaan, while they annihilated the loyalists, they still would have incurred losses, albeit small. Assuming that the Thousand Suns were as decimated as the Raven Guard, they would be pretty weak at best. So only 7 legions at near full strength would have attacked. But given that the loyalists on Terra had the defensive advantage, it wouldn't be wrong to assume that most, if not all of the traistor legions suffered greatly, and then any losses suffered during their eventual retreat and later black crusades and infighting, it seems odd that enough have survived to still launch 13 black crusades. That not even accounting for the fact that not even the full strength of the traitor legions would have been involved. With many either being independent warbands or too busy doing chaos stuff in the warp. The imperial has trillions of people to recruit from, so they theoretically should always have the upper hand when it comes to overall force size, not including warp spawn or other demons, even if their forces aren't as localised as chaos when they attack
While it definitely doesn't make up for all of it, the loyalists seem to deal with a lot more problems than the traitors seem to do. Think tyranids, orks, necrons, eldar, etc. There's a surprising amount of chapters that will get wiped every here and there, usually rendering a large amount of geneseed unusable. Add to that the worlds both in and out of the warp owned by traitors which bring good amounts of cultists to the table to essentially play the role of traitor imperial guard. Another point to add, which might not be reflected in the games or tabletop, is that lorewise the average chaos astartes dude of rank tends to be a fair bit stronger than their loyalist counterpart. An example would be Supreme Grand Master Azrael of the dark angels needing saving from an alpha legion captain gone warlord by a group of Deathwing terminators in single combat. So even without counting the numerous demons and what not, the chaos forces will usually have a fair amount of strength, even if their numbers seem lacking.
@@ratface7329 This. Chaos Marines are almost always superior, and have large legions of mortal followers to take with them, regiments of guardsmen turn traitor far more often than astartes do, and the civilians of imperial worlds being taken by Chaos forces tend to devolve into civil wars as large swathes of them join Chaos for one reason or the other. Getting new Gene Seed might not be the easiest task, but the mortal backup, the daemonic backup, the occasional traitor marines joining them and so on tend to pick up for the slack, even BEFORE making more of them with what they have. And that's not touching the Imperium's losses, starting with dividing the loyal legions into chapters that, on paper, have ONLY 1000 marines each. That's literally 1% of the STANDARD strength of the old legions, meaning that even if a chaos legion was only at 10% strength or sent only 10% of their peak-number forces to do anything, disregarding the mortal heretics (that counters loyal mortals like guardsmen) you would need TEN average chapters to match their numbers.
6:22 - They rebelled, due to not being appreciated...at least they aren't Night Lords. | 9:36 - A psychopath, even by Traitor Legion standards. | Not even the Sisters of Battle are immune from this.
There's a short story in a compendium novel where 3 traitor marine commanders visit an ancient iron warrior warsmith to barter for genenseed, he becomes enraged when the 3 warlords say they are newly made, I think they are thousand sons, emperor's children and night lord
I'm stunned you totally forgot to mention thr facilities the iron warriors used in the Ultramarine Novel 3. As I recall: In the hearth of their fortress there was a cave filled with women with giant bloated bodys, each was home to an embryo of an Astartes baby. The babys were born as astartes. This was the reason how the iron warriors were able to wage their great wars amongst eachother, involving thousands of Astartes. It was never mentioned if the babys were actually clones or not. But there was a lot of gross detail about the twisted and corrupted way they were bred. They used the energy of a demon of khorne to infuse the neophytes with unreal anger, hatred and list for battle.
While I did initially miss the Daemonculaba, it is arguable that they are more in regard to speeding up the transformation process as opposed to out and out recruitment
@@40KTheories ah I see. good point. Last time I read the book was in 2013 so my knowledge is a little rusted^^ yet I personally think they would have been a fine addition since the way they and Hanzou work are fairly detailed wich gives us a good inside into the mindest of iron warriors "recruitment" methods.
They click on those "single traitors near you" adds.
single big tiddy daemon girlfriends in your area
Citizen: "I want a big tiddy daemon girlfriend!"
*Ads are covered by propaganda.*
Be the alpha legion and steal an entire chapter of loyalists for yourself
Sounds like blood ravens in disguise.
Or at least something they would do.
@@Sone01TheFirst Nah they had converted an entire population in to thralls of theirs over several generations and once they thought it was time they activated all of the brothers who were there thralls I'm missing several key details sorry but look it up
@@Sone01TheFirst I could see the Blood Ravens stealing Librarian aspirants from other chapters. They take them as a bonus after filching everything from the chapter vault.
@@Sone01TheFirst naa bloodravens steal your wargear they like shinys.
@@joshbunton6424 You're talking about the Crimson Consuls. The destruction of the chapter was supposedly orchestrated by just 1 alpha Legionare, slowly destroying parts of the chapter disconnected from the rest (for instance fighting in some other part of the system or galaxy), and psycho-indoctrinating/conditioning them, without them being aware, to essentially be Manchurian candidates, destroying their own chapter and chapter fortress once activated.
Imperial space marines - “hippity hoppity your best children are our property!” Chaos space marines - “second verse, same as the 1st!”
"But a little bit louder, and a little bit worse"
That's amazing. All together now.
Daniel Nelson Morty “This is just slavery with extras steps!!”
Bitches dont know about my Daemonculaba
@@ChiotVulgaire hahahahaha
_"Hey kids, wanna be able to do _*_ALL_*_ of the cocaine?!"_ - *Doomrider, the Emperor's Children's best 'recruiting officer'*
Doomrider, more like Daddy
"I DO COCAAAAAAAAAIIIIIINE"
-Doomrider
@Kyros Droztamyr I've always assumed that the sex and the drugs are just entry level excesses, the kind of stuff recruiters can use on almost everyone. The worship of Slaanesh is after all first and foremost an ever escalating search of the perfect stimulus, which implies that you start vanilla and continue to push your boundaries of decency and morality.
@@Omnicide101 Rockzo the rock and roll clown = doomrider confirmed
@@khornedmaple So furries then.
Same as any other organization:
_Pamphlets and Flyers_
They also sponsor community events and popular athletes. I've also heard that many of the interns they accept are offered permanent positions at the end of a trial period.
Seo
Door 2 Door
@@docvaliant721 'we've come to talk to you about nurgle.'
Greetings Corpse Worshiper! Have you a moment to talk about Chaos? And just exactly WHAT it can do for you?
Ok see when chaos mommy and chaos daddy love each other very very much...
No
So... The Emperor's Children method (one of them anyway)?
*Fabius Bile:* _[in the distance]_ "WHY DO I KEEP WORKING WITH THESE SICK FUCKS?!"
Then the chaos daddy proceeds to RIP AND TEAR.... and then you reeeeeeeeeeally don't want to know the rest.
Someone in the other corner of the room: cause you're sick fuck yourself, Fabius!
@@zenoblues7787 Sadly I know.
Abbadon what are we going to to when we get out of the eye ? Same thing we do every Black Crusade , try to destroy the Imperium .
ah yes pinky and the brain reference I see you know your stuff
"Failbbadon" not abbadon
Khorne's Witnesses go door to door on imperial planets politely seeking new converts.
you know they were there when there is no longer a door...and maybe some relatives missing
They trimmed my bushes in the front yard and cleaned my pool so I signed up cant wait to get one of those sweet chain axes
I still remember *that* wiki article:
List of khornate massacres
[This list is uncomplete, *you can help by expanding it* ]
(Cocks boltor)
"Politely"
We have video footage
"JOIN OR DIE YOU SACK OF WATER DOWN HORSESHIT"
Chaos marine: JOIN CHAOS AND BECOME ONE WITH THE RUINOUS POWERS!
citizens: hmm...
Chaos marine: we also have cookies-
Citizen: LET THE GALAXY BURN!!
CHAOS considering how poorly citizens are treated by the Imperium, it would probably be that simple.
@@TheRandomMuffinMan hahaha yeah actual food not ration bars
Fuck that. I'll join the normal guys before one of those chaos gods turns me into what is basically a sentient pile of shit.
Please, that fate would be worse than losing my genitals. I can't risk it.
@@TheKing-qz9wd
pointing out losing your genitals seems oddly specific
@@CedricBassman
Because how am I supposed to enjoy a fine woman if I lose my member?
Exactly. Therefore he becomes of great importance.
For Khorne recruitment: Bring milk for the milk flakes.
For Slaanesh recruitment: Sleep with a xeno, indulge in a lot of drugs, or torture a living being.
For Tzeentch recruitment: Read forbidden books.
For Nurgle recruitment: find the most disgusting thing ever and eat it.
Nurgz and Slaanesh recruit from UA-camrs?
Nah, Nurgle marines are basically immortal
@@CaptainRufus they need more followers for their cults of pleasure and rotten flesh.
@@CaptainRufus UA-camrs and Furries. ;)
I thought Slannesh was the Chaos God & Goddess of Sex, Drugs & Rock n Roll.
When the music started I expected to hear the Cato Sicarius.
"Their constant, uninterupted chantings is drilling into my skull as if they were the immensly sanctimonious lovechild of tinnitus and a jackhammer..."
IT IS I
@@ItsRawdraft2 *[ULTRAGROAN]*
@@Mrkabrat AAAAA
@@ItsRawdraft2 *pitches voice* Cato Sicarius of the Ultramarines
Alpha legion also recruits from every chapter/legion, with the potentiat to become alhpa legion, they come across. as demonstrated in the novel "sons of the hydra" where you have a small warband containing a former nightlord, a fallen of the dark angels and even a son of papasmurf.
@Tigran Abazyan greyknights/custodes have tho. no greyknight/custude did ever fall to chaos afaik.
You almost never see the acid spit or memory from flesh abilities used in lore unless there in a situation specific to that ability like being captured in a cage
my khorne beserker used the flesh memory thing in a black crusade game i was in
The memory thing is used in the Carcharodon book Red Tithe, I could swear that I have seen it elsewhere but that’s the only one that I can remember at the moment
@@nurglenuggets Maybe the Ahriman novels. The spacewolves in it munch on it to track their prey.
As to the acid spit, I can't actually remember it being used at all myself.
Yeah, but Space Marines don’t really need to do that. Anything they might need to dissolve slowly with acid, would probably do better with a few bolter rounds or a chainsword beating. As well, I assume most Astartes wouldn’t want to eat anyone with memories of chaos to avoid corruption, as well as not wanting to consume human flesh for obvious reasons. I also imagine an Astartes would eat anything he could before eating filthy xeno flesh.
I think uriel ventricular uses the acid spit in an ultramarines novel. One of the iron warriors eats an ork brain to learn to fly an ork 'plane' in the novel the siege of castellax
The iron warriors breed their own geneseed iirc
Honsou, you sick fuck!
Yes, good spot in regards to the daemonculaba. (Though admittedly that seems to be a way to speed up the transformation process as opposed to overall recruitment)
@@xeonespydonum4995 na Honsou is a beast Iron Warriors are the best the emperor should have treated them better and sent the yellow cowards on the garrison missions
@@christophercombs7561 The Iron Warriors are the epitome of wasted potential. They had such high aspirations for the Imperium and they truly believed in making a glorious civilization for all of mankind, but then saw that dream being torn apart in front of their very eyes as they were relegated to menial garrison guarding, horrendous trench warfare, and siegebreaking, suffering innumerable casualties (which weren't helped by their Primarch seeing them less as sons and more as walking flesh bags with guns) which would result in widespread paranoia and backstabbing within the Legion itself, all the while everyone else hated them and most of their efforts were credited to the Imperial Fists instead.
Then, after all their grueling work and effort, the ungrateful residents of Olympia, the only people that didn't completely despise them, rebelled. Perturabo, already on the brink from everything else going on, snaps and proceeds to attack his own homeworld and enslave the populace. Then came Horus' betrayal, and most of the Iron Warriors leapt at the opportunity of taking revenge against those that wronged them (even though most of their newfound allies, such as the Sons of Horus, were amongst those that looked down on them in the past as well, and others, such as the Emperor's Children, would continue to attempt to exploit them for their own benefit), turning their former once noble dream into a depraved mockery of it. Dedicating themselves to the destruction of the Imperium only to build their own twisted parody of it on top of the rubble.
And even in the midst of all of this, there were still Iron Warriors that remained loyal to the Imperium, such as Barabas Dantioch, and yet despite his loyalty, he was repaid by luring the Tyranids to the galaxy, resulting in billions of deaths.
Anyway, I'm getting off track here, back to the topic.
Honsou is by all means, for lack of a better term, "a sick fuck", but had the Iron Warriors not deteriorated to their current state, he might not have been. Honsou is notably a very just and fair leader to his men (which is strange taking all of the above into consideration) and he is respectful towards both friend and foe alike. Had his Legion not fallen to Chaos, he might have been a valuable asset to the Imperium, and his character just adds to the overall tragedy of the Iron Warriors.
But you probably already knew all of this and I'm just a broken record.
They also seem to use chimeric gene-seed (most notable examlle, Honsou)
I am sick to death of people saying Fabius Bile traded his fulgrim clone off for *just* the Geneseed.
He did it because he was terrified of Fulgrim, he realized that this clone was TOO perfect and had the exact same personality flaws that lead Fulgrim to becoming corrupted by Slaanesh. The was a lot more going on in Clonelord than just Fabius selling out his creation
Chaos will never allow Fabius Bile to achieve his dream. That's kind of the point of Chaos.
@@Farscryer0 Thats absolutely true but I feel like I shouldn't be listening to someone with an actual demon as their pfp when they talk about the nature of Chaos
@@SHDW-nf2ki Shame you feel that way, for who better than one of the Neverborn to describe the intricacies of the Immaterial to a Material.
But yes, some of the themes common to all the Powers is that you never get what you want, that your sins will be reflected upon you for all to see, and that electing to follow the Path of Glory is akin to edging yourself through mind and action into just another extension of the Great Game.
Just like every other daemon.
@@Farscryer0 Seriously though Kneesocks is the supreme demon
SH4D0W damn right, lol
"Why bother training new recruits when you can let the loyalist pups do it for you?" A very Tzeentchian way of thinking, and also the easiest way for Traitor Astartes to gain new members without having to actually recruit and train them.
Correct, but anything can be a new future or new plan under the eye of Tzeetch.
Yes Inquisitor, this video right here.
Scab
Thank you loyal citizen, unfortunately we must purge all knowledge of this Heresy. Blam
baronvonslapnuts
May I inquire citizen as to how you possess the knowledge of this video’s existence?
Too slow heretic
Marked traitors are probably immortal, when they die in the material realm their patron gods just poof them into existence in the immaterium as long as they behave or the plot requires.
Yes thats right, but the issue is futher bolstering their ranks for black crusades and the unrully nature of chaos space marines. Khornate Berserkers kill their own, Dreadnaughts going insane and murdering everyone and even as sacrfices
"Immortality" isn't really what I'd call it. Traitors do die, just like Loyalists. The difference is, are you a "Grand High Muckty Muk" who burned a thousand worlds and blah blah blah blah? Or, are you Joe Nobody. Member of the "Who Are You Again?" Chapter that went rogue because of some "Incident" that happened twenty thousand years ago?
Plausible but I doubt the chaos guys would care that much to rematerialize you.
Probably drag the last shambles of your consciousness from your mangled corpse and "eat" it.
Well now I'm imagining the Apothecaries overseeing the breeding program you mentioned talking about and showing off their prized bloodlines like some kind of Best in Show-style mockumentary.
Warsmith Honsou devised a horrifyingly clever method of replenishing his CSM horde. Along with the Dark Mechanicus, he merged female slaves with a sort of geneseed through the use of the warp and long-forgotten technologies. The way it worked, babies or children would be sealed inside the feminine hideosities and emerge as skinless, fully formed CSM. After being "clothed" in the flayed skin of slaves, they were ready to go out and join the slaughter.
*Hoh.* Well damn.
The Deamonculaba.
holy shit
So they were the Telaxu.
That's why one of the things I plan on making was a Chaos Rhino or three that had the tops and rears replaced with sculpted, bloated flesh and hideous orifices for the doors, to go with a unit of still-gory and blood-soaked Chaos Marines.
The implication being, of course, that it was a Daemoncaluba on wheels.
>Doesn't mention daemonculaba
You're getting soft Remleiz
To be entirely fair that didn't ever work well.
It's also pretty stupid
Black dragons? Salamanders? Marines malevolent? That's just weird to see in a war band. I mean they have to be fighting each other constantly.
That's what normal chaos warbands do anyway.
I love your channel bro, even though its like 80% heretical heresy !
I kinda just assumed the bulk of them came from recently loyal astartes continuously falling. I was always under the impression that chaos marines, while usually showing up in great force, are extremely few in numbers in the broad picture. You know, even by astartes standards.
I have always found this topic to be fascinating and it's important to know how the legions keep up there numbers in the face of the long war. Excellent video, ty
“Can I intrude for a few minutes to talk to you about the 8 fold path?”
Bribery with homemade pastries.
EFOT: if you join chaos, get a free mug.
wait, it is stated that the salamanders REMEMBER their past lives as humans in the novel nocturne, do they do the implantation differently or is it just a contradiction?
The process is probably different for every chapter. Specific types of implants, select surgeries over others, the indoctrination brainwashing is definitely different for every Chapter. But I believe, that it all comes from a prototype version of what Aspirants go through now. The process for creating Astartes BEFORE the Primarchs were located, was a uniform set up, implants, indoctrination, then told which legion to join, followed by an introductory seminar from that Legions highest ranking Astartes.
It's mentioned in the Ultramarines series that Uriel Ventris, the main characters, remembers his home world of Calth, though he's fuzzy on the details. He also remembers his training before his ascension, and can even speak the dialect of his home world if he chooses to. It can be different for each chapter, and the Salamanders in particular heavily value humility and remaining grounded, and would likely prioritize keeping their marine's memories of their former lives as vivid as possible, as to not forget where they came from.
The brainwashing primarily focuses on Chapter Loyalty, Loyalty to the Imperium/Emperor and Loyalty to the parent Legion. Only real select Chapters would probably really fuck with the minds of their Aspirants, the Black Templars, the Minotaurs, and the Marines Malevolent really come to mind, but there are probably others. Really secretive Chapters probably do some shit that might border on "Heretical" to keep specific things "In Chapter".
The only ones that _very_ explicitly don't are the Grey Knights, the rest probably have it simply pushed into the background. You gotta remember that IoM tech isn't exactly reliable nor are Chapters all the same so it's probably highly dependent.
Salamanders remember because of intensive hug training.
Chaos legions are famous for their bake sales
Yeah, but wait til the Minotaur Scouts ring at your door. I assure you they did not earn that "human resource" badge just for selling their famous lemon cookies
@@phreakazoith2237 no but being prime rib for the world eaters
@@charlottewalnut3118 wonder what Iron Legions would eat
I love the smell of heresy in the morning!
Same
@Cian McCabe like a Clinton
When the video about Chaos Space Marines starts with the Ultramarines Chant
Fitting
I gotta say I don't think it is much of a mystery as to how they do that. I think cloning might be another way - if Fabius finds say a family line that is particularly successful at producing viable offspring he might just in-vitro fertilize a bunch of eggs to produce male offpsring - grow them in artificial womabs/clone tanks and get all that messy hypno conditioning out of the way as early as possible. I'm sure there are breeding factories - it's the only way to match pace with an entity the size of the Imperium.
Word Bearers just ask you on what side of summoning ritual you want be.
As I told people back when I was playing, not every traitor chapter follows Chaos. Also, pretty cool hearing the music from Choas Gate. man, I wish I still had my copy of that game. Never beat it.
Imperial fists come from Holy Terra? Emperor bles- I mean... Good stuff!!
Something I have been curious about, do chaos war bands/ traitor legions have scouts or some kind of equivalent in their ranks?
I think so. The alpha legion warband in Shroud of Night has one scout, as a named and prominent character/member.
The same warband also used a seemingly demonic or some sort of twisted device to essentially "scout" their flight path (although it might've been just a particularly upset machine spirit). Likewise sorcery and cultists can do the trick aswell.
Doubt there will be many scouts hanging around with the more chaotic/corrupted groups though. Groups like the AL have always been less heavy on a purely full fledged/typical astartes roster.
The ones that still use a type of military discipline, and actually PLAN their battles might. But I doubt they have scout units in the ones screaming "BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD!!" Or the ones who are constantly masturbating with barbed wire.
"So we helped you Imperial Curs, you'd better be grateful."
"Fek u Iron Warriors!"
"Okay what if we just outdo the Orks?"
"Okay have some recruits then..."
Sons of our Father, stand in midnight clad...
Ave Dominus Nox.
Kalkator´s dyplomatic methods are to my liking. I wish we had such straight forward leaders now a days.
Expected to hear about the daemonculaba...
Good spot in regards to the daemonculaba.
That's one of the most horrible things I have read about since ever.
Kind of wonder how Rubric Apotecharies would look like. Of course, I know that the Thousand Sons can reanimate dead Rubrics and Magnus himself can bring back dead sorcerers to life, but outside of probably calling dibs on rogue Librarians and unless they figured out the sorcerous equivalent of geneseeding, their numbers could very well still be on the lower end (though still numerous by Legion standards).
I just imagine a World Eater covered in blood and mumbling about skulls trying to hide behind a bush in a school playground
Ooooh, so Zahpor was a brainwashed former Storm Lord? That would explain why he made such collateral mistakes on Vraks.
What the hell were the World Eaters thinking?
@@zenoblues7787 World Eaters... thinking? Dafuq?
That shit's for Iron Warrior's son.
They probably get resurrected by the power of the warp. For some veteran chaos marines of the original horus heresy that may explain why they have lived for 10000 - 11000 years.
Magnus the red has "died" multiple times though he is technically a daemon now.
Eliphas died multiple times in dawn of war 2 (he probably faked his death though).
I know for certain that yvraine resurrected some thousands son ghost marine back into a normal astartes and then proceeded to kill them to toy with ahriman.
Same with plague marines. They're basically warpified zombies in power armour and hence are undead which probably can be raised from repeated deaths.
The "Gods" probably have their toys, Ahriman, Erebus, Typhus, etc. Guys whom, if they WEREN'T protected by their "Gods", would have been killed by their own men centuries ago. Then there's the "Deamon Princes", Astartes who live forever as meatpuppets for Neverborn. Magnus, and his brothers CAN'T die. They can be "Destroyed", or banished back to the Warp, but true death is beyond them. At least as long as the corpse is still on his golden potty. But Chaos Astartes do die. And they die constantly. Just not enough to get rid of them.
@@Brandelwyn I wish they were Zombies, then maybe Typhus would shut up.
@@Brandelwyn no they're not zombies. Zombies are mindless.
But they are undead. They are not living creatures. There is no way a creature can live with that much missing cellular tissue and infection.
@@Brandelwyn but to get rid of a pluage Marine you have to completely destroy it's body in fire preventing it from rising back from it's grave due the merciful embrace of Grandfather Murgle
@@Brandelwyn true though during the Siege of Vraks The Death Korps of Krieg didn't have any flame weapons but the plague Marines had CP-13 gas (I'm just guessing I forgot the gas's name but really nasty stuff) and it may have melted their bodies bit they would come right back especially those killed with lase and bolter fire
A very extremely great video as always 40k Theories.
ah zufur sounds familiar...ya arch went through his demise..on vraks.
Nathan Zylla didn’t he escape? Khornate lord?
@@invaderHUNK yep opened a warp rift
He was defeated, but not killed.
I didn't remember...he escaped...darn it.!
Cursed writing style.
I always imagine they recruit the same way as normal Space Marines. More forcefully.
Potential topic for next video: What if Cawl and company did successfully seal off the Eye of Terror with the Cadian Pylons?
I submit the following possibility: Perhaps Heretic Astartes initiation, while having a harsh reputation. Is actually nada or close to. Perhaps just surviving the implantation process is sufficient initiation enough and given their possibly reduced recruitment numbers it just has to be that way.
Also, Astartes who have fallen out of favor or are disowned by their chapter are known to trickle in to groups as like the Red Corsairs (there is a story where as much is mentioned), so that's another way.
Doing all that implants to make a chaos space marine is just too hard, I always imagined that imperium space marines that were done an injustice joined them.
Actually Imperium itself has pirates, zealots and bloodthirsty maniacs in its own ranks enough to keep endless strife going without Chaos Space Marines. They most likely use similar methods than loyalist Astartes and maybe their methods have developed so that adults can be altered as well. Loyal, brutal and cunning cultist-veteran already knows how to fight so improving his physical abilities is smart choice.
"Be a chaos marine! Travel the galaxy! Free dental care!"
The Blood Gorgon has its own independent recruiting world.
"Hey kid! You want some candy?"
It seems to work for the Catholic Church. :(
Great content, thank you.
Its also great to heare the music of "Chaos March" 😊
You have to remember that the traitor legions would be stronger in number after HH
Without Guilliman breaking chapters down to stop future civil wars
Yeah they won't be at full strength following the defeat but without being weakened by successor chapters
any new heretic/renegade chapters are just more numbers for the forces of Chaos
*The emperor wants to know your location*
that ... was theory? seemed pretty well sourced sounds more like legit facts to me fair dues... subbed.
I think all these methods are viable. It annoys me when I read a book that suggests Chaos marines are mostly 10 000 years old.. but.. er.. mysteriously no stronger or more experienced than a new Loyalist, after 10 000 years of war you'd be such a skilled veteran you should slaughter a dozen regular marines. So, to me most chaos marines are no older than their loyalist counterparts and recruited from chaos worlds or else renegades.
Sure there was vat grown astartes or humans within the iron warriors legion. It was in one of the honsou books. Can't remember exactly as it was many years ago tho.
*knocks on door" do you have a minute to talk about our lord and savior, khorne the blood god?"
You beat the hell in to them
Ty,For your Content 😏 ,Please Continue,and May Emperor Bless you 😎 ,Ofc they can ,In the end They are Chaos......
From Fabulous Biles Flesh Emporium. It costs an arm and a leg (literally) but those prices are damn great
Warp shenanigans plays a big role in how CSM keep their numbers up. They don't necessarily have to follow the normal gene seed rules. The opening of one of the battle fleet gothic games seems to imply you can just make a chosen cultist into a space marine via demon power. The Thousand Sons codex entry on sorcerers talks about the process of transforming psykers into aspiring sorcerers by shoving organs into them and then letting them bake in the power of "just as planned". Also, do the death guard even need new recruits? They're all undead anyway. Papa Mortarion and Grandpapa Nurgal can probably just resurrect the ones they really like. Same with Magnus for the TS. (the sons which aren't dust in armor anyway). As for everyone else, the gene seed of the original legions has been altered quite a bit thanks to apothecaries like Bile, so who knows what it's really capable of after it's been spliced with stuff like the Laer.
The Imperium doesn’t want you to know this, but you can walk right into a Chapter Monastery’s geneseed vaults and take it.
Well of course they can influence everyone then take a geneseed from previous chaos marines and put them in the new recruits
I think the casualty rate of chaos space marines would be much higher than imperials given chaos infighting and berserk tactics often used by chaos. This combined with lesser resources and recruitment pools would make chaos marines much less numerous than their imperial counterparts.
We skipped over the Daemonculaba, thankfully.
The alpha legion used runes in the hive of a recruiting world to subvert the recruitment process and create sleeper agents within the chapter prior to indoctrination. It was the crimson consuls. And for the effort they got untainted gene-seed new battle brothers a fortress and all the equipment left in the armory.
I feel like the Alpha Legion just sits around going "So that last plan was pretty devious. Now we gotta do something even *more* subverted and devious!" all day.
@@winterschwartz9522 Like fucking up Abaddon's grand tour of the galaxy for the thirteenth time.
That didn't help them in the siege of Vraks
The Emperor of Mankind HATES him! Find out how YOU can go from being mere chaos spawn to a chaos marine in 19 easy steps!
*Stares in Fabius Bile's Consortium full of Chaos Space Marine Apothecaries*
Ask Malos Vrykan. He seemed to know the way.
I wonder how it works for the Space Wolves, then. Because Wolf Priests don't really take kids, they take great warriors who proved themselves in battle even if they were "wounded unto death", I think the old codex quote went.
In Ragnar Blackmanes book it states your considered a man at like 14 when you get an Axe and shield for your birthday coincidently that means you get to help fight for your clan during which the priests look for promising youths
@@thatstupidguy6669 This. On Fenris, a "warrior" can easily be a teenager.
I thought they just waited for the Imperium to piss some folks off, and took them in.
They post an add on space book, of course.
Let's just hope and pray to the Emperor that none of them, least of all Bile, ever get their vile little hands on any Primaris gene seed; The day that happens, we're all doomed.
Why is that
@@Shablimbles Basically because my understanding is that the Primaris are either close to or even possibly exceeding the level of the freaking CUSTODES, but with a MUCH higher success rate. And Chaos-tainted marines tend to be more powerful than the loyalists thanks to blessings from the Chaos Gods, so imagine what it'd be like fighting a Primaris hopped up on whatever the hell Khorne gives his followers.
*The Daemonculaba*
That’s one way it’s done, another is capturing young slaves and men and then geenseed implantation is performed, creating the chaos space marine
kid: where do the little chaos space marines come from?
dad: go ask honsou!
Well if your Honsou, you grow the bastards... until the Ultramarines show up and destroy everything of course. Then you pray to Slaanesh for a very special mark that lets you downstairs bolter fire live rounds for once.
Waitaminute, I see traitor marines, but yet I hear Ultramarines.
The Ultramarines are traitors towards good writing
Ahh, and here's me, all these years I thought it was through cold callers...
I am putting this in the category of "shit i didn't want to know" but is somehow awesome.
You'te in the Black Legion now, o-oh-ohhhh, you're in the legion now~
Hand grenades flying over your head
--drums--
Deathstrke missiles flying over your head
If you wanna survive
Spell the warp-alphabet
You're in the Black legion now~
Did someone say Khorne flakes? Sign me up! Always wanted to be a milk drinker and use my SpoonBladeX to snap, crackle and pop the imperials.
"WOLOLO" - Chaos Sorcerer/Recruiter
Left out the Daemonculaba the Iron Warriors used in that admittedly cringey Ultramarines novel mini series McNeill wrote. Oh, and the Blood Gorgons from the Bastion Wars trilogy (Henry Zhou) seemed to have an unusual recruitment and creation process.
So looking at the chaos intro from BFGA2, it appears that if they capture a Space Marine they can harvest the organs and give it to a new recruit. Fabius Bile is also known to be an apothecary that could make new Space Marines but he was more obsessed with making Primarius Marines.
In Warhammer Fantasy the chosen knight armor is some sort of cursed artifact that once worn it cannot be taken off, however the armor mutates and makes the larger and stronger. It is unlikely some sort of mutation will result in anything stable as a space marine.
Being in the warp space their mortal ages are extended to a point where the attrition of centuries does not affect them. A human infected from a plague by nurgal will likely never be stable to be a space a marine. Same for Khorne Berzerkers or Slanesh Noise Marines. Odds are they have to be Space Marines before they are consecrated to a single pantheon.
The Ruberic Marines from the Thousands sons are now ethereal dust sealed in an armor. It is likely if the armor be reforged than the essence of that dust could be reimbued into the armor rebirthing the Thousand son.
The first video too actually talk about traitor recruitment practices.
How? Phase 1: collect underpants, Phase 2, Phase 3: new recruits!
The Death Guard have to turn them away, such is the magnetism of Father Nurgles embrace.
Nurgle
So, the real question is: why do you have the Ultramarines chant as background music for a video dealing with traitor legions. ;)
Salamanders don't turn traitor, they just seek out new friends.
I wanna boop the snoot!
Wasn't there the incident where Alpha Legion had hypnotized all of a chapter's neophytes and etc. who then turned against their parent chapter.
One thing I've never understood is now the traitor marines are still on a comparable size to the Imperiums forces. Each legion was 100k marines, 18 legions total, with an even 9v9 split during the heresy. So at best 900k marines on each side. 4 of the trailer legions needed to destroy the loyalists in their legion at the start which would have reduced their numbers by even a small fraction. Then on Istvaan, while they annihilated the loyalists, they still would have incurred losses, albeit small. Assuming that the Thousand Suns were as decimated as the Raven Guard, they would be pretty weak at best. So only 7 legions at near full strength would have attacked. But given that the loyalists on Terra had the defensive advantage, it wouldn't be wrong to assume that most, if not all of the traistor legions suffered greatly, and then any losses suffered during their eventual retreat and later black crusades and infighting, it seems odd that enough have survived to still launch 13 black crusades. That not even accounting for the fact that not even the full strength of the traitor legions would have been involved. With many either being independent warbands or too busy doing chaos stuff in the warp. The imperial has trillions of people to recruit from, so they theoretically should always have the upper hand when it comes to overall force size, not including warp spawn or other demons, even if their forces aren't as localised as chaos when they attack
While it definitely doesn't make up for all of it, the loyalists seem to deal with a lot more problems than the traitors seem to do. Think tyranids, orks, necrons, eldar, etc. There's a surprising amount of chapters that will get wiped every here and there, usually rendering a large amount of geneseed unusable.
Add to that the worlds both in and out of the warp owned by traitors which bring good amounts of cultists to the table to essentially play the role of traitor imperial guard.
Another point to add, which might not be reflected in the games or tabletop, is that lorewise the average chaos astartes dude of rank tends to be a fair bit stronger than their loyalist counterpart. An example would be Supreme Grand Master Azrael of the dark angels needing saving from an alpha legion captain gone warlord by a group of Deathwing terminators in single combat.
So even without counting the numerous demons and what not, the chaos forces will usually have a fair amount of strength, even if their numbers seem lacking.
@@ratface7329 This. Chaos Marines are almost always superior, and have large legions of mortal followers to take with them, regiments of guardsmen turn traitor far more often than astartes do, and the civilians of imperial worlds being taken by Chaos forces tend to devolve into civil wars as large swathes of them join Chaos for one reason or the other. Getting new Gene Seed might not be the easiest task, but the mortal backup, the daemonic backup, the occasional traitor marines joining them and so on tend to pick up for the slack, even BEFORE making more of them with what they have. And that's not touching the Imperium's losses, starting with dividing the loyal legions into chapters that, on paper, have ONLY 1000 marines each. That's literally 1% of the STANDARD strength of the old legions, meaning that even if a chaos legion was only at 10% strength or sent only 10% of their peak-number forces to do anything, disregarding the mortal heretics (that counters loyal mortals like guardsmen) you would need TEN average chapters to match their numbers.
6:22 - They rebelled, due to not being appreciated...at least they aren't Night Lords. | 9:36 - A psychopath, even by Traitor Legion standards. | Not even the Sisters of Battle are immune from this.
13:55: That's not really a hypnotic conversion. That's a lobotomy.
deamonculaba: *allow us to introduce ourselves*
There's a short story in a compendium novel where 3 traitor marine commanders visit an ancient iron warrior warsmith to barter for genenseed, he becomes enraged when the 3 warlords say they are newly made, I think they are thousand sons, emperor's children and night lord
I'm stunned you totally forgot to mention thr facilities the iron warriors used in the Ultramarine Novel 3.
As I recall: In the hearth of their fortress there was a cave filled with women with giant bloated bodys, each was home to an embryo of an Astartes baby.
The babys were born as astartes.
This was the reason how the iron warriors were able to wage their great wars amongst eachother, involving thousands of Astartes.
It was never mentioned if the babys were actually clones or not. But there was a lot of gross detail about the twisted and corrupted way they were bred. They used the energy of a demon of khorne to infuse the neophytes with unreal anger, hatred and list for battle.
While I did initially miss the Daemonculaba, it is arguable that they are more in regard to speeding up the transformation process as opposed to out and out recruitment
@@40KTheories ah I see. good point. Last time I read the book was in 2013 so my knowledge is a little rusted^^
yet I personally think they would have been a fine addition since the way they and Hanzou work are fairly detailed wich gives us a good inside into the mindest of iron warriors "recruitment" methods.
What about the daemoncula of honsou?