Adam was 1st in his qualifying group and 1st in the semifinal, where the route setting suited him. Tomoa won the final because the problems suited him. It would have made more sense to have a mixture of problems in qualis, semi and final and then the best climber would have won. Tomoa is in awesome form and there is a good chance he would have won anyway. Adam has great technique and determination, probably would have made the podium. There would have been more tops, making it more exciting for the spectators... with this setting you didn't even need a top to be on the podium! Anyway, congrats to Tomoa, what an awesome display of strength and coordination. Also huge congratulations to Jakob, who never gives up, and to Yannick, who was very impressive throughout the event. Let's hope the route setting is less crazy in the lead and combined events.
I wish there was a reasonable forum to let the IFSC know that this is not what we as an audience of climbers want out of climbing. This routesetting meant we watched all of our favorite athletes jump up and down on a mat attempting to grab a start or second hold for the entire event. It isn't even about the outcome, most of the world's best did not even get a chance to climb on half the runs. They were stuck hopping around trying to start. So lame.
I haaate running start moves in a gym (especially with soft mats!) I would be livid as a climber being asked to do so. It's been said here already, but no resemblance to outdoor bouldering.
@@jasonbattermann9982 Who cares if it resembles real bouldering? If you want real bouldering go and watch real bouldering. Also, just because people who do real bouldering deliberately choose not to set themselves routes that involve parkour and dynos doesn't mean they're not a part of bouldering. Real bouldering contains totally arbitrary man made routes - the fact that most of these routes don't contain parkour or dynos just means that "real" boulderers are choosing to limit their bouldering. Presumably, part of it is to do with safety, but safety isn't an issue in competition, so why shouldn't they have parkour and dynos?
Honestly, nobody of the involved route setters should ever be allowed to set boulders for competitions again. The athletes dedicate their life and train hard af for months, and they just mess it all up with their hardcore super-sloper-parcour sh*t that's got nothing to do with rock climbing. Just frustrating for the athletes as well as to watch..
Usually there is a combination of different style of boulders in final but this one, it seems like all the boulder problems are similar in nature, just dynamic low percentage moves. I prefer having a mix.
Very sad to see the best climber of the world dependent of Ninja Warriors route setters... Very sad to see athletes dependent on the quality of their finger skin with no possibility to recover Very sad to see the winners having to step on a huge Red Bull logo (formerly known as podium)
best *sport* climber in the world that's part of your physical conditioning maybe you'd like to not watch climbing comps online with a decent level of production?
what a poor setting for the world championship, i hope they do a better job for the olympic, the route setting dictate the quality of the show, and this was a bad viewer experience
Using your body to get up a wall isn't climbing? Climbing is more than just who can crimp the hardest, if that's what you meant. Dynamic movement, body tension, and route reading are also part of the picture. I love seeing the ingenious betas that some of the climbers come up with.
I think Tamoa's win is totally well deserved, but these boulders are just too brutal. Boulder one looked like it was hard on the fingers, (several climbers looked like they had slightly hurt their fingers) and generally it's not such fun watching climbers falling off, and struggling against such tough boulders. The bouldering final should be about showcasing the tremendous skill of these wonderful athletes not putting them through the meat grinder.
Agreed. I don't quite understand this trend, where bouldering is now just only coordination / jump in a Ninja Warrior / parkour style. The reason seems to be that it's more aesthetic or spectacular, but I don't really see that here - I just see climbers falling and hurting their fingers. @IFSC, you like those moves, fine, but I beg you, don't make bouldering only that. We'd like to see some real climbing. A nicely set boulder in a real climbing style is very aesthetic to watch (and I'm not a professional climber, just a random john who discovered climbing through bouldering a few month ago, so I trully feel I fall in the "basic spectator" category). And thanks for sharing those high-quality videos on youtube :)
i agree with the sentiment gloips de galerf except that calling it "real" climbing rubs me the wrong way. you often here the same thing when people are talking about outdoor climbing. just because it originated there and you prefer one over the other doesn't mean that it is more real or proper or whatever word you wanna use than the other. for example if i'd hate overhang and would love slabs i wouldn't say only slab climbing is real climbing.. in the end it's only semantics but to me it does make a difference
@@soulseek2 real bouldering occurs on *boulders* That is literally what bouldering is. As such, saying "real" climbing implies rock climbing and should center on movement which at least occasionally occurs on rock, not just parkour randomness.
You know, people can argue about whether the direction that the setting is going in is good or bad...but it is objectively true that there was little to no diversity in the types of settings. Every boulder demanded a similar approach to solve, and similar set of skills. Fight me on this.
To me, it seems that many people conflate overcooked boulders with parkour-style routesetting. IMO the main problem was 2 overcooked boulders (M2 and M4). But let's go through the style of each boulder: M1: The typical coordination boulder, quite Parkour-style. I think one such boulder in a round is nice. It wasn't even too crazy as some moves in the past. the part after the zone was pretty cool and hard, too. When Adam Ondra failed on the start it was very obvious for me what we did wrong, and why it worked out the one time he did it. M2: Modern, but fundamentally old-school powerful boulder on steep terrain. Unfortunately overcooked, otherwise pretty good. No coordination/parkour as far as we could see. M3: The slab. It can certainly be argued that it was too dynamic, because the other boulders were quite dynamic, too. But to be climbed, it required two fundamental slab skills: standing on bad feet, and making precise hip-movements. I liked the boulder, and the difficulty was still okay with 1 top and 2 zones. M4: Typical powerful boulder with either a simple coordination beta or basic dyno beta for the start move. I have totally seen and climbed such type of moves outside on real rock. Unfortunately, the second half was overcooked. Would have been nice with a few more crimps instead of slopers and volumes, though My bottom line: If M2 and M4 would have been a bit easier, it would have been a pretty cool final that only missed a hard crimp boulder. But there was only one parkour boulder. All the other sequences I could imagine to find on real, rock, too.
@@benediktneyses5514 Thanks for the analysis. I'd have to agree with most of the nuts and bolts. But diversity is multi-dimensional. I never explicitly stated that every boulder was parkour-style, but wouldn't you agree that every problem almost required a dyno of some sort? Small distinction, and sometimes the moves were performed relatively statically, but the setting didn't seem conducive to static moves. Whatever the final outcome of the setting, it's pretty clear to me that the setters had one goal in mind (providing a spectacle...at which they failed), and that's why I think there wasn't any diversity in their setting.
@@mikejungle Yeah, I can definitely agree with you that the round would have benefitted a lot from at least one slower and/or more crimpy boulder. My comment regarding the Parkour-setting was perhaps not so much aimed at you specifically, but at what appears to be the general opinion in the comments section. But I still think that getting the difficulty on all the boulders right would have let to a final that many people who have enjoyed. M2 and M4 required some savage pulling, and apart from M1, there were no moves that I could not imagine to find on real rock. In fact, in my area (north of Sweden), just 2 weeks ago a few new boulders were established that required some really funky comp-style beta to unlock. For one of the boulders the idea actually came from watching a bouldering WC. In any case, I enjoyed your comment, nice discussion!!! It shows how many factors come into play to set a balanced, fair and spectacular round that also provides good separation.
Route 1: Typical Coordination Route 2: Test of strength on overhang Route 3: Slab with bad feet and crucial hips placement Route 4: Straightforward dyno for a start, intended 360 spin into compression moves I think this set was well-balanced. Difficulty wise the routesetters could have done better. Anyway if you wish to watch strictly climbing based on rock please free free to watch reel rock or moonboard masters
Hmmm this final was pretty disappointing... I don't find parkour and crazy dynos over and over again very interesting, a couple are fine but more traditional boulders are much more interesting imo and climbers usually have more unique beta on them 🤷♀️
IFSC you seriously need to step in and stop every boulder being a parkour style jump, its boring to watch once let alone for 4 problems! Your making a joke of our sport! #bringbackthecrimps
Here is the reason so many comp boulders have been parkour style. It may not be so for you, but dynamic boulders rile up the crowd more. Sure, they can put ultra technical crimpy boulders up, but those who have possibly never climbed before may not understand how hard it really is. If the athlete needs to jump, do toe hooks, heel hooks and related, it definitely would appear harder to a spectator. When I look up at a crimpy gym boulder that has a grade of V10, it may not look so bad, but when dynamics come into play, I think it looks much harder.
Too much jumping around and dynamic moves. Too much falling as well. Would love to see some actual climbing for a change. Meanwhile, the women's final had some amazing route setting.
Man, the boulders had been so suuuper high qualtiy only have been a liiitle bit too hard... But the japanese routesetters really showed what they are able to set: endlevel!
It has all already been said by everyone in the comments, but I will post this anyways because it cannot be overstated and hopefully the weight of words will catch someones attention. This was absolutely TERRIBLE route setting. If the goal was to deliver excitement to the audience, you failed utterly. Nobody wants to watch one climber after another jump around and fail for 4 minutes. If the goal was to determine the best climber, you failed utterly. Climbing is a sport of many different skills and styles and by only testing one style (dyno/coordination) in all 4 boulders, you did not give athletes a chance to show all the skills they have been training. Most importantly, this did not stay true to what real climbing is. What an absolute shame...
When you scroll quickly through the video, and all you can see are climbers on the ground, you know there's something wrong. These problems were terrible.
Damn. Apparently, I'm one of the very few who did like these boulders. OK, they're not very "outdoorsy." Yes, they suit the japanese climbers better. And the mid-part of boulders 2 and 4 were probably too hard. But, despite all that, I still prefer seeing very few tops than half the climbers topping all boulders and one guy flashing all of them. Maybe these boulders didn't go very well together but, individually considered, I'd say they were pretty good. I loved the first one, in particular.
For all the people Who never set a boulder in thier lifes. These boulders are extraordinary high class and extremely high quality! Just a little bit too hard... So many people say there are only coordination moves but i can only see 1 (boulder 1), maybe 2 (boulder 3) coordination moves. You really needed to have everything a good INDOOR CLIMBER needs to top these boulders. Boulder 1: coordination. Boulder 2: overhang. Boulder 3: slab and finally boulder 4 was highly physical to defnitely soak out all the energy you have left in tank!! The complexity of the boulders had been too high, so many of the athletes failed but the japanese setters defnitly the best setters in world!!
Absolutely frustrating to watch these routes and sorry but this seemed very much like a Tamoa special route. Every routesetter knows his style and how to stop or let him win.
Damn - just damn.That was terrible. The only thing that saved it is that I didn't watch it live so I could keep hitting the right arrow. Two podium places for 3 zones each?!? Just terrible.
true. half of the time the climbers where brushing/chalking because they failed the start or the second move. every climber, on the same move. double tap right saved the day...
This was the worst final I have seen. We want to see climbing not parkour. The route setters basically gave the comp to Narasaki when they made it 4 coordinations boulders. (Im not saying Narasaki isn’t a good climber because he is a world class climber. It’s just he is the best at coordination moves.)
@@lalalamooone Everything he said is true. If they set an exceptionally hard crimp lock off boulder and an off-width challenge Tomoa may still come out on top (because he's amazing), but then we at least would know he earned it through versatility. This was just climbs running straight up his alley, he didn't get a chance to show that versatility, and no else even got to compete. It didn't let anyone fully demonstrate their skills, and as such was quite a disappointment.
In compared to the semis these boulders were a big disappointment. Maybe worst finals ever. As the setters succeeded in womans final, don't understand this. Zero normal climbing. Terrible. Glad for Yannick though.
There needs to be a lot more balance in the boulders. One should be coordination, one strength, one compressing and one all-rounder etc. Doesn't demonstrate a balanced climber overall. It's almost like a sub sport now. Should be called 'JumpRock'.
For some reason, it seems like the organizers are hell bent on imploding their sport. Uninspired route setting that makes this a 2 hour parkour competition, with more falling than climbing. Denying Adam the opportunity to use footage in his vlogs. Come on ...
Routes for women were good. I played a lot of sudoku throughout men´s routes and jumped forward a lot too. Was there even live audience? They must have been very sad...
[Please consider liking if you agree] IFSC what I'd really love to see, please, is after each comp a session with the route setters demonstrating the intended beta. I think it would really add a lot to see what is was that was keeping these world champions from the top!
Wow such a boring final, worst I've ever watched! If only one person in the top 6 finalist can get only 2 done the setters seriously mucked up! pretty sure no one on women's or men's side enjoyed those boulders.
Who on earth set these problems? This is the worst set finals of all time. There’s nothing wrong with an occasional coordination move, but every problem? What a joke.
I was thinking about this the other day, they need to set some rules to the styles so there always a mixture, like 1 vertical, 1 slab, 1 dyno (on whatever inclination) and then 1 free set or something otherwise of that nature so route-setters cant just set 3 or 4 times the same boulder.
okay... yes the setting was bad, but cmon I only see whining people in the comments, so credit where credit is due: Tomoa absolutly beasted through these boulders. Definitly my favorite for tokyo 2020!!
It's route setting like this that worries me about the opening Olympics for climbing being in Tokyo. It's a personal opinion but compared to world cup route setting (with one notable exception) in France this is a circus...not climbing
The route setting wasn't done by the Japanese association, the head route setter was European (Manuel Hassler (SUI)) who is quite famous for this sort of style. Just overcooked them a bit, I think the poor friction due to the lighting didn't help. The same team set the women's climbs. We may still be in for a good Olympics (fingers crossed)
@@distant_melody ah I stand corrected. I hope so. I'm a big fan of the French style of route setting that prevailed in the lead setting of the various world cups to date where sustained hard climbing provided the complexity. I can also see that would be harder to generate over a short boulder... Lots for them to think about as the lighting, for example, will be more extreme for the greater level of coverage of the Olympics.
Yikes! That was history in the making! Now, let’s do the world of climbing a service, learn from today’s mistakes, and not repeat it 🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️ #olympicskilledmypsych
What utter garbage setting. I don't mind that the boulders are savagely difficult, that is better than too easy. If this is the world championship, we should see the best in the world against the hardest setting. Instead we saw the best in the world against three of the stupidest, most contrived and unaesthetic climbs I've seen this year, and one problem that sort of looked like a boulder problem (M2) albeit with an apparently impossible cross in it. It's shameful.
Wow, ppl really don't seem to like this. I quite enjoyed watching the whole bouldering championship. Sure, one route with just hard crimping would have been nice in this final, but I prefer seeing the athletes make progress and the feeling of everyone having a chance to jump up the rankings if they get a rare top. In some of the world cups it's mostly down to attempts, in the extreme how many flashes you get, so as soon as there's one mistake it's over. That said, some more tops would have probably improved the atmosphere.
It is sickening how many people rage against the route setting in the comments. I would prefer the opinion of the athletes themselves. Bouldering is not about having many athletes top many things. It is about the struggle and ingenuity of the athletes. Just because something else is the norm, it doesn't mean this competition was not enjoyable. I would also have prefered a little more variety in the style of the boulders, but I think it is amazing to see route setters having the guts to set something that difficult. I am sure these athletes like to be challenged to their limits. I prefer this by far over competitions where everything is about attempts and everyone tops everything.
Where is climbing??? Have not seen anything so boring in a while... Give Narasaki chance to win in fair competition and not in this Anti-Ondra & Pro-Narasaki route setting...
This must have been the worst route setting for a men's final I have ever seen. I wouldn't even call this "bouldering" anymore. Nowhere in the real world can you find these moves on rock. Quit the Gym-type-dyno-highrisk-lucky shitshow and make decent boulders where there are four different types if boulders. Slabs, crimps, power moves and what not, but for the love of god (and the future of comp bouldering) stop these nonsense gym-monkey indoors shitshow. @CharlieBoscoe, i really do love all your enthousiasm and accurate commenting, but doubting adam's form is not the question to ask here. He recently climbed 9c, possibly even 9c+ and came back from an injury. The question is more wether these type of routes reward the best climber... (Not degrading Tomoa's win in any way, this dude is gonna be gold medalist in 2020!) Stop the nonsense, start building decent routes. Respect the bouldering as a climbing sport, not a parkour/ninja warrior commercial exploit. Sincerely, A big fan of outdoor and competition climbing
This routesetting was like making an ice skating competition in the middle of a desert. Why do you bring the best climbers in the world if there is nothing to climb? Better to pick some random dudes from the street and the competition would be as exciting... What a shame!
In boulder 1 why were climbers given attempts for times when they did not control all 4 parts of the start? I thought an attempt is only made once you’ve controlled the starting position and that any attempts trying to control the start don’t count against you?
Reading through the comments, I just hope IFSC does the same and recognizes the anti-parkour sentiment. I don't mind some coordination in a final, but at least get climbers off the ground and juxtapose it with some crimping and pinching. Glad the setting was better for the combined.
the jump on number two seemed to be up to the thumb on the lower hand. Squeezing the black volume allowed climbers to slow down the swing and stay with the orange hold.
I don't agree with the people who hate dynos and coordination moves in competition, I think one or two are great, but every boulder? Seriously? The semis had a lot more variety in style and it was great to watch. Any one or two of these boulders in a final would have been great, but all four was complete overkill. Tomoa did amazing though. Earned the win in my opinion. Adam seemed a bit screwed by the style, but Jacob and the other Japanese guys are pretty dynamic and Tomoa crushed problems that they got nowhere near.
Very disappointing route setting, hopefully the Olympics will focus more on climbing rather than parkour. So much jumping, coordination moves, low percentage moves. And for what? For the spectacle? Don't think it was much of a spectacle… :((.
I don't think they will change the style for Olympics. CIO decided to do a combined of three disciplines because of boulders, too boring to stream for them, with too much time to wait between two tries. Speed is like 100m and there is no waiting periods, lead is also entertaining to watch because it's "long" with suspense all along the route. They just don't know what climbing is and believe all disciplines are the same sport. By doing this combined, they just say to the recordman of speed to stay at home. Did they ask Usain Bolt to run a marathon or a 10km?
I second that. Chief routesetter's name should be in the program on the day, and they should take a bow before the crowd, possibly with the whole team, either before or after the round.
So frustrating to watch Ondra climb in the IFSC circuit. I think mostly because his sponsors are pushing this "greatest climber of all times" and you expect him to basically be a male Janja Garnbret. In fact, he's doing very well for an out-of-circuit climber. But still, he could do a few more attempts. I guess he has his style and method (plus looking out to the other disciplines etc.), but if you look at the results... trying to outbrain the problem for 30 seconds instead of dialing in your moves isn't the way to go
Can we please go back to some form of real climbing? I used to be a supporter of competition bouldering being its own entity of movements you don't find outdoors, but they're overdoing it. When majority of the moves are low percentage, it's boring and annoying to watch. Competition climbing is losing actual climbing technique in its settings. You couldn't have trained for this. I agree with most of the comments, there should be a limit to coordination style climbing. Props on Tomoa being a monster at this, but I still would have liked to see the other climbers showcase different strengths. This is a very one-trick pony type of setting. Hachioji, overall, has given me extremely low expectations for the Olympics to accurately represent the sport.
It's perfectly reasonable for the world championships or future Olympics to be peak difficulty, but the event organizers seemed to only care about dramatic impossible looking acrobatic manoeuvres like you see on those goofy ninja gameshows. Plus the routes they set all had one, single obvious route to use. They need a bit more variety in the feature placement, especially in the beginning section, to let climbers of different heights play to their strengths and encourage the element of problem solving essential to boulders. That way if one feature or movement is a dud then another could make up for it and still make it meaningfully competitive. If they are worried about making it too easy and ties too likely, add another scoring zone and make time the last of the tiebreaker criteria.
I hope IFSC reads their UA-cam comments... Lemme make it very clear: PLEASE STOP SETTING PARKOUR ROUTES. WE WANT CLIMBING ROUTES NOT CIRCUS TRICKS. LESS JUMPING.
Actually I hope Ondra decides to skip this parcour comp shit and to dedicate to hard rock climbs again. Sad to watch him put in all this effort for nothing..
These bolders were set for the Japanese and against Adam Ondra! These bolders are really crazy. It's not climbing, it's kind of artistics. Very bad route setting work... inappropriate for world championship's Please more climbing and less dino's. .
Absolutely awful, dull final... In the final of the bouldering world championship, two of the four boulders couldn't be climbed (and no one was close), and only one man had climbed the other two boulders. Well done Japan, you destroyed bouldering.
I'm actually pretty stoked on the difficulty of these. Obviously they are too hard consider that basically no competitors did "well". But I like that not everyone is flashing each boulder. But most of them looked straight up not possible, especially not in 4 minutes.
M1
Jakob Schubert 16:49
Yannick Flohé 21:13
Keita Dohi 25:32
kokoro Fujii 29:50
Tomoa Narasaki 34:16
Adam Ondra 37:49
M2
Jakob Schubert 43:28
Yannick Flohé 47:29
Keita Dohi 51:53
kokoro Fujii 56:18
Tomoa Narasaki 1:00:47
Adam Ondra 1:05:07
M3
Jakob Schubert 1:12:29
Yannick Flohé 1:16:55
Keita Dohi 1:21:21
kokoro Fujii 1:25:46
Tomoa Narasaki 1:30:19
Adam Ondra 1:34:39
M4
Jakob Schubert 1:40:07
Yannick Flohé 1:44:17
Keita Dohi 1:47:47
kokoro Fujii 1:52:37
Tomoa Narasaki 1:57:13
Adam Ondra 2:01:54
God
You're a good boy
thank you
Mvp
Absolute legend
Adam Ondra (in his Road to Tokyo vlog): I don't like toe hooks and jumpy coordination moves.
Route setters today: Say no more.
These routes are almost always defined many days or even weeks before the competition. But yeah - pretty funny nevertheless :D
Hah i was thinking the same thing! Really sucks :/ i feel bad for him
I was also thinking exact same thing. Lol
It is worse and worse. It is not bouldering anymore when you have 2-3 consecutive dynamic moves.
Adam was 1st in his qualifying group and 1st in the semifinal, where the route setting suited him.
Tomoa won the final because the problems suited him.
It would have made more sense to have a mixture of problems in qualis, semi and final and then the best climber would have won.
Tomoa is in awesome form and there is a good chance he would have won anyway. Adam has great technique and determination, probably would have made the podium. There would have been more tops, making it more exciting for the spectators... with this setting you didn't even need a top to be on the podium!
Anyway, congrats to Tomoa, what an awesome display of strength and coordination. Also huge congratulations to Jakob, who never gives up, and to Yannick, who was very impressive throughout the event.
Let's hope the route setting is less crazy in the lead and combined events.
One of the best comments here. Well said.
I wish there was a reasonable forum to let the IFSC know that this is not what we as an audience of climbers want out of climbing. This routesetting meant we watched all of our favorite athletes jump up and down on a mat attempting to grab a start or second hold for the entire event. It isn't even about the outcome, most of the world's best did not even get a chance to climb on half the runs. They were stuck hopping around trying to start. So lame.
I haaate running start moves in a gym (especially with soft mats!) I would be livid as a climber being asked to do so. It's been said here already, but no resemblance to outdoor bouldering.
exactly!! how can they be so not listening to all climbers comments!!
Looked like sharma in the last legends only. Smh
The women's route setting was bad ace tho
@@jasonbattermann9982 Who cares if it resembles real bouldering? If you want real bouldering go and watch real bouldering. Also, just because people who do real bouldering deliberately choose not to set themselves routes that involve parkour and dynos doesn't mean they're not a part of bouldering. Real bouldering contains totally arbitrary man made routes - the fact that most of these routes don't contain parkour or dynos just means that "real" boulderers are choosing to limit their bouldering. Presumably, part of it is to do with safety, but safety isn't an issue in competition, so why shouldn't they have parkour and dynos?
So happy for Tomoa! Wins the WC and WCH in the same year again! What an amazing performance :)
That was a disaster. Props to Narasaki, he is the best competition boulderer on the circuit, no contest. The women’s side was a masterclass.
I am sure Tomoa would win any american ninja comp anytime and without issues :)
I'm 2 hours into the video and struggling to remember if i saw any climbing ...
Ian McNulty it’s normal, it was Ninja Warrior route setting...
@@Dardjiskien exactly my thoughts
just seeing the first boulder right now and I already don't want to watch the rest
@@Cellkist 150 professional world class climbers which are attended this event are totally disagreed with you. Soooooo...
@@dlavrik4811 source?
awful route setting. Do the routesetters work at Cirque du Soleil as well?
I'd love to see the route setters climb these boulders!
in 4 minutes
and without their ladder :)
Honestly, nobody of the involved route setters should ever be allowed to set boulders for competitions again. The athletes dedicate their life and train hard af for months, and they just mess it all up with their hardcore super-sloper-parcour sh*t that's got nothing to do with rock climbing. Just frustrating for the athletes as well as to watch..
A-freaking-men! Especially #2
Then watch this!
ua-cam.com/video/Vk_sijg_HVY/v-deo.html
Usually there is a combination of different style of boulders in final but this one, it seems like all the boulder problems are similar in nature, just dynamic low percentage moves. I prefer having a mix.
Very sad to see the best climber of the world dependent of Ninja Warriors route setters...
Very sad to see athletes dependent on the quality of their finger skin with no possibility to recover
Very sad to see the winners having to step on a huge Red Bull logo (formerly known as podium)
best *sport* climber in the world
that's part of your physical conditioning
maybe you'd like to not watch climbing comps online with a decent level of production?
@@themeatpopsicle he literally missed the 1st place overall in bouldering by 5 points
what a poor setting for the world championship, i hope they do a better job for the olympic, the route setting dictate the quality of the show, and this was a bad viewer experience
IFSC Climbing World Championships - Hachioji 2019 - PARKOUR - Men Finals
Sadly, this was truly awful. The route setters really messed up here. They did understand this was a CLIMBING competition, right?!
somehow Narasaki doesn't care about how awful the routesetting is :)
how did they fail when narasaki finished it with ease?
Using your body to get up a wall isn't climbing? Climbing is more than just who can crimp the hardest, if that's what you meant. Dynamic movement, body tension, and route reading are also part of the picture. I love seeing the ingenious betas that some of the climbers come up with.
@@qwertyuiop-cu2ve I love dynamic movements, I’m a competition climber myself, but not every single boulder should have a dyno in finals.
Adam Ondra trained for a climbing world championship not a ninja warrior/parkour world championship, that's where he messed up.
I think Tamoa's win is totally well deserved, but these boulders are just too brutal. Boulder one looked like it was hard on the fingers, (several climbers looked like they had slightly hurt their fingers) and generally it's not such fun watching climbers falling off, and struggling against such tough boulders. The bouldering final should be about showcasing the tremendous skill of these wonderful athletes not putting them through the meat grinder.
We're not here to see these guys get injured.
dear setters: I've had enough coordination moves, thank you.
Agreed. I don't quite understand this trend, where bouldering is now just only coordination / jump in a Ninja Warrior / parkour style. The reason seems to be that it's more aesthetic or spectacular, but I don't really see that here - I just see climbers falling and hurting their fingers. @IFSC, you like those moves, fine, but I beg you, don't make bouldering only that. We'd like to see some real climbing. A nicely set boulder in a real climbing style is very aesthetic to watch (and I'm not a professional climber, just a random john who discovered climbing through bouldering a few month ago, so I trully feel I fall in the "basic spectator" category). And thanks for sharing those high-quality videos on youtube :)
i agree with the sentiment gloips de galerf except that calling it "real" climbing rubs me the wrong way. you often here the same thing when people are talking about outdoor climbing. just because it originated there and you prefer one over the other doesn't mean that it is more real or proper or whatever word you wanna use than the other. for example if i'd hate overhang and would love slabs i wouldn't say only slab climbing is real climbing.. in the end it's only semantics but to me it does make a difference
Here, here.
@@soulseek2 real bouldering occurs on *boulders* That is literally what bouldering is. As such, saying "real" climbing implies rock climbing and should center on movement which at least occasionally occurs on rock, not just parkour randomness.
You know, people can argue about whether the direction that the setting is going in is good or bad...but it is objectively true that there was little to no diversity in the types of settings. Every boulder demanded a similar approach to solve, and similar set of skills.
Fight me on this.
I don't want to fight you, I want to agree with you
To me, it seems that many people conflate overcooked boulders with parkour-style routesetting. IMO the main problem was 2 overcooked boulders (M2 and M4).
But let's go through the style of each boulder:
M1: The typical coordination boulder, quite Parkour-style. I think one such boulder in a round is nice. It wasn't even too crazy as some moves in the past. the part after the zone was pretty cool and hard, too. When Adam Ondra failed on the start it was very obvious for me what we did wrong, and why it worked out the one time he did it.
M2: Modern, but fundamentally old-school powerful boulder on steep terrain. Unfortunately overcooked, otherwise pretty good. No coordination/parkour as far as we could see.
M3: The slab. It can certainly be argued that it was too dynamic, because the other boulders were quite dynamic, too. But to be climbed, it required two fundamental slab skills: standing on bad feet, and making precise hip-movements. I liked the boulder, and the difficulty was still okay with 1 top and 2 zones.
M4: Typical powerful boulder with either a simple coordination beta or basic dyno beta for the start move. I have totally seen and climbed such type of moves outside on real rock. Unfortunately, the second half was overcooked. Would have been nice with a few more crimps instead of slopers and volumes, though
My bottom line: If M2 and M4 would have been a bit easier, it would have been a pretty cool final that only missed a hard crimp boulder. But there was only one parkour boulder. All the other sequences I could imagine to find on real, rock, too.
@@benediktneyses5514
Thanks for the analysis. I'd have to agree with most of the nuts and bolts.
But diversity is multi-dimensional.
I never explicitly stated that every boulder was parkour-style, but wouldn't you agree that every problem almost required a dyno of some sort? Small distinction, and sometimes the moves were performed relatively statically, but the setting didn't seem conducive to static moves.
Whatever the final outcome of the setting, it's pretty clear to me that the setters had one goal in mind (providing a spectacle...at which they failed), and that's why I think there wasn't any diversity in their setting.
@@mikejungle Yeah, I can definitely agree with you that the round would have benefitted a lot from at least one slower and/or more crimpy boulder. My comment regarding the Parkour-setting was perhaps not so much aimed at you specifically, but at what appears to be the general opinion in the comments section.
But I still think that getting the difficulty on all the boulders right would have let to a final that many people who have enjoyed. M2 and M4 required some savage pulling, and apart from M1, there were no moves that I could not imagine to find on real rock. In fact, in my area (north of Sweden), just 2 weeks ago a few new boulders were established that required some really funky comp-style beta to unlock. For one of the boulders the idea actually came from watching a bouldering WC.
In any case, I enjoyed your comment, nice discussion!!! It shows how many factors come into play to set a balanced, fair and spectacular round that also provides good separation.
@@benediktneyses5514 what does 'overcooked' mean? :)
IFSC? What a joke? Why don't you change your name to INTERNATIONAL FEDERATION OF PARKOUR (IFP) instead?! Leave climbing to climbers!
try to remember that last time you saw a pinch hold in a comp.......anyone????
Route 1: Typical Coordination
Route 2: Test of strength on overhang
Route 3: Slab with bad feet and crucial hips placement
Route 4: Straightforward dyno for a start, intended 360 spin into compression moves
I think this set was well-balanced. Difficulty wise the routesetters could have done better.
Anyway if you wish to watch strictly climbing based on rock please free free to watch reel rock or moonboard masters
Let Adam uses the footage.
man i hate that they did that -.-
This might be the one time he doesn't want to :(
Imagine if Tomoa wasn't here and there were zero tops in the entire final...
Hmmm this final was pretty disappointing... I don't find parkour and crazy dynos over and over again very interesting, a couple are fine but more traditional boulders are much more interesting imo and climbers usually have more unique beta on them 🤷♀️
IFSC you seriously need to step in and stop every boulder being a parkour style jump, its boring to watch once let alone for 4 problems! Your making a joke of our sport! #bringbackthecrimps
I miss the crimpy problems tbh. Parkour style problems are fun, but shouldn't be the only problems.
Here is the reason so many comp boulders have been parkour style. It may not be so for you, but dynamic boulders rile up the crowd more. Sure, they can put ultra technical crimpy boulders up, but those who have possibly never climbed before may not understand how hard it really is. If the athlete needs to jump, do toe hooks, heel hooks and related, it definitely would appear harder to a spectator. When I look up at a crimpy gym boulder that has a grade of V10, it may not look so bad, but when dynamics come into play, I think it looks much harder.
Too much jumping around and dynamic moves. Too much falling as well. Would love to see some actual climbing for a change. Meanwhile, the women's final had some amazing route setting.
we are waaay far from outdoor bouldering, feel sorry for these climbers who trained themselves hard for this day...
Very boring to watch, really hope the route setter do a better job at the Olympics
Man, the boulders had been so suuuper high qualtiy only have been a liiitle bit too hard... But the japanese routesetters really showed what they are able to set: endlevel!
@@RampageRoutesetting Yea they were super hard but the routes are supposed to be doable, nobody is gonna watch hours of no sends
What great entertainment! Glad we got to see the worlds best boulderers get shutdown on every problem... Thanks IFSC
Hopefully my sarcasm is obvious
Something needs to change or else the olympics may not be the exposure the climbing world really wants
It has all already been said by everyone in the comments, but I will post this anyways because it cannot be overstated and hopefully the weight of words will catch someones attention. This was absolutely TERRIBLE route setting. If the goal was to deliver excitement to the audience, you failed utterly. Nobody wants to watch one climber after another jump around and fail for 4 minutes. If the goal was to determine the best climber, you failed utterly. Climbing is a sport of many different skills and styles and by only testing one style (dyno/coordination) in all 4 boulders, you did not give athletes a chance to show all the skills they have been training. Most importantly, this did not stay true to what real climbing is. What an absolute shame...
I love how Ondra chalks up in the preview stage like he about to send it right there 😂
When you scroll quickly through the video, and all you can see are climbers on the ground, you know there's something wrong.
These problems were terrible.
Damn. Apparently, I'm one of the very few who did like these boulders.
OK, they're not very "outdoorsy." Yes, they suit the japanese climbers better. And the mid-part of boulders 2 and 4 were probably too hard. But, despite all that, I still prefer seeing very few tops than half the climbers topping all boulders and one guy flashing all of them.
Maybe these boulders didn't go very well together but, individually considered, I'd say they were pretty good. I loved the first one, in particular.
SPOILERS:
.
.
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Two tops out of 24.
For all the people Who never set a boulder in thier lifes. These boulders are extraordinary high class and extremely high quality! Just a little bit too hard... So many people say there are only coordination moves but i can only see 1 (boulder 1), maybe 2 (boulder 3) coordination moves. You really needed to have everything a good INDOOR CLIMBER needs to top these boulders. Boulder 1: coordination. Boulder 2: overhang. Boulder 3: slab and finally boulder 4 was highly physical to defnitely soak out all the energy you have left in tank!! The complexity of the boulders had been too high, so many of the athletes failed but the japanese setters defnitly the best setters in world!!
Absolutely frustrating to watch these routes and sorry but this seemed very much like a Tamoa special route. Every routesetter knows his style and how to stop or let him win.
6 climbers on 4 routes, 24 total climbs, yet only 2 tops (from the same climber)? Seriously??
Yeah... Two tops of 24 atempts in total of the six best boulderers in the world... I want my two hours watching back from the routesetters! :D
Best parkour final I seen in my lifee 🥰
Wait what.... ?🤔
what an absolutely awful final...the route setter did a terrible job of allowing actual climbing...
frigging dance music sucks
Damn - just damn.That was terrible. The only thing that saved it is that I didn't watch it live so I could keep hitting the right arrow. Two podium places for 3 zones each?!? Just terrible.
true. half of the time the climbers where brushing/chalking because they failed the start or the second move. every climber, on the same move. double tap right saved the day...
Well that was dull.
hardcore parkour
This was the worst final I have seen. We want to see climbing not parkour. The route setters basically gave the comp to Narasaki when they made it 4 coordinations boulders. (Im not saying Narasaki isn’t a good climber because he is a world class climber. It’s just he is the best at coordination moves.)
your salt is real. you are just dismissing narasaki's success. calling a world champion a world class climber is an insult u salty swine
@@lalalamooone Everything he said is true. If they set an exceptionally hard crimp lock off boulder and an off-width challenge Tomoa may still come out on top (because he's amazing), but then we at least would know he earned it through versatility. This was just climbs running straight up his alley, he didn't get a chance to show that versatility, and no else even got to compete. It didn't let anyone fully demonstrate their skills, and as such was quite a disappointment.
@@lalalamooone idiot 😂
I didn't see 4 coordination boulders though. Could you enlighten me on how there were 4 of them?
i think I am going to watch around the 2012 year comps to rel...a time TV and novices didn't need to be pleased with visual problems,,
In compared to the semis these boulders were a big disappointment. Maybe worst finals ever. As the setters succeeded in womans final, don't understand this. Zero normal climbing. Terrible.
Glad for Yannick though.
Nice parkour championship. When is scheduled the CLIMBING competition?
I'm glad I didn't watch that live!
Fortunately, the first problem was not live streamed due to technical problem... Woman final was way pleasant to watch.
Drunkman: you wont make circus an olympics sport
IFSC: Hold my beer
There needs to be a lot more balance in the boulders. One should be coordination, one strength, one compressing and one all-rounder etc. Doesn't demonstrate a balanced climber overall. It's almost like a sub sport now. Should be called 'JumpRock'.
For some reason, it seems like the organizers are hell bent on imploding their sport. Uninspired route setting that makes this a 2 hour parkour competition, with more falling than climbing. Denying Adam the opportunity to use footage in his vlogs. Come on ...
Routes for women were good. I played a lot of sudoku throughout men´s routes and jumped forward a lot too. Was there even live audience? They must have been very sad...
[Please consider liking if you agree]
IFSC what I'd really love to see, please, is after each comp a session with the route setters demonstrating the intended beta. I think it would really add a lot to see what is was that was keeping these world champions from the top!
Okay... I just found out that this exists: ua-cam.com/video/Vk_sijg_HVY/v-deo.html
But still I'd love to see it as part of the broadcast.
Wow such a boring final, worst I've ever watched! If only one person in the top 6 finalist can get only 2 done the setters seriously mucked up! pretty sure no one on women's or men's side enjoyed those boulders.
Who on earth set these problems? This is the worst set finals of all time.
There’s nothing wrong with an occasional coordination move, but every problem? What a joke.
Very disappointed in these boulders. They need to make a rule where only one coordination boulder is allowed in a comp.
I was thinking about this the other day, they need to set some rules to the styles so there always a mixture, like 1 vertical, 1 slab, 1 dyno (on whatever inclination) and then 1 free set or something otherwise of that nature so route-setters cant just set 3 or 4 times the same boulder.
okay... yes the setting was bad, but cmon I only see whining people in the comments, so credit where credit is due: Tomoa absolutly beasted through these boulders. Definitly my favorite for tokyo 2020!!
It's route setting like this that worries me about the opening Olympics for climbing being in Tokyo. It's a personal opinion but compared to world cup route setting (with one notable exception) in France this is a circus...not climbing
The route setting wasn't done by the Japanese association, the head route setter was European (Manuel Hassler (SUI)) who is quite famous for this sort of style. Just overcooked them a bit, I think the poor friction due to the lighting didn't help. The same team set the women's climbs. We may still be in for a good Olympics (fingers crossed)
@@distant_melody ah I stand corrected. I hope so. I'm a big fan of the French style of route setting that prevailed in the lead setting of the various world cups to date where sustained hard climbing provided the complexity. I can also see that would be harder to generate over a short boulder... Lots for them to think about as the lighting, for example, will be more extreme for the greater level of coverage of the Olympics.
When the world’s best climbers don’t even get close to top in most boulders = setters fucked up bad
2 tops and from the same climber... and Yannick Flohé giving up in the last boulder is really sad to see
Yikes! That was history in the making! Now, let’s do the world of climbing a service, learn from today’s mistakes, and not repeat it 🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️
#olympicskilledmypsych
What utter garbage setting. I don't mind that the boulders are savagely difficult, that is better than too easy. If this is the world championship, we should see the best in the world against the hardest setting. Instead we saw the best in the world against three of the stupidest, most contrived and unaesthetic climbs I've seen this year, and one problem that sort of looked like a boulder problem (M2) albeit with an apparently impossible cross in it. It's shameful.
**WOW** these setters should be fired. Not to take away from Narasaki, he deserved the gold 100.00%.
Wow, ppl really don't seem to like this. I quite enjoyed watching the whole bouldering championship. Sure, one route with just hard crimping would have been nice in this final, but I prefer seeing the athletes make progress and the feeling of everyone having a chance to jump up the rankings if they get a rare top. In some of the world cups it's mostly down to attempts, in the extreme how many flashes you get, so as soon as there's one mistake it's over. That said, some more tops would have probably improved the atmosphere.
It is sickening how many people rage against the route setting in the comments. I would prefer the opinion of the athletes themselves. Bouldering is not about having many athletes top many things. It is about the struggle and ingenuity of the athletes. Just because something else is the norm, it doesn't mean this competition was not enjoyable. I would also have prefered a little more variety in the style of the boulders, but I think it is amazing to see route setters having the guts to set something that difficult. I am sure these athletes like to be challenged to their limits. I prefer this by far over competitions where everything is about attempts and everyone tops everything.
Exactly! Agree 100%! After all, comp bouldering a different discipline than outdoor bouldering!
genuine question: who does the forerunning for these routes? esp the men's finals? are the moves designed really execute-able?
They setting team has former world cup competitors and even former world cup champions like Tsukuru. (He was even in 2016 World Champs finals)
Did Digital Homicide take the opening music or ...?
Where is climbing??? Have not seen anything so boring in a while... Give Narasaki chance to win in fair competition and not in this Anti-Ondra & Pro-Narasaki route setting...
This must have been the worst route setting for a men's final I have ever seen. I wouldn't even call this "bouldering" anymore. Nowhere in the real world can you find these moves on rock. Quit the Gym-type-dyno-highrisk-lucky shitshow and make decent boulders where there are four different types if boulders. Slabs, crimps, power moves and what not, but for the love of god (and the future of comp bouldering) stop these nonsense gym-monkey indoors shitshow.
@CharlieBoscoe, i really do love all your enthousiasm and accurate commenting, but doubting adam's form is not the question to ask here. He recently climbed 9c, possibly even 9c+ and came back from an injury. The question is more wether these type of routes reward the best climber... (Not degrading Tomoa's win in any way, this dude is gonna be gold medalist in 2020!)
Stop the nonsense, start building decent routes. Respect the bouldering as a climbing sport, not a parkour/ninja warrior commercial exploit.
Sincerely,
A big fan of outdoor and competition climbing
Seriously, The lighting?
This routesetting was like making an ice skating competition in the middle of a desert.
Why do you bring the best climbers in the world if there is nothing to climb? Better to pick some random dudes from the street and the competition would be as exciting... What a shame!
In boulder 1 why were climbers given attempts for times when they did not control all 4 parts of the start? I thought an attempt is only made once you’ve controlled the starting position and that any attempts trying to control the start don’t count against you?
Alexandra Woodward I think it‘s an attempt as soon as you‘re touching the starting holds and you leave the ground completely...
Reading through the comments, I just hope IFSC does the same and recognizes the anti-parkour sentiment. I don't mind some coordination in a final, but at least get climbers off the ground and juxtapose it with some crimping and pinching. Glad the setting was better for the combined.
the jump on number two seemed to be up to the thumb on the lower hand. Squeezing the black volume allowed climbers to slow down the swing and stay with the orange hold.
I don't agree with the people who hate dynos and coordination moves in competition, I think one or two are great, but every boulder? Seriously? The semis had a lot more variety in style and it was great to watch. Any one or two of these boulders in a final would have been great, but all four was complete overkill. Tomoa did amazing though. Earned the win in my opinion. Adam seemed a bit screwed by the style, but Jacob and the other Japanese guys are pretty dynamic and Tomoa crushed problems that they got nowhere near.
this was an anticlimactic final ruined by overambitious trendhypey routesetting. who really wants this??
Very disappointing route setting, hopefully the Olympics will focus more on climbing rather than parkour. So much jumping, coordination moves, low percentage moves. And for what? For the spectacle? Don't think it was much of a spectacle… :((.
I don't think they will change the style for Olympics. CIO decided to do a combined of three disciplines because of boulders, too boring to stream for them, with too much time to wait between two tries. Speed is like 100m and there is no waiting periods, lead is also entertaining to watch because it's "long" with suspense all along the route. They just don't know what climbing is and believe all disciplines are the same sport. By doing this combined, they just say to the recordman of speed to stay at home. Did they ask Usain Bolt to run a marathon or a 10km?
Btw, IFSC, who specifically have been the routesetters for the men's bouldering comps at this leg of WC?
I second that. Chief routesetter's name should be in the program on the day, and they should take a bow before the crowd, possibly with the whole team, either before or after the round.
So frustrating to watch Ondra climb in the IFSC circuit. I think mostly because his sponsors are pushing this "greatest climber of all times" and you expect him to basically be a male Janja Garnbret. In fact, he's doing very well for an out-of-circuit climber. But still, he could do a few more attempts. I guess he has his style and method (plus looking out to the other disciplines etc.), but if you look at the results... trying to outbrain the problem for 30 seconds instead of dialing in your moves isn't the way to go
Seemed like he was saving his skin for lead. These low percentage dynos rip your skin straight off with multiple attempts
great commentary, great job to the competitors, the setting was too brutal and reliant on low % moves
ABSOLUTELY BORING
Have any routesetter climbed outdoors ever on his life?
Can we please go back to some form of real climbing? I used to be a supporter of competition bouldering being its own entity of movements you don't find outdoors, but they're overdoing it. When majority of the moves are low percentage, it's boring and annoying to watch. Competition climbing is losing actual climbing technique in its settings. You couldn't have trained for this. I agree with most of the comments, there should be a limit to coordination style climbing. Props on Tomoa being a monster at this, but I still would have liked to see the other climbers showcase different strengths. This is a very one-trick pony type of setting. Hachioji, overall, has given me extremely low expectations for the Olympics to accurately represent the sport.
So did Tamoa grab the overall championship prize or is there still a chance for Ondra?
It's perfectly reasonable for the world championships or future Olympics to be peak difficulty, but the event organizers seemed to only care about dramatic impossible looking acrobatic manoeuvres like you see on those goofy ninja gameshows. Plus the routes they set all had one, single obvious route to use. They need a bit more variety in the feature placement, especially in the beginning section, to let climbers of different heights play to their strengths and encourage the element of problem solving essential to boulders. That way if one feature or movement is a dud then another could make up for it and still make it meaningfully competitive. If they are worried about making it too easy and ties too likely, add another scoring zone and make time the last of the tiebreaker criteria.
The entire point is to force a specific set of moves for the climbers to do.
I hope IFSC reads their UA-cam comments... Lemme make it very clear: PLEASE STOP SETTING PARKOUR ROUTES. WE WANT CLIMBING ROUTES NOT CIRCUS TRICKS. LESS JUMPING.
Actually I hope Ondra decides to skip this parcour comp shit and to dedicate to hard rock climbs again. Sad to watch him put in all this effort for nothing..
Adam is still the best climber in the world although he got zero point in this final. Don't worry. It's the route-setter's fault. :)
love is blind
.... next time let’s see if Adam Ondra can win if the route setters make 4 crack climbs... this final was bs
These bolders were set for the Japanese and against Adam Ondra! These bolders are really crazy. It's not climbing, it's kind of artistics. Very bad route setting work... inappropriate for world championship's
Please more climbing and less dino's.
.
Ondra couldn't reach the zone hold on physical problems 2 and 4 tho...
My only thought while watching this was "did the route setters test these before finalizing them?".
At this rate, I'm not even going to bother tuning in for Tokyo...
a little more light next time might help us see the climbers and the climbers see the routes.
Those lines were made in advantage for short competitors. You can see in Adam Ondra's results.
Am I watching Ninja Warriors? Where's the bouldering at?
Absolutely awful, dull final...
In the final of the bouldering world championship, two of the four boulders couldn't be climbed (and no one was close), and only one man had climbed the other two boulders.
Well done Japan, you destroyed bouldering.
While I agree that the routesetting was bad, blaming it on Japan is pretty stupid... This has been the trend the last couple of years sadly
Really horrible route setting. Hopefully things get better for the olympics.
I'm actually pretty stoked on the difficulty of these. Obviously they are too hard consider that basically no competitors did "well". But I like that not everyone is flashing each boulder.
But most of them looked straight up not possible, especially not in 4 minutes.
This final was boring.
Hey its just like the music industry!? You want bubble gum pop, you got it...