The "Royal We" normally refers to the office/title of king/queen, not the individual. Annalise claims no subjects, but the Queenly position is still assumed. So while SHE may claim no subjects, the monarchy is still in practice, therefore, the royal We is used.
"Eyes on the inside" is a nod to hippocampus evolving from a periental eye - hippocampus is responsible for releasing DMT which affects how we percieve reality. Hippocampus also governs the amygdala.
Laurence wasn't the first to betray Willem at Byrgenwerth. The original Japanese has Willem say "you also think to betray me", in the cutscene between himself and Lawrence. The Cainhurst betrayal came first
r44cker I think he's talking about the scholar who betrayed Byrgenwerth and brought back the forbidden blood back to Cainhurst, he/she was the first to betray Master Willem. Gehrman isn't a scholar, as we know he's the first hunter. We also know that he's the colleague of Laurence, the founder of the Healing Church. We can conclude that the healing blood distributed by the church is the one that caused the beast scourge, which is why Laurence asked Gehrman to be the first to hunt them (he then recruited elementary doctors as hunters, suggested from the Black Church set description). Later we have 3 types of hunters in Yharnam, the Old Hunters, and the Powder Kegs with Ludwig's church hunters (which includes Black and White Church hunters) working in tandem.
Not sure if someones said this yet and this is almost a year after the fact, but does the vileblood queen's line of "Moon-scented hunter" imply that she can smell your relation to the moon presence and may possibly know of the moon presence already?
E E I would say probably. A moon scented Hunter is one who has had a blood transfusion and thus made a pact to hunt beasts. I'm assuming the blood itself is from the moon presence and would change your scent. She is extremely old. Vilebloods themselves are corrupted by old blood from a great one so it wouldn't surprise me if they would know of other great ones giving blood.
A thought, we've established all manner'o'ways that blood is business AND fun in Yharnam. Blood cocktail spells out how people prefer to get drunk on blood than alcohol. Well, if one were a woman of pleasure, and had particularly sweet blood to boot, sharing her blood wouldn't be all that rare an occurrence, right?
Minor Correction... When you choose to kill the celestial child, Ariana does not die. She merely faints or passes out. You can tell by the fact that she is still breathing. Also, there is a clear difference between the poses Ariana ends up in whether you kill the child only, or if you actively kill Ariana by attacking her. Keep the great content coming bro! I have been with you since the beginning and it is clear that you continue to improve your videos. In my opinion your content is better than most if not all the other BloodSouls Lore channels. You always have unique theories and analysis unlike most other people who simply regurgitate the work of others. Keep up the great work!!!
You know, with Annalise’s iron mask, the french terminology, and Arianna’s ironic fate as a surrogate mother for the child of blood, I wonder if Arianna was in fact a twin of sorts to Annalise, a sort of twist on one of the legends surrounding the man in the mask and the then ruler king louis XIV, in which the masked prisoner was actually the king and a look a like or twin sat the throne.
Pretty sure Arianna, and possible other children as well, were deliberately spared by Logarius, seeing as his motto seemed to have been to always endeavour to do good, even if the act might be unwise. The Church might have provided Arianna with lodgings in Cathedral Ward, as a means to keep an eye on here, just in case.
Gilbert mentions your strange scent as well; I think the fact that your blood is not *as* tainted as everyone else's in Yharnam is why both Arianna and Annalise comment on your blood, and not necessarily a Cainhurst/Vileblood thing. Really great video! I like the series a lot.
Imposter Iosefka also mentions your scent if you pry your way into the clinic before the blood moon. She says "Ah, moonlit scents!" when you first walk into the area of the clinic that she is in. Very interesting indeed. Maybe it's because your blood isn't as tainted, or maybe it's a moon presence thing? The Moon Presence seems to usually if not always choose a *foreigner* as the new hunter when an old one is released. Father Gascoigne is also a foreigner, as it says in his clothe set that the title of "Father" didn't exist in Yharnam. So, perhaps father gascoigne was also a hunter for the moon presence until he was released and started working for the healing church? That could also tie in how his daughter comments that you smell like him. Just speculation. The hunters dream where the moon presence resides is also covered in flowers that kinda look like the lumenflowers thats scent would comfort the patience of the research hall in the old hunters DLC. So maybe they reek of the flowers or scent of the moon presence? Not sure.
~ 13:20 When you kill the Celestial Child, I don't think Arianna dies, though I may be wrong, because when you search anything dead in the game, it says "Search Corpse," and instead, for Arianna's Shoes, it says "Pick up Item..." Just an idea... Keep up the great work Mitch! ;D
@Esoteric Jesus Lol she won't be using them anytime soon, so it would be a shame to let a good pair of noble slippers go to waste. Edit: Funny story, I hit her and the celestial child using a fire dmg weapon and only the baby went down. I had to hit Arianna about two more times before she finally died. I felt bad about it, but I wanted those damn slippers. Flaying and burning a lady and her newborn baby alive just to mug her for her shoes definitely isn't one of my proudest accomplishments.
A lot of NPCs comment on the hunter's smell. At first you're expected to think it's the smell of blood/beasts/gunpowder, but then it becomes clear it's the "smell of the moon" as more and more NPCs comment on it. It's supposed to be a foreshadowing that the moon and the dreaming hunters are connected.
I just typed up a lengthy comment replying to someone else that actually touches on your theory. I'll just copy and paste it here if you don't mind and you can tell me what you think.
Imposter Iosefka also mentions your scent if you pry your way into the clinic before the blood moon. She says "Ah, moonlit scents!" when you first walk into the area of the clinic that she is in. Very interesting indeed. Maybe it's because your blood isn't as tainted, or maybe it's a moon presence thing? The Moon Presence seems to usually if not always choose a foreigner as the new hunter when an old one is released. Father Gascoigne is also a foreigner, as it says in his clothe set that the title of "Father" didn't exist in Yharnam. So, perhaps father gascoigne was also a hunter for the moon presence until he was released and started working for the healing church? That could also tie in how his daughter comments that you smell like him. Just speculation. The hunters dream where the moon presence resides is also covered in flowers that kinda look like the lumenflowers thats scent would comfort the patience of the research hall in the old hunters DLC. So maybe they reek of the flowers or scent of the moon presence? Not sure.
Holy shit, Mitch! You nailed this! I completely missed The Cainhurst/Arianna connection. I thought it was just the place you get her dress. I wasn't playing consciously. This made me want to step up my pay-attention-to-detail game up big time. Bcs of this video I found you on Patreon and became a $10/month pledger. I'd love to see a Lore Video on The Fishing Hamlet.
I would say that the lack of mirrors may be due to the “insight” that some of the people may acquire. And they wanted to prevent people from seeing beasts, or from seeing themselves as beasts. Same goes for why many of the characters in game have bandages over their eyes. What they saw due to their insight drove them mad so they take out their own eyes
I love your work. You dont di entry level lore like vaatividya and fungo who just talk about things you can discover by playing the game. You actually speculate and use deeper lore and make your own thoughts. You talk about the parts of the lore I have always been interested in. And that's the world and what it was like before instead of just focusing on all the characters anyone playing through the game comes across. I admire your work very much and am certainly going to subscribe
First off, great vids. I think your position that Cainhurst is the oldest part of Yharnarm is very intriguing. Coupled with the idea that they are "vampires" of a sort, it made something quite clear for me: Why would any scholars/students/teachers etc. at a University decide to start "Drinking" some old blood they found in a dark crypt in the first place? It had always seemed odd to me that the drinking of blood would seem like a thing to do at all. Not just for students, but also eventually for all the residents of Yharnam, even to become as normal as imbibing alcohol. But if Cainhurst is, indeed, the oldest culture of the area, it would seem understandable that their practices (of drinking blood), would somehow find their way into the social consciousness. Perhaps their ancient and peculiar ways were what gave the first Byrgenwerth scholars the IDEA of imbibing blood. The peculiarity of Cainhurst, in a way, normalized the drinking of blood. Through hearsay, myth, first, second, and third hand accounts, it was Cainhurst's ancient practice that was the backdrop for Byrgenwerth's original methods. And perhaps a few Cainhurst Nobles were even integral in the Byrgenwerth ranks. Perhaps even, {from the empty sets of presumably Cainhurst Armor in the Chalice Dungeons), they were the ones that gave knowledge of the old labyrinths to the Byrgenwerth elite in the first place. Perhaps it didn't "all start at Byrgenwerth" after all.
I love your summary. Very well put. Something I had not considered until after I read your comment is that universities often require great amounts of wealth to be constructed and maintained. What kind of institution would be able to bankroll an operation like Byrgenwerth? I think you're seeing what I'm getting at.
I watched both of these, last night and just decided to subscribe. I never thought of the meaning of the "Cainhurst" name (other than sounding like a true British place name), but it makes sense. I'm enjoying these as much as Vaati's lore videos.
Another excellent lore vid. Arianna is one of my favorite characters as well so cool you covered her so extensively. I think you're on to something with Cainhurst being quite similair to the Healing Church in the ways they cope with the beast plague. It indeed sounds more likely that Cainhurst was aware of old blood and the great ones far before Byrgenwerth though never in the same scholarly capacity as Willem's teachings. In fact it's more like Cainhurst was unaware of the origin of the old blood but not of its effects so it took on a different cultural form that is the unique to the Cainhurst nobles. In this context the 'child of blood' could merely be the Great One's surrogate the way Cainhurst(and as such Annalise) understood it. Cainhurst dealt with the old blood most likely ages before Byrgenwerth researched it but never reaching the same conclusion. The institution Willem and Laurence started however were able to academically research the old blood and were able to figure out how it related to the Phtumerian labyrinth, the Great Ones and ultimately their yearning for a human surrogate as they could not reproduce on their own.The 'old blood' is ultimately seen as some kind of virus that while having medicinal properties ultimately turns people into beasts but what if that isn't really what happens? The old blood could merely be the means through which the Great Ones communicate in order to find a suitable surrogate. It says so in the lore note that ''when the red moon hangs low the line between man and beast is blurred'' which indicates onset of beasthood is in direct relation with the arrival of the Great Ones followed by ''..and when the Great Ones descend, a womb will be blessed with child'' which again is also exactly what happens as after slaying Rom Queen Yharnam gives birth to Mergo and Arianna is impregnated by Oedon giving birth to a celestial. The Healing Church knew this would happen and indeed as you say the fact Arianna is not surprised that a birth in her bloodline took place(just that it was her) indicates the arrival of a Great One's surrogate was built into Cainhurst culture and tradition but with completely different meaning attributed to it(namely, a 'child of blood' through the offering of blood dregs). That Cainhurst was ultimately so similar as being 'chosen' by the Great Ones as the Healing Church explains their animosity towards them. After all, Cainhurst was their biggest rival even if the nobles weren't aware of it. There are some really clever metaphysical relations with organized religion here but that's probably a topic for another time. :p Looking forward to your next vid about Alfred, Logarius and the executioners. Lots of really cool lore stuff there as well.
Thank you, my friend. It's cool to see that some people agree with the timeline of Cainhurst. I agree that they do not understand it to the same point that the Healing Church does, though it is curious that the anonymous scholar decided to take the blood back to Cainhurst. For research? or perhaps as an item of faith? I wouldn't be surprised to find out that the Cainhurst nobles fed the blood to some of their people to see what would happen to them, and then kill them discretely after observing the effects. At some point I will also try to prove that the Cainhurst Knights descended into the Chalice Dungeons at some point. I have presented some of the evidence already, but I have more that I would like to put out there as well. What I will also discuss is just how fucking slimy the Healing Church are. The morality of the Executioners is so warped and a really fascinating topic to think about. Thanks for your feedback! Also, are you Dutch? Stroopwafel is one of my favourite snacks!
Good points! Could be that there was some kind of relationship between Cainhurst and Byrgenwerth(and later the Healing Church) before things turned sour as the Healing Church felt betrayed by a scholar taking some of the forbidden blood back to Cainhurst. The medieval armor you find in the chalice dungeons could definitely indicate that the Cainhurst lineage was aware of the Phtumerian labyrinth long before Byrgenwerth was. The Healing Church is definitely malicious but this seems to be a recurring theme in Miyazaki's games: The Way of White, the Cathedral of the Deep, 'God' worshipped in Demon's Souls actually being The Old One.The Healing Church is definitely among the worst though considering all the shit they did in the research hall and the fishing hamlet. Wouldn't be surprised if the violation of Kos' corpse is what caused the schism between Willem and Laurence. Haha yeah I'm Dutch and definitely agree: stroopwafels(caramel waffles) are delicious!
stroopwafel en ijsje I actually started making graphs on a whiteboard today to get what was in my head out visually, haha. I have a theory that would explain exactly why the Executioners were sent to Cainhurst, but it's a bit zany. I will present it to the best of my ability in the next video. If I can figure out how to prove it, it could change a lot in regards to how we view Cainhurst and their connection to the Great Ones/Pthumerians.
I think you nailed it mate. The idea that the Great Ones impregnating the vilebloods is instead perceived simply as a "child of blood" and that the tradition is carried on without the true knowledge of why it happens, I think is why Cainhurst thrived for so long (Until the Executioners wiped them out of course) The Yarnhamites by contrast, do not follow any kind of blood tradition and actively investigate its meaning as soon as the old blood is discovered. This is what lead to their own downfall, as they went mad learning the truth about the great ones which caused them to disregard their morals in pursuit for "ascension". Had they not gone that far, they could have potentially quarantined the beast scourge (As they had attempted to do in old yarhnam) and focused on refining or abandoning the blood.
Often a sovereign will use "I" in situations like that as well as the royal we. I'm sure there's a technical explanation about when to use "we" and when to use "I", but the point is they will often mix it up and use both.
"sanguine plague" means "bloodborne plague". A sickness of the blood. Considering the fact that the beast plague is the most prominent plague in the game (besides Ashen Blood), I think it's safe to say that the Cainhurst folks were familiar with the beast plague. They were vampires, so maybe the scourge manifested itself differently, and they transformed into Bloodlickers and vampires instead of Beastmean and scourge beasts.
Basically, yeah. The main takeaway from that section of the video is that the Healing Church used the exact same methods of discretely hiding the Scourge before it manifested into uncontrollable beasthood.
@@mitchl6896 I think that Cainhurst actually managed to hide it since, I'm assuming, only Royals were allowed to partake in Blood. Whereas the Healing Church gave it to everybody.
a lot of characters actually refer to you by scent as opposed to vision gasgoignes daughter, iosefka, annalise, arianna, etc. my theory is that the blood itself enhances the senses however it is odd that annalise mentions it arrianna makes sense, like all yharnam residents (city wise and possibly outskirts as well) sghe would have possibly partaken of the healing church blood offerred to citizens however annalise and by extension the vilebloods themselves, are supposedly born of DIFFERENT blood from another source (though this blood too came from Byrgenworth which eventually the healing church would form from technically) so was the blood actually the same and the inquisitors (the executioners) fabricated the forbidden blood lie to further demonize the cainhurst nobles? it should also be noted that it is Alfred who mentions this who in my oppini9on is NOT a true executioner himself but instead admires their legacy based on word of mouth stories. hence his blatant fanaticism regarding them. in fact i would further theorize that the true executioners are no more having been disbanded or killed long ago (possibly at cainhurst itself as Alfred states that "all did not go well..." possibly meaning most fell in the assault)
Obviously late but ive started to give consideration to the healing church wanting to get rid of the vile bloods because even after a much longer period of imbibing blood they have yet to ascend. Contradicting the churches beliefs
Just want to say thank you from 2019. Your high quality video essays are very appreciated and I dearly enjoy these on my morning commute. You are a great video editor and are effective at speaking in a way that it makes this analysis feel like a story more than a documentary.
The Cainhurst stuff is a Griffith reference from berserk. The armor looks almost exactly like his and the formal wear is almost identical to what he wore to the ball where he was almost poisoned.
One thing that really makes me appreciate Castle Cainhurst is the original Bela Lugosi Dracula. So much is referenced. The carriage ride is highly reminiscent of the one Renfield took in the film. The ghost women of Cainhurst look like Dracula's harem of undead femme fatales. The fact that the Indentured Knights of Cainhurst (and potentially you) are basically vampire thralls like Renfield. If you haven't already seen it, watch the film after that chapter of Bloodborne.
There could be some credence the theory that Logarius is a pthumerian. I apologize if Redgrave already said this as I have not watched his video, but the Pthumerian Elder’s close range scythe-like spell is nearly identical to the shape of Logarius’s weapon. That on top of logarius’s similar size and hair color to that of the pthumerians
Ive seen from the other comments and me too i believe that Arianna doesht die when you kill her alien kid, i think she just faints and because we know that Miyazaki is very strict with his games when you search her body it doesht say search corpse, just pick up item so we can assume she is still alive.
I think that in the royal plural, you are still allowed to refer to yourself as "I". The reason why one refers to themselves as "we" is because the belief is that the monarch represents the country, so every time they speak, they do so for the realm and their subjects. Saying "I claim no subjects" actually rings with a hint of sadness in her dialogue, because she refers to herself as "I". Therefore, it's the equivalent of her stating that she's fully alone and subjectless. I don't think that it's meant to be an exception from the royal plural.
fashion wise cainhurst borrows from several time periods the most obvious being Queen Analise who sports a round gown with an empire waist from the Empire Period (1785 - 1820 ) the knight set feels like late georgian era featuring a short waistcoat, jockey boots, loose fitting breeches, great coat and periwig hair.
I highly doubt Ariana was alive during the siege of Cainhurst. It almost seems like what happened in Cainhurst had happened decades earlier, if not centuries. I think it's much more likely that she's simply a descendant.
@@jacobhoover1654 yes there is to some extent :) the type of armor and weaponry equipped by the fallen vilebloods are historically much earlier than the victorian type attire that we see in Yarnham, and the Queen speaks in an old-fashioned way as well. though who can really say
@@Darfail it's the industrial era as shown by the smoke stacks, Gatling gun, & size of the buildings which are many times larger than the Victorian era. Are u saying BB is an alternate earth timeline? I'd agree with you because the Gatling gun is named after its inventor irl.
@@jacobhoover1654 In my opinion it seems pretty clear that yarnham was largely inspired by the victorian era, yes obviously it's not a one-to-one thing but the clothing, architectural style etc. seem fairly clearly victorian to me. They had chimneys in victorian times too....and the gatling gun was invented in the victorian era... but one of the things in the game that clearly stands out as being from a previous period (analogously) is Cainhurst - in architecture, weaponry and armor, and language among other things... Even without it being a direct alternate earth timeline, there are reasons why armor and weaponry progressed the way it did and the entire way Cainhurst is set up seems to imply that it is from a previous era even in-game.
I’ve spent way too much time watching lore videos, but for some reason in this one it occurs to me how strange it is that people in black church garb appear to have died kneeling before Cainhurst statues. This made me wonder, did the Healing Church member take up residence in the Castle after it had been cleared by the Executioners only to be plagued by the spectres of their slain foes?
I haven’t gotten a great look at the daggers carried by the Cainhurst ghosts, but don’t they look similar to the small blade of Lady Maria’s Rakuyo? Her hunter set mentions that she was a descendant of the Cainhurst line. If you guys have any input on this I’d love to have a discussion.
"I claim no subjects, but here lieth Our throne", it's a statement about her view on the kingdom of Cainhurst. Its Knights slaughtered, its Nobles murdered, and its Peasants driven to madness and mindlessness... a Kingdom of Empty Corpses being ruled over by an Immortal. As far as I can find she never uses anything but the royal We from that point on.. but this assumes that the translation into English was well done.
I applaud your talent and recognize the hard work behind your videos, especially this one. I only have one thing to not, necessarily correct but more of to inquire upon. I could have sworn you can attack the child and not kill the surrogate mother? She faints afterwards this is shown by her breathing post to slaying the "god". I forget how to angle it but I am pretty sure it can be done. Other than that I believe you did exceedingly well on this and have pointed out much lore that I was interested in. Look forward to more mate. Cheers!
I think you're right, actually. You can kill the child without Arianna dying as well, that was my fault. It's also interesting she faints when the child dies, but I digress. Thanks very much for your feedback! It real means a lot. The next video will probably be about digging deep into the lore and history of the executioners, so I hope to see your thoughts on that!
Yeah either way, with this video was spot on theories and more importantly proof of those theories! By the way, what time is it where you are because it is 3:30 am where I am at and to get a response this "early or late" is awesome. You do great with fan service and I love it.
+Nathaniel Phillips Thanks dude. Bloodborne is just so fascinating to think about. I live in Australia so we are about 9 hours or do behind the US on average. Not sure where you are but I assume it's somewhere in the northern hemisphere. Also I love interacting with the lore enthusiasts, honestly makes the entire process worth the effort :)
Yeah I live in Pennsylvania in the US. So its about lunch time where you are at, cool. Glad that you aren't losing sleep because you are making lore videos! Though I do look forward to more I'd rather you stay sane for as much "insight" as you have. lol Well anyways I am going to go check out your dark souls 3 lore series right now. If it is anything like this I am going to be up for awhile. So yay more theory talk! :)
I believe Cainhurst and Byrgenwyrth cooperated well after the events of Fishing Hamlet. It's only after the Healing Church's establishment that the Executioners raided the Castle.
The traitor might not be a "he". The English translation added a gender where the original Japanese left it neutral and mysterious. It's very likely the "traitor" was Lady Maria. At of all of Laurence's Hunters I think she and her arc fits best.
Mitch, I know it’s been years since you wrote this, but something I’ve noticed, and I hope you can respond, is why the Cainhurst Knights on horses on the stairs have their right legs cut off? I mean, I know all the speculation on the curse coming up the right leg and the belts on some of the leg armour sets and German having a peg leg. Have any idea?
It’s interesting to think about how Alfred’s mention of the scholar being a “he” was added in the translation to English, which opens up who the betraying scholar could be.
great stuff man, can't wait to see more. Sorry I don't have more to say, but you're putting as lot of info out there so it's hard to process right away
the barking in the background lmao, but thank you as a person who also wants to learn more abt the vilebloods these videos help me a lot due to how thorough they are, never thought of the "being watched" part of the hemwick cutscene being a possible reference to someone watching you and guiding you to Cainhurst castle. i'm wondering If anyone has a guess on who it would be? i'm thinking maybe the vileblood you fight at the grand cathedral during Eileen's quest, because the other ones are only found in the chalice dungeons, and at least we find the guy in Yharnam
As usual, very facinating!! I really loved that clip where you told a story of Arianna. I also like the way the music and the way you phrased it matched when you said ''To think, it was corrupted Blood that began this Eldrich Liason''. I also like that you picked apart her final dialogue to get meaning out of it. Can't wait to hear you talk about her Mask and the superstitions of Metals... Reminds me that Quicksilver bullets from the PC and the Oedon runes are Mercury, a metal... I also like that you discussed that the ghosts look real and alive under the right light; VERY SIMILAR TO CHALICE GHOSTS if you ask me. Corrupt Blood and immortality eh.. Analysis of that weird elevator statue/image is great too, but I wouldn't say it looks like a Kos Parasite hand, but more like holding a huge feather or feather pen. I just want a never ending flow of these videos, I love Bloodborne Lore so much, and especially your presentation of it, that I'd watch every single video you put out regarding Bloodborne. Please sir, may I have some more?
Thank you for your wonderful feedback! Bloodborne lore is just fascinating. I don't plan on stopping anytime soon. Next video should be up around a week from now.
U mean the big enemies with axes, the executions that brought the executioner's gloves from a distant land, or the Exacutioner covenant that hunts vilebloods
Great video! Adding some personal interpretation to the lore is in my opinion the best way to explore and wrap up the story :) many things can be guessed just by putting ourselves in the characters' shoes and trying to see the world from their prospective. Can't wait for your video on Lady Maria! From what you anticipated in this episode, it seems like we have similar ideas about her background and the 'lifestyle' of the Cainhurst nobles as a whole :) As for the country of origin of the Chikage I think it's safe to assume it's the same " distant Eastern land" mentioned in Yamamura's garb (he even wields it :D )
Thanks for your feedback! I can't wait to talk about Lady Maria and her story. She's one of the most interesting characters in the game, and is probably my favorite boss battle in Bloodborne. We will be making a brief pit stop by talking about the Executioners, as they have some really fascinating elements to them that I can't wait to discuss. Thanks again!
By the way, I've just seen your PM to the channel, but it won't let me respond for some reason. Could you resend it to the facebook page or my Twitter? There's some topics I'd like to discuss with you!
I think the reason you smell strange not Arianna, and the reason Annelise calls you "moon-scented," is because of the Hunter's Dream and the Moon Presence. I think the Hunters who rely on the Hunter's Dream have an otherworldly, ethereal scent. I also think they're very rare, as I imagine Hunter's of the Church aren't aware that the Dream exists.
Great video, Explains a lot about the time line that had not made sense to me before, particularly the distinction between the nobles and the vile bloods. I have a theory that there can be considered to be 4 active factions in the game during the time period we play in: Cainhurst, the choir, the school of Mensis and the moon prescence. I believe that all of them excluding the moon presence are attempting to advance the species through different means. Cainhurst and the choir are attempting to create a hybrid species with the old ones to continue the legacy of their own species; I believe that all the celestial children in upper cathedral ward are collected in the orphanage to achieve this goal and as such the choir are far closer to achieving it than the vilebloods. The school of mensus on the other hand are trying to replicate the old ones and ascend to a mental realm and abandon the physical realm completely. As such they use the power of a celestial child to create a nightmare realm and shape it with miklash as the host, thus why it appears with human architecture where as the nightmare frontier lacks a host to shape it resulting in its chaotic nature. The blood moon is a regular natural occurrence when it is possible for the physical and the mental to coincide which is why people afflicted with the scourge transform then and the old ones become visible without insight. Rom however has been supressing the blood moon from reaching its apex preventing access to the nightmare realms. The last faction is that of the moon presence and thus we are tasked (unknowingly) with destroying Rom so as we can access to the nightmare of mensus and destroy Mergo in turn destroying the nightmare. This goal is only in conflict with that of the school of mensus as we can complete the game without ever going to upper cathedral ward or castle cainhurst. Most significantly however the blood moon will continue to appear and the scourge will continue so long as human use the old blood. The moon presence's motives still remain a mystery to me however.
Chikage is actually a common female Japanese name so it's the sister to Evelyn. Why are they named after females? It's like how you name a ship after a woman or something. People name their weapons.
Arianna is either, dare I say it, the daughter of the Vileblood Queen herself, or a descendant, most absolutely. A noble, without a doubt. Also, points for using the score from Bram Stoker's Dracula. (don't worry, I feel you, my boy). Nailed it. /hands Mitch L a cross "For the dead travel fast......." /slams carriage door.
Personally, I believe the Executioners had their own goal along with the church's goal. Logarius is very likely Pthumerian. Now, if that is true, he would have likely seen what happened to Queen Yahrnam, her unborn child Mergo, and the fall of the Pthumerian civilization. Maybe he wanted to avoid the same outcome of Yahrnam's pregnancy being repeated in Cainhurst.
20:40 I find this assertion that Evelyn was "probably beautiful" a little odd, as the gun could have just as easily been named after her because she invented/helped to invent it in the first place.
Many characters say "moon scented" and some do it from very far away (Iosefka) and others do it from through windows (gascoigne's daughter) so I doubt that it's just the smell of blood
counter counter point: royals in the real world time frame that bloodborne is based off often would reverb between royal indication (we, our) to casual indication due to the poorer people gaining more control and adjusting the language of royals
When it comes to Arianna being a black sheep I think she's referring to begin the black sheep at Oedon Chapel and how nearly no one is too fond of her there. If we're to believe that she escaped the executioners' raid on Cainhurst Castle and made it to Yharnam that would turn her into an outsider, someone who Yharnamites aren't fond of, that, alongside her profession. Sister Adella shows to be jealous or upset by us simply interacting with Arianna and the Narrow Minded Man conspires against her as soon as both Adella and Arianna reach the chapel.
Awesome video! Just one point, "Chikage" is written "千景" which means "thousand shadow". Not blood. If blood it will be written as"血" but how it reads is same sound. It might be a rhyme.
I figured I'd bring this up, but I have reason to suspect that Cainhurst may have had their hand in the events that happened at the hamlet, just look carefully at the designs on the cainhurst helmet, you should find a familiar enemy amongst the many designs on the head piece.
I'm here a bit late, but I find it funny that you've got a dog barking in the background of your video while talking about Ariana, like its warding her off. "Back, foul temptress, tempt not thine blood upon mine master!"
I think, and maybe someone has already said this, is that when the church was on begining to gain more followers, the scourge happened and at that time cainhurst and the church might have been in agreeable terms. So cainhurst started dispatching knights to deal with the beasts. Around that time gerhman, maybe a peasant or a regular commoner participating of the hunt, noticed how the Knights were powerless against beasts for their clunky and noisy armor. That's when gerhman decided to utilize speed and stealth and the church noticed. He then might have gained notoriety and was given the option to train the first hunters. Thou the church might have secretly have their own enforcers like the executioners back then.
Something of note, the scent of a hunter is probably something very unique but also probably potent. You mention both Analise and Arianna commenting on it, but before that even, Gascoigne's daughter will comment on your scent when you first talk to her through the window in Central Yarnham. Her dialogue goes as follows, "Who... are you? I don't know you, but I know that smell... are you a hunter?"
But other characters other than ariana and anilyse (sorry if I misspelled their names I dont remember how to spell them and guessed) smell you or try to smell you, the idea is that hunters give off a weired smell because some characters smell you before you reach them, take the dweller for example, he mentions how he didnt smell you coming because of the insece that masked the hunter scent
Just a few points. Hunts are a common occurrence, the chapel dweller says that Yharnam has always survived them, though the time you meet him he thinks this time Yharnam is done for. Arianna was picked by Oedon, the formless great one to give birth to it's child. Oedon most likely did this because the chapel dweller invited an adequate surrogate to the Cathedral Ward. With her words saying "this can't be... This is a nightmare", it's worth having in mind that planes of existence that are not the waking world are refered to as dreams and nightmares. Arianna's is in shock/disbelief/denial with what has just happened, referring to what has just happened to her is her living in a dream/nightmare.
I think it's interesting that Arianna may also be considered the only "fertile" mother available, from Oedon's perspective. There is Adella the Nun, but her chastity might make Oedon shy away from her. I'd like to have a closer look at this in the future. Planes of existence will also be a topic of a future video. Thanks for your feedback as always!
Mitch L I think the great ones also have trouble finding anyone that can give birth successfully, not just a case of a woman being fertile. The great ones are in a way different species to one another not just humans so they have real difficulty producing successful offspring.. As for planes of existence, it's worth researching astral planes as Bloodborne takes a lot of influence from that as well as Lovecraft. Fun fact. The Moon Presence's name is Flora (the doll says that) with a lot of ties to the Roman deity of the same name. Perhaps it's a coincidence that the dream is covered in flowers but for me it's a nice tie in especially since the flowers in the dream are may flowers which are very related to the Roman goddess Flora.
they smell you because hunters cover themselves in an incense that wards off beasts, it helps them hunt. this scent is also noticeable by people, and it lets them know that you're a hunter
In relation to Arianna being a prostitute and offering you her 'blood' instead of her 'body', maybe that's what constitutes a prostitute in Yharnam? There are such things as 'lactating prostitutes' which... well, you can figure it out. Instead of going in for sex, customers come to imbibe in her "forbidden blood" (the forbidden fruit always tastes the sweetest). We learn from the pungent blood cocktail that blood is more popular in Yharnam than alcohol, "as the former is far more intoxicating". Perhaps instead of booze & sex, brothels instead provide blood and... more blood. As for the unknown Byrgenwerth scholar who brought back forbidden blood to Cainhurst, I posit this may be Maria. She was there at the beginning before Lawrence & Wilhem's schism, she was at the Fishing Hamlet (meaning the figure in the painting/effigy may indeed be holding a Kos parasite) and she is from Cainhurst. While Maria is never explicitly referred to as a 'scholar', her prowess with a blade shouldn't belittle her intellect in any respect.
I know I'm about 4 years late, but as a side note, Arianna doesn't seem to die if you're careful when killing the Celestial Child - it says "Pick up item" on her body, not "Loot Corpse" as it does on the Child. It doesn't make sense for this to only apply to picking up clothing or something like that, considering we get the "Loot Corpse" option when picking up the clothes off any other corpse we find. It's certainly possible that there is a link between the Child and its mother, but that link could have instead knocked her unconscious for the remainder of the Hunt, or even placed her into a coma. Perhaps I'm just hoping I didn't murder someone innocent in this game (again), idk.
if I recall, there's quite a number of characters besides the two you mentioned that mentions about the character's smell. My question though is what does 'Moon Scented' mean???
The "Royal We" normally refers to the office/title of king/queen, not the individual. Annalise claims no subjects, but the Queenly position is still assumed. So while SHE may claim no subjects, the monarchy is still in practice, therefore, the royal We is used.
"Eyes on the inside" is a nod to hippocampus evolving from a periental eye - hippocampus is responsible for releasing DMT which affects how we percieve reality. Hippocampus also governs the amygdala.
Laurence wasn't the first to betray Willem at Byrgenwerth. The original Japanese has Willem say "you also think to betray me", in the cutscene between himself and Lawrence. The Cainhurst betrayal came first
r44cker I think he's talking about the scholar who betrayed Byrgenwerth and brought back the forbidden blood back to Cainhurst, he/she was the first to betray Master Willem.
Gehrman isn't a scholar, as we know he's the first hunter. We also know that he's the colleague of Laurence, the founder of the Healing Church.
We can conclude that the healing blood distributed by the church is the one that caused the beast scourge, which is why Laurence asked Gehrman to be the first to hunt them (he then recruited elementary doctors as hunters, suggested from the Black Church set description).
Later we have 3 types of hunters in Yharnam, the Old Hunters, and the Powder Kegs with Ludwig's church hunters (which includes Black and White Church hunters) working in tandem.
no
It could have just of easily meant Laurence betrayed him and also did something else to him ex: lie
Not sure if someones said this yet and this is almost a year after the fact, but does the vileblood queen's line of "Moon-scented hunter" imply that she can smell your relation to the moon presence and may possibly know of the moon presence already?
E E I would say probably. A moon scented Hunter is one who has had a blood transfusion and thus made a pact to hunt beasts. I'm assuming the blood itself is from the moon presence and would change your scent. She is extremely old. Vilebloods themselves are corrupted by old blood from a great one so it wouldn't surprise me if they would know of other great ones giving blood.
A lot of people talk about your scent. Like the weird but nice guy in the chapel, or Gascoigne's daughter.
Yup
A thought, we've established all manner'o'ways that blood is business AND fun in Yharnam. Blood cocktail spells out how people prefer to get drunk on blood than alcohol.
Well, if one were a woman of pleasure, and had particularly sweet blood to boot, sharing her blood wouldn't be all that rare an occurrence, right?
It sings to me, it's enough to make a man sick!
Minor Correction... When you choose to kill the celestial child, Ariana does not die. She merely faints or passes out. You can tell by the fact that she is still breathing. Also, there is a clear difference between the poses Ariana ends up in whether you kill the child only, or if you actively kill Ariana by attacking her.
Keep the great content coming bro! I have been with you since the beginning and it is clear that you continue to improve your videos. In my opinion your content is better than most if not all the other BloodSouls Lore channels. You always have unique theories and analysis unlike most other people who simply regurgitate the work of others. Keep up the great work!!!
Ah really? I'll make a correction in the next video. Thanks for your continued support Brian, it really means a lot!
I love how thorough you are, story of Ariana escaping as the Executioners raided the castle was amazing
00000
You know, with Annalise’s iron mask, the french terminology, and Arianna’s ironic fate as a surrogate mother for the child of blood, I wonder if Arianna was in fact a twin of sorts to Annalise, a sort of twist on one of the legends surrounding the man in the mask and the then ruler king louis XIV, in which the masked prisoner was actually the king and a look a like or twin sat the throne.
Honestly, I just thought Arianna was a bastard child, since royals did sleep around a fair bit, but that idea is WAY cooler
Pretty sure Arianna, and possible other children as well, were deliberately spared by Logarius, seeing as his motto seemed to have been to always endeavour to do good, even if the act might be unwise.
The Church might have provided Arianna with lodgings in Cathedral Ward, as a means to keep an eye on here, just in case.
Gilbert mentions your strange scent as well; I think the fact that your blood is not *as* tainted as everyone else's in Yharnam is why both Arianna and Annalise comment on your blood, and not necessarily a Cainhurst/Vileblood thing.
Really great video! I like the series a lot.
JamieDanger Gascoigne's daughter mentions the hunter's scent as well.
Imposter Iosefka also mentions your scent if you pry your way into the clinic before the blood moon. She says "Ah, moonlit scents!" when you first walk into the area of the clinic that she is in. Very interesting indeed. Maybe it's because your blood isn't as tainted, or maybe it's a moon presence thing? The Moon Presence seems to usually if not always choose a *foreigner* as the new hunter when an old one is released. Father Gascoigne is also a foreigner, as it says in his clothe set that the title of "Father" didn't exist in Yharnam. So, perhaps father gascoigne was also a hunter for the moon presence until he was released and started working for the healing church? That could also tie in how his daughter comments that you smell like him. Just speculation. The hunters dream where the moon presence resides is also covered in flowers that kinda look like the lumenflowers thats scent would comfort the patience of the research hall in the old hunters DLC. So maybe they reek of the flowers or scent of the moon presence? Not sure.
oedon is formeless, yet his child is slug like, like ebrietas (daughter of the cosmos)
Kos is fish (yeah) like, yet her child is humanoid
~ 13:20 When you kill the Celestial Child, I don't think Arianna dies, though I may be wrong, because when you search anything dead in the game, it says "Search Corpse," and instead, for Arianna's Shoes, it says "Pick up Item..." Just an idea... Keep up the great work Mitch! ;D
@Esoteric Jesus Lol she won't be using them anytime soon, so it would be a shame to let a good pair of noble slippers go to waste.
Edit: Funny story, I hit her and the celestial child using a fire dmg weapon and only the baby went down. I had to hit Arianna about two more times before she finally died. I felt bad about it, but I wanted those damn slippers. Flaying and burning a lady and her newborn baby alive just to mug her for her shoes definitely isn't one of my proudest accomplishments.
A lot of NPCs comment on the hunter's smell. At first you're expected to think it's the smell of blood/beasts/gunpowder, but then it becomes clear it's the "smell of the moon" as more and more NPCs comment on it. It's supposed to be a foreshadowing that the moon and the dreaming hunters are connected.
I just typed up a lengthy comment replying to someone else that actually touches on your theory. I'll just copy and paste it here if you don't mind and you can tell me what you think.
Imposter Iosefka also mentions your scent if you pry your way into the clinic before the blood moon. She says "Ah, moonlit scents!" when you first walk into the area of the clinic that she is in. Very interesting indeed. Maybe it's because your blood isn't as tainted, or maybe it's a moon presence thing? The Moon Presence seems to usually if not always choose a foreigner as the new hunter when an old one is released. Father Gascoigne is also a foreigner, as it says in his clothe set that the title of "Father" didn't exist in Yharnam. So, perhaps father gascoigne was also a hunter for the moon presence until he was released and started working for the healing church? That could also tie in how his daughter comments that you smell like him. Just speculation. The hunters dream where the moon presence resides is also covered in flowers that kinda look like the lumenflowers thats scent would comfort the patience of the research hall in the old hunters DLC. So maybe they reek of the flowers or scent of the moon presence? Not sure.
"Get Lube."
Fantastic. Absolutely fantastic.
Holy shit, Mitch! You nailed this! I completely missed The Cainhurst/Arianna connection. I thought it was just the place you get her dress. I wasn't playing consciously. This made me want to step up my pay-attention-to-detail game up big time. Bcs of this video I found you on Patreon and became a $10/month pledger. I'd love to see a Lore Video on The Fishing Hamlet.
Ghost Paper thank you!! This means a lot!
I would say that the lack of mirrors may be due to the “insight” that some of the people may acquire. And they wanted to prevent people from seeing beasts, or from seeing themselves as beasts. Same goes for why many of the characters in game have bandages over their eyes. What they saw due to their insight drove them mad so they take out their own eyes
"the way your char turns around and gazes into all that insight he has collected after that confrontation" was priceless
These videos have made me very sympathetic to Cainhurst and the Vilebloods.
Mitch L more like Mitch "Most Thorough" Loreman
Ty for these brilliant vids, m8!
The "L" is for Lore!
and thanks!
I love your work. You dont di entry level lore like vaatividya and fungo who just talk about things you can discover by playing the game. You actually speculate and use deeper lore and make your own thoughts. You talk about the parts of the lore I have always been interested in. And that's the world and what it was like before instead of just focusing on all the characters anyone playing through the game comes across. I admire your work very much and am certainly going to subscribe
I'd love to see you do videos on the houses of dark souls similar to this vilebloods lore
First off, great vids.
I think your position that Cainhurst is the oldest part of Yharnarm is very intriguing. Coupled with the idea that they are "vampires" of a sort, it made something quite clear for me:
Why would any scholars/students/teachers etc. at a University decide to start "Drinking" some old blood they found in a dark crypt in the first place? It had always seemed odd to me that the drinking of blood would seem like a thing to do at all. Not just for students, but also eventually for all the residents of Yharnam, even to become as normal as imbibing alcohol.
But if Cainhurst is, indeed, the oldest culture of the area, it would seem understandable that their practices (of drinking blood), would somehow find their way into the social consciousness. Perhaps their ancient and peculiar ways were what gave the first Byrgenwerth scholars the IDEA of imbibing blood. The peculiarity of Cainhurst, in a way, normalized the drinking of blood. Through hearsay, myth, first, second, and third hand accounts, it was Cainhurst's ancient practice that was the backdrop for Byrgenwerth's original methods.
And perhaps a few Cainhurst Nobles were even integral in the Byrgenwerth ranks. Perhaps even, {from the empty sets of presumably Cainhurst Armor in the Chalice Dungeons), they were the ones that gave knowledge of the old labyrinths to the Byrgenwerth elite in the first place.
Perhaps it didn't "all start at Byrgenwerth" after all.
I love your summary. Very well put. Something I had not considered until after I read your comment is that universities often require great amounts of wealth to be constructed and maintained.
What kind of institution would be able to bankroll an operation like Byrgenwerth? I think you're seeing what I'm getting at.
Haha! Give me some of that Vampire Money!
I watched both of these, last night and just decided to subscribe. I never thought of the meaning of the "Cainhurst" name (other than sounding like a true British place name), but it makes sense. I'm enjoying these as much as Vaati's lore videos.
Dragon-of-The-Abyss86 Thank you! I appreciate the support!
Mitch, the Lord of Lore.
You flatter me.
Another excellent lore vid. Arianna is one of my favorite characters as well so cool you covered her so extensively.
I think you're on to something with Cainhurst being quite similair to the Healing Church in the ways they cope with the beast plague. It indeed sounds more likely that Cainhurst was aware of old blood and the great ones far before Byrgenwerth though never in the same scholarly capacity as Willem's teachings. In fact it's more like Cainhurst was unaware of the origin of the old blood but not of its effects so it took on a different cultural form that is the unique to the Cainhurst nobles. In this context the 'child of blood' could merely be the Great One's surrogate the way Cainhurst(and as such Annalise) understood it. Cainhurst dealt with the old blood most likely ages before Byrgenwerth researched it but never reaching the same conclusion.
The institution Willem and Laurence started however were able to academically research the old blood and were able to figure out how it related to the Phtumerian labyrinth, the Great Ones and ultimately their yearning for a human surrogate as they could not reproduce on their own.The 'old blood' is ultimately seen as some kind of virus that while having medicinal properties ultimately turns people into beasts but what if that isn't really what happens? The old blood could merely be the means through which the Great Ones communicate in order to find a suitable surrogate. It says so in the lore note that ''when the red moon hangs low the line between man and beast is blurred'' which indicates onset of beasthood is in direct relation with the arrival of the Great Ones followed by ''..and when the Great Ones descend, a womb will be blessed with child'' which again
is also exactly what happens as after slaying Rom Queen Yharnam gives birth to Mergo and Arianna is impregnated by Oedon giving birth to a celestial.
The Healing Church knew this would happen and indeed as you say the fact Arianna is not surprised that a birth in her bloodline took place(just that it was her) indicates the arrival of a Great One's surrogate was built into Cainhurst culture and tradition but with completely different meaning attributed to it(namely, a 'child of blood' through the offering of blood dregs). That Cainhurst was ultimately so similar as being 'chosen' by the Great Ones as the Healing Church explains their animosity towards them. After all, Cainhurst was their biggest rival even if the nobles weren't aware of it. There are some really clever metaphysical relations with organized religion here but that's probably a topic for another time. :p
Looking forward to your next vid about Alfred, Logarius and the executioners. Lots of really cool lore stuff there as well.
Thank you, my friend. It's cool to see that some people agree with the timeline of Cainhurst. I agree that they do not understand it to the same point that the Healing Church does, though it is curious that the anonymous scholar decided to take the blood back to Cainhurst. For research? or perhaps as an item of faith?
I wouldn't be surprised to find out that the Cainhurst nobles fed the blood to some of their people to see what would happen to them, and then kill them discretely after observing the effects. At some point I will also try to prove that the Cainhurst Knights descended into the Chalice Dungeons at some point. I have presented some of the evidence already, but I have more that I would like to put out there as well. What I will also discuss is just how fucking slimy the Healing Church are. The morality of the Executioners is so warped and a really fascinating topic to think about.
Thanks for your feedback! Also, are you Dutch? Stroopwafel is one of my favourite snacks!
Good points! Could be that there was some kind of relationship between Cainhurst and Byrgenwerth(and later the Healing Church) before things turned sour as the Healing Church felt betrayed by a scholar taking some of the forbidden blood back to Cainhurst. The medieval armor you find in the chalice dungeons could definitely indicate that the Cainhurst lineage was aware of the Phtumerian labyrinth long before Byrgenwerth was.
The Healing Church is definitely malicious but this seems to be a recurring theme in Miyazaki's games: The Way of White, the Cathedral of the Deep, 'God' worshipped in Demon's Souls actually being The Old One.The Healing Church is definitely among the worst though considering all the shit they did in the research hall and the fishing hamlet. Wouldn't be surprised if the violation of Kos' corpse is what caused the schism between Willem and Laurence.
Haha yeah I'm Dutch and definitely agree: stroopwafels(caramel waffles) are delicious!
stroopwafel en ijsje I actually started making graphs on a whiteboard today to get what was in my head out visually, haha. I have a theory that would explain exactly why the Executioners were sent to Cainhurst, but it's a bit zany. I will present it to the best of my ability in the next video. If I can figure out how to prove it, it could change a lot in regards to how we view Cainhurst and their connection to the Great Ones/Pthumerians.
Awesome! Looking forward to it.
I think you nailed it mate. The idea that the Great Ones impregnating the vilebloods is instead perceived simply as a "child of blood" and that the tradition is carried on without the true knowledge of why it happens, I think is why Cainhurst thrived for so long (Until the Executioners wiped them out of course)
The Yarnhamites by contrast, do not follow any kind of blood tradition and actively investigate its meaning as soon as the old blood is discovered. This is what lead to their own downfall, as they went mad learning the truth about the great ones which caused them to disregard their morals in pursuit for "ascension". Had they not gone that far, they could have potentially quarantined the beast scourge (As they had attempted to do in old yarhnam) and focused on refining or abandoning the blood.
24:02 Ya got a message buddy..
Often a sovereign will use "I" in situations like that as well as the royal we. I'm sure there's a technical explanation about when to use "we" and when to use "I", but the point is they will often mix it up and use both.
I like that you used the music from Bram Stoker’s Dracula. It certainly fits.
"sanguine plague" means "bloodborne plague". A sickness of the blood.
Considering the fact that the beast plague is the most prominent plague in the game (besides Ashen Blood), I think it's safe to say that the Cainhurst folks were familiar with the beast plague. They were vampires, so maybe the scourge manifested itself differently, and they transformed into Bloodlickers and vampires instead of Beastmean and scourge beasts.
Basically, yeah. The main takeaway from that section of the video is that the Healing Church used the exact same methods of discretely hiding the Scourge before it manifested into uncontrollable beasthood.
@@mitchl6896 I think that Cainhurst actually managed to hide it since, I'm assuming, only Royals were allowed to partake in Blood. Whereas the Healing Church gave it to everybody.
a lot of characters actually refer to you by scent as opposed to vision
gasgoignes daughter, iosefka, annalise, arianna, etc.
my theory is that the blood itself enhances the senses
however it is odd that annalise mentions it
arrianna makes sense, like all yharnam residents (city wise and possibly outskirts as well) sghe would have possibly partaken of the healing church blood offerred to citizens
however
annalise and by extension the vilebloods themselves, are supposedly born of DIFFERENT blood from another source (though this blood too came from Byrgenworth which eventually the healing church would form from technically)
so was the blood actually the same and the inquisitors (the executioners) fabricated the forbidden blood lie to further demonize the cainhurst nobles?
it should also be noted that it is Alfred who mentions this who in my oppini9on is NOT a true executioner himself but instead admires their legacy based on word of mouth stories. hence his blatant fanaticism regarding them. in fact i would further theorize that the true executioners are no more having been disbanded or killed long ago (possibly at cainhurst itself as Alfred states that "all did not go well..." possibly meaning most fell in the assault)
4:00 I hear a doggo. bork bork
Obviously late but ive started to give consideration to the healing church wanting to get rid of the vile bloods because even after a much longer period of imbibing blood they have yet to ascend. Contradicting the churches beliefs
Just want to say thank you from 2019. Your high quality video essays are very appreciated and I dearly enjoy these on my morning commute. You are a great video editor and are effective at speaking in a way that it makes this analysis feel like a story more than a documentary.
N V thank you for your kind words!
The Cainhurst stuff is a Griffith reference from berserk. The armor looks almost exactly like his and the formal wear is almost identical to what he wore to the ball where he was almost poisoned.
Ah, I think you're right. I guess Miyazaki just can't help himself , lol
muh BERSERK reference
One thing that really makes me appreciate Castle Cainhurst is the original Bela Lugosi Dracula. So much is referenced. The carriage ride is highly reminiscent of the one Renfield took in the film. The ghost women of Cainhurst look like Dracula's harem of undead femme fatales. The fact that the Indentured Knights of Cainhurst (and potentially you) are basically vampire thralls like Renfield. If you haven't already seen it, watch the film after that chapter of Bloodborne.
In the original book, Harker, the main character, took the carriage ride
There could be some credence the theory that Logarius is a pthumerian. I apologize if Redgrave already said this as I have not watched his video, but the Pthumerian Elder’s close range scythe-like spell is nearly identical to the shape of Logarius’s weapon. That on top of logarius’s similar size and hair color to that of the pthumerians
I love this video! And the part with the Cainhurst slaughter is brilliant!!
Thanks!
Ive seen from the other comments and me too i believe that Arianna doesht die when you kill her alien kid, i think she just faints and because we know that Miyazaki is very strict with his games when you search her body it doesht say search corpse, just pick up item so we can assume she is still alive.
I think that in the royal plural, you are still allowed to refer to yourself as "I". The reason why one refers to themselves as "we" is because the belief is that the monarch represents the country, so every time they speak, they do so for the realm and their subjects.
Saying "I claim no subjects" actually rings with a hint of sadness in her dialogue, because she refers to herself as "I". Therefore, it's the equivalent of her stating that she's fully alone and subjectless. I don't think that it's meant to be an exception from the royal plural.
This is great dude. thank you so much for being so in depth. I've been sitting uere for the last 2 hours watching.
fashion wise cainhurst borrows from several time periods the most obvious being Queen Analise who sports a round gown with an empire waist from the Empire Period (1785 - 1820 ) the knight set feels like late georgian era featuring a short waistcoat, jockey boots, loose fitting breeches, great coat and periwig hair.
holy shitman. this is some really high quality stuff. keep it up mate !
I highly doubt Ariana was alive during the siege of Cainhurst. It almost seems like what happened in Cainhurst had happened decades earlier, if not centuries. I think it's much more likely that she's simply a descendant.
The weapons you find there seem just as advanced as anywhere else. I think it just looks old because it's been destroyed in a battle.
@@jacobhoover1654 yes there is to some extent :) the type of armor and weaponry equipped by the fallen vilebloods are historically much earlier than the victorian type attire that we see in Yarnham, and the Queen speaks in an old-fashioned way as well. though who can really say
@@Darfail it's the industrial era as shown by the smoke stacks, Gatling gun, & size of the buildings which are many times larger than the Victorian era. Are u saying BB is an alternate earth timeline? I'd agree with you because the Gatling gun is named after its inventor irl.
@@jacobhoover1654 In my opinion it seems pretty clear that yarnham was largely inspired by the victorian era, yes obviously it's not a one-to-one thing but the clothing, architectural style etc. seem fairly clearly victorian to me. They had chimneys in victorian times too....and the gatling gun was invented in the victorian era... but one of the things in the game that clearly stands out as being from a previous period (analogously) is Cainhurst - in architecture, weaponry and armor, and language among other things... Even without it being a direct alternate earth timeline, there are reasons why armor and weaponry progressed the way it did and the entire way Cainhurst is set up seems to imply that it is from a previous era even in-game.
I believe 'Evelyn' and 'Evelynns' is the name of the 'special pistol used by Cainhurst Knights'
Should point out in the topic of scents that Gasciogne’s child and the guy at cathedral ward identify you as a hunter by scent
I’ve spent way too much time watching lore videos, but for some reason in this one it occurs to me how strange it is that people in black church garb appear to have died kneeling before Cainhurst statues. This made me wonder, did the Healing Church member take up residence in the Castle after it had been cleared by the Executioners only to be plagued by the spectres of their slain foes?
I haven’t gotten a great look at the daggers carried by the Cainhurst ghosts, but don’t they look similar to the small blade of Lady Maria’s Rakuyo? Her hunter set mentions that she was a descendant of the Cainhurst line. If you guys have any input on this I’d love to have a discussion.
the lore is so deep...
"I claim no subjects, but here lieth Our throne", it's a statement about her view on the kingdom of Cainhurst. Its Knights slaughtered, its Nobles murdered, and its Peasants driven to madness and mindlessness... a Kingdom of Empty Corpses being ruled over by an Immortal. As far as I can find she never uses anything but the royal We from that point on.. but this assumes that the translation into English was well done.
Love this video man, most thorough lore exploration I've seen.
Thank you!
I applaud your talent and recognize the hard work behind your videos, especially this one.
I only have one thing to not, necessarily correct but more of to inquire upon. I could have sworn you can attack the child and not kill the surrogate mother? She faints afterwards this is shown by her breathing post to slaying the "god". I forget how to angle it but I am pretty sure it can be done. Other than that I believe you did exceedingly well on this and have pointed out much lore that I was interested in. Look forward to more mate.
Cheers!
I think you're right, actually. You can kill the child without Arianna dying as well, that was my fault. It's also interesting she faints when the child dies, but I digress.
Thanks very much for your feedback! It real means a lot. The next video will probably be about digging deep into the lore and history of the executioners, so I hope to see your thoughts on that!
Yeah either way, with this video was spot on theories and more importantly proof of those theories!
By the way, what time is it where you are because it is 3:30 am where I am at and to get a response this "early or late" is awesome. You do great with fan service and I love it.
+Nathaniel Phillips Thanks dude. Bloodborne is just so fascinating to think about. I live in Australia so we are about 9 hours or do behind the US on average.
Not sure where you are but I assume it's somewhere in the northern hemisphere. Also I love interacting with the lore enthusiasts, honestly makes the entire process worth the effort :)
Yeah I live in Pennsylvania in the US. So its about lunch time where you are at, cool.
Glad that you aren't losing sleep because you are making lore videos! Though I do look forward to more I'd rather you stay sane for as much "insight" as you have. lol
Well anyways I am going to go check out your dark souls 3 lore series right now. If it is anything like this I am going to be up for awhile. So yay more theory talk! :)
+Nathaniel Phillips sounds good. If you ever want to chat, send me a message on the FB page or twitter.
The smelling is a habit off dogs/wolves as their something werewolf/vampire like, so smelling would be one off the first instincts.
loving the Bloodborne vids, got yourself a new sub :)
Thanks dude!
so am I the only one who thought of the Monty python scene where one guy massacres a wedding when I heard of what the executioners did?
Haha! That's actually perfect.
Your lore videos are so good. Keep up the good work mate
Thank you!
I believe Cainhurst and Byrgenwyrth cooperated well after the events of Fishing Hamlet. It's only after the Healing Church's establishment that the Executioners raided the Castle.
That's probably true.
The traitor might not be a "he". The English translation added a gender where the original Japanese left it neutral and mysterious. It's very likely the "traitor" was Lady Maria. At of all of Laurence's Hunters I think she and her arc fits best.
is it just me or do i hear a beast borking "tonight Gherman joins the hunt"
Could it be that arianna and maria are sisters. They are very similar in appearance and are both seemingly from cainhurst. Just a neat little theory.😊
Mitch, I know it’s been years since you wrote this, but something I’ve noticed, and I hope you can respond, is why the Cainhurst Knights on horses on the stairs have their right legs cut off? I mean, I know all the speculation on the curse coming up the right leg and the belts on some of the leg armour sets and German having a peg leg. Have any idea?
Daniel Burnd that’s my guess or That it’s an oversight. I imagine it would be quite difficult to stay upright on a horse with one leg.
It’s interesting to think about how Alfred’s mention of the scholar being a “he” was added in the translation to English, which opens up who the betraying scholar could be.
I heard that dog asking for attention at 3:55
great stuff man, can't wait to see more. Sorry I don't have more to say, but you're putting as lot of info out there so it's hard to process right away
All good! Thanks for watching!
in my 700+ hours in bloodborne I have never seen that seen Ariana in the basement having given birth nice find
it certainly adds a lot to the lore
the barking in the background lmao, but thank you as a person who also wants to learn more abt the vilebloods these videos help me a lot due to how thorough they are, never thought of the "being watched" part of the hemwick cutscene being a possible reference to someone watching you and guiding you to Cainhurst castle. i'm wondering If anyone has a guess on who it would be? i'm thinking maybe the vileblood you fight at the grand cathedral during Eileen's quest, because the other ones are only found in the chalice dungeons, and at least we find the guy in Yharnam
extremely well researched!
Cheers mate!
As usual, very facinating!! I really loved that clip where you told a story of Arianna. I also like the way the music and the way you phrased it matched when you said ''To think, it was corrupted Blood that began this Eldrich Liason''. I also like that you picked apart her final dialogue to get meaning out of it.
Can't wait to hear you talk about her Mask and the superstitions of Metals... Reminds me that Quicksilver bullets from the PC and the Oedon runes are Mercury, a metal...
I also like that you discussed that the ghosts look real and alive under the right light; VERY SIMILAR TO CHALICE GHOSTS if you ask me. Corrupt Blood and immortality eh..
Analysis of that weird elevator statue/image is great too, but I wouldn't say it looks like a Kos Parasite hand, but more like holding a huge feather or feather pen.
I just want a never ending flow of these videos, I love Bloodborne Lore so much, and especially your presentation of it, that I'd watch every single video you put out regarding Bloodborne. Please sir, may I have some more?
Thank you for your wonderful feedback! Bloodborne lore is just fascinating. I don't plan on stopping anytime soon. Next video should be up around a week from now.
Im late but still gonna comment that the executioners came after the first hunters
U mean the big enemies with axes, the executions that brought the executioner's gloves from a distant land, or the Exacutioner covenant that hunts vilebloods
imagine evelyn was related to maria or arianna 😳
Great work as always! Eagerly awaiting your next video.
I think the next one will focus on the Executioners, Annalise, and a slightly zany theory that I have.
Great video! Adding some personal interpretation to the lore is in my opinion the best way to explore and wrap up the story :) many things can be guessed just by putting ourselves in the characters' shoes and trying to see the world from their prospective.
Can't wait for your video on Lady Maria! From what you anticipated in this episode, it seems like we have similar ideas about her background and the 'lifestyle' of the Cainhurst nobles as a whole :)
As for the country of origin of the Chikage I think it's safe to assume it's the same " distant Eastern land" mentioned in Yamamura's garb (he even wields it :D )
Thanks for your feedback! I can't wait to talk about Lady Maria and her story. She's one of the most interesting characters in the game, and is probably my favorite boss battle in Bloodborne. We will be making a brief pit stop by talking about the Executioners, as they have some really fascinating elements to them that I can't wait to discuss. Thanks again!
By the way, I've just seen your PM to the channel, but it won't let me respond for some reason. Could you resend it to the facebook page or my Twitter? There's some topics I'd like to discuss with you!
I think the reason you smell strange not Arianna, and the reason Annelise calls you "moon-scented," is because of the Hunter's Dream and the Moon Presence. I think the Hunters who rely on the Hunter's Dream have an otherworldly, ethereal scent. I also think they're very rare, as I imagine Hunter's of the Church aren't aware that the Dream exists.
Great video, Explains a lot about the time line that had not made sense to me before, particularly the distinction between the nobles and the vile bloods.
I have a theory that there can be considered to be 4 active factions in the game during the time period we play in: Cainhurst, the choir, the school of Mensis and the moon prescence. I believe that all of them excluding the moon presence are attempting to advance the species through different means.
Cainhurst and the choir are attempting to create a hybrid species with the old ones to continue the legacy of their own species; I believe that all the celestial children in upper cathedral ward are collected in the orphanage to achieve this goal and as such the choir are far closer to achieving it than the vilebloods.
The school of mensus on the other hand are trying to replicate the old ones and ascend to a mental realm and abandon the physical realm completely. As such they use the power of a celestial child to create a nightmare realm and shape it with miklash as the host, thus why it appears with human architecture where as the nightmare frontier lacks a host to shape it resulting in its chaotic nature. The blood moon is a regular natural occurrence when it is possible for the physical and the mental to coincide which is why people afflicted with the scourge transform then and the old ones become visible without insight. Rom however has been supressing the blood moon from reaching its apex preventing access to the nightmare realms.
The last faction is that of the moon presence and thus we are tasked (unknowingly) with destroying Rom so as we can access to the nightmare of mensus and destroy Mergo in turn destroying the nightmare. This goal is only in conflict with that of the school of mensus as we can complete the game without ever going to upper cathedral ward or castle cainhurst. Most significantly however the blood moon will continue to appear and the scourge will continue so long as human use the old blood. The moon presence's motives still remain a mystery to me however.
Chikage is actually a common female Japanese name so it's the sister to Evelyn. Why are they named after females? It's like how you name a ship after a woman or something. People name their weapons.
Arianna is either, dare I say it, the daughter of the Vileblood Queen herself, or a descendant, most absolutely. A noble, without a doubt. Also, points for using the score from Bram Stoker's Dracula. (don't worry, I feel you, my boy). Nailed it.
/hands Mitch L a cross "For the dead travel fast......." /slams carriage door.
What if the “something circular” in the carved woman’s hand is a crude representation of a part of Umbilical Cord?
Personally, I believe the Executioners had their own goal along with the church's goal. Logarius is very likely Pthumerian. Now, if that is true, he would have likely seen what happened to Queen Yahrnam, her unborn child Mergo, and the fall of the Pthumerian civilization. Maybe he wanted to avoid the same outcome of Yahrnam's pregnancy being repeated in Cainhurst.
20:40 I find this assertion that Evelyn was "probably beautiful" a little odd, as the gun could have just as easily been named after her because she invented/helped to invent it in the first place.
Or could be a reference to Avelyn, the crossbow from the *Dark Souls* games.
He said "perhaps beautiful" and that it was speculation so he wouldn't bother talking about it
Gascoignes daughter can smell you as well when you approach her window hunters seem to just have a distinct smell probably that of blood
Many characters say "moon scented" and some do it from very far away (Iosefka) and others do it from through windows (gascoigne's daughter) so I doubt that it's just the smell of blood
counter counter point: royals in the real world time frame that bloodborne is based off often would reverb between royal indication (we, our) to casual indication due to the poorer people gaining more control and adjusting the language of royals
When it comes to Arianna being a black sheep I think she's referring to begin the black sheep at Oedon Chapel and how nearly no one is too fond of her there. If we're to believe that she escaped the executioners' raid on Cainhurst Castle and made it to Yharnam that would turn her into an outsider, someone who Yharnamites aren't fond of, that, alongside her profession.
Sister Adella shows to be jealous or upset by us simply interacting with Arianna and the Narrow Minded Man conspires against her as soon as both Adella and Arianna reach the chapel.
Awesome video! Just one point, "Chikage" is written "千景" which means "thousand shadow". Not blood. If blood it will be written as"血" but how it reads is same sound. It might be a rhyme.
I figured I'd bring this up, but I have reason to suspect that Cainhurst may have had their hand in the events that happened at the hamlet, just look carefully at the designs on the cainhurst helmet, you should find a familiar enemy amongst the many designs on the head piece.
The dog at 4:15 made me happy fr
I'm here a bit late, but I find it funny that you've got a dog barking in the background of your video while talking about Ariana, like its warding her off. "Back, foul temptress, tempt not thine blood upon mine master!"
I think, and maybe someone has already said this, is that when the church was on begining to gain more followers, the scourge happened and at that time cainhurst and the church might have been in agreeable terms. So cainhurst started dispatching knights to deal with the beasts. Around that time gerhman, maybe a peasant or a regular commoner participating of the hunt, noticed how the Knights were powerless against beasts for their clunky and noisy armor. That's when gerhman decided to utilize speed and stealth and the church noticed. He then might have gained notoriety and was given the option to train the first hunters. Thou the church might have secretly have their own enforcers like the executioners back then.
She is a prostitute but you are a hunter! Blood.
I love that, "moon scented hunter" line.
Something of note, the scent of a hunter is probably something very unique but also probably potent. You mention both Analise and Arianna commenting on it, but before that even, Gascoigne's daughter will comment on your scent when you first talk to her through the window in Central Yarnham. Her dialogue goes as follows, "Who... are you? I don't know you, but I know that smell... are you a hunter?"
Arianna is the OG only fans girl!!!
Vanpires dont need mirrors ;P
Also if executioner grabs you he slits your throat like they did to the vilebloods
But other characters other than ariana and anilyse (sorry if I misspelled their names I dont remember how to spell them and guessed) smell you or try to smell you, the idea is that hunters give off a weired smell because some characters smell you before you reach them, take the dweller for example, he mentions how he didnt smell you coming because of the insece that masked the hunter scent
Just a few points.
Hunts are a common occurrence, the chapel dweller says that Yharnam has always survived them, though the time you meet him he thinks this time Yharnam is done for.
Arianna was picked by Oedon, the formless great one to give birth to it's child. Oedon most likely did this because the chapel dweller invited an adequate surrogate to the Cathedral Ward.
With her words saying "this can't be... This is a nightmare", it's worth having in mind that planes of existence that are not the waking world are refered to as dreams and nightmares. Arianna's is in shock/disbelief/denial with what has just happened, referring to what has just happened to her is her living in a dream/nightmare.
I think it's interesting that Arianna may also be considered the only "fertile" mother available, from Oedon's perspective. There is Adella the Nun, but her chastity might make Oedon shy away from her. I'd like to have a closer look at this in the future.
Planes of existence will also be a topic of a future video. Thanks for your feedback as always!
Mitch L I think the great ones also have trouble finding anyone that can give birth successfully, not just a case of a woman being fertile. The great ones are in a way different species to one another not just humans so they have real difficulty producing successful offspring..
As for planes of existence, it's worth researching astral planes as Bloodborne takes a lot of influence from that as well as Lovecraft.
Fun fact.
The Moon Presence's name is Flora (the doll says that) with a lot of ties to the Roman deity of the same name. Perhaps it's a coincidence that the dream is covered in flowers but for me it's a nice tie in especially since the flowers in the dream are may flowers which are very related to the Roman goddess Flora.
they smell you because hunters cover themselves in an incense that wards off beasts, it helps them hunt. this scent is also noticeable by people, and it lets them know that you're a hunter
In relation to Arianna being a prostitute and offering you her 'blood' instead of her 'body', maybe that's what constitutes a prostitute in Yharnam? There are such things as 'lactating prostitutes' which... well, you can figure it out. Instead of going in for sex, customers come to imbibe in her "forbidden blood" (the forbidden fruit always tastes the sweetest). We learn from the pungent blood cocktail that blood is more popular in Yharnam than alcohol, "as the former is far more intoxicating". Perhaps instead of booze & sex, brothels instead provide blood and... more blood.
As for the unknown Byrgenwerth scholar who brought back forbidden blood to Cainhurst, I posit this may be Maria. She was there at the beginning before Lawrence & Wilhem's schism, she was at the Fishing Hamlet (meaning the figure in the painting/effigy may indeed be holding a Kos parasite) and she is from Cainhurst. While Maria is never explicitly referred to as a 'scholar', her prowess with a blade shouldn't belittle her intellect in any respect.
Xanatos712 Exactly my thought as far as to the nature of her prostitution.
I know I'm about 4 years late, but as a side note, Arianna doesn't seem to die if you're careful when killing the Celestial Child - it says "Pick up item" on her body, not "Loot Corpse" as it does on the Child. It doesn't make sense for this to only apply to picking up clothing or something like that, considering we get the "Loot Corpse" option when picking up the clothes off any other corpse we find. It's certainly possible that there is a link between the Child and its mother, but that link could have instead knocked her unconscious for the remainder of the Hunt, or even placed her into a coma. Perhaps I'm just hoping I didn't murder someone innocent in this game (again), idk.
Mitch just a heads up... chikage (千景) means something like "A thousand sceneries"!
Thank you! Always love looking at the translations.
Many people can smell and the chruch of the good Chalice have a story with people smelling and it's of the moon.
Why does the character in the beginning look so decent? Like you did a great job creating him. Mine looks like wax
Hours in character creation
if I recall, there's quite a number of characters besides the two you mentioned that mentions about the character's smell. My question though is what does 'Moon Scented' mean???
That they smell like the hunters dream/moon Prescence