What It's Really Like To Work In Germany Vs. The U.K.
Вставка
- Опубліковано 2 вер 2023
- Visas, pay, insurance, taxes that's all important stuff but what is it actually like to work in Germany with Germans? What is the day to day really like? How do people treat each other, how do they communicate and what can you expect? Well find out what it was like for me...
What to watch next:
• Starting Over In Germany
• How Money Conversation...
• How I became Fluent in...
About me:
I am a Brit (from England) who lives in Germany. After completing University in the UK I moved to China where I taught English for two years. I’ve learned a thing or two about cultural integration, language learning and everything else that goes with upping sticks and moving to a foreign country. I make videos about cultural, language and life and tend to pose a lot of questions. Join me on my exploration of life abroad.
#work #workingermany #workingabroad
Germans give direct negative feedback rather than the very indirect negative feedback in the UK:
"You'r doing it wrong" instead of
"Maybe you should think about this as well...".
It's a cultural thing.
Totally!
As german I worked 10 years in switzerland.
First it was annoying to ask in every email how the weekend was and hoping the children are well and wishing a good start for the week....
The critics was the same after all.
When I first started working here, often the comments started with: " That's not the way we do it here. " I wasn't sure if they meant at the place of work or Austria in general. Sometimes there were snide remarks: "Is that an American way of doing things?" Having European parents, I knew all about directness and emphasis on negatives, so I didn't take it personally. After 5 years of weird hierarchy rules at two different places, I opted to self-employ.
Greatly depends on the sector and even then on the location, I think. I've had wildly varying experiences outside and inside the academic world, in Freiburg and in Potsdam. The former was VERY hierarchical, which immediately starts the circus of blame avoidance. The second gave you much more leeway to accept your responsibility without immediate negative consequences.
As a German living and working in the UK, I think you are spot on. I took me a while and quite a lot of effort to “iron out” some of my German habits, which didn’t go down well here at all. I can totally see how difficult it must be for a Brit to get used to it on the other side. So you have my sympathies 😉
😀thanks a lot where there’s a will there’s a way but it does take a bit of getting used to
Which habits exactly didn’t go down well and what would have been expected instead?
I don’t agree with the video partly on failure culture. It has gotten a lot better with the blame game and only really shitty colleagues and companies aren’t aware of the fact that this is not a good company culture. That doesn’t mean you don’t look into what has gone wrong anymore because that is important to do it better next time. But usually where I work there is an understanding that to blame someone isn’t very helpful.
Same here, German living and working in the UK. I feel like there's a lot to talk about.
What I found hard is emails/work conversations. And it's really two things that seem contradictory. My German self wants to just get to the point and not having all this chat about the weather, traffic, coffee machine etc. I get it, it's nicer to ease into a conversation...my manager literally had to practice with me picking a random topic of the week to talk about when on the phone😅...oh yes, the tube is on strike again, yes very awful...😅😅 on the other hand, maybe it's just me, but a lot of Germans have a tendency to write very convoluted emails. Too many adjectives, too much detail... at least for me it's the very German mindset of being very precise. Anyone else the same?
@@larimichel4250 I like the German directness. I lived in Germany for about 11 years from 1993. I like to be organised anyway :)
As usual, the main culture shock is and remains the differences in style: Germans are rudely direct if you are British, Brits are enormously vague and confusing if you are German. I have had to explain to many of the people reporting to me that if I ask them to do something, that my phrasing should not be mistaking it for a suggestion. I've had to learn that sometimes you do have to tell Germans explicitly that what you just phrased (to them) as a suggestion, is, in fact, a Dienstanweisung.
Yes, please - tell them directly. I am Northern German and subtle hints about how things could or might be done are completely wasted to me. Southern and Western Germans, from my experience, are lot less direkt (probably still very direct from a British perspective), but I spent years listening sympathetically to me Western German neighbours (after moving here) before I realised that everytime they were telling me something about a problem they were having, they wanted to let me know that I should do something about a problem I was _creating_ in their eyes, w/o being to impolite. So instead telling me that our bushes would grow past the gardenfence, narrowing the sidewalk, they would be telling me long stories about how fast the bushes grew in their garden, even past their fence... wtf... Of course I did not realise they were adressing my fence when talking about theirs. :)))
They just could have said: "See, could you please cut your bushes? They are blocking the sidewalk". And I would gladly have obliged.
Of course, by the time I realised how communication worked over here, they thought that I was both weird and rude and talking to me about anything garden-related at all was completely useless.
🤣🤣oh dear. That sounds like a classic
It is part of my profession to teach Germans how to translate "You're doing it wrong" into English: "This is an interesting approach; however, I'm not sure I would do it this way. Have you tried...". I'm not sure (see, I'm doing it ;)) to what extent this direct approach vs. circumlocution really mirrors different attitudes or is just a cultural convention. The misunderstanding works the other way round, too: an uninformed German might take "interesting" for praise, whereas any Brit would immediately realize that it means quite the opposite.
Yes totally. I imagine integrating in the British workplace can be really frustrating for a German because you always have to read between the lines and kind of guess what the other person really means.
Yes. And while reading the emails you ask yourself "Where is the point? What does he want? Where are the hooks?".
It takes more energy to decode it, than telling the facts.
@@britingermanythat would drive me nuts, tbh😂
... explains a lot of British politics though.
In this regard the Austrians are very similar to the Brits. I read an article about an Austrian professor (or what do you call someone working in university as teaching person?) who worked in a German university. He had some situations where he was facing some misunderstanding. One day he wanted his students to search for a specific book with the phrase "Sie könnten vielleicht mal nach diesem Buch suchen..." (English: Maybe you could look for this book...). Several weeks passed and the professor asked his students why they hadn't look for it. They were confused. They thought his request was optional.
In my view Germans use a large spectrum of saying "You do it wrong" or "Your idea is bad".
When you've done something wrong it could be: "You've done was not so smart..." (polite) to "Are you serious?" (rude).
When you're idea is bad: "You can do it this way, I wouldn't recommend it..." (polite) to "Your idea is complete bullshit" (rude).
My father told me his approach how he treats his employees. I'm quoting him mostly directly: "If you have a problem with your work and you're not able to solve it, you can come to me and ask for help. But if you don't do it and you mess up your work, you have to take responsibility for it. I'm definitely not going to run after you and ask if you have a problem."
@@Dueruemtarget👏👏👏very good statement , the emloyee should be honest to himself and admit that the task is not clear to him. Could be a hint for the Boss to be more precise.
Having worked in Germany for three decades, there are a lot of interesting and valid points there. The working environment is very rules-based, so if you want to fit in, you have to observe a myriad of little rules. I've had my fair share of finger-wagging for taking shortcuts that ultimately made sense but were contrary to the accepted procedure. Where I work, in the south, they have a saying that goes, "nicht geschimpft ist Lob genug," which roughly translates as "the absence of criticism is praise enough." There is a certain tongue-in-cheek aspect to this. As you say, the Germans don't go in for full-on sarcasm, but if you've been with a company for a while and your language skills are up to scratch, there is plenty of subtle humor around to lighten up an otherwise mundane day. You`ll often find that when the cat's away the mice will play.
Hahah that’s great last point. And yes one of my previous managers always used to say “manchmal muss man sich selbst Loben”…because no one else is going to do it 🤣
But Eigenlob stinkt ;) joke aside Ur channel and the "who is mert?" Channel are the two best english speaking channels bout germany, even if Ur content is Miles away from each other. 😊
When we're going through homework my German language teacher never says good or well done if the answer is correct. There's just silence. For Australians this is very unnerving. Now I understand. Thank you!
"the absence of criticism is praise enough." I honestly love this. I really dislike receiving praise, it makes me feel awkward. I like silent, subtle praise.
@fritzish7299 At the company I work for, they have subtle ways of showing appreciation if you're good at what you do without actually saying as much (that's a no-go!), e.g. getting singled out to attend meetings, more interesting assignments, above-average bonus, the boss buying you a coffee etc.
This is very true. As a Brit I hated how unserious people can be in the British workplace and how everything can turn into "bannntzzz maaaate" in some workplaces, and have seen it lead to banter bros get promoted over the hardest workers. However, when I lived in the Netherlands (which I assume has a very similar working culture to Germany), I was shocked by how much the opposite it was. After very serious discussions, I would try to lighten things up with a mild jokey remark and be met with silence or sometimes even death stares. I couldn't believe how serious and formal everything was, all the time. I still prefer it that way over the English way tbh, but somewhere in the middle would be ideal.
It’s definitely possible to get that. I think it’s a bit easier in smaller companies that are not so bogged down with corporate red tape
That’s how I feel as a Brazilian working in Germany. The solution was to move to bigger and more diverse german company.
Oh my god, you reminded me of my struggles in Luxembourg until I got used to 😁. I live here for a very long time and the majority of my work experience is here. I'm Bulgarian btw, a mixture of very serious work ethics with sarcastic sense of humour, though we know to lighten up and have fun. Boy, did my desire to make fun after a stressful bout of incident management clash with the Germanic side of the work culture here 😁. In addition, a big part of the workforce is French, who have a VERY different sense of humour and work culture, Wallons (they are just the best 😁😍) and when you add all the rest of Europe in the European institutions, it becomes a mish-mash of horror stories, which makes you want to dig a hole and hide after a joke landed flat. 😁
That said, the serious working ethics is something that I thrive in, so I understand you completely.
One last thing, I also noticed very quickly how Germans are convinced they know right from wrong and that's something that used to irk me so much. I always thought that we should keep in mind that whatever we do might be wrong. I got broken at the 20th year living here 😂. Not that I think they or I are wrong or right, I just found ways to cope and not challenge them openly. Thankfully, Bulgarian language gives me a big repertoire of mental retorts I can do to calm down my "righteousness urticaria" 😁.
Listening to this makes me feel glad to be retired! You're all welcome to the world of work, whether it be in the UK, in Germany, or in Timbuktu! 🙂
Lucky you!!!
When you eventually retire, you'll wonder how and where you found the time to go out to work! 🙂 Work, for me, was only ever a means to an end; it was never an end in itself. My late partner, an American, was my complete opposite. He was quite a lot older than I. Moreover, he was a workaholic. So closely did he identify with his chosen academic career that he somehow couldn't imagine life outside of the Academy. He ended up not retiring, though he could easily have afforded to do so. Then he passed away, never having enjoyed the fruits of his labours and never having enjoyed a day of his retirement. He suffered greatly; and, alas, so have I.
As a fellow retiree, I totally agree. In my last corporate job the concept of work-life balance was quietly left to die and in it's place came e-mails from my manager at anytime of the day or evening, heavier work loads and fewer perks. I jettisoned working directly for a corporation and became an independent contractor where I set my own workload, choosing quality of life over more and more income. Happy to be retired now and leave all those challenges behind.
@@TSinRM Good for you! In the modern world, it seems to me that the concept of work-life balance has gone out of the window. In the corporate world, money rules everything now. Many people are little better. We are living in an incredibly greedy society. There is a lot to be said for being grateful for that which one has. One other thing I have observed, and it is this: few people understand the concept of deriving pleasure from just 'being'. In the modern world, people appear to understand only 'doing'. People run around the place like headless chicken! They all seem to be afraid of missing out on something. They run frantically here, drive recklessly there, and fly all over the place. We all like to do some of those things some of the time, but filling each and every minute of each and every day is not my idea of fun! Little wonder that so many people today end up with all sorts of illnesses, many of which were relatively unknown to previous generations.
It is nice to read that you have found your happiness and enjoy a good quality of life. That is actually quite an achievement in today's frenetic world. Happy retirement!
As an American who moved to DE from Silicon Valley in California almost 25 years ago, I was used to lots of leeway in how I got my work done. Not so here. I quickly learned that there was a prescribed way of doing almost every task, and that my boss would immediately correct me if I deviated from the rules. It took me a while to adjust, but the benefits of the job were so great that learning to do things the German way was worth it.
Glad to hear you adjusted well 😀
Much like learning their language. My Spanish teacher in college was from Spain and gave us some tips and shortcuts about who to figure out masculine vs feminine nouns. I took a Goethe German course later with a teacher from Germany. When I asked if there was any shortcuts to figure out the gender she looked horrified and said that you just memorize the nouns and their gender-period. The whole idea of shortcuts was clearly distasteful to her. Just a different culture from America/UK.
As an American living in Germany for decades, I recognise your description of interpersonal relations in the workplace. But I would add that most of what you describe is true within German society as a whole. The abject fear of doing something wrong, making a mistake, being at fault is probably what makes Germans such strict followers of rules. At a basic level Germans believe that unless you follow the rules you will probably do something bad or stupid. Or both. From that, probably, the German tendency to frequent bouts of moral indignation at other people's behaviour. "Ich bin empört" was one of the first phrases I learned when I came to Germany. People, it seemed, were constantly doing wrong.
There is a barely translatable German word, Eigenmächtigkeit, which has purely negative connotations. Behaving eigenmächtig, following your own lights, is simply wrong. This is axiomatic for a German, and difficult for a non-German to get their head around.
Yes, can’t argue with that 👍🏻
your are not wrong but maybe your perspective of the issue is still a bit influenced by your upbringing. The "modern" german dont follow rules because of hierachy (we had that and it went NOT WELL). but because we like to plan and order things and therefore "TRUST" rules and their goal. often rules dont make sense for your personal situation because its the "exception" that always exists, but instead of instantly debunking the rule we take some time to rethink if that rule does make sense in the majority of the situation. If you can answer this question with a "YES" we accept the rule.
the easiest example is traffic light ... we dont cross the street at a red light.
that has nothing to do with hierachy or fear of punishment but with common sense :) we understand that people in our society (children) are not able to asses that correctly so we agreed for the "greater good" to accept that rule even if it is a small inconvenience for us.
So if you dont follow a rule because of your personal situation without rethinking the "greater idea" of the rule it can happen that people are "empört" :)
Self directed, self centered, bull-headed, loose cannon.
@@Ashoriskthat would be very true if a very big portion of Germans didn't forget the rules once they pass the German border.
It's difficult to simplify an entire nation in a UA-cam comment but there are just way too many foreigners who notice this fear of doing wrong, specially in front of the others, for it to just be exceptions all the time.
Both you and the OP are right in your own way from my experience, it's just part of the complexity of a nation.
Having lived and worked in Germany since 1976, the first four years in the British army, thereafter 40 years in construction, I preferred the work atmosphere in Germany. But as I say I was in construction. And in constuction the atmosphere is Hart aber Herzlich (hard but sincere) You can tell your work mate to go and "f" himself, and 5 minutes later you are sitting down together laughing and drinking coffee.
British work culture: fairly informal and very indirect communication
German work culture: formal and very direct communication
Dutch work culture: informal and very direct communication
Alright...then lets move to the Netherlands 🤣
I would prefer the Dutch working culture as well.
Telling someone directly that they're doing something wrong isn't for the sake of putting them down, but to improve efficiency. Less spanners in the works, less drama, less rework, etc. Getting the workflow in order makes life easier for everyone and the business more productive.
Totally. It’s just a cultural thing where if you’re not used to it it can seem offensive.
*This was great !* .. A Dutch friend worked in the early 2000's in Germany in a US finance company. Everyone in the office greeted older colleagues in the morning by their surname. He figured, well, it's a US company branch, so he greeted everyone by their first name. Apparently the older colleagues didn't like it, but nobody said anything. He knew he'd only be there for a year, so he didn't really care. I worked with a couple of Germany expats in Ireland. They were very "stiff" and kept to themselves. But slowly they got into the office silliness. In Ireland, we don't really go for "office bantz". It's more occasional silly pranks ( even I've experienced among quite senior colleagues ). it can't all be just work - there has to be lighter/ human side also in the Irish culture
That doesn't surprise me at all 🤣
Wonderful seeing you back! Glad you look so calm and in control. Painting the DE workplace for others elsewhere was an excellent idea! 😊
Thanks a lot 😀. Have a great Sunday
Not all physicians hand out sick notes easily.
heard an orthopaedist once shouting at a patient (in another room) "ICH BIN NICHT DOKTOR HOLIDAY!!“ 😂
🤣🤣pushed too far!
I am German and I used to work in the Bank of England for one year in the 90s. It was HORRIBLE compared to the standards in Germany! Incredible overtime without any reasons. Dictative style, no friendly relationships between colleagues. In the Netherlands in the 2010s it was all about non-communication and leaving home early. I seriously prefer working in Germany.
Good news, you are where you belong.
Glad to hear you’ve found your place 😀
It is great you are back where the standards suit you and where you can complain along with others, especially about the ways of foreign people.
@@barbsmart7373 Ausser Beleidigungen hast du auch nichts drauf. Dein Leben muss scheixxe sein.
@@p.h.3987
Well, mate, you are free to think and write the way you do.
I admire britingermany because he has a very positive, friendly and respectful way of thinking and responding.
I live in a country where friendliness, respect, being laid back, embracing other cultures and not complaining are all typical ways of being.
britingermany is being very polite, like my people also usually are.
But I have heard from many Germans how much they admire their own unique norm of being brutally honesty. So I expect that a more honest comment, like mine would have been received a lot better.
It appears to me, however, that you are one of the Germans who do not appreciate honest feedback, jn actual fact.
You have not written a comment full of complaints only for German people to see.
They are read by people from all over the world. Being in Germany, perhaps you are not reprimanded by others for complaining excessively about the ways of a country which allowed you to not only live there, but to also work there with them. In my country, that behaviour is often scorned upon.
Where I live, we welcome visitors to our country very warmly. If they were to then complain excessively about us, that would be considered extremely disrespectful.
The act of deliberately switching to a language not normally spoken by the person being spoken to, is something I have never, ever witnessed in my life before. Again, to be honest, that would be seen as an extremely low level to stoop to.
I actually no longer use words from the official language of my country, around German people because one complained kne day about this bilingual practise we have here.
So regarding my life, I would not stoop to something that low.
While on the topic of how people are in life, I think it is a good idea to not only look at the behaviours of others, for example being dictative, non-communicative, and having inferior "standards", and look honestly at the behaviours of oneself.
I have an amazing friend who came to my country from the Netherlands. He advocated looking at things from the other persons point-of-view.
I worked in a huge hospital for a decade with people from hundreds of different countries and from many different religions.
We all got on perfectly well due to the culture of respect.
I know a lot of the nurses and doctors came from countries where they had much greater workloads, did more delegating, and had even better teamwork than we have here.
But I never, ever heard any person complain about our ways of doing things. Never.
I actually learned a lot about several wonderful religions and countries while working there. My respect for all those cultures, without exception, is enormous.
So my comment is just my response to your complaints about people from a country who accepted a person from a country like yours into theirs. I hope that is a clear response to your view of my comment.
My friends from the Netherlands and England have often told me about playing in rubble when they were kids. I am aware that there are many reasons why a person shouldn't get too stuck on how superior they are, and that includes all of us, of course.
I am a German working and living freelance from Spain. You nailed it with your description of the German work culture. There are still many sectors where a healthy work life balance is frowned upon as being unproductive and it's rather work-life-blending that is required. Although this seems to be slowly changing with the younger generation. Thumbs up for your insightful videos!
Thanks a lot Claudia😀
Good morning all! What has your experience been with work g in Germany? Can you relate or am I completely off? Have a great Sunday 😀
There several stages for workplace heroes:
1) find the mistake and name it
2) make suggestions to avoid it in the future
3) change or install a process to avoid these mistakes in the future.
If your criticism is solution driven and it's not personalised, if you see a mistake as a result and you work for a solution and embetterment of a product, you produce quality.
I think critics is a matter of containment in courtesies, it's a task to work on it.
Correction: .. "it's NOT a matter of containment in courtesies"
@@Kartoffelsuppe_m_Wursteinlage 1a) having the balls to say: it was my mistake
Interesting perspective. Having worked on projects in quite a few (10?) European countries for varying lengths of time I'd say all over the continent there is some joking around at work: at the coffee machine, over lunch, or the beginning / ending of meetings - the social parts of the day basically. But there is also serious work conversation with (little or) no levity involved, so there's a very clear split between the social and professional.
In the UK people feel a strong compulsion towards humour from the social imperative not to be "taking yourself too seriously" or "not to be too full of yourself" etc. Which means that after 3 minutes of anything the Brit feels compelled to make a jokey remark, where other Europeans do not. The split, the "now to business" is much less clear. This may make work more fun, but also less efficient and it shows in the results. And in the third of fourth project, it's very politely never mentioned why the new project still needs to do most of the work left over from the first. The lack of communication about issues is probably the major cause, but humour is part of that in my view.
@peter_meyer
Right.
1b) Never ever try to hide your mistakes from others or to belittle the consequences.
Hello! I'm a Scot who's also been in Germany since 2011 and I agree with your observations about banter. On one or two occasions I have really put my foot in it 😬 just trying to make someone laugh - the word Fettnäpfchen springs to mind!
I come from the consulting sector and have found Germans to be thorough but sometimes too rigid in their approach to work. Once a "Prozess" is in place, they are loathe to deviate from it, even if circumstances demand more flexibility. Every decision needs to undergo a proper "Abstimmung" before the team can move forward. The general observations about work-life balance and taking sick days are less applicable in consulting, as you are supposed to hit your targets, and overwork is actually glorified.
That’s the year that I moved to Germany as well. It seems like such a long time ago. I guess if the right incentives are in place then people will strive hard to achieve them.👍🏻
Your last sentence absolutely applies to the health care sector as well.
Abstimmung and Sicherheit 😂😂😂
Kia ora mate.
Come to New Zealand. Put both your feet here any time. We love a laugh. We're not anal. We embrace diversity.
your video series are valuable and love your commitment to both cultures. pleased do not stop! thankyou
Thanks a lot. Illl do my best to keep it up 👌🏻
I can't agree more with everything you've said and for all this reasons I miss working in Germany. Working in the UK as a German can be very challenging.. I love this country but even after almost 9 years living and working in the UK, I still struggle with what I would call 'false politeness' when colleagues (or myself) are obviously making mistakes and no-one seems to care! I've worked in quality and personal development in Germany and I just miss the good standards we have in Germany. There are some on paper here (I work as a Civil Servant) but that's about it. And also the blame and shame when you stay home for sickness, it's appalling. I haven't missed a day in the last 12 months but that also means, I gonto work when being ill..
Don't want to be misunderstood, I love living here and have met wonderful people, but work definitely not my reason for staying :)
Yeah the UK civil service is a funny place. Did a stint myself (also German), was fun but not for forever!
I guess it depends which department you're working. It's definitely better than the other jobs I had here in the Uk.. :)
@@martinaaugsburg1139 makes sense. I went from the civil service to Consulting to PE in the City. But now back home in DE for the chilled lifestyle. Enjoy the CS!!
@@thereallotharmatthae Sounds like a good career. I'm stuck here but nevermind ;)
Thank you, and you enjoy your life back in Germany!
I totally feel your pain! That's one of the challenges of moving abroad. Some cultural things are curious and fun others hard to adapt to
We have a friend who founded a company some 40 years ago, just outside of Vienna, and decided to have a "suggestions for improvements" box. He told us every week there would be slips of paper of colleagues complaining about each other, but every so often a good idea did come in. As for the complaints, he said it was probably a good way for people to let off steam as hardly anybody quit.
We had that for a while in a previous job as well. It was fun for a while but kind of petered put pretty quickly
I was in an interview yesterday, and they started with a speech in saying they try out calling each other "du" in the office, and asked whether I am OK with it in this interview...
Interesting. What did you say?
A very enjoyable video. Subbed.
Thanks a lot 😀🙏
Interesting to compare this with working in Japan versus London and Australia. Work (in office)is approached in a circular sort of way with ideas going around and being mulled over to achieve consensus often influenced by the section head. Somewhere in between the British and German paths yet off to side too.
There are many things I really like about German work culture (in comparison to the work culture in Canada, where I come from), but this incessant insistence on "right" and "wrong" ways of doing things tends to not only be inefficient at times, but also stifles innovation, I find. Now I just do things "the German way" in German corporate workplaces not because it works out better (often it doesn't), but simply to avoid blame. Even if I find a better way to do something, and even if I explain what's better about it, I won't be appreciated for suggesting it, and I definitely won't be remunerated appropriately for coming up with something better. It's actually made me realize why so often Nazi soldiers or officers in the lower rungs actually thought "I was just following orders" was some kind of valid excuse for their crimes during the Nürnberg trials. That may be an extreme comparison, but this insistence on following processes that have been set from the top down is seemingly an immovable aspect of German work culture. Pity really, because it often means that bad processes are allowed to run rampant too long, and problem solving is not a skill that's recognized in anyone who's not a higher up.
I think that this depends very much on the field you are working in. When I was workind in Science, hierarchies were flat and problem solving was highly appreciated. However, working at a lab in a large hospital associated with a university, I soon realised that this was not at all true for the whole medical field. There, it was much more like you described it. Which regulary led to problems in projects in which medical stutents or researchers and STEM-students/researchers were supposed to cooperate.
Up to today, many hospitals have a massive problem with "Fehlerkultur", being loathe to change established procedures and also loathe to admit to mistakes being made. So everybody sticks the established ways of things in order not to take the blame for whatever. (I have no idea whether that is also the case in hospitals elsewhere - I just can speak for Germany).
This notion might also be especially strong in Germany, as we as a Nation seem to be the epitome of "better safe than sorry"... ;) - but I think that in some fields it's really prominent, while in others, it is not existent.
I've never worked in Germany or for a German firm, but I know from experience that receiving a 7/10 satisfaction rating from a German client is stellar and even a 6/10 is solid. An American client would give a 6/10 to convey deep dissatisfaction and desire to talk to upper management.
Maybe it depends on the type of business you're in. In my experience only a 9 or 10 out of 10 is considered good here. An 8 or a 7 is kind of neutral.
Good morning, Ben!
For some time I've been working at a place where addressing each other was considered as norm, yet some few people were communicating on a more casual level. It was a bit weird - to say the least.
In all of my engineering jobs I've experienced a less formal and sgnificantly more cooperative culture with quite some banter and fun. The latter was needed sometimes as a way of coping with stress when things didn't work the way they were supposed to do. In engineering it's quite essential to find flaws as soon as possible because the later flaws are found the more expensive corrective actions will be - if they're feasible at all that is. Hence the more direct hinting at flaws and mistakes is taken as a friendly act of support rather than some kind of disrespect.
I found that it's actually a matter of company culture to maintain a way/style of communication which clearly separates banter from professional matters. The less clarity in that regard the more communication failures, I'd say.
Hello michael. Yes there are I dusted specific differences and I agree that in engineering it is very important to catch issues as quickly as possible. I think it is just the cultural difference in the communication style between direct and indirect which is often a little difficult to handle.
@@britingermany possibly there's such a difference within Germany, or better German speaking countries too. People from northern Germany are sometimes perceived as a bit more grumpy, unfriendly and harsh. There's a tendency to package criticism and rejection in a more acceptable, sometimes a bit indirect way in south Germany. And I've come across a few accounts of Germans appearing as offensive in Switzerland.
I worked for 10 years Switzerland. There are cultural and semantic differences in professional interaction.
If the meeting is in berndütsch language, it will have another atmosphere and sometimes result than in plain german. Swiss coworkers always ask how the children are, before they tell you that your new modifications made a mess in the data structure over the weekend.
Especially if a sentence ends with "odr?" you should be careful. It's not a question of confirmation, like "Isn't it?" It's just the order not to contradict now. ;)
In my experience I'm just shocked at how angry Germans get about work. My wife had an awful boss until recently and once she asked for a holiday off around Christmas, her boss later asked her to cancel it and she refused since it had all been planned with family and everything. The boss and the secretary absolutely lost it, the secretary was so angry that she was literally shaking with anger, at the indignation of the fact that she refused. This was not even a large company but a small startup. Unsurprisingly, my wife's holiday in the end had absolutely no impact on the project anyway. It was purely an emotional attachment to the fact that some aspect of the project had gone wrong and an indignation at the fact that my wife was not attached to the situation.
I've never interacted with another group of people who have such strong emotional attachment to their work. If it goes wrong, they cannot process it emotionally, and build up huge amounts of anger
I can relate very much to the “shaking with rage”. I have been confronted by that quite a few times….to be honest I think it is not always genuine…as I’ve experienced people to calm down unusually quickly if they get what they want…
Interesting, as always. Have a beautiful Sunday
Morgen, Arno!
@@sisuguillam5109 Hallo Sisuuuuuu! Habe dich schon vermisst.
@@arnodobler1096 bin seit 2.30 Uhr wach, weil ich die Kinder und den Hund gehütet habe. Jetzt hab' ich Feierabend und mach ein Nickerchen.
@@sisuguillam5109 Schlaf schön 🛏
Thank you Arno…spending a bit of time on the Rhein today😀. Enjoy the sun
The best example is when BMW took over British Leyland many years ago. The Brits couldn't understand why it took the Germans years to develop a car.
Quit a number of Brits went to Munich to be trained there in the German way and a lot of Germans came over to the UK to train people here. As we know now, BMW succeeded in only one plant with their way of working and that was at the Cowley plant near Oxford.
The rest was sold off for £1.00
The only reason Rover was run into the ground is because BMW wanted the Mini brand. Rover cars were seen to be more of a competitor, which wouldn't make financial sense for a company to have.
I will agree with you that the way the German factory workers work is quite good. I have never worked for a UK manufacturer, so I can't compare.
I wouldn't blame it on the Rover workers without knowing more. The responsibility lies with the boss (BMW). They didn't need Rover....
@@dandare1001 come on, British Leyland cars were crap and that was, in my opinion, mainly due to the power the unions had at the time
@@hanshartfiel6394 BL might not have been very good- that's debateable, yes, the unions did mess a lot up, as well as Margaret Thatcher. This was way before BMW.
The reason Rover (BMW didn't buy British Leyland, as far as I know) went down, was a deliberate move from BMW. If they could "teach" the Mini plant to work well, then they could do the same with Rover.
It obvious they didn't want that.
I can remember working in the design department in Ford, England & walking past the design vice president & greeting him “morning Andy” & he’d say “good morning” back to me, and I was just a nobody. Fast forward to working in BMW FIZ & you couldn’t even say “Du” to your immediate supervisor let alone greeting the design president!
Yes, you're expected to ask first to remove this barrier. Or the other person just offers this to you first, before you have a chance to ask. But greeting should not be an issue. A "good morning" followed by an answer is a thing (even in Germany) and it is considered to be very rude to not do this. Doing this and not getting a reply is a big no-go. No matter how big the gap between the ranks is. I would not allow this to slip through, even if the other guy is the president of presidents... Must be a real xxxhole then.
I once worked for a supplier in Germany in their small design department, & every morning the "chef" would come in & shake everyone's hand. I always assumed he shook Thomas's hand first because his desk was next to the door & my hand last because my desk was furthest. One particular morning I was using the printer right next to the door & the Boss walked in & I gave him my hand, but no he went straight over to Thomas first & greeted the others before shaking my hand. So it was then obvious that the "hand shake" was given by hierarchy, the longest serving first & me last because I was the "schiess Englander"!!!
@@dnocturn84
That's interesting. I started a project for BMW, recently, and they all offered the "Du" at the first meeting. I haven't met any directors, yet, so I don't know what they are like.
Daimler were only "Sie". They were also a miserable and arrogant bunch. I've heard this from many Germans about Daimler though, so it doesn't seem like my bad luck.
I'm at the FIZ quite often, these days, and luckily the BMW people all seem very friendly and kind. I know quite a few who have and had worked there, who didn't like it, but so far, my exoerience is positive. We'll see what it's like when the pressure goes up a few notches....
Thank you very much for your impressions. I also hold the impression that Germans are very Buddhist workers, so to speak: When they work, they work. They do not play, they do not surf the internet, they do not drink coffee, but they work. Other nations, such as the French or the British, both countries where I used to work, seem to be less focused....
Interesting. thanks for sharing 😀
So called "banter" in the UK can also be a vehicle for sexism or racism. And the defence will be it was just a joke.
Right that's what I meant when I said if you don't understand the humour you will spend a lot of time being very confused, hurt and upset....
No jokes.
In modern companies the fast track to the exit.
In our IT we have a lot of female IT-managers, they do a fantastic job. I 've seen many overbearing and arrogant males cleaning up their desk. So it's no good idea to beliitle females in telefone conferences.
Banter should help people not get stressed and help with team communication. If anyone is offended, they need to make themselves heard. And if someone is making sexist or racist comments disguised as banter, then everyone needs to put a stop to that right away.
@@britingermanythe humor is the excuse. It's not truly funny.
Dear Brits, is this true in metoo times? Is behaviour and judgment different between gender? Maybe you can state, where you did not take it as funny, hold grudges?
This was great! Also, I hope you enjoy being in Bamberg, one of the few very medieval-feeling towns in Germany.
Yes I loved Bamberg. Gorgeous town 😀
Bämbörg! - 😂
I'm a middle aged German working in a country that also really doesn't value our direct approach to communication. I tried to hold back my Germanness for a couple of years but that got increasingly energy consuming. Now I just try to keep the contact to locals to a minimum 'cause I'd rather be alone than fake my personality.
I'm sorry to hear that. have you thought about moving somewhere that's more conducive to your personality?
The thing is also - something I have just found out very recently - that, if you work and you have such a sick note in Germany, you are no longer protected by the insurance if something happens to you. So, maybe, the people are also afraid that something bad might happen and then, they have no more insurance protection.
Yes exactly. That's why you need to tell the doctor if you have an importance project and need to get back by a certain time so that he doesn't write you off sick for the whole week
Good morning!
Yes, unfortunately. This direct approach to express criticism now often goes through the bosses. The employees shift disagreements three management levels up and half-truths and rumors often come back from there.
This avoids direct differences of opinion, but the workload with trivialities is shifted upwards.
Yes I can agree with that
@@britingermany And then it gets so messy. I hate that lack of direct communication exactly because half-truths and rumours will arrive at my boss and then you suddenly have to deal with a “situation” that could easily have been avoided by talking from face to face. But in my experience only cowards do that. Decent colleages will talk to you in person, yes, they will tell you that you did this or that wrong but at least I can then answer directly, clear things up or change things on the spot by asking for their experiences or advice. And more often than not, they won’t phrase it in a harsh way but say “I noticed sth the other day. Usually this isn’t done like that here. Maybe you could do it this way instead…”
I once had an extremely difficult experience when I had only just started a new job and one other new colleague tried to actually make me look bad and went to complain about me to my boss. The thing was that she was constantly talking BS about other female colleagues (the pretty ones) and unfortunately she lived close to me and we took it in turns to drive to work in order to save fuel. So every morning I would have to listen to her talking about people she even didn’t know yet and I didn’t know how to stop her without being direct. But at some point I told her that I was wondering what she said about me to others when I wasn’t present since she was talking about others when they weren’t present. That’s where hell broke loose.
She set off the whole frightening procedure of 1. my boss blaming me for bullying 😮2. a report about my supposed behaviour in my personal file right before the decision whether I was given a permanent contract or not. Additionally she insisted on her staying anonymous.
I turned to the second boss and he advised me to just drop it and ignore it because “Mr…(our first boss) can’t deal with being contradicted.”
I contacted HR and they chickened out because my colleague had gone to the second boss first (she was friends with him) and he was a bully and everybody was afraid of his actions. I learned that only later.
I insisted on a meeting, though, because I hadn’t bullied anybody.
During that meeting the second boss was literally speechless because he just had believed that colleague but she apparently had just called me a bully without proof and he had taken that to the first boss and the first boss had then accused me of bullying trusting that there must be reason enough because he had been contacted. In the end my first boss (and I still respect him for it) apologized openly to me during that meeting because the meeting became more and more ridiculous. There were no examples for my alleged bullying, and the second boss, for lack of proof, turned to the manager who was responsible for new colleagues and schedules and that one then blamed me for having been sick for a longer time and suggested it as a reason not to keep me - just to get rid of the issue without having solved it.
That was so unfair that my first boss stopped the meeting then and there and apologized to me. Unfortunately he retired a few years later.
As a Brit in the UK, your comments regarding 'banter' in the workplace does still exist but maybe not to the degree it used to, again depending on which industry.
Having watched a German dashcam footage channel for the last couple of years your comments on righteousnous in the workplace suddenly makes sense in relation to driving styles - a lot of the footage shown gives the impression of people always in a rush, angry, not wanting to be polite because they believe it is their right of way and nothing can slow them down at all :)
I say that with a smile as it's sometimes difficult to stay calm in the UK with the way society is becoming very 'me me me!' orientated (likely due to the pandemic and the suddent focus on one's self), and so watching other cultures driving I'm going 'stay calm, there's no need to be so explosive when a little thing happens'. It's interesting! Would you say there's a similar sense of self in Germany - or anywhere else - since the pandemic too?
Hey thanks for updating me. I think the reason Germans often get so irate and indignant is when they think people are not following the rules or doing things in the right way, because the collective/community generally trumps the individual. There is more focus on the bigger picture and what impact and individuals actions have on society as a whole.
I think we have changed. There was a great sense of cohesion at the beginning of 2020, but then it went the other way. People wanted to be left alone with all these covid rules. But now it seems to be back to normal. The emphasis is on seem.
I think all of us, not only in Germany but in almost all countries, are much more afraid for our future than we used to be, and we react accordingly. The future is very uncertain. For a long time, all of us in the West thought that things were getting better with each passing year, that the curve was going up. And now that beautiful illusion has been shattered.
I think brittingermany pretty much summed it up how it's here in Germany: "The collective/community usually trumps the individual".So there are enough people who believe that "together we can do it". But I think nerves are more strained than they used to be and everyone reacts according to their own temperament and character.
Came here more for the comparison with the UK - interesting video, thanks!
Can confirm how out of sync German formality feels in an international workplace sometimes. At the last multinational I worked at, it wasn't uncommon to have email chains that switched from calling my boss by their first name in the english version (when looping in our US branch or whatever), to going right back to using their last name in the german version.
In every german law firm I worked at, the formality was clear: Lawyers among each other would use informal address, assistants among each other would do the same, but always formal language for the in between. I imagine it would feel a bit strange for non-germans sometimes.
British working enviroment sounds more fun for sure. Shame that I only did like catering jobs when I was back there. Wish I would have worked in a British office job as well. Well, working for an Irish company at the moment, but it's for the German-speaking market.
I could imagine that an Irish office would be full of banter 😉
Excellent thumbnail. So good that I got distracted from following the video.
Oh! 🤣🤣I’m not sure that’s what I was going for
Germans really are somewhat obsessed with the idea of "the right way and the wrong way" of doing things. It can be quite problematic in some cases - I'm a linguist currently in the unfortunate situation of looking for a translation job. Because of this, I regularly have to perform language tests to show that I know what I'm doing, I've done about 20 of those tests by now. Sometimes I get to see the results afterwards. Last time, I had dozens of mistakes in a short text that was meant to be naturally sounding narrative, and I saw that they had marked any noun without an article as wrong, as well as any many valid translations I had used to make the text less monotone. I studied German and English and have a PhD in German. Nevertheless, I fail the tests regularly because they use a binary right/wrong template for evaluation that punishes variability.
Yes that kind of thing can be pretty frustrating. I can see how it's effective in some fields but in the majority it#s probably more of a hindrance
How they interpret your abilities is a different story, but evaluating your language tasks or test just can be be done by right or wrong. It is in the name Rechtschreibung or orthography.
@@henningbartels6245 Sure, if you focus on the parts that can be flagged right/wrong. That's not a very complex level of language, and doesn't even touch natural language.
@@Wonzling0815 well, a "translating job" sound rather like a precise work to me - whether it is a product manual, a firm presentation, a website, work documentions or specifications or interrogation at the police ... this should be done correctly ... how such a job is badly done everybody knows from weird manual coming with elelectronics made in China or Taiwan.
After all a translator is not an interpreter.
@@henningbartels6245 The examples you give are rather reductive considering the range of types of text that need to be translated. And if I look at a typical website, I usually see at least three different classes of text making up the whole. HTML tags, menu items and descriptive texts for example all offer different degrees of leeway. If someone wants a stylistically specific translation, they need to state explicitly what the rules are. Beyond "Rechtschreibung" of course, because that one is a given for professionals.
The rules could be seen as very draconian and a way of pressuring you into doing things as fast as possible, especially if you bump into them. But for me as a german I've seen it many times and I might have also done it myself, that the rules are used as an excuse to get away with things. "Never do a rollout on Friday" can be seen as a draconian rule to stifle your creativity and autonomy or as an excuse to to some slow passed work, on the last day of the work week you'd normaly don't get around to do and start your weekend without being stressed until you finally clock out. :)
I can only speak for my company. There, formalities (dress code, the formal "Sie", fixed working hours, on place work were largely abolished.
They are open to recruit (and look out for ) female managers, look for "nerds", and are LGBTQ+ friendly.
What has been sharpened are social and communicative skills, the ability to take criticism, suitability as a team player, and support other team members to be successful.
This is checked very carefully.
Do you need a job in Frankfurt? ;)
Well I am always open for new opportunities but not actively looking for a new job😉
I am not sure how strict this is seen in other countries but if you have clear working hours, punctuality is of a very high importance in Germany. Not being punctual on the job, not with a quarter more or something, but be precisely on time, might even cost you the job if it happens several times. I always was punctual in the other countries, being punctual is a second nature to Germans, but I am not sure wether this is such a big problem in other countries. I heard some German employers say that some nations do have problems with that very strict concept.
I value punctuality very highly and to be honest haven't many many people (German or not) who are s punctual as I am...🤷♂️...maybe I was born to live here 🤣
As always very interesting video. I never knew about this blaming culture in the German workplace as something so widespread. I thought it is just healthcare where I work. When something happens, first thing to do is to find out Wer war das!?🙂 I also see a very strong hierarchic structure in medicine hier. The senior is always right and you are not supposed to challenge his decisions. If your boss wants a procedure to be done in one particular way, then it´s going to be done like that. And there is not that much place for discussion or alternative approaches. Probably outside the Hospitals in private practice there are more freedom. Have a great working week😀
Hey thanks for sharing. I have a few friends in healthcare and from what I’ve heard it can be really full on. Might be a little more extreme than other private sector industries but as far as I know, at least for doctors and dentists and that kind of thing you can earn a lot of money
@@britingermany That’s true for sure😊You can’t get rich working in hospital only praxis
Hmm, better companies have a "Fehlerkultur" a cultur to handle mistakes and questions like "Who was it?" Are the least interesting.
Even your Senior chief will listen to your suggestions, if your work style is appreciated. Never underestimate your senior chief. He looks very careful what kind of coworker you are. Mostly after two weeks he knows the limitations of your personal development.
@@Kartoffelsuppe_m_Wursteinlage "Hmm, better companies have a "Fehlerkultur" a cultur to handle mistakes and questions like "Who was it?" Are the least interesting." Most hospitals do not have that. Some larger ones started to establish that at - well, I think, 10, maybe 15 years ago, and from that I heard, it's still not working properly - als @Lea-kk9zb wrote, too.
Most gudie books for doctors emphasise how important such a thing is if you start working in a practice - however, I think in many of them it is more of a theoretical thing, too... it's difficult to change the customs of a whole field of work, I guess.
i can not agree with the sentence regarding the blame game, because it is the opposite for me (working in an international corporation based in germany) its gotten way worse with UK Management.
But that can also be just a communication error because the german in me takes it too serious.
I guess in general you could be right - germans tend to plan a lot and take that serious (right way vs. wrong way) while other cultures are way more open to "try and error".
I dont wanna say one is better than the other - but if you like to plan and something goes wrong it has another weight than if you are just testing if it could work.
Good, solid advice, as always...I worked in Germany as a student in the 70s. Coming from strike-torn England, Germany was a positive place to work. They had a good work ethic but knew how to enjoy themselves after work. Very refreshing !
God help you if you made a mistake, though.
Also, they were not very good with back-up plans. If something went wrong they were lost.
How could their 'perfect' plan not work ?
The English tended not to have firm plans as these were almost certain to go wrong anyway so they were better equipped when everything went belly-up. The Germans often became somewhat hysterical in such circumstances. Screaming and shouting. They took things too seriously.
They tended to view the English with bemusement as we didn't do things the 'German' way i.e. the right way.
' How could they have won ?' My experience of Germans abroad is that they still tend to think that 'the German way' predominates. This ranges from poolside towels to bringing dogs into museums.
Quite disturbing when you think of their history. They should adopt a slightly more humble tone.
My German friends told me that if people shout at you, then you should just shout back.
Something alien to us Brits...
They make good friends, though...
Sounds a little like prejudices and stereotypes. But it was the 70s according to your post. Nowadays it is much more different.
Prejudices and stereotypes often have a grain of truth in them, unfortunately.
As for the towel placing: I remember leaving my sun mattress for a few moments on the beach in Mauritius to find a topless German woman had plonked herself down there, even though the mattress was obviously taken.
Why oh why must elderly German women sunbathe topless on public beaches, especially in Mauritius ?
Reminded me of two fried eggs run over by a bus.
When I confronted her, I was told that I had not placed my towel completely over the mattress and 'the German way' applied.
She had been there for 'zree veeks' and did not intend to move.
I replied in Churchillian tones. ' Madam, WE have been here for two hundred years' ( Mauritius was a former colony) Get off my mattress !
She moved.....
@@jurgenmuller143
A very credible report; many memories come up while reading ...😜☺👍
@@edwarddavies8411had a little smile, because brits aren't different. Being to gran Canaria in a hotel with predominantly british people, they even stand up at 6 in the morning just to place their towel and went back to bed. And 10am they where all around the pool, didn't want to explore the surrounding and where already drinking all kinds of alcoholic drinks. So I guess, we all focus on others but it's hard to reflect on ourselves. 😊
I agree the Brits are no angels abroad. I just wanted to point out how I've experienced GERMAN behaviour.
Btw do the Brits actually 'stand up' or 'get up' in the morning.
Room for a great deal of misunderstanding here...@@jennyfinck7779
I do usually like the formality in German workplaces and as somebody who grew up in Germany I have nothing against a certain hierarchy structure in companies however employees should be treated fairly and with respect.
I had a different experience as a trainee in the company I currently work in. Basically my boss is also my instructor but couldn’t care less about my apprenticeship. She doesn’t teach me anything but then gets mad at me if I don’t know about certain things that she never showed me in the first place which is really frustrating.
So we’re a team of 7 people weirdly enough everybody is on first name basis with her but I (even though I’ve been in the company for the longest time) still need to call her „Sie“ and last name and get called mrs …. by her. I wouldn’t mind if everybody was addressed formally but if it’s only you it makes you feel left out and not part of the team. Also the fact that as a trainee in Germany you basically get treated like a second class citizen by your boss no matter what you do or how important you are to the company (doing the work of every normal employee) just because you’re young and don’t have professional work experience. I’ve also noticed that my colleagues are not able to give their opinion on certain projects bc they fear they will be seen as less if the boss doesn’t like the idea and even if a suggestion is valid your boss will not take it into account and will do it her way anyway, don’t get me started about how mad the boss gets when a mistake is found and someone needs to be blamed (like you said). Work could be so much fun in an harmonious environment but sadly a lot of German Managers in high positions are stuck in the 20th century. I‘m not surprised that German companies have problems finding new trainees these days.
I live in Denmark, and the Danish culture is also very direct but very informal. We don't use honorifics and we always use peoples' first names. The hierarchical structure in companies tends to be pretty flat as well. I'm pretty pleased with this type structure in work. :)
Sounds very good to me and as effective! Maybe we Germans follow one day... :-)) lucky you!
Sounds great 😀
The Dutch way is pretty much the same as the Danish way, more informal, less hierarchical and just like the German time management. When I worked in Germany (at a construction company) on three projects, I couldn’t get used to the fact that the architect is the only one, I really mean the only one, who decides. Any suggestions for change or better solutions from the project manager of the construction company was put aside by the architect, at least it was 20 years ago. In The Netherlands the owner/developer, the architect, the construction engineer and the construction company are more in cooperation, at least that’s my perspective. There is also a hierarchy, but it is more to the background and will only come in action when a joint decision can’t be found.
@@RealConstructor Yeah, my ex, who speaks German and has worked in Germany in the past, said that the German “command structure” in companies is usually very top-heavy. That the people doing the work have no say in what should be done, and often are discouraged from asking questions about why they are doing it in this way, and not that way.
and theres my *wort zum sonntag * ;)
🤣🤣happy Sunday
The conclusion I have come to locally in the UK is if you want the best culture of all to work in, it is found in our local cathedral. Those Christian laws, like do not judge and love your neighbour are practised in that place. I don't often get impressed with work environments in the UK, but you meet the staff of the cathedral and they are very intelligent, and very warm and friendly, like they treat you like family. Maybe these corporations need to be inspired by that. Sarcasm in the workplace is very tedious. A genuinely friendly atmosphere is also good as it rubs off onto the customer.
Interesting. I would never have thought of working in a cathedral other than maybe if it’s a well known one that offers tours.
The downside on the German job market is that I wasn't given a CONCRETE reason why the companies rejected me.
The good thing is that the job center supports me (in my mid-50s) and finances my further training.
I would assume that you never get a concrete reason for a rejection other than they’ve decided to go with someone else. But yes Germany is pretty generous when it comes to support 👍🏻
German here. I heard it often has something to do with Rechtssicherheit, as big companies are being dragged into anti discrimination lawsuits easily, if their reasons for rejections don’t add up legally.
I haven't worked in Germany but I did work in Australia for 2 years. I'm from England. When you mentioned Germans being direct when communicating and telling you that you are wrong it reminded me of my experience in Australia. The Aussies can be very blunt and lose their temper very fast! They are homest. Going back to work in the UK after working in Aus seemed quite frustrating to me as colleagues and bosses were not as direct. It seemed liked a guessing game to find out what someone is trying to say. I think knowing where you stand is much better and makes you more productive. It creates less stress in the long term
Eine besondere "Firma "ist die Bundeswehr, bei der tatsächlich Improvisation gefragt ist
2:45 main difference I find is that in the UK if things go south you don't look for WHO did that but WHAT went wrong. There is a very strong dissociation between the action, person and blame. Usual culprit of all the screwups is lacking guidelines, trainings, procedures, pipelines, but not people. People are never to be blamed. This creates workspace safety.
I would agree that it doesn’t help to ask that question unless of course if the same person is repeatedly making the same mistakes
Hey, I think one reason why we give a "harsh" (from German perspective pretty normal) hard "NO" and gainsay as a response of a statement we strongly disagree is because we love to discuss.
I think it is a stereotype that is actually somewhat true, I myself got more exposed to this side of me while living in Japan right now for around half a year only but still.
We love to discuss, because other perspectives can be a useful source of information but in order to get more information out of the person we either strongly disagree (discussion under friends) or most likely in context of workplace it could be that if discussions would course us to lose time, we want to shut down any opposition as quickly as possible to focus on the task as hand.
These are only my German perspective and of course a simplified presentation of my opinion on this topic.
5:45 my chief always said during apprenticeship: mistakes are done by all humans, but the same mistake done more often than two times is a sign of stupidness.
Sounds a bit unforgiving 😉
@@britingermany No, first it says, you can do mistakes 2 times, that should be enough to learn how it's not done.
And it says, if you do it more often, you are considered stupid. It only damages your reputation, you are not fired or punished or things like this.
It may also a sign that that things are organised the way that make persons commit mistakes more easily.
@@britingermany to answer with another sentence of him: "Unter Druck entstehen Diamanten."(diamonds are formed under pressure) XD
I'm surprised you say wages are higher than UK. I made the exact opposite experience.
Germany has suffered wage stagnation pretty much since the reunification. It's become almost a cultural thing. Only saving grace is living cost are low too
Maybe it depends on the field that you work in. 50-60K a year is considered a high salary in the U.K…
i saw a Reaction video from a other you-tuber about u , idioms and stuff like that..."Fisch sucht Fahrrad"."Fish searching Bike", like personal advertisement in the newspaper; "it doesn´t fits at all" ... when u look at a Friend/someone u know introdusing the new Partner and u know these keeps a month top,despretly.
or: "die Radischen von unten ansehen" /Look at the radishes from below u r doomed to death/or already done.
"Jeden Pfennig zweimal umdrehen" flip every coin despretly twice around to see if someting MORE is on the otherside and see "there" is nothing else
i hope u like Germany and fined your way , cya
Oh interesting. Which channel was that?
I always worked in IT. Which is a very liberal and liberating work place even in Germany.
Traditional German work culture would break me I think. Even though I'm very German.
I recall a documentary about when BMW bought Mini. The fly on wall documentary followed a group of Brits to Germany where they worked in various trainee/team building activities. In two teams UK v Germany they had to produce some kind of go-kart. It was amusing to consider how the Germans took it all seriously compared to the Brits who were making a big joke out of the entire exersise and treating it as a jolly. Funny enough, BMW sold Mini....
What about office politics? More of a UK or a German thing? Was massive at my last London employer.
Difficult to say really, as it depends a lot on your colleagues. So far that's been pretty big in Germany in my experience
@@britingermany interesting. In my current German job there seems to be none, but also only a small team. Always a waste of time of course, wherever you are.
Did the ends justify the means?
How about this sensitive issue: can you have a drink or two, or a glass of wine or two, or bottle of strong beer on your lunch break, in both GB and in Germany?
In Finland and Sweden this would not seen as positive, but people might not openly criticise a work-mate, not as far as I know, but in Denmark maybe a bit different? - In Norway I guess nobody does it because it is so expensive - right or wrong? And in the Netherlands and other countries? Is there a correlation between efficiency culture and use of alcoholic bewerages during the work day?
Unless you are working freelance, alcohol in the workplace is either not appreciated our outright not allowed in most German companies. (Depending on the line of work.)
Of course there are alcoholics who do drink during worktime, but I never heard of anyone doing it openly.
@@marge2548 Good! The right norms! 🙂 It is a few years ago, but when in London - we saw with our own eyes, sitting beside them, the workers in City in their smart clothes, gathered for lunch drinks in the pubs - I was chocked. I'm sure it is shocking for some that Finnish adults drink (fatfree) milk at their lunch breaks. Other alcoholfree bewerages are becoming ever more popular, though. Similar in Sweden.
It would say it is also usual in the U.K. …maybe if you an investment banker in London….I think everyone understands this is not great for getting things done at work….having said that at my previous job we often were expected to drink with clients especially in the afternoon/evening
@@britingermany But that would more or less after work, once the informal part started, right?
And mayhap at a „Geschäftsessen“/ „business-related dinner invitation“ in the evening of sorts, read: in some restaurant or with catering involved, not literally „at the workplace“ or during lunchbreaks
I had forgotten to take these into account. There, alcohol might be in the play, that‘s true.
But depending from the field of work, there are more or less of these occasions.
My father used to have quite a few in the 1970ies, working in the military industries.
My husband works in IT and there, at least with his employers, it‘s rather unusual.
@@britingermany Well, they sure looked like they were in the finance sector - 🙂 I'm really venting prejudice, am I not?!! Hope it is not expected now, that you treat clients to drinks. I think you look so handsome and healthy, and your job should not spoil that for you, but all the best in every aspect of life!
7:00 I think this is just a cultural difference that you see too much into it. I don't know how it works exactly in German, but in my native tongue (Lithuanian) we too have two different ways to address someone. It doesn't really mean that one is friendlier, it just means that one is more formal and one is less formal. And the more formal one as well shows more respect, but that doesn't mean that the other one is disrespectful in itself, although it can be used disrespectfully. It's just how languages are, but of course culture and language are very very related/similar.
Thing is in my country a lot of bosses are asking to address them using the informal one, which to me just feels so not right and difficult to do. It all depends on the person.
I just remembered that English actually has it too, but it's considered obsolete now in a sense: thee and you. So English has chosen to constantly use the more respectful one to address everyone, which in theory makes everything more formal, but it seems to work just fine.
Sounds like you stayed working in Germany due to sick leave and holiday benefits :). I was preparing for my move to Germany with my pet, including plane ticket and cat`s docs and just had to give up two days before the journey from another continent, due to blame game played by my friend who`s lived and worked there for long and should have helped me at the beginning of my integration. I would have to stay with her in one bedroom apartment for who knows how long until I get the job and am able rent my own apartment, being exposed to that all the time. A piece of mind is very important to me. I hold Master`s in Education, Pedagogy, paperwork published in NYC and national rewards. My German is level A2 towards B1, but that`s not active knowledge. I probably need a few months in German speaking environment to overcome that gap. Do you have any specific piece of advice where to start when it comes to moving there by myself? Thank you
Yeah sounds like you made the right decision breaking that off. If you have some savings then the best thing would be an air b and b of some kind of furnished apartment for the first 1 to 3 months. In that time you can look for your own apartment go to a German intensive course and maybe just get a service job until your German is good enough for your preferred field. In my experience it takes 1 to 2 years to get settled and start to feel comfortable. I wouldn’t make the move without savings or some form of financial support - that would be a lot of stress
@@britingermany Yes, I thought so. The trouble is how to find an apartment to rent when in Germany it takes to have at least three last salaries listed there to be able to rent it.
From my experience, The majority of Brits spend a vast amount of time just standing about talking about non-work issues and ignoring their responsibilities/customers. Nearly all other nations I have worked with seem to believe that they are paid to work, not to chat and thus get on with the job. Therefore the Brits are less efficient. The British work culture uses a lot of adaptability and ideas to solve problems, and many other cultures seem to just follow rules, even if they don't solve the problem. Most British businesses work on sealing wax and string to hold everything together. Other countries invest in getting the right kit for the job and keeping it up to date. You are right to differentiate between private and public workers. The latter appears the same in all countries, and the model seems to be, that this is something I do between 9-5 and I am not interested in any efficiency measures and actually solving problems for customers as I will keep my job however badly I perform. Harsh, but mainly true. Great, interesting video with carefully crafted messages.
Interesting take. I think some would argue that the standing around and chatting about things not related to work is where the magic happens and how great ideas are generated 😉. But I found it quite frustrating. I guess its best to have a job that is permeance based in the UK rather than enumerated in relation to the time you put in
Curious to know how the equivalent of the word "sissy" in German is perceived. Bit of a slur in English.
Nix für Weicheier….probably comes close to it….and that‘s just a Thursday afternoon, everyday language…Germans haven‘t yet developed into total snowflakes
@@lynnm6413was jetzt?
As someone on the autistic spectrum from the UK. I wonder if Germans on the AS find it easier to understand and be understood in Germany.
I’m not sure about that but you are not the first to ask about autism in Germany.
@@britingermany I saw a comment under a channel similar to yours, which said that "Germany is a bit of an autistic country". The commenter was also German.
I thought about the emphasis on rules, toeing the line and timekeeping, which are behaviours that I and other high functioning autistic people have and it made a lot of sense to me.
I also remember that the condition "Asperger Syndrome" was named after an Austrian doctor. It's not used now and he is totally discredited, but he was Teutonic.
I am not German,, but Dutch, and I do not have AS, but I also often do not understand wether my bBritish colleagues mean I agree or I disagree. Dutch colleagues never an issue.
@@lidewijvandenbrink5223 Actually, a lot of English people have a similar difficulty.
When I was sick and couldn't work I loved talking about my diarrhea with my boss. Out of compassion. - 🤭 - Just kidding. - "Should I send you a sample?"
I'm curious whether younger people in Germany now have the tendency to address everyone in the familiar form. I'm in France, but occasionally order things from a German company and actually find it shocking that the emails from the company written to me in French, always address me as "tu." My native language is English, but I have lived in France long enough that it really felt "off." Hey, I don't know you, so what's up?! Businesses in France, in my experience, don't do this and certainly in the countryside, where I live, people are addressed in the formal form sometimes for years before possibly switching over if you become really good friends.
Yes I would say generally people in their 20’s use the formal Sie a lot less today than they did 10 years ago.
Yes, you'll find the formal version indeed a lot less today. We'll usually offer it immediately at the first personal meeting, or tell the other one, that we prefer the informal way to adress each other, followed up by asking them if they agree. First interactions by email or phone call are usually still dealt the formal way at first, until we meet each other in person or have just so many calls, online meetings or write so many emails with each other, that it does make sense to ask early.
But you still have to be somewhat careful. There are still German people out there - even younger ones (which surprised me) - who really love to do it "old-school" and who get really pissed, if you screw up and use the informal version without asking first. Even met people, who insited that the older person has to offer this to the younger one, and not the other way around. I didn't even know that this rule existed... And I am German and grew up with the formal way.
Still, I think anyone dealing with French businesses on a professional level should stick to the ‚Vous‘…
I can still remember being thoroughly off-put by all the flowery French formalities which are even worse than English with it‘s nuanced digs and slights.
I‘m 42, tho, so I also can‘t speak for GenZ
@Sarah, could the "tu" be a grammar mistake?
If you are in a business situation in Germany and you don't know the person - it should be still the formal "Sie". If it is more a colleague situation or you already have worked in projects together in sort of team (despite being from different companies) applying the informal "Du" is getting more and more common.
It also depends on the business branch: in some "hip" webdesign business informalities could be find more often. It also depends on the region: Berlin is infamously known for using an informal "wir" (we) but meaning you.
In my northern region it is often an informal plural "ihr /euch", which avoids the personal informal "du" but shows more informality than "Sie/Ihnen".
@@henningbartels6245 I don't think so. Just pulling from my email box I have such titles as: “Ta facture est disponible”
“Ton colis est en route”
“Nous avons expédié ta commande”
Another interesting and revealing example I just found is when one of the things I ordered was no longer available. This time, the email came in German: “Wenn du zur kommenden Woche noch ein anderes Produkt stattdessen erhalten möchtest, lass es uns gern wissen”
Hmmm. 🤔
Okay, I'm an old lady, but I'm also a retired linguistics professor and so pretty much open to any and all language variation. I surprised myself with my strong reaction to the use of "tutoiement" and "das Duzen" by some unknown business person! 🤣
Is this a podcast that is filmed, or just a UA-cam video ? The disconnect between the sound and the visual is weird. Sitting a room, your voice wouldn't naturally sound like that. I'll listen, but I can't watch at the same time. If it's just a video, why would you make your voice sound like that ? Not trolling, just curious.
Yes I'm still struggling with audio, the room was very echo(y) and I tried to get that out as much as possible. I've tried something different for upcoming videos and so it should be more natural
Lapelle mike?
Look at the chem-trails at 8.54-9.04!!!!
It's very interesting to hear that for Brits, Germans seem more rude. Because for me, as a Ukrainian, who works in Germany for more than 10 years, my German colleagues seem much more polite than what I experienced back in Ukraine. And yeah, Brits are even more polite than Germans, sometimes even too polite :D
I work in an international team with people from all over Europe and some outside. If you exclude south east asia, it's really the Anglosaxon countries that like to beat around the bush and wrap people in cotton wool. As a German, I'm glad that most other Europeans are more direct 😅
That Thumbnail is so hot! 😜🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
🤣🤣really?! Well thank you👍🏻
As a German, being surrounded by unprofessional people at work who constantly joke and are sarcastic and all that sounds like hell. I'm glad where I work is relaxed, but professionalism is still held as a key factor.
"Germans are more efficient and focused, even though they take more holidays/sick days etc." This is actually something I find funny yet sad to hear so often. No, it is not *even though* it is *because* of that. Mentally well people are more productive than people who spend all that time working. Also, it is a typical opinion among German workers that we don't have enough holidays because even though the calendar might say there are a lot of them, most of them don't count in more than a handful federal states (or are actually Austrian/Swiss), and even then many more don't actually let you enjoy a day or two off.
I am interested to know what is your job speciality?
I work in retail/sales
Thanks@@britingermany
If you get single one day: move to The Netherlands ... 🙂♥
Haha. I’ll bear it on mind😉
I would find the "du" versus "Sie" thing very difficult - very awkard!
Wow, I see not much has changed with German work culture since the 80s. Back then, I worked with a number of Germans, both from the GDR and from West Germany, here in the US and "righteous indignation" is absolutely right. They would get upset at what other people did or didn't do that didn't really concern them, nor was it very important. They would also get incensed with my classic American response of "I don't care". I began to say it just to watch their faces because it really was funny.
They were a source of constant infighting in the dept and were very disliked by just about everyone in the entire building. They seemed unable to understand the nuances of English and were surprised when someone took serious offense at the direct accusation and aggressively confronted them. No matter how many times I told them that "snitches get stitches" in the US, they just didn't get it.
Sounds like a bit of a drag
Hello from New Zealand.
I wish I could say that it sounds like a bit of a drag. But I can't.
I have thought very long and very hard about many aspects of the German culture.
I guess I always wonder how much remains the same since the '30's and '40's.
A few decades ago, 2 older German women yelled out "Dirty Jew" to a Jewish man in a family restaurant near where I live.
A few years ago a German man yelled at my daughter who was riding her bike on a track for riding "on the wrong side", whatever that meant, in this river city in my country of freedom.
I don't actually really know any German people myself, which is strange because I have easily gathered friends from France, the Netherlands, England, Scotland, India, Australia, Russia, Georgia, South Africa, lots of Pacific Islands, the Fillipines, Japan, China, Taiwan, South America, Italy, and very many other countries.
The German people I have seen on buses usually have their heads down, are busy doing things, whispering briefly to eachother, and looking very serious. They are never smiling or interested in other people. Only once have I ever talked to a German on a bus. He was great.
Here in New Zealand, people are mostly very friendly and laidback. Smalltalk is extremely common. I think everyone knows that smiling and connecting with others is very pleasant and gives people a lift.
It is intriguing for me to find a culture where people so strongly support the ways of theirs that we jn New Zealand find so unfriendly and, often, inhumane.
"Smalltalk", which is such a vital part of many rich experiences I have had in my life is seen extremely negatively by many German people.
Kiwis like to smile, be friendly and be helpful- to anyone. "Smalltalk", sounds so shallow and fake, especially thanks to Germans, that I call it a chat or better still a korero. That is because Maori interacting is foundationally done with goodwill and good vibes. Thats not fake, it is tikanga, the culture.
I am not really surprised that Germans complain a lot and also don't come across as very friendly or joyful.
A casual chat may or may not be be very brief, and it may not be about, or lead to huge depth. But for me, the fact that these come from a stranger who does not even need to share their warmth, character or kindness. It is special, as it gives us a new experience, a new slice of human experience. The result of a kind word can be exponential.
From my point of view, there is nothing shallow or fake about these interactions whatsoever.
Chats on buses etc have lead to many travellers staying at our house for a night or more.
Many brief chats and the over night stays have been very memorable.
In fact, I recall a young Japanese man staying with us.
He was such a beautiful person that he helped to overturn a prejudice I had held about the Japanese.
Similarly, a Nigerian taught me that in some cultures people are far more pushy. The country can be heavily populated and competetive.
A homeless Maori lady and her little boy stayed with us also a while back. I will never forget her either because of the beautiful gift she had made for her son. All my thousands of possessions held less meaning than one book in her one suitcase that she had made for her little boy.
Along with friendliness and helpfulness, Kiwis like giving compliments. These are again seen as fake by Germans.
For me, the compliments are very far from fake. They are genuine, and given for the same reasons. They are at least to share good vibes. But they also let the person know that someone has noticed something special about them. I think these actions can help support mental health. You could be going through a rough time, and some good thoughts and feedback can be good for uplifting a person's spirit.
In NZ and Oz, blokes always called eachother "mate". Our isolation, war time cameraderie, and for us the ANZAC spirit lives on. In NZ now, many people call guys "Bro", or "Brother", as I sometimes do here. This comes from the Maori concept of family, or now it can be the group you belong to.
Our last prime minister, Jacinda, inspired our "team of five million" during covid with this team concept.
I will always appreciate the friendly Peoples of the world. The Americans, Brits, Indian, Fillipino, Scottish, Irish, Pacific and all other peoples in NZ add so much more here. Americans and Brits are always friendly and give more aliveness as well as others who have settled here.
I have decided not to advocate aroha and friendliness to Germans any more but to accept that they hold on tightly to their ways. Also their history has made them that way. Their focus on timekeeping means they have only enough time for small groups of people. Also their focus on efficiency, which feels traumatising for me in so many ways, is however something they cherish and they don't think it helps cause them to behave inhumanely.
I sometimes think about how the Maori, Pacific and Aboriginal people must have found the British invaders, colonizers and the rest of us so greedy, rude, disconnected, abusive and destructive. It seems like a similar kind of barbarity, ignorance, selfishness and arrogance to the German inhumanity. I hope to find peace in myself mostly about human beings who killed millions in 2 world wars and the shoah. But also the arrogance of my people who destroyed majestic forests, destroyed much of a beautiful culture, and brought pest after pest after pest as well as my hardworking ancestors to these shores.
I appreciate your comment. The maliciousness that seeped out of Germans then, and even now is quite staggering but it is still hope to see past the self-focus and malice and see the good.
@@barbsmart7373 that's an awful involved and at times hypocritical way to state "I hate Germans". Apparently you don't even know any Germans, at least you stated as much. What if you're the problem?
@@mamfredvonclouseau8468 I don't hate Germans, mate.
I understood a while ago that Germans like brutal honesty. I have concluded that actually, they don't.
I could write A BIG BOOK about things that were done to my friends and relations by German people. It would not be appreciated at all. But many people are very proud of the brutal honesty they think theg like, so I write s few things here and there.
I have written very comprehensively. I have explained how different the German culture is from the Kiwi culture, and how shocking it is to find Germans yelling at us when they have been welcomed into this country. It is very different, and shocking.
There are a lot of things I like a lot about the German culture too which I will now mention.
I really like the recycling over there. I really like the way Germans ride bicycles, walk, and keep fit.
I like the way they are practical and wear practical clothes.
I like the way they like quality products.
I like how very honest Germans are. It actually touches my heart quite a lot.
I also understand that once German people make friends, they keep their friends forever, and the friendships are deep.
I see an advantage in spying on neighbours and checking that recycling is put on the street correctly.
I had a friend who stayed in Salzburg. A retarded German woman really did the dirty on him and he was stranded over there.
One day he found the landlady in the room he was renting with the authorities there. So the woman had gond to the authorities instead of findjng out how he might be helped.
That's a big difference between those kinds of people and us Kiwis. These modern day stories I can never ever forget.
I truly love the fact that German people have done what they can to face up to some of their past- that is around WW2. I understand that Japan has not done that. It is wonderful that has been done by Germans, and that laws exist in Germany to prevent any repeat of what happened after Hitler took control.
I appreciate very much the thoughtful, honest comments that Germans tend to write in comment sections.
I think it is wonderful that many immigrants have been accepted into Germany.
I like how natural a lot of Germans are.
I am genuinely sorry if some people there complain a lot or don't feel the kinds of joy other people feel by being friendly like Aussies & Kiwis.
I am also deeply, deply sorry fof the individual German soldiers that ended up in Soviet captivity. I can only imagine that the German soldiers believed nonsense they were fed.
I have read a book about things that happened there around the '30's. All the people written about in the book were killed, except one who had been a lawyer before having to join the army. His English wife managed to get him released from a concentration camp.
So a lot of the best German people were probably killed for acting with humanity. It is appallingly sad, and I am sorry.
I feel terribly sad for the Germans who were also sent into battle around 1918. For some reason they really believed Germany would win that war too.
Look, these are just my random thoughts.
I guess with so few Jewish people remaining in Germany, most Germans don't come face to face with people who live each day with trauma.
I don't hate Germans. All people are human. But parts of the German culture feel traumatising to me.
I think I indicated that my British people were
very greedy, entitled & arrogant also. So my own People have an appalling past.
The Jewish wisdom and Maori people have been the must wonderful teachers for me. But all cultures have great things about them.
@@barbsmart7373get help.
The Swiss are very much like the British in terms of indirectness. 😂
Really?! I would have thought they were even more direct that the Germans…especially the Swiss-Germans
@@britingermany Haha no, we‘re totally different in that regard. I can tell because I‘m a Swiss German myself and we‘re masters in beating around the bush. 😅
I can not completely agree with the taking responsibility/blame culture as you describe it. In the 40 years or so that I have been working (not including work while I was still a student), I have not come across this. In the 4 companies I have worked the culture has always been that if you made a mistake you go to your boss and let him know and together you would look for a solution, if there is one, and later analyze how this mistake came to be and see if there is a process that could be implemented to avoid this kind of mistake. But never have I felt judged, nobody shouted at me, nor where there any consequences that had a negative impact. I don't know if I just have been extremely lucky in this regard, that the company culture has always been like that, or maybe it is the field that I have been working in? I don't really know, but my personal experience is different from what you describe.
Some of the other things you mentioned I can partially relate to, not all and not completely. I am getting the impression it probably really is due to my field of work and the company culture. I have worked for more than 30 years for a very large international company and maybe that environment really was different from what you describe. I have never worked for a small company, so there really might be a difference.
What I really don't appreciate is the insinuation that doctors in Germany "like" to give out sick notices (as it sounds for no reason at all). That is quite a tall order. I've never encountered any such doctor. I cannot say it isn't so, as - of course - I know only my doctors, but it never happened to me that they would slap a sick notice on the desk willy-nilly for me to dance out of their office to enjoy a couple of days not working, just because I feel so.
But as always, very interesting to hear your take on work culture in Germany, from your own experience. I have only ever worked in Germany (majority), the US and Italy, and of course there are differences. I felt that in the US people did not work as hard as I was used to it in Germany, and in Italy there is a very different hierarchy system in place, where you are hardly left with any authority to make your own decisions, everything comes from top-down. Also most everything was more or less discussed over coffee and/or lunch instead of in the office working hours.That was a bit hard for me to adapt to, as I don't drink coffee and I usually brought my ow lunch, which means that - until I realized how things work - I was pretty much left out. Whereas in Germany I always had a lot more space to make decisions on my own and take responsibility. In the US I did not really have a job that involved decision making, so I cannot say how it would have been there.
My experience in Germany is that people try not to admit to their mistakes, generally, and do occasionally try to pass the buck. You have been pretty lucky if your boss treated you like that, but it might have been because you went to him first. Either way, that is a good thing to do. Highly commendable.
I have seen people shouted down in front of other colleagues, fairly and unfairly, quite often. I find that extremely unprofessional, and it can lead to a bad working environment. When I have made mistakes, I have usually been treated very fairly, though. I suppose it will depend on the boss.
I'm sorry, but I know so many people who get a sick note for trifling reasons. I have been to doctors many times, and they have usually asked me if I need a sick note. I have almost always refused. The last time, I took 4 days sick, but my doctor gave me two weeks. I know many Germans who always use the maximum number of sick days every year. They tell me that they are entitled to them. A very bad attitude, in my opinion.
@@dandare1001 "I have been to doctors many times, and they have usually asked me if I need a sick note." Now, I do not know the circumstances, but doctors are obliged to ask you that question as you as an employee are obliged to hand in the sick note to both your employee and your healthcare-provider within 3 days once you are sick and unable to work. I work freelance, so if it's nothing serious, I usually refrain from taking one, unless one of my clients insists on it. (However, I actually rather should, as if one is in madatory Healthcare, there is something about sick pay if a sickness lasts longer than six weeks, and for that, the initial sick note is important.)
2 weeks I find pretty extended - I take it that you were either more seriously ill than you were willing to admit to yourself at that time - or you were seeing a very lenient doctor. :)
"Taking the maximum number of sick days" I would consider a bad habit, too.
It's usually a sign of a bad workplace athmosphere if people do this.
Because Germans are direct about a lot of things, but might want to back out of others. What you describe is called "innerliche Kündigung" (internal quitting), with people maxing ther benefits and working the minimum, feeling justified by the fact that the company is a "bad employer".
But i think it used to be more frequent some years ago.
hmm, but the "who done it"-game has been brought to a new level by information technology from the US, not from Germany. I think it plays a role rather all over the western world of business, but in Germany it is more openly done.
German workplaces "are not for sissys"? But are they anywhere else? I do not think so.
In my experience that had nothing to do with technology.
Yeah you could be right with the last point
@@britingermany You did not get the point here. You tell us that in Germany it is always important to find the culprit and yes, I agree. But IT with its vast capabilities to blame the culprit is determined since decades by US-staff. Microsoft e.g. did not invent the spying capabilities of its "Teams"-Software for Germany, but for US-employers. In Germany we have to prune and limit this when this kind of software gets introduced here. This proves that the "get the thief"-culture is not unique to Germany.
my favorite response: Ich wars nicht. 😇🤡
Watch at at least x1.5 👍
Feel free...that's the beauty of UA-cam
Being garman didn't save Germany from bei g wrong on almost Everything political nowadays tho... Cheers
This is what I expected to hear. To cut it short, anyone who don't like to work then don't even consider to work in germany. Not saying there are no lazy people there, but when you compare to the UK...
See how many people take the piss out of everything, doing nothing but claiming benefits. Zero productivity. The amount of people who are not willing to improve/ learn.........
Well it does depend a little. There are those safe and secure jobs in Germany where you can’t really be fired and you can get by doing the bare minimum but on the whole you are expected to pull your weight
They're complainers and collectivists. I see many parallels with Scandinavians.
Really? I don’t have much experience in Scandinavia but haven’t heard many parallels drawn between before
Swedish people have their PR, how they want to be perceived by foreigners. In my experience, most conversations are complaints - even bickering at funerals - a Dutch friend was driven to distraction by customers complaining about every little thing: it was a damned red brick college cafeteria@@britingermany
Potty trained at gunpoint.
Yeah, Anglo-Saxon working culture sucks. We all know that, nothing new here.
Thanks for commenting…although🤔🤔I wonder if you watched the video..:
Germans will throw you under the bus without batting an eye😉
You don't good examples of what you are talking about. You talk in circles. In america we have a employees handbook that lays the rules of the workplace. Like a man touching a female body or calling her anything but her first or last name. You can use something like miss or mrs brown or her first name.
In america you have a supervisor and his responsibility to teach your job and how to perform it.
Again you give bad examples of the differents between england and germanys workplace. You said you made a mistake at your workplace in germany. What was that mistake. Give better examples.
In america if a person comes to work sick. We sent that person home. We don't want that person spreading a virus to the rest of us.
We also on a yearly schedule a employees meeting for everyone to attend. One meeting would cover the company's health plan and a other meeting. The company's 401K retirement plan.
A saw a person at a fast food restaurant in america . That was sick with a cold. A call the shift supervisor over and told that supervisor what I was seeing. The supervisor said sorry for misses it and we will send that person home and with full pay.
I sure their maybe a small amount of business in america. That don't follow this policy. I wouldn't want to want to work for that company or give them my business.
I work in a company that you could accumulate thirty days of sick days in a year.
I also would before taking the job. Telling my headhunter. That I wanted a thirty day vacation as part of my starting to work for that company.
I didn't understand what you wanted to achieve with your comment... He told generally what you need to understand when you would like to work in Germany.
American workplaces sending sick staff home? What? And the rest of your post: Eh?
@@sisuguillam5109 yes, this over 15 years ago. Companies finding sick employees spreading things like the flu to other workers. You disagree with companies doing that?.
@@Dueruemtarget He is giving double talk with little to no great details on the subject. What did he apologized for at his office?. He didn't go into any details on that. Did touch a women's body or did he use a four letter word?. He's just talking in circles.
@@orangeguy3314 Sry, but you misunderstood what he wanted to say.
It's not about violation of company rules but common understanding of work ethics. An example: Maybe you work as accountant and you post the wrong amount of an supplier invoice then you are expected to take responsibility for this mistake. The reason is clear because it could worsen the relation to the supplier if you repeat the same mistake several times. It also causes displeasure of your colleagues, since they would have to clear up your mistake.
At the end of the day he talked about handling common mistakes and not exceptional occurences like harassing women.