Professor Kathleen Stock | This House Believes in the Right to Offend
Вставка
- Опубліковано 7 січ 2023
- November 17th 2022 at 20:00 in the Debating Chamber
Debate Results: Ayes: 217 | Absn: 140 | Noes: 72
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Thumbnail Photographer: Flo Tawns
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Second Proposition
Professor Stock is a philospher, writer and formerly professor of Philosphy at the University of Sussex, until she resigned in October 2021 following attacks on her by colleagues as well as a student campaign. She has published academic works on aesthetics, fiction, imagination, and now writes on sex and gender identity, as well as the nature of the womanhood.
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Here is a person saying what they think whilst being acutely aware of how unfair their persecution is. This woman is a credit to herself.
She is a credit to philosophy, to freethought and to Enlightenment values in general.
An absolute legend.
She had to explain to a Cambridge student that sexism was not seen as wrong in the fifteenth century? 😂😂
Professor Stock. The more I see you, the more I admire you. So stoic in the face of such adversity. And so smart.
She's a very brave woman.
You see what you want to see
I found this quite rattling. So impressed with Kathleen. Why are people challenging her during her initial speech?This was clearly a formal presentation. She took interruptions from the audience all the way through. Sooo brave to take on a turbulent audience with protests outside. She was clearly unsettled; I’m not sure I could have finished.
She's calling for an end to trans people and you're worried about her security? Have some compassion.
@@jesipohl6717 Really? Produce some evidence to back up your claim.
The challenges are allowed under the specific rules of the house. The speaker is however not obliged to let the challenger speak. Kathleen chose to do so.
@@jesipohl6717 This would be the part where you present credible evidence that Professor Stock has ever suggested that trans people should be "ended."
Please proceed.
She did seem quite nervous - more so than I've seen her before. She may have felt limited by the time in which she was allowed to speak.
Also, this seems to be not a one-off presentation or speech, but part of a debate run at Cambridge University. In such debates, there are two or more speakers for each side on the debate - the "affirmative side" supporting the proposition and the "negative side" arguing against the proposition. Prof. Stock seems to refer to the other speaker on her side (the affirmative).
Especially iff Prof. Stock was the second speaker on her team, her speech would have had to involve rebuttal of previous speaker(s) on the opposing side - which requires a lot of quick thinking on one's feet, without being able to rely on preparation and pre-writing of a speech.
In such a debate:
A) Each speaker is limited in the time they are allowed to speak. A bell indicates that their time is running out, and would also be used to indicate that the speaker's time had run out if they went on too long.
B) Audience members are permitted to interrupt the speaker on the grounds of a "Point of information". These interruptions are essentially allowed for audience members to query any point the speaker has just made, asking for further or deeper information on the point. Basically: what supports the point of information the speaker just said, or here is this point that argues against the point the speaker just made.
C) The debate speaker is not obliged to accept "point of information" queries from the audience members. They can just say, "No thanks" and plough on with what they are saying. Prof. Stock here is quite generous in both taking and responding to the points of information audience members interrupt her with. The one she baulks at and then refuses is the one raised by one of the speakers on the oppositing team of the debate itself.
Kathleen Stock has the patience of a saint. They’re given such a short time to speak, that the interrupters couldn’t wait til she finished her carefully laid out train of thought is astonishing. And disappointing.
Insolent & petulant children.
A growing trend for Gen Z
And typical. We have let the transgender/self-ID religion tyrannize our liberal society.
I wholeheartedly agree, what has offended me listening to this is the total inability to let the invited speaker finish a sentence. I was a punk as a teenager but I still treated others as I would wish to be treated.
The new generation is spoiled and miseducated. You can experiment that everyday everywhere. A selfish and narcissist generation endoctrined by wokism and cancel culture
They will pay it very hard in the future. The backlash will be very violent.
I think questions for clarifications are included in the format of this sort of debate.
'Speak the Truth, even if your voice shakes"
Kathleen, you absolute BEAUTY, thank you for being brave enough to say what every intelligent person is thinking
Keep going Kathleen. Never stop. You are loved and respected by the majority.
Bravo Kathleen to continue so calmly in the face of rude, impulsive people who find it hard to listen for 10 minutes without erupting, as well as commenting on the physiological effects you were experiencing yourself due to the angry interruptions. Is this the level of exchange that Cambridge students engage in?
Tell me about it, because I couldn't make out what they were saying without subtitles.
Speak even if your voice shakes! Thank you prof Stock!
I can't believe so much of her time - and our time as an audience - was wasted by people who were prattling on with such boring points. She's a gifted thinker and speaker - so let her speak. Listen. Then ask and carry on the conversation.
That’s far too much of a mature request!
She was nervous otherwise she could have ignored them. Having said that the chairman should have shut them down, badly chaired by the Cambridge Union.
@@gareth2736 "Madam president" who sat with crossed legs and wearing a bare-shouldered evening gown to the proceedings. Phffft!
What is a woman? Professor Kathleen Stock (a human, adult, female). What a woman too! She’s courageous, highly intelligent and articulate.
My goodness, such a lovely, professional, polite woman carrying on whilst the children are allowed to scream in the halls instead of joining the debate and debating! We need more like her. x
Are you screaming in a hallway?
Thank you Dr. Stock for your calm, sensible reasoning even in the face of utter lunacy.
Great to see Kathleen out and about. What happened to her was a fkn disgrace.
what happened to her ?
She quit, and the "bullying" she mentioned was actually a seperate lecture about trans lives co-occuring within the same time frame as her lecture.
@@jesipohl6717 Did the bullies tell you that?
@@_Sakidora_ the fact that she quit Was widely reported. And that her bullying claims have often fallen flat is not surprising. How Band people did you know growing up who called people names "masked men, women in dresses" and then went on to claim they were the one being bullied.
Stock's "academic freedom" looks an aweful lot like her white cis privilege.
@@jesipohl6717
You are a misinformed troll, you know very well Prof Stock was subject to 3 years of intimidation and death threats which made her tenure... untenable.
Your subjective and selective arguments are clear for all to see. Wise up and allow real debate; get out of your echo chamber of ' right-on' nonsense.
The ability to lay out one complex point after another, making them very easy to understand, while in a hostile cauldron, with a mob outside deliberately making extremely distracting noise, after just having been called DISGUSTING, which half the room applauded, and switch instantaneously out of her own thoughtstream to precisely answer questions, then switch straight back into her own thoughtstream, to do it all with crystal clear pronunciation, at speed, despite being obviously stressed, is an absolute masterclass in intellect and courage. John Wick eat your heart out.
Agreed with you. Massive intellect, courage, and patience.
What a brave and intelligent woman.
All she’s saying should be obvious in 2023. We’re in a bad situation.
Am i imagining it or is there clearly noise from outside trying to disrupt this event?
It's very apparent that on the controversy that has followed Professor Stock one side has arguments and rationality and the other side has emotions and the willingness to silence and crush any dissent rather than the ability to back up most of what they claim.
Kathleen Stock is clearly a thoughtful, compassionate and incredibly resilient human being.
If any of them are students they should be sent down.
Yes
Yes there is a protest going on outside
I recommend you look up the entire debate for appropriate context. For example, the first speaker on Prof Stock’s proposition side used their time to personally attack her and decry the University for inviting her on campus. There were more such direct attacks, so along with the protesters shrieking outside the hall, you can better understand why she appears so rattled.
You are correct, I saw it and she is more gracious than I would have been in dealing w/ those quarterwits.
Are there penalties for making personal comments in a debate?
So the people opposing the motion were utilising their right to offend in order to argue that no such right exists?
@@MrSamuelHorton and some people nominally in favour of the motion used their right to offend to declare that their team member Stock was too offensive to be invited to speak.
I’m really surprised this union allows people to stand up and interrupt a speaker. It is vulgar to me
What a brilliant, inspiring woman. More power to her.
I think what she says makes a lot of sense. I agree a society needs to make space for heretical thoughts, and to not persecute people with differing opinions as it is doing now. Thank you Kathleen and Cambridge University for this video.
She quit her job after calling for an end to trans people. Trans people are not calling fir an end to women. Not so sure you nor Stock understand the word "persecuted". By your definition, Putin could be described as persecuted.
Calling for an end to trans people? Wow that is an hyperbole seen from space,.
@@jesipohl6717 She has never called for the end of trans people, so please provide proof of this allegation. She was forced out of her position by intolerance.
Part of the issue is that she largely holds the majority opinion, yet is being supressed by a smal minority of extremists who are either in positions of power or group together to wield power through disingenuous bully tactics.
Jesi when. Did she ask for an end to grabs people?
Why did the ‘president’ of the debate allow this personal attack on Kathleen Stock? If these students at one of the world’s elite universities are the cream of the young intelligentsia we are all in big trouble.
She’s great. What a joy to listen to such a clever thinking woman.
Preserve this woman. Respect from Queen's U, Canada.
Brave woman. You could tell she was nervous in her voice. Well done to Prof.
Great statement by Prof. Stock. Also, I love that you can hear the sad mob chanting outside!
Kathleen Stock is an absolute boss. From a generation with the courage to storm the beaches at Normandy to a generation convinced they're all going to drown in a glass of water.
Great analogy! 👍
And that the glass of water was part of some genocidal conspiracy
Indeed! This new generation of young people are seriously BAD TO THE CORE!
@Robert Haines Absolutely spot on!
Please do not read the following if you are of a sensitive nature.
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I do not disagree with your assessment of her at all, she is fabulous. But she is not from the generation which stormed the beaches at Normandy, LOL!! That would be one or two prior.
Prof Stock is GREAT !
Listening to this I found myself massively offended by the protests…
Well done Kathleen.
Someone needs to tell the men in this audience to "let women speak."
Women have been speaking for the last 60 years and look at where it has gotten us.
Exactly, let women speak. Stop trying to drown out women's voices or ignore their concerns. Those people interrupting should've been shut dowwnnnn.
@@almostafa4725 access to education, rights to vote, childcare, healthcare, rights not to be assaulted, rights to protection.... Yup, that's what it got us. Yay!! 👏
@@almostafa4725 Get back in your time machine and go back to 1723.
@@almostafa4725 right to divorce you lol
Bravo Kathleen!
She is just that good! Well done Prof Kathleen Stock, brilliant under pressure. Thank you.
I think she's flustered because she is realizing she's talking to insane people.
She is remarkably composed despite the hysterical attacks. Why does the Chair do nothing?
She is flustered because there is a massive protest against her outside of the debating chamber.
She's a leftist. She's beholden to the wokies. We need proper reactionaries who will take pride and pleasure in defeating them.
I think the impact of the lengths to which such train of thoughts could lead (ahem, Handmaid's Tale), is very difficult to debate, when she's simply up against "feelings". It is like talking to a brick wall.
I"m offended people won't let her speak without interruption!
I believe this debating style permits questions from the floor. It is up to the speaker whether to answer the question, ignore it or postpone it until she finished her current point. It is very similar to the point of information in british parliamentary style debates mimicking the debates in the House of Commons. The protest however was uncalled for and such a disruption to this debate.
She is so brave-bless you Professor Stock.
@AlexandriaOccasional-Cor-zf7xp now having an opinion makes u bigot? The corners of your neighborhood are too narrow.
@Alexandria Occasional-Cortex how? Explain your point of view
@Really There Explain his point of view?!!!! Without his comfort blanket?!!!!!!
Are you completely without feeling?!!!!!
@@tcrown3333 you do make a good point
@@reallythere I try! 🤣😉
I saw the comments from the person preceding her speech, who clearly opposed her being permitted to talk. I think what rattled her and left her clearly visibly upset was the pure utter hatred that person displayed towards her in a public debate, purely because she holds a different opinion (that is all it is..)
What is tragic is that these young people are supposed to represent the very best of our young people. The more I see of this kind of behaviour, and the lemmings that blindly follow, the more depressed I get and despair for the future of our country.
The hope is with people like Kathleen Stock who are brave enough to speak out against the madness that has descended on society. I really hope that the person displaying that hatred might one day reflect and ask themselves, really, who is the one with the problem here.
Can you share those comments? And don't worry about the future, society wibble-wobbles back and forth in 70-year intervals
We have got to put a stop to this level of self entitlement and narcissistic behaviour coming from those who are attempting to silence and intimidate individuals they disagree with. Rather than having an exchange of views and being involved in the discussion in a calm and mature way. Quite frightening.
I agree. The other thing that needs changing is what seems to be a growing tendency for people to respond to what they *think* someone's said, rather than what they've actually said. I listened to a podcast called "The Witch Trials of JK Rowling", and in the episode where they spoke to her critics, every single argument, without exception, was the critic's own extrapolation and inference, not what JKR had actually said. The same thing applies to Kathleen and her critics. I find this infuriating and obstructive, because we need debate to move ideas forwards, and we can't have it if people aren't listening and understanding each side properly. Straw men do not make solid foundations for advancement of thoughts, ideas, morals etc.
One thing is painfully clear! Many of the youth of today are disrespectful, entitled brats. No manners, no morals & no clue how to behave respectfully. If someone has been given the floor, then respectfully give them the floor & debate their points afterwards. That is how civilised, mature & respectable people conduct themselves. These “children” & I’ll call them children are being disruptive, rude & insolent. They need to take a long hard look at themselves in all honesty. They spend their time twisting narratives to suit a narcissistic ego & call it free speech & inclusivity. They will be humanities down fall.
You know what, even if I disagreed with her (and I don't tbh), I'd be impressed with her composure and want to give her a hug after watching this.
The interruptions shouldn't have been allowed! Where are the moderators to remind the audience of protocol? It's bad enough you can hear protestors chanting outside, the speakers should've been allowed to speak without interruption.
Admire your courage .shame on those who seem unable to.listen to different perspectives
Full of class and calm. Well done, KS!
This poor woman is being bullied in the most repulsive way.
Why are audience member allowed to interupt with a speech? Total chaos.
Because it’s effectively just a room filled with entitled, insolent children.
It is based on the workings of the House of Commons
Wish the interruptions were audible. Though the chair should shut them up. She is brilliant and admirable.
The mob are indefensible
If students would actually just stop for one second and actually listen to what Kathleen actually says rather than wanting to take offence they would truely learn something. I would have loved to have teachers and professors like her to listen to because shes engaging, easy to listen to and understand. Universities and students are only doing themselves a diservice by trying to shut her down.
Thank you, Professor, you are absolutely great.
I am offended by the idea that we no longer have a right to offend… by their own logic, censors should have no right to voice their censorship, then.
As a Libertarian... Thank you Ms. Stock! 👏 All valid and logically neutral. As it should be!
She is actually very brave for making it through that. Shame on Cambridge University for putting her through that.
The challenge I have with these videos is that in many of them the people in the background are obviously not paying the slightest attention to the speaker.
Such a profoundly impressive person. Incredibly brave and erudite
So that’s THE Cambridge?! 🤯
I was very surprised and not a little annoyed that the Chairperson appeared to have no idea about what her function entailed, namely to keep order, and preserve civility in the debate. Questions to the speaker are for when the speaker has finished speaking. Even a school debating Society knows this!
Not exactly, this style of debate allows questions during the speech. The speaker can then allow the question to be asked, ignore it or postpone it until you have finished your arguments. It works in a very similar fashion to the point of informations in british parliamentary style debates as seen in the house of commons. So the interruptions are perfectly acceptable and the chair is correct in not doing anything. The protest outside is abhorrent and very disruptive.
Very well said Prof!
brave and resilient woman, she inspires me every day.
Hooray for Kathleen Stock, she is amazing.
What an inspiring and amazing women, staying strong despite all the madness and animosity around her. Awful that she lost her job for speaking the truth and awful how she's being treated here. This felt like watching a witch trial, horrible how polarised and irrational people are now. Trans women are not real women. Hope she keeps up this amazing work of speaking out. Thank you to her 🤍🙏🏻
She understandably appears extremely nervous with so much hostility towards her
Her views on self id are shared by the overwhelming majority of the population. It's time for the silent majority to do more to stand up for people like Kathleen. We can't let the screeching fascists win.
Historically, fascists fall on the anti-trans side of things...
Kathleen is amazing 🥰
*BRAVO* to this amazing woman!!! 💗💗💗
What a brilliant human. A hero. Full stop.
Well said, Professor, some didn't make it easy for you, but you finished.
Great speech, really enjoyed her clarity of thought.
Why do people keep interrupting her? Is that part of the format, and if so, why weren't they given mics? So annoying when you're trying to listen to her excellent points and people keep interrupting and throwing her off.
Why do you want trans people not to exist, why are you afraid of us? Do you know any trans people? Do you know the definition of persecution. It's not an overprivileged white woman leaving her job after attacking trans existence, hint.
I think it's like the Oxford format where anyone is allowed to voice a challenge but it's up to the speaker if they want to allow or reply.
@@jesipohl6717 I don't, I'm not, I do, I do. Did you watch this video and listen to her arguments? Because the topic up for discussion had nothing to do with trans rights.
@@smoss9813 Ah right. Very distracting. They should let them finish their prepared statements and then maybe do a few minutes of rebuttals or whatever, rather than having random interruptions. Also the fact that the questions couldn't be heard made it sort of pointless for the viewer.
Yes, the President should have shut them up. These interruptions would certainly not have been permitted when I was an undergraduate.
Love how Ms Stock just calmly says "Noooh." "You can't change sex".
we can all imagine woke cultist with forks and torches
Well done done that woman!
The way this is going, future historians will pick devastating characterisations of the predominant attributes for the current generation of young people.
A mature woman with lots of life experience standing there heckled by children with warped ideas on the world (i.e. men can somehow become women based on feelings, whom in fact have serious mental health problems) and if you criticize these ideas, you're offensive and need to be cancelled and destroyed. These kids need discipline in form of a solid fist to knock a bit of reality back into these fascists
The dark ages ended some time ago.
Agreed!!
@@anonnymous4684 we have now entered the Woke LOST Age
Dr. Stock, what a legend you are 👏👏👏
Thank you Prof Stock,I could listen to you for hours.
You should have your own radio/television debate programme,you are an eloquent orator very clear and precise.
Keep doing what you are doing and ignore illiterate,undisciplined children…..
I served in the military to defend our rights to express ourselves in society not only the LGBTQ+ community…..
SHERO. This is what actual bravery looks like.
We love you ❤You are an amazing courageous inspiration for all Women
I always enjoy listening to Kathleen. Somewhat surprised that this is subject matter for discussion at university level however. I'm not offended if you disagree.
The White Ivory towers now collude in Lockstep with NAZISM & EUGENICS MEANING ALL the loud mouthed stupid offended are CHEAP & never about the message. When EUGENICS Comes to suck their blood, brains & organs those OhSo Offended will be screaming - crap, age was right and I contributed to this hell on earth & full
on genocide of all humans, starting with my appalling dramatic exclusion of intelligent thought & speech when everyone had a voice in fact, platforms to express their minds. The child pedophilia/Trans movement of 1% lovers pushing us towards full on Eugenics!
I salute this woman
Thanks to KS and others who have faced the mob bullies. If they wish to believe that the world is flat be careful not to go too close to the edge
Hmm interesting Christopher Hitchens had to argue similar things in the face of religion. He would be turning in his grave now if he saw the nonsense with current issues of people being outraged so easily.
Brilliant ! 👍
Truth and Justice WILL PREVAIL 💀⚔️🕊️
I am shocked to hear Cambridge students mindlessly chanting outside the Union!
It has happened at Oxford too, I admit. The Chair should have kept better control of those
students interrupting the guest speaker.
I believe this debating style permits questions from the floor. It is up to the speaker whether to answer the question, ignore it or postpone it until she finished her current point. It is very similar to the point of information in british parliamentary style debates mimicking the debates in the House of Commons. The protest however was uncalled for and such a disruption to this debate.
Kathleen Stock is SO right!
The irony and entitlement of men standing up to interrupt a speech, because they feel they can.
I searched for her at the Oxford Union-- but I found her here at the Cambridge Union. She wasn't allowed to debate there at Oxford?
It's crazy that a non-conservative could be so easily shunned by those who've traditionally championed freedom of speech-- the Liberals.
A lady of courage! There are many people like her in the world.Sadly, without her guts!
From 3:45, sounds like there were protests? About Stock being allowed to talk? Sadly very predictable.
Not allowed, but rather invited and paid to give a lecture about her genocidal program of ending trans existence. Her ideology fits Lemkin et al.'s definition.
@@jesipohl6717 please provide evidence that she has a "genocidal program of ending trans existance". The only 2 arguments I see are that 1)biological sexes must be recognized, and 2) people should have a right to offend
@@jesipohl6717 it sounds like you haven't actually read book, is that true?
@@jesipohl6717 Not ‘genocide’. You keep using that word while evidently having no idea what it means
Trans is not a race or ethnicity. It is a made-up concept with no basis in verifiable fact or biology, to allow people struggling with difficult personal problems a focus for their energy. It’s like saying Emo or Goth should have been a protected category of human.
Also, no one is trying to hurt you. You are exaggerating for dramatic effect. Most people would happily go about their business and ignore you dressing however you like - dinosaur, kangaroo, what have you.
_Demanding_ that everyone around you go along with your cosplay puts you in the same category as a toddler throwing a tantrum, and should be treated accordingly, with the word ‘No.’ Which is, by the way, a complete sentence.
@@jesipohl6717 " about her genocidal program of ending trans existence"
could you explain that program? What exactly is she proposing that will try to "end trans existence"?
Good to see the bullying, rudeness, ad hominem attacks and hostility (all the things TRANS people fear) would not shut this strong woman up.
Not only is there a right to offend, there is also a right to be offended.
The crowd probably forgot that they were talking to a Philosopher. Her intelligence is way beyond their comprehension . Her politeness deserve respect.
She scolded them sarcastically😂😂😂
The woman speaks sense. She also a lovely person.
She’s simply amazing. Wow!
I wonder how they made it into university at all with all those interruptions.
Amazing woman. Why the f would Cambridge allow interruptions? What a joke of an institution.
this style of debate allows questions during the speech. The speaker can then allow the question to be asked, ignore it or postpone it until you have finished your arguments. It works in a very similar fashion to the point of informations in british parliamentary style debates as seen in the house of commons. So the interruptions are perfectly acceptable and the chair is correct in not doing anything. The protest outside is abhorrent and very disruptive.
The rudeness of students interrupting an invited speaker and not be challenged for doing so reflects badly on the institution .I.e. the Cambridge Union. Shame !
Amazed at the impatience and lack of manners amongst the Cambridge students. Wow.
Like beauty, offense is in the eye of the beholder. You can be offended by anything you want. That should not be taken as a right to silence anyone with whom you disagree.
I wish one day to be a 100th as a courageous as this gravely brave woman. God bless her and I fully support her efforts against the moral and intellectual dilution that is transgender ideology - soon I hope washed away and not remember by history
Nervous? Needing to go to the toilet? Anyway, big fan of Professor Stock. PS it's pathetic that students can't manage to keep quiet during speeches and that they are not put in their place immediately when they interrupt. Everyone in that room including Prof Stock was far too tolerant of the interruptor. Was it not laid out in the beginning that interruptions were not welcome?
So you want freedom of expression or not? I'm confused, because when protesters are outside it's also not ok. When is it OK to protest?
@@jesipohl6717 it's not OK when it prevents people from speaking. Freedom of expression doesn't mean the right to interfere with the expression of others. I didn't say anything about it not being OK to protest outside. I would say if the protest is so threatening that huge security bills get raised and charged to the institution, thereby sometimes shutting down events, that is not ideal.
@@chelseapoet3664 so all the silenced trans people that are never given a chance to speak as cis people choose who speak, what about them? Stock's "academic freedom" looks strangely a lot like her cis whit privilege.
As for freedom of speech, if you really cared, you'd be up in arms about the laws silencing trans people and allies from reporting science and administering scientifically proven life-saving care.
You're a bigot.
@@chelseapoet3664 I better see you opposing all the proud boys and terfs shutting down drag story hour.
She was probably, understandably afraid of the screaming fascists outside
Very brave to talk back to a student union that invited you to control you. 👏👏👏👏👏
Absolutely excellent woman and power to her X