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Thanks for this well-presented and important background information on this event. My father Lt "Buzzy" de Kock, 4 squadron SAAF, was part of one of the attacking squadrons. His log book is open on my lap and reads. 22nd April. Take off time 07.30. Airborne for 2hrs 30 mins. Just a few words as was the rule with log books: " 10 miles east of Tunis. 20+ A/A ( anti aircraft fire) reported. Squadron score 9 ME 323 's destroyed.....self: 1 ME 323. Lt Steele missing believed safe" And that's it. He didn't like to talk about it and was convinced that the one he shot down had a platoon of Wermacht soldiers on board who pointed their tommy guns out the window shooting at him and he maintained one could very easily get hit by one of these things so they may have been slow but it was nervy stuff. It was his 25th sortie on his only tour of 100 and his only aircraft victory, 4 squadron mainly doing bombing and strafing. He admitted he was shit scared at the time and did not feel good about the ending of other young men's lives who probably had the same goal as him ...to return to their families and girlfriends. He returned to his girlfriend...my Mother "Doe", which is the reason you can read his account from their son.
@@EmilPozarphoto They probably let the earlier missions go ahead and waited for the Gigant mission before attacking. So not to alert the Germans to the cracking of the enigma.
They didn't need any decoding given the loss of so many resources in North Africa. Modern wars too a great deal petrol, lubricants, ammunition and spares. Supply was one area both the Pacific and European was demonstrated the Axis suffered in. Reports of large amounts of German armour parked because of lack of fuel meant the Germans would need to either attempt to resupply by sea and/or by air. Since they lacked transport aircraft with speed and maneuverability if they could be caught they would be easy targets for fighters. The British had picket ships, subs and even spies among the fishing fleets all over the Mediterranean. By this time they had the upper hand in supplies and units available. That said many lives were lost in 1942 trying to get documents, machines and coded messages to use back at Bletchley Park in breaking the Enigma code. The raids on Norwegian ports provided a great deal of resources for those breaking the codes. Then shipping losses began to reach critical proportions and the British got more desperate. All kinds of gimmicks were used for breaking the various Enigma codes, each military branch had their own distinct machines and codes plus the Abwehr had their own as well. Even unbroken coded messages were helpful as information could be pieced together after the fact to figure out what could have been said. In 1942 a series of cross channel ports were raided just in the hopes of grabbing Enigma material. For these raids a cover had to be created as if any hint was left that a code might be compromised the Germans would move on to the next code. That's the think that made the Enigma battle a full length battle during WW2. The disastrous raid on Dieppe was one such raid which resulted in thousand of Canadians lost or taken prisoner. It was incidentally the first time US troops saw any action at all, a small group of 50 US Rangers also landed. All the while the raid was going on specially trained commandos made their way to the harbour shed to get the machine and any paperwork. They were also instructed a skilled Enigma operator would be a great prisoner if possible. All the combined "pinched" material was a big help breaking Enigma codes in 1942 making 43 a much better year. With the losses in the north Atlantic at critical levels in 42 it was the only real time the war was close to being lost.
@@CalibanRising this is the case, at least outlined as such in An Army at Dawn, Atkinson, R. 1st volume of the Liberation Trilogy. Its were I first read of this Operation Flax. The detail from Ultra was down to what were the manifest of the transport ships and the highest value ones targeted. Also too in later air attacks on these transports the Ju-52s got the smackdown - literally. In one account of an engagement of the 18th the shallow water "The sea turned red, circled by oily debris" when Ju-52s full of crews smashed in the beach level water. Slaughter, as you said.
It's funny to me that WWII Germany never quite figured out that bigger isn't really better in most cases. The Bismark and Tripitz sinking, the Me 323 being a giant sitting duck, the Tiger tanks and Elephant Tanks being so big that their drive shafts constantly failed and they were too big to cross most bridges, etc. Idk. Just seems like a recurring theme.
This by a large chunk (To stay on topic) was down to who ordered the machines. The intellectual qualities of the Nazi leadership were easily overrated. They often didn't really think in practical terms, rather symbolism. That being said, Bismarck and Tirpitz were planned and built in a time when planes weren't the threat they would become only a few years later, so having a big battleship cutting supply lines by its mere presence in the Atlantic did make sense. HMSs Rodney and Nelson weren't short of size and heavy guns either and Yamato and Musashi even outdid the Nazi battleships in size, so on water, Nazi gigantomania was still kind of sane. The Me 323 definitely overstretched the range of what was really manageable reliably with those day's technology.
if there is inadequate air superiority, any large military transport will be a sitting duck . imagine if c-5s undertook a similar mission in wartime without an escort of f-15s or f-16s nowadays
My late uncle a Luftwaffe Paratrooper was in such a position landing in a JU52 at Malememe Airfield,Crete May 1941 a hail of 303 bullets hit the Cockpit killing the crew and raked the cabin,he lost his left leg but survived the war.
@@redtobertshateshandles Agreed as the fuselages were fabric over wood and steel to keep the weight down but nevertheless they were a flight engineering marvel!
My family lost nobody in WW1 but it was a different story in WW2 we lost 7 dead, 5 in Europe, 2 in Malaya three of the my deceased uncles died at Arnhem one in a shot down in flames Dakota actually on German film,we also lost a sailor in peacetime when HM Submarine M1 sank with all hands off the Isle of Wight after a collision with a Swedish Freighter in 1925,he left a pregnant widow and his daughter never saw her father,she passed away aged 85 in 2010 and i took over from her as keeper of our family history.
Always had a soft spot for the Kittyhawks. Probably obsolete against the best German fighters , didn't detract from the brave aircrew that used them to a great effect in North Africa
Whilst I understand the definition of “Massacre” to fit the circumstances it strikes me that the word is usually applied to a mass killing of defenceless people or animals, in this case I think annihilated would be more fitting, the ME 323 might have been a transport aircraft, slow and lumbering, not exactly manoeuvrable and little to no defence, but it was still a military aircraft of the enemy and therefore a legitimate target, in my opinion “massacre” should be reserved for incidents and actions such as the cold blooded killing of unarmed P.O.Ws at Malmady, the student riots in Tiananmen Square China, the ethnic cleansing between the Serbs and Croat people etc etc, sorry but that is just an old mans opinion.
I see your point. To be honest I went with that particular word to align with the similar event known as the Palm Sunday Massacre, 18 April also called the Palmsonntag Massaker auf Deutsch.
There was another incident I remember reading about where Beaufighters encountered a formation of JU-52s that had missed their fighter escorts over the Mediterranean Sea. I only have a very vague memory of the story. Out off some 16 planes, only 2 Junkers reached their destination. Sadly I don't have the book anymore, so I can't look up details. I remember the British called it the Junkers Party. If you could find infos about that story it would be very interesting, too! However, those stories show that Luftwaffe didn't have the means to really support such long range air transport missions. The 109 simply wasn't suitable for long distance, the 110 was no fighter, the 190 wasn't available in sufficient numbers and Luftwaffe just lacked a fighter to fill that gap. That´s what I think doesn´t receive enough attention as being an advantage of the Allied air forces: The multitude of designs available to them provided a good tool for all jobs.
I remember reading about that , it's fifty years ago now . Can't recall much of the details but seems to me it said that the beaufighter was not very effective with escorted planes and usually sent looking for light shipping or ground transport . But they ran across the German planes accidentally and anything in front of them could be in big trouble
In the end, it was also a game of numbers: Germany lacked both the resources and the required workforce to compete with the number of planes and other materials the US factories churned out. On top of that, the US also managed to up the number of pilots trained - they had the first crude flight simulators, which lessened the risk for novice pilots, and made it cheaper and faster.
@@outinthesticks1035 Yepp. The Beau wasn't fast and not highly manoeuvrable but robust and packed a mighty punch. Definitely a fighter for the big prey! Good you remember that story, too. That means I'm not as daft as I feared! 😆
@@Misophist In the early phase of the war the Nazis attacked with the advantage of numbers and lost in the Battle of Britain. France is a special case, they had the technology and economic power to build an air force capable of defeating the Luftwaffe, Morane-Saulnier, Bloch and Breguet also had fighter designs on offer that would have been deadly opponents for the 109 E2 and E3 versions in service when France was attacked. France just had wasted all their money on real estates while Hitler had read a book by Colonel de Gaule about mobile and agile tank warfare. Poland still had a biplanes only air force, the Benelux were too small to cope with an attack in any meaningful way. France's oldtimers in the government added much to the Nazi's successes in war. Moreover the backbone of the Luftwaffe's fighters, the 109, had loads of shortcomings and was in decline of its usability after the F version, an ever more demanding on the pilot and unwieldy handling plane that should have been replaced. Messerschmitt tried, but kept designing air racers instead of fighters. Me 209 and 309 were utterly totally useless. Actually a rather mediocre manufacturer who had happened to have one good idea, which was taking the design for a Rolls Royce Kestrel powered plane by a Finnish and building it. A bit like some TV shows that are on air way too long Messerschnitt just didn't see when it was time to call it quits. The 109 sold by price, not quality. Besides the economic power of the allies, this was a deciding factor in the air war.
They were compelled to fly supplies in as submarines operating out of Malta had taken a severe toll on the shipping convoys from Italy. . I'd read that they also flew troop reinforcement's in by these planes, having poor defensive capabilities, the troops had tried defending the planes with their personal arms. This might have been on a different day, but the result was the same.
That's an interesting point. Did the Allies plant agents to be captured just to protect Ultra intel. Doesn't seem unlikely at all, perhaps a bit coldblooded though.
@@CalibanRising the allies got pretty good at deception during the war, like e.g the invasion in Normandie. I'm pretty sure they would go to great lenghts to protect the ultra intel
Judging from the British fixation for the smaller .303 bullet in their early Spitfires and Hurricanes, the Germans thought their huge size made them difficult to shoot down, enabled by the fact they were fabric covered, not all aluminum, which made their airframe less prone to catastrophic loss to bullet holes in their skin, as the aluminum aircraft's structural strength is enabled by the aluminum skin itself. Adding to their cargo vulnerability was the 50 cal. guns used in the South African's P-40's as well as the later up-gunned Spitfires with 20mm canons. It is ironic how the division between the RAF's Fighter and Bomber Command resulted in their bombers staying with their beloved .303's instead af allowing their bombers to be better protected with heavier fire power.
It was just logistics and the necessity of wartime. There were already production lines set up to make .303 machine guns and their ammunition, production problems had been solved, and the supply chain existed, so that's what we used. Also, ramping up production numbers was really just a matter of duplicating existing facilities, which is far simpler than introducing new ones for an unfamiliar item. It's a massive undertaking to set up factories and production lines for a new gun and the logistics chain to support that, even more so at a time when every resource was stretched to the limit, so it simply made sense to use something we already had and which we knew worked. RAF command knew that heavier guns were needed but we didn't have a fully developed gun until later, and you can't just wish something like that into existence.
Not particularly. The only advantage the 50 cal had was in range, higher velocity meant further travel before the bullet started to drop. Actual impact damage wasnt that different and had a penalty in number of rounds fired as well as a weight penalty. The RAF decided the loss of agility and range wasnt worth a 20% increase in lethality, it was better to jump straight to 20mm which allowed explosive shells, three times the damage of a 50 cal and if you limited it to 4 x 20mm you were carrying less weight than 6 x 50cal and ammunition. The bomber fleet stayed with .303 because rear gunners were more useful as observers to dodge incoming attacks, firing guns destroyed the gunners night vision and if he did have to fight then firing range in the dark was basically at knife fight range so blasting a lot of lead and maximising hits on a briefly visible target or scaring off the attacker was more useful than a chance of maybe getting more damage. Which of course went out the window when the Germans went to schrage musike. But with night fighters one of the more useful bits of kit was rear facing radar, which the GErmans countered by homing in on that radar. The gun was sometimes the least useful bit of equipment in the rear turret.
@@voiceofraisin3778 Some later production Lancasters were up-rated to .50 mgs, with the rear turret swapping 4x 303s for 2x .50 mgs. Also some Spitfire marks carried 2x20mil cannon & 2x .50mgs.
These transport missions were costly to the Luftwaffe's airlift capability. Losing a lot of aircraft and pilots. Also remember that the Battle of Stalingrad was going on at about the same time as this, and Luftwaffe transport aircraft would eventually face a lot of losses. The air service was stretched out heavily with such high demands that it put into frontline service their instructor pilots for the Tunisian airlift campaign. Lots of them would be killed here. It's like Panzer Lehr where the German army, desperate for panzer crews, pressed into frontline service a bunch of their instructors. Instead of training replacement panzer crews for the future of the German army, the instructors were grouped into one formation, Panzer Lehr. Though very well trained and experienced, they almost all got killed in Normandy 1944.
The Stalingrad Kessel surrendered on Feb 2nd but apart from some holdouts that was it but the Luftwaffe Airdrop had failed long before then as that winter was particularly cold and the losses high.
And while these aircraft were hauling supplies to North Africa, Field Marshall Paulus over in Stalingrad was getting no supplies. The German supply transports were just not up to the two simultaneous jobs put on them.
It wasnt even the job. The Germans were obsessed with combat strength Their best people went into fighter squadrons, the squadrons were organised so the 'experten' took the lead and got the kills. Further down the priority list you got the bomber and liason pilots. transport was reserved for the lowest ranking men in a class or people who had failed in other roles. Anyone with any pride fought to get out of transport, there just wasnt any drive to improve systems or methods until it was too late in the war. There certainly wasnt any drive to increase the transport fleets size which is why they were drafting in recon and bomber planes to try and supply Stalingrad.
Some lovely nostalgia for me there with footage from IL2 46. Must be time-consuming to fly and record from the various sims (two in this vid?) and then edit the recordings into the narrative - salute!
thank you for telling us about an interesting event I had never before heard of. Among other things it shows that the Nazis were not as efficient in organizing their operations as they were cracked up to be.
@@touristguy87 The main reason the axis lost the war is because even with control of Europe they had at most 40% of the resources and manpower (including Japan). Another is that the 'arsenal of democracy' was out of reach of long range bomber aircraft.
I interview Veterans with my organization Veterans Voices of Canada. I spoke with Stocky Edwards who flew Kittyhawks against and attacked this mission. Unfortunately,he didnt talk about it until we had finished our interview on camera...but spoke about it during our lunch. He only said it was a massacre and the Gigants again,were only sitting ducks.
My father in law was in 5 squadron and credit with 2 ME 323 that day and he never spoke about it. He did share other exploits but never about this particular action.
@@condor4679123 I'd imagine these airmen wouldn't have felt good about shooting down fellow airmen, especially ones in transports who were pretty much defenceless.
I watched a documentary about this mission. I revolved around one of the crew members of that flight but sadly, I can't remember the actual name of the Doc.
The Axis' HQ's mindset was a little too optimistical about Luftwaffe's cargo capacity, in SCW they've carried troops and supplies for the nationalists pratically untouched...but this wasn't that kind of war anymore! DAF now had modern and FAST fighters, that could destroy everything the Axis could send so it was probabilly an expected outcome.
Towards the latter stages of the war in North Africa, the Allied air forces had steadily grown in strength. When Axis forces finally surrendered in Tunisia, they'd grow even more to be strong enough to start waging these massive air campaigns. They did so in preparation for the invasion of Sicily inflicting high losses on the Luftwaffe. Adolf Galland got sent down to the area to resolve the situation, and he was totally shocked by it all. The scale of operations dwarfed anything he saw before, and he had been fighting at the Battle of Britain, too. The situation down south had been so bad that Germany was diverting all its new fighters to this theater. From here on in 1943, the western Allied air forces would get too strong. The bleeding of the Luftwaffe to dangerous levels would begin here, in the Mediterranean Theater.
Well done! Another good work. Enjoyed your dry wit eg 9:45. 😂 Another topic worth covering is Catapult Hurricanes off CAM’s. A perilous mission. Good luck
The North African and Mediterranean campaigns, taken together, were like a gigantic arm-wrestle for ultimate control of the European war's pivotal centre. Whilst we're all familiar with Crete, the desperate battle for Malta, and the land campaigns from Egypt to Morocco, it's episodes Ike these which are so fascinating. I never knew of this until today (nor the Palm Sunday massacre, either). It's accounts like this which Fill the taps in the history books. Many thanks, and the graphics really bring the account to life.
A ME 323 almost intact has been found lying off N Sardinia in 35M water one of two shot down May 1943 there are plans to raise it plus the search for its partner goes on.
I am willing to wager that the departure of the Ju-323s from Italy was already known by British Intelligence in Bletchley Park days before they were even airborne and en route. This would explain why the Ju-52s were pretty well ignored, and the main cargo planes (i.e. Rommel's supplies) were the primary targets. Ultra intercepts were the main reason that the only supplies that Rommel ever got that year were what washed up on the beaches.
the most likely course change is technical issues the loss of 2 planes before take off will sugest others may fail in route so he might have gone for land quickly
14:00 "Caliber" is a size unit, so saying a gun is 150 mm caliber is like saying it's 150 mm inches. Caliber is a size unit often used for the diameter of a gun but isn't really used for anything over an inch.
@@CalibanRising I think they were featured spuriously in the film Valkyrie - in reality I believe it was another P-40 squadron who attacked Stauffenberg's column? Those shark mouths look cool though. . .
So many miss communications, info was slow and it caused massive missed opportunities and missed defensive actions, but the bravery, determination and pride got these men through so that we could have our freedoms here in the USA, forever grateful to all who served and those who serve today. 🙏🇺🇲
SAAF Right on Didn't know they fought I'm 61 and watched the World At War and Victory At Sea series twice. I didn't know Britton an aircraft carrier off the coast of Japan till two months ago.
My dad's uncle (mother's brother) flew with SAAF No1 squadron. They were involved in intercepting a supply flight. He was credited with 1-1/4 kills that day.
Great video, well explained good content. P.S. Minor point, "Oberstleutnant", and "GeneralOberst" (Lieutenant Colonel, Colonel General), the colonel bit is pronounced Oh-Bear-st.
Would the result have been any different if they flew at night? The landing strip could have been lit.I'm not sure if the allies had nightfighters in North Africa in early 43.
Those 323s just scream "giant target with all the durability of a gasoline-soaked box kite in a lightning storm." I can't imagine how anyone could expect to use them in combat under anything but the most desperate circumstances. Sad.
Good video, just my opinion you could do away with the CGI and use more archived footage. Well researched and well spoken which cannot be praised enough.
Thanks for watching Jim and for your feedback. I'd love to use more archive footage, but unfortunately most of the good stuff would set me back $100s per video, if not $1000s. Couldn't find any public domain Me 323 stuff apart from the photos.
@@jimdavison4077 There's one still shot from American Heritage WWII (Sulzberger) that shows a 323 in-flight engulfed in flames. Its plenty frightening to think about.
There were several examples of Germans turning traitor and doing things that aided the Allies. Though I rather doubt that was the case here, I think it should be considered. We'll never know for sure though.
@sim.frischh9781 "True, but "Mücke" can also mean "fly". The German word for "mosquito" is "Moskito", as in the TA 154 "Moskito", Germany's own "wooden wonder".
Before strangling names a dozen times, learn their pronunciation at Forvo. The 'ie' in Fieseler and Riese is pronounced like 'ee'. Oh, or like 'ie' in piece. Obvious, isn't it?
I find it amazing to consider how much fuel would have been used by the Germans even if their planes hadn't been shot down. Over 100 planes in the air? That must have been hundreds of tonnes of fuel to power their planes.
A BF-109 took 400 litres in internal tanks + 300 in external. 100 aircraft x 700 litres max is 70k litres. At 0.79kb / litre, that's 55300kg for BF-109 assuming they have been all full at takeoff.
Lots of myths built around Rommel. He was not the commander in North Africa. He was only the commander of the DAK which consisted of 2 panzer divs and 1 motorised div. He got his orders from he Italian commander as the DAK was only on loan to the Italian's and had to follow orders from the Italians. same as the BEF in France got its orders from the French. The Italians had 5 armoured divs and 30 inf divs in north Africa and did most of the fighting backed up by Rommel. Rommel used captured British tanks when he could get them and if he couldnt get British tanks he used Italians tanks as he found the German tanks were rubbish and only used them if he had no choice. Only battles Rommel ever won was when he outnumbered the British by over 100 to 1 in tanks. IE when he 1st arived in Africa he only had 1 panzer div. it took him 3 months to beat 22RTR which only had 10 matlida tanks and 1 battalion of infantry. Not 1 of the British tanks was lost but rommel lost all his tanks and had to rely on the Italians to push back the retreating western desert force. The rest of western desert force had been withdrawn to go to Greece which was 7th armoured and 4th Indian divs. When Richard O'conner was commander of western desert force he had 25k men and 100 tanks and took on and beat the Italian army of 2 million men and 500 tanks and in 3 months captured 250k prisoners and took out 400 tanks. he wanted to continue his attack and capture Tunis and Tripoli and he was only about 2 to 3 days away from it when he got ordered to stop his attack. he refused and wanted to carry on but got removed from command for disobeying orders. 7th arm was told to leave its tanks were they were and get on trucks and head to Alexandria then take 10th arm tanks and head to Greece. 10th arm was supposed to head to the front to get 7th arm tanks but never got there as the trucks were oredered to leave them and go and get 4th indian and bring them back to be sent to greece. So when Rommel arived only 22RTR was on the front line with 10 tanks and a battaliian of infantry to defend the entire front. Rommel couldnt even beat them. They just did a slow withdrawal to give Tobruk time to be reinforced. 22RTR with its 10 tanks took out 200 German tanks and 500 Italalion tanks with 0 losses to its own tanks. But Rommel was able to capture all of 7th arm tanks that had been sat in the desert waiting for 10th arm to pick them up. so Rommel grabbed them and put German markings on them as they were the only tanks he could get that could take on the British tanks. Funny thing is my dad was in the BEF and 7th armoured. He left his tank at Dunkirk and got it back in Africa after he found it and removed the German markings from it. Rommel found his tank in France and took it to Africa with him and he got it back from Rommel lol.
Rommel got extracted from Africa, but Paulus had to stay in Russia. It's no wonder the Germans ended up with such poor morale-no one at the top taking any responsibility.
Thanks for sharing. Air power played a significant role in the interdiction of supplies to the Afrika Korps. I used to know a chap who flew Beaufort torpedo bombers out of Malta. Many of his missions target those supplies, but he also managed to use his combination of luck and talent to play a key role in sinking the Italian cruiser Trento. His war memoirs are now published as "The Last Torpedo Flyers".
I have read an account by one P40 pilot involved - he wrote that it was the only time in the war he ever felt any sympathy for the enemy as the slaughter was great and from his perspective, utterly one-sided! But he felt that only for short time!
One of The saddest thing that i ever heard from the tunisia evacuation was the situation with the fighter squadrons They were of course ordered to retreat to airbases in sicily The mechanics and ofher ground crew had no ride so alot of the pilots flew them out in the storage compartments in their 109s Of course that ment they couldn’t practically pull high g aggressive manoeuvres. Alot of the 109s were shot down and alot of pilots refused to abondon their passengers and bail out. I read this in Franz Stiglers parts of the “A higher call” Its a great book
I'm just about to start that one. It's been on my list for a while and I recently read a comment on FB calling Stiglers a fraud. Gotta check that claim out.
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Thanks for this well-presented and important background information on this event. My father Lt "Buzzy" de Kock, 4 squadron SAAF, was part of one of the attacking squadrons. His log book is open on my lap and reads. 22nd April. Take off time 07.30. Airborne for 2hrs 30 mins. Just a few words as was the rule with log books: " 10 miles east of Tunis. 20+ A/A ( anti aircraft fire) reported. Squadron score 9 ME 323 's destroyed.....self: 1 ME 323. Lt Steele missing believed safe" And that's it. He didn't like to talk about it and was convinced that the one he shot down had a platoon of Wermacht soldiers on board who pointed their tommy guns out the window shooting at him and he maintained one could very easily get hit by one of these things so they may have been slow but it was nervy stuff. It was his 25th sortie on his only tour of 100 and his only aircraft victory, 4 squadron mainly doing bombing and strafing. He admitted he was shit scared at the time and did not feel good about the ending of other young men's lives who probably had the same goal as him ...to return to their families and girlfriends. He returned to his girlfriend...my Mother "Doe", which is the reason you can read his account from their son.
did this mission have a name? those dinos had terrible defensive measures
I don't think that this mission has a particular name, at least not in English.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if the Allies knew the details of the resupply mission via the Enigma decodes.
I think you're right that the Allies were well aware of the situation and I wouldn't be surprised if Ultra was behind it.
@@CalibanRising for sure
@@EmilPozarphoto They probably let the earlier missions go ahead and waited for the Gigant mission before attacking. So not to alert the Germans to the cracking of the enigma.
They didn't need any decoding given the loss of so many resources in North Africa. Modern wars too a great deal petrol, lubricants, ammunition and spares. Supply was one area both the Pacific and European was demonstrated the Axis suffered in. Reports of large amounts of German armour parked because of lack of fuel meant the Germans would need to either attempt to resupply by sea and/or by air. Since they lacked transport aircraft with speed and maneuverability if they could be caught they would be easy targets for fighters. The British had picket ships, subs and even spies among the fishing fleets all over the Mediterranean. By this time they had the upper hand in supplies and units available. That said many lives were lost in 1942 trying to get documents, machines and coded messages to use back at Bletchley Park in breaking the Enigma code. The raids on Norwegian ports provided a great deal of resources for those breaking the codes. Then shipping losses began to reach critical proportions and the British got more desperate. All kinds of gimmicks were used for breaking the various Enigma codes, each military branch had their own distinct machines and codes plus the Abwehr had their own as well. Even unbroken coded messages were helpful as information could be pieced together after the fact to figure out what could have been said. In 1942 a series of cross channel ports were raided just in the hopes of grabbing Enigma material. For these raids a cover had to be created as if any hint was left that a code might be compromised the Germans would move on to the next code. That's the think that made the Enigma battle a full length battle during WW2. The disastrous raid on Dieppe was one such raid which resulted in thousand of Canadians lost or taken prisoner. It was incidentally the first time US troops saw any action at all, a small group of 50 US Rangers also landed. All the while the raid was going on specially trained commandos made their way to the harbour shed to get the machine and any paperwork. They were also instructed a skilled Enigma operator would be a great prisoner if possible. All the combined "pinched" material was a big help breaking Enigma codes in 1942 making 43 a much better year. With the losses in the north Atlantic at critical levels in 42 it was the only real time the war was close to being lost.
@@CalibanRising this is the case, at least outlined as such in An Army at Dawn, Atkinson, R. 1st volume of the Liberation Trilogy. Its were I first read of this Operation Flax. The detail from Ultra was down to what were the manifest of the transport ships and the highest value ones targeted. Also too in later air attacks on these transports the Ju-52s got the smackdown - literally. In one account of an engagement of the 18th the shallow water "The sea turned red, circled by oily debris" when Ju-52s full of crews smashed in the beach level water. Slaughter, as you said.
It's funny to me that WWII Germany never quite figured out that bigger isn't really better in most cases. The Bismark and Tripitz sinking, the Me 323 being a giant sitting duck, the Tiger tanks and Elephant Tanks being so big that their drive shafts constantly failed and they were too big to cross most bridges, etc. Idk. Just seems like a recurring theme.
Fun to think about but what if our British and American grandfathers had been killed during this battle?
NONE OF US WOULD BE HERE !!!! 😂
This by a large chunk (To stay on topic) was down to who ordered the machines.
The intellectual qualities of the Nazi leadership were easily overrated. They often didn't really think in practical terms, rather symbolism. That being said, Bismarck and Tirpitz were planned and built in a time when planes weren't the threat they would become only a few years later, so having a big battleship cutting supply lines by its mere presence in the Atlantic did make sense. HMSs Rodney and Nelson weren't short of size and heavy guns either and Yamato and Musashi even outdid the Nazi battleships in size, so on water, Nazi gigantomania was still kind of sane. The Me 323 definitely overstretched the range of what was really manageable reliably with those day's technology.
A compensation for something else rather small. 🤣
if there is inadequate air superiority, any large military transport will be a sitting duck . imagine if c-5s undertook a similar mission in wartime without an escort of f-15s or f-16s nowadays
The jagdpanzer elephant did one thing and did it well unfortunately that one thing was for it’s transmission to catch fire.
If only one of the Gigants had survived the war, they would’ve been quite a sight at any air show or museum!
Only a wing spar remains. Same with the condor. A loss to history
Yes. Like Zeppelins. I'd love to see one!
I have a hard time imaging a worse fate than sitting in a transport that gets shot down
My late uncle a Luftwaffe Paratrooper was in such a position landing in a JU52 at Malememe Airfield,Crete May 1941 a hail of 303 bullets hit the Cockpit killing the crew and raked the cabin,he lost his left leg but survived the war.
Worse fate is surviving impact.
12,000 litres of fuel. That's a torch. 🔥
@@redtobertshateshandles Agreed as the fuselages were fabric over wood and steel to keep the weight down but nevertheless they were a flight engineering marvel!
My family lost nobody in WW1 but it was a different story in WW2 we lost 7 dead, 5 in Europe, 2 in Malaya three of the my deceased uncles died at Arnhem one in a shot down in flames Dakota actually on German film,we also lost a sailor in peacetime when HM Submarine M1 sank with all hands off the Isle of Wight after a collision with a Swedish Freighter in 1925,he left a pregnant widow and his daughter never saw her father,she passed away aged 85 in 2010 and i took over from her as keeper of our family history.
Always had a soft spot for the Kittyhawks. Probably obsolete against the best German fighters , didn't detract from the brave aircrew that used them to a great effect in North Africa
Proud to hear that our South African Squadrons made their presence felt!!!
And they were deadly Boet!
@@CalibanRising The South Africans were very good at being nasty to their black population.
Apartheid squadrons 😡
@@destroyerarmor2846 technically no. Apartheid not a thing yet. At this point in history the USA had worse segregation laws.
@@DocTommy1972 let it be, argue with a fool and get beaten by their experience.
Whilst I understand the definition of “Massacre” to fit the circumstances it strikes me that the word is usually applied to a mass killing of defenceless people or animals, in this case I think annihilated would be more fitting, the ME 323 might have been a transport aircraft, slow and lumbering, not exactly manoeuvrable and little to no defence, but it was still a military aircraft of the enemy and therefore a legitimate target, in my opinion “massacre” should be reserved for incidents and actions such as the cold blooded killing of unarmed P.O.Ws at Malmady, the student riots in Tiananmen Square China, the ethnic cleansing between the Serbs and Croat people etc etc, sorry but that is just an old mans opinion.
I see your point. To be honest I went with that particular word to align with the similar event known as the Palm Sunday Massacre, 18 April also called the Palmsonntag Massaker auf Deutsch.
My dad landed in Algeria with Operation Torch, and fought the rest of the war all the way to Czechoslovakia.
36 division from Texas
There was another incident I remember reading about where Beaufighters encountered a formation of JU-52s that had missed their fighter escorts over the Mediterranean Sea. I only have a very vague memory of the story. Out off some 16 planes, only 2 Junkers reached their destination. Sadly I don't have the book anymore, so I can't look up details.
I remember the British called it the Junkers Party. If you could find infos about that story it would be very interesting, too!
However, those stories show that Luftwaffe didn't have the means to really support such long range air transport missions. The 109 simply wasn't suitable for long distance, the 110 was no fighter, the 190 wasn't available in sufficient numbers and Luftwaffe just lacked a fighter to fill that gap. That´s what I think doesn´t receive enough attention as being an advantage of the Allied air forces: The multitude of designs available to them provided a good tool for all jobs.
Thanks for the suggestion. I'll see if I can find that story.
I remember reading about that , it's fifty years ago now . Can't recall much of the details but seems to me it said that the beaufighter was not very effective with escorted planes and usually sent looking for light shipping or ground transport . But they ran across the German planes accidentally and anything in front of them could be in big trouble
In the end, it was also a game of numbers: Germany lacked both the resources and the required workforce to compete with the number of planes and other materials the US factories churned out. On top of that, the US also managed to up the number of pilots trained - they had the first crude flight simulators, which lessened the risk for novice pilots, and made it cheaper and faster.
@@outinthesticks1035 Yepp. The Beau wasn't fast and not highly manoeuvrable but robust and packed a mighty punch. Definitely a fighter for the big prey!
Good you remember that story, too. That means I'm not as daft as I feared! 😆
@@Misophist In the early phase of the war the Nazis attacked with the advantage of numbers and lost in the Battle of Britain. France is a special case, they had the technology and economic power to build an air force capable of defeating the Luftwaffe, Morane-Saulnier, Bloch and Breguet also had fighter designs on offer that would have been deadly opponents for the 109 E2 and E3 versions in service when France was attacked. France just had wasted all their money on real estates while Hitler had read a book by Colonel de Gaule about mobile and agile tank warfare. Poland still had a biplanes only air force, the Benelux were too small to cope with an attack in any meaningful way.
France's oldtimers in the government added much to the Nazi's successes in war.
Moreover the backbone of the Luftwaffe's fighters, the 109, had loads of shortcomings and was in decline of its usability after the F version, an ever more demanding on the pilot and unwieldy handling plane that should have been replaced. Messerschmitt tried, but kept designing air racers instead of fighters. Me 209 and 309 were utterly totally useless. Actually a rather mediocre manufacturer who had happened to have one good idea, which was taking the design for a Rolls Royce Kestrel powered plane by a Finnish and building it. A bit like some TV shows that are on air way too long Messerschnitt just didn't see when it was time to call it quits.
The 109 sold by price, not quality.
Besides the economic power of the allies, this was a deciding factor in the air war.
They were compelled to fly supplies in as submarines operating out of Malta had taken a severe toll on the shipping convoys from Italy. .
I'd read that they also flew troop reinforcement's in by these planes, having poor defensive capabilities, the troops had tried defending the planes with their personal arms. This might have been on a different day, but the result was the same.
Are you saying that German soldiers were shooting their rifles out of the 323 against the enemy fighter planes?
Spies in a monastery...or a cover story for Ultra intel?
Partisan priests?
That's an interesting point. Did the Allies plant agents to be captured just to protect Ultra intel. Doesn't seem unlikely at all, perhaps a bit coldblooded though.
@@CalibanRising
the allies got pretty good at deception during the war, like e.g the invasion in Normandie. I'm pretty sure they would go to great lenghts to protect the ultra intel
Judging from the British fixation for the smaller .303 bullet in their early Spitfires and Hurricanes, the Germans thought their huge size made them difficult to shoot down, enabled by the fact they were fabric covered, not all aluminum, which made their airframe less prone to catastrophic loss to bullet holes in their skin, as the aluminum aircraft's structural strength is enabled by the aluminum skin itself.
Adding to their cargo vulnerability was the 50 cal. guns used in the South African's P-40's as well as the later up-gunned Spitfires with 20mm canons.
It is ironic how the division between the RAF's Fighter and Bomber Command resulted in their bombers staying with their beloved .303's instead af allowing their bombers to be better protected with heavier fire power.
Design and manufacturing delays, the Achilles heel of many a nation
It was just logistics and the necessity of wartime. There were already production lines set up to make .303 machine guns and their ammunition, production problems had been solved, and the supply chain existed, so that's what we used. Also, ramping up production numbers was really just a matter of duplicating existing facilities, which is far simpler than introducing new ones for an unfamiliar item.
It's a massive undertaking to set up factories and production lines for a new gun and the logistics chain to support that, even more so at a time when every resource was stretched to the limit, so it simply made sense to use something we already had and which we knew worked.
RAF command knew that heavier guns were needed but we didn't have a fully developed gun until later, and you can't just wish something like that into existence.
Not particularly. The only advantage the 50 cal had was in range, higher velocity meant further travel before the bullet started to drop.
Actual impact damage wasnt that different and had a penalty in number of rounds fired as well as a weight penalty.
The RAF decided the loss of agility and range wasnt worth a 20% increase in lethality, it was better to jump straight to 20mm which allowed explosive shells, three times the damage of a 50 cal and if you limited it to 4 x 20mm you were carrying less weight than 6 x 50cal and ammunition.
The bomber fleet stayed with .303 because rear gunners were more useful as observers to dodge incoming attacks, firing guns destroyed the gunners night vision and if he did have to fight then firing range in the dark was basically at knife fight range so blasting a lot of lead and maximising hits on a briefly visible target or scaring off the attacker was more useful than a chance of maybe getting more damage.
Which of course went out the window when the Germans went to schrage musike.
But with night fighters one of the more useful bits of kit was rear facing radar, which the GErmans countered by homing in on that radar. The gun was sometimes the least useful bit of equipment in the rear turret.
@@voiceofraisin3778 Some later production Lancasters were up-rated to .50 mgs, with the rear turret swapping 4x 303s for 2x .50 mgs. Also some Spitfire marks carried 2x20mil cannon & 2x .50mgs.
These transport missions were costly to the Luftwaffe's airlift capability. Losing a lot of aircraft and pilots. Also remember that the Battle of Stalingrad was going on at about the same time as this, and Luftwaffe transport aircraft would eventually face a lot of losses. The air service was stretched out heavily with such high demands that it put into frontline service their instructor pilots for the Tunisian airlift campaign. Lots of them would be killed here.
It's like Panzer Lehr where the German army, desperate for panzer crews, pressed into frontline service a bunch of their instructors. Instead of training replacement panzer crews for the future of the German army, the instructors were grouped into one formation, Panzer Lehr. Though very well trained and experienced, they almost all got killed in Normandy 1944.
The Stalingrad Kessel surrendered on Feb 2nd but apart from some holdouts that was it but the Luftwaffe Airdrop had failed long before then as that winter was particularly cold and the losses high.
And while these aircraft were hauling supplies to North Africa, Field Marshall Paulus over in Stalingrad was getting no supplies. The German supply transports were just not up to the two simultaneous jobs put on them.
It wasnt even the job.
The Germans were obsessed with combat strength Their best people went into fighter squadrons, the squadrons were organised so the 'experten' took the lead and got the kills.
Further down the priority list you got the bomber and liason pilots.
transport was reserved for the lowest ranking men in a class or people who had failed in other roles. Anyone with any pride fought to get out of transport, there just wasnt any drive to improve systems or methods until it was too late in the war.
There certainly wasnt any drive to increase the transport fleets size which is why they were drafting in recon and bomber planes to try and supply Stalingrad.
check you dates - the battle of Stalingrad ended 2 month earlier
stalingrad was over by feb 1943 the last airport a month before that
War is a madman’s game where the pawns are sacrificed on mass for the kings 😢.
Some lovely nostalgia for me there with footage from IL2 46. Must be time-consuming to fly and record from the various sims (two in this vid?) and then edit the recordings into the narrative - salute!
Yes, it's becoming a full time job! Luckily I get George to do most of the flying for me while I get the shots.
thank you for telling us about an interesting event I had never before heard of. Among other things it shows that the Nazis were not as efficient in organizing their operations as they were cracked up to be.
@@touristguy87 The main reason the axis lost the war is because even with control of Europe they had at most 40% of the resources and manpower (including Japan). Another is that the 'arsenal of democracy' was out of reach of long range bomber aircraft.
I interview Veterans with my organization Veterans Voices of Canada. I spoke with Stocky Edwards who flew Kittyhawks against and attacked this mission. Unfortunately,he didnt talk about it until we had finished our interview on camera...but spoke about it during our lunch. He only said it was a massacre and the Gigants again,were only sitting ducks.
My father in law was in 5 squadron and credit with 2 ME 323 that day and he never spoke about it. He did share other exploits but never about this particular action.
@@condor4679123 I'd imagine these airmen wouldn't have felt good about shooting down fellow airmen, especially ones in transports who were pretty much defenceless.
Shoutout to the guy who parachuted out the moment the transports turned south at 7:06
lol
Great video, love finding out things about the war I never knew before.
Thanks for watching
I watched a documentary about this mission. I revolved around one of the crew members of that flight but sadly, I can't remember the actual name of the Doc.
The Axis' HQ's mindset was a little too optimistical about Luftwaffe's cargo capacity, in SCW they've carried troops and supplies for the nationalists pratically untouched...but this wasn't that kind of war anymore! DAF now had modern and FAST fighters, that could destroy everything the Axis could send so it was probabilly an expected outcome.
Towards the latter stages of the war in North Africa, the Allied air forces had steadily grown in strength. When Axis forces finally surrendered in Tunisia, they'd grow even more to be strong enough to start waging these massive air campaigns. They did so in preparation for the invasion of Sicily inflicting high losses on the Luftwaffe. Adolf Galland got sent down to the area to resolve the situation, and he was totally shocked by it all. The scale of operations dwarfed anything he saw before, and he had been fighting at the Battle of Britain, too.
The situation down south had been so bad that Germany was diverting all its new fighters to this theater.
From here on in 1943, the western Allied air forces would get too strong. The bleeding of the Luftwaffe to dangerous levels would begin here, in the Mediterranean Theater.
Start by getting the name correct - it was the Gigant!
Well done! Another good work. Enjoyed your dry wit eg 9:45. 😂
Another topic worth covering is Catapult Hurricanes off CAM’s. A perilous mission. Good luck
Thanks CT. Yep, I have the Hurricats on my to do list. That's a crazy story!
Great video! These giants don't get much attention. I like to call them Pugs due to them being chubby and having a flat nose haha
Fantastic video. Love learning about battles that are not really talked about . Thank you for your time
Glad you enjoyed!
The North African and Mediterranean campaigns, taken together, were like a gigantic arm-wrestle for ultimate control of the European war's pivotal centre. Whilst we're all familiar with Crete, the desperate battle for Malta, and the land campaigns from Egypt to Morocco, it's episodes Ike these which are so fascinating. I never knew of this until today (nor the Palm Sunday massacre, either). It's accounts like this which Fill the taps in the history books. Many thanks, and the graphics really bring the account to life.
You always say: "Obstleutnant", which translates to "Fruit-lieutenant". ;-)
Amazing! 🥝
My father and uncles fought here. 28th Maori Battalion NZ.
Too many distracting references and numbers. Just tell the story.
A ME 323 almost intact has been found lying off N Sardinia in 35M water one of two shot down May 1943 there are plans to raise it plus the search for its partner goes on.
South Africans represent.
I am willing to wager that the departure of the Ju-323s from Italy was already known by British Intelligence in Bletchley Park days before they were even airborne and en route. This would explain why the Ju-52s were pretty well ignored, and the main cargo planes (i.e. Rommel's supplies) were the primary targets. Ultra intercepts were the main reason that the only supplies that Rommel ever got that year were what washed up on the beaches.
Nice view of the White Cliffs of Dover.
lol, caught me!
the most likely course change is technical issues the loss of 2 planes before take off will sugest others may fail in route so he might have gone for land quickly
Imagine putting close to a hundred fighters in the air only to have your flying gas tanks killed off one by one with no fighter cover.
Imagine being a German pilot of a Gigant when your gunner shouts "Enemy fighters!" I'd shrug and mumble, "Fuuuuuuuck."
14:00 "Caliber" is a size unit, so saying a gun is 150 mm caliber is like saying it's 150 mm inches.
Caliber is a size unit often used for the diameter of a gun but isn't really used for anything over an inch.
Thanks for the correction
Why did no one tell the 323 pilot he was goin off course?
I saw the thumbnail and was waiting for mention of RAF No.112 Squadron!
Yes, they were one of the squadrons that arrived later in the combat if memory serves.
@@CalibanRising I think they were featured spuriously in the film Valkyrie - in reality I believe it was another P-40 squadron who attacked Stauffenberg's column? Those shark mouths look cool though. . .
Wow I bet they were big fat turkeys to shoot at.
Love to see that Krautz get a pounding .
So many miss communications, info was slow and it caused massive missed opportunities and missed defensive actions, but the bravery, determination and pride got these men through so that we could have our freedoms here in the USA, forever grateful to all who served and those who serve today. 🙏🇺🇲
Why not a night supply mission instead?
I can't imagine that the cargo on 10 Ju-52's are worth sacrificing 14 Me-323's for.
SAAF
Right on
Didn't know they fought
I'm 61 and watched the World At War and Victory At Sea series twice.
I didn't know Britton an aircraft carrier off the coast of Japan till two months ago.
"Meshersmitt."
Possibly fuel consumption due to wind direction or overloading ? Or maybe the guy just needed a dump . .
It’s assumed every single M323 built was shot down.
Splendid presentation and oration 👌👍
Cheers Ian.
Bet there’s a lot of German kit in that ocean.
My dad's uncle (mother's brother) flew with SAAF No1 squadron.
They were involved in intercepting a supply flight.
He was credited with 1-1/4 kills that day.
Is there the possibility that the commander of the 323's was secretly a supporter of the Allies and acted ths way he did to support the Allies ?
Great video, well explained good content. P.S. Minor point, "Oberstleutnant", and "GeneralOberst" (Lieutenant Colonel, Colonel General), the colonel bit is pronounced Oh-Bear-st.
Es tut mir Leid 😜
Would the result have been any different if they flew at night? The landing strip could have been lit.I'm not sure if the allies had nightfighters in North Africa in early 43.
Those 323s just scream "giant target with all the durability of a gasoline-soaked box kite in a lightning storm." I can't imagine how anyone could expect to use them in combat under anything but the most desperate circumstances. Sad.
Good video, just my opinion you could do away with the CGI and use more archived footage. Well researched and well spoken which cannot be praised enough.
Thanks for watching Jim and for your feedback. I'd love to use more archive footage, but unfortunately most of the good stuff would set me back $100s per video, if not $1000s. Couldn't find any public domain Me 323 stuff apart from the photos.
@@CalibanRising I will bow to your expertise in the cost. Not as much footage of the ME 323 as many other aircraft out there. Still a very good videos
@@jimdavison4077 There's one still shot from American Heritage WWII (Sulzberger) that shows a 323 in-flight engulfed in flames. Its plenty frightening to think about.
Was fascinated by this story.
Palm Sunday Massacre
Why were they not flying at night? This was at a time when the Afrika Corps was on the defensive, they should have been more cautious.
Ah yes i remember shooting some of them from my B-24 Liberator ball turret
CoD Big Red One anyone?
Meshersmitt?!
There were several examples of Germans turning traitor and doing things that aided the Allies. Though I rather doubt that was the case here, I think it should be considered.
We'll never know for sure though.
The C130 is a direct result from the ME 323 concepts
Their mistake was going to Tunisia, rather than 400 miles to the west.
So brave to fly in daylight. Suicidal!.
The Giant at 2:02 has "Mücke" on its nose, which means "Mosquito" LOL
well it was another wooden wonder I suppose, lol
@@CalibanRising Until that massacre...
Actually it just means "fly" in German.
@@cuttlefisch No, "Fly" in german means "Fliege".
@sim.frischh9781 "True, but "Mücke" can also mean "fly". The German word for "mosquito" is "Moskito", as in the TA 154 "Moskito", Germany's own "wooden wonder".
That swastika with the palm tree marking on the tank looks so rad
12,000 litres. Burn baby burn. 🔥
Forgive me father, fort I have sinned. But then maybe not. I reported a large flight of German cargo planes to the Allies.
1st
Before strangling names a dozen times, learn their pronunciation at Forvo. The 'ie' in Fieseler and Riese is pronounced like 'ee'.
Oh, or like 'ie' in piece. Obvious, isn't it?
Thanks the feedback.
And yet today we have the C-130 and the C5 (and similar). What the differences there are, yes?
Hardly the same. Dunno what the 2nd line means.
@@mikeholland1031 Actually, it's exactly the same thing. However, you can be sure that air superiority would have been attained and assured.
@@garybrader8447 a powered glider that can barely fly is hardly the same as a Hercules or C-5.
@@mikeholland1031 They are all lightly armed cargo aircraft. Tactically, in contested airspace the situation would be identical.
@@garybrader8447 I don't agree
I find it amazing to consider how much fuel would have been used by the Germans even if their planes hadn't been shot down. Over 100 planes in the air? That must have been hundreds of tonnes of fuel to power their planes.
A BF-109 took 400 litres in internal tanks + 300 in external. 100 aircraft x 700 litres max is 70k litres. At 0.79kb / litre, that's 55300kg for BF-109 assuming they have been all full at takeoff.
@@touristguy87 I learned something on that day, didn't feel like wasting time, contrary to now
@@touristguy87 I'm too suble sometimes, I'm wasting time talking to you
@@touristguy87 okay
Lots of myths built around Rommel.
He was not the commander in North Africa. He was only the commander of the DAK which consisted of 2 panzer divs and 1 motorised div. He got his orders from he Italian commander as the DAK was only on loan to the Italian's and had to follow orders from the Italians. same as the BEF in France got its orders from the French.
The Italians had 5 armoured divs and 30 inf divs in north Africa and did most of the fighting backed up by Rommel.
Rommel used captured British tanks when he could get them and if he couldnt get British tanks he used Italians tanks as he found the German tanks were rubbish and only used them if he had no choice.
Only battles Rommel ever won was when he outnumbered the British by over 100 to 1 in tanks. IE when he 1st arived in Africa he only had 1 panzer div. it took him 3 months to beat 22RTR which only had 10 matlida tanks and 1 battalion of infantry. Not 1 of the British tanks was lost but rommel lost all his tanks and had to rely on the Italians to push back the retreating western desert force.
The rest of western desert force had been withdrawn to go to Greece which was 7th armoured and 4th Indian divs.
When Richard O'conner was commander of western desert force he had 25k men and 100 tanks and took on and beat the Italian army of 2 million men and 500 tanks and in 3 months captured 250k prisoners and took out 400 tanks.
he wanted to continue his attack and capture Tunis and Tripoli and he was only about 2 to 3 days away from it when he got ordered to stop his attack. he refused and wanted to carry on but got removed from command for disobeying orders.
7th arm was told to leave its tanks were they were and get on trucks and head to Alexandria then take 10th arm tanks and head to Greece. 10th arm was supposed to head to the front to get 7th arm tanks but never got there as the trucks were oredered to leave them and go and get 4th indian and bring them back to be sent to greece.
So when Rommel arived only 22RTR was on the front line with 10 tanks and a battaliian of infantry to defend the entire front. Rommel couldnt even beat them. They just did a slow withdrawal to give Tobruk time to be reinforced.
22RTR with its 10 tanks took out 200 German tanks and 500 Italalion tanks with 0 losses to its own tanks. But Rommel was able to capture all of 7th arm tanks that had been sat in the desert waiting for 10th arm to pick them up. so Rommel grabbed them and put German markings on them as they were the only tanks he could get that could take on the British tanks.
Funny thing is my dad was in the BEF and 7th armoured. He left his tank at Dunkirk and got it back in Africa after he found it and removed the German markings from it.
Rommel found his tank in France and took it to Africa with him and he got it back from Rommel lol.
Rommel got extracted from Africa, but Paulus had to stay in Russia. It's no wonder the Germans ended up with such poor morale-no one at the top taking any responsibility.
I wonder if Britain knew from cose breaking
Yes, ULTRA to the rescue (and doom).
Thanks for sharing.
Air power played a significant role in the interdiction of supplies to the Afrika Korps.
I used to know a chap who flew Beaufort torpedo bombers out of Malta.
Many of his missions target those supplies, but he also managed to use his combination of luck and talent to play a key role in sinking the Italian cruiser Trento.
His war memoirs are now published as "The Last Torpedo Flyers".
what is the game that he use to show the combat ?
Looks like IL2 1946?
It looks like IL-2 1946, but I could be wrong.
Yep, it's Il2 1946 in this case
I have read an account by one P40 pilot involved - he wrote that it was the only time in the war he ever felt any sympathy for the enemy as the slaughter was great and from his perspective, utterly one-sided! But he felt that only for short time!
Why were No Italian aircraft involved?
I had never heard of this.
Your narration is admirable. Thank you.
It's nice to see people still using IL-2 1946.
Why did the flight not go at night with an ETA of sunrise?
COD 2: Big Red One B-24 mission anyone?
9:18 Germans found the radio or the allies?
It was the Germans who found an Allied agent
One of The saddest thing that i ever heard from the tunisia evacuation was the situation with the fighter squadrons
They were of course ordered to retreat to airbases in sicily
The mechanics and ofher ground crew had no ride so alot of the pilots flew them out in the storage compartments in their 109s
Of course that ment they couldn’t practically pull high g aggressive manoeuvres. Alot of the 109s were shot down and alot of pilots refused to abondon their passengers and bail out.
I read this in Franz Stiglers parts of the “A higher call”
Its a great book
I'm just about to start that one. It's been on my list for a while and I recently read a comment on FB calling Stiglers a fraud. Gotta check that claim out.
A transport plane in spirit a pre cursor to c130 or c5
Gotta love confident commanders...
I love IL-2 1946
Did someone say 'Ultra'?
@9:20 - It was a coastal spy who tipped off the Allies, not Ultra.
Good work well done
Thanks for watching Harold
Oh I thought this was the Dallas air show
No, I decided not to comment on that until we knew more.
😕 promosm
There is no Tiger-4 tank.
Tiger 4? Didn't I say Panzer IV?
@CalibanRising >>> 👍👍
We cheated , we read their mail !