It is always good to learn trombone history especially about King. I played a 1485 at a store. It is an interesting horn. Being a tenor only player, I put it back on the wall. The horn that my Holy Grail Horn is the King 3B Silver Sonic model 1430S. It is such a beautiful horn. Great Video.
Such a great feeling to finally acquire a dream horn. I remember when I got my Lätzsch after years and played the first notes how happy I've been. Now waiting for the next dream horn 😉
Not boring at all, even for a trumpeters ... and genuine enthusiasm is always a nice thing to see 🙂. My vintage favourite instrument at the moment is a Conn B6 Trumpet (think Connstellation with less bling). Yet another unusual design that went out of favour with modern builders, but giving you a certain something that new off the shelf instruments do not often have.
I have a King Silversonic purchased new in 1964. No model designation on the bell, but, is, I believe, the equivalent of a 5B - .547 bore (not dual bore) and 9 inch bell. I have played it as my tenor trombone using a Schilke 52. Had it modified by Osmun Brass in Boston to take press fit lead pipes - have the original King and a Benge 190 leadpipe. The King lead pipe is shorter - like the George Roberts Kanstuhl bass trombone leadpipe compared to other Kanstuhl leadpipes - and has - to my ears - a more open sound. Hard to describe sound, but the sterling silver adds a "sparkle" to the sound. The sound is dark, but resonate. Yes the ergonomics are not good, but you get used to the hand position - only a little painful after a few hours of playing. I did add a counter weight.
I have my father's King Silversonic small bore bass - ordered in 1962, and delivered in 1963, and used when he played bass trombone w/ the Milwaukee Symphony (the other players in the section were playing .500 to .508 bore instruments). It is a wonderful instrument, great slide, and has a great throw to the sound. Mouthpiece match is the Bach 2G (which Bach designed for the Bach 45 small bore bass). The 1 1/2 G (designed for the 50B) is probably too big to be a good match for the horn - could be the cause of the intonation issues you noted. Also - are the springs in the slide still there? Many repairmen have yanked them out, and that is another intonation issue. This is the perfect horn for Beethoven, Brahms, Mendelssohn, etc. when doing the consort trombone section (alto, small tenor, small bass), or in the performance of Moravian trombone works. It is not the late 20th century bass trombone. I also have my father's King 3B Silversonic from 1956 - again used for orchestral playing in the 1950's and 60's. These horns play bigger than the bore size might indicate.
I had this EXACT type of horn a few years ago! It didn't have the gold wash bell, but still had the super heavy sterling silver bell. I used it throughout High School and made so many memories on it, even if my band director thought it was a piece of junk. Funny you mention trying a Yamaha 58, that's the type of mouthpiece I used on mine.
It somehow just clicked with me in that intro that you're the same burgerbob I see on forums all the time after I've been watching your videos for a while lol
I feel your Enthusiasm I love king Horns. Please do an update when you’ve made modifications. I’d like to see how you solved the trigger issue. That looks like a special trombone, enjoy.
Love this old horn! Only played on one once, back in the early 70s, and loved it. A kid from Big Piney, WY was using it in a district honor band. He wouldn't even consider selling it to me! Back in the day, I believed that this horn would have been the perfect horn for my all-around commercial playing (except lead), instead of using my King 6B with a Bach 4G mouthpiece. Never got to prove that, as I could never get my hands on one. However , why wouldn't you be able to use it in professional settings? Share your thoughts with me on why not.
I just have a hard time imagining a place I would use it. It's not a good tenor trombone, though it can do the role- I have two horns much better suited for it. And I have 6 or 7 basses at any given time that are easier to play and have two valves. So it's in that weird middle ground of small, single bass... at some point I may play in a downsized orchestra section and it will be great on 3rd.
I totally understand the linkage woes. I had a 1480 that I fixed up about 5 years ago to give as a Christmas gift to a tech friend whose son needed a step up. I had to do a bunch of work, but I was able to modify the trigger to reach a more comfy spot. That is a patch on your f slide for sure, and if there is a crack I’m sure Ben wouldn’t have any problem removing the patch and doing a silver solder fill and some burnishing to tidy that up a bit depending on what is underneath. It is possible that the slide was stuck and someone used excessive force to try to remove it, damaging it in the process. For mouthpieces I found that a Stork 1 1/4 was the winner for response for me! My Schilke 60 was way too big, a Bach 2g was too small, and I’ve never been a fan of 1 1/2’s. In the end, I went with a king 5b with a 7b rotor and a Conn 88HK bell for a small bass/ tenor because I liked the 5b ergos, spatula, string rotor, and the swooping lines of the trigger tubing. I partially wish that I had it back, but I’m very glad to know that a kid is playing through college right now. Plus I don’t need a small bass considering I have 3 big bois in the rotation at the moment
As someone who likes somewhat smaller versions of brass instruments I find this very interesting. My main instrument is a tuba with a 13" bell and I bet this would blend with it much better than it would with any modern bass.
I think this trombone was designed and engineered for marching due to light weight and for big band back then when music for bass wasn’t that low with double rotors. In the common wealth countries ,such as Canada ,Australia , Jamaica and so forth where mostly get are instruments from Great Britain then , 80 years ago we used G basses for marching and concert bands.the big bass trombone was mostly used in orchestra, such as Bach, and Conn. king was mostly for jazz and marching military bands
Not quite, the 1480 was designed decades before any double valve bass trombones. It was designed as simply a full size bass trombone of the time! Quite heavy for the time as well.
Congratulations Aiden! Super cool horn How does this compare to the King 5b? I know they have different bell metals and I’m pretty sure the 5b has a single bore slide. Curious if you’ve ever played one
5B is just a tenor with a bit larger throat bell- they're neat but even more strange in use than this horn, IMO. This was designed from the ground up to be a bass of the time, so it really has that bass character
@@AidanRitchie been looking for a “small bass” for playing TB3 parts on Verdi operas and when section sizes down with alto on lead. Been looking for Conn 70 or 72s, Bach 45s, King 5b, but they are proving tough to find.
@@WillBakerMusic I'd skip the 5B- it's not bass really at all, it's just a 4B. You could have a 45 made that could be pretty awesome, but it'll take time! There are definitely Conn 7XH out there, I think you'll find one of those first before any of the other horns show up.
Aidan you have ever played a Yamaha YBL-322 Trombone? I found one from Japan with a good slide less that $500.00. I want to own a large bore just to have and for no other reason. Of course I’d play it often.
@@AidanRitchie I love trombone and I especially love the sound of the bass trombone. I mostly play jazz ( intermediate player) ..it seems if I practiced on Base trombone I’d improve my playing ability on my other tenors. I play a .500 & .525… I am fascinated with the big sound, and I have decent wind and chop fundamentals. I just began tinkering with some Rochut etudes I though through ybl-322 might be a gas go experiment with. In fact, if there is an intermediate classical music book you’d recommend, please do . If I’m enjoying my experience with that. I can always contact you for some lessons.
It is always good to learn trombone history especially about King. I played a 1485 at a store. It is an interesting horn. Being a tenor only player, I put it back on the wall. The horn that my Holy Grail Horn is the King 3B Silver Sonic model 1430S. It is such a beautiful horn. Great Video.
Such a great feeling to finally acquire a dream horn. I remember when I got my Lätzsch after years and played the first notes how happy I've been. Now waiting for the next dream horn 😉
Congratulations Man!!
It was mine! So very glad you got it!! I have a silver plated duo gravis too,
Not boring at all, even for a trumpeters ... and genuine enthusiasm is always a nice thing to see 🙂. My vintage favourite instrument at the moment is a Conn B6 Trumpet (think Connstellation with less bling). Yet another unusual design that went out of favour with modern builders, but giving you a certain something that new off the shelf instruments do not often have.
I have a King Silversonic purchased new in 1964. No model designation on the bell, but, is, I believe, the equivalent of a 5B - .547 bore (not dual bore) and 9 inch bell. I have played it as my tenor trombone using a Schilke 52. Had it modified by Osmun Brass in Boston to take press fit lead pipes - have the original King and a Benge 190 leadpipe. The King lead pipe is shorter - like the George Roberts Kanstuhl bass trombone leadpipe compared to other Kanstuhl leadpipes - and has - to my ears - a more open sound. Hard to describe sound, but the sterling silver adds a "sparkle" to the sound. The sound is dark, but resonate. Yes the ergonomics are not good, but you get used to the hand position - only a little painful after a few hours of playing. I did add a counter weight.
That's a 1485 as well! Same horn as this.
I have my father's King Silversonic small bore bass - ordered in 1962, and delivered in 1963, and used when he played bass trombone w/ the Milwaukee Symphony (the other players in the section were playing .500 to .508 bore instruments). It is a wonderful instrument, great slide, and has a great throw to the sound. Mouthpiece match is the Bach 2G (which Bach designed for the Bach 45 small bore bass). The 1 1/2 G (designed for the 50B) is probably too big to be a good match for the horn - could be the cause of the intonation issues you noted. Also - are the springs in the slide still there? Many repairmen have yanked them out, and that is another intonation issue. This is the perfect horn for Beethoven, Brahms, Mendelssohn, etc. when doing the consort trombone section (alto, small tenor, small bass), or in the performance of Moravian trombone works. It is not the late 20th century bass trombone. I also have my father's King 3B Silversonic from 1956 - again used for orchestral playing in the 1950's and 60's. These horns play bigger than the bore size might indicate.
I have a Yamaha 58 I'm going to try today, as well as the original King 29 in the mail to me as we speak!
Congratulations on acquiring this beautiful instrument!
I had this EXACT type of horn a few years ago! It didn't have the gold wash bell, but still had the super heavy sterling silver bell. I used it throughout High School and made so many memories on it, even if my band director thought it was a piece of junk. Funny you mention trying a Yamaha 58, that's the type of mouthpiece I used on mine.
It somehow just clicked with me in that intro that you're the same burgerbob I see on forums all the time after I've been watching your videos for a while lol
No uhh... that's some other guy for sure
I feel your Enthusiasm I love king Horns. Please do an update when you’ve made modifications. I’d like to see how you solved the trigger issue. That looks like a special trombone, enjoy.
I wish I’d known you wanted one, I had one a couple months ago.
Love this old horn! Only played on one once, back in the early 70s, and loved it. A kid from Big Piney, WY was using it in a district honor band. He wouldn't even consider selling it to me! Back in the day, I believed that this horn would have been the perfect horn for my all-around commercial playing (except lead), instead of using my King 6B with a Bach 4G mouthpiece. Never got to prove that, as I could never get my hands on one. However , why wouldn't you be able to use it in professional settings? Share your thoughts with me on why not.
I just have a hard time imagining a place I would use it. It's not a good tenor trombone, though it can do the role- I have two horns much better suited for it. And I have 6 or 7 basses at any given time that are easier to play and have two valves. So it's in that weird middle ground of small, single bass... at some point I may play in a downsized orchestra section and it will be great on 3rd.
I totally understand the linkage woes. I had a 1480 that I fixed up about 5 years ago to give as a Christmas gift to a tech friend whose son needed a step up. I had to do a bunch of work, but I was able to modify the trigger to reach a more comfy spot. That is a patch on your f slide for sure, and if there is a crack I’m sure Ben wouldn’t have any problem removing the patch and doing a silver solder fill and some burnishing to tidy that up a bit depending on what is underneath. It is possible that the slide was stuck and someone used excessive force to try to remove it, damaging it in the process. For mouthpieces I found that a Stork 1 1/4 was the winner for response for me! My Schilke 60 was way too big, a Bach 2g was too small, and I’ve never been a fan of 1 1/2’s.
In the end, I went with a king 5b with a 7b rotor and a Conn 88HK bell for a small bass/ tenor because I liked the 5b ergos, spatula, string rotor, and the swooping lines of the trigger tubing. I partially wish that I had it back, but I’m very glad to know that a kid is playing through college right now. Plus I don’t need a small bass considering I have 3 big bois in the rotation at the moment
Thanks for the info!
As someone who likes somewhat smaller versions of brass instruments I find this very interesting. My main instrument is a tuba with a 13" bell and I bet this would blend with it much better than it would with any modern bass.
It probably would!
I think this trombone was designed and engineered for marching due to light weight and for big band back then when music for bass wasn’t that low with double rotors. In the common wealth countries ,such as Canada ,Australia , Jamaica and so forth where mostly get are instruments from Great Britain then , 80 years ago we used G basses for marching and concert bands.the big bass trombone was mostly used in orchestra, such as Bach, and Conn. king was mostly for jazz and marching military bands
Not quite, the 1480 was designed decades before any double valve bass trombones. It was designed as simply a full size bass trombone of the time! Quite heavy for the time as well.
Did this come out of Austin??? It might have been mine! I hope it was. And everything you’re saying is correct.
I think it did- I didn't know it was coming from you! That's serendipity!
Congratulations Aiden! Super cool horn
How does this compare to the King 5b? I know they have different bell metals and I’m pretty sure the 5b has a single bore slide. Curious if you’ve ever played one
5B is just a tenor with a bit larger throat bell- they're neat but even more strange in use than this horn, IMO. This was designed from the ground up to be a bass of the time, so it really has that bass character
@@AidanRitchie been looking for a “small bass” for playing TB3 parts on Verdi operas and when section sizes down with alto on lead. Been looking for Conn 70 or 72s, Bach 45s, King 5b, but they are proving tough to find.
@@WillBakerMusic I'd skip the 5B- it's not bass really at all, it's just a 4B. You could have a 45 made that could be pretty awesome, but it'll take time!
There are definitely Conn 7XH out there, I think you'll find one of those first before any of the other horns show up.
I want a King 7B.
Aidan you have ever played a Yamaha YBL-322 Trombone? I found one from Japan with a good slide less that $500.00. I want to own a large bore just to have and for no other reason. Of course I’d play it often.
Yes, they are good single basses! I wouldn't necessarily buy one to own a large bore tenor, since they are larger than that, of course.
@@AidanRitchie I love trombone and I especially love the sound of the bass trombone. I mostly play jazz ( intermediate player) ..it seems if I practiced on Base trombone I’d improve my playing ability on my other tenors. I play a .500 & .525… I am fascinated with the big sound, and I have decent wind and chop fundamentals. I just began tinkering with some Rochut etudes I though through ybl-322 might be a gas go experiment with.
In fact, if there is an intermediate classical music book you’d recommend, please do . If I’m enjoying my experience with that. I can always contact you for some lessons.
@@pebblebeach8517 the Cimera 55 Etudes is a good book to work in- nice simple shirt melodies.
I would like to hear you playing something simple on this to demonstrate sonic qualities!
Of course! I made this video at like 10pm so I didn't want to play much.
@@AidanRitchie great, l do like your videos.