As a Patreon supporter, I like the summary table but it's not the reason I pledged my support. I get a lot of value from your videos. As an engineer, there are only a few creators I can watch without cringing, and you are at the top of the list. I'm happy to be able to play a very tiny part in supporting your channel.
I agree. The summary is very useful but it’s not the primary reason I support the channel. The testing is valuable even if only viewed video by video. Many thanks, Igor. If you think it would help promote the channel and prevent someone making money off your work perhaps you could make the summary open to everyone. I don’t need a gift to want to support your work.
Same here, Igor. As an engineer, I really appreciate the work you put into all of this and everything you do. I love the juicy data, but that's only part of it. And today, I learned about how to improve my ASA and ABS overhangs with cooling! Thank you!
I really like your channel. Not sure why UA-cam doesn't. I'm an engineer, so I think your channel and videos feed into that. Some people get engineering degrees, but are not an engineer. An engineer will do it for the love of inventing/tinkering/designing/programming etc.
I'm a simple man - I see a new upload from you and I watch it. Always enjoy your method of testing filaments. Much more impartial than most (who are sponsored) youtubers in the 3D printing scene.
One thing I noticed using/test both myself is that the ASA Prime is quite a bit more sensitive to moisture than ABS Prime, it needs to be dried, the abs one does not. Another thing I noticed different from other ASA/ABS types is that it sticks to the bed a LOT better, even with no glue/spray/whatev, it also does not require too high temperatures, I print both at 60º to 70º! They are also less prone to shrinking, I can print bigger stuff without enclosures and since it does not require so hot a bed it works just fine in simpler printers such as Bambu A1 mini :)
I think the parallel existence of ABS and ASA is easy to explain - inertia in the market place, not really for any technical reason. ABS was invented first (1948) while ASA wasn't invented until the 1980's. ABS is still used because so many things were designed to be made from ABS plastics including interior car parts, plastic toys etc...(Lego!) and for the things it's used for its "good enough" with no compelling reason to switch to another material unless you need a property like UV resistance where ASA has a clear advantage. So when consumer 3D printing first came along supply chains for ABS pellets that could be made into filament were far more readily available and cheaper than ASA - ABS was one of the first 3D printing materials (before PLA I think ?) while ASA is very recent for consumer 3D printing. Initially ASA was a more expensive filament (still is in some brands) due to a smaller commercial supply of the material, so ABS had a reason to exist but that difference is going away. At the point when they reach universal price parity you do have to wonder why ABS still exists other than to allow people already printing in ABS to continue to do so. But if you were starting 3D printing today and they are the same price then I would say skip over ABS altogether. ASA is either equal to or significantly better than ABS in nearly every metric as your tests and many others show. I print in PLA, PETG, TPU and ASA - I have no interest in printing in ABS because it's a backwards step from ASA in almost every way and offers no unique or significant benefits over ASA. ASA really is just a better ABS.
Supposedly asa is harder to color vs. Abs when injection molding and when injection molding asa its supplied already with colored pellets rather than coloring the batch on site. Also well for most injection molded uses the things that make it nice to 3d print dont matter.
I find your videos very intresting, actually they are the reference for me whenever I want to check for a material a specific properties or just check any new filament...Very nice work!!
Your videos are amazing, I'm very surprised that YT doesn't appreciate them and hope it's not the case, that said, we do appreciate them! As a fellow engineer I can say that your videos are very helpful and professional, well done!
Igor, for what i have learned from Your videos, and what makes me return to watch for more, You should put a paywall behind your data. I would never resell it no matter what, but would see no issue to pay a one off sum or recurring amount should i ever want to access it in a professional matter. You should not be ashamed to earn from your honest unbiased and valuable work. That being said i am subscribed to Your channel, but sadly i am not planning to become a patreon or use of your data in any organized manner.
I would like to make a suggestion for a future video/series: How does layer height (and possibly also in combination with speed) affect strength - most likely just in the realm of layer adhesion. The best I can find on this topic is a 5 year old video from CNC Kitchen on this topic tilted "The influence of layer height on the strength of FDM 3D prints" that talks about layer heights of .1, .15 and .20 - which don't exactly align to today's layer heights in modern slicers. Also 5 years ago in 3D printing might as well have been 20 years ago given the printer speed and filament quality enhancements since then. My primary motivator for this topic is I am 3D printing light sabers for my kids, and I want the best layer adhesion possible, especially for the collapsible "blades". Beyond light sabers, I often will drop the layer height down to .16 or even .12 to try and make whatever I am printing as strong as possible, so it would be good to have more recent guidance from someone I consider to the GOAT of 3D printing strength testing. 😁 Lastly, I don't do a lot with Patreon so I want to encourage you to explore the UA-cam membership system as I would sign up for the like $2.99 a month to help out the channel and you amazing efforts.
Whether overextrusion affects strength should also be investigated, I print parts that need strength at 103% flow hoping the extra material squishing against each other would be beneficial
@@youtubehandlesux Excellent addition to the idea! We should probably also consider printing temps because I think hotter filaments will take longer to cool and that might enhance layer bonding.
After so many testings, I don't really see the reason for using the ABS. In most cases (mechanical properties) the ASA is better. Additionally, it is UV, weather resistant, less smell.. There are some diferences between manufacturers, but for example Prusament don't even have ABS from exactly this reason.
I can say it warps more and has more odor. It also seemed to be more flexible, but no actual testing to back that up. This is compared to Polymaker, Flashforge and Prusament. I have some Sunlu that I haven't tried yet.
@@MyTechFun to me it says it is in stock, on their EU website... the "some items are out of stock" written appears to me when I checkout, but that regardless of what I try to buy on their website, and it does let me order it. What actually worries me is that 15€ shipping fee...
Hi Igor! Nice video as always! Just an idea, but maybe a collab with Stefan from CNC kitchen can attract more visibility to your channel. I know that it's not that simple, but it may be worth a shot. Cheers from France!
Probably he don't want to colaborate with so small channel like mine. Additionally, we went in very different direction with his videos. I am missing his filament testings from the "old times".
So annoying. Gotta love it when people consider simply saving data that someone else created through hard work as their own "achievement" and then even go so far to sell it. And then they start talking about CC licenses as their defense completely ignoring that it's a question of principle and decency. Besides, the right CC license can also mean you are free to use it but not commercial for profit. I'm already a Patreon supporter, mainly because I just want to support your work, Igor and not just for the data lists. But hearing this makes me angry... I have to deal with other people selling my work which I share with the 3D printing community for free (but not for commercial use), so I am familiar with how shitty this feels.
Thank you for your support. And as I mentioned in the video, I will continue providing individual excel tables too. It was just temporary anger, but I am over it..
I agree, the main advantage of ABS is lower price. I noticed that they slightly reduced the price of their ABS Prime. It's still high for ABS, but one could argue that it's an enhanced version of ABS.
I use ABS and ASA pretty much interchangeably and don't really bother with the distinction that much. I find most differences between the two plastics seem to vary more across different manufacturers/base resins than between the material itself. Azurefilm ABS was probably the smelliest I have printed yet. I started a print in the evening, and when I came back into the room the next morning, I thought I'd need a gas mask to reach the window. I think I might have heard my Nevermore crying somewhere in the corner. I have another spool of Azurefilm ABS I bought together with that first one, but I have not yet dared printing it.
I would love to see if the reduced warping persists when you use a printer without an enclosure. I think the need for an enclosure is the main entrance barrier to ABS-like materials for most people. The manufacturer claims it works, so maybe give it a try and share the results? I would highly appreciate it! AzureFilm on ASA Prime: "We recommend using an enclosure or enclosed 3D printer, though this material can be printed without an enclosure."
Thanks again Igor. I find ASA more prone to warping than ABS so I use more ABS - except AzureFilm. I haven't used the Prime version but I have found Azure ASA to not warp unlike others I have tried from various manufacturers. I don't understand the algorithm at all - whenever anyone on Reddit asks about materials, I point them to MyTechFin. I have a question though: when the eBay impact tester is set up and calibrated, will you be running your DIY setup alongside it? If not, newer results will no.longer be comparable with the older ones. Fory purposes, I'm not overly interested in the actual figures using industry-standard equipment and methods. My interest is in relative impact resistance, so your results are good because they are a consistent set of results across the range. That makes them directly comparable in relative terms.
I've noticed the opposite. ABS warps and shrinks all the time while ASA (at least from Extrudr) almost prints like PLA. ASA also smells less bad, so my ABS is collecting dust. I also saw one video with a guy, that was only printing in ABS and puts out a box with about 2 years old ABS-parts stored in the dark. He could break the parts apart like they were made out of old bread. Not sure how reliable is ASA in the long term, but certainly PETG holds up better even if it's in the sun on a daily basis.
Hi, I'm not a Patreon supporter but I might be soon. I'm an engineer with 14 years of experience that has started 3D printing 2 months ago (averaging 2 kg/week). I mostly print Polymaker ASA for practical parts so this is an area where I might have some useful feedback. The biggest problem with ASA is warping--I have invested a lot of time and money into sealing my P1S and regulating the chamber temperature so that it stays at 60C. Printing ASA with chamber temperatures less than 50C is a recipe for disaster--certain types of parts will warp with incredible force, and you can only slightly mitigate this by going slow. You should do a side-by-side comparison of the regular ASA and this ASA Prime to judge this warping. Since you have a X1C, I recommend you build the 2nd AUX fan (link after my message) for 2 reasons: 1) the 2nd AUX fan will make your overhangs better on the right side of the bed, and 2) the upper duct (the piece rendered in orange) is a perfect test of warping. Finally, I am interested in learning what Azure did to the ASA formulation. According to their site, ASA Prime has lower UV resistance than regular ASA--that is a big compromise that cannot be ignored for practical parts. I would like to know how much less the UV resistance is. www.printables.com/model/435201-bambu-lab-p1-x1-dual-aux-fan-bentobox-728-updated
@@EliteMacFreak I print primarily with ASA as well. I don’t have any problems with warping anymore. I use an X1C, polylite ASA, chamber temp >40C, bed 90C, magigoo on high temp plate. I run a max volume speed of 12mm3/s since I need part strength. For my wide and tall parts I put thin vertical slots 1mmx10mm about 3 to 5 mm above the bed every 75 to 100mm to act as strain reliefs during printing. Sometimes I just use 3mm holes. Works like a charm. I credit Igor for putting me on to polylite ASA.
@@riba2233 I've had this account since UA-cam came out (hard to believe it's been been almost 20 years), it's tied into my Gmail account, and although I'm a super-heavy user I rarely post so maybe at this point there's a certain level of trust. Who knows!
@@spongecounter That's interesting. I would think that putting internal voids in the ASA for it to expand and contract would result in very poor dimensional tolerances. Have you ever measured your parts for dimensional accuracy, or is what you're printing not that sensitive?
@@EliteMacFreak for clarity, the slots are only for printing stress and punch though the entire parts. I find they reduce the outer part dimension tolerance variability a tiny amount. Probably because of stress relief as the layers build up. I wish I could add a picture in the comments here.
Fpr asa abs printability is really interesting. Why is this not discussed more. That is usually my they add cf and weird stuff. So what does adding fans do? How does overhangs look withiut fans? This is key to asa abs printing. They are usually durable enough.
Perhaps it’s the chemical properties? Is there a difference? I’m currently repairing my floor from a failed toilet seal, so I’m working with ABS wastewater pipe, and the appropriate ABS glue. If the plastic manufacturers need to manufacture in ABS to maintain compatibility with legacy products, making additive manufacturing filament is probably an easy revenue stream to add to their business.
What do you think is the best filament for gears? Low warping, tough, which brand? For instance, PA12 eSun is better than other Nylons, that I've tried. But it is interesting to try BambuLab PACF, ASA +CF, and PETG +CF.
Thank you for all your work. What about ease of printing? Similar or is one of these printable on a cheap 3d printer with just a hoody ontop (passive heated by hearbed) instead of a full enclosure printer
You have great content and your videos answer important questions for 3D printers and makers. I do, however, sometimes struggle to understand what you are saying due to your accent. Sometimes it's to the point that I stop watching because I am not understanding the content of your video. The algorithm issues may be in response to viewers like me who have an interest in what you are presenting but don't watch it all the way through. I hope what I am saying doesn't discourage you in any way. Despite the difficulty I have, I still look forward to your videos (I've been a subscriber for a while). Kind regards
Thank you for the reply. I am working on my accent, but this is a problem I will always have (I speek 3 languages which I use more ofthen than English). Recently, for more important videos, I started adding a corrected subtitles, to replace automatically generated. I hope this helps.
@@MyTechFun Thank you for the subtitles. 3D Maker, UA-camr, AND 3 languages! That's not a problem! That's impressive! Maybe using an AI service that dubs using your voice is another option. Looking forward to you next video!
For me Igor is easy to listen, maybe because English is also not my 1st language. Rally English FTW - don't let pronunciation and dialect be in your way 😉 I guess you are not British 😅
I would suggest that you don't show the summary in a PDF or excel style but show the grey graphs in full screen mode after each test, I think that would improve the videos. Basically skip the summary and intersperce it between the tests to make it a bit easier to relate to the tests and easier to digest in small amounts.
Between hacks, unexpected policy shifts over the years and unsustainable business model with VC backing, I'm not keen on creating a Patreon account nor leaving them payment details. This jerk, technically legal pirate demonstrated that there's an opportunity for you to sell access to your material testing database outside of Patreon. That'll be another revenue stream outside of UA-cam and Patreon for you, which people like me or industries might vastly prefer. Like for Patreon, you could let the customer set the price: preventing any unfair competition as well as allowing larger donations. Now setup some kind of website and do it! 😎
maybe give your Patreon supporters early access? give them the videos a week early or something? i dunno man. i'd hate to see you go away but can't afford a subscription to anything else at this time.
Thx for suggestions. I create too many videos, I publish them when they are finished. I don't have patience to wait 1 week or so. Sometimes they get access to unlisted video 1-2 days earlier. But soon I will have few videos only for them..
His accent probably is a factor in the popularity of his videos. It is pretty thick. I have to turn on subtitles, and even the subtitle engine has a hard time with it. The first time I heard him saying “share test” I was confused for a second. Then I mentioned that shear rhymes with beer. I don’t think he cares. Hehe. The accent isn’t exactly a huge issue, but I can see people not wanting to struggle with it and just skipping instead.
I appreciate the effort you put into comparing ABS and ASA filaments. However, I’d like to address a couple of issues with the methodology used in the video. Firstly, the sample size of 2 is quite small, which significantly affects the reliability of the conclusions. To better assess the results, it's important to consider the standard deviation and margin of error. With standard deviations of 1.202 for ABS and 0.283 for ASA, and only 2 samples, the degrees of freedom are 1. This results in a t-value of 12.706 for a 95% confidence interval and 6.314 for a 90% confidence interval. Consequently, the confidence intervals are: - **ABS @ 95%**: 56.15 (lower limit) - 66.95 (average) - 77.75 (upper limit) - **ABS @ 90%**: 61.58 (lower limit) - 66.95 (average) - 72.32 (upper limit) - **ASA @ 95%**: 60.46 (lower limit) - 63.00 (average) - 65.54 (upper limit) - **ASA @ 90%**: 61.93 (lower limit) - 63.00 (average) - 64.07 (upper limit) At both 95% and 90% confidence levels, the results are statistically indistinguishable. Secondly, testing different filament colors can influence mechanical properties, as noted by Stefan of CNC Kitchen. Consistency in color is crucial for accurate comparisons. Given your expertise as a mechanical engineer with a Ph.D., I would expect a more scientifically rigorous approach. Providing accurate and reliable information is vital for the makers’ community, and I believe they deserve detailed and precise data. Thank you for considering this feedback.
As you noted, standard deviation isn't really a helpful metric when you have low sample size. If you are going as far as to measure process capability, ideally you need at least 30 parts. and as you noted it will vary further considering spool to spool (long term capability) and color variation. That is a lot of time, money and effort. If MTF had sufficient views or support to sponsor the spools and the weeks required to make a video on the subject, I'm sure it can happen. But practically it's a tough ask.
Probably for same material the color might produce significant changes in properties... but ASA & ABS I do not think it has the sane pigments for blue color for example
@@Duckferd This why then end statistical result is showing large variations. So, we cannot state meaningful conclusions if one product is similar, or better than an other. That way you are misleading the viewer stating conclusions that could be false. It’s will be more important if there results are showing differences that are falling within the margin of error. If there are not enough resources, time and/or money, then don’t do it, unless you want to showoff. If you look at results from Stefan of CNC Kitchen, he presents data that are statistically sound. Why not Igor? Considering he is an engineer with a Ph.D, he should stand to higher scientific standards which I’m certain he can. Igor, continue your efforts, what you are doing is interesting but show the audience what is the differences between professionalism and amateurism.
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
As a Patreon supporter, I like the summary table but it's not the reason I pledged my support. I get a lot of value from your videos. As an engineer, there are only a few creators I can watch without cringing, and you are at the top of the list. I'm happy to be able to play a very tiny part in supporting your channel.
Thank you for kind words and support!
I agree. The summary is very useful but it’s not the primary reason I support the channel. The testing is valuable even if only viewed video by video. Many thanks, Igor.
If you think it would help promote the channel and prevent someone making money off your work perhaps you could make the summary open to everyone. I don’t need a gift to want to support your work.
+1
Same here, Igor. As an engineer, I really appreciate the work you put into all of this and everything you do. I love the juicy data, but that's only part of it. And today, I learned about how to improve my ASA and ABS overhangs with cooling! Thank you!
I really like your channel. Not sure why UA-cam doesn't. I'm an engineer, so I think your channel and videos feed into that. Some people get engineering degrees, but are not an engineer. An engineer will do it for the love of inventing/tinkering/designing/programming etc.
Thanks for your efforts
Thank you for your support!
I'm a simple man - I see a new upload from you and I watch it. Always enjoy your method of testing filaments. Much more impartial than most (who are sponsored) youtubers in the 3D printing scene.
Thanks!
Thank you, I am glad that you find the video useful!
One thing I noticed using/test both myself is that the ASA Prime is quite a bit more sensitive to moisture than ABS Prime, it needs to be dried, the abs one does not.
Another thing I noticed different from other ASA/ABS types is that it sticks to the bed a LOT better, even with no glue/spray/whatev, it also does not require too high temperatures, I print both at 60º to 70º!
They are also less prone to shrinking, I can print bigger stuff without enclosures and since it does not require so hot a bed it works just fine in simpler printers such as Bambu A1 mini :)
I think the parallel existence of ABS and ASA is easy to explain - inertia in the market place, not really for any technical reason.
ABS was invented first (1948) while ASA wasn't invented until the 1980's. ABS is still used because so many things were designed to be made from ABS plastics including interior car parts, plastic toys etc...(Lego!) and for the things it's used for its "good enough" with no compelling reason to switch to another material unless you need a property like UV resistance where ASA has a clear advantage.
So when consumer 3D printing first came along supply chains for ABS pellets that could be made into filament were far more readily available and cheaper than ASA - ABS was one of the first 3D printing materials (before PLA I think ?) while ASA is very recent for consumer 3D printing.
Initially ASA was a more expensive filament (still is in some brands) due to a smaller commercial supply of the material, so ABS had a reason to exist but that difference is going away. At the point when they reach universal price parity you do have to wonder why ABS still exists other than to allow people already printing in ABS to continue to do so.
But if you were starting 3D printing today and they are the same price then I would say skip over ABS altogether. ASA is either equal to or significantly better than ABS in nearly every metric as your tests and many others show.
I print in PLA, PETG, TPU and ASA - I have no interest in printing in ABS because it's a backwards step from ASA in almost every way and offers no unique or significant benefits over ASA. ASA really is just a better ABS.
Such a reasonable explanation. Thanks. Probably in a decade or so, the ASA will completly replace the ABS.
Abs is still avaliable in more colors than asa by far. That's why. Filament companies just need to get on board.
Supposedly asa is harder to color vs. Abs when injection molding and when injection molding asa its supplied already with colored pellets rather than coloring the batch on site.
Also well for most injection molded uses the things that make it nice to 3d print dont matter.
I find your videos very intresting, actually they are the reference for me whenever I want to check for a material a specific properties or just check any new filament...Very nice work!!
Your videos are amazing, I'm very surprised that YT doesn't appreciate them and hope it's not the case, that said, we do appreciate them! As a fellow engineer I can say that your videos are very helpful and professional, well done!
Your testing is very much appreciated! Thank you Igor.
another awesome test, thanks! they performed the best to far in temp test, impact is not bad but the layed adhesion could be better.
Igor, for what i have learned from Your videos, and what makes me return to watch for more, You should put a paywall behind your data. I would never resell it no matter what, but would see no issue to pay a one off sum or recurring amount should i ever want to access it in a professional matter.
You should not be ashamed to earn from your honest unbiased and valuable work.
That being said i am subscribed to Your channel, but sadly i am not planning to become a patreon or use of your data in any organized manner.
Great video, and big thanks. I use Azure Film filaments :D
This is a great video, thanks for making it for us!
I would like to make a suggestion for a future video/series: How does layer height (and possibly also in combination with speed) affect strength - most likely just in the realm of layer adhesion. The best I can find on this topic is a 5 year old video from CNC Kitchen on this topic tilted "The influence of layer height on the strength of FDM 3D prints" that talks about layer heights of .1, .15 and .20 - which don't exactly align to today's layer heights in modern slicers. Also 5 years ago in 3D printing might as well have been 20 years ago given the printer speed and filament quality enhancements since then.
My primary motivator for this topic is I am 3D printing light sabers for my kids, and I want the best layer adhesion possible, especially for the collapsible "blades". Beyond light sabers, I often will drop the layer height down to .16 or even .12 to try and make whatever I am printing as strong as possible, so it would be good to have more recent guidance from someone I consider to the GOAT of 3D printing strength testing. 😁
Lastly, I don't do a lot with Patreon so I want to encourage you to explore the UA-cam membership system as I would sign up for the like $2.99 a month to help out the channel and you amazing efforts.
Whether overextrusion affects strength should also be investigated, I print parts that need strength at 103% flow hoping the extra material squishing against each other would be beneficial
@@youtubehandlesux Excellent addition to the idea!
We should probably also consider printing temps because I think hotter filaments will take longer to cool and that might enhance layer bonding.
Great work as always! Thanks so much 🙂
I printed some ABS in the past, but never ASA! 🤦♂ I should give it a try!
You really should 😊
After so many testings, I don't really see the reason for using the ABS. In most cases (mechanical properties) the ASA is better. Additionally, it is UV, weather resistant, less smell.. There are some diferences between manufacturers, but for example Prusament don't even have ABS from exactly this reason.
Abs is for mosquito-heavy days-they drop out of the air.
It would be interesting to see how Elegoo''s suspiciously cheap ASA perfoms
I wanted to buy one, but its not available currently. I am preparing 10 ASA filament brands comparisons.
@@MyTechFun Nice! Can't wait for the video, your filament testing it truly the best out here.
I can say it warps more and has more odor. It also seemed to be more flexible, but no actual testing to back that up. This is compared to Polymaker, Flashforge and Prusament. I have some Sunlu that I haven't tried yet.
@@MyTechFun to me it says it is in stock, on their EU website... the "some items are out of stock" written appears to me when I checkout, but that regardless of what I try to buy on their website, and it does let me order it.
What actually worries me is that 15€ shipping fee...
For me the advantage of abs is you can get abs for 30-40% cheaper.
To really test warping you should print long bars with 100% infill. Example on X1C a long Square rod printed diagonally on the build plate.
Thx. I am preparing 10 ASA comparisons. I will test the warping there
@@MyTechFun thanks, can't wait! 😊
Hi Igor! Nice video as always! Just an idea, but maybe a collab with Stefan from CNC kitchen can attract more visibility to your channel. I know that it's not that simple, but it may be worth a shot. Cheers from France!
Probably he don't want to colaborate with so small channel like mine. Additionally, we went in very different direction with his videos. I am missing his filament testings from the "old times".
So annoying. Gotta love it when people consider simply saving data that someone else created through hard work as their own "achievement" and then even go so far to sell it. And then they start talking about CC licenses as their defense completely ignoring that it's a question of principle and decency. Besides, the right CC license can also mean you are free to use it but not commercial for profit. I'm already a Patreon supporter, mainly because I just want to support your work, Igor and not just for the data lists. But hearing this makes me angry... I have to deal with other people selling my work which I share with the 3D printing community for free (but not for commercial use), so I am familiar with how shitty this feels.
Thank you for your support. And as I mentioned in the video, I will continue providing individual excel tables too. It was just temporary anger, but I am over it..
I agree, the main advantage of ABS is lower price. I noticed that they slightly reduced the price of their ABS Prime. It's still high for ABS, but one could argue that it's an enhanced version of ABS.
We should try to use the same colour for these tests preferably, even though this should matter rather little.
In many cases, I don't have a choise. And with 2-3k views, I can't afford just to buy filament for the testing.
I use ABS and ASA pretty much interchangeably and don't really bother with the distinction that much. I find most differences between the two plastics seem to vary more across different manufacturers/base resins than between the material itself.
Azurefilm ABS was probably the smelliest I have printed yet. I started a print in the evening, and when I came back into the room the next morning, I thought I'd need a gas mask to reach the window. I think I might have heard my Nevermore crying somewhere in the corner. I have another spool of Azurefilm ABS I bought together with that first one, but I have not yet dared printing it.
I agree. Soon I will have 10 ASA filament comparison... in 1 month or so
I would love to see if the reduced warping persists when you use a printer without an enclosure. I think the need for an enclosure is the main entrance barrier to ABS-like materials for most people. The manufacturer claims it works, so maybe give it a try and share the results? I would highly appreciate it!
AzureFilm on ASA Prime: "We recommend using an enclosure or enclosed 3D printer, though this material can be printed without an enclosure."
Thanks again Igor.
I find ASA more prone to warping than ABS so I use more ABS - except AzureFilm. I haven't used the Prime version but I have found Azure ASA to not warp unlike others I have tried from various manufacturers.
I don't understand the algorithm at all - whenever anyone on Reddit asks about materials, I point them to MyTechFin.
I have a question though: when the eBay impact tester is set up and calibrated, will you be running your DIY setup alongside it? If not, newer results will no.longer be comparable with the older ones.
Fory purposes, I'm not overly interested in the actual figures using industry-standard equipment and methods. My interest is in relative impact resistance, so your results are good because they are a consistent set of results across the range. That makes them directly comparable in relative terms.
I've noticed the opposite. ABS warps and shrinks all the time while ASA (at least from Extrudr) almost prints like PLA. ASA also smells less bad, so my ABS is collecting dust. I also saw one video with a guy, that was only printing in ABS and puts out a box with about 2 years old ABS-parts stored in the dark. He could break the parts apart like they were made out of old bread. Not sure how reliable is ASA in the long term, but certainly PETG holds up better even if it's in the sun on a daily basis.
@@Leynad778 That's interesting. I wonder why the difference between experiences.
@@Leynad778 abs is 100% reliable long term. Maybe he used some c grade blended filament
Hi, I'm not a Patreon supporter but I might be soon. I'm an engineer with 14 years of experience that has started 3D printing 2 months ago (averaging 2 kg/week). I mostly print Polymaker ASA for practical parts so this is an area where I might have some useful feedback. The biggest problem with ASA is warping--I have invested a lot of time and money into sealing my P1S and regulating the chamber temperature so that it stays at 60C. Printing ASA with chamber temperatures less than 50C is a recipe for disaster--certain types of parts will warp with incredible force, and you can only slightly mitigate this by going slow. You should do a side-by-side comparison of the regular ASA and this ASA Prime to judge this warping. Since you have a X1C, I recommend you build the 2nd AUX fan (link after my message) for 2 reasons: 1) the 2nd AUX fan will make your overhangs better on the right side of the bed, and 2) the upper duct (the piece rendered in orange) is a perfect test of warping. Finally, I am interested in learning what Azure did to the ASA formulation. According to their site, ASA Prime has lower UV resistance than regular ASA--that is a big compromise that cannot be ignored for practical parts. I would like to know how much less the UV resistance is. www.printables.com/model/435201-bambu-lab-p1-x1-dual-aux-fan-bentobox-728-updated
Wow can't believe yt let you post a comment with a link...
@@EliteMacFreak I print primarily with ASA as well. I don’t have any problems with warping anymore. I use an X1C, polylite ASA, chamber temp >40C, bed 90C, magigoo on high temp plate. I run a max volume speed of 12mm3/s since I need part strength. For my wide and tall parts I put thin vertical slots 1mmx10mm about 3 to 5 mm above the bed every 75 to 100mm to act as strain reliefs during printing. Sometimes I just use 3mm holes. Works like a charm.
I credit Igor for putting me on to polylite ASA.
@@riba2233 I've had this account since UA-cam came out (hard to believe it's been been almost 20 years), it's tied into my Gmail account, and although I'm a super-heavy user I rarely post so maybe at this point there's a certain level of trust. Who knows!
@@spongecounter That's interesting. I would think that putting internal voids in the ASA for it to expand and contract would result in very poor dimensional tolerances. Have you ever measured your parts for dimensional accuracy, or is what you're printing not that sensitive?
@@EliteMacFreak for clarity, the slots are only for printing stress and punch though the entire parts. I find they reduce the outer part dimension tolerance variability a tiny amount. Probably because of stress relief as the layers build up. I wish I could add a picture in the comments here.
Fpr asa abs printability is really interesting. Why is this not discussed more. That is usually my they add cf and weird stuff.
So what does adding fans do? How does overhangs look withiut fans? This is key to asa abs printing. They are usually durable enough.
Hello I have a question?
Is Asa conductive
Do they smell the same during printing?
Not exactly
No. ABS have more smell (even if this one is reduced, compared to regular ABS)
Perhaps you can change the license type for your videos to CC BY-NC (non-commercial) to disallow selling of the data
Perhaps it’s the chemical properties? Is there a difference?
I’m currently repairing my floor from a failed toilet seal, so I’m working with ABS wastewater pipe, and the appropriate ABS glue. If the plastic manufacturers need to manufacture in ABS to maintain compatibility with legacy products, making additive manufacturing filament is probably an easy revenue stream to add to their business.
9:00 Immediately joined your Patreon after that story. What a shit move reselling your data somewhere else.
Thank you for your support!
What do you think is the best filament for gears? Low warping, tough, which brand? For instance, PA12 eSun is better than other Nylons, that I've tried. But it is interesting to try BambuLab PACF, ASA +CF, and PETG +CF.
Usually injection molded are made from nylon.
Thank you for all your work. What about ease of printing? Similar or is one of these printable on a cheap 3d printer with just a hoody ontop (passive heated by hearbed) instead of a full enclosure printer
Usually, the ASA is easier for printing. In this case, it was ABS.
Great
You have great content and your videos answer important questions for 3D printers and makers.
I do, however, sometimes struggle to understand what you are saying due to your accent. Sometimes it's to the point that I stop watching because I am not understanding the content of your video. The algorithm issues may be in response to viewers like me who have an interest in what you are presenting but don't watch it all the way through.
I hope what I am saying doesn't discourage you in any way. Despite the difficulty I have, I still look forward to your videos (I've been a subscriber for a while).
Kind regards
Thank you for the reply. I am working on my accent, but this is a problem I will always have (I speek 3 languages which I use more ofthen than English). Recently, for more important videos, I started adding a corrected subtitles, to replace automatically generated. I hope this helps.
@@MyTechFun Thank you for the subtitles. 3D Maker, UA-camr, AND 3 languages! That's not a problem! That's impressive! Maybe using an AI service that dubs using your voice is another option. Looking forward to you next video!
English is not my first language, I watch him at 1.5x and understand every single word. Just watch him a bit more and you'll get everything ;)
For me Igor is easy to listen, maybe because English is also not my 1st language. Rally English FTW - don't let pronunciation and dialect be in your way 😉
I guess you are not British 😅
It would be very useful if you also had open printer test as they advertise
I would suggest that you don't show the summary in a PDF or excel style but show the grey graphs in full screen mode after each test, I think that would improve the videos. Basically skip the summary and intersperce it between the tests to make it a bit easier to relate to the tests and easier to digest in small amounts.
At the moment i can't support you via patron.
Reselling you data is just really a dick move!
I have to look careful athe your print settings for ASA. With my Polymaker ASA the results are awful. ABS GF from bambu works flawlessly, though
Between hacks, unexpected policy shifts over the years and unsustainable business model with VC backing, I'm not keen on creating a Patreon account nor leaving them payment details.
This jerk, technically legal pirate demonstrated that there's an opportunity for you to sell access to your material testing database outside of Patreon.
That'll be another revenue stream outside of UA-cam and Patreon for you, which people like me or industries might vastly prefer.
Like for Patreon, you could let the customer set the price: preventing any unfair competition as well as allowing larger donations.
Now setup some kind of website and do it! 😎
And he already has a website! 😊
maybe give your Patreon supporters early access? give them the videos a week early or something? i dunno man. i'd hate to see you go away but can't afford a subscription to anything else at this time.
Thx for suggestions. I create too many videos, I publish them when they are finished. I don't have patience to wait 1 week or so. Sometimes they get access to unlisted video 1-2 days earlier. But soon I will have few videos only for them..
Change your license from CC if you want to stop someone ripping it off.
You should consider using Eleven Labs to narrate your videos. You can make a voice model to have your voice but easier to understand.
His accent probably is a factor in the popularity of his videos. It is pretty thick. I have to turn on subtitles, and even the subtitle engine has a hard time with it. The first time I heard him saying “share test” I was confused for a second. Then I mentioned that shear rhymes with beer. I don’t think he cares. Hehe. The accent isn’t exactly a huge issue, but I can see people not wanting to struggle with it and just skipping instead.
The accent is one of the best parts!!
@@michaelhaas9053 Not when you can’t understand a word he says. Hence his poor UA-cam performance.
I appreciate the effort you put into comparing ABS and ASA filaments. However, I’d like to address a couple of issues with the methodology used in the video.
Firstly, the sample size of 2 is quite small, which significantly affects the reliability of the conclusions. To better assess the results, it's important to consider the standard deviation and margin of error. With standard deviations of 1.202 for ABS and 0.283 for ASA, and only 2 samples, the degrees of freedom are 1. This results in a t-value of 12.706 for a 95% confidence interval and 6.314 for a 90% confidence interval. Consequently, the confidence intervals are:
- **ABS @ 95%**: 56.15 (lower limit) - 66.95 (average) - 77.75 (upper limit)
- **ABS @ 90%**: 61.58 (lower limit) - 66.95 (average) - 72.32 (upper limit)
- **ASA @ 95%**: 60.46 (lower limit) - 63.00 (average) - 65.54 (upper limit)
- **ASA @ 90%**: 61.93 (lower limit) - 63.00 (average) - 64.07 (upper limit)
At both 95% and 90% confidence levels, the results are statistically indistinguishable.
Secondly, testing different filament colors can influence mechanical properties, as noted by Stefan of CNC Kitchen. Consistency in color is crucial for accurate comparisons.
Given your expertise as a mechanical engineer with a Ph.D., I would expect a more scientifically rigorous approach. Providing accurate and reliable information is vital for the makers’ community, and I believe they deserve detailed and precise data.
Thank you for considering this feedback.
As you noted, standard deviation isn't really a helpful metric when you have low sample size. If you are going as far as to measure process capability, ideally you need at least 30 parts. and as you noted it will vary further considering spool to spool (long term capability) and color variation. That is a lot of time, money and effort. If MTF had sufficient views or support to sponsor the spools and the weeks required to make a video on the subject, I'm sure it can happen. But practically it's a tough ask.
This is all nice but he is doing this in his free time, for the community and losing money on it. So we need to be realistic with our expectations.
Probably for same material the color might produce significant changes in properties... but ASA & ABS I do not think it has the sane pigments for blue color for example
Or at least 5 samples each. At least then you have something that begins to resemble statistics.
@@Duckferd This why then end statistical result is showing large variations. So, we cannot state meaningful conclusions if one product is similar, or better than an other. That way you are misleading the viewer stating conclusions that could be false. It’s will be more important if there results are showing differences that are falling within the margin of error. If there are not enough resources, time and/or money, then don’t do it, unless you want to showoff. If you look at results from Stefan of CNC Kitchen, he presents data that are statistically sound. Why not Igor? Considering he is an engineer with a Ph.D, he should stand to higher scientific standards which I’m certain he can. Igor, continue your efforts, what you are doing is interesting but show the audience what is the differences between professionalism and amateurism.