Hi Joel. You spliced my work into your review! By that I mean the snippets of the cut scenes from the PC Game. I was co-designer and executive producer of the Star Wars Rebellion PC game (1998). Thank you for mentioning FFG product's lineage and similarities to the PC game. I was pleased to see the FF kept the character/leaders and the missions to which they may be deployed at the game's core. When the PC game came out, I believe it was the first to integrate characters and missions within a grand strategy game. Yours was a very good review of the board game.
+Doug Mogica Thanks for commenting Doug. I'm glad you (sort of) just confirmed that the two were linked. I haven't read every piece of news on the game, but there was rampant speculation that the board game took inspiration from your game. It's a fascinating approach to this style of game. One thing "epic strategy" games sometimes miss out on is the importance of the extraordinary individuals that play a large role in a large scale conflict. Oddly enough, the other board game that does this well (War of the Ring) is also based on a work of fiction.
+Drive Thru Review To clarify, the FFG game is a completely independent project and is not linked to the PC game in any way other than what may have been some inspiration at FFG from the PC game's design. I have no affiliation to FFG nor did I contribute to their Star Wars Rebellion game. What FFG may have chosen or not chosen as ideas to incorporate from the PC game was their creative choice. FFG has said the name "Star Wars Rebellion" was an homage to the PC game. Designs on the same topics may tend to use similar mechanisms and emphasize some of the same things. The key design elements of the PC game aside from building and deploying hardware assets, were the hidden, movable Rebel Base, major characters and their missions, and planetary loyalty.
Land combat in SW Rebellion was abstracted. It would compare your # of troops with those on the planet and tell you who won. The Empire at War game had 3D ground combat.
Best review I've seen in a long time, very often I skip the rules explanations but here they were not only informative but also engaging. Thank you good sir!
Great review. I think many people were expecting this game to be similar to war of the ring, but in the Star Wars universe. Your review validates those assumptions while also highlighting its unique mechanisms. I can't wait to try it
This game is more like a themed mod to Twilight Imperium (TI). TI is for 6 players competing to become emperor of the universe. TI is not so similar in the goal, but it has many of the same mechanics of Rebellion, like objective cards, missions, etc. The problem of TI is that it requires 6 players and the difference is that the core of the game of TI is diplomacy and alliances between players, while in Rebellion it has assymetric victory conditions.
Most helpful review I've seen for this game. Very detailed, well thought out, and clearly communicated. Really appreciate you putting in the time to explain the rules and share your thoughts.
I love how you make that comparison to Twilight Struggle. I haven't played Rebellion, but have played TS a dozen times. At heart I'm very much a euro gamer, but TS scratches a very specific itch with me. It's a masterfully crafted balancing act, with so much psychological warfare. It's almost chess-like. The first thing I hoped for when I heard about Rebellion was a TS alternative set in the Star Wars universe. I'm glad this is a very different game, I wouldn't care for a outright copy of TS (is that even possible?). But I love that at least some of that TS feeling for me is apparant in this game. Can't wait till next week, I'm guessing I'll get it for my birthday. Thanks for the great review.
Playing this now with my 10 year old son -- his words -- "this game is awesome, until combat brings it to a grinding halt." That was until you explained the use of combat dice way better than the rules book. Thanks very much for putting this video up -- your explanation of the rules and combat in particular is very helpful. We are going to be enjoying this game for a good long while. :)
The intro was from Star Wars: Rebellion, the computer game, wasn't it? ALSO: Mistake in setting up. All Empire Worlds should start with at least 1 ground unit on it, regardless of whether it is Loyal/Subjugated. In addition, any Subjugated world WITHOUT a ground soldier on it loses it's subjugation.
There is a great app in the play store for the build and probe book keeping called "rebellion assistant" and its free. Just informative mentioned. Great review!
Star Wars: Rebellion has a strong theme. Game creates stories that one remembers long after the game is played. Narrows escapes, everything hanging on the thread before that thing that turns the situation around. Great game indeed. We just played this one with my co-host who had never played anything else than Hungry Hippos or Monopoly. Dude is huge Star Wars fan. It was a great experience for him and we got some fun, fresh view for our footage.
I bought the expansion. In my last game, Mon Mothma was captured and turned to the dark side by Palpatine despite the best efforts of rebels. And General Dodona was captured. The Death star blew a Mon Calamari ship. I have not managed to destroy an entire planet yet with the Death Star, but I did a single reactor ignition and wiped out Rebel forces on a planet. The empire won. In the game before that, Rebels destroyed an AT-AT using a single snowspeeder and all remaining troopers were defeated by the snowspeeder in a humiliating way. Luke went to Dagobah but he was captured by Boba Fett and brought him to an imperial system, and Han went to rescue him. There was a big battle at Naboo and Admiral Ackbar hit my fleet badly and I lost 2 Star Destroyers in a humiliating defeat. I almost found the base twice, but Rebels won as they got enough reputation.
Great review! Can you explain a little bit more what do you think about replayability of this game? I mean, there are some limited objectives, so how many plays do you think you can have before knowing them all? Also, what do you think of the balance between a very expert player (having played 10 times maybe and knowing all the objectives of the Empire and the Rebeles) and a new one? Are there any ways to balance this to make a good experience for the new player? And the last one, how much the game changes with 4 players? Is it a better game? I'm used to play with 3 or 4 people, never with 2, would I be missing a lot of the game (cause it seems more like a 2 player Empire vs Rebels thing)?
I'm a big fan of imperial assault and axis and allies. This seems like a perfect mix of both. Speaking of imperial assault your review was one than convinced me to get it
That was an excellent review of the game Joel. I've watched a few now which have either been a bit too 'over-excited fanboy' or just looking for faults, but yours hit the right middle ground. Told me exactly what I wanted to know and made me really look forward to my first play. Incidentally would you recommend the least experienced player take Imperials or Rebels for the first game?
+parsdunk That's an interesting question. I don't know that it really matters. I would ask yourself if you would rather play Mr. X or Dracula in Scotland Yard/Fury of Dracula or if you'd rather play the hunters.
this game can be so fun to capture heroes as the empire. one game Boba Fett captured Luke Skywalker on dagobah, han Solo turned to the dark side, and chewbacca was frozen in carbonite. the rebel player has no fire power I was able to destroy their whole fleet
Hey Joel! I just played the game for the first time and I loved it but I was thinking about this strategy. If instead of using the missions you just concentrate in moving you troops with your leaders to find the base. Wouldn't that be faster? Do you think is viable?
Definitely, but letting the rebels run roughshod with their missions and ignoring the bonuses from your own...it's tempting... but I've definitely seen players spread way out too early.
@@alejandrolozano1258 Honestly, it's been a little while since we've played this one. Pandemic threw off our game nights and it's not hit the table since 2019, so my memories are pretty fuzzy. But, from my recollection the pull of those missions is too strong to just ignore.
What has worked for me is to capture leaders and trying to subjugate as many systems as possible to find the rebel base and cut rebel production to limit their forces. That leaves few options to move the base too. It has to be done quickly because moving forces to attack the rebel base takes time, and imperials have limited time.
This will be FFG's first new game post ANA pricing shenanigans. Is this game really worth the $100 price point? i'm not talking about the value of $100 so much as the value of this game versus 2 or 3 other games?
+Maui Chris Very hard to say until it happens, but it can be had right now for ~70$ online. My FLGS will sell for $100 MSRP, but they have 15% discount for their loyal customers so that's about 85$. I mean other games in the $100 range are The Gallerist, Empires: Age of Discovery, Food Chain Magnate. This certainly holds up in comparison to those games... imo.
Would you say that this is closer to Twilight Struggle or War of the Ring? I enjoy TS for how the events play out in different ways, but felt like WotR was too combat-centric.
Mom and I are taking a break from our second match of this game. She is not good at it but she nearly won the first one. My rebel base is on Dantooine.The battle of Madalore is coming and if I take out the Death Star and that blasted star destroyer I should win the game. Pesonel Me:Mon Mothma, Leia, Jon Dodona, General Rieeken, (Jedi) Luke, Chewbacca, Obi-Wan Kenobi (Noble Sacrificed), and Lando. Mom:Darth Vader, Emperor Palpitene, Grand Moff Tarkin, General Tagge, Boba Fett, Moff Jerjerrod, Admiral Ozzel, and Colonel Yularen.
As much as I want to immerse myself in the epic space battles of Star Wars... The mechanics in this game just aren't there for me. I guess i'm just not a Corey Konieczka fan. Looks like I'm sticking to Imperial Assault.
Ugh. I don't know. They are both really different. Rebellion is off in it's own world, but Forbidden Stars competes more with Eclipse and other games... but not really also. It's not really a 4x. It's like Dudes on a Map but in space and not on the ground. So, it competes more with Nexus Ops or Cry Havoc... but it's in space... so not really :)
Hey how does compare to the video game of the same name (Star Wars Rebellion by Lucas Arts) or was it called Star Wars Supremacy I can't remember it was that long ago.
It was very much inspired by that video game is my understanding. While the games play drastically different, I can definitely see the lineage. (It was also called Rebellion).
Hey Joel - For lineage, rather than the Rebellion video game, look to the late 70's Avalon Hill game 'Freedom in the Galaxy' which was, ironically, a blatant ripoff of the epic style of Star Wars and actually calls the factions the 'Rebels' and the 'Empire'. Thematically, it shares the tale of a small band of hidden rebels, smugglers, and spies trying to sabotage the evil Empire while still trying to stay undiscovered. Mechanically, it has the Empire seeking to discover the Rebel base and the Rebels sending agents on missions to try and ruin the Empire's plans, exactly as Rebellion does. Freedom in the Galaxy was one of those AH games that might not have actually been play tested because it was completely unbalanced and took way too long for what your experience actually was--the 'full' campaign was something like 20 hours long!. It sounds like Rebellion fixes those issues and make a more enjoyable, streamlined experience.
+Jason Foss Interesting sounding game. If you scroll down a bit, there are some comments confirming the lineage (albeit loosely) with the Rebellion PC game.
+Drive Thru Review, I saw that and I felt his comments view it more as an homage than true lineage. Seriously, download and read through one of the rules compilations for FITG on BGG and you'll see what I'm talking about.
+Jason Foss Thanks for your comment. To me what is most interesting is that neither Scott Witte (other Rebellion PC designer) nor myself had played nor seen "Freedom in the Galaxy" (although being an AH wargamer, I was aware of it) yet independently, we apparently came to several similar design choices for our games. To this day, I still have not seen nor played FitG.
Hi Joel. You spliced my work into your review! By that I mean the snippets of the cut scenes from the PC Game. I was co-designer and executive producer of the Star Wars Rebellion PC game (1998). Thank you for mentioning FFG product's lineage and similarities to the PC game. I was pleased to see the FF kept the character/leaders and the missions to which they may be deployed at the game's core. When the PC game came out, I believe it was the first to integrate characters and missions within a grand strategy game. Yours was a very good review of the board game.
+Doug Mogica Thanks for commenting Doug. I'm glad you (sort of) just confirmed that the two were linked. I haven't read every piece of news on the game, but there was rampant speculation that the board game took inspiration from your game. It's a fascinating approach to this style of game. One thing "epic strategy" games sometimes miss out on is the importance of the extraordinary individuals that play a large role in a large scale conflict. Oddly enough, the other board game that does this well (War of the Ring) is also based on a work of fiction.
+Drive Thru Review To clarify, the FFG game is a completely independent project and is not linked to the PC game in any way other than what may have been some inspiration at FFG from the PC game's design. I have no affiliation to FFG nor did I contribute to their Star Wars Rebellion game. What FFG may have chosen or not chosen as ideas to incorporate from the PC game was their creative choice. FFG has said the name "Star Wars Rebellion" was an homage to the PC game. Designs on the same topics may tend to use similar mechanisms and emphasize some of the same things. The key design elements of the PC game aside from building and deploying hardware assets, were the hidden, movable Rebel Base, major characters and their missions, and planetary loyalty.
+Doug Mogica Great. Thanks for the clarification!
I wasted many an hour crushing the pathetic rebellion in that old game. Wish it had come out during the era where online play was possible.
Land combat in SW Rebellion was abstracted. It would compare your # of troops with those on the planet and tell you who won. The Empire at War game had 3D ground combat.
Man, you do the smartest reviews. The first 20 words you said told me more about this game than any full review of this game currently online.
+Javier Perez Hah... Thanks.... "Hey everybody. Welcome to Drive Thru Review number 480"? :p hehe
Best review I've seen in a long time, very often I skip the rules explanations but here they were not only informative but also engaging. Thank you good sir!
+Mikolaj Witkowski Thanks Mikolaj.
This is the most concise walk through on UA-cam. Thanks for the hard work. Love your videos.
+Eric Finley Thank you Eric.
Had to comment... Love when you do this. I can see the effort.
+Sirbob Games Thanks Alex.
Great review. I think many people were expecting this game to be similar to war of the ring, but in the Star Wars universe. Your review validates those assumptions while also highlighting its unique mechanisms. I can't wait to try it
This game is more like a themed mod to Twilight Imperium (TI). TI is for 6 players competing to become emperor of the universe. TI is not so similar in the goal, but it has many of the same mechanics of Rebellion, like objective cards, missions, etc. The problem of TI is that it requires 6 players and the difference is that the core of the game of TI is diplomacy and alliances between players, while in Rebellion it has assymetric victory conditions.
Best review I've seen of this game. Great job!
Thank you sir! I appreciate the thought.
Most helpful review I've seen for this game. Very detailed, well thought out, and clearly communicated. Really appreciate you putting in the time to explain the rules and share your thoughts.
+Thomas Wang Thanks Thomas. I appreciate it.
Thomas Wang ii
I want this even more now. Pre ordered it in late January. It may well be another couple of months before it arrives here in Sweden.
Perfect review. I love the detail in your reviews. :)
I love how you make that comparison to Twilight Struggle. I haven't played Rebellion, but have played TS a dozen times. At heart I'm very much a euro gamer, but TS scratches a very specific itch with me. It's a masterfully crafted balancing act, with so much psychological warfare. It's almost chess-like. The first thing I hoped for when I heard about Rebellion was a TS alternative set in the Star Wars universe. I'm glad this is a very different game, I wouldn't care for a outright copy of TS (is that even possible?). But I love that at least some of that TS feeling for me is apparant in this game. Can't wait till next week, I'm guessing I'll get it for my birthday. Thanks for the great review.
Playing this now with my 10 year old son -- his words -- "this game is awesome, until combat brings it to a grinding halt." That was until you explained the use of combat dice way better than the rules book. Thanks very much for putting this video up -- your explanation of the rules and combat in particular is very helpful. We are going to be enjoying this game for a good long while. :)
"When" I become a Billionaire I will hire Joel on Salary to be my rules reader.
The intro was from Star Wars: Rebellion, the computer game, wasn't it?
ALSO: Mistake in setting up. All Empire Worlds should start with at least 1 ground unit on it, regardless of whether it is Loyal/Subjugated. In addition, any Subjugated world WITHOUT a ground soldier on it loses it's subjugation.
+Llamad Mow It was from the computer game. Nice catch there on setup. I should have paid more attention to what I was putting on the board.
There is a great app in the play store for the build and probe book keeping called "rebellion assistant" and its free. Just informative mentioned. Great review!
Oh nice. I'll check it out.
just got this game yesterday and played it, loved the hell out of this
now play twillight imperium 3 :)
+neil armstrong I have a group that gets together about every 6 months to play Twilight Imperium 3. another great game
TI3 is epic (hard to get the 6 players for the time needed)
+neil armstrong that's why my game group is awesome
Star Wars: Rebellion has a strong theme. Game creates stories that one remembers long after the game is played. Narrows escapes, everything hanging on the thread before that thing that turns the situation around. Great game indeed. We just played this one with my co-host who had never played anything else than Hungry Hippos or Monopoly. Dude is huge Star Wars fan. It was a great experience for him and we got some fun, fresh view for our footage.
I bought the expansion. In my last game, Mon Mothma was captured and turned to the dark side by Palpatine despite the best efforts of rebels. And General Dodona was captured. The Death star blew a Mon Calamari ship. I have not managed to destroy an entire planet yet with the Death Star, but I did a single reactor ignition and wiped out Rebel forces on a planet. The empire won.
In the game before that, Rebels destroyed an AT-AT using a single snowspeeder and all remaining troopers were defeated by the snowspeeder in a humiliating way. Luke went to Dagobah but he was captured by Boba Fett and brought him to an imperial system, and Han went to rescue him. There was a big battle at Naboo and Admiral Ackbar hit my fleet badly and I lost 2 Star Destroyers in a humiliating defeat. I almost found the base twice, but Rebels won as they got enough reputation.
Great review! Can you explain a little bit more what do you think about replayability of this game? I mean, there are some limited objectives, so how many plays do you think you can have before knowing them all? Also, what do you think of the balance between a very expert player (having played 10 times maybe and knowing all the objectives of the Empire and the Rebeles) and a new one? Are there any ways to balance this to make a good experience for the new player? And the last one, how much the game changes with 4 players? Is it a better game? I'm used to play with 3 or 4 people, never with 2, would I be missing a lot of the game (cause it seems more like a 2 player Empire vs Rebels thing)?
+fran arce Did you watch the last portion of the review? :)
I'm a big fan of imperial assault and axis and allies. This seems like a perfect mix of both. Speaking of imperial assault your review was one than convinced me to get it
Just bought this, I've yet to play yet, but he has explained the rules rather well.
That was an excellent review of the game Joel. I've watched a few now which have either been a bit too 'over-excited fanboy' or just looking for faults, but yours hit the right middle ground. Told me exactly what I wanted to know and made me really look forward to my first play. Incidentally would you recommend the least experienced player take Imperials or Rebels for the first game?
+parsdunk That's an interesting question. I don't know that it really matters. I would ask yourself if you would rather play Mr. X or Dracula in Scotland Yard/Fury of Dracula or if you'd rather play the hunters.
Excellent review!
this game can be so fun to capture heroes as the empire. one game Boba Fett captured Luke Skywalker on dagobah, han Solo turned to the dark side, and chewbacca was frozen in carbonite. the rebel player has no fire power I was able to destroy their whole fleet
Sounds awesome. Good stuff!
Hey Joel! I just played the game for the first time and I loved it but I was thinking about this strategy.
If instead of using the missions you just concentrate in moving you troops with your leaders to find the base. Wouldn't that be faster? Do you think is viable?
Definitely, but letting the rebels run roughshod with their missions and ignoring the bonuses from your own...it's tempting... but I've definitely seen players spread way out too early.
@@DriveThruReview Have you tried it?
@@alejandrolozano1258 Honestly, it's been a little while since we've played this one. Pandemic threw off our game nights and it's not hit the table since 2019, so my memories are pretty fuzzy. But, from my recollection the pull of those missions is too strong to just ignore.
@@DriveThruReview It's hard to keep playing de the same one. Thanks Joel!
What has worked for me is to capture leaders and trying to subjugate as many systems as possible to find the rebel base and cut rebel production to limit their forces. That leaves few options to move the base too. It has to be done quickly because moving forces to attack the rebel base takes time, and imperials have limited time.
agree with others, best review and how to play on this game. keep up good work!
Thank you sir.
+Drive Thru Review just curious, will you be attending origins game fair this year?
+Brad DiMond How I wish. I do plan on trying to attend in 2017.
now that's a review!
This will be FFG's first new game post ANA pricing shenanigans. Is this game really worth the $100 price point? i'm not talking about the value of $100 so much as the value of this game versus 2 or 3 other games?
+Maui Chris Very hard to say until it happens, but it can be had right now for ~70$ online. My FLGS will sell for $100 MSRP, but they have 15% discount for their loyal customers so that's about 85$. I mean other games in the $100 range are The Gallerist, Empires: Age of Discovery, Food Chain Magnate. This certainly holds up in comparison to those games... imo.
+Drive Thru Review Food Chain Magnate is another game though that has a rather questionable price :D
Love your reviews m8.... Putting theme aside.... If someone wanted a good space conflict board game.... This or Forbidden Stars?
+Si Teal This is a different beast from your traditional combat heavy space (4x-ish) style game. I'd say it depends on what you want from the game.
Would you say that this is closer to Twilight Struggle or War of the Ring? I enjoy TS for how the events play out in different ways, but felt like WotR was too combat-centric.
+newkillerstar26 Probably closer to War of the Ring honestly.
Mom and I are taking a break from our second match of this game. She is not good at it but she nearly won the first one. My rebel base is on Dantooine.The battle of Madalore is coming and if I take out the Death Star and that blasted star destroyer I should win the game. Pesonel Me:Mon Mothma, Leia, Jon Dodona, General Rieeken, (Jedi) Luke, Chewbacca, Obi-Wan Kenobi (Noble Sacrificed), and Lando. Mom:Darth Vader, Emperor Palpitene, Grand Moff Tarkin, General Tagge, Boba Fett, Moff Jerjerrod, Admiral Ozzel, and Colonel Yularen.
Just realized that I put my leaders the same order they were recruited and for the Empire the opposite.
This creates memories of family time. It makes my day. At this time your post is 7 years old. How does it feel to have these memories today?
would a expansion be possible?
+jace76ful I think so.
When does this release?
+Rolando Orozco Next week... I think.
+Drive Thru Review Awesome.
As much as I want to immerse myself in the epic space battles of Star Wars... The mechanics in this game just aren't there for me. I guess i'm just not a Corey Konieczka fan. Looks like I'm sticking to Imperial Assault.
I must be spoiled by your good reviews... I forgot to say thank you Joel!
+woehrle17 No worries. Thank you for taking the time to comment! :)
star wars rebellion or forbidden stars??
Ugh. I don't know. They are both really different. Rebellion is off in it's own world, but Forbidden Stars competes more with Eclipse and other games... but not really also. It's not really a 4x. It's like Dudes on a Map but in space and not on the ground. So, it competes more with Nexus Ops or Cry Havoc... but it's in space... so not really :)
Hey how does compare to the video game of the same name (Star Wars Rebellion by Lucas Arts) or was it called Star Wars Supremacy I can't remember it was that long ago.
It was very much inspired by that video game is my understanding. While the games play drastically different, I can definitely see the lineage. (It was also called Rebellion).
Hey Joel - For lineage, rather than the Rebellion video game, look to the late 70's Avalon Hill game 'Freedom in the Galaxy' which was, ironically, a blatant ripoff of the epic style of Star Wars and actually calls the factions the 'Rebels' and the 'Empire'. Thematically, it shares the tale of a small band of hidden rebels, smugglers, and spies trying to sabotage the evil Empire while still trying to stay undiscovered. Mechanically, it has the Empire seeking to discover the Rebel base and the Rebels sending agents on missions to try and ruin the Empire's plans, exactly as Rebellion does. Freedom in the Galaxy was one of those AH games that might not have actually been play tested because it was completely unbalanced and took way too long for what your experience actually was--the 'full' campaign was something like 20 hours long!. It sounds like Rebellion fixes those issues and make a more enjoyable, streamlined experience.
+Jason Foss Interesting sounding game. If you scroll down a bit, there are some comments confirming the lineage (albeit loosely) with the Rebellion PC game.
+Drive Thru Review, I saw that and I felt his comments view it more as an homage than true lineage. Seriously, download and read through one of the rules compilations for FITG on BGG and you'll see what I'm talking about.
👍
+Jason Foss Thanks for your comment. To me what is most interesting is that neither Scott Witte (other Rebellion PC designer) nor myself had played nor seen "Freedom in the Galaxy" (although being an AH wargamer, I was aware of it) yet independently, we apparently came to several similar design choices for our games. To this day, I still have not seen nor played FitG.
Only 6 more month until this comes to Germany -.-