Hard drives will use microwaves and lasers to store 60TB or more | Upscaled
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- Опубліковано 13 жов 2024
- With 16TB and 18TB drives, we're nearly hit the limits of how much data we can cram onto a hard drive platter. But a pair of new methods for writing data may enable a leap forward in capacity: heat-assisted and microwave-assisted magnetic recording, HAMR and MAMR (collectively called energy-assisted, or EAMR). Hard drives may feel old fashioned compared to flash SSDs, but these new methods use some cutting edge physics to cram as much as 60TB of data into a hard drive.
All three of the big hard drive makers, Western Digital, Toshiba, and Seagate, are developing versions of this technology, and the first consumer drives just shipped.
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Dude this is the best guy from this channel
Agree
By far
🍟🐕🦔
I seriously love the Upscaled series. Don't even take a second to click the play button on these videos. Superb job 👌🏼
Same.
It's the best tech stuff in my opinion. I do think Engadget should break it off as its own channel though.
This series should have a separate channel. Fricking amazing stuff.
literally came in to the comments section to say this exact thing.
Accurate
It’s mad they haven’t done this but I think the demand is growing - comments like this appear on every video now.
Agreed
This guy's energy is higher than the energy used by these new hard drives. 😅
Keep this guy on more videos on this channel. 👍😎
quick! get those cables, and we'll jump him?🐕🧸
This series really has the perfect amount of technical detail.
I just love how much effort and detail this guy puts in his videos. He definitely needs a raise
Finally someone who can atleast explain nicely 👍👍
I remember that there was also research on organic and cristal based hard drive storage, both very expensive and taking a very long time to record something, but with huge capacities, i wonder how they are ferrying right now
Remember reading about that too many moons ago
That is the road to Zardoz
lol, /s
Thanks, Chris, for another awesome episode of Upscaled! Always informational and detailed. Hope you are staying well and safe!
nice explanation. the main problem is, as capacities go up, transfer speeds must go up too because having to read let's say 10TB from a mechanical disk will take you several days to complete and the risk for fail is big. hdd speeds have not changed much. these new technologies are awesome, but if speeds are not within reason for the capacity, one of the biggest problems in storage, still remains even for archived data.
I am loving the energy of this guy and the intense information density that i cannnot find anywhere else while still being entertaining.
The first computer my family had in the early 90s had maybe like 100mb of HDD storage, and I remember my dad telling me how that was enough to store the text of all the books on our bookshelf. I was incredibly impressed! This is just unfathomable
These videos are amazing Chris. Always amazed at how easy to follow you make these explanations.
Barely purchased a pair of 10 TB IronWolf NAS drives... Interesting how this content gets on my recommended feed days after setting up a RAID drive. MAMR & HAMR are fascinating tech though! Just two 60 TB drives in a compatible RAID 1 setup could be all I need for preserving footage for a docfilm!
I don't think that is a smart idea.
When one drive fails you want to rebuild the RAID. But there is chance higher than 50% that you get an non-correctable sector read error when reading more than about 12 TB. You would need 3 Disks.
Chris is the smartest 🥳 and I love the “hysterical vegan” vibe 😎
I feel so educated even though I understood nothing.
Great video! I like this channel because you value the content rather than releasing low-quality videos every day. Thanks.
This series is heavily underrated...
From watching his videos he seems to know his work and did his research. His videos are very informative and intrguing, at least most of the times.
Sounds like a bit of old magnetic technology from 100 years ago creeping in. Excellent. Back in the days of recording magnetic tape we needed an ultrasonic magnetic 'bias' signal that was applied with the audio signal being recorded. This got around the magnetic hysteresis problem for weak audio signals so the audio-frequency magnetic signal recorded on the tape was not butchered by the magnetic hysteresis in the magnetic medium. This is just like tapping the edge of the paper when demonstrating how a bit of powdered iron would align with the field of a permanent magnet underneath the paper. The tiny bit of mechanical energy from vibrating the paper helped the iron particles to finally settle into their correct places. That's how ultrasonic bias worked back in the day. What you described for the magnetically assisted methodology you were speaking of seems conceptually identical to old ultrasonic bias to me.
These videos are amazing, basic sciences and how they apply to real stuff. Love it! I've given up local storage years ago now, have a box of Toshiba 6tb drives just sitting there with Gbit broadband I just download everything from cloud
HAMR and MAMR are what Thor should have called Mjolnir and Stormbreaker.
I wanna see this guy conduct an orchestra. 😁
Great info and explanation, btw. Keep up the good work!
Man oh man. It’s so weird that tech like CRT’s and HDD’s run off of concepts that are so much more mind-blowing and hard to wrap your head around (mostly because they take physical movement speed into account) than any of their superior modern counterparts.
5:14 It's refreshing to see someone admitting that instead of bullshitting his way through a flawed or dead wrong explanation.
All audio tape recorders use some form of bias when recording voice or music on tape. This is necessary for two reasons: one, to erase what is already recorded on tape; two, to ensure that even the most feeble sound is correctly recorded.
This is normally achieved with a pre magnetization frequency (>100 KHz) applied with an "erase head" to the tape; and by applying the same frequency to the "record head", in addition to the audio signal to be recorded. The high frequency signal applied must be strong enough to override the magnetic reluctance (related to the coercivity you mention in the video) of the tape, and the various magnetic hysteresis. This high frequency signal must increase with the resistance to magnetization of the tape (the bias for a metal tape is 250% the signal necessary for a normal Fe-Cr tape).
This is the first time I see a bias signal added to a digital recording. Using a radio frequency bias, in my view, is better than using heat. But this is the opinion of one, of course.
Thanks for the video,
Anthony
2:42 that animation was spot on!
0:22 he can't be more right lol, i'm keeping about 1 tb of movies in an external hdd and i never look back at them, it doesn't seem that i'll be able to get rid of them any time soon for some reason !
@Omar Valentini I just have a 1 tb hard drive on my gaming laptop and I have to delete games to play new ones
@Omar Valentini nice
Upscaled got me to sub. This is high quality content.
Awesome presentation as always. Thanks, Chris.
Excellent, quality content. Great job Chris, keep it up!
Nice explanations with good visuals. Enough to satisfy my curiosity craving.
I get the impression hard disk drive prices have remained overinflated. There was a time when prices would halve when higher capacities were released but even an 8TB drive is quite high in cost considering it’s quite old. Perhaps allowing companies to buy their competition out was not a smart move as there isn’t a need to be competitive anymore and they can easily keep prices inflated. I suspect these will have enterprise pricing for a long time as there seems to be a movement to take high capacity storage out of reach of consumers budgets forcing users to subscribe to cloud storage tightly linked to certain apps like Apple Photos + iCloud, Lightroom + Adobe CC storage etc
Good to see you provided all sources👍👍👍👍...expecting it in all😀😀😀
I had written off this channel until I saw this... This is the perfect blend of intro and deeper dive!
I think improving speed is most important for now as backing up a 20 TB drive takes a while
I hope it's not gonna come with huge drawbacks like the SMR drive debacle.
9:37 : "So what are you doing to store in your brand new 60TB hard drive ?"
My "homework" folder. I'll probably need a few HAMR hard drives though
Hard drive prices haven't come down in about a decade; 4TB was the standard hard drive size in 2011, and it's still the standard size today. In the 2000's, prices used to halve every 2 years or so. Those Thailand floods irreversibly screwed the progress of hard drives.
Well, you can only make a hdd to a certain price point, because of manufacturing. A 1tb hdd can't be way cheaper than a 4tb drive because of that.
@@macht4turbo My point is that the capacities vs prices we're at now is the same as they were 10 years ago, whereas in the 2000's capacities vs prices doubled every 2 years. We should be having 32GB drives for $130 at this point.
@@BaghaShams Price progression is not always linear like that. The consumer demand for hdd is very low right now and enterprise is able to buy drives at a much higher cost, the enterprise derived consumer hdds are more expensive that way. These huge hdds are not very viable for daily consumer use. I would argue, that if you have the demand for a raid with 32gb drivey, you are most likely going to be able to suffer the cost, you are buying enterprise equipment none the less.
@@macht4turbo Price progression was quite linear for over a decade, then it completely stopped as of the Thailand floods. That was the only point I was making.
Your theory about demand is interesting, although I'm not completely convinced considering the various hobbies and professions such as photography and video production which has exploded in recent years, which all require vast amounts of redundant data storage.
What are you taking about? The price per gb has like halved .
Absolutely love this show. Should have WAY more views than its getting. Maybe getting drowned out by other random Egadget stuff?
Why is it that all the reporting on hard drives is about capacity? Seagate, for example, has developed a technology called Mach.2 with which they have increased IOPS and MB/s. This does not make their HDDs into SSDs, but at least more interesting if you want a compromise between capacity, price and speed.
Hilarious Sidenote of magnetic direction in lavae! Love it! :D Guess for fun, have you been an exogen Tutor?
My man with all the juicy stuff!
I love this guy, this is the best tech series I’ve seen.
This was a absolutely amazing presentation. Well done.
When are we going to see the 5.25inch drives coming back? Rosewill has a nice server chassis that adapts 9x5.25 bays, to 12x3.5 inch bays, by cutting out the surrounding material, you'd be able to have more platters in a given space. I could see a 5.25 inch drive, using current technologies, being 28TB instead of 16TB
Manufacturers should go for 2 SSDs. Sata big 1 TB for storage & M.2 PCI express 256 GB for OS.
0:00 Surprised i didnt see a bunch of people commenting "but flash drives are so much smaller"(in the sense of small USB drives)
HAMR sounds like a philosophical descendant of the old super floppy drives.
You should do more UPSCALEd Type videos..
This is seriously getting into Retro Encabulator territory
The overriding concern of placing this much data on one device is recoverability. Unless I/O speeds are proportionally increased, the amount of time needed to extract/rebuild the data from a drive that was predicted to fail (via SMART) or had already failed (in some RAID config) could challenge the ability of the remaining like sized drives whose MTBF’s would be comparable at that moment. Even if only one drive prematurely failed and collective MTBF were not in play, how long would it take to reconstruct a RAID 5 or “10” array constructed from numerous 50TB drives? A long time even at highest SATA bus rates available today.
The big bottleneck of these high capacity hdd is Price
I still don’t get why they can’t stripe data across the platters physically on top of each other so they can do simultaneous reads and writes off of every platter surface. So like an 8 platter HDD should be able to read/write 4 times faster than a 2 platter HDD. This seems like it’d make more sense than having two actuators.
0:46
That is actually impossible you have to rebuild so you will go for new anyway and it DOESN'T save money either way...
Great explanation with visuals. Thanks.
While my day to day storage is on SSDs, I still use HDDs for backups and mass storage.
A 15Tb HDD is still 10 times less expensive than an SSD of equal storage.
And you should never store anything "in the cloud" that you would not want shared with everyone in the world - including your wife, daughter, mother and boss. Because "the cloud" really means, "someone else's server". And you are completely at the mercy of someone else's server security.
There should always be a prominent place for local storage, and local encryption, no matter how connected we become.
Fantastic as always!
This technologies are amazing, but one have to wonder if they even make sense. Right now we can create a 100TB ssd with easy. Clearly they are expensive, but most of the money go to the fact of they are unique. The Curie temperature is for Pierre Curie, one of his many contributions. I was a shame that he died so young, in his prime. Together with his brother (engineer) they were a magnificent couple of the experimental sciences.
Dude no offense but you exist at 1.25 speed and that scares me.
The video is pretty fantastic, even though it gives me that very specific 'studying 30 min before the exam' anxiety.
Upscaled should get its own separate UA-cam channel
Let's help this guy with the algorithm of UA-cam ;) Btw, you did a great job!
This guy's videos are the best.
I search for upscaled not engadget.
thanks for your great content
This feels like Sony's MiniDisc on steroids. MDs use a laser to heat up the magnetic material to its Curie point and use magnetic field to write data. The data on MDs is read with a laser head like a CD though.
Didn't we have something like this back in the floppy disk era?
So a nano-scale laser heats up a nano-scale section of a very thin platter for a nano-scale circuit made up of nano-scale capacitors, coils, etc. to magnetize this nano-scale area of the platter.
All while the platter is moving at 5400, 7200 or even 10,000 rpm and there is not only one, but several doing similar operations several times per second, all in a 3.5" enclosure...
And all is being developed to happen seamlessly to be able to reliably store data not only for days, but years.
*cries in exabytes*
Now I will need one week to copy all the data to that drive with 100MB/s speed
This is hardcore, would love a 20terabyte external hard drive
Calculate how long it takes to fill the drive, when you constantly write to it.
Why do you need so much space?
@@happygimp0 For homework and games.
These are very insightful info and you are very smart and intelligent on the above topic 👏👏👏👏
Plus the pace is perfect!
Good video, but it was distracting with the volume of the music.
Sounds like an excited robot voice over from the Family Guy universe of people on the verge of needing to drop a deuce. I wasn't actually looking at the screen while listening to this and when I did I thought it was the guy from The Office...
Rotary data density advantage = as hard drive data density increases, hdds will overtake ssd with both speed and reliability. Hdd's will make a huge comeback in desktops as the incentive for flash memory disappearing gradually
That just makes no sense
@@akalion213 Flash memory speed is at 'saturation'. Premium ssd use ddr4 ram to speed up data throughput. But this can be added to hdd's of the future. Clearer? Oh well I tried..
@@addydiesel6627 Don't you think that if it could be done effectively it would've happened already?
@@akalion213 Ok just for u. I'm talking about future. MAMR arrives fall of 2021
Never mind the capacity limits, when is the price going to drop? The sweet spot has been 4TB for far too many years now. I currently have 3 drives in my main machine because it’s more cost-effective than buying a single equivalent-capacity drive.
Don’t try this on an OS with only 26 drive letters!
yeah this is cool but so far a 10% improvement comes with a 10% price hike for a lot of tech these days
hard drives are dead to me, they aren't cheap enough to compensate being like 20 times slower and noisier, capacity isnt everything even when using as cold storage, if it takes you a couple days to move data around, its time to reconsider things
3:45: I thought it was that Harry Potter scene with all the banking elfs the first time around.
I'll pretend like I understood a word you said but I'll play along
One big problem is, that these drives take forever to be written.
For the primary use, in datacenters, it isn't a problem. They still use HDDs because is still cheaper per GB than SSD, and they can balance traffic so no disk needs to run faster.
In fact, this could be a nice option for having some sort of tape storage (now there are options up to 185TB!) replacement for information that doesn't require really long term storage or needs to be access fast.
What about LTO Ultrium for backup storage?
IN. SANE. the tech is just... i can't even
Not sure why manufacturers are wasting time and effort trying to squeeze another 30% of capacity that's probably of questionable reliabilty out of mechanical hdds. Solid state storage is far more promising, cheaper and smaller - SDUC micro Sd cards have the potential to hold 128TB, you could have dozens of those and it would still take up less space than a 3.5inch hard drive.
Love your videos!!
His series on various tech things is the only reason I'm subscribed to this channel! Amazing content and energy!
Great content as always.
Something I don't understand, to heat a substrate above its curie point you need mm microwaves or infrared in the 100's nanometers wavelength but the tracks are less than a 50nm width. Can you explain how a laser shining an IR light in the 1000 nm would bring the current track at curie point without erasing all the neighbor tracks. The only wavelength able to target a 50-nm track would be in the gamma ray range but gamma ray do not heat a surface they just go thru it, and are pretty nasty to human without proper shields.
How much coffee did you have before this take? 50? 60 cups?
I seriously don't understand why sequential throughout doesn't increase with an increase in density. Are they only squeezing the tracks closer together and not making the "bit pitch" (along the track) smaller?
Why I've subscribed to this channel.
Just when I thought SSD will go cheaper and harddrives go extinct..
Boom *new technology* 😅
this is a very valuable information
thankyou
Lol, this guy is a spazzy nerd. Love it. :D
Great content!
More reliable? Better be careful with that, the way I understand it a SSD can only be read and written to a specific number of times and that becomes worse with qlc flash. Whilst a hdd can go as long as there are no mechanical failures.
Completely forgot i was subscribed to this. This makes up for it
We are reaching the capacity limits of HDD only now? Wow... This tech is ancient. Ask grandpa and he will tell stories of 10MB drives the size of a shoe box with the prize tag of 3000 dollars...
I can't believe we're still using mechanical media in 2021. Regardless of how far the technology has come- solid state will eventually replace it.
Western Digital HDD is great product. 👍
Imagine array rebuild times...
Fingers crossed they come out soon and drive down $perTB down and insure HDD live on rather before SDD make them into vinyls
I think HDDs will make a return because the shortening of life span that happens every time more bits per cell are added will make SSDs un-useable for any sort of long term storage. only crystal or DNA storage can replace HDDs
So the substrate used in HAMR technology is Glass and no more Aluminum,right?