It really is a missed opportunity that during the nearly 10 year lifespan of Splatoon that we've not had anyway to customize our kits so many weapons can shine more compared to the fixed kits they have currently. Even if they don't incorporate it until Splatoon 4, I definitely would love for the devs to include it as a Challenges mode to get the blueprints of Splatoon 4's kits set in stone.
Would more weapons shine in a kitless system? What stops Sploosh players from dropping their weapon and just playing Splash with Curling and Hammer? And would anyone play pencil if any backline could have cooler? And it's not just main weapon diversity that might suffer: Booyah Bomb owes its life in competitive play to the Sloshing Machine's vanilla kit. Without restrictions there's a risk the meta becomes even more over-centralized as comp players choose only the best mains, best subs and best specials.
@@brendandefrancisco5817 tbh I'm not sure how much it speaks for anybody else, but I think it'd give more opportunity for people who enjoy a main weapon's strengths to be able to use it in more ways. Just off your example I genuinely prefer Sploosh as a main weapon, so there'd be no reason for me to switch off to Splash, Aerospray, or any other shooter, since I feel like I could make up for the Sploosh's weaknesses or enhance its strengths better.
I feel one advantage that the current kit system has is being able to identify what kit a weapon has at a glance. Once you've spent enough time with the game, you'll know most if not all of the weapon kits, and subsequently, you can divise a strategy to fight against the enemy team. Whereas with custom kits, you may have to spend more time figuring out what your opponents are using, whether that's looking at the map screen for longer, or seeing your opponents using their subs and specials for the first time. I still want custom kits though.
this!! the devs might have to add another UI element to counteract this-maybe something like the gear abilities when you pull up the map?-but that's a bit clunky. theoretically, it means you wouldn't have to learn kits as a newcomer, but it's still clunky and probably the best criticism of custom kits
@Zehmaskedman doesn't it only show kits of teammates, not your opponents? Honestly I don't remember because that part of the map isn't something I've looked at in ages
Custom kits would definitely be interesting because like you said, it would be amazing for casual, but then in comp everyone would just be running OP kits on OP weapons, I do think it would be really fun though. (I think your solution with picking 3 subs and specials is perfect for the game, I even thought about it one time)
Nintendo should honestly reach out to this man cuz these ideas are actually genius, or reach out to its fanbase as a whole cuz some of the best ideas come from fans
i also can't help but imagine that without any degree of control on the dev side of things, it wouldn't exactly be sunshine in casual either. the first thing that came to my head is an aerospray running tenta missiles. that's not competitively viable right now, but causally it could be absolutely infuriating. (admittedly the problem is that tenta missiles exists in the first place, but yk) i like the idea of limiting the options a bit for that reason. i also think limiting the options would be helpful, because can you imagine the decision paralysis as a new player opening the game and having SO MANY combinations and options? admittedly they could put an unlocking system on the specials and subs too, but the game is already hard enough to get started in.
Yeah this is probably the biggest counter point, its THE reason custom kits in general are seen as a bad idea, charas compromise idea is good on paper for sure but im sure at some points the devs will put a great special with a great sub on a great weapon, and thus a meta will form, and now there will be even more of a cancerous boring metagame where everyone picks only 1-2 types of sub, special and thus exclude all the weapons without those options.
@@DanielGonzalez-kj5zr I mean to be fair the idea he gave in this video is literally everybody's first idea when asked "what's a good middle ground between custom and set kits"
i would love it too but i doubt the devs would allow that. they don’t want twitter mobs of people being like “look at this clip of zipcaster dapple please put it in the game”.
I think one issue with custom kits that isn't talked about is readability, the way kits work is very intuitive, you can see a teams composition and immediately know what subs and specials you're up against.
@@hentloll1370 Yeah but that isn't really what I'm talking about. When I say instant I mean instant. No 2nd guessing you see x weapon you know everything about it as soon as you see it
@@NCozy Oh definitely. That said, if the subs/specials are restricted to only a few, it wouldn't be too hard to memorize the combos. Additionally, maybe they could also add stickers of the sub/special below the weapon icon, similar to how the brand sticker shows under the weapon icon.
I think having 2 subs for each weapon (R or L to use) and having one be a bomb and one be a utility sub would really help with kit balancing. I think it could help with advertising for splatoon 4 too because every weapon would have 4 aspects- the main, sub, secondary sub, and special.
I’ve thought about that once, it could be cool. Though it might be awkward to press the L button as your brain is typically mapped to “right side of the controller is for attacks” and being able to throw a utility sub with a side of the controller that’s always used for movement or communication could be odd. Love the idea tho
Custom kits sound good a paper but again competitive would just have the same specials and subs with just different weapons which isn’t saying much. I always thought about the idea of having a set amount of subs and specials even before Splatoon 3, it just makes so much sense that way it feels more flexible and caters to almost everyone.
Everybody will always be running the same things in competitive, though, that's just how top level works. The reason why this idea would improve competitive is it would improve _main weapon_ diversity, which we don't have a lot of right now.
Honestly I feel like diversity would improve because even if there is a set meta that everyone generally follows, you're going to have more options within it and to fight against it. rn you have to work hard to not have a comp without pencil or zooka, but at the very least even if you are stuck on pencil you get an option for if you want to run something like fizzy, suction, or burst for variance in playstyle, and if you're stuck on zooka duty you're not just resigned to shot, you can pick any viable short range panting option and probably be able to build a comp around it. I feel like I'd heavily prefer that to just "you will run a pencil/shot/squeezer comp or you lose" even if fundamentally not much has really changed.
The simplest balancing for a custom kits system I haven't seen anyone talking about before is to have each special and sub weapon have custom points for special and ink cost for each weapon. This would be a lot of work, yes, but honestly it seems like less work for Nintendo if making weapon kits is apparently THIS hard for them. They obviously have the resources to pump out over triple, maybe quadruple the weapon kits per update/season, but they just don't for... Some reason??? If they really hate making weapon kits that much, then surely a pre-set, easy to tweak system of each weapon having specific costs for each special and sub that is set in stone from launch and never needs to be updated would be far more appealing to them, right?
sometimes simplicity is a strength. in theory it would be foolproof, yes, but the sheer amount of individual possibilities they'd have to account for just means its way more likely they'll mess some of them up. not to mention how much memorization & adaptation that would require on the player's perspective, and how many variables the devs would have to keep track of while balancing. it would slow everyone down.
It isn't hard, they just can't be bothered and seem to be relying on a randomizer and calling it a day. I've felt like there's a second green team getting attention over the people who actually try to make good maps and kits and giving the game the proper work in. How many times have the trailers shown better kits and maps by now? I understand this happens all the time, but it feels they are intentionally lying because of how consistent it is.
I've actually suggested something similar to your partially-customizable kits solution for a potential ARMS 2, specifically by giving each character the choice to equip 2 of 6-9 ARMS (the equipment). This would increase individuality between the characters on the roster rather than just letting each character use every ARMS with only their abilities & stats being the unique differentiating factors.
ARMS already has this as an unlockable option. however, having more options right out of the gate, would be a great way to revitalize the franchise (it’s also why competitive arms died because it takes too long to unlock everything for TO’s there’s an article online about this)
So many people have commented based on the title and not watched the video to its end. Towards the end, chara suggested a semi-custom kit system where, based on your weapon, you get a pick of a couple of subs and specials, and the choices you can pick from expand as the game goes on. That would somewhat mitigate the potential issue of the homogenization of kits, since people will just pick the most broken kit combo under a fully custom kit system. There's your TL;DW because a lot of people DW lol
I think there's also an issue here with overwhelming new players. For example, the Splattershot Jr is such a great starting weapon because it consistently has one of the simplest subs and specials and that makes it a great tool for learning the game. If new players have to deal with making their own kits on top of everything else, it could easily alienate them.
I really like the idea of being able to choose based on a couple of given choices. It’s much better than the current system and it can allow for kits that’s aren’t too broken by giving players balanced options! (I do like being able to have a kit that I enjoy while having a skin for the weapon that matches my outfit haha)
All I know is I'd like a system more akin to loadouts, where each weapon has 3 different subs and specials, and you can mix and match them. For example, Roller in Splatoon 3 has Curling/Beacon for subs and Big Bubbler/Kraken for specials, you could mix it up and have a Roller loadout, with Curling and Kraken, or Beacon with Big Bubbler That way not Every weapon has burst bombs, but each weapon feels like you have kits to experiment with.
Oh yeah, Chara kind of talks about it, but I was also thinking, that weapon skins, could be something one could pull from the shellout machine if they brought it back for the next game, so the main weapon still has something to customize and now just subs/specials
I guess without kits updates would be pretty dry though - I don't know what else they'd use as the majority of the update. The option you presented would be nice but I think the majority of players wouldn't see much substance to the updates
I mean, itd force them to add new weapons and specials at a more aggressive rate. It could also mean they can start working on new subs cause when was the last time that happened
They would definitely have to do more stuff but honestly that might be better. I've played a lot of Salmon run in S3 and I feel like modes like that and tableturf could add a lot more. That and we could also get a few more new main weapons or new subs or modes? There's a lot of areas S3 lacked in update content they could do without kits being a huge deal.
I feel like they'd be able to flesh out more aspects of the game that aren't exclusively kits though. Salmon Run could get new content, they could rework/tweak ranked modes, more gear/fashion, and even in the case of DLC they'd probably have a few extra hands on deck to help flesh out an expansion.
OMG IS THAT THE MESSENGER OST WWWWWWW Also good video I think there are a lot of interesting ideas that could definitely work better than the current system here And I love the kit names at 3:00 lol
They're probably using set kits to prevent choice overload, at least that's my hypothesis for one of the reasons for locking on set kits for 3 games in a row. Having a fully custom kit experience could be overwhelming for someone playing casually, or for the first time. So your middleground option is really interesting in that aspect too; you have just enough liberty, but you're not overwhelmed with options. As others said, I'm sure they'll use side order as a test of that for future iterations of the game, or I hope so lol Great video as always Chara!
Like you've presented, I think a middle ground makes the most sense. One thing the video doesn't bring up is the potential for custom kits to overwhelm casual players; if they're presented every option for every weapon, they'll probably just pick the safest/most powerful-looking options. I think it's healthy for the game to sort of prod you into trying out weirder subs and specials like toxic mist and splattercolor screen; if the kits were more limited I think it'd be much less intimidating - like a "sure, why not" response. Either way, great topic.
Also if branded weapon skins became an unlockable thing, they should just axe the "put a sticker on it" ones. I'd love to see them look more like the Kensa kits, where their design is still recognizable but neatly matches the brands' signature style - Forge weapons would have a 'tacticool' aesthetic, Inkline would take after outdoors gear like carabiners and portable stoves, Annaki weapons could have a DIY beat-up look to it...etc etc etc.
i feel like they should do what pokemon unite does and allows you to pick between 2 sub weapons and 2 specials. It can even be shown by adding some decorations to show what things it has on the actual weapon and of course an indicator that shows them too so you dont have to stare at the gun to know
Actually, I really quite like the idea of it changing different decorations on weapons. Like maybe in some weird world where different branding stickers etc instead of being tied to the main weapons, instead is tied to the sub weapon. And maybe the core colour scheme indicates the special weapon. The weapon skin then is still tied to the kit, while permitting more flexibility.
I have never been a fan of this system since I started playing Splatoon. To me, it always felt like I was being treated like a toddler and it was always disappointing to see weapons getting very little to work with either because they don't get third kits and/or stuck with terrible kits. Splatoon 3 has really highlighted how archaic this kit system has become. For me last year's fresh season was what broke the camel's back for me, my favourite weapon sploosh basically got slapped with one of the worst kit synergies in splatoon history.
Off topic, but as much as I like the Catalog system I wish their was more reward for completing it. It would be a cool idea to release all previous (and unavailable like the cool capes) campaign gear and jp exclusive and hopefully collab gear (Squid Girl my beloved) into the Catalog as reward for playing the similar to Halo MCC's system.
i think your idea for the kits is something i never thought of but its a great idea! i like the addition of the brand lore with the specials, i think the sev team could do a lot with it
Kinda surprised you left out one of the reasons for why the kit system is how it is: Predictability. When getting into any match, you can glance at the weapon composition for any team and already expect what they can and cannot do. Splatoon is a fast game and you can't really use any amount of time to, for example, stay in spawn and memorize what kit anyone in a match is using. Something like this works in games like Dota 2 and League of Legends because those games are much slower paced. You get to see what they're going for in terms of itemization way before they can actually get to use them, while the characters themselves have their skills set in stone, with the only choice there being what the player prioritizes getting on every level. How could that be mitigated? Probably by giving some more time before every match to see what everyone is running. The 3-set sub and special system could help on getting used to certain combinations with experience, but that would be something that could easily take time for better players and be completely overwhelming for newer ones. Still: As long as it isn't some system where people can just pick whatever they want, then I would be alright with it. So long as people don't go around running only lethal bombs and the obviously good specials, then I'm up for it, because you can't really talk about influencing variety while you know people will clearly gravitate for the best options.
I guess this would make it hard to identify your team mates and opponents specials/subs when match first starts if each kit has 3x3 different options. Cant decide of thats a good or bad thing though?
Expanding on the compromise idea a little, I think it would be nice if you could choose any sub and any special for a weapon. No restrictions at all. Just so people can have fun using them with friends. For tournaments (official or unofficial) a rule can be made that you can only pick the subs & specials that are available in public lobbies. Dunno how good this idea truly is, but I think it’d be pretty cool.
an alternative to adding 4 or 5 sub/special choices per is to make entirely separate groups of three for new weapon brands so, for example, the standard splash-o-matic could have burst bomb/beakon/splat bomb and the Crab Tank/Trizooka/Ultra Stamp, while the Neo Splash-o-matic could have suction bomb/autobomb/point sensor and Triple Inkstrike/Kraken/Booyah Bomb, allowing for multiple forms of customization without leaning too far into infinite variations
This also means Nintendo can get away with releasing only two variants of a main weapon since you would already have like 18 unique combinations to choose from, compared to 3 at best.
Surprised to see you with this take - I thought I’d always love the kit system until fairly recently, when exactly the points you brought up started to creep in. I like the compromise idea, it would certainly work, but quite frankly I think I’d just love to see them actually balance custom kits. If they needed to replace burst bomb with a more unique (and less busted) rework, I wouldn’t mind. It would force them to buff subs like sprinkler or else nobody would pick them. I’m hoping with all this buzz about custom kits that we’ll see it in 4. I do have more hope now than I did before.
I doubt they'll ever do custom kits outside of DLC. For one, Nintendo likes to build on what worked previously, and nowhere is this more apparent than in the main campaign. Octo Expansion worked, so let's make Splatoon 3's main campaign exactly like that. So expecting them to rock the boat that much for the main multiplayer component, even with a middle ground solution, is probably expecting too much. For the other, they first have to actually be under the impression that there is a problem with the current system, which I don't think they are. Kits make up the majority of the content of the updates, and are basically zero effort additions from a technical standpoint. It's basically free content.
I like your the solution you gave because while there would still be guessing whether or not your main gets a solid a sub or specials to choose from, you at least have other options and aren't screwed over. Something I want to add is that maybe badges and titles could somehow incentives players to test different kit options (ex: you can get badges for using range blaster with burst/wave breaker, burst/kraken, and curling/missiles). Also for anyone who might think you won't be able to clearly tell the sub and specials with anything other than preset kits, the map shows them next to the main weapon.
I started playing Splatoon with 3 with no prior knowledge of the series. When I heard a "custom splattershot junior" was being added in chill season, I thought "oh cool, people will be able to put whatever kit they want on the Junior, that's cool". Then chill season came around. My disappointment was immeasurable, and my day was ruined.
To your point about neo sploosh/dapples with beakons: The whole point of the weapon is to be aggro. Beakons allow you to instantly flank (if the enemy team doesn't notice and destroy the beakons). This is especially true for the dapples: tacticooler + beakon = basically instant recovery from death.
Maybe the weapon skins could be tied to the specials and let you switch out the sub with one from a different kit, e.g. Ttek would always have tri-strike, but you could replace it’s splat bomb with vshot’s suction bomb.
Here's my solution to Custom Kits's problems Just straight up make custom points for special for every kit in existence and balance them each patch Is it a lot of work? Yeah but it would massively help maintain the balance+custom kits would be much easier to keep
A lot of work? Much closer to an impossible workload. That's around 1200 combos you need to make, before you even consider factoring in subs. Then you need to keep track of the usage statistics of all of those combos and balance them accordingly. That just won't work.
But then something like N-Zap with Burst and Tac could make that combo broken, so they would have to make it 220p. And then if you wanted to run brella or something with burst and tac, then ur just screwed.
Half the kits are literally just the devs going “alright, it’s a fun main with a fun special, now what’s the *worst* possible sub we could give it…” or vice versa between the sub and special.
This is definitely how it should be done If we want to keep the second kit skins in a way that would make sense, they could add second kits as specialty kits that are meant to be really strong (but can't be altered), and only add to the vanilla weapons' kits when a completely new sub or special drops. Of course, the kits probably won't be strong enough for it to be worth it.
I really like your new system at the end, Chara! The only problem with a new system, and why I think they haven't done a new system yet, is because kits are instantly known due to the branding. You know when you spawn in that the Tentatek Splattershot has Splat Bomb and Tristrike. You know this because every Tentatek has this. I think they need a new system for having kits be identifiable by teammates and allies. Otherwise, who's to say if your team in solo queue is running 1 or 3 Tacticoolers. You won't know if that Slosher has Trizooka until it shoots you with it for the first time in the match. There would be a certain fear of the unknown at the start of every game, and while that might be fun, I think the devs are trying to avoid that. Great video! Hopefully Splatoon 4 has an even better system than we expect.
I would love the mix and matching idea. It is also one of the things Ive been wanting for a while. Although I’ve also heard people say they don’t like it because they wouldn’t be able to know what kind of special they would be bringing but I think this could easily be resolved with a new UI system where it show both weapon, special and sub weapon the person has mixed and matched. I really hope this idea becomes a reality for Splatoon 4 or even 3 as some sort of big quality of life updates (they could just merge current weapons kits and let us pick which sub and special we want)
I'm going to say that kits are not a bad thing but I personally have thought for a long time that we should have each weapon have three pre-selected subs and three pre-selected specials that you can switch in between for an individual weapon to give way more variety and control to the player base, and then just having alternate weapons skins that can have all of those other abilities hopefully enough to make it to where pretty much every weapon can have any special and any sub or maybe one or two miss out on a weapon that it would just be completely broken on or whatever but that would add so much for variety and make it where we don't have to worry as much yo after actually watching the video Chara says what I've been saying for years hell yeah this is phenomenal to my ego
The semi-custom kit system sounds almost perfect to me. It gives a little more freedom to the players, but still allows the devs enough freedom to avoid broken kits to preserve the balance of the game. Having the points for special change based on what sub-special combo you choose is also genius. My biggest concern is just how to handle multiple weapon skins. My idea is that you could unlock them as you get more stars on your weapon. Maybe the second skin is unlocked at 2 stars and the third skin is unlocked at 4 stars. It would be a lot cooler of a reward for playing a weapon than locker stickers or badges. (This is also how weapon titles for splat tags should work, btw. It’s ridiculous that you have to role a gacha machine to get a splat tag title for your main. I think you should unlock the titles for each weapon at 3 stars)
5 stages of kit grief anger: "what were they thinking" denial: "these kits arent that terrible" depression: "these kits are terrible" bargaining: "maybe the 3rd kits will cook/maybe we can replace the system" acceptance: "theyre bringing kits back for splatoon 4 arent they"
I think the kit system itself is fine, but I feel like we need huge buffs to the non-bomb subs, as there are so many kits in this game that get ruined by the sub. After some sub balancing, the kit system would be fine imo.
even though I watched it when it came out, just now thinking about the ability to switch the subs and specials are a REALLY good idea. The different combos if every weapon got a 3rd kit would be amazing!
Im a big proponent of the fully custom kit idea and have been since midway through s2 where it began to really wear away at me waiting endlessly for the cool part of the game where everythings available (enough if your lucky). I did also see the brandings being used as weapon skins you could customize with stickers or alt colors too but that halfway point idea feels rhe most like a truly better second option. I was even ready to critique the suggestion thinking about the limitations of "bad choices made for the goodie bag a weapon gets" only for another elegant solution to come up in vid of different brands providing different goodie bags. This also helps in a moment to moment gameplay manner as youd still be able to see a weapon with a specific skin and think "ok enpwrry brand probably means they have this or that many special and sub combinations" helping out in the information war alongside the other mentioned points. Great idea
I think if they do decide to use something similar, they’ll merge it with the freshness system so that the more stars you have on a weapon the more subs and specials you are given to choose from. Would suck competitively but casually would be sick
If there's an option that lets us use Sheldon licences to get access to those sub and specials before reaching 5 stars, I think that would also be good.
honestly???? banger idea, limited custom kits is the way to go imo, really fun idea. Perhaps in the shops you could have sheldon's store that sells you the weapon and its base kit, then shelly/donny could have their own store that sells "kit expansion sets" for each weapon, that way it feels like you're opening new options and they can be added in updates without just Appearing
The middleground idea is such a great way to help it especially if subs and specials could be assigned different design choices or stickers that go onto the weapon and could make identifying certain combinations easier too - plus it’d just be super fun all around 🤩
Good video on the topic. I've always been a staunch defender of the kit system in this game. However for the sake of a healthier competitive scene i think the three sub three special compromise is a good idea. My problem with custom kits are these reasons: 1) i like being able to see the other team and know *exactly* what im dealing with. I see that the enemy team has these certain weapons and that im dealing with these specials and subs for the match. I think this is a positive for both solo q/casual and competitive, in casual play you dont have to find out the enemys kits through trial and error or some other means, and competitive matches dont have to spend time knowing 4 subs and 4 specials the othe team uses before any given match, what if they decide to switch in between games? (This could be banned i supposed) 2) custom kits would heavily impact match making, not so much an issue with competitive but definitely impacting the game proper. If theres a special thats really good right now like say zooka, and 50 percent of players play with zooka, youre going to experience a lot more waiting for games as the game tries to find a balanced team. The game may not even try past a certain point and you get hit with double maybe triple zooka anyway. What if the game decides to prioritize different specials over gun variety during match making? Or vice versa? A lot of speculation here i realize but there would absolutely be an impact on how the game tries to balance matches Overall im very torn on the subject, im very much for player/skill expression but i think how splatoon handles balancing matchmaking with set kits is really unique and can work well, they just need to make smarter kits in my opinion
This is something that I can also 100% agree with even on the more casual side. Having a small selection to choose from adds enough flexibility to each weapon to both be fun in casual and strong for competitive. Having new Special being added in during the game's lifespan does get a little tricky, since you can't add them onto too many older weapons. A neat little expansion to this idea could be that those extra Subs and Specials could be unlocked at fixed intervals as you level up the weapon by using it. Give it its own token system utilizing Sheldon Licenses so players can choose which new thing to unlock and use for a given weapon. You can still try out any combination in the Test Range, but I think it's a little more new-player friendly to have a base kit that players can expand on as they play the game instead of just dropping them all on them right out of the gate.
I think that one of the major underlying problems with this system is that the sub weapons are so ridiculously unbalanced. So many weapon kits just get stuck with sprinkler or line marker and are immediately doomed to never see use. Even a custom kit system wouldn't fix the state of the game completely. In fact I think it would just make the sub balance problems even more apparent. Line marker and sprinkler would no longer see any use because they can't get carried by the rest of the kit. I think that if the devs took a patch to seriously look at the state of the sub weapons and actually try to fix them a lot of the problems we have with the current kit system would melt away. The chances that a weapon gets a kit it wants would increase, not because there are more kits, but because there are less bad subs it could get. This wouldn't solve all the problems, if they still refuse to give us more than 2.5 kits a weapon a lot of kits still wouldn't see the light of day due to synergy problems. However I think rebalancing the sub weapons they have refused to touch for years is an important step no matter what kind of kit system they choose moving forward.
the three subs and specials on the weapons would be a dream come true, maybe they're gonna do it in the next game (but i really dont think they would change the system that much)
I think the sub/special pool is interesting to see. Definitely something that would be fun to play around with. Would help with balance, too, as a group of strong options for the main can be added to both pools and players can pick and choose what they prefer. Hell, even separating subs by category like 'damage', 'mobility' and 'utility' would be cool, e.g. suction, burst and beakon on shot. Opens up so many ways to play.
I really like the idea of the middle ground solution and have even thought about it myself somewhat before this video came out, my only concern is that it might actually increase the work for each weapon because you're effectively making 3 kits (kinda) for the weapon and then still 2 more in the future, I could be wrong since it all depends on if they still treat it like the kit system we have now but its interesting to think about, the current system definitely needs to go and I love hearing possible solutions like this
I had this same Idea. I think its a good middle ground between completely customizable kits and what we have now. I think it would be interesting if each main weapon was made of 3 different parts that would each look different depending on the main, sub, and special that you chose for it
its ironic when you think about it the kit system was designed to prevent people from creating overpowered combinations and thus prevent people from forming an otherwise stale and repetitive meta, and yet in the end, the kit system has created that vary same stale and repetitive meta that it was designed to avoid, due to it subsequently preventing some weapons from being viable enough, due to their lack-luster kits. mayhaps such an issue is truly impossible to prevent, for so long as their are options, its most likely that one will always be better at, at the very least something, then the rest.
Some things I’d add to a “limited custom kit” system. At first you could be given a base kit with just one sub and special, and at a later level you get either the ability to either unlock full customisation for the weapon, or unlock one sub or special weapon at a time. What’s more, this restriction could be lifted during splatfests, letting players express themselves even further, while developers get data in case they want to rearrange kits for specific weapons
One thing I like about the idea of mixing and matching between 3 different options is that they could still keep the brands associated with kits, so that when you see someone using the weapon you can still know what to expect right away (rather it being potentially anything like if we had fully custom kits). If you were going up against say a roller that could have either of its current kits, then knowing that it's krak-on with a kraken ready is extremely important, and we can still have that in this new system if it were added (we just wouldn't know whether it's beacon or curling bomb without checking the menu, something I figure is far less important than knowing the special).
I really like your new idea for kits as fully custom kits in my opinion would destroy casual play; in all 3 games there were always periods where the "strongest" weapons were way too common, and I feel like having fully custom loadouts would make the problem worse overtime as people found stronger and stronger combinations. So having certain kits the devs REALLY don't want in the game restricted instead of just giving the playerbase a very limited system is a good middleground, especially since the devs and players usually don't see eye to eye when it comes to design philosophy.
Ive seen some folks worried that custom kits would make things worse because the same specials would get picked on every weapon; I very much disagree with that being the problem The current kit system does nothing to prevent broken specials from being spammed, as we are seeing right now with tacticooler and zooka. The only thing the current system does do is restrict what main and sub weapons can be used alongside those specials. It would actually be much preferable for those specials to be on any weapon because we would atleast have way better main weapon diversity than we do now The same specials being used over and over again is a special balance issue, not a kit system issue, so it shouldnt be counted against custom kits Same goes for sub weapons, if you think that every non-bomb sub weapon would never be picked if you had the choice of having a bomb instead, maybe those non-bomb options are just too weak balance wise and are meerly being unjustly propped up by being mandatory if you want to play a certain weapon Keeping set kits for this reason is a bandaid over broken arm
Third kits would be nice, but they'd be redundant if we didn't add more subs and specials, because with how many weapons are in this game, there would be tons of kits that have similar main weapons, sub weapons, and special weapons.
I like the system you suggested! I think it's the best step forward that I've heard of at least I don't know how this would work for comp, but my frustrations with solo Q made me think that it'd be nice if you could have two weapons assigned to you and pressing the left stick down (like how you activate special with right stick) could be another way to spend your special charge to switch between them So if you had no backline in solo Q and you brought sploosh you could switch to charger if your special gauge was fool idk, funky unpolished idea
If Nintendo were to add this, they could add a drawback system, whereas if your kit is op, your main could have less ink efficiency or your special could require more points
If we're gonna have fully customizable kits, then for a compromise, that would be the path of least resistance (i.e. least restrictive compromise). I think ink consumption of sub would be primarily determined by the weapon's damage output, while points for special is based on a combination of both the range and paint output of the main weapon, (and sub if applicable). This would initially at launch and Nintendo can make adjustments if needed.
If the problem with custom kits is that you won't know their sub/special combo, you could do kind of like a team preview fashion when loading into your match. It could go right next to the banners that are currently shown when when the "before battle" fanfare is playing. You could also make that info viewable when you bring up the map, kind of like how you can see opponent's abilities already.
I think a fun middle ground would be something like having the default kits be how they are now, but rather than being brand new weapon kits per update, the new kits are unlocking one new sub and one new special for the weapon to mix and match as you said, using the new kit looks as choosable skins. It still keeps options healthily limited so that the weapons can’t just get whatever they want, but it allows more options than currently and means that if you like one part from a kit but like a different part of another, you can pick and choose. For example, you could start with just Autobomb and Reefslider on Dark Tetra Dualies, but when the Light Tetra Dualies come out with Sprinkler and Zipcaster, you could mix and match and choose Autobomb and Zipcaster. Or you know, choose Sprinkler and Reefslider if you hate winning, but it’s an option. And if you really like the current kit system of having a good and bad part of a kit, then you could do something like “if you use the matching sub and special of a kit, then you get slightly lower points for special, like -10 for a matching kit”. Then you can have the tradeoff of having the better kit that you personally work better with or being able to get your special more often at the cost of a lesser kit. And keep the kit skins separate from this, if you really like the Dark Tetra look but like the Light Tetra kit, then let you use the Dark skin without sacrificing this PFS boost. Is this perfect or even good? Probably not, but it’s how I’d personally go about it and I hope others agree with it. P.S. also I feel like they should have some seasonly vote thing ingame or on social media where people propose main/sub/special combos, and the one with the most positive reception gets added. Let all the Inklings and Octolings choose at least one of the weapons they are gonna be using, and it’d be a fun social experiment to see if people on the whole favor equal main/sub/special representation, fun and unusual kits, or competitively powerful kits more.
As a casual fan who doesn't know the full conversation... What's the feeling amongst top level about every weapon kit having a lethal bomb AND a utility sub (using the L button or something to activate)?
Another compromise I found online a while back consists of a weigh limiter system. Every main, sub and special is assigned a weight value, and the total sum cannot exceed a certain limit. This way Nintendo gets to have some control over the amount of potential a weapon gets while allowing players some level of flexibility to optimize their weapon builds. Players can still find ways to get their main weapon to be viable while requiring some level of creativity. As an example: let's say each weapon is assigned a number between 1-3 and the limit is 6. Weapons like slosher, the .52 gals or eliter gets assigned to 3 whereas Sploosh and undercover gets assigned to 1 (for now at least). Essentially kit dependent main weapons get lower weight values than main weapons that are self-sufficient. For subs, any versatile subs (a.k.a bombs) get weight values are somewhere close to 3 on average whereas utility subs are closer to 1. For specials', their weight value is inversely proportional to their level of counterplay so a special like Kraken with infinite hp is set to 3 while ultra stamp with no viable defence is set to 1. With this example, players can't run something like Slosher + burst bomb + tenta missiles but will be possible to run Sploosh + Splat bomb + trikzooka (i.e. Splat 1 Sploosh 7 kit)
I basically said the exact same middle ground idea when I was talking about it w/ friends maybe a month ago. I would absolutely love to see that in the game
Expanding on the weapon customisation there, I think there's a lot to explore! I feel updates would feel a bit lacking without new weapons, so they could make Sheldon sell weapon skins to you, instead of new weapons, they could release weapon skins every season and it could even be themed like the chirpy chips season.
I like that idea, I think weapons could have different skins depending on what is equipped, and weapons could also have exclusive specials to different subs, tying it back to gear.
Unfortunately I feel this would ultimately end up *reducing* kit variety outside of casual turf war and low ranked anarchy battles. I come from a long history of playing the hero shooter Paladins, that game features a system called talents, at the start of every game, you get to pick one of three options of a talent, which modifies how the character you picked plays in some way, where that be by increasing the amount of damage one of your abilities does while you have a particular buff active, changing the way your main weapon functions in some way, or any other number of things. For the most part, these talents have added a lot of spice to the gameplay on paper, but for as long as talents have existed, each character has really only played with one of them, a talent which is obviously stronger than the other choices which becomes the default. Occasionally, you will see 2 talents get play for the same character, but it's rare and only happens with the especially versatile characters when they have two particularly strong options to pick from. This pours even into the game's casual queue. You will see off-meta talents occasionally, but for the most part, people learn what's good and stick to it, even in casual settings. This is all to say that I feel this would inevitably happen in Splatoon as well with semi-custom weapon kits as your describe. Let's say for example that the Splash-o-Matic got access to a choice from Splat Bomb, Toxic Mist, and Autobomb, with a choice of specials from Triple Inkstrike, Killer Wail 5.1, and Big Bubbler. Even at casual levels of play, the majority of Splash-o-Matic players would immediately lock into Splat Bomb + Triple Inkstrike and never look back, save for maybe the occasional Autobomb to counter sharks. The only way to really stop this from happening would be to make every option a strong, enticing decision, such as offering the choice of Splat, Burst, and Suction bombs, with a special array of Triple Inkstrike, Crab Tank, and Trizooka, but in that case you end up with a weapon that's far too versatile and can handle almost any role given to it, an especially big issue when you can run 4 of the same weapon. Kits as they are now are definitely not a perfect system, but I do think they inject more variety into the game as they exist now. With semi-custom kits you'd, for example, never see the Splatana Stamper running Fizzy Bomb, as regardless of the Zipcaster or Crab Tank choice, the weapon will pretty much always prefer Burst Bomb. Similarly, you'd never see Ultra Stamp or Toxic Mist being used by a Mini Splatling, because every player under the sun would just play with Burst + Big Bubbler because that's just optimal for the weapon given the pool. Maybe in a perfect world where sub and special balance wasn't so completely lopsided, but in the world we exist in now, custom kits like this would ultimately result in just one kit becoming universal.
An idea I had is subs and specials could become chunks that you can spend to change a weapons kit (much like how you can spend ability chunks to change abilities on gear). When weapons first come out, Nintendo will give them a default kit, but players can still use those sub/special chunks to change them.
As a Squiffer, it’s been years and we never got an amazing kit, and with the new one I 100% agree with what you say about how hard it is for a perfect fun and good kit.
I was going that Side Order weapons would have the option to create a custom kit, sure that’d cause meta chaos (pun intended) but it’d open up so many possibilities.
Fully customizable/partially customizable kits would also worl great with the freshest fits feature, allowing you to quickly equip your preffered kit and gear for it.
My idea for something Different: Weapons, sub weapons and special weapons will all have different custom point Prices And going over budget Will either result in some penalties
Very hilarious that you made this immediately after the third kits video.
Totally unplanned too lol, scheduling got changed a bit recently 3rd kits vid was supposed to be 2 weeks ago originally. But this is funnier.
I KNOW I WAS JUST SO SHOCKED 😂
@@kirahhdropSAME BRO
My man lost hope immediately (not actually but the thought is really funny)
I loved the feeling of creating your own kits in Side Order, I hope they keep on this custom kits idea in future single players.
Yeah that would make single player much more exciting
I find it hilarious that a dlc themed around order has a kit system that's more choatic than the actual main game themed around chaos.
It's also funny how most of the kits the weapons start with are *horrible* so you're even incentivized to swap them out.
@@DiegoG2004 fr,like there's only a handful that are actually good
Love the idea, but it would make some weapons overpowered
It really is a missed opportunity that during the nearly 10 year lifespan of Splatoon that we've not had anyway to customize our kits so many weapons can shine more compared to the fixed kits they have currently.
Even if they don't incorporate it until Splatoon 4, I definitely would love for the devs to include it as a Challenges mode to get the blueprints of Splatoon 4's kits set in stone.
Its a perfect challenge opportunity right there
Would more weapons shine in a kitless system? What stops Sploosh players from dropping their weapon and just playing Splash with Curling and Hammer? And would anyone play pencil if any backline could have cooler? And it's not just main weapon diversity that might suffer: Booyah Bomb owes its life in competitive play to the Sloshing Machine's vanilla kit. Without restrictions there's a risk the meta becomes even more over-centralized as comp players choose only the best mains, best subs and best specials.
@@brendandefrancisco5817 tbh I'm not sure how much it speaks for anybody else, but I think it'd give more opportunity for people who enjoy a main weapon's strengths to be able to use it in more ways. Just off your example I genuinely prefer Sploosh as a main weapon, so there'd be no reason for me to switch off to Splash, Aerospray, or any other shooter, since I feel like I could make up for the Sploosh's weaknesses or enhance its strengths better.
I love how you used a picture of booga to represent a casual player
BOOGA REPRESENT
Niko wins
NIKO WINS !
NIKO WINS
NIKO WINS!
I feel one advantage that the current kit system has is being able to identify what kit a weapon has at a glance. Once you've spent enough time with the game, you'll know most if not all of the weapon kits, and subsequently, you can divise a strategy to fight against the enemy team. Whereas with custom kits, you may have to spend more time figuring out what your opponents are using, whether that's looking at the map screen for longer, or seeing your opponents using their subs and specials for the first time.
I still want custom kits though.
this!! the devs might have to add another UI element to counteract this-maybe something like the gear abilities when you pull up the map?-but that's a bit clunky. theoretically, it means you wouldn't have to learn kits as a newcomer, but it's still clunky and probably the best criticism of custom kits
@@novacream81 It's already there, the game shows you the weapon kits when you pull up the map...
@Zehmaskedman doesn't it only show kits of teammates, not your opponents?
Honestly I don't remember because that part of the map isn't something I've looked at in ages
@@OriginalGameteer It shows kits of opponents.
Thats a fair point, though I do think the players who will know the kits are more experienced anyway, its definetly a fair drawback though.
Custom kits would definitely be interesting because like you said, it would be amazing for casual, but then in comp everyone would just be running OP kits on OP weapons, I do think it would be really fun though. (I think your solution with picking 3 subs and specials is perfect for the game, I even thought about it one time)
Nintendo should honestly reach out to this man cuz these ideas are actually genius, or reach out to its fanbase as a whole cuz some of the best ideas come from fans
i also can't help but imagine that without any degree of control on the dev side of things, it wouldn't exactly be sunshine in casual either. the first thing that came to my head is an aerospray running tenta missiles. that's not competitively viable right now, but causally it could be absolutely infuriating. (admittedly the problem is that tenta missiles exists in the first place, but yk) i like the idea of limiting the options a bit for that reason.
i also think limiting the options would be helpful, because can you imagine the decision paralysis as a new player opening the game and having SO MANY combinations and options? admittedly they could put an unlocking system on the specials and subs too, but the game is already hard enough to get started in.
Yeah this is probably the biggest counter point, its THE reason custom kits in general are seen as a bad idea, charas compromise idea is good on paper for sure but im sure at some points the devs will put a great special with a great sub on a great weapon, and thus a meta will form, and now there will be even more of a cancerous boring metagame where everyone picks only 1-2 types of sub, special and thus exclude all the weapons without those options.
@@DanielGonzalez-kj5zr I mean to be fair the idea he gave in this video is literally everybody's first idea when asked "what's a good middle ground between custom and set kits"
@@apersonwhomayormaynotexist9868 I mean I never thought of this before so definitely not everybody 😅
I’d like a kit creator for private battle/ the sholl just to make the game feel fresh even after the update cycle is over.
i would love it too but i doubt the devs would allow that. they don’t want twitter mobs of people being like “look at this clip of zipcaster dapple please put it in the game”.
I think one issue with custom kits that isn't talked about is readability, the way kits work is very intuitive, you can see a teams composition and immediately know what subs and specials you're up against.
It wouldn't be very hard to put the sub and special beneath each player's name tbh
@@hentloll1370 Yeah but that isn't really what I'm talking about. When I say instant I mean instant. No 2nd guessing you see x weapon you know everything about it as soon as you see it
@@NCozy Oh definitely. That said, if the subs/specials are restricted to only a few, it wouldn't be too hard to memorize the combos.
Additionally, maybe they could also add stickers of the sub/special below the weapon icon, similar to how the brand sticker shows under the weapon icon.
@NCozy just look on the map 💀
“if everyone’s super… no one will be”
Not the incredibles reference 😂
splatershoot:
@@guillermocervisalmeron2209Phenomenal point.
I think having 2 subs for each weapon (R or L to use) and having one be a bomb and one be a utility sub would really help with kit balancing. I think it could help with advertising for splatoon 4 too because every weapon would have 4 aspects- the main, sub, secondary sub, and special.
I like that, would lead to more dynamic fights and options.
I’ve thought about that once, it could be cool. Though it might be awkward to press the L button as your brain is typically mapped to “right side of the controller is for attacks” and being able to throw a utility sub with a side of the controller that’s always used for movement or communication could be odd. Love the idea tho
I hope this gets added in splat 4
My brain will explode
this
since most bombs are better than most utility subs having one utility and one bomb wont be an issue
Custom kits sound good a paper but again competitive would just have the same specials and subs with just different weapons which isn’t saying much.
I always thought about the idea of having a set amount of subs and specials even before Splatoon 3, it just makes so much sense that way it feels more flexible and caters to almost everyone.
Yeah but that point is already in the game sadly, if the weapon is not as strong as splattershot its probably on low tier
Everybody will always be running the same things in competitive, though, that's just how top level works.
The reason why this idea would improve competitive is it would improve _main weapon_ diversity, which we don't have a lot of right now.
Honestly I feel like diversity would improve because even if there is a set meta that everyone generally follows, you're going to have more options within it and to fight against it. rn you have to work hard to not have a comp without pencil or zooka, but at the very least even if you are stuck on pencil you get an option for if you want to run something like fizzy, suction, or burst for variance in playstyle, and if you're stuck on zooka duty you're not just resigned to shot, you can pick any viable short range panting option and probably be able to build a comp around it. I feel like I'd heavily prefer that to just "you will run a pencil/shot/squeezer comp or you lose" even if fundamentally not much has really changed.
The simplest balancing for a custom kits system I haven't seen anyone talking about before is to have each special and sub weapon have custom points for special and ink cost for each weapon. This would be a lot of work, yes, but honestly it seems like less work for Nintendo if making weapon kits is apparently THIS hard for them.
They obviously have the resources to pump out over triple, maybe quadruple the weapon kits per update/season, but they just don't for... Some reason??? If they really hate making weapon kits that much, then surely a pre-set, easy to tweak system of each weapon having specific costs for each special and sub that is set in stone from launch and never needs to be updated would be far more appealing to them, right?
but then they have to pay people to do that in the first place which *gasp* might take new code!!!1!11 instead of reusing the code they already have
sometimes simplicity is a strength. in theory it would be foolproof, yes, but the sheer amount of individual possibilities they'd have to account for just means its way more likely they'll mess some of them up. not to mention how much memorization & adaptation that would require on the player's perspective, and how many variables the devs would have to keep track of while balancing. it would slow everyone down.
This is true but knowing the devs zap would drop usage by 2% and be given 55% ink cost suction bombs and they'd never fix it.
Could be interesting… but it’s worth noting this is presumably the animal crossing team as well. They’re probably super busy
It isn't hard, they just can't be bothered and seem to be relying on a randomizer and calling it a day. I've felt like there's a second green team getting attention over the people who actually try to make good maps and kits and giving the game the proper work in. How many times have the trailers shown better kits and maps by now? I understand this happens all the time, but it feels they are intentionally lying because of how consistent it is.
I've actually suggested something similar to your partially-customizable kits solution for a potential ARMS 2, specifically by giving each character the choice to equip 2 of 6-9 ARMS (the equipment). This would increase individuality between the characters on the roster rather than just letting each character use every ARMS with only their abilities & stats being the unique differentiating factors.
ARMS already has this as an unlockable option. however, having more options right out of the gate, would be a great way to revitalize the franchise (it’s also why competitive arms died because it takes too long to unlock everything for TO’s there’s an article online about this)
Arms deserved so much better, I hope they give it another chance next console
So many people have commented based on the title and not watched the video to its end.
Towards the end, chara suggested a semi-custom kit system where, based on your weapon, you get a pick of a couple of subs and specials, and the choices you can pick from expand as the game goes on. That would somewhat mitigate the potential issue of the homogenization of kits, since people will just pick the most broken kit combo under a fully custom kit system.
There's your TL;DW because a lot of people DW lol
This 1000% needs to be pinned.
I think there's also an issue here with overwhelming new players. For example, the Splattershot Jr is such a great starting weapon because it consistently has one of the simplest subs and specials and that makes it a great tool for learning the game. If new players have to deal with making their own kits on top of everything else, it could easily alienate them.
BOOGA IS CANON IN CHARA LORE
The "Shoot Forever" Hydra Splatling looks like a dream come true!
I really like the idea of being able to choose based on a couple of given choices. It’s much better than the current system and it can allow for kits that’s aren’t too broken by giving players balanced options! (I do like being able to have a kit that I enjoy while having a skin for the weapon that matches my outfit haha)
All I know is I'd like a system more akin to loadouts, where each weapon has 3 different subs and specials, and you can mix and match them.
For example, Roller in Splatoon 3 has Curling/Beacon for subs and Big Bubbler/Kraken for specials, you could mix it up and have a Roller loadout, with Curling and Kraken, or Beacon with Big Bubbler
That way not Every weapon has burst bombs, but each weapon feels like you have kits to experiment with.
Oh yeah, Chara kind of talks about it, but I was also thinking, that weapon skins, could be something one could pull from the shellout machine if they brought it back for the next game, so the main weapon still has something to customize and now just subs/specials
I guess without kits updates would be pretty dry though - I don't know what else they'd use as the majority of the update. The option you presented would be nice but I think the majority of players wouldn't see much substance to the updates
I mean, itd force them to add new weapons and specials at a more aggressive rate. It could also mean they can start working on new subs cause when was the last time that happened
They would have to put out actual content instead of just reskinning weapons! Oh the horror!
At the current rate of updates I doubt they'd put in the extra effort tbh. They'd probably just stick to the bare minimum we have currently
They would definitely have to do more stuff but honestly that might be better. I've played a lot of Salmon run in S3 and I feel like modes like that and tableturf could add a lot more. That and we could also get a few more new main weapons or new subs or modes? There's a lot of areas S3 lacked in update content they could do without kits being a huge deal.
I feel like they'd be able to flesh out more aspects of the game that aren't exclusively kits though. Salmon Run could get new content, they could rework/tweak ranked modes, more gear/fashion, and even in the case of DLC they'd probably have a few extra hands on deck to help flesh out an expansion.
Oliy straight up brought out the Desmos Graphing Calculator lol
I LOVE DESMOS GRAHHHHH
OMG IS THAT THE MESSENGER OST WWWWWWW
Also good video I think there are a lot of interesting ideas that could definitely work better than the current system here
And I love the kit names at 3:00 lol
I love your idea for kits! I didn't think of the pros and cons of custom kits before, so your solution is a lot better
They're probably using set kits to prevent choice overload, at least that's my hypothesis for one of the reasons for locking on set kits for 3 games in a row. Having a fully custom kit experience could be overwhelming for someone playing casually, or for the first time. So your middleground option is really interesting in that aspect too; you have just enough liberty, but you're not overwhelmed with options.
As others said, I'm sure they'll use side order as a test of that for future iterations of the game, or I hope so lol Great video as always Chara!
Like you've presented, I think a middle ground makes the most sense. One thing the video doesn't bring up is the potential for custom kits to overwhelm casual players; if they're presented every option for every weapon, they'll probably just pick the safest/most powerful-looking options. I think it's healthy for the game to sort of prod you into trying out weirder subs and specials like toxic mist and splattercolor screen; if the kits were more limited I think it'd be much less intimidating - like a "sure, why not" response. Either way, great topic.
Also if branded weapon skins became an unlockable thing, they should just axe the "put a sticker on it" ones. I'd love to see them look more like the Kensa kits, where their design is still recognizable but neatly matches the brands' signature style - Forge weapons would have a 'tacticool' aesthetic, Inkline would take after outdoors gear like carabiners and portable stoves, Annaki weapons could have a DIY beat-up look to it...etc etc etc.
@@scruffmutt I think s3 is def better in this regard than s2
i feel like they should do what pokemon unite does and allows you to pick between 2 sub weapons and 2 specials. It can even be shown by adding some decorations to show what things it has on the actual weapon and of course an indicator that shows them too so you dont have to stare at the gun to know
i just watched the whole video ignore the comment
This but simultaneously
You get to bring FOUR things into the match
Splatoon 4 funny number gimmick
Actually, I really quite like the idea of it changing different decorations on weapons. Like maybe in some weird world where different branding stickers etc instead of being tied to the main weapons, instead is tied to the sub weapon. And maybe the core colour scheme indicates the special weapon. The weapon skin then is still tied to the kit, while permitting more flexibility.
Oh no, he finally made THIS video.
the consequences of dread D and custom explo
@@somebodylikesbacon1960 Cexplo makes me sad
And crb :3
I have never been a fan of this system since I started playing Splatoon. To me, it always felt like I was being treated like a toddler and it was always disappointing to see weapons getting very little to work with either because they don't get third kits and/or stuck with terrible kits.
Splatoon 3 has really highlighted how archaic this kit system has become. For me last year's fresh season was what broke the camel's back for me, my favourite weapon sploosh basically got slapped with one of the worst kit synergies in splatoon history.
Off topic, but as much as I like the Catalog system I wish their was more reward for completing it. It would be a cool idea to release all previous (and unavailable like the cool capes) campaign gear and jp exclusive and hopefully collab gear (Squid Girl my beloved) into the Catalog as reward for playing the similar to Halo MCC's system.
i think your idea for the kits is something i never thought of but its a great idea! i like the addition of the brand lore with the specials, i think the sev team could do a lot with it
Custom kits are bad and vast majority loves the new kits and is why the game keeps growing at a positive rate and you know
@@maplemiles3381 i mean as an explo player id like to disagree
Kinda surprised you left out one of the reasons for why the kit system is how it is: Predictability.
When getting into any match, you can glance at the weapon composition for any team and already expect what they can and cannot do. Splatoon is a fast game and you can't really use any amount of time to, for example, stay in spawn and memorize what kit anyone in a match is using. Something like this works in games like Dota 2 and League of Legends because those games are much slower paced. You get to see what they're going for in terms of itemization way before they can actually get to use them, while the characters themselves have their skills set in stone, with the only choice there being what the player prioritizes getting on every level.
How could that be mitigated? Probably by giving some more time before every match to see what everyone is running. The 3-set sub and special system could help on getting used to certain combinations with experience, but that would be something that could easily take time for better players and be completely overwhelming for newer ones. Still: As long as it isn't some system where people can just pick whatever they want, then I would be alright with it. So long as people don't go around running only lethal bombs and the obviously good specials, then I'm up for it, because you can't really talk about influencing variety while you know people will clearly gravitate for the best options.
I guess this would make it hard to identify your team mates and opponents specials/subs when match first starts if each kit has 3x3 different options. Cant decide of thats a good or bad thing though?
Couldn't pay attention to half of the video because i recognized the background music and is fire🔥
Yo, The Messenger soudtrack jumpscare, hype!
Expanding on the compromise idea a little, I think it would be nice if you could choose any sub and any special for a weapon. No restrictions at all. Just so people can have fun using them with friends. For tournaments (official or unofficial) a rule can be made that you can only pick the subs & specials that are available in public lobbies. Dunno how good this idea truly is, but I think it’d be pretty cool.
an alternative to adding 4 or 5 sub/special choices per is to make entirely separate groups of three for new weapon brands
so, for example, the standard splash-o-matic could have burst bomb/beakon/splat bomb and the Crab Tank/Trizooka/Ultra Stamp, while the Neo Splash-o-matic could have suction bomb/autobomb/point sensor and Triple Inkstrike/Kraken/Booyah Bomb, allowing for multiple forms of customization without leaning too far into infinite variations
This also means Nintendo can get away with releasing only two variants of a main weapon since you would already have like 18 unique combinations to choose from, compared to 3 at best.
Surprised to see you with this take - I thought I’d always love the kit system until fairly recently, when exactly the points you brought up started to creep in. I like the compromise idea, it would certainly work, but quite frankly I think I’d just love to see them actually balance custom kits. If they needed to replace burst bomb with a more unique (and less busted) rework, I wouldn’t mind. It would force them to buff subs like sprinkler or else nobody would pick them.
I’m hoping with all this buzz about custom kits that we’ll see it in 4. I do have more hope now than I did before.
I doubt they'll ever do custom kits outside of DLC.
For one, Nintendo likes to build on what worked previously, and nowhere is this more apparent than in the main campaign. Octo Expansion worked, so let's make Splatoon 3's main campaign exactly like that. So expecting them to rock the boat that much for the main multiplayer component, even with a middle ground solution, is probably expecting too much.
For the other, they first have to actually be under the impression that there is a problem with the current system, which I don't think they are. Kits make up the majority of the content of the updates, and are basically zero effort additions from a technical standpoint. It's basically free content.
The limited pool of customizable pieces mentioned at the end of the video definitely feels the best in my mind for balance and creativity.
I like your the solution you gave because while there would still be guessing whether or not your main gets a solid a sub or specials to choose from, you at least have other options and aren't screwed over. Something I want to add is that maybe badges and titles could somehow incentives players to test different kit options (ex: you can get badges for using range blaster with burst/wave breaker, burst/kraken, and curling/missiles). Also for anyone who might think you won't be able to clearly tell the sub and specials with anything other than preset kits, the map shows them next to the main weapon.
I started playing Splatoon with 3 with no prior knowledge of the series. When I heard a "custom splattershot junior" was being added in chill season, I thought "oh cool, people will be able to put whatever kit they want on the Junior, that's cool". Then chill season came around.
My disappointment was immeasurable, and my day was ruined.
To your point about neo sploosh/dapples with beakons: The whole point of the weapon is to be aggro. Beakons allow you to instantly flank (if the enemy team doesn't notice and destroy the beakons). This is especially true for the dapples: tacticooler + beakon = basically instant recovery from death.
Maybe the weapon skins could be tied to the specials and let you switch out the sub with one from a different kit, e.g. Ttek would always have tri-strike, but you could replace it’s splat bomb with vshot’s suction bomb.
Here's my solution to Custom Kits's problems
Just straight up make custom points for special for every kit in existence and balance them each patch
Is it a lot of work? Yeah but it would massively help maintain the balance+custom kits would be much easier to keep
A lot of work? Much closer to an impossible workload. That's around 1200 combos you need to make, before you even consider factoring in subs. Then you need to keep track of the usage statistics of all of those combos and balance them accordingly. That just won't work.
he talked about this in the other custom kit video
But then something like N-Zap with Burst and Tac could make that combo broken, so they would have to make it 220p. And then if you wanted to run brella or something with burst and tac, then ur just screwed.
Half the kits are literally just the devs going “alright, it’s a fun main with a fun special, now what’s the *worst* possible sub we could give it…” or vice versa between the sub and special.
2:26 i was just pausing for fun to see what weird kits i could land on and i saw torpedo/inkjet dynamo, and honestly, that would be really nice
5:12 A Splatana Monado would go hard.
This is definitely how it should be done
If we want to keep the second kit skins in a way that would make sense, they could add second kits as specialty kits that are meant to be really strong (but can't be altered), and only add to the vanilla weapons' kits when a completely new sub or special drops.
Of course, the kits probably won't be strong enough for it to be worth it.
I really like your new system at the end, Chara!
The only problem with a new system, and why I think they haven't done a new system yet, is because kits are instantly known due to the branding.
You know when you spawn in that the Tentatek Splattershot has Splat Bomb and Tristrike. You know this because every Tentatek has this. I think they need a new system for having kits be identifiable by teammates and allies. Otherwise, who's to say if your team in solo queue is running 1 or 3 Tacticoolers. You won't know if that Slosher has Trizooka until it shoots you with it for the first time in the match.
There would be a certain fear of the unknown at the start of every game, and while that might be fun, I think the devs are trying to avoid that. Great video! Hopefully Splatoon 4 has an even better system than we expect.
I feel like almost everyone learns how to check everyone's specials on the map before they start memorizing kits.
I would love the mix and matching idea. It is also one of the things Ive been wanting for a while. Although I’ve also heard people say they don’t like it because they wouldn’t be able to know what kind of special they would be bringing but I think this could easily be resolved with a new UI system where it show both weapon, special and sub weapon the person has mixed and matched. I really hope this idea becomes a reality for Splatoon 4 or even 3 as some sort of big quality of life updates (they could just merge current weapons kits and let us pick which sub and special we want)
I'm going to say that kits are not a bad thing but I personally have thought for a long time that we should have each weapon have three pre-selected subs and three pre-selected specials that you can switch in between for an individual weapon to give way more variety and control to the player base, and then just having alternate weapons skins that can have all of those other abilities hopefully enough to make it to where pretty much every weapon can have any special and any sub or maybe one or two miss out on a weapon that it would just be completely broken on or whatever but that would add so much for variety and make it where we don't have to worry as much
yo after actually watching the video Chara says what I've been saying for years hell yeah this is phenomenal to my ego
The semi-custom kit system sounds almost perfect to me. It gives a little more freedom to the players, but still allows the devs enough freedom to avoid broken kits to preserve the balance of the game. Having the points for special change based on what sub-special combo you choose is also genius. My biggest concern is just how to handle multiple weapon skins. My idea is that you could unlock them as you get more stars on your weapon. Maybe the second skin is unlocked at 2 stars and the third skin is unlocked at 4 stars. It would be a lot cooler of a reward for playing a weapon than locker stickers or badges. (This is also how weapon titles for splat tags should work, btw. It’s ridiculous that you have to role a gacha machine to get a splat tag title for your main. I think you should unlock the titles for each weapon at 3 stars)
Tetras having an actual kit sounds pretty good
5 stages of kit grief
anger: "what were they thinking"
denial: "these kits arent that terrible"
depression: "these kits are terrible"
bargaining: "maybe the 3rd kits will cook/maybe we can replace the system"
acceptance: "theyre bringing kits back for splatoon 4 arent they"
I think the kit system itself is fine, but I feel like we need huge buffs to the non-bomb subs, as there are so many kits in this game that get ruined by the sub. After some sub balancing, the kit system would be fine imo.
I've been a big critic of the 'fully custom kits' idea, but the system you propose towards the end of the video seems really good to me.
even though I watched it when it came out, just now thinking about the ability to switch the subs and specials are a REALLY good idea. The different combos if every weapon got a 3rd kit would be amazing!
Im a big proponent of the fully custom kit idea and have been since midway through s2 where it began to really wear away at me waiting endlessly for the cool part of the game where everythings available (enough if your lucky). I did also see the brandings being used as weapon skins you could customize with stickers or alt colors too but that halfway point idea feels rhe most like a truly better second option. I was even ready to critique the suggestion thinking about the limitations of "bad choices made for the goodie bag a weapon gets" only for another elegant solution to come up in vid of different brands providing different goodie bags.
This also helps in a moment to moment gameplay manner as youd still be able to see a weapon with a specific skin and think "ok enpwrry brand probably means they have this or that many special and sub combinations" helping out in the information war alongside the other mentioned points. Great idea
I think if they do decide to use something similar, they’ll merge it with the freshness system so that the more stars you have on a weapon the more subs and specials you are given to choose from. Would suck competitively but casually would be sick
finally, my goal to 5 star every weapon has a purpose
If there's an option that lets us use Sheldon licences to get access to those sub and specials before reaching 5 stars, I think that would also be good.
honestly???? banger idea, limited custom kits is the way to go imo, really fun idea. Perhaps in the shops you could have sheldon's store that sells you the weapon and its base kit, then shelly/donny could have their own store that sells "kit expansion sets" for each weapon, that way it feels like you're opening new options and they can be added in updates without just Appearing
The middleground idea is such a great way to help it especially if subs and specials could be assigned different design choices or stickers that go onto the weapon and could make identifying certain combinations easier too - plus it’d just be super fun all around 🤩
Great idea with the multiple choice kits! Keep up the good content!
Good video on the topic. I've always been a staunch defender of the kit system in this game. However for the sake of a healthier competitive scene i think the three sub three special compromise is a good idea. My problem with custom kits are these reasons:
1) i like being able to see the other team and know *exactly* what im dealing with. I see that the enemy team has these certain weapons and that im dealing with these specials and subs for the match. I think this is a positive for both solo q/casual and competitive, in casual play you dont have to find out the enemys kits through trial and error or some other means, and competitive matches dont have to spend time knowing 4 subs and 4 specials the othe team uses before any given match, what if they decide to switch in between games? (This could be banned i supposed)
2) custom kits would heavily impact match making, not so much an issue with competitive but definitely impacting the game proper. If theres a special thats really good right now like say zooka, and 50 percent of players play with zooka, youre going to experience a lot more waiting for games as the game tries to find a balanced team. The game may not even try past a certain point and you get hit with double maybe triple zooka anyway. What if the game decides to prioritize different specials over gun variety during match making? Or vice versa? A lot of speculation here i realize but there would absolutely be an impact on how the game tries to balance matches
Overall im very torn on the subject, im very much for player/skill expression but i think how splatoon handles balancing matchmaking with set kits is really unique and can work well, they just need to make smarter kits in my opinion
This is something that I can also 100% agree with even on the more casual side. Having a small selection to choose from adds enough flexibility to each weapon to both be fun in casual and strong for competitive.
Having new Special being added in during the game's lifespan does get a little tricky, since you can't add them onto too many older weapons.
A neat little expansion to this idea could be that those extra Subs and Specials could be unlocked at fixed intervals as you level up the weapon by using it. Give it its own token system utilizing Sheldon Licenses so players can choose which new thing to unlock and use for a given weapon. You can still try out any combination in the Test Range, but I think it's a little more new-player friendly to have a base kit that players can expand on as they play the game instead of just dropping them all on them right out of the gate.
I think that one of the major underlying problems with this system is that the sub weapons are so ridiculously unbalanced. So many weapon kits just get stuck with sprinkler or line marker and are immediately doomed to never see use.
Even a custom kit system wouldn't fix the state of the game completely. In fact I think it would just make the sub balance problems even more apparent. Line marker and sprinkler would no longer see any use because they can't get carried by the rest of the kit.
I think that if the devs took a patch to seriously look at the state of the sub weapons and actually try to fix them a lot of the problems we have with the current kit system would melt away. The chances that a weapon gets a kit it wants would increase, not because there are more kits, but because there are less bad subs it could get.
This wouldn't solve all the problems, if they still refuse to give us more than 2.5 kits a weapon a lot of kits still wouldn't see the light of day due to synergy problems. However I think rebalancing the sub weapons they have refused to touch for years is an important step no matter what kind of kit system they choose moving forward.
the three subs and specials on the weapons would be a dream come true, maybe they're gonna do it in the next game (but i really dont think they would change the system that much)
I think the sub/special pool is interesting to see. Definitely something that would be fun to play around with. Would help with balance, too, as a group of strong options for the main can be added to both pools and players can pick and choose what they prefer. Hell, even separating subs by category like 'damage', 'mobility' and 'utility' would be cool, e.g. suction, burst and beakon on shot. Opens up so many ways to play.
I really like the idea of the middle ground solution and have even thought about it myself somewhat before this video came out, my only concern is that it might actually increase the work for each weapon because you're effectively making 3 kits (kinda) for the weapon and then still 2 more in the future, I could be wrong since it all depends on if they still treat it like the kit system we have now but its interesting to think about, the current system definitely needs to go and I love hearing possible solutions like this
I had this same Idea. I think its a good middle ground between completely customizable kits and what we have now. I think it would be interesting if each main weapon was made of 3 different parts that would each look different depending on the main, sub, and special that you chose for it
its ironic when you think about it
the kit system was designed to prevent people from creating overpowered combinations and thus prevent people from forming an otherwise stale and repetitive meta, and yet in the end, the kit system has created that vary same stale and repetitive meta that it was designed to avoid, due to it subsequently preventing some weapons from being viable enough, due to their lack-luster kits.
mayhaps such an issue is truly impossible to prevent, for so long as their are options, its most likely that one will always be better at, at the very least something, then the rest.
The way to prevent stale a meta (in any game) is to actually take action to balance it. Nintendo does not do this, at least not nearly enough.
Some things I’d add to a “limited custom kit” system. At first you could be given a base kit with just one sub and special, and at a later level you get either the ability to either unlock full customisation for the weapon, or unlock one sub or special weapon at a time.
What’s more, this restriction could be lifted during splatfests, letting players express themselves even further, while developers get data in case they want to rearrange kits for specific weapons
I love how a picture of Booga represents a casual player.
One thing I like about the idea of mixing and matching between 3 different options is that they could still keep the brands associated with kits, so that when you see someone using the weapon you can still know what to expect right away (rather it being potentially anything like if we had fully custom kits). If you were going up against say a roller that could have either of its current kits, then knowing that it's krak-on with a kraken ready is extremely important, and we can still have that in this new system if it were added (we just wouldn't know whether it's beacon or curling bomb without checking the menu, something I figure is far less important than knowing the special).
I really like your new idea for kits as fully custom kits in my opinion would destroy casual play; in all 3 games there were always periods where the "strongest" weapons were way too common, and I feel like having fully custom loadouts would make the problem worse overtime as people found stronger and stronger combinations. So having certain kits the devs REALLY don't want in the game restricted instead of just giving the playerbase a very limited system is a good middleground, especially since the devs and players usually don't see eye to eye when it comes to design philosophy.
Ive seen some folks worried that custom kits would make things worse because the same specials would get picked on every weapon; I very much disagree with that being the problem
The current kit system does nothing to prevent broken specials from being spammed, as we are seeing right now with tacticooler and zooka. The only thing the current system does do is restrict what main and sub weapons can be used alongside those specials. It would actually be much preferable for those specials to be on any weapon because we would atleast have way better main weapon diversity than we do now
The same specials being used over and over again is a special balance issue, not a kit system issue, so it shouldnt be counted against custom kits
Same goes for sub weapons, if you think that every non-bomb sub weapon would never be picked if you had the choice of having a bomb instead, maybe those non-bomb options are just too weak balance wise and are meerly being unjustly propped up by being mandatory if you want to play a certain weapon
Keeping set kits for this reason is a bandaid over broken arm
Third kits would be nice, but they'd be redundant if we didn't add more subs and specials, because with how many weapons are in this game, there would be tons of kits that have similar main weapons, sub weapons, and special weapons.
I like the system you suggested! I think it's the best step forward that I've heard of at least
I don't know how this would work for comp, but my frustrations with solo Q made me think that it'd be nice if you could have two weapons assigned to you and pressing the left stick down (like how you activate special with right stick) could be another way to spend your special charge to switch between them
So if you had no backline in solo Q and you brought sploosh you could switch to charger if your special gauge was fool
idk, funky unpolished idea
If Nintendo were to add this, they could add a drawback system, whereas if your kit is op, your main could have less ink efficiency or your special could require more points
If we're gonna have fully customizable kits, then for a compromise, that would be the path of least resistance (i.e. least restrictive compromise).
I think ink consumption of sub would be primarily determined by the weapon's damage output, while points for special is based on a combination of both the range and paint output of the main weapon, (and sub if applicable). This would initially at launch and Nintendo can make adjustments if needed.
Chara literally mentioned points for special changing depending on the kit
There should be a Challenge, similar to the gear randomizer challenge, to where weapons get a random sub and special
If the problem with custom kits is that you won't know their sub/special combo, you could do kind of like a team preview fashion when loading into your match. It could go right next to the banners that are currently shown when when the "before battle" fanfare is playing. You could also make that info viewable when you bring up the map, kind of like how you can see opponent's abilities already.
I think a fun middle ground would be something like having the default kits be how they are now, but rather than being brand new weapon kits per update, the new kits are unlocking one new sub and one new special for the weapon to mix and match as you said, using the new kit looks as choosable skins. It still keeps options healthily limited so that the weapons can’t just get whatever they want, but it allows more options than currently and means that if you like one part from a kit but like a different part of another, you can pick and choose.
For example, you could start with just Autobomb and Reefslider on Dark Tetra Dualies, but when the Light Tetra Dualies come out with Sprinkler and Zipcaster, you could mix and match and choose Autobomb and Zipcaster. Or you know, choose Sprinkler and Reefslider if you hate winning, but it’s an option.
And if you really like the current kit system of having a good and bad part of a kit, then you could do something like “if you use the matching sub and special of a kit, then you get slightly lower points for special, like -10 for a matching kit”. Then you can have the tradeoff of having the better kit that you personally work better with or being able to get your special more often at the cost of a lesser kit.
And keep the kit skins separate from this, if you really like the Dark Tetra look but like the Light Tetra kit, then let you use the Dark skin without sacrificing this PFS boost.
Is this perfect or even good? Probably not, but it’s how I’d personally go about it and I hope others agree with it.
P.S. also I feel like they should have some seasonly vote thing ingame or on social media where people propose main/sub/special combos, and the one with the most positive reception gets added. Let all the Inklings and Octolings choose at least one of the weapons they are gonna be using, and it’d be a fun social experiment to see if people on the whole favor equal main/sub/special representation, fun and unusual kits, or competitively powerful kits more.
As a casual fan who doesn't know the full conversation... What's the feeling amongst top level about every weapon kit having a lethal bomb AND a utility sub (using the L button or something to activate)?
Hopefully line marker would count as utility for this idea
Okay but the tenta brella with triple wall is a brella wet dream
4:08 the attempt to emulate “seasonal live service” games has made the new content output a lot less engaging
Another compromise I found online a while back consists of a weigh limiter system. Every main, sub and special is assigned a weight value, and the total sum cannot exceed a certain limit.
This way Nintendo gets to have some control over the amount of potential a weapon gets while allowing players some level of flexibility to optimize their weapon builds. Players can still find ways to get their main weapon to be viable while requiring some level of creativity.
As an example: let's say each weapon is assigned a number between 1-3 and the limit is 6.
Weapons like slosher, the .52 gals or eliter gets assigned to 3 whereas Sploosh and undercover gets assigned to 1 (for now at least).
Essentially kit dependent main weapons get lower weight values than main weapons that are self-sufficient.
For subs, any versatile subs (a.k.a bombs) get weight values are somewhere close to 3 on average whereas utility subs are closer to 1.
For specials', their weight value is inversely proportional to their level of counterplay so a special like Kraken with infinite hp is set to 3 while ultra stamp with no viable defence is set to 1.
With this example, players can't run something like Slosher + burst bomb + tenta missiles but will be possible to run Sploosh + Splat bomb + trikzooka (i.e. Splat 1 Sploosh 7 kit)
I basically said the exact same middle ground idea when I was talking about it w/ friends maybe a month ago. I would absolutely love to see that in the game
Expanding on the weapon customisation there, I think there's a lot to explore! I feel updates would feel a bit lacking without new weapons, so they could make Sheldon sell weapon skins to you, instead of new weapons, they could release weapon skins every season and it could even be themed like the chirpy chips season.
The third in between option is what I’ve BEEEN wanting!!!
I like that idea, I think weapons could have different skins depending on what is equipped, and weapons could also have exclusive specials to different subs, tying it back to gear.
Completely 100% agree. Liked the balancing idea for the custom kits as well.
i need that "break your fingers" inkbrush kit
Someone needs to send this video to the splatoon 3 devs
Unfortunately I feel this would ultimately end up *reducing* kit variety outside of casual turf war and low ranked anarchy battles. I come from a long history of playing the hero shooter Paladins, that game features a system called talents, at the start of every game, you get to pick one of three options of a talent, which modifies how the character you picked plays in some way, where that be by increasing the amount of damage one of your abilities does while you have a particular buff active, changing the way your main weapon functions in some way, or any other number of things.
For the most part, these talents have added a lot of spice to the gameplay on paper, but for as long as talents have existed, each character has really only played with one of them, a talent which is obviously stronger than the other choices which becomes the default. Occasionally, you will see 2 talents get play for the same character, but it's rare and only happens with the especially versatile characters when they have two particularly strong options to pick from. This pours even into the game's casual queue. You will see off-meta talents occasionally, but for the most part, people learn what's good and stick to it, even in casual settings.
This is all to say that I feel this would inevitably happen in Splatoon as well with semi-custom weapon kits as your describe. Let's say for example that the Splash-o-Matic got access to a choice from Splat Bomb, Toxic Mist, and Autobomb, with a choice of specials from Triple Inkstrike, Killer Wail 5.1, and Big Bubbler. Even at casual levels of play, the majority of Splash-o-Matic players would immediately lock into Splat Bomb + Triple Inkstrike and never look back, save for maybe the occasional Autobomb to counter sharks. The only way to really stop this from happening would be to make every option a strong, enticing decision, such as offering the choice of Splat, Burst, and Suction bombs, with a special array of Triple Inkstrike, Crab Tank, and Trizooka, but in that case you end up with a weapon that's far too versatile and can handle almost any role given to it, an especially big issue when you can run 4 of the same weapon.
Kits as they are now are definitely not a perfect system, but I do think they inject more variety into the game as they exist now. With semi-custom kits you'd, for example, never see the Splatana Stamper running Fizzy Bomb, as regardless of the Zipcaster or Crab Tank choice, the weapon will pretty much always prefer Burst Bomb. Similarly, you'd never see Ultra Stamp or Toxic Mist being used by a Mini Splatling, because every player under the sun would just play with Burst + Big Bubbler because that's just optimal for the weapon given the pool.
Maybe in a perfect world where sub and special balance wasn't so completely lopsided, but in the world we exist in now, custom kits like this would ultimately result in just one kit becoming universal.
10:44 DREAD WRINGER WITH SENSOR/CRAB PLEASE
An idea I had is subs and specials could become chunks that you can spend to change a weapons kit (much like how you can spend ability chunks to change abilities on gear). When weapons first come out, Nintendo will give them a default kit, but players can still use those sub/special chunks to change them.
As a Squiffer, it’s been years and we never got an amazing kit, and with the new one I 100% agree with what you say about how hard it is for a perfect fun and good kit.
I was going that Side Order weapons would have the option to create a custom kit, sure that’d cause meta chaos (pun intended) but it’d open up so many possibilities.
Hoping*
Fully customizable/partially customizable kits would also worl great with the freshest fits feature, allowing you to quickly equip your preffered kit and gear for it.
I adore the idea of having a set of custom options!
My idea for something Different: Weapons, sub weapons and special weapons will all have different custom point Prices And going over budget Will either result in some penalties
Man this really makes think about just how much potential Splatoon has. It’s absolutely insane. Nintendo should watch this video