7PRC Testing Ammo Velocity
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- Опубліковано 25 вер 2024
- Welcome to Ron Spomer Outdoors! Well, there has been a lot of discussion lately about the 7mm PRC cartridge being an underperformer, many saying that it shoots as much as 200ft per second slower than advertised. So I have a Springfield waypoint here in seven PRC with which we are going to shoot some ammunition and record the velocities.
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Who is Ron Spomer
For 44 years I’ve had the good fortune to photograph and write about my passion - the outdoor life. Wild creatures and wild places have always stirred me - from the first flushing pheasant that frightened me out of my socks in grandpa’s cornfield to the last whitetail that dismissed me with a wag of its tail. In my attempts to connect with this natural wonder, to become an integral part of our ecosystem and capture a bit of its mystery, I’ve photographed, hiked, hunted, birded, and fished across much of this planet. I've seen the beauty that everyone should see, survived adventures that everyone should experience. I may not have climbed the highest mountains, canoed the wildest rivers, caught the largest fish or shot the biggest bucks, but I’ve tried. Perhaps you have, too. And that’s the essential thing. Being out there, an active participant in our outdoor world.
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Disclaimer
All loading, handloading, gunsmithing, shooting and associated activities and demonstrations depicted in our videos are conducted by trained, certified, professional gun handlers, instructors, and shooters for instructional and entertainment purposes only with emphasis on safety and responsible gun handling. Always check at least 3 industry handloading manuals for handloading data, 2 or 3 online ballistic calculators for ballistic data. Do not modify any cartridge or firearm beyond what the manufacturer recommends. Do not attempt to duplicate, mimic, or replicate anything you see in our videos. Firearms, ammunition, and constituent parts can be extremely dangerous if not used safely.
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The first batch of factory Hornady 7 PRC was loaded with RL 26. the current powder is a lgbtq special blend.
😂😅😂😅
Haha!
Tons of videos with crono testing 7PRC. They were mostly all way way slower than advertised. Many just 2800 fps.
I'm getting over 2800 fps with a 20" Browning sbr using Federal ammo. Most guys are getting 3000 or slightly more.
Im sticking with the federal 175 ELDX.
I chronographed both federal and Hornaday and there was a huge difference. Avg of 2974 federal compared to 2778 Hornady.
Maybe. An elk would never know the difference unless it was 600+ yards away.
@PassivePortfolios not wrong about that. Ive killed Elk with slower and smaller bullets at that range.
Im worried about dialing consistency. I'm not chronographing every single box of ammo I buy to make sure my DOPE is correct so I can accurately make the shot out that far. standard deviation was over 55 fps with the hornady. Only 22 with the federal. Groups fine at 100, but really started opening up at over 250. Faster made more consistency. Had the same problem with hornady 6.5 creedmore 143gr ELDX. The S&B 140gr stuff was faster and far far more consistent. Even the 156hr stuff isn't too bad.
Even then, if I wanted 2800 FPS gun, I would have just gone with something not in a standard length action. I expect magnum performance from a magnum length cartridge.
Either way, I'm not making any more preferential buys in favor of Hornadays ammo. Great bullets, but damn I'm starting to hate their ammo.
@@rustyking2728 I 100% agree with you. I could care less what my velocity is as long as its the same every time.
Eldx is too fragile for elk. You can't pay me to use it.
@moneyx3232 I've heard that concern before from friends who use the ELD-M at longer ranges.
I've always liked the reliable expansions of the ELD-X bullets. Something I never got with bergers.
I personally haven't had issues with it punching through a shoulder at 500+ in various cartridges. Only time it didn't pass through was on my kids 6.5 creedmore at 350. But that was out of an 18" sig cross and the cow didn't go far and was clearly hurt. A second shot easily brought her down. That was before I chronographed the hornady loads and found out how inconsistent they are.
I've considered trying out the 170gr terminal assent because I know many who speak highly of them, and I'm becoming a bigger fan of the federal loads.
What do you use?
Someone get Ron that new Garmin chronograph!!
He’s banking, he can get it himself.
I bought a Lab Radar about 6 months before Garmin Xero came out. The Lab radar is finicky until you learn where to position it. Still dropping another $600 for a Xero is not warranted for me. Ron's old school light shade chrono works. Probably a $250 unit compared to $600 for radar chronos, it gets the job done.
Eats the big deal with those things? I notice all the influencers are shilling them.
I agree.. And WhoTeeWho. But at least Ron uses a Chrono, so we always get an idea what a rifle and Ammo can do.
* Get him a spotting scope as well, so he can see where is shots are landing.
Would be nice if you add an addendum video to supplement this one using Federal 175 ELDX ammo and Federal Terminal Ascent ammo just to show how they do in that rifle
We need the Ron Spomer ammo lot numbers that Hornady created just for this video to hit close to box velocities 😂
Sure...
100%
Lol, they're on the boxes in the video.
4:35, he says the lot numbers are the same
Only ron gets box velocity
yes !
Yeah cause he has clout 😂 do you think Hornady sent him some of their "special stock" ammo?
@@Stewart7516 that hilarious
If Hornady paid me to shoot fake lot numbered ammo I would report box velocity too😂
Ron - I've got three lots of trash Hornady ammo that I'd be happy to shoot with my Tikka 7PRC along with your cherry picked ammo.
I been getting over 3k for months in my 7mmprc u guys are behind try catching up
When new lots of ammo with the different powder were produced they should have changed the listed velocity on the box to match the actual velocity of the new lots with the different powder.
Correct!
Yeah, this is the bottom line. None of the reasons from Hornady matter whatsoever at this point. I also think they should have gone as far as to make completely different boxes to distinguish it further.
Exactly. Hornady needs to issue a recall. I wasted over $500 on trash ammo.
They didn't. If it bothers you that much, protest with your wallet from now on and buy something else.. like an RCBS single stage, then you can color your own boxes and write whatever you want on it.
@@markcalvert7601 Who are you even talking to? Because personally I can't understand you with your mouth full of Hornady's nuts. Do you honestly think it is asking too much for ammo manufacturers to print accurate velocities on the box? And what does handloading have to do with anything? I handload a lot of different cartridges. That doesn't mean that I never shoot factory ammo and that I don't expect factory ammo to list accurate velocities on the box. Do you think Hornady is gonna come give you a pat on the back for being a good little bootlicker or something?
Mr. Spomer mentioned in a previous video that he later discovered that he somehow ended up with boxes of the older, faster ammo which prevented him from seeing the velocity problems reported elsewhere. Hornady has lost a lot of credibility over this ammo mess. If they would have just placed stickers with the correct velocity on the boxes of the slower ammo, they would not have lost as much trust. Not every hunter has the ability to check the velocity of each box of ammo before using it, and the reported velocity variations can have a big effect on a long range cartridge such as this. Even though a shooter may be annoyed that he got a slower batch of ammo, at least he will hit his target with it.
Velocity changes with altitude and atmospheric conditions, it means nothing
@@joshlower1 So you don't mind if one box of ammo shoots the same bullet 150fps slower than another box?
@joshlower1 different shooters shoot at different elev and temperatures. One shooter usually stays at same elev and climate
@@444MarlinSSwhere i live one day you might hunt elk at 8000 ft the next day an oryx hunt at 4500ft and the following day a barbary sheep at 6000 ft all within 25 miles
@@joshlower1that may be so, but that is a different matter. Hornady admitted it was them changing the loadings, so the atmospherics argument is moot.
I think the bottom line is if we don't start manufacturing these components here in the U.S.A. were screwed ! I don't think
the manufacturers are totally honest either .
Couldn't agree more I don't know why Hornady an Hodgdon don't go together to try to get Federal an CCI primers even Alliant powder, Federal an Remington ammo....idk why you wouldn't pursue the primers atleast
@@seetownwv ? you do know that Hornady makes some of their own primers but they also contract Federal and CCI primers already. Until very recently the vast majority of Hornady Primers were Federal and CCI.
What components aren't made in the U.S.? Yes many powders are imported but the larger manufacturers Federal, Rem, CCI, Win buy raw materials and make all the components in house. Bullet manufacturers (sierra, barnes, Nosler, etc) do the same thing.
@wcb5890 no did not know that but I still think American family owned buisness shouldn't let a foreign company buy another that makes reloading components. Cause Hornady does not sell primers or powder an their bullets useless without them. I think Hornady is quality has went down hill. I had read about loose primers pockets on 7 prc brass...well they weren't wrong! Twice fired Hornady brass didn't even attempt to seat. I hit table it fell out. Their brass is about 60 bucks on this cartidge they push. So now their ammo isn't true to velocity an brass is trash. Atleast on this cartidge.
@wcb5890 an most of the best burning magnum powders aren't made here. Vihtavuori an Ramshot, part of Hodgdon an Alliant all are made somewhere else. Hodgdon is trying to get a monopoly which I give them credit for but their prices are getting ridiculous now.
Are we going to ignore the magazine popping out of the rifle? Cmon Springfield
Looked like Ron didn’t have it in correctly
I love this video. It really illustrates the underperformance of the 7prc. It also shows that Hornady is mostly a modest bullet manufacturer that would rather spend its money on marketing rather than true engineering. Honestly, if Ron can't shoot 1 moa with a $2,000+ gun, it's not an exceptional cartridge. In that is the proof in the pudding about Hornady.
In the same breath you say that Hornady is just an ammo manufacturer but then blame them for the quality of a rifle someone else produced?
How's that even make sense? Lol
I’m not understanding all the hate for Hornady, especially on this channel. I honestly don’t know if Ron is a good bench rest guy or not. Everyone getting butt hurt because Hornady revises and modernizes old cartridge designs.
@@stevenlewis6781finally someone hinted at it - Ron doesn't look like a very good shooter in any of his videos. I wouldn't take his tests as rifle/ammo accuracy tests even if they were the only tests 😅
@@cijetovinaDon’t know how good he is on a bench but I would wager that he’s deadly in the field. Lots of folks like that.
@@stevenlewis6781 sure, no doubt about that, there's much more to hunting than just shooting. It's just that nothing gives me confidence in his marksmanship alone, never saw him shoot a decent group 🤷
Who t who and you wear me out with those chronographs LOL
Do yourself a great deal.
GET A GARMIN
7mm rem mag is being made with 1in8 twist factory rifles that can match or exceed 7prc box velocities. As far as im concerned none of the prc cartridges have done enough to set themselves apart from older more common cartridges. If you want true precision you need to reload anyway so its much cheaper to take a rifle you already own and swap the barrel. If you want a true performer in 7mm go with the SAUM STW or 28 nosler all three are 100 to 200fps faster than the 7prc box velocity. Its already been shown 7mm08 can stabilize and shoot 180s over 2700fps. From what im seeing today the 7prc is only 150fps faster as a magnum than a short action standard cartridge. Thats a huge fail in my book.
to me the white elephant in the room in this video is the accuracy of the rifle. The waypoint is a $2000+ rifle with a .75MOA guarantee. None of the groups made the guarantee.
And the mag fell out
The guarantee applies to the rifle. The ability of the shooter
May vary.
I agree. I was wanting to see all the bullets touching.
I chalk it up to crappy Hornady factory loaded ammo.
I have Christensen Arms 300 PRC. Hornady is the only manufacturer of factory loaded 300PRC. The ELD-M and hunter ELD-X all group 1 to 1.5 moa. I am now hand loading my own on new ADG brass, Retumbo powder out on precision digital scale dispenser, Win LRM primers, and Hornady 230 gr A-Tip and precision dies. I anneal the brass to ensure consistent neck tension on bullet seating. I also fine tuned my seated COL to 2.81". I now push those 230 gr A-tips at 2910 fps at 10 fps spreads. And...
I now get 1/2 MOA groups with those careful hand loads, some strings are touching at .25 MOA groups.. I'm happy now with my own handloads.
My conclusion is it's the crappy Hornady factory ammo.
It seemed that the all copper bullet was the only one that showed any precision. The rest were all 1-1.25” groups at best. So is it the ammo, the shooter, the rifle, or all three. Leaning towards the rifle myself.
Thanks for the honesty in your videos, I am looking forward to the update video with the current production ammo
Right , he didn't test the new ammo that is the debate !!
Velocity was decent but groups from a 2k rifle and leupold scope, well lets say horrible is a good start. My 7mag not a precission cartridge like 7prc(cough) built on sako trgs action with proof bbl with factory or hand loads is laughing 😂 at the waypoint. Off the hood of my truck is avg of 3/8" moa. Cant wait to put it on a bench. Oh and avg with 175 eldx 3030 fps 26" bbl reloder 26 powder
Exactly,the 7mm mag actualy holds MORE powder!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Yeah, great job Hornady, you re-invented the 7mm Rem mag. Cudos to the Creedmores also. You made inherently accurate cartridges for supreme range that have identical performance to "classic" cartridges at short to mid range. Those high B.C. Bullets are great at killing paper, they don't quite expand to humanely kill game like the "classic" lower B.C. Bullets. Competition shooting is great fun. Game meat in my freezer is greater fun.
I agree those groups are junk for even factory loads ...
Garmin needs to sponsor you pal!!!!!
I second that
Yep, I would think a serious shooter like Ron would have a better chrono.
I tell WTW on every single video to get one. Once you have one. You will never use the old style again. They are amazing.
@@RMM--uv7uk i agree I have had one for 2 years and there is no better buddy.
My garmin xero works great
I'm older, a lot older, I started with 7mm Remington in 1967. Didn't have a chrony back then so it was all about accuracy, anything over an inch at 100 yds didn't cut it. I started hand loading and got under 1 moa at a hundred without a problem. Shot the barrel out of my Remington 100 in a few years and had it rebarreled, same caliber. It took a different loading to get the accuracy back but it worked. When Layne Simpson came around with the 7 STW I got one of those in a custom barreled Browning A Bolt, the slowest powder gave 3150 fps and a group under 1 inch for everyone to shoot, factory ammo wouldn't group an inch ever and the velocity was horrid, 2830fps or so, my son has that rifle now. Since then I have gone to a Sharps and black powder, no more hunting for me. Enjoy watching your channel, especially the shooting, never get tired of shooting. Thanks for the time involved, really like to see a good shooter do their thing.
Excellent video Ron 👍 other manufacturers are dealing with the same problem with powders too. The hate for Hornady is unjustified in my opinion. They are one of the only American owned and operated Ammonium company 🙏✌️
I think you hit the nail on the head with the comment on the supply going to the wars. That's why I'm going to stay with the most common calibers. And spend my money on components instead of the latest and Greatest rifle and cartridges. Especially if Vista outdoors gets bought by Checloavak. All their going to produce is military ammunition.
I don't think Ron is that great of a shot... so I would not take too much from this. I've never seen him get bettet that 3/4" group.
Ron you showed in a previous video that accuracy increases when you stabilized the foreend. I’m surprised to see you not changing to doing that.
Yeah I’ve been a little surprised that he is letting it recoil freely, which as you alluded to, is less accurate for him.
Thanks for the accurate information Ron. There it is from a trusted source.
I appreciate this topic, especially when other calibers like 6.8 Western perhaps got a minor bad wrap (and had poor marketing at launch). I'm not a re-loader, so I have to trust in the boxes on the shelves. But when the advertised velocities don't jive, we have to rely on Ron and others to help sort it out with tests like this...Thank you Ron!
The 6.8 western is a great round ..BUT the 270wsm is all it is
A good spotting scope would be a handy item. Cant believe you dont mess with one. Would save alot of time.
I don’t like to use one either. I like walking to the target. I can think about what went right or wrong with the last group attempt. It also gives the barrel time to cool down, and the bonus is I get a few more steps in for that day
I wouldn't be happy with those groups and those 3 types of Hornady ammo after spending $2600 for that rifle. That's a 2.5 MOA rifle in field conditions.
ummm what? somehow field conditions make the rifle less accurate?
@440capnhook yes because in the feild you wont have a bench and bags..
Ron should get a 308 😉
Thanks Ron, you always give unbiased info in my experience. Enjoyed the video.
Keep'em coming!
Ron, thank you for doing this video. 2 reasons for that are that I have looked at that rifle. Along as the cartridge and ammo . I have had concerns with the magazine noise as well , but the rifle looks to be well built. I have been leaning towards other brands. However, I live in SC so here in the southeast the long shots are hunting over bean fields or power line cut downs running through hunting land. With all that said I also been looking at the at the 360 buckhammer. But I have been waiting on ruger to see are they going to build a marlin in that caliber. I know it sounds strange but I like the pistol grip design on the marlins for it reminds me of my bolt action. Plus the marlins have been turning out impressive groups for a lever action. The main reason that I have been looking at the 360 buckhammer is the fact of, my 35 remington ammo is getting hard to find. Plus I like the idea of the better range of the 360 and the fact that it is being loaded in the 200gr. Thank you for all you do. The entertainment and knowledge you pass on in your videos is really appreciated and a joy to watch after may day of work. Please let us know if you hear that marlin is bringing the 360 buckhammer to their line up in the model 336. May you and Mrs. Betty stay blessed in all that you all do and the goes for everyone one in your life as well
Thanks Again
George
I wanted a Springfield rifle till now 😂 kept ejecting the mag and the accuracy was not great
Same
Ron I’m a little disappointed in your journalism. You had an interview with Hornady about the ammo, they admitted newer ammo is slower due to powder changes (due to multiple valid reasons) and a desire to maintain accuracy - you failed to ask them about why they failed to report this, why they still haven’t changed box labels and why recent marketing still includes false high velocities when they know it’s not possible with the current powder issues.
Most " Journalists " are owned by corporations so it seems.
No he didn't. The Hornady guy said we could change the velocities but we don't want to change it because we would have to change it back and forth as we source powder. That was answered
Why don’t you go interview them and make a video then? Ron spends an enormous amount of time and energy providing us free content. The correct response to him is “thank you” and unless you are paying for a specific service from him, be grateful and stop criticizing.
I just bought a ruger american gen 2 in 7 prc.
I sighted it in using ELD x precision Hunter ammo
I did achieve sub MOA accuracy with with lot #3241571 but was only getting a muzzle velocity of 2600 ft per second.
I understand that with only a 20 inch barrel velocity is going to suffer but only 2600 ft per second seems very pathetic.
I get 2700 with 7mm08.
What bullet weight?
@NelsonZAPTM
Do you have the new Ruger American gen 2 in 7mm-08?
@@NelsonZAPTM 175 grain
Damn my 20" 7pc is getting low 2800s out of a 20" CarbonSix barrel on most factory ammo. I have put threw it using a garmin chronograph.
I would be sending that thing back you got a dud.
agree flush magazine for hunting is the way to go. Not having a flush option would exclude the rifle from my purchase options
I have the same rifle chambered with in 6.5 PRC. She absolutely hates CX and loves Barns TX. My 300 prc rifle though likes CX.
I really think the 7mm Rem Mag is the biggest underperformer due to being loaded down in SAAMI specs. As you mentioned, all the other belted magnums go to 65000psi, there is no reason the 7mm Rem Mag doesn't - none at all. I think they need to rewrite the SAAMI spec on the 7mm Rem Mag.
As far as the 7PRC is concerned, the Federal loads for it do make the 3000fps mark easily. The Hornady loads consistently don't, from nearly every gun tested. However, from most of the 7PRC's I've seen, they have been quite precise/accurate. And that was the stated goal. I just wish Hornady had made the cartridge a little "stouter" so they could solidly and confidently and consistently hit that magic 3000fps mark with the 180gr bullets.
The specs are what was submitted for the registration of the calibre surely. you dont change the original that is what was submitted like any calibre handloading changes specs and blueprinting custom rifles too.
@@keithprinn720 They most certainly update specs with updates to technology. For instance, if what you are saying was true, the .45-70 would still be stuck with black powder and the 9mm+P and .45ACP+P would not exist.
They updated the original spec, with the knowledge that many of the original firearms would be dangerous if used with the modern, updated spec ammo.
The same is certainly possible with the 7mm Rem Mag. They could even designate the new ammo 7mm Rem Mag +P if they felt it was necessary. Not that they do so with .30-06 ammo.
@@nathanbailey9153 You sure the 06 was originally a black powder cartridge?
@@440capnhook No, because it wasn't. I got it mixed up with another, early military cartridge that is still common today - the .45-70; first available in black powder and now available in smokeless (I think there are still some black powder users out there today as well, but less common).
Thanks, I'll correct my mistake.
The problem isn’t so much what the velocity average is. The problem is that they change it on you and don’t inform you. So forever more it will be impossible to trust that two boxes from different lots will perform similarly.
Hornady has the power to solve this. They should include a code with the lot number that indexes to the powder type or just include the powder type AND complete a velocity test for each lot and put that velocity on the sticker.
Correct!
It's fraud
I like my 26” barrels but apparently all gun manufacturers like saving that two inches or more off every rifle they build. Me I want all of the velocity that I can get and to do that I need a 26” barrel and without a muzzle break I can’t stand them things! And I don’t like my magazine hanging below my stock unless it holds 30 rounds.😊
They aren’t saving anything, it’s just an inch or two extra going in the scrap bin when it’s trimmed to length. It’s also not the manufacturer’s pushing it it’s the market, if they put 22” and a 26” everything else the same would on a shelf they will sell more of the 22s. People are going through the process of registering hunting rifles as short barrel rifles because they want short, that’s not the current trend for better or worse.
* What gets me is when the ammo/ firearm industry makes a new high pressure cartridge designed for long distance shooting, puts a faster twist rate in their barrels, and then slaps a 20 inch barrel on their firearms. IMO, this kind of defeats the purpose, or at least limits the potential of the new cartridge/firearm.
I.have 26 inch on all of mine but a 22 inch barell is only 50 fps slower on 7 prc and so many people running suppressors
I purchased a 7mm PRC last year and was totally disappointed at the 2864 FPS. I just received a shipment of brass and will begin hand loading pretty soon. I really want to use RL26 but it's virtually impossible to get. I believe there are other powders in the reloading manual that will get me to 3000 easily.
Why haven’t you got a spotting scope beside you?
* I'm with you Ron. The 6mm Rem. is a tremendous cartridge.
Great video. Thanks for clearing that up. I ordered a 7prc last monday
Stop listening to these 7mm mag fan boys 7mmprc is awesome and extremely accurate just don't use hornady ammo buy the federal ammo unless u handload
@@Matt-en1kn agreed
I would have to say that the 7 PRC only edge is the faster twist rate to stabilize the heaver bullets then the 7 mm rem Mag! But at higher elevations it's not a problem if you look at ballistic calculators. The recoil of this Springfield 2020 sure looks mild compared to my old Ruger M77 in 7mm rem mag. Also, as far as powder production in our country look no farther than the EPA, we have only one manufacture of powder in the USA, St Marks and that is spherical ball powder only. Dupont, Hercules, Olin, Atlas all gone.
I had a M77 Ruger in 270 and that thing kicked worse than my 7mag with 175gr.
100%
I have seen 7 people testing this ammo & Ron's is the only 1 that seems out of place !
How come you're getting higher velocities than the max velocity we can get as hand loaders?
The throttle back on the 7mm Remington and 300 Win Mag is due to all the various types of actions vs. just a bolt or falling block.
Very nice love the show!! 7mm PRC rocks but your right I would be happy with either one but would go with the 7 PRC for the big game animals personally 🙂
Thank you for the video, it was very informative 👍
I seen the federal terminal ascent pushing over 3k.
Same. Mine gets upper 2800s with a 20" barrel. Most rifles are getting 3000fps or slightly higher.
Is your brass getting a deep gouge when mag feeding? I see people complaining that happens a lot with those rifles.
Agree on the box magazine for 6-8 rnds… I like a slim/ accurate/ light rifle…
Hornady will sell you 7mm Rem Mag because there are hundreds of thousands of rifles out there chambered for them. Get back to me when Hornady will sell you some 6.8 Western Ammo. Maybe they don't like Winchester pushing 165gr Accubond LR advertised box velocity 2,970 fps. It would be interesting for you to do a back to back velocity comparison of the 7 PRC 175 ELD-X with the 6.8 Western 165 Accubond LR. My guess is that in factory ammo the Western will slightly edge out the PRC while the PRC will have very slightly less drop and carry slightly more energy to 500 yards based entirely on SD.
Great video. I want to see you do one on your hunting pack. What kind of things go in your bag when you go on these mountain or plains hunts? I would love to see what you deem necessary or good as back ups, and I think it would do a lot of new hunters some good to see what to bring and what you probably shouldn't bring. Thanks!
If you want to compare with the 7rem mag, use the 162 eldx precision hunter ammo at 2975 for the rem mag compared to the 175 eldx on the 7 PRC at 2800. The 7 rem mag will have almost identical ballistics if the 7 PRC is only shooting 2800. But then again, the precision hunter ammo for th7mm rem mag is proably shooting slower as well. Seems like the 7 PRC should produce better long range accuracy theoretically at least in factory rifles.
My 280AI will beat 2,800 fps with a 162 ELDx rather easily with a 20" barrel.
@@texpatriot8462not with factory ammo it wont
@@texpatriot8462 "My 280AI will beat 2,800 fps with a 162 ELDx rather easily with a 20" barrel." You would need more like 2975 with the 162 eldx to match the ballisics of the 7 PRC shooting a 175 eldx at 2800.
Everyone's doing their part to push the seven PRC
3000 fps at the factory was achieved using a premium action and 24 inch barrel. Knowing Hornady from their podcasts, it would have been a Proof Research or Bartlein barrel.
So, the big stink was started recently by BackfireTV showing Jim shooting a 7 PRC and getting MV of around 2800 fps. No telling the length of the barrel he had. Others are saying why didn't Hornady come and say this. Well, they did state that they can no longer get the powder to get that speed for now. How much more full disclosure can they give? I say, if a guy hates Hornady, then quit buying from them. By the ammo and cartridge you like somewhere else and enjoy life instead of making everything a confrontation.
So, I also respect Ron's data here, too. It is also data, just as much as Jim's or any of the other people claiming to get 3k fps. Why not change the box? Box 3k fps is the spec.
I agree, 7 PRC and 7 RM will do nearly the same thing. I happen to like the 7 PRC for the heavier bullets and I look for impact performance as a hunter.
Another thing about the case capacity is with the longer high BC bullets the case capacity is reduced on the 7mm Rem Mag when the bullet is seated deeper in the case. That idea of case capacity would only be correct using light bullets that did not get seated deep in the case.
Need to get u some of those ludicrous expensive shoot n see targets. Seems lately you'd benefit from them.
Just don’t get the Chinese made knockoffs as another video showed how crappy they were.
How about a video on what powders we do have available?
And where to find data on some of these new powders in some of our older cartridges (257 wheatherby, 264 winchester) and the lack of data available for the older cartridges.
Im betting there is more 257 wheatherby and 264 winchester than 7mm PRC. Maybe not but you get my point.
3rd video I've seen where 7mm PRC is getting box posted velocities. John Mc Adam's, Ron Spomer and Joseph at handloader TV. All original ammunition. Must be the powder.
Hey Ron, you mention recent issues with the Pro Chrony, have you tried applying the "photo box"-method? Where you place a box-like structure around the sensors, and the "roof" of that box being semi-opaque and placing LED lights on top, making sure you get the same lighting conditions at the sensors, whatever the weather?
Guessing Hornady paid for this comparison.
Be interesting if someone else would make a load for this caliber that isn't a Hornady bullet?
Spot on. A larger and larger percentage of Hornady's focus is now simply marketing and we know how repeated marketing can "bend" facts.
Other companies do load for the 7 Prc
Ramshot magnum is hard to find. I have 1-8 twist 7 rem mag and I hand load. PRC has more free bore if I looked at the dimensions correctly.
Stopped at sports store and this was the lot number of the 7PRC 180 ELD Match #3231744, just FYI. They have had 7PRC in stock every time I stop.
Hornady seems to be loading for most cartridges but not the 6.8 western. Why is that? Thats what got some people saying hornady was not correcting the velocity numbers on the 7 PRC to 2800fps, because if they did, the 6.8 western would also perform close to the 7 PRC.
Something that should be considered is the manufacturers. Ive seen people have a couple hundred fps difference with the same load between two rifles, and the shooter found the slower rifle had more generous tolerances lowering pressure or allowing more gas to blow by.
Cmon! The variation in all aspects of shooting PRECLUDES a " standard" or " uniform" result from ANYTHING. Sight it in and chrono. Live with it
Great video!!! Thank you!!!
I'm in this for SHTF, so I care not about velocity or the latest craze. Give me the tried and true, most available rounds like .22lr, 308, 5.56 and 9mm. Availability is the name of the game, for me.
It would also all be the first ammo gone when something happens and less common rounds will be left un touched
Is it stressful living in fear every day?
Another Great Video Ron 💯💥💥💥💥💥💥💥
Well heck, I may not ever feel comfortable taking factory ammo to the deer woods again. I mean, I don't want to hear a big buck complain the bullet that hit him was traveling 100 fps slower that what appeared on the box.
Those are shooting great velocity wise. With the high BC bullets at those velocities, the 7 PRC is quite amazing. Close to 1500 ft-lbs of energy out to around 900 yards! (5000 ft elevation, 40 degrees)
Yes, but only an idiot would shoot at deer as such a range
Shooting great? 😂
If Hornady changes the powder and it impacts the velocity, they need to change the box and website velocities or they are committing fraud.
@@MrHf4l LOL. Not accuracy wise, velocity wise. I was thinking, for that expensive of a rifle, it doesn't shoot great groups.
@@texpatriot8462 "If Hornady changes the powder and it impacts the velocity, they need to change the box and website velocities or they are committing fraud." Totally agree.
If you know your velocities, the rest is easy to figure out. The problem is not with what the velocity numbers are. They are what they are. If someone likes the performance (or performance capability), they'll buy into the cartridge. The problem lies with what is posted on the box vs what the chronograph is saying. Miraculously, Ron's chronograph is within reasonable numbers. Everyone else is averaging 150fps slower. Ron mentioned that the 7 Rem Mag was dialed back from it's original velocities. So, did everyone keep the old velocities posted or were they adjusted? He used Rem Mag box posted velocities to argue the PRC's case. That's the point..... You can't use the PRC's box posted velocities to argue a point because 99.8% of people aren't getting those numbers. Federal can get those numbers. Hornady can't, but they're still printing them on the box. Hornady..... Post the velocities for the powder you're using. When you change back, adjust accordingly. From a non reloaders (not me) perspective, it looks bad on the 7 PRC and it looks bad on Hornady. That's the way I see it.
7:04 I don’t know Ron, doesn’t seem to take long to get that magazine out, lol.
Love your work. (Not much confidence in these chronographs)
Barrel length vs what some others have tested with? The Waypoint is 24"
Hi Ron. When you gonna shoot the 6.5-300 weatherby mag. Do some data on it. I would appreciate it.
Is there any change in the rifle/case to withstand 65k psi vs 61k or how do they decide the max pressure?
How does the 264 win mag compare
Get Garmin Xero C1 or FX True Ballistic, would be precision numbers
Looks like the rifle shot okay, but i have seen Ron get better groups with other rifles. Of course a handloader can experiment with powders, seating depth, etc. to tune loads for the rifle. Not crazy about the magazine. A flush fit style peobably would not ratttle like that. And a hinged floorplate definitely does not rattle, and likely weighs less.
The only PRC that interests me is the 6.5, mainly because i might compete with it. I beither need nor want the power level of the 7mm or 300 PRC. If i need more oimph that the 30-06's and 308's i have (and stock 8x57) or the 7mm-08 i am going to get, i will go 338 Federal or 35 Whelen. But i doubt i will get that far into it. I just enjoy different rifles and cartridges. I got an 8x57 (Yugo M48) years before i got my first -06, which seemed vaguely un-American. But i had 1 308 already and got another one the following year, so i was okay. And i already had a 30-30 and some other stuff. Now i just need a 300 Savage, a 348 Win, a 38-55, a 25-06, a 45-70, and......and......
I’m just not riding the PRC bandwagon. There are plenty of current cartridges out there that already do everything these “new kids” claim to do. The 260, 270, 280 AI, 6.5x55, etc. All great super flat shooters, with incredible reloading capabilities.
PRC was designed to run longer bullets in weights higher than 175 in factory guns. 7mm mag in order to run longer bullets in the 180-190 class you had to have a gunsmith ream n chamber your barrel. Simple concept
What about other ammo that has 300fps extreme deviation?
This is why I hand load.
If I buy factory ammo, I usually pull and reload it.
I wonder if ron can get a different lot number new ammo to see how bad it really is.
I think it takes more than one 3 shot group per loading to find the right cartridge.
When I first started playing with S&W .460 mag, I was convinced that Hornady had a proprietary powder. I couldn’t get the 2300 that Horrnady was bragging about, still don’t understand what’s going on.
What's the tolerance of the chrono? 1% is 30 fps.
all those speeds acceptable if want more consistent loads then dont rely on factory ammo. as usual social media rubbish complaints.
How'd you get a Waypoint in 7prc?
Different batch numbers too science is key
@7:00 the mag drops 🤣
Very nice rifle. Unfortunately the dang things are getting way to overpriced much like everything else. Blue collar man can't even afford nice things anymore. We used to though. People don't forget
Now Ron, don’t let your practical data get in the way of a good agenda out here on social media lol
Try my factory ammunition it just does break 2700fps i would be glad to send it to you
Excellent non-bias evaluation Ron. Cheers
As I have said before, I will say it again... The 7PRC either shoots fast but not accurate or accurate but not fast... 1inch at 100yards is not doing it anymore in the 21st Century. Hand load and drop the speed by 150-200 fps. You'll shoot 1/2 inch, 100yard groups all day long .
The BOSS -equipped A-Bolt stainless Stalkers from 1990 were getting sub 1/2" groups in almost all chamberings...
Ron, thank you for mentioning the magazine!!!!
If SA built this rifle with a hinged floor plate, I’d have bought one by now.
If they can't get the advertised velocity, change the writing on the box to reflect the lower velocity .
Many thanks. Well done as always.
Is the 7 PRC what the 7mm 06 would be