From the original creator and scientist behind the chimpanzee mirror video: ""Find over 100 videos of wildlife encounters with giant mirrors installed in the jungle of Gabon (Central Africa) filmed by Xavier HUBERT-BRIERRE, his wife Anne-Marie and their friend Michel Djomou Guiss: ua-cam.com/users/XHB06400CANNESvideos After watching each of these videos, please read the description attached to learn more about the behaviour of wild animals when faced with their reflection." We highly recommend you watching these fascinating videos!
This is the single most impressive break down and exploration of bloodborns story I have seen. It makes perfect sense that the brain of mencas is literally the brain of the moon, the moon presence. Great work!
Point of order: killing Rom doesn't cause the Blood Moon, it reveals that it has always been there. Miyazaki said in an interview that they deliberately put a message in Yaharghul that said "Behold! A Paleblood sky!" in a place where you could see it before and after killing Rom as a hint to players that the red moon was always there, Rom was just hiding it. Furthermore, many of the notes that refer to "ritual secrets" say in the original Japanese "ritual concealment".
He said killing Rom was necessary for the School of Mensis to beckon the moon, but they've already done that. Rom was just covering up their work, not preventing it from happening. I suppose you could argue that Rom was hindering Mensis by not letting them see what they were doing, but based on the mummified bodies and the complex landscape of the Nightmare of Mensis, I'd say they've been doing what they were doing for a while. The changes to Yaharghul after the red moon appears are probably just the result of time passing.
He addresses this 24:50 To be fair, the ritual is ongoing and though the moon is there already, it cant seem to fully take effect in our plane until Rom is defeated.
To me, this makes the narrative of the brain and the ritual's success more compelling. Mensis conducted their ritual and succeeded. Rom simply concealed that success.
Mercury is a big part of BB. We use quicksilver (mercury) bullets, which we can make using our own blood indicating that our blood contains mercury. "Madness" is also a symptom of mercury poisoning.
Mercury was an ancient medical treatment for thousands of years, mostly for infections as it had a very limited effect in the same way chemotherapy can for cancer, killing harmful cells slightly faster than other cells. Still not great and generally led to other life shortening issues but not totally ineffective as people think, still something to be avoided and dangerous though.
I think the reason the brain gives Moon is more-so because the description makes mention of Great Ones responding when called out to. The rune it gives isn't necessarily indicative of it's essence, it's something it's SAYING. You don't get the rune from killing it, you get it from Making Contact, and with runes being transcriptions of "the inhuman utterings" of Great Ones, it seems much more likely to me to take Moon as something the brain is saying in response to you. Maybe it's being used as a greeting because the description paints a benevolent image of Great Ones, or perhaps it recognizes you as being associated with the Moon Presence through the Hunter's Dream.
Hm, maybe. I think the thing that is unanswered is, what is our call? What is the meaning of the gesture? Are we saying "Hi." And it responds with Moon? Are we saying "Moon." And it responds with mimicry? Or, are we giving a kind of introduction? "My name is..." If we are introducing ourselves, it's possible that the brain is introducing itself. Which would mean it calls itself Moon. I don't really have a strong view on this. But I think there's at least a strong case to be made that the brain is some manifestation of the Moon Presence even with everything you mentioned being true. This sort of thing is well in line with Lovecraft. With various entities have multiple ways of appearing depending on context and even having different names in these manifestations.
The Moon Rune is supposedly an indicator of the Moon's sympathy with Hunters, and desire for them to collect more Blood Echoes. As such, the word itself doesn't necessarily mean the Moon so much as it means the Moon's blessing... Something the Brain is somehow capable of giving.
I love your theory about Mergo being bait for the School of Mensis! I do think there is another very likely reason the Mensis brain gives you the "Moon" rune - it's naming you. As a hunter, you are a hunter FOR the Moon Presence - ironically, the School of Mensis DID manage to get the Moon Presence's attention, but by the Moon Presence sending a hunter to hunt Mergo rather than adopt it. The Brain of Mensis recognizes this and responds with what you are / who you work for.
Just want to mention that killing Rom doesn't cause Mergo to start crying, it only allows you to hear the crying at any insight. Before you kill Rom, you can still hear Mergo's cries if you have 90 insight. Also implying that the ritual has always been going on behind the scenes
@@AssailantLFBut he didn't though. Around minute 25 is where that subject is touched on, and he says killing Rom is required to fully beckon the moon (revealed to all regardless of insight) and we "hear" Mergo's cries. Not that killing Rom "causes" Mergo to start crying, just that they can be heard. He also makes it clear that the Mensis ritual using Mergo to beckon the moon has been going on for long enough that the physical bodies of the school of Mensis have desiccated. If this is about not mentioning that X insight let's you hear the cries early, then that seems a minor thing that doesn't weaken the theory provided.
Don’t forget also that the “Make Contact” gesture can be interpreted as gesturing the x and y axes of two mirrored isosceles triangles, as per your earlier discussion of mathematics and optics.
@@costanzazacchi6498Wasn't it meant to proof to the other party that you're an "advanced" species because the gesture shows that you have an understanding of mathematics and must therefore be self-conscious? I think that's what I remember.
@@TheOneGreat Similar ideas! I also liken the fact that you obtain the moon rune when you complete the gesture as a bit of a nod to the dual nature of the moon presence, if that’s what the mensis brain is. In one reality, the mensis is all brain; but the flip side of that is only body, an incomplete great one. Maybe that’s why the moon presence you fight in the end of the game has no face?
I see it as the hunter mimicking a bell. The hunter's mark looks like a bell and the hunter moving their arms the way they do looks like a bell ringing. And considering bells can reach across worlds to other hunters carrying them... yeah.
I’d like to think FromSoft has a team dedicated to history and science that fuels their game designs and lore. The team sits across from the marketing and sales teams just like any other company, but their whole job is just researching cool things to give ideas to Miyazaki (he’s probably on the team too)
I love how you start with a history lesson that segue into lore for the game, it really makes the real world more interesting by looking through the lens of the game😊
It's not JUST interesting. The inspirations and contrast from real world history literally form the backbone for the direction of events and the fulcrum of motives of the history of FromSoft Souls games. If TA or someone went back on all his videos and summarized them in chronological order, a fairly comprehensible timeline of these worlds can be made. Most Souls lorecrafters have managed to glean details and cobble together stories and motives of related characters, but never has anyone dived this deep into the lore with an extensive, exhaustive, and inclusive-of-all-details approach, and uncovered this much substance and understanding of the game's obscure history.
@@PaszerDyei believe the guys name was charred thermos but he made a very interesting Bloodborne series going into detail about the game being an allegory for victorian era medical practice/surgery
@@joeclarke7982 Yeah, but it also isn't the victorian era's science and medical practice. It involves sciences, pre-scientific practices, technology, discovery, and all the relationship of all those to religion throughout human history. Also, I just found out Charred Thermos deleted his channel for no apparent reason, and another user managed to save his videos. Like, what the hell?
Excellent video, but I'm not sure everything lines up. I've always understood Rom as hiding the ritual, not blocking it. Based on what you've presented, if the Mensis ritual has already happened, then Rom can't be a seal on it, but instead a buffer from everyone else finding out about it. Another posted commented about the message "Behold, a paleblood sky!" appearing before and after the Red Moon, which put this together for me. The school of Mensis long completed their ritual, and used Rom to hide what they were doing so the Choir wouldn't try to steal the great one from them. As I understand, the two groups were more than at odds with each other and their very different approaches. The Brain of Mensis was likely their goal, as you stated, but they lacked the knowledge to make contact, which is probably why Micolash talks so much about Rom. They are trying to understand how Rom made contact and that is their current phase of research when we arrive in Yharnam. So as I'd understand it, as the moon-scented hunter it is likely that we were called to help free the Moon Presence following from your theory. This forces us to unravel the "secrets" and reveal the truth so we can confront it and eventually free the Moon Presence, then prevent Mensis from repeating their ritual again by dealing with Mergo. Once we've accomplished that task, we are basically told to leave as the "hunt" is over. In this case, the "besats" in question would be Mensis, and the rest of the events in Yharnam are caused by their ritual would be my guess. Also, late night theory crafting, so hopefully this comes together right 😅
Interesting points. I have always wondered why Willem seems to indicate us to go and kill Rom. If Rom hides the ritual, killing Rom will reveal it, so we can find the real Yahar'gul and stop the ritual? Did Willem help create Rom originally to hide the truths of the Kosm, to stop others from delving into these matters? But now that Micolash and his school have managed to transfer themselves to the Nightmare and are beckoning the Moon Presence from there, he needs Rom to be removed so that hunters can find the true state of matter, kill Mergo and stop the Great One Flora from devastating Yharnam with the Beast Sourge as it pursues its objective? The Moon Presence likely doesn't care about what its presence does to humans, it just wants to be free. So, does Willem and the Moon Presence's objectives overlap even though their goals are quite different? The Moon Presence wants to escape captivity, and Willem wants to get all these Great Ones away from Yharnam. Perhaps his motivations are less about being humanitarian and more about keeping the Eldritch Truth to himself though.
I always through Rom was hiding the Ritual to create a buffer and keep people from being influenced by it. Once Rom is dead, everyone goes (even more) crazy, and based on what we know about Old Yharnam, a Red Moon hanging low causes people to transform into Beasts more easily. I thought this because Rom is hiding inside a lake, and the Lake rune talks about large bodies of water acting as a "bulwark guarding sleep" and increase defenses, since having that separation help keep you safe.
i think the choir were the ones trying to hide the blood moon, because you can summon a scholar of mensis to help you kill rom. if mensis were trying to keep it a secret why would one of them help you kill rom
The sponsor ad in this video is the funniest bloodborne thing I have ever seen. The voicing of it, the pop ups, the "come on down to yahargul" Lifelong fan forever sir
I'm not sure how widely this interpretation is known, but I always took the Cages as being a form of psychic shielding, allowing the scholars of Mensis to dream without fear of hostile psychic incursions. although perhaps psychic isnt the correct term when applied to a shared collective dream realm. this kind of insulation could also explain how Micolash survived the probable death of his physical body in the waking world. his consciousness is held in place by the cage, able to freely roam the Nightmare.
I think the cages are to facilitate communication with great ones much like cell phone towers. Torture or capture people and shock them in order to psuedo make contact with great ones. The reason it works is because it’s great one blood in all those people due to having Laurence’s blood ministration. So they get all these people with yarnham blood together and torture them until mergo or another great one hears their cries and does something about it.
My absolute favorite lore channel. As an art history major this is my jam on a spiritual level, giving these games the credit they deserve and digging into rabbit holes for the gold within
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The brain of mensis being a manifestation of the moon presence could make sense since the Japanese makes it seem like the nightmares and dream-realities are stacked on top of one another. The fact is backed up by dream reality geography as well. The hunter's dream is on top a foggy lake (Maybe the moonside lake?) , the nightmare frontier above the fishing hamlet which is above the hunter's nightmare. Hence the Choir's epiphany: That while their feet were planted on the earth the cosmos were literally just above their heads.
That's an interesting theory about the Brain being the Moon Presence. I always assumed the Brain was just either recognizing our smell or else knew who sent us. One idea I had while watching this is that the "stillbirth of their brains" might be a reference to the Brain itself since the nightmare is hosted in their collective consciousness. Or perhaps they had an oopsie and teleported their brains to the nightmare and the amalgamation, along with some bath messangers caught up in the process, formed the Brain of Mensis itself. Either way, this might have been the impetus for Flora to direct the hunters to end the ritual and stop the attempts at capturing it.
The brain of Mensis likely predates the Mensis scholars. The nightmare frontier and nightmare of Mensis was likely once the nightmare of Loran. The Loran silver beasts and the surviving architecture in this area indicate this to be the case. The tower we find the brain is built similarly to the amygdala's tower and the surrounding distinct gothic/victorian architecture seems to bleed into it, as if it manifested alongside this tower that already existed. This tower is also situated directly above pitch black chasm that has seemingly been excavated by the Mensis scholars as if they dredged the brain up from its depths. Its likely that this area was brought about by Loran communing with the moon presence resulting in the creation of the brain and those poison slugs that also have messengers under neath them, as well as the evolution of the trapped humans into nightmare lost children and trapped beasts into silver beasts. The winter lanterns would have had to have been a more recent creation of the brain since Loran almost certainly predates the creation of the doll. There is also some evidence that isn't as strong but still exists. The englsih version of the living string says the brain was retrieved though the japanese version is more vague making this item less concrete. There is also a cut boss called Fauna the silver beast which is likely meant to evoke a a connection to the moon presence whose other name is Flora as well as silver beasts who originate from Loran. So yeah i think the brain was created by Loran not Mensis.
@@Wile_E_Cyote A curious idea regarding the Winter Lanterns. I had always felt they were manifestations determined by the Good Hunter, a sign of utmost warmth and care, different from person to person, used to lure hapless adventurers in the Nightmares to their ultimate end.
@@HighPriestFuneral For a long time that's also what I thought they were, some kind of manifestation created by the brain just to fuck with people, still kind of do. However there was always a hole with that idea since you can also find winter lanterns standing above where you get lady Maria's rakuyo in the fishing hamlet. Which seems to imply a stronger more specific connection to the doll and lady Maria. So when I realized that the brain of Mensis gave the moon rune it seemed most likely that the brain was strongly connected to the moon presence and the winter lanterns were some sort of independent creatures created to mimic the doll. Personally i like the original idea that a winter lanterns form is specific to who ever views it. But considering their other connections it seems more likely these creatures are tied to the doll alone. So that's the theory i go with.
I always though the reason behind the abductions was to steal as many bodies and flesh as possible in order to give their own great one a physical body. As such, the previous owners of such flesh are represented all around Yahar'gul as statues writhing in horror and pain.
Also to add that the way Micolash and the other corpses wearing the Mensis Cage on their head are strapped to their chair is very reminiscent of an electric chair, adding a layer to the theme of electricity.
I've wondered if the covered mirrors in Yahar'gul were a reference to the practice of covering reflective surfaces (mainly mirrors) after a funeral so that the spirit wouldn't be trapped. I meant to read up on it more but never got around to it. That would make sense in Yahar'gul, where they seem to be focused on death/necromancy/resurrection. If Mensis used mirrors or reflective surfaces to access the nightmare, that also makes sense with the religious connotations of the covered mirrors---the nightmare acts as an underworld where the spirits of the named characters of the game persist long after their bodies have decayed in the waking or living world. Mirrors could potentially trap a spirit if not used properly, so Mensis covered them up.
@@brnecessities3335 Thanks-I figured I’d reactivate my channel to comment on videos from time to time, but either someone immediately snatched my handle after I deleted my channel or UA-cam won’t allow me to use my old name. I had to go with TheCharredThermos, which seems kinda sus. But yeah, same person.
Fantastic video as always! I particularly find the theory of the mirrors made of mercury to be very fascinating due to mercury's other name: Quiksilver. Considering the Hunter uses Quiksilver bullets as ammunition for Hunter tools that touch upon the Arcane and the cosmos, as well as a part of a Great One, I'm tempted to believe in it.
I didn't know the moon presence had messengers on its body! This is interesting considering the messengers have already been compared to cherubic angels.
I don't think the Brain of Mensis is directly connected to the Moon Presence. That said, the Moon Presence is clearly being drawn to Mergo's cries, so even though MP isn't completely ensnared in Mensis' trap like the Brain is, the effect is similar. The Mensis Ritual is slowly but surely drawing MP into the nightmare, so it summons up the Moon-Scented Hunter to stop the ritual before it's really and truly trapped.
I recently discovered you're channel and I think you might actually be the best lore channel I've found, you go deeper than any channel along with amazing video quality. And I want to thank you for treating the religious aspects and themes you cover in your video's with respect and remaining impartial like a true historian. Unlike many of the other lore channels who seem to love to interject their opinions on religion, often being openly hostile to and mocking religion every chance they get. Keep up the great work.
Incredible. Great contribution to the lore scene in this one. The Brain of Mensis as the Moon Presence [ESPECIALLY with the juxtaposed art] in another form is VERY good. Also very much agreed with the Rom's corpse interpretation and dream form argument. Really appreciate the Slime Scholars mirrors and quicksilver thing too. I'm not sure it ALL holds together firmly yet but I'll continue to extend the benefit of the doubt you earned with your Elden Ring series. I hope we hear more about what the actual catastrophe that fused all the people into the wall was [if you feel confident enough to present a theory, it could of course be inexplicable as well but I think it might tie into how the Nightmare of Mensis' buildings actually formed and ended up with Yharnamite architecture.] Overall an excellent episode, loved the infomercial too. More! Sooner!
Holy shit I was just watching your other videos as background while I played Bloodborne, and I was sad because there were only two videos on it so far. Immaculate timing.
I think you missed an important connection. I spent years thinking about how "The Sandman" by E.T.A Hoffmamn is connected to Bloodborne. The story is about a guy going crazy after looking through some "magic" lenses. His delusions manifest through the fear of a monster who wants to steal his eyes and his love for a singing doll. The story was later used by Freud to explain the uncanny. Crazy i never made the connection.
Checking it out right now and I think you're spot on. On top of what you said, I especially think that the whole thing about the sandman yanking out people's eyes is the source of the eye yanking theme of the game.
As a professional spider scientist, you have no idea how happy/proud I am that you called that Rom's lake form is not actually a spider. While the 'telson' you noted COULD be very long spinnerets, better evidence is that all of the (too many) legs are attached to the abdomen. Real spiders, including those in other parts of Bloodborne, have all of their limbs (8 legs + 2 pedipalps) attached to their heads.
Funnily enough, I read that originally Rom was supposed to have long legs but the team decided to change them because they didn't know how to make them work for the fight. Which is why we see Rom having long legs in the Altar of Despair
Great video. I'm honestly surprised your videos have been so spot on. I'm a pretty big bloodborne lore nut and there are even a few things in them that I didn't know about. I will say though that the brain of Mensis is not the moon presence, its definitely related to it, but it isn't the moon presence itself. You find a lot of creatures in the nightmare frontier and nightmare of Mensis infused with messengers. You also find a lot of creatures associated with Loran. Its very likely that these areas where once the nightmare of Loran and that Loran previously made contact with the moon presence which resulted in the creation of the brain of Mensis, which the Mensis scholars would find later find. I definitely think the brain of Mensis is intimately connected to the moon presence, especially since the winter lanterns are clearly amalgamations of the brain and the doll. The doll being a recent creation of the moon presence would mean that the brain has to have some sort of spiritual or psychic link. But yeah i think its a stretch to say it is the moon presence, its likely a situation similar to Rom's.
also, the bodies in the walls remind me of what was supposed to have happened to sailors in the Philadelphia Experiment as a result of government testing of…electromagnetism, optical camouflage, & teleportation!
It's because of all the high quality videos like this one, that Bloodborne content is still as relevant and well recieved after all those years! It amazes me everytime! so, thank you! :)
I always wondered what the significance of all the mirrors were but could never find any information or theories from any forums on the internet. Thought I was reading too far into things all these years but I’m glad more lore content is coming out to explain the more obscure stuff in this absolute masterpiece of a game. Thanks once again TA!
Your attention to detail is astounding, never would’ve caught the diagrams on the blackboard, and even if I had I would’ve had no idea what they signified.
So, we ultimately are guided to the Mensis Nightmare to "kill Mergo" and end that Nightmare.. to release an Aspect of Flora trapped there? Very interesting implications! Even just the idea is interesting enough, even if not entirely true. As the Moon rune is probably our human "understanding" of whatever it's communicating. (I've always been sure that being able to go back there after finishing the task must be purely related to "gameplay" reasons.. as the Dream should technically end). Anyway @7:37 I don't think I was mentally prepared for that.. Historically very insightful, as always. I continue to enjoy your eye for detail, and the tangents you take me to.
Incredibly cool video. I've loved Bloodborne with my whole heart since day 1, and it continues to baffle me how very little I actually know about it. That Bloodborne is Victorian-era in function as well as form; that details like chalkboards and background furnishings reveal deeper elements of the story and are not just aesthetics; this game is beyond a masterpiece
mind bending analysis with context added by real life history. another great video. so glad you decided to start revisiting bloodborne after i recently pushed myself to see credits
Just wanted to say that I love your videos so much. Its given me a new perspective, not only on the games themselves but what good, internally consistent writing is and how real world history can inspire such fascinating fictional worlds. I don't think I'll be able to see these games the same way again, and I want to take the same sort of analytical mindset to other media for myself.
Very good video! The only thing I disagree with is the Brain of Mensis being the Moon Presence. The latter is maybe the most powerful collector of blood echoes in existence, while the former is described as a rotten and imperfect mess of a thing. Moreover, the fact it answers with "Moon" only indicates what its voice sounds like in your mind at the moment of contact. Meaning it could either be answering your question about ("seek the Moon"), or he's expressing some deep-seated longing for the Moon, like Ebrietas communicating "Eye" to Master Willem. Throw in there the more ambiguous Japanese description, where Mensis just "stumbled upon" the Brain in the Nightmare, and I think it's safer to say that the Brain is a result of a compact between Mensis and the Wet Nurse. What I mean is: Mensis probably set out to beckon the Moon, but Rom's interference hid their ritual (and Mergo) from the Moon. Another Great One, the Wet Nurse, swooped in and took Mergo, giving Mensis "a brain lined with eyes" in return. If this rotten brain is the result of the merging of Mensis' scholar is left up to interpretation, but I like to think so, because that'd mean they did ascend, just not in the way they wanted.
I’m rather confused about this point - - - you talk about how the red moon comes during the story, how we can explore Yahar’gul “before the Red Moon” (after we are abducted and taken there). But… wasn’t the whole idea that Rom was hiding the true nature of the world from everybody? I always assumed that once Rom is dead, we’re seeing the world for what it truly is, and that’s one with a red moon hanging in the sky.
Damn. I am astonished what details you can pull out of those games. I watched my fair share of Soulsborne lore videos. But i find yours to be the most concise.
One thing I have never heard anyone say: the bells that the chime maidens use to perform their blood magic sound very similar to the sanctus bells, which are principly rung at the consecration and elevation of the host and chalice, and since the prayers of consecration are said in the quiet voice, an unitiated outsider might believe that it isn't the prayers that effect consecration, but the bells themselves.
Let's not overlook the fact that Mensis chained up a brain in their nightmare, and the ritual resulted in the stillbirth of their minds. Seems like an 'As above, so below' kind of _mirroring_
Oh shit, that is a profound phrase to put into it. As above, so below is very fitting for the duplicates of the Great Ones we find both in the waking world and the dream worlds of the Kosm above.
I had always assumed that the brain of Mensis was a great one created by the amalgamated minds of the students wearing mensis cages next to Mikolash. I realize Mikolash isn’t part of this being, but I thought that maybe he had another part to play. Either way, I do think the massive amount of bodies in the village (the ones in walls) were likely used as some sort of catalyst to either enter the dream or fuse their minds into a great one, etc.
I respect this theory I thought this as well, their mind matter that could still be salvaged was just thrown into one being, eh shitty way to ascend tho
@@devildante9 I think so too. There seems to be this insinuation that at some point during the Great One life cycle, they ascend from their physical forms and exist only in dreams. It could be the One Reborn is a Great One whose spirit or dream form has been attached to an amalgamation of the villagers’ bodies of Yahar’gul. Giving it a way to exist in the waking world once more.
@@justinfernandez3894 I appreciate that! Speaking to it being a “shitty way to ascend”: It could very well be that the experiment failed in some way. Considering the line that states that the students of Mensis’ minds were stillborn, I suspected something went terribly wrong. Perhaps they meant to ascend but not in such a limited way.
@@devildante9 The game indicates what bosses are great ones or attempted great ones in the achievements. The one reborn is just a a big zombie. Though it may have been an attempt at a great one in a previous version of the game, its not in the released version.
Unmentioned, Lovecraft and the various people in his writing circle would give the powerful entities in their stories various manifestations. Alternate forms that could be radically different in both name and appearance depending on context. The Brain of Mensis being a manifestation of the Moon Presence would be right in line with that literary inspiration. If you really want to get wacky, every one of the entities we come across that looks like a human organ could in fact be a manifestation of the Moon Presence. This would mean we have more or less a complete torso when we combine Moon Presence' spinal features with Ebrietas' lung like features and sit the Brain's... brain features on top. They each have their own realm in which to manifest as well. Not saying this is the case. But it is plausible given the source inspiration as well as everything else.
I really enjoyed the video! Very interesting ideas. I’ve always been under the impression that: The ultimate goal of Mensis isn’t to hunt, it’s the same goal of Bergenwoeth, the Healing Church, and the Choir: To ascend to a higher plane of existence and _become_ Great Ones themselves. To that end they beckoned the Moon, seeking contact with existing Great Ones to receive their help. They encounter (or lure) the large brain and basically torture it to learn its secrets, causing it to go crazy and its gaze to cause others to go mad (frenzy). Or, it’s gaze when exposed to moonlight always caused frenzy. Either way they strung it up in a tower as a defense mechanism. From it they may have learned about Great Ones wanting children, if they didn’t already know, and used Mergo as bait to lure another Great One in Mergo’s Wet-nurse. Either way Mensis and all the others fail. It’s not a simple matter of Blood (Healing Church) or Eyes/Insight (everyone else), but both of those, which is why our Hunter doesn’t evolve until after we’ve gained a large amount of Insight via at least 3 umbilical cords, and a large amount of Blood(echoes) by slaying the Moon Presence. Though the Insight granted by the umbilical cords is clearly “special” in some way, as having a large amount of Insight alone from other sources isn’t enough to repel the Moon Presence’s attempt to bind you to the Hunter’s Dream.
I love the artistic analysis of your videos, always refeshing and just so...calming? I wish my art history classes in high school were that interesting...
Man i love this game so much but it took 3 years from initial release for me to touch it and was my first real foray into the souls games, before that i saw them as masochistic. Its story and meanings were for the most part waaayyy over my head yet its mystique made it all the more captivating. Bloodborne truly is one of the greatest games of all time and i hope bluepoint do a remake someday, could you imagine?! i am still learning about bloodborne to this day with help of great videos like yours. good job.
Thank you! I've been scouring the web for an actual explanation for what the hell was going on with Mensis, and this is absolutely the most sensible interpretation I've heard so far!
Your videos are so cool. They have discovering and making sense of things that over my several playthroughs I have never figured out. Also, your ad was hilarious.
This is fricking brilliant. The longest running basis for the theory of Bloodborne was the old video that analyzed the religious influences (Catholic, Shinto, and Lovecraft). Adding in this science angle really helps to complete the story. Thank you! Edit: It's also amazing because in the story of Bloodborne, both the Choir and the School of Mensis succeeded (in different ways) because the multiverse is incredibly vast. I guess it's also crazy because the while we think of both the Choir and the School of Mensis as villains, it seems that while the School of Mensis sought to hunt the Great Ones, the Choir turned to trying to hide and protect them. Obviously, not for good reasons. The Choir had selfish reasons for wanting to contact the Great Ones. And to add, it's funny that the Moon Presence itself was also hunting other Great Ones. And thus, what's something that proves you an ally to the Brain of Mensis? When your arms swap from one side to the other in the Make Contact...you "Praise the Sun"! So, this also comes down to another hidden story of the Sun vs. the Moon!
Awesome video as always, but I believe it strongly falls appart at the end. The Brain of Mensis is not the Moon Pressence, and our mission isn't to free it. We can prove that by just looking at what's mandatory in the game. The Nightmare of Mensis ends when we free Mergo, not the Brain. The Brain stuff is optional. It's Mergo who's powering the Nightmare of Mensis, and it is called the Nightmare of Mensis because Mensis tried to get to Mergo and they paid the price. Look at the Hunter's Nightmare. Its fueled by Kos/the Orphan as a punishment for hunters. Same with Mensis. They tried to kidnap Mergo and they were punished for it, with their brains stillbirthing, forming the Brain of Mensis and being a hostage of Mergo's realm forever. When we make contact with the Brain of Mensis and it answers back saying "Moon", it's just because... Well, it is the amalgamation of the brains of the scholars of Mensis. They always had the Moon in mind. It's their thing. It's a hint at its true identity. Also, does the Moon Pressence's body have messengers on it? Doesn't look like it in game. Is that picture from the official art book or something? Never saw it before, I'm genuinely curious. Keep going with the amazing work!
It makes me so happy that science, philosophy and their history has come into the mainstream fromsoft theory community in such force. Elden Archeologist, you're super articulate, hardworkin and astute dude, idk if I tottaly agree that the mensis brain IS the moon presence, maybe it's warning us of them? Unless I'm missing something. I have actually gotten weird looks for pointing at the inspiration for fromsoft being the sort of basic science related to the phenomenon of consciousness. So I appreciate your hard work.
I think the make contact gesture is just making a right triangle. And right triangles are related to many many mathematical and engineering concepts. That's why the brain responds, you proved yourself to be conscious of the code of the universe.
Since I played Bloodborne, I've wondered why we had to go through the lake to get to Rom. This channel ALWAYS surprises me in the best possible ways, discovering new facts from a game that came out almost 8 years ago is an amazing thing to feel. Thank you a lot
There is a lot of in game lore hints that talk about the brain being rotted with bad eyes. I like the theory that the brain IS the school of Menses that were "granted eyes" in order to achieve their final goals which other channels relate to ascending to the status of great one.
I'm with others that aren't quite convinced the brain is the moon presence as you fight it's dream form after all in the hunters dream. Also i know cut content isn't canon but I'm pretty sure there is a "physical" moon presence you can fight in the chalice dungeons using one of the special seeds/codes that contain it
The baths remind me of a baptismal font, which is interesting because baptism (arguably the most important sacrament) is conspicuously absent from all the lore videos I have seen discussing the Catholic parallels. Water baptism symbolizes death and rebirth, the Flood of Noah being a typological baptism for example. Could the corpses in the walls of Yahar'gul be meant to evoke something similar?
Possibly worth noting as well that when the player wakes up in the font, it's after submerging himself in the lake (the word baptism etymologically means submersion) and defeating Rom there. Interestingly, the Lake rune item descriptions also compare the utterance of the Great Ones to a 'watery reflection.'
I was awaiting expectant a new video of yours. I recently found your channel and got hooked to your videos. The arcane magic that this games ooze and the great repertoire of annecdotes and details you can sprinkle everything to reinforce what you say is fascinating. However, a humble tip I'd like to give you is to avoid using the word "literally" in unnecesary, or even wrong situations. It sort of sullies what you say, which is a shame, because your script is very carefully written and it shows. Anyways, keep it up!
I personally think the Mensis scholars were making portals to try and find out where the fuck all the missing socks keep disappearing to when you do laundry. It's them fuckin sock gnomes, I know it. But where do they go?
I don't agree with all your points, but it was definetly a very interesting and insightful video. Very good job, especially when relating the in game lore to irl scientific developments
30:09 You go below the church and find Erebus(?) the butterfly great one with wings to fly on. She is there trying to revive Rom. Now we see a statue mimicking that of the one she is reviving: without a head. And when we revive the queen… she imitates said queen via being smashed to bits by us. When we defeats Laurence he was not beheaded but he was once. But both ROM and Laurence were defeated by us. Does this mean to fulfill the ritual that she has to follow in some way the path of those she revived? She even has a swarm of the babies around her similar to that which protected ROM… It may be possible do this is true that the statue actually resembles the abandoned great one when not reviving someone- or at least not reviving someone who has already gone through a transformation. This may actually have been done with our Clinic girl… it would make sense that this is where her doppelgänger came from.
From the original creator and scientist behind the chimpanzee mirror video:
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This is the single most impressive break down and exploration of bloodborns story I have seen. It makes perfect sense that the brain of mencas is literally the brain of the moon, the moon presence. Great work!
Pls continue with the Sin and Sophie inspired humour segments! My life expectancy will thank you.
sooo any of them eye scoopers left? i seem to have been late to the party with em.
Am I too late to get this eyeball scooper? Lol
Point of order: killing Rom doesn't cause the Blood Moon, it reveals that it has always been there. Miyazaki said in an interview that they deliberately put a message in Yaharghul that said "Behold! A Paleblood sky!" in a place where you could see it before and after killing Rom as a hint to players that the red moon was always there, Rom was just hiding it. Furthermore, many of the notes that refer to "ritual secrets" say in the original Japanese "ritual concealment".
There's also the notes in Oedon Chapel and Byrgenwerth that talked about Rom hiding rituals.
Wait did he not catch it???
He said killing Rom was necessary for the School of Mensis to beckon the moon, but they've already done that. Rom was just covering up their work, not preventing it from happening. I suppose you could argue that Rom was hindering Mensis by not letting them see what they were doing, but based on the mummified bodies and the complex landscape of the Nightmare of Mensis, I'd say they've been doing what they were doing for a while. The changes to Yaharghul after the red moon appears are probably just the result of time passing.
He addresses this 24:50
To be fair, the ritual is ongoing and though the moon is there already, it cant seem to fully take effect in our plane until Rom is defeated.
To me, this makes the narrative of the brain and the ritual's success more compelling. Mensis conducted their ritual and succeeded. Rom simply concealed that success.
Mercury is a big part of BB. We use quicksilver (mercury) bullets, which we can make using our own blood indicating that our blood contains mercury. "Madness" is also a symptom of mercury poisoning.
Absolutely! Have you seen Max Derrat's excellent videos on Alchemy in Bloodborne?
@@ladyfox6705 no, but I’ve seen Redgrave talk about it. One reference he used was the story about what happened in Minamata Japan after WW2.
@@CharlesZane_ Ahhh ok. Well, if you're interested in Lore deep dives, Max has great videos too.
Interesting… hadn’t thought of that.
Mercury poisoning can be caused by consuming too much fish. Interesting connection to the killing of Kos, maybe?
Mercury was an ancient medical treatment for thousands of years, mostly for infections as it had a very limited effect in the same way chemotherapy can for cancer, killing harmful cells slightly faster than other cells. Still not great and generally led to other life shortening issues but not totally ineffective as people think, still something to be avoided and dangerous though.
As an electrical engineer, I can firmly say that I have seen the Eldritch Truth and now I fear the Nightmare of Maxwell.
I think the reason the brain gives Moon is more-so because the description makes mention of Great Ones responding when called out to. The rune it gives isn't necessarily indicative of it's essence, it's something it's SAYING. You don't get the rune from killing it, you get it from Making Contact, and with runes being transcriptions of "the inhuman utterings" of Great Ones, it seems much more likely to me to take Moon as something the brain is saying in response to you. Maybe it's being used as a greeting because the description paints a benevolent image of Great Ones, or perhaps it recognizes you as being associated with the Moon Presence through the Hunter's Dream.
Other NPCs recognise you as an envoy of the moon. Some even call you "moon-scented" so you're right
Hm, maybe. I think the thing that is unanswered is, what is our call? What is the meaning of the gesture? Are we saying "Hi." And it responds with Moon? Are we saying "Moon." And it responds with mimicry? Or, are we giving a kind of introduction? "My name is..." If we are introducing ourselves, it's possible that the brain is introducing itself. Which would mean it calls itself Moon.
I don't really have a strong view on this. But I think there's at least a strong case to be made that the brain is some manifestation of the Moon Presence even with everything you mentioned being true.
This sort of thing is well in line with Lovecraft. With various entities have multiple ways of appearing depending on context and even having different names in these manifestations.
The Moon Rune is supposedly an indicator of the Moon's sympathy with Hunters, and desire for them to collect more Blood Echoes. As such, the word itself doesn't necessarily mean the Moon so much as it means the Moon's blessing...
Something the Brain is somehow capable of giving.
@@rainbowkrampusLike the christen God
@@jacobnoelle8428??
I love your theory about Mergo being bait for the School of Mensis! I do think there is another very likely reason the Mensis brain gives you the "Moon" rune - it's naming you. As a hunter, you are a hunter FOR the Moon Presence - ironically, the School of Mensis DID manage to get the Moon Presence's attention, but by the Moon Presence sending a hunter to hunt Mergo rather than adopt it. The Brain of Mensis recognizes this and responds with what you are / who you work for.
Just want to mention that killing Rom doesn't cause Mergo to start crying, it only allows you to hear the crying at any insight. Before you kill Rom, you can still hear Mergo's cries if you have 90 insight. Also implying that the ritual has always been going on behind the scenes
And 90 Insight mirrors the 90 degrees of the Make Contact gesture
Actually you can hear Mergo's cry when you reach 60 insight
@@emrecopur8455Ahh so you turn the 90 on it's side, more mirroring, very smart
classic TA missing a basic observation and building tons of theories on his misconception/misunderstanding
@@AssailantLFBut he didn't though. Around minute 25 is where that subject is touched on, and he says killing Rom is required to fully beckon the moon (revealed to all regardless of insight) and we "hear" Mergo's cries. Not that killing Rom "causes" Mergo to start crying, just that they can be heard. He also makes it clear that the Mensis ritual using Mergo to beckon the moon has been going on for long enough that the physical bodies of the school of Mensis have desiccated.
If this is about not mentioning that X insight let's you hear the cries early, then that seems a minor thing that doesn't weaken the theory provided.
That fake ad read was so good
Ebrietas' *WHAT* ???M😅
@@WardofSquid i wonder how many blood vials it took to become a member 😂
More than 8 years after this game is released and i'm still learning bits of lore. Hands down one of the greatest games to ever be released.
Don’t forget also that the “Make Contact” gesture can be interpreted as gesturing the x and y axes of two mirrored isosceles triangles, as per your earlier discussion of mathematics and optics.
Mind blowing 😮
@@costanzazacchi6498Wasn't it meant to proof to the other party that you're an "advanced" species because the gesture shows that you have an understanding of mathematics and must therefore be self-conscious? I think that's what I remember.
@@TheOneGreat Similar ideas! I also liken the fact that you obtain the moon rune when you complete the gesture as a bit of a nod to the dual nature of the moon presence, if that’s what the mensis brain is. In one reality, the mensis is all brain; but the flip side of that is only body, an incomplete great one. Maybe that’s why the moon presence you fight in the end of the game has no face?
I see it as the hunter mimicking a bell. The hunter's mark looks like a bell and the hunter moving their arms the way they do looks like a bell ringing. And considering bells can reach across worlds to other hunters carrying them... yeah.
I’d like to think FromSoft has a team dedicated to history and science that fuels their game designs and lore.
The team sits across from the marketing and sales teams just like any other company, but their whole job is just researching cool things to give ideas to Miyazaki (he’s probably on the team too)
I had no idea optics was a part of Bloodborne's story. As someone working in optics, this pleases me. Loved the history overview!
I love how you start with a history lesson that segue into lore for the game, it really makes the real world more interesting by looking through the lens of the game😊
Nice pun at the end 👌
I agree
It's not JUST interesting. The inspirations and contrast from real world history literally form the backbone for the direction of events and the fulcrum of motives of the history of FromSoft Souls games. If TA or someone went back on all his videos and summarized them in chronological order, a fairly comprehensible timeline of these worlds can be made. Most Souls lorecrafters have managed to glean details and cobble together stories and motives of related characters, but never has anyone dived this deep into the lore with an extensive, exhaustive, and inclusive-of-all-details approach, and uncovered this much substance and understanding of the game's obscure history.
@@PaszerDyei believe the guys name was charred thermos but he made a very interesting Bloodborne series going into detail about the game being an allegory for victorian era medical practice/surgery
@@joeclarke7982 Yeah, but it also isn't the victorian era's science and medical practice. It involves sciences, pre-scientific practices, technology, discovery, and all the relationship of all those to religion throughout human history.
Also, I just found out Charred Thermos deleted his channel for no apparent reason, and another user managed to save his videos. Like, what the hell?
Excellent video, but I'm not sure everything lines up. I've always understood Rom as hiding the ritual, not blocking it. Based on what you've presented, if the Mensis ritual has already happened, then Rom can't be a seal on it, but instead a buffer from everyone else finding out about it. Another posted commented about the message "Behold, a paleblood sky!" appearing before and after the Red Moon, which put this together for me.
The school of Mensis long completed their ritual, and used Rom to hide what they were doing so the Choir wouldn't try to steal the great one from them. As I understand, the two groups were more than at odds with each other and their very different approaches. The Brain of Mensis was likely their goal, as you stated, but they lacked the knowledge to make contact, which is probably why Micolash talks so much about Rom. They are trying to understand how Rom made contact and that is their current phase of research when we arrive in Yharnam.
So as I'd understand it, as the moon-scented hunter it is likely that we were called to help free the Moon Presence following from your theory. This forces us to unravel the "secrets" and reveal the truth so we can confront it and eventually free the Moon Presence, then prevent Mensis from repeating their ritual again by dealing with Mergo. Once we've accomplished that task, we are basically told to leave as the "hunt" is over. In this case, the "besats" in question would be Mensis, and the rest of the events in Yharnam are caused by their ritual would be my guess.
Also, late night theory crafting, so hopefully this comes together right
😅
You are right because Mergo's Umbilical Cord description proves your point.
Interesting points. I have always wondered why Willem seems to indicate us to go and kill Rom. If Rom hides the ritual, killing Rom will reveal it, so we can find the real Yahar'gul and stop the ritual? Did Willem help create Rom originally to hide the truths of the Kosm, to stop others from delving into these matters? But now that Micolash and his school have managed to transfer themselves to the Nightmare and are beckoning the Moon Presence from there, he needs Rom to be removed so that hunters can find the true state of matter, kill Mergo and stop the Great One Flora from devastating Yharnam with the Beast Sourge as it pursues its objective? The Moon Presence likely doesn't care about what its presence does to humans, it just wants to be free. So, does Willem and the Moon Presence's objectives overlap even though their goals are quite different? The Moon Presence wants to escape captivity, and Willem wants to get all these Great Ones away from Yharnam. Perhaps his motivations are less about being humanitarian and more about keeping the Eldritch Truth to himself though.
I always through Rom was hiding the Ritual to create a buffer and keep people from being influenced by it. Once Rom is dead, everyone goes (even more) crazy, and based on what we know about Old Yharnam, a Red Moon hanging low causes people to transform into Beasts more easily.
I thought this because Rom is hiding inside a lake, and the Lake rune talks about large bodies of water acting as a "bulwark guarding sleep" and increase defenses, since having that separation help keep you safe.
i think the choir were the ones trying to hide the blood moon, because you can summon a scholar of mensis to help you kill rom. if mensis were trying to keep it a secret why would one of them help you kill rom
The sponsor ad in this video is the funniest bloodborne thing I have ever seen. The voicing of it, the pop ups, the "come on down to yahargul"
Lifelong fan forever sir
I'm not sure how widely this interpretation is known, but I always took the Cages as being a form of psychic shielding, allowing the scholars of Mensis to dream without fear of hostile psychic incursions. although perhaps psychic isnt the correct term when applied to a shared collective dream realm.
this kind of insulation could also explain how Micolash survived the probable death of his physical body in the waking world. his consciousness is held in place by the cage, able to freely roam the Nightmare.
I think the cages are to facilitate communication with great ones much like cell phone towers. Torture or capture people and shock them in order to psuedo make contact with great ones. The reason it works is because it’s great one blood in all those people due to having Laurence’s blood ministration. So they get all these people with yarnham blood together and torture them until mergo or another great one hears their cries and does something about it.
My absolute favorite lore channel. As an art history major this is my jam on a spiritual level, giving these games the credit they deserve and digging into rabbit holes for the gold within
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The brain of mensis being a manifestation of the moon presence could make sense since the Japanese makes it seem like the nightmares and dream-realities are stacked on top of one another. The fact is backed up by dream reality geography as well. The hunter's dream is on top a foggy lake (Maybe the moonside lake?) , the nightmare frontier above the fishing hamlet which is above the hunter's nightmare. Hence the Choir's epiphany: That while their feet were planted on the earth the cosmos were literally just above their heads.
That's an interesting theory about the Brain being the Moon Presence. I always assumed the Brain was just either recognizing our smell or else knew who sent us. One idea I had while watching this is that the "stillbirth of their brains" might be a reference to the Brain itself since the nightmare is hosted in their collective consciousness. Or perhaps they had an oopsie and teleported their brains to the nightmare and the amalgamation, along with some bath messangers caught up in the process, formed the Brain of Mensis itself. Either way, this might have been the impetus for Flora to direct the hunters to end the ritual and stop the attempts at capturing it.
whoa.. That bit about the brain of mensis being an amalgamation of the scholars' brains just blew my mind kind of. What a cool idea.
The brain of Mensis likely predates the Mensis scholars. The nightmare frontier and nightmare of Mensis was likely once the nightmare of Loran. The Loran silver beasts and the surviving architecture in this area indicate this to be the case. The tower we find the brain is built similarly to the amygdala's tower and the surrounding distinct gothic/victorian architecture seems to bleed into it, as if it manifested alongside this tower that already existed. This tower is also situated directly above pitch black chasm that has seemingly been excavated by the Mensis scholars as if they dredged the brain up from its depths. Its likely that this area was brought about by Loran communing with the moon presence resulting in the creation of the brain and those poison slugs that also have messengers under neath them, as well as the evolution of the trapped humans into nightmare lost children and trapped beasts into silver beasts. The winter lanterns would have had to have been a more recent creation of the brain since Loran almost certainly predates the creation of the doll. There is also some evidence that isn't as strong but still exists. The englsih version of the living string says the brain was retrieved though the japanese version is more vague making this item less concrete. There is also a cut boss called Fauna the silver beast which is likely meant to evoke a a connection to the moon presence whose other name is Flora as well as silver beasts who originate from Loran. So yeah i think the brain was created by Loran not Mensis.
@@Wile_E_Cyote Very nice, very good points👏
@@Wile_E_Cyote A curious idea regarding the Winter Lanterns. I had always felt they were manifestations determined by the Good Hunter, a sign of utmost warmth and care, different from person to person, used to lure hapless adventurers in the Nightmares to their ultimate end.
@@HighPriestFuneral For a long time that's also what I thought they were, some kind of manifestation created by the brain just to fuck with people, still kind of do. However there was always a hole with that idea since you can also find winter lanterns standing above where you get lady Maria's rakuyo in the fishing hamlet. Which seems to imply a stronger more specific connection to the doll and lady Maria. So when I realized that the brain of Mensis gave the moon rune it seemed most likely that the brain was strongly connected to the moon presence and the winter lanterns were some sort of independent creatures created to mimic the doll.
Personally i like the original idea that a winter lanterns form is specific to who ever views it. But considering their other connections it seems more likely these creatures are tied to the doll alone. So that's the theory i go with.
I always though the reason behind the abductions was to steal as many bodies and flesh as possible in order to give their own great one a physical body. As such, the previous owners of such flesh are represented all around Yahar'gul as statues writhing in horror and pain.
Also to add that the way Micolash and the other corpses wearing the Mensis Cage on their head are strapped to their chair is very reminiscent of an electric chair, adding a layer to the theme of electricity.
I've wondered if the covered mirrors in Yahar'gul were a reference to the practice of covering reflective surfaces (mainly mirrors) after a funeral so that the spirit wouldn't be trapped. I meant to read up on it more but never got around to it. That would make sense in Yahar'gul, where they seem to be focused on death/necromancy/resurrection. If Mensis used mirrors or reflective surfaces to access the nightmare, that also makes sense with the religious connotations of the covered mirrors---the nightmare acts as an underworld where the spirits of the named characters of the game persist long after their bodies have decayed in the waking or living world. Mirrors could potentially trap a spirit if not used properly, so Mensis covered them up.
Nice to see you here! I very much enjoyed your additions to the community. I figure you have your reasons for removing your content though.
@@brnecessities3335 Thanks-I figured I’d reactivate my channel to comment on videos from time to time, but either someone immediately snatched my handle after I deleted my channel or UA-cam won’t allow me to use my old name. I had to go with TheCharredThermos, which seems kinda sus. But yeah, same person.
Return of the king
Fantastic video as always! I particularly find the theory of the mirrors made of mercury to be very fascinating due to mercury's other name: Quiksilver. Considering the Hunter uses Quiksilver bullets as ammunition for Hunter tools that touch upon the Arcane and the cosmos, as well as a part of a Great One, I'm tempted to believe in it.
I didn't know the moon presence had messengers on its body! This is interesting considering the messengers have already been compared to cherubic angels.
Kinda reminiscent of the Divine Chariot in kabbalism. Which victorians were also obsessed with
I don't think the Brain of Mensis is directly connected to the Moon Presence. That said, the Moon Presence is clearly being drawn to Mergo's cries, so even though MP isn't completely ensnared in Mensis' trap like the Brain is, the effect is similar. The Mensis Ritual is slowly but surely drawing MP into the nightmare, so it summons up the Moon-Scented Hunter to stop the ritual before it's really and truly trapped.
I recently discovered you're channel and I think you might actually be the best lore channel I've found, you go deeper than any channel along with amazing video quality.
And I want to thank you for treating the religious aspects and themes you cover in your video's with respect and remaining impartial like a true historian.
Unlike many of the other lore channels who seem to love to interject their opinions on religion, often being openly hostile to and mocking religion every chance they get.
Keep up the great work.
GRANT US EYES GRANT US EYES
Incredible. Great contribution to the lore scene in this one. The Brain of Mensis as the Moon Presence [ESPECIALLY with the juxtaposed art] in another form is VERY good. Also very much agreed with the Rom's corpse interpretation and dream form argument. Really appreciate the Slime Scholars mirrors and quicksilver thing too. I'm not sure it ALL holds together firmly yet but I'll continue to extend the benefit of the doubt you earned with your Elden Ring series. I hope we hear more about what the actual catastrophe that fused all the people into the wall was [if you feel confident enough to present a theory, it could of course be inexplicable as well but I think it might tie into how the Nightmare of Mensis' buildings actually formed and ended up with Yharnamite architecture.]
Overall an excellent episode, loved the infomercial too. More! Sooner!
I love it when I probably won't be turned into a horrible monster or fused into a wall! Sounds great to me and not at all worryingly specific!
these are really high quality videos with a great amount of thought and research. great job
Holy shit I was just watching your other videos as background while I played Bloodborne, and I was sad because there were only two videos on it so far. Immaculate timing.
I think you missed an important connection. I spent years thinking about how "The Sandman" by E.T.A Hoffmamn is connected to Bloodborne. The story is about a guy going crazy after looking through some "magic" lenses. His delusions manifest through the fear of a monster who wants to steal his eyes and his love for a singing doll. The story was later used by Freud to explain the uncanny. Crazy i never made the connection.
Checking it out right now and I think you're spot on. On top of what you said, I especially think that the whole thing about the sandman yanking out people's eyes is the source of the eye yanking theme of the game.
As a professional spider scientist, you have no idea how happy/proud I am that you called that Rom's lake form is not actually a spider. While the 'telson' you noted COULD be very long spinnerets, better evidence is that all of the (too many) legs are attached to the abdomen. Real spiders, including those in other parts of Bloodborne, have all of their limbs (8 legs + 2 pedipalps) attached to their heads.
Funnily enough, I read that originally Rom was supposed to have long legs but the team decided to change them because they didn't know how to make them work for the fight. Which is why we see Rom having long legs in the Altar of Despair
@@spawnofchaos9422where did you read it? It was never said
@@satanamogila9251 Cut content mumbo jumbo in the files
Speaking of arcane tech 7:36 considering your Mensis scooper; I recently learned to used ice cream scooper for jelly and other substances.
15:40 the best example of a faraday cage is the microwave. That metal screening inside has voltage and keeps microwaves inside it.
Great video. I'm honestly surprised your videos have been so spot on. I'm a pretty big bloodborne lore nut and there are even a few things in them that I didn't know about. I will say though that the brain of Mensis is not the moon presence, its definitely related to it, but it isn't the moon presence itself. You find a lot of creatures in the nightmare frontier and nightmare of Mensis infused with messengers. You also find a lot of creatures associated with Loran. Its very likely that these areas where once the nightmare of Loran and that Loran previously made contact with the moon presence which resulted in the creation of the brain of Mensis, which the Mensis scholars would find later find. I definitely think the brain of Mensis is intimately connected to the moon presence, especially since the winter lanterns are clearly amalgamations of the brain and the doll. The doll being a recent creation of the moon presence would mean that the brain has to have some sort of spiritual or psychic link. But yeah i think its a stretch to say it is the moon presence, its likely a situation similar to Rom's.
the optical science & mirror teleportation discussion is amazing 🤯
also, the bodies in the walls remind me of what was supposed to have happened to sailors in the Philadelphia Experiment as a result of government testing of…electromagnetism, optical camouflage, & teleportation!
It's because of all the high quality videos like this one, that Bloodborne content is still as relevant and well recieved after all those years! It amazes me everytime! so, thank you! :)
I always wondered what the significance of all the mirrors were but could never find any information or theories from any forums on the internet. Thought I was reading too far into things all these years but I’m glad more lore content is coming out to explain the more obscure stuff in this absolute masterpiece of a game. Thanks once again TA!
Let’s go TA, you’re the only channel I’d wait this long and even longer for an upload and still be super hyped
it was well worh the wait, hopefully we get more regular uploads though 😂
Your attention to detail is astounding, never would’ve caught the diagrams on the blackboard, and even if I had I would’ve had no idea what they signified.
My number one must-watch channel, always hype for a new video
So, we ultimately are guided to the Mensis Nightmare to "kill Mergo" and end that Nightmare.. to release an Aspect of Flora trapped there? Very interesting implications! Even just the idea is interesting enough, even if not entirely true. As the Moon rune is probably our human "understanding" of whatever it's communicating.
(I've always been sure that being able to go back there after finishing the task must be purely related to "gameplay" reasons.. as the Dream should technically end).
Anyway @7:37 I don't think I was mentally prepared for that.. Historically very insightful, as always. I continue to enjoy your eye for detail, and the tangents you take me to.
Brain of mensis being aspect of Oedon that he wants back is a great idea as what Odin alway feared was loosingg his ravens - mind and memory.
2:41 - vision projected outward from the eye - they were working on Ray Tracing, just a bit early
I look forward to these videos like I look forward to official Bloodborne news. Phenomenal work
Thank you so much for doing this series, I was rewatching your videos last night in anticipation of this episode. Keep up the great work!
Incredibly cool video. I've loved Bloodborne with my whole heart since day 1, and it continues to baffle me how very little I actually know about it. That Bloodborne is Victorian-era in function as well as form; that details like chalkboards and background furnishings reveal deeper elements of the story and are not just aesthetics; this game is beyond a masterpiece
mind bending analysis with context added by real life history. another great video. so glad you decided to start revisiting bloodborne after i recently pushed myself to see credits
Just wanted to say that I love your videos so much. Its given me a new perspective, not only on the games themselves but what good, internally consistent writing is and how real world history can inspire such fascinating fictional worlds. I don't think I'll be able to see these games the same way again, and I want to take the same sort of analytical mindset to other media for myself.
The Mensis Ritual takes place in my house about an hour after breakfast.
Very good video! The only thing I disagree with is the Brain of Mensis being the Moon Presence. The latter is maybe the most powerful collector of blood echoes in existence, while the former is described as a rotten and imperfect mess of a thing. Moreover, the fact it answers with "Moon" only indicates what its voice sounds like in your mind at the moment of contact. Meaning it could either be answering your question about ("seek the Moon"), or he's expressing some deep-seated longing for the Moon, like Ebrietas communicating "Eye" to Master Willem.
Throw in there the more ambiguous Japanese description, where Mensis just "stumbled upon" the Brain in the Nightmare, and I think it's safer to say that the Brain is a result of a compact between Mensis and the Wet Nurse.
What I mean is: Mensis probably set out to beckon the Moon, but Rom's interference hid their ritual (and Mergo) from the Moon. Another Great One, the Wet Nurse, swooped in and took Mergo, giving Mensis "a brain lined with eyes" in return. If this rotten brain is the result of the merging of Mensis' scholar is left up to interpretation, but I like to think so, because that'd mean they did ascend, just not in the way they wanted.
Congrats to finally getting the sponsorship deal. You deserve it!
I’m rather confused about this point - - - you talk about how the red moon comes during the story, how we can explore Yahar’gul “before the Red Moon” (after we are abducted and taken there).
But… wasn’t the whole idea that Rom was hiding the true nature of the world from everybody? I always assumed that once Rom is dead, we’re seeing the world for what it truly is, and that’s one with a red moon hanging in the sky.
You know this is the only channel where I can get from software lore and a history lesson all wrapped into one. You are a fantastic educator
Damn. I am astonished what details you can pull out of those games. I watched my fair share of Soulsborne lore videos. But i find yours to be the most concise.
Marvelous. There are some inconsistencies with this approach, but for the most part, it really seems to fit. Outstanding work.
8:07 lmao nice I enjoyed the eye scooper commercial.
One thing I have never heard anyone say: the bells that the chime maidens use to perform their blood magic sound very similar to the sanctus bells, which are principly rung at the consecration and elevation of the host and chalice, and since the prayers of consecration are said in the quiet voice, an unitiated outsider might believe that it isn't the prayers that effect consecration, but the bells themselves.
I love how you literally see every single thing you are describing in the game. Thank you for all of the much needed context. =)
Let's not overlook the fact that Mensis chained up a brain in their nightmare, and the ritual resulted in the stillbirth of their minds.
Seems like an 'As above, so below' kind of _mirroring_
Oh shit, that is a profound phrase to put into it. As above, so below is very fitting for the duplicates of the Great Ones we find both in the waking world and the dream worlds of the Kosm above.
I had always assumed that the brain of Mensis was a great one created by the amalgamated minds of the students wearing mensis cages next to Mikolash.
I realize Mikolash isn’t part of this being, but I thought that maybe he had another part to play.
Either way, I do think the massive amount of bodies in the village (the ones in walls) were likely used as some sort of catalyst to either enter the dream or fuse their minds into a great one, etc.
I respect this theory I thought this as well, their mind matter that could still be salvaged was just thrown into one being, eh shitty way to ascend tho
I think the villagers were used to create a fake great one, the one reborn. The ritual blood item reads "When all is melted in blood, all is reborn."
@@devildante9 I think so too.
There seems to be this insinuation that at some point during the Great One life cycle, they ascend from their physical forms and exist only in dreams.
It could be the One Reborn is a Great One whose spirit or dream form has been attached to an amalgamation of the villagers’ bodies of Yahar’gul. Giving it a way to exist in the waking world once more.
@@justinfernandez3894 I appreciate that! Speaking to it being a “shitty way to ascend”: It could very well be that the experiment failed in some way.
Considering the line that states that the students of Mensis’ minds were stillborn, I suspected something went terribly wrong. Perhaps they meant to ascend but not in such a limited way.
@@devildante9 The game indicates what bosses are great ones or attempted great ones in the achievements. The one reborn is just a a big zombie. Though it may have been an attempt at a great one in a previous version of the game, its not in the released version.
this was a great video. I never seen this part of the game brought up before and it is a breath of fresh air for a game this old. Good job good man
This is gonna be the longest shift of my life waiting for a chance to watch this haha
Unmentioned, Lovecraft and the various people in his writing circle would give the powerful entities in their stories various manifestations. Alternate forms that could be radically different in both name and appearance depending on context. The Brain of Mensis being a manifestation of the Moon Presence would be right in line with that literary inspiration.
If you really want to get wacky, every one of the entities we come across that looks like a human organ could in fact be a manifestation of the Moon Presence.
This would mean we have more or less a complete torso when we combine Moon Presence' spinal features with Ebrietas' lung like features and sit the Brain's... brain features on top. They each have their own realm in which to manifest as well.
Not saying this is the case. But it is plausible given the source inspiration as well as everything else.
I really enjoyed the video! Very interesting ideas. I’ve always been under the impression that: The ultimate goal of Mensis isn’t to hunt, it’s the same goal of Bergenwoeth, the Healing Church, and the Choir: To ascend to a higher plane of existence and _become_ Great Ones themselves. To that end they beckoned the Moon, seeking contact with existing Great Ones to receive their help.
They encounter (or lure) the large brain and basically torture it to learn its secrets, causing it to go crazy and its gaze to cause others to go mad (frenzy). Or, it’s gaze when exposed to moonlight always caused frenzy. Either way they strung it up in a tower as a defense mechanism.
From it they may have learned about Great Ones wanting children, if they didn’t already know, and used Mergo as bait to lure another Great One in Mergo’s Wet-nurse.
Either way Mensis and all the others fail. It’s not a simple matter of Blood (Healing Church) or Eyes/Insight (everyone else), but both of those, which is why our Hunter doesn’t evolve until after we’ve gained a large amount of Insight via at least 3 umbilical cords, and a large amount of Blood(echoes) by slaying the Moon Presence.
Though the Insight granted by the umbilical cords is clearly “special” in some way, as having a large amount of Insight alone from other sources isn’t enough to repel the Moon Presence’s attempt to bind you to the Hunter’s Dream.
I love the artistic analysis of your videos, always refeshing and just so...calming? I wish my art history classes in high school were that interesting...
Beer, weed, xbox, kitties , rain, no work, tarnished archeologist... yeah its all coming together
Dude, replace kitties with a dog and I am literally there, my brother.
I have a parrot that loves these videos, she really likes TA's voice.
@@hereticalhermit8148 "Raaa! Grant us eyes! RAAA! Fear the old blood!( *incoherent parrot shrieks* )" 🦜
@@ATOMIC_V_8 Its definitely not essential. Good for you. Willpower and keeping promises to yourself are cool 😎
That was a 7 hit combo
I find chatted thermos take on mensia rituals more accurate. But your theory complements in some aspects with charred’s theory
Man i love this game so much but it took 3 years from initial release for me to touch it and was my first real foray into the souls games, before that i saw them as masochistic.
Its story and meanings were for the most part waaayyy over my head yet its mystique made it all the more captivating.
Bloodborne truly is one of the greatest games of all time and i hope bluepoint do a remake someday, could you imagine?! i am still learning about bloodborne to this day with help of great videos like yours. good job.
Thank you! I've been scouring the web for an actual explanation for what the hell was going on with Mensis, and this is absolutely the most sensible interpretation I've heard so far!
It's official. This is the best ad read of all time. Everyone else can go ahead and stop advertising now. Permanently.
Your videos are so cool. They have discovering and making sense of things that over my several playthroughs I have never figured out. Also, your ad was hilarious.
these videos are so thought-provoking & well made. thank you TA! also the ad segment was also hilarious 👍
This is fricking brilliant. The longest running basis for the theory of Bloodborne was the old video that analyzed the religious influences (Catholic, Shinto, and Lovecraft). Adding in this science angle really helps to complete the story. Thank you!
Edit: It's also amazing because in the story of Bloodborne, both the Choir and the School of Mensis succeeded (in different ways) because the multiverse is incredibly vast. I guess it's also crazy because the while we think of both the Choir and the School of Mensis as villains, it seems that while the School of Mensis sought to hunt the Great Ones, the Choir turned to trying to hide and protect them. Obviously, not for good reasons. The Choir had selfish reasons for wanting to contact the Great Ones. And to add, it's funny that the Moon Presence itself was also hunting other Great Ones. And thus, what's something that proves you an ally to the Brain of Mensis? When your arms swap from one side to the other in the Make Contact...you "Praise the Sun"! So, this also comes down to another hidden story of the Sun vs. the Moon!
this is why I love listening to these videos, not only learning about the lore but also learning about real life history at the same time :3
Awesome video as always, but I believe it strongly falls appart at the end. The Brain of Mensis is not the Moon Pressence, and our mission isn't to free it. We can prove that by just looking at what's mandatory in the game.
The Nightmare of Mensis ends when we free Mergo, not the Brain. The Brain stuff is optional. It's Mergo who's powering the Nightmare of Mensis, and it is called the Nightmare of Mensis because Mensis tried to get to Mergo and they paid the price.
Look at the Hunter's Nightmare. Its fueled by Kos/the Orphan as a punishment for hunters. Same with Mensis. They tried to kidnap Mergo and they were punished for it, with their brains stillbirthing, forming the Brain of Mensis and being a hostage of Mergo's realm forever. When we make contact with the Brain of Mensis and it answers back saying "Moon", it's just because... Well, it is the amalgamation of the brains of the scholars of Mensis. They always had the Moon in mind. It's their thing. It's a hint at its true identity.
Also, does the Moon Pressence's body have messengers on it? Doesn't look like it in game. Is that picture from the official art book or something? Never saw it before, I'm genuinely curious.
Keep going with the amazing work!
Man. After all these years, I'm still discovering new things about Bloodborne through UA-camrs like you. I had ZERO clue optics played such a role.
It makes me so happy that science, philosophy and their history has come into the mainstream fromsoft theory community in such force. Elden Archeologist, you're super articulate, hardworkin and astute dude, idk if I tottaly agree that the mensis brain IS the moon presence, maybe it's warning us of them? Unless I'm missing something.
I have actually gotten weird looks for pointing at the inspiration for fromsoft being the sort of basic science related to the phenomenon of consciousness. So I appreciate your hard work.
You’re missing esoterica and metaphysics but yeah I agree. They mostly cover all angles.
The maya had pools of mercury deep in caves to reflect the night sky
I think the make contact gesture is just making a right triangle. And right triangles are related to many many mathematical and engineering concepts. That's why the brain responds, you proved yourself to be conscious of the code of the universe.
Since I played Bloodborne, I've wondered why we had to go through the lake to get to Rom. This channel ALWAYS surprises me in the best possible ways, discovering new facts from a game that came out almost 8 years ago is an amazing thing to feel. Thank you a lot
Another banger 🔥 Your Bloodborne series is a joy to watch. I love the historical, scientific, and religious context that you bring into your videos.
Thanks!
There is a lot of in game lore hints that talk about the brain being rotted with bad eyes. I like the theory that the brain IS the school of Menses that were "granted eyes" in order to achieve their final goals which other channels relate to ascending to the status of great one.
Fantastic video. Love your videos and love that you're covering Bloodborne.
I was needing a new video. Thank youu 🙏🙏
This channel is really on some next level lore exploration. So glad i subbed
Aw naw dude I ran out of videos. 😭..... What do i do now. You've got me playing Bloodborne again and everything. Such a great channel
I'm with others that aren't quite convinced the brain is the moon presence as you fight it's dream form after all in the hunters dream. Also i know cut content isn't canon but I'm pretty sure there is a "physical" moon presence you can fight in the chalice dungeons using one of the special seeds/codes that contain it
The baths remind me of a baptismal font, which is interesting because baptism (arguably the most important sacrament) is conspicuously absent from all the lore videos I have seen discussing the Catholic parallels. Water baptism symbolizes death and rebirth, the Flood of Noah being a typological baptism for example. Could the corpses in the walls of Yahar'gul be meant to evoke something similar?
Candles are also used in the sacrament of baptism by the way
Possibly worth noting as well that when the player wakes up in the font, it's after submerging himself in the lake (the word baptism etymologically means submersion) and defeating Rom there.
Interestingly, the Lake rune item descriptions also compare the utterance of the Great Ones to a 'watery reflection.'
I was awaiting expectant a new video of yours. I recently found your channel and got hooked to your videos. The arcane magic that this games ooze and the great repertoire of annecdotes and details you can sprinkle everything to reinforce what you say is fascinating.
However, a humble tip I'd like to give you is to avoid using the word "literally" in unnecesary, or even wrong situations. It sort of sullies what you say, which is a shame, because your script is very carefully written and it shows.
Anyways, keep it up!
Ebrietas OF is absolutely goated, not even debatable.
Best lore video ive ever seen man. Good stuff you are underatted TA
I personally think the Mensis scholars were making portals to try and find out where the fuck all the missing socks keep disappearing to when you do laundry. It's them fuckin sock gnomes, I know it. But where do they go?
I don't agree with all your points, but it was definetly a very interesting and insightful video. Very good job, especially when relating the in game lore to irl scientific developments
30:09
You go below the church and find Erebus(?) the butterfly great one with wings to fly on.
She is there trying to revive Rom.
Now we see a statue mimicking that of the one she is reviving: without a head.
And when we revive the queen… she imitates said queen via being smashed to bits by us.
When we defeats Laurence he was not beheaded but he was once.
But both ROM and Laurence were defeated by us.
Does this mean to fulfill the ritual that she has to follow in some way the path of those she revived?
She even has a swarm of the babies around her similar to that which protected ROM…
It may be possible do this is true that the statue actually resembles the abandoned great one when not reviving someone- or at least not reviving someone who has already gone through a transformation.
This may actually have been done with our Clinic girl… it would make sense that this is where her doppelgänger came from.
Banger work as always. No one does it like you.
Gotta admit you caught me off guard with that sponsor, nice job TH!