Watching this over a year later for the first time and I have pins and needles listening, I’ve thought about these exact things since I was a child and never knew how to express them. I had the experience multiple times between the ages of 7 and 11 years old, growing up meditating frequently since 4 years old, never religious but neo humanistic, after thinking about how I came to be a part of this body in this life, I experienced reaching a meditative state where I disappeared from existence and became one with everything. It was a euphoric feeling which only lasted a few seconds before I would get scared that I didn’t know who I was, and I’d come back to reality by remembering my name. Then if all flooded back and I wished I could explain what I’d experienced, it was so incredible, full of awe and something I don’t have any other words to describe but euphoric. I only know as a 22 year old now how to describe what I experienced in this way. I’m now studying psychology and hope to do research in neuroscience on consciousness because I’m so fascinated about these experiences and how they come to be.
I can very much relate to your experiences meditating as a child, which sound very similar to experiences I had meditating in the late 20s. You mentioned an important point which I would like to probe you on. You said that for a few seconds, you experienced euphoria, but out of fear, you reminded yourself that you have a self, by which you began to reidentify with the self as opposed to allowing your sense of self to dissolve into nothingness, and recognizing what is beyond the self, or what is called the no-self. The experience beyond the state you mentioned has been called the light body. Basically, in the moment the fear arises, you must negate the fear by negating the illusion of self. In a state of no-fear, you go from euphoria to bliss, during which time you will see, with eyes closed, white light rapidly flooding your visual field, and you will experience ego-death, or the dissolution of the illusion of all boundaries. There is a distinction to make, which is that you have 2 different visual fields. One is encoded by the eyes. This visual field you experience as if it were outside your body, or in front of your head and streaming through the eyes. You can probe this visual apparatus independently by shutting your eyes tightly, upon which some fluid and evolving geometries begin to appear then fade to black. The other visual field is encoded by the brain. This visual field you experience physically within your own brain, which is why you see it not with eyes, but with sensors located in the center of the brain (this is scientifically proven, there are rods in the center of the brain that detect white light). Both visual fields can be activated simultaneously, although this may require deep states of meditation or mind-altering substances. The eyes encode geometrically. The inner light experience does not fit into the domain of geometry, because it is dimensionless. Your mind may relate it to the sphere because it does tend to initially manifest "spherically" from a central point, but this is still an illusion of experience, because it is essentially an experience of 0 tending to 1, or a point becoming a singular whole. As such, the inner "eye" perceives without form as such. One more way to look at it is: with eyes open, you are experiencing 4 dimensions of the external world, 3 of space and 1 of time. When you close your eyes, you lose 3 of the dimensions gradually, after which the fourth dimension begins to dissolve as well. Once all 4 dimensions stop manifesting totally and you are fully awake, there is a singularity of experience, which is also a boundary, a fold, a flop, a twist in the fabric of spacetime. You may even experience it as a falling into a single point, similar to vertigo. Because it resembles vertigo (not knowing what is up, what is down, which is me, which is else, etc.) it induces fear in the mind. But this fear is the final doorway to the experience of ego-death, because it resembles physical death in our inner experience. However, it is not a physical death, it is instead a birth into the non-physical non-manifest, from where one can begin to observe the physical and meta-physical interplay of self-illusion, and to control its manifestations with total clarity.
you just reminded me of my experience of this too with your words, "I’d come back to reality by remembering my name". I haven't remembered this memory for like years wow
It seems obvious to me also that symmetry and valence are intrinsic utilitys of existence and that coding for it in the right way creates new long term selection mechanisms. I feel like iv come to a whole new understanding of really what is therapeutic and how to apply it based on the work you guys have put out at QRI. It blows my mind every time I read an article or watch a video. So glad that finally someone is describing reality in a relatable way. Thank you!
Amazing talk! I recommend virtualism for synthesizing phenomenology and idealism vs materialism, as proposed by Evan McMullen at The Stoa for example, it‘s quite clean and comprehensive!
i have 5 questions for andres: 1. is there such a thing as a qualia informed political, social or religious movement, and if so what would that look like? 2. is the mandelbrot set high symmetry because it contains infinite similar copies of itself, or low symmetry because no obvious pattern can be seen along its outer edge at any zoom level? 3. are there a set of simple practices to increase perceived symmetry that are easy to do every day based on the theory or does mindfulness not need a qualia upgrade? 4. what is valence ultimately grounded in, the average of all topological pockets in the consciousness field; or is it more of a renormalization qed kind of thing? 5. what if the hard problem of consciousness was identical to the universe from nothing problem in astrophysics and cosmology and it comes down to that 'nothingness' contains all possibilities and that pure consciousness arose even before there was a nothing out of the pure essence of it being 'permit'? id like to hear your comments. _ _ *_* .
2. I suggest maybe there would be a definite answer if the pattern was translated into a different medium, such as raw numbers, a sequence? 5. I suggest Andres' video on zero ontology, if you haven't already watched it
Just like there’s more than 4 elements and states of matter and consciousness, there’s more than 3 doors. The three doors are kind of stuck in language. As we get better language and more varied qualia comparisons we can give other instructional doors, which I suppose can always be translated into the 3 door frame, but it’s important not to reify language by showing alternative recipe instructions exist.
Though this is interesting stuff, I think it pales in comparison in value with participating in the practices that brought the experiential understanding that gives them credibility. So going to meditate and contemplate before I watch…
thinking about the emptiness-love coupling. this could be a very human species thing, because of our group/tribal evolutionary history. imagine a hermaphroditic species (e.g. like in the sf film "enemy mind"). perhaps this species would perceive the fundamental coupling as void continuity in a similar stage of e.
I just dont know what Frank Yang has to say hes an arahant. Instead of claiming it, tell us what each stage of awakening was like for you and what made you think you got into these stages of permanent perceptual changes and benefit. It just feels like he did what me and everybody else did - read Daniel's book, get way too excited and reach a powerful A & P stage, and then take that to be enlightenment. For me it lasted four months of incredibly convincing changes and benefits before it started to calm down and I realized it was only the arising and passing. The one point Daniel points out again and again in his book and interviews is to NOT mistake this for awakening.
bro frank and daniel together is the best. basically Avengers Endgame
Respect for DS3 profile pic
Hahaha my guys! For real both of you. Much love guys!
yes! dhamma porn
Daniel is iron man and Frank is Spiderman
😂❤@@thegringoscottproductions1699
Ingram's "What are the ramifications for Materialism?" is brilliant, hits science right in the Achilles heel!!! 👌💯
Watching this over a year later for the first time and I have pins and needles listening, I’ve thought about these exact things since I was a child and never knew how to express them. I had the experience multiple times between the ages of 7 and 11 years old, growing up meditating frequently since 4 years old, never religious but neo humanistic, after thinking about how I came to be a part of this body in this life, I experienced reaching a meditative state where I disappeared from existence and became one with everything. It was a euphoric feeling which only lasted a few seconds before I would get scared that I didn’t know who I was, and I’d come back to reality by remembering my name. Then if all flooded back and I wished I could explain what I’d experienced, it was so incredible, full of awe and something I don’t have any other words to describe but euphoric. I only know as a 22 year old now how to describe what I experienced in this way. I’m now studying psychology and hope to do research in neuroscience on consciousness because I’m so fascinated about these experiences and how they come to be.
I can very much relate to your experiences meditating as a child, which sound very similar to experiences I had meditating in the late 20s. You mentioned an important point which I would like to probe you on. You said that for a few seconds, you experienced euphoria, but out of fear, you reminded yourself that you have a self, by which you began to reidentify with the self as opposed to allowing your sense of self to dissolve into nothingness, and recognizing what is beyond the self, or what is called the no-self. The experience beyond the state you mentioned has been called the light body. Basically, in the moment the fear arises, you must negate the fear by negating the illusion of self. In a state of no-fear, you go from euphoria to bliss, during which time you will see, with eyes closed, white light rapidly flooding your visual field, and you will experience ego-death, or the dissolution of the illusion of all boundaries.
There is a distinction to make, which is that you have 2 different visual fields. One is encoded by the eyes. This visual field you experience as if it were outside your body, or in front of your head and streaming through the eyes. You can probe this visual apparatus independently by shutting your eyes tightly, upon which some fluid and evolving geometries begin to appear then fade to black. The other visual field is encoded by the brain. This visual field you experience physically within your own brain, which is why you see it not with eyes, but with sensors located in the center of the brain (this is scientifically proven, there are rods in the center of the brain that detect white light). Both visual fields can be activated simultaneously, although this may require deep states of meditation or mind-altering substances.
The eyes encode geometrically. The inner light experience does not fit into the domain of geometry, because it is dimensionless. Your mind may relate it to the sphere because it does tend to initially manifest "spherically" from a central point, but this is still an illusion of experience, because it is essentially an experience of 0 tending to 1, or a point becoming a singular whole. As such, the inner "eye" perceives without form as such. One more way to look at it is: with eyes open, you are experiencing 4 dimensions of the external world, 3 of space and 1 of time. When you close your eyes, you lose 3 of the dimensions gradually, after which the fourth dimension begins to dissolve as well. Once all 4 dimensions stop manifesting totally and you are fully awake, there is a singularity of experience, which is also a boundary, a fold, a flop, a twist in the fabric of spacetime. You may even experience it as a falling into a single point, similar to vertigo. Because it resembles vertigo (not knowing what is up, what is down, which is me, which is else, etc.) it induces fear in the mind. But this fear is the final doorway to the experience of ego-death, because it resembles physical death in our inner experience. However, it is not a physical death, it is instead a birth into the non-physical non-manifest, from where one can begin to observe the physical and meta-physical interplay of self-illusion, and to control its manifestations with total clarity.
you just reminded me of my experience of this too with your words, "I’d come back to reality by remembering my name". I haven't remembered this memory for like years wow
thank you for this incredible conversation.
I still believe that words can't do justice to any of our relation with god.
This is an absolute treat, thank you!
It seems obvious to me also that symmetry and valence are intrinsic utilitys of existence and that coding for it in the right way creates new long term selection mechanisms. I feel like iv come to a whole new understanding of really what is therapeutic and how to apply it based on the work you guys have put out at QRI. It blows my mind every time I read an article or watch a video. So glad that finally someone is describing reality in a relatable way. Thank you!
Can you elaborate on the therapeutic bit? Id like to hear more about how they correlate!
This is amazing. Thank you guys for putting it out there. Where were you guys in my 20’s.
Lmao I’m 20 and so thankful that this is exists i would be so confused without people like Frank and Daniel
Truth!
@@milesp123xd7 same god bless
Excellent conversation! 😌💭
It would be fascinating to hear an exploration of these themes via a consideration of the experience/perspective/statements of UG Krishnamurti.
Such a hype lineup for this conversation!
really enjoyed this
Great chat, lots of ground covered!
this is awesome
Amazing talk!
I recommend virtualism for synthesizing phenomenology and idealism vs materialism, as proposed by Evan McMullen at The Stoa for example, it‘s quite clean and comprehensive!
This is so cool. Luv
Bernardo Kastrup is missing
working on him + donald hoffman
keep an eye out. - ryan
43:00
I can't believe this video exists
It doesn't, it's only a bunch of separate frames
i have 5 questions for andres:
1. is there such a thing as a qualia informed political, social or religious movement, and if so what would that look like?
2. is the mandelbrot set high symmetry because it contains infinite similar copies of itself, or low symmetry because no obvious pattern can be seen along its outer edge at any zoom level?
3. are there a set of simple practices to increase perceived symmetry that are easy to do every day based on the theory or does mindfulness not need a qualia upgrade?
4. what is valence ultimately grounded in, the average of all topological pockets in the consciousness field; or is it more of a renormalization qed kind of thing?
5. what if the hard problem of consciousness was identical to the universe from nothing problem in astrophysics and cosmology and it comes down to that 'nothingness' contains all possibilities and that pure consciousness arose even before there was a nothing out of the pure essence of it being 'permit'?
id like to hear your comments.
_ _ *_*
.
Cool questions!
2. I suggest maybe there would be a definite answer if the pattern was translated into a different medium, such as raw numbers, a sequence?
5. I suggest Andres' video on zero ontology, if you haven't already watched it
1. Andres has videos on advanced visions of paradise, and on advanced visions of art and ethics
Just like there’s more than 4 elements and states of matter and consciousness, there’s more than 3 doors. The three doors are kind of stuck in language. As we get better language and more varied qualia comparisons we can give other instructional doors, which I suppose can always be translated into the 3 door frame, but it’s important not to reify language by showing alternative recipe instructions exist.
Ontological paradox when it emerges is a form of a rational sceptic enveloped in a soft solipsism, both self and not self.
Go fearless!
ULTIMATE GEEK OUT
Horseshoe theory of valence let’s go!
Though this is interesting stuff, I think it pales in comparison in value with participating in the practices that brought the experiential understanding that gives them credibility. So going to meditate and contemplate before I watch…
there is a middle way! Materialism is wrong... idealism is wrong... this is basically the teaching of gudo wafu nishijima ☝️
Gudo wafu nishijima intresting ill look him up thanks for the coment
Nice
thinking about the emptiness-love coupling. this could be a very human species thing, because of our group/tribal evolutionary history. imagine a hermaphroditic species (e.g. like in the sf film "enemy mind"). perhaps this species would perceive the fundamental coupling as void continuity in a similar stage of e.
Farkin fronk and ingrams """
admin 😂❤♾🎉💚
I just dont know what Frank Yang has to say hes an arahant. Instead of claiming it, tell us what each stage of awakening was like for you and what made you think you got into these stages of permanent perceptual changes and benefit. It just feels like he did what me and everybody else did - read Daniel's book, get way too excited and reach a powerful A & P stage, and then take that to be enlightenment. For me it lasted four months of incredibly convincing changes and benefits before it started to calm down and I realized it was only the arising and passing. The one point Daniel points out again and again in his book and interviews is to NOT mistake this for awakening.
Nice to see Yang, hope he starts to consider cognitive science contributing...
i think he majored in philosphy not sure though
@@AskEpic He only took an intro to philosophy class during college
Volume pretty low i have to max my headphones just to barely hear
We’re like very complicated particles
Good to see Andres supporting this notion that high neg. valence != quasi-enlightened state. Nice try, Frank!
What do you mean?
Ryan looks a lot like Andres.
these guys are such dorks
Sheer bangaz
Thanks for the conversation, fellas!