Fiberglass Q&A And A Better Paint For Your Project Boat??
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- Опубліковано 3 лют 2025
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#BoatworksToday #Bertram #Restoration
Hope you're having a great week!
Thanks for watching!
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I'm now a distributor for Alexseal and can ship anywhere in the Continental US! Check it out! www.millerboatworks.com
Glad you did the Q&A. There's a lot of misinformation on UA-cam and the web. I've been using fiberglass and composites for over 35 yrs. Started with surfboard repair then boats and move on to composites ( Depot level ) on aircrafts in the Navy. I will say I'm still learning new things and new ways to do repairs. Great channel and very informative.
Life happens, Andy. Thanks for keeping us informed of what's going on. I look forward to your post-training vids to see what your perception of Alexseal is and how it's applied.
Nice tips, refresher, and update! "Life is what happens to you while you are making other plans" I'm sure they invited you to SC to learn something themselves - don't sell yourself short! I kind of think of you as our rep to them - you know the pro side well, but thanks for also advocating and remembering us backyard/outdoor DIY'ers!
Hi Andy, it's great that you're setting things straight about the epoxy hype. Lately I was feeling like a caveman when working with polyester resin...
I find your videos informative whether your actually working on something or just like this video. I am looking forward to seeing your video about the alexseal class.
Fantastic! Looking forward to hearing about your trip and the "new" product.
Invite only!!! Right on Andy. Can’t wait to see what they show you. I’ll be interested in the new paint.
Andy, thanks for another great video. You make education entertaining.
A couple of other things about using poly resin. 1) Polyester resin wets out fiberglass fabrics MUCH more easily and quickly than epoxy. That is a big factor when working on large surfaces. 2) Size matters. When you are laying a large surface area with new glass over old you have a lot of area for bonding. Even if the bond is a bit weaker, the large area means that you will still get significant total bond strength.
While epoxy provides a stronger secondary bond than than polyester, the total strength of the bond over many square feet will be adequate with either, particularly when you do multiple layers of glass like on the Bertram (where the second layer of 1708 is chemically bonded to the first layer). For a small patch the lesser bond strength of poly compared to epoxy could be an issue, particularly if the peel strength is a concern.
Well said Todd ;-)!
Great Content. My favorite boat channel on UA-cam! Keep it up! Brian
Great video Andy and I’m sure you’ll enjoy the trip down south. 👍
Hey Andy, love your videos, I've learned so much, and am looking forward to seeing your videos concerning the new paint.
By the way, I see your videos on Jamestown Distributers website as well. Every time I order from them, in the comment section, I mention that seeing you, and Lou from Tales from a Shipwright, led me to them, and seeing you two use their product encouraged me to use their products as well. I'm hoping that they in some way are sponsoring you guys.
I can't wait to see the Alexseal episode. I just got off the website and sounds like it's just what I'll be needing in the future on my DIY project.
This helped a lot with my upcoming Vanguard project.....glassing week after.....super cool stuff
Don't sweat the sailboat Andy, it is what it is, with that said, I do hope you can get started on your boat soon!
Looking forward for that field trip!
Hey Andy, another helpful video. Thanks a bunch. Looking forward to see how things go with Alexial.
Good luck with the trip Andy. Cant wait for the feedback. Des
Thanks for the quick response.
Great info packed episode. Now I know why I put PVA on poly resin :)
Hi Andy, I am super excited about your trip. I have been looking at the Alexseal paint ever since you mentioned it several videos ago. I have a huge project coming this spring, a 42 year old 23' Hirondelle sailing catamaran, that needs a full restoration. It was put on the hard 10 years ago after it hit a dock and did some damage to the starboard bow. The owner stripped all of the hardware to prep for repairs and paint, and that is where it sat. But at this point I feel like spring may never come here in Wisconsin, and unlike you I don't have a giant heated workspace. Snow, snow and more snow!
I hear ya, we're supposed to get another 6-9" today :-O!! This is the most plowing I've had to do in many years!
Yes. the northern counties are definitely getting more out of this one. It has mostly passed through here already and I think we got around 5" of heavy stuff. Think spring!
New don't now what to do,,, been watching for 2 or 3 weeks
Charleston has some great boat builders and restorers. If you get an extra day or two down there it would make for great extra content in interviews and looking at projects!
I remember building my first "tack & tape" boat, a Bolger Gypsy, following Dynamite Payson's instructions in "Build the new instant boats", and using polyester resin to fiberglass all the seams and the hull. Then, after reading some online comments, I became very uneasy because the prevailing opinion was that poly will fail and you should always use epoxy (which to me was unaffordable at the time). So, being very worried, I sent Dynamite a letter explaining what I read and essentially asking for confirmation that I had done the right thing. Several weeks later, my letter came back to me with his comments handwritten in the margins. Next to my question about the opinions stating that poly and ply does not make a good bond he wrote "Bull!". When I mentioned that the consensus is that the boat would not last, he wrote, "just hang on to it and see!", and regarding the much vaunted advantages of epoxy he wrote, "the epoxy people sure have done a great job of marketing their products, haven't they?". So there's another master's opinion. Well, I had that boat for three years, well used, then sold and came across it many years later, and can attest that aside from needing a new paint job that hull was as sound as ever. I do build in epoxy now, as it is undoubtedly superior for this type of construction, but poly is certainly not as bad as some think, and when you consider that the great majority of production boats are made of the stuff, with many very old ladies still giving hard service out there, surely polyester has proven its worth beyond any doubt.
Jack Rabbit , hi good story, I built a tack& tape plywood (1/4"BS1088) Kayak back in 1972! Polyester taped seams and varnish everywhere else.
My brother sent me pictures of the kayak that had been used and stored inside all its life. At least one refinishing but still holding together just fine.....go figure. See here. www.flickr.com/photos/143629100@N07/albums/72157705548972951 Cheers Warren
Poly vs Epox on the boat building forums are dejavu of the synthetic vs conventional oil debates on many of the car enthusiast forums 15-20 years ago. So many a dog pile bickerfests all started when it was often stated by an “expert” that NOT using syn will doom your car’s engine to an early demise. All the while many engines are racking up 300,000 miles with conventional oil just fine. It really does all comes down to marketing and what somebody else read somewhere on the internet.
Excellent explanation as always. Hope to see a future video with this new paint.
Andy, your videos have given me the motivation and confidence to go DIY and I thank you for the savings I will receive from it.
I have a question regarding a 22 aquasport and how to refinish the inside liner walls, cap, casting deck and floor deck. What is recommended for the liner? I understand paint has come a long way but it’s typical discussed about using it for topsides. How about the inside of the boat? Any input is greatly appreciated.
Great videos Andy, I have been using Alexseal for about 10 yrs now. It's a excellent product. To me it has the gloss and durability of Awlgrip and the ability to repair as Awlcraft. Spraying, roll and tipping work very well. I've also used all their primers with great success. Can't wait for you to try it, you'll going to love it. Thanks again for your videos.
Paul,
Where do you buy? How much is the paint and catalyst? Having a difficult time getting any answers to this question.
The guru has spoken!
Thanks for the xtra info on the processes... I said it before, thank you for approaching this from a layman’s DIY too. Cost is a huge factor especially when you start adding in specific tools needed along with the products. You do a great job at both ‘How too and DIY” instructions and yep there is a difference. Don’t beat yourself up on the content, remember weekly professional TV show has whole teams working on episodes from casting, content, editing and production...you’re a team of one 👍🏼.... (not a fan of the UA-cam commercials though 😜). Thanks Again
Very informative. I have a friend went to Roxol insulation. No videoing in the process areas. Only exterior of plant. They gave him enough insulation to do his house for free because he did a pretty nice video of the plant on his channel. Ooh there’s a thought.
Cool can not wait to see the paint video.
Soooo educational. Know what to do, then do it.
Great videos by the way! Very informative!
Used Awlgrip for the first rebuild but look forward to learning about Alexseal for the next in 5 - 6 years. I will say the Awlgrip is holding up well though. Thank you Andy
Not planing on painting any boats the next 10 years or so, loved the vid anyway!
Sprayed,brushed gallons of Alexseals stuff. Great product. Been to Awlgrips YPAC in Coco Beach. Rad experience
Always a good video, even this one !! Learn a lot here !!
I am going to enjoy hearing your review of Alexseal. I found it to be great to work with and the primer is the best primer I have ever used. It's awesome stuff... I shot Luana in my driveway.
Hi Andy, great explanation and summing up the basics of polyester again. Question regardings balance & weight: With adding more layers of polyester and fibre; how do you know the balance and weight of the boat remains within limits?
Hope you enjoy your trip here to Charleston! Take a drive by our flight line and see some HUGE composite hulls...787...LOL
Really interested to see what your thoughts will be on this new paint. It will be nice to know if it a good go to DIY paint; and if you can use the paint with soft sand. Great video and have a safe flight.
I CANT WAIT!!! Wonderful!!!
So happy i subscribed to this channel,im about to take on a stringer and deck rehash of my old 22ft speed boat, but also need to address the outside and your instruction on different products and how n when to use them has given me confidence to attempt such a project, thankyou again Andy, look so forward every week for new stuff keep up the amazing channel!
First of all thanks for the videos you’re the best on UA-cam for boat/fiberglass repair I restore old jet skis usually early Kawasaki stand ups my question is are the polyester resin on those or do you know I can’t seem to find any info but I been using epoxy for repairs and have not had any issues thanks again for sharing your knowledge with us
Most likely poly but can't say for sure. Would say 95% sure it's poly though :-)
In my experience of doing a 20 month refit on my 1970 Cal29 hull 163 the boat is poly and rock solid after 50 years BUT substantial sections of secondary bonding and bulkhead tabbing had either failed or were able to be peeled off
Was this boat just the one they slacked off on I will never know but I wasn’t going to worry about the 5 gallons of epoxy it took to square things away compared to the amount of work it was to prep everything
Painting
I paint bicycle frames with a SATA mini jet and when you mix a paint 2:1:1 you dealing with literally 4 oz of material and you can control your exposure as the mini is basically a big air brush
My next big project was painting my J24 mast with Perfection using the SATA MINI because it was marketed to the DIY but in reality there weren’t a lot of reducer options compared to Awlgrip but it was done indoors and came out fine
When it became time to paint the Cal 29 Alwgrip became the choice due much more factory support and reducers to as it was and outdoors tarp project
After spraying the 545 primer which is a dangerous but controllable hazard it became obvious spraying was out of the question due to the quantity of paint and health risks
So roll & Tip it was and 8 years later ever with Desert Tan being more likely to fade it hasn’t and the paint is just durable
At the end I used polyurethane Spies Hecker for automotive and work great!
Have you built a fiberglass plywood below the deck fuel tank?
Hi Andy. Just making a comment to help out
One other alternative for a roll and tip paint is gelcoat, thinned with 10% Duratek. The Duratek lets it flow out pretty well.
I was looking for an answer to this, so you can roll and tip gelcoat? Did you mean mix 10% duratec and then roll and tip or use the duratec to replace the tip?
Hi. Can I spray Awlgrip with a 27 gallon compressor with a max of 8.1 CFM at 40PSI with HVLP spray gun?
Great videos, you're my go to guy for all repair info. Quick question, When I look at a boat, how can I tell the difference between polyester and vinyl ester resins used in the construction?
I've painted all three of the sailboats I've owned with polyurethane paint. First two were with Awlgrip, which I though was great. The last one was Alexseal. In my opinion, Alexseal is much better. The gloss retention has lasted much longer than Awlgrip, and I was told by their rep there are more solids in Alexseal, so the coverage is better. I sprayed all three boats so that wasn't an issue. I haven't had to do a repair/repaint the Alexseal boat, so I can't comment on that aspect. But I will say if you plan on sanding and buffing it, it needs to be done fairly quickly after it's gone off, as it dries hard like glass and doesn't sand very easily if you wait a week.
Can you tell me how you prepped the Alexseal job. Pre sanded with what grit , primer used, number of coats etc.TKS ken
Done a lot of fiberglass work on top of houseboat roof using polyester resin, never covered it with anything until a few months later when I gel coat it. Should I be worried?
Two most over used things on most boat repairs.. epoxy & 3m 5200
Thanks for the defense of polyester glass!
I repaired some blisters on my Carver 3607 with poly and all I heard was " you should use West System " I couldn't understand why due to polyester did just fine for 25 years...it should be fine for another 25... Plus to this date I've never bought any 5200....
thanks
Glassmater please help, I'm using west system 105 and 205 to fix holes, cracks all over my boat.
My question is after fixing do I need to use something to seal the patches before I paint the boat ?
Or just use 105 and 205 then paint over it ?
Very helpful video as always Andy.I am curious if this new paint is friendly to aluminum.
Can you find out if you can use Alexseal over damaged Awlgrip?
Epifanes polyurethane two-part paint, opinion on it? I have used it on my 22ft searay, Boat rolled on with a 1/4'' nap 4"wide roller... going with it just because of its high gloss and was sand and buffable. pretty good results.
Hi I have questions, I’m doing the floors on my fibreglass boat, I have cut the marine plywood that I’m using for my floor, could you tell me how and what I need to seal it for waterproofing and if I need top layers or just resin on the ply wood
Andy: how did you get started repairing boats, and would you consider yourself more of a craftsman or an avid boater?
Was polyester resin used in the very early days of fiberglass? I have a 1959 Dyer 29 (hull no. 12) and I'm curious what they used.
Yes, pretty much exclusively!
Thank you @@boatworkstoday !
In Charleston, go to Husk for shrimp and grits.
I'll remember that! Thanks ;-)
Would you by chance be willing to maybe cover to some extent repairing cracks or damage to boats that have an outer skin made of Lauran S(acrylonitrile/styrene/acrylate)? I have been watching your show for a long time now and am happy that I ran into your channel I feel like I have learned a lot and the thought of taking on a project does not scare me nearly as much as it would have prior to me watching your shows.
My boat is a 2004 Hunter that I recently became the owner of and I have not seen anyone talk about doing a repair with Plexus.
why can't you buff or wet sand awlgrip? what bad things happen if you try it? just curious.
When Awlgrip cures the pigment settles to the bottom of the coating and a clear coat floats to the top. If the clear coat is removed by sanding or buffing it exposes the bare pigment which will quickly fade and dull :-(
Andy-I would love to use Alexseal on my project. Thanks for the info on the touch up on the AG. I did not know that downside man. If they are decent to you....otherwise I am gonna look further; thanks!
Have you don't a vide about how you add a drain plug to a boat? (Transom drain plug specifically) … ie. Is there a right and wrong way to install one?
For me cost is a third or fourth tier consideration. How much work and how well it will hold up are what I am looking at. I don't want to be doing it again in 3 years.
Hi Andy i’m looking into reinforcing my non skid deck on an old Aquasport with the same process you did in your last video, will it work with proper sanding? I also have one spill way through the center can i lay fiberglass over that? Thanks!
Aqua net hairspray=PVA in a pinch.
Anything that will keep oxygen off the surface in a pinch will work
Great vid Andy, thanks. I've long known about gelcoat with or without wax, but never really understood the why. My early attempts at polyester were frustrating so I just went to epoxy I guess. So putting the pieces together, when they call a product laminating gelcoat, it's intended use is to be applied directly to a mold and thus the mold will be sealing it from the air? Is that right? Oh and one last thing. Once your layup cures, do you remove the PVA? or just start sanding and it goes first?
There's a number of reasons for using a laminating resin but the jest is that it allows a person to add more material after the initial layup without having to sand the surface. Ex: layup glass over some damage one weekend, come back the following and you're able to pick up where you left off without having to sand. Once ready to sand then seal the surface (ie cure the material) and sanding will be a lot easier as the sandpaper will not gum up. PVA is water soluble so cleaning it off prior to sanding with warm water is all that's needed
Laminating resin does not have added wax so it retains a green (incompletely cured) surface so you can add additional layers of laminate without sanding, etc. You do need to seal it with something (waxed gel coat, paint, PVA) before it will cure completely. If you use PVA you need to completely remove it because it does not form a bond to the surface (you can peel it off if you lift an edge) and future layers of resin will not stick to it. Fortunately PVA is water soluble so you can wash it off. Just make sure you use enough water to completely remove it.
So if i ise PE resin for the repair i would be fine using a gel coat with wax additive? Both will cure good?
Hi, love your work and have taught me heaps, one question please, will Vinyl ester resin go off with out covering with PVA, Gelcoat etc, i have built a fuel tank and forgot to cover the last lay up on the inside of the tank, Thanks again.
Depends if the vinyl had wax mixed in. If not then it should be topcoated with something but given it's on the inside don't know how accessible it is now :-/
@@boatworkstoday It was unwaxed, the tank is part of the boat, i used the stringers as the sides and glassed a top and bottom in place, also theres a floor and centre console sitting over it know, it's been laid up for 6 months air tight?
damnit - you just gave away one of the last trade secrets!
You'll love working with alexseal. great products, great support.
Everyone I've talked with so far has been great! Looking forward to actually meeting them!!
I hope they let you record
Could u seal poly resin with ,for example bilge coat for engine bay,and if you sanded outside hull and rolled on rustoleum topside,my whole resto basically being done in a shelterlogic pop up garage,crude but only option i have right now lol?
Andy, I hope Topcoat offers you a contract and pays you A LOT of $$$$$ for plugging their product voluntarily. You're doing them an amazing service considering the audience you have, and advertising is never cheap nor should it be when it's being done by a very respectable source like yourself.
try i paint you can look them up on net i love it great paint and goood to work with and fix
Bahaha yeah I've learned from you and some others. Lots of time there's no need for the extra expense and work of going with epoxy on many repairs.
I was one of those last week that asked about laying new polyester over old polyester fiberglass. I believe I got my negative information about it from watching other channels documenting covering up through-hulls on sailboats. They recommended using epoxy patches to cover over/remove through-hulls in polyester hull was the solution and not polyester patches. So if your creating 12" circular patches over 1/2 - 1 1/2 thick hulls to close up 2 - 3 inch holes bored in polyester fiberglass hulls do you think polyester will work? 'Yea' or 'Nay' to this comment would be appreciated since I plan on doing it shortly. I would like a professional opinion on it whether to save money using polyester or the more expensive epoxy for that work. Thank you as always for being attentive to these comments!
Poly will absolutely work :-) People have been doing repairs like that for decades! Only thing I would add is that since the repair would be below the waterline it would be a good idea to add some kind of an epoxy coating simply for blister prevention. It's technically not needed, but more of a Belt And Suspenders precaution. This could be doing the final fairing with thickened epoxy or by rolling on an epoxy barrier coat
Thanks so much for the response. I appreciate and my Wallet especially appreciates it! :) ;)
Hi really enjoy your content and presentation, have learnt a lot.
Just wondering if you have had any experience with crack repair with Luran S ASA plastic, I own a Hunter 216 sailboat with some crack that is more cosmetic than structural integrity, but your thoughts on repairing this would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Not familiar with that, what's it used for on your boat (molded cabinets?)
@@boatworkstoday It is the outer surface (skin) of the deck, there is no structural integrity issue, strictly cosmetic there is a blog ( forums.sailboatowners.com/index.php?threads/plastic-hunter-crack-repair.192123/ there are some pictures in this blog of the typical cracks) with a variety of attempts to repair, just thought you may have some experience with products that actually work and how to finish it off to look beautiful like so many of your projects.,
can l use epoxy on polyester or do l need something between?
I would like to mill the hull of my boat (IP 26 cutter) down to the polyester fabric and rebuild it with epoxy
and a ghost foil as reinforcement
epoxy overtop poly is perfectly fine. Just be sure that the surface is clean and well sanded for adhesion. You'll need to finish with paint and not gelcoat then
@@boatworkstoday thank you for your quick answer
Whats wrong with interlux perfection? Ive had great results rolling and tipping that product.
Nothing wrong with it, it's just not designed to be wetsanded and buffed for future repairs (much like Awlgrip) :-)
I've always wondered why not use a car paint instead of a marine paint. We all know anything with marine attached is more expensive. Cars get wet, stay out in the sun and snow so the paint does weather just fine. Maybe its the flexing of the fiberglass that precludes car paint but cars have painted plastic bumpers and the bumpers fles and the paint does peel.
Some manufacturers do use automotive paint. The only down side is that they typically require a clear coat over the base coat, making it more difficult to repair down the road
@@boatworkstoday Deltron DCC is a single stage acrylic urethane.
How do you handle amine blusse with West System Epoxy? Enjoy your videos, thanks.
Warm water and scotchbright pad :-) Dry with clean towel and blush is gone ;-)
Why do people not use Automotive paint either single stage or Base and clear coat? Would seem much easier to apply and maintain.
Brian Pitts The simple answer is you can. Base clear on a boat requires same prep work as a single stage like Awlgrip.
I am sure you have covered this in the past, but can you compare gel coat versus paint for DIY. (𝑀𝑎𝑑𝑠 𝑜𝑣𝑒𝑟 𝑜𝑛 𝑆𝑎𝑖𝑙 𝐿𝑖𝑓𝑒 𝑐ℎ𝑜𝑠𝑒 𝑚𝑢𝑙𝑡𝑖𝑝𝑙𝑒 𝑐𝑜𝑎𝑡𝑠 𝑜𝑓 𝑝𝑎𝑖𝑛𝑡 𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑏𝑢𝑓𝑓𝑖𝑛𝑔. 𝐻𝑒 𝑔𝑜𝑡 𝑣𝑒𝑟𝑦 𝑔𝑜𝑜𝑑 𝑟𝑒𝑠𝑢𝑙𝑡𝑠.)
Yup, ua-cam.com/video/X3XwvsorsYw/v-deo.html
You mentioned 1 paint can be rolled 1 can only be sprayed. Why is that? is one really thin only for a gun? And would all run off a paint roller? I would think if it would spray on and stick i would think you can roll it on and it would stick but im no expert lol thats why im wondering. why?
It's dependent on the resin base whether it can be rolled and or sprayed. Awlgrip and Awlcraft are 2 different bases
Seven out of ten marine gremlins prefer the taste of polyester resin over epoxy. Isn't that the best reason to stick to epoxy resins?
Typically the Gremlins are taking advantage of old, failed bedding compound; really has nothing to do with the resin used in the glass ;-)
😮😮
Fifteen years not using products sure makes you think 🤔 😮😮
Hard to feather.
How about Perfection. paint.
Unfortunately not intended to be sanded or buffed. It's quite similar to Awlgrip :-/
Do you have any comments on this Interlux product. Positive or negative. Can it be buffed?
@@boatworkstoday Thank you. That's what I thought.
@@johntripp2028 , I've used it alot. The two part paint is a no buff no sanding paint.. the single is a sand and buff type, it even touches up nice.
I've done 3 boats in Perfection and one deck in the brightsides buffable. I'll take the perfection or other similar two parts paints every time. Much harder resistance to scratches, smoother finish, longer lasting gloss ect. I and a few customers were all more than satisfied with the intermix perfection. It's been about 9 years since the first paint job and the current owner says it's still looking great and glossy. I can't wait to try Alexseal though. A two part that's buffable is the best of both worlds.
And E over P, never P over E.
I have to laugh about the whole epoxy vs PE resin debate. It all stems from laypeople that want to know 'what's the best material to use?' Yes the marketing on epoxy is far more wide reaching and known in applications far beyond boat building/repair. Lets face it, working with epoxy in general is FAR safer than PE resin because you can be a real newbie and not burn the house down or have severe personal injury if you do something ill advised. You let some of the inexperienced people fool around with MEKP the way they do with epoxy....and watch what happens.
I was surprised you didn't get into PE resin vs epoxy and the binders in fiberglass, and why the majority of boats are therefore built using PE resin (aside from cost).
As for new PE over old, chances are the people who had that trouble just got themselves into some trouble. Prep is definitely important. The reason people swear by epoxy IMHO is because it is a relatively safe bet if you don't know what is underneath. If a poly hull had some repairs done with epoxy and you try to apply PE resin over the epoxy.... well yeah it ain't gonna work out for you that well so the safe bet is the expensive epoxy route. Hence the epoxy group that stand by their conviction. To know what to use when and where requires a greater level of knowledge and experience. I appreciate your channel for clarifying a lot of questions out there as there is a lot of misinformation floating around there.
8 minutes in and I'm more confused than when I started. Too much jumping around. Need to organized the process of instructing.
are you getting divorced??
No, why?
Wow where did that come from?