That's true. Funny thing is that there's also a bunch of Vietnamese fighter losses attributed to US fighters without and American claims to match them.
@@showtime112How many of those match up with another Vietnamese pilot’s kill claim and turn out to be friendly fire? I have never studied the Vietnam air war in great depth so videos like yours are great since you give some of the finer details which are really interesting.
Not come across this accusation before - Would you let me have your examples/sources? also do you believe this is genuine deception or a consequence of confused air warfare. Historically claims are relatively unreliable a least before very modern electronic systems and determining the cause of a loss even more difficult.
@@thegreyarea-WPP Less likely on another pilot's claims and more likely that they were lost to flak/ground fire, GCI made friendly fire in the air less likely but the copious amount of flak and the North Vietnamese willingness to throw everything from small arms up against aircraft makes it kind of hard to control
Great video. The UA-cam channel Not A Pound For Air To Ground has done many good videos on the USAF and USN in the Vietnam air war, analyzing miscalculations and successes. Overall he shows that US pilots were very aggressive and well trained as individual aviators but team tactics and battle strategy were often lacking. What I get most from your videos is people finding themselves in high-tech situations where the enemy is trying his best to kill you.
Thanks for the feedback! In the case of US involvement in Vietnam (and development of military aviation tactics in the period that preceded it), history generally agrees that leadership under performed quite badly.
Great video as always. Video Request: If you haven’t already, could you do an episode on Operation Focus? It was such a superbly done operation and one of the most successful in modern history, yet surprisingly there’s such little coverage centered solely on it - instead it’s just a footnote in the wider six day war.
Thank you for the comment and suggestion! I might tackle with that operation one day. I like the idea of covering an entire campaign or a smaller war in a series of videos. The Operation Focus itself would probably require several of them.
These people had to fight the Japanese first, then the French, then the USA. Thirty years of war. Chapeau to the Vietnamese people, who in the end won! What a great vid, Showtime, thank you! Although i'm used to expect nothing less than what you usually do, all the same i'm always startled at seeing that your vids never disappoint me!!! Great!!!
You reference gun camera footage a lot in this post. If you know where to find it, or if you could link it to me, I would be very thankful. great video as always!
I doubt that it's available online. Multiple sources mention that it existed and was used to confirm at least one kill. But others point to the fact that Soviet gun cameras were pretty poor in quality and probably weren't much better than on MiG-15s from the Korean War era.
I was using some of those but a pretty annoying thing is that almost every update screws it up and you have to search it and install again once the modder updates it. I'll see if I can find a good, working one. Thanks for reminding me.
Hello Showtime 112 . I don't know if I noticed correctly but I believe hp-23 could mean on the MiG 17 cannon Nudelmann- Richter 23 cannon? Thank you. Greetings from Tijuana BC.
@ I don't know if you watched my previous video about the Suez War of 1956. I used both sims there so you can try to spot the differences 😁 I can just say that Sinai map and external MiG-15 model looks better in DCS. MiG cockpit is about the same.
Thank you! As for the frequencies, the coordination was far from great. But it is questionable how much the Phantoms could have done. The MiGs were completely unobserved until they made their first attack.
Seems to me the US Navy totally messed this mission up. Wrong radio channels ? Just so foolish and blame has to start on the carrier, in the briefing rooms. Second mistake as I see it is that the F-4s are probably better able to deal with ground targets than the F-8s so the roles should have been switched.....unless this was intentional in order to give the crews of the planes experience doing those missions. The last error is simply the F-8s not paying attention. Rookie mistakes
I would believe the American records, they really had nothing to gain or lose lying and for the most part their battle engagements were highly accurate and reliable. The NVAF were made up primarily of rookie pilots and like you said early in the video, not very well educated. I can see them getting the jump on the yank's jets, after all the Yanks were not really expecting them and in the heat of battle the distance between truth and fiction can be some what blurred.
Loss records are generally accurate, at least when it comes to how many aircraft were lost on which date. The exact cause might not always be 100% correct but that's a whole other story.
'Red Star' pilots were trained in the Soviet for 10 years. Not all Vietnamese pilots were excellent, but some were better than American pilots who had just graduated from military academy. Robin Olds said that the North Vietnamese Air Force pilots outperformed WW2 Luftwaffe. As you know, Olds shot down 13 German fighters and 4 MiGs.
@@dominiqueroudier9401 I don't get it, I ask how many trolls / bots have content on their channel? You think you may have a first comment if the first comment is not a troll. A troll is someone trying to bait you into a argument.
Hope the new TV works alright 😁 Bots seem to have plenty of interest in my channel. But they are so easy to recognize. I don't think there are many young women watching this content 🤣
EXCELLENT video, as usual. CONGRATULATIONS. You are paying tribute to those pilots who fought for their cpuntries.
I believe these events need to be remembered, it's my modest contribution to it. Thanks for being around!
Another exciting video! The air war over Vietnam is an interesting subject, particularly when viewed from the NVAF point of view.
Thank you! I'll probably keep covering some of these Vietnam air battles. Things are just starting to heat up 😁
Great job as usual!
Thank you very much!
The US Air Force had a history of recording air to air combat losses as flak losses or SAM losses.
That's true. Funny thing is that there's also a bunch of Vietnamese fighter losses attributed to US fighters without and American claims to match them.
@@showtime112How many of those match up with another Vietnamese pilot’s kill claim and turn out to be friendly fire? I have never studied the Vietnam air war in great depth so videos like yours are great since you give some of the finer details which are really interesting.
Not come across this accusation before - Would you let me have your examples/sources? also do you believe this is genuine deception or a consequence of confused air warfare. Historically claims are relatively unreliable a least before very modern electronic systems and determining the cause of a loss even more difficult.
Like on April 4th, 1965 after 2 F-105's were shot down one Mig pilot said 3 Migs were shot down by American fighters.@@showtime112
@@thegreyarea-WPP Less likely on another pilot's claims and more likely that they were lost to flak/ground fire, GCI made friendly fire in the air less likely but the copious amount of flak and the North Vietnamese willingness to throw everything from small arms up against aircraft makes it kind of hard to control
Great video. The UA-cam channel Not A Pound For Air To Ground has done many good videos on the USAF and USN in the Vietnam air war, analyzing miscalculations and successes. Overall he shows that US pilots were very aggressive and well trained as individual aviators but team tactics and battle strategy were often lacking. What I get most from your videos is people finding themselves in high-tech situations where the enemy is trying his best to kill you.
Thanks for the feedback! In the case of US involvement in Vietnam (and development of military aviation tactics in the period that preceded it), history generally agrees that leadership under performed quite badly.
So many edicts from Washington caused unnecessary casualties on both sides and extended the war far longer than it should have been fought.
Very nice content! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Thank you very much!
Great work!
Thanks Chups!
Outstanding video. Thanks for the weekly lesson
Thank you for being an early watcher!
another awesome video !!
Thank you for appreciating the comment!
Another great video, thanks! 😊
Thank you very much!
Appreciate the video. Thank you 👍😊
thx for another upload
🇨🇦😁
Thank you for watching so early!
Great video as always.
Video Request: If you haven’t already, could you do an episode on Operation Focus?
It was such a superbly done operation and one of the most successful in modern history, yet surprisingly there’s such little coverage centered solely on it - instead it’s just a footnote in the wider six day war.
Thank you for the comment and suggestion! I might tackle with that operation one day. I like the idea of covering an entire campaign or a smaller war in a series of videos. The Operation Focus itself would probably require several of them.
Superb! Thanks
Yes! Another great video!
Thank you for a very positive comment!
Outstanding! I'm looking forward to the next instalment. :)
Gerat video thank you so much for making all of this Gerat videos keep on great work show time 112😊
Thank you very much for your enthusiasm!
These people had to fight the Japanese first, then the French, then the USA. Thirty years of war. Chapeau to the Vietnamese people, who in the end won! What a great vid, Showtime, thank you! Although i'm used to expect nothing less than what you usually do, all the same i'm always startled at seeing that your vids never disappoint me!!! Great!!!
Thank you so much, I appreciate your positive comment! There's plenty more to come.
The bort number of the Pham Ngoc Lan MiG-17 was "2310" , is in Toperczer´s book "MiG-17/19 aces of the Vietnam war"....
I believe it it. In War Thunder, bort numbers can be pretty complicated to manipulate so I decided to use a generic skin without them.
You reference gun camera footage a lot in this post. If you know where to find it, or if you could link it to me, I would be very thankful. great video as always!
I doubt that it's available online. Multiple sources mention that it existed and was used to confirm at least one kill. But others point to the fact that Soviet gun cameras were pretty poor in quality and probably weren't much better than on MiG-15s from the Korean War era.
Excellent history documentary Showtime! F4 being the eternal beast.
It sure is 😁 Thank you very much!
Excellent thank you.
Thank you for appreciating it!
great one
Thank you for the positive feedback!
Thanks ! I'm a big fan of Vietnam War jets :)
You, me and a zillion other people 😁 Thanks for another comment!
Just a little tip, if your using War thunder to make your videos you can download a realistic sound mode to add to the realism
I was using some of those but a pretty annoying thing is that almost every update screws it up and you have to search it and install again once the modder updates it. I'll see if I can find a good, working one. Thanks for reminding me.
Hello Showtime 112 . I don't know if I noticed correctly but I believe hp-23 could mean on the MiG 17 cannon Nudelmann- Richter 23 cannon? Thank you. Greetings from Tijuana BC.
I think so, 'HP' is cyrillic for 'NR'. Thanks for the comment!
Again good job👍
Jon well done Showtime 112! ♠️🎩🎯🇺🇸🏹
Punctual and positive as always 😁, thank you so much!
Story of Flying officer Nirmaljeet singh shekhon please
Unfortunately, I can't do Gnat stories as this airplane isn't available in the simulations I use. Hopefully, it gets introduced in the future.
Great video! Ensign is pronounced "en-sine".
Is this an F-8 Mod for DCs?
No, this is War Thunder.
@showtime112 Gaijan is catching up to Eagle Dynamics; couldn't tell the difference: thank you.
@ I don't know if you watched my previous video about the Suez War of 1956. I used both sims there so you can try to spot the differences 😁 I can just say that Sinai map and external MiG-15 model looks better in DCS. MiG cockpit is about the same.
Got the notice let's roll it
Good to see notices are working 😁
Very nice video as usual, sadly the American pilots were on different freuquencies. (F8 and F4's)
Thank you! As for the frequencies, the coordination was far from great. But it is questionable how much the Phantoms could have done. The MiGs were completely unobserved until they made their first attack.
Seems to me the US Navy totally messed this mission up. Wrong radio channels ? Just so foolish and blame has to start on the carrier, in the briefing rooms. Second mistake as I see it is that the F-4s are probably better able to deal with ground targets than the F-8s so the roles should have been switched.....unless this was intentional in order to give the crews of the planes experience doing those missions. The last error is simply the F-8s not paying attention. Rookie mistakes
❤
Hvala!
Did jet fighters do away with armour. ww2 fighters had armour and self sealing fuel tanks
Zuni missles and many us military a/c were named after american indian tribes as a tribute to these people
Thanks for sharing!
F'n eh Showtime 112.....F'n eh !!
I would believe the American records, they really had nothing to gain or lose lying and for the most part their battle engagements were highly accurate and reliable. The NVAF were made up primarily of rookie pilots and like you said early in the video, not very well educated. I can see them getting the jump on the yank's jets, after all the Yanks were not really expecting them and in the heat of battle the distance between truth and fiction can be some what blurred.
Loss records are generally accurate, at least when it comes to how many aircraft were lost on which date. The exact cause might not always be 100% correct but that's a whole other story.
'Red Star' pilots were trained in the Soviet for 10 years. Not all Vietnamese pilots were excellent, but some were better than American pilots who had just graduated from military academy. Robin Olds said that the North Vietnamese Air Force pilots outperformed WW2 Luftwaffe. As you know, Olds shot down 13 German fighters and 4 MiGs.
WW1?
It's in my long term plans but I can't say anything more specific for now.
Second 😤😤😤or may be first if bot..Just in time to test my brand new tv LG 4K
How many trolls have content on their channel?
@@dominiqueroudier9401 I don't get it, I ask how many trolls / bots have content on their channel? You think you may have a first comment if the first comment is not a troll. A troll is someone trying to bait you into a argument.
@@JSFGuymarria Harris is a bot
Hope the new TV works alright 😁 Bots seem to have plenty of interest in my channel. But they are so easy to recognize. I don't think there are many young women watching this content 🤣
@showtime112 yes🤣😍
Have you seen ,i paid tribute to F8 with rare books !@!