Karen Pavicic: The Breaking of Don Daiquiri
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- Опубліковано 8 вер 2024
- The sign of a good trainer is that another rider should, in theory, be able to get on the horse and effortlessly ride it. Karen Pavicic sold Don Daiquiri a year ago to Daniel Hirosh. Last weekend he scored in the low 60's and I went on a mission to make a who rode him better video as I have done with so many horse and rider combinations before. On a mission to discuss judging bias in dressage, I found this instead. Every single warm up clip I have of Karen Pavicic has the exact same wrestling match with her and Don Daiquiri in the warm up ring. These segments were filmed over the course of more than ten different shows.
Instead of uncovering a judging bias or a fun comparative video of another top rider taking over the proverbial reins, we are now looking at a discussion about how the breaking of a horse by one rider becomes a chore to over come for the next.
This week Karen Pavicic has also announced that rather than riding for Canada in the sport of dressage she will now be representing Croatia. Some of you may recall a judging fiasco, which was the result of a giant sized temper tantrum that Karen Pavicic threw after she failed to obtain the qualifying scores to head to the Olympic games in Rio. She filed an attack against the judges claiming an absolute bias against her. I would invite you to watch the clips of the warm and decide for yourself if this riding is the caliber that we should idolize and ascertain to as dressage riders.
To watch Karen Pavicic ride Don Daiquiri with a blue tongue in the warm up click here:
• Blue Tongues in Dressa...
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I used to be in the dressage world. I worked with top dressage horses and have both ridden and stood on the sideline and seen what goes on. I left dressage after many years simply because of the amount of abuse these horses goes through daily. I'm not saying every dressage rider abuse their horse, but when u get too a certain level its stops being for the horses and instead for the money and the win. People stop trying to understand the horse and instead they abuse and bully them into submission. I've seen people regularly beating up the poor horses, even gone as far as hitting foals and youngsters at the ages of 1. It's sick and everyone around just watches, egging them on to continue. It's so wrong and I don't understand how these people can be proud of such thing. unfortunately these things happens in other horse sports too. The amount of broken horses I've seen in my life makes me ashamed of the human race. Not trying to offend anyone btw.
Yeah it's amazing how many riders come to accept this and defend this type of riding
Yea it's just disgusting. At most training barns I worked at the horses all became injured enough to have to go off work regularly. I personally have never had a horse come up injured. Not to say injuries csnt happen even to the best of us after a ride, but it's when u have them over and over and on different horses regularly. U know?
@@itsbevinallison I googled "proper use of the running martingale" and then I googled "Henry Wynmalen running martingale". Not a single photo came up in Google images using the running martingale with 2 reins on a single bit, and many of them also had a tie-down. If you read Henry's book, he clearly explains why this is a training aid for green horses and why you need 2 reins on a single snaffle bit.
If the horses are being trained improperly right from the getgo, then they are already being ruined before they even reach 4th level. The FEI needs to grow some backbone, identify the riders who abuse their horses, and ban them for life. Otherwise, it's just a joke and "modern dressage" will go down in history as how NOT to school a horse.
@@martimasters7704 Why is using two reins wrong?
@@marusiaradimiow7811 Please read my post again. I never said using 2 reins is wrong. My post is about using a running martingale and 2 reins.
I'm not a top level dressage rider but to me it looks like her hands are too harsh and she is suffering from 'pressure cooker syndrome'. By this I mean that you can build up pressure in the horse with your legs, your seat (and with this I include core tension) and your hands. If you don't allow the pressure to dissipate either by reducing one of the three and let the horse go forward the horse will go up. He is unhappy in the mouth, his neck looks very short and I'm wondering how often he is allowed to move forward naturally, freely and joyfully as part of his training. And Angela, one doesn't need to torture a horse with the whip and spurs. All that pressure and tension (plus in the video clips she is frequently behind the movement of the horse) is psychological torture and much more subtle so people who do not have an eye for it, like yourself, don't see it. To me that horse looks like he will need a bit of a vacation before he gets restarted to learn to trust a rider again.
+freddyvonrabenau1 great insight! Thank you for your comments!
Yes to this!!
I love that phrase. Pressure cooker syndrome. In a way, that's how you can get collection, by asking the horse, and the horse being strong enough to bunch up and collect. You are right here, He is bunching really hard with no release, causing him to "Explode" in a direction. Because of her hands, he can't go forward, because of her legs, he can't go back. Because of her seat, he can't go side to side. So, it's up or down. I will add a thing. It is also possible that that extreme bunching with tension has caused kissing spine.Vacation for this baby indeed!
Yes Your right about the build up... no release of the hand and continually leg leg and not much seat.
freddyvonrabenau1 exactly
There is a lot of force riding in this. The horse is trying so hard and she just isn't listening.
Karen Pavicic: The Breaking of Don Daiquiri - horrible! There should be a way to use this type of video as evidence in a court of law to ban Karen and similar riders for life. FEI banned hyperflexion and we need to develop a way to hold these riders responsible for such violations.
Again thank you for continuing to raise awareness of horse cruelty and abuse.
What I see is a tense topline from the poll to the tail causing the back to drop and hind legs to trail behind. Making it impossible for this horse to activate it's underline so it can carry itself properly.
Which is most horses you see in the dressage ring anymore.
Emma Parrish yes, he's hollow because she has conditioned him to expect the punishment at the end. Very athletic horses can dons much even when not in frame, it's seemingly common for riders to allow less than correct posture of the horse as long as the movement comes out. Of course it'd be a ton better if he was properly engaged. I see so much back damage on the dressage horses (I do equine bodywork) it's disheartening. I can hardly watch a clinician or show without cringing.
@@TheOldandslow If you do all the work, why aren't you writing up reports and calling in the state veterinarian, who can review the horse's physical and mental condition AND send the report to the prosecutor who can charge the rider, the stable manager, and the trainer (if there is one) with animal torture, which is a high court misdemeanor, similar to a felony. It generally carries a 5000 fine, 5 years in prison, and probation upon release. We can all sit here and complain, but if you come into contact with broken horses, you need to take action because the horses can not speak for themselves!
the rider wants to sit only pretty straight but doesnt truly follow the horses back with her softening back , her upper body seems like a body builder
I watched Sahar's ride on the horse and the horse seemed much more relaxed.
+karin schackne yup he certainly has done a lot off work
Do you have footage of the new rider?
Yes
I hope all her students, sponsors, clients see these videos and pull every dime.
This women is all spurs and hands/seat with no give. I wouldn't put her on a donkey!
Poor, poor horse. He's trying so hard but totally confused and wanting nothing more than to get away. SMH!
The horse is fighting her, his mouth is open and she doesn't give any release with her legs or hands.
The horse is not collected underneath her a collected horse is relaxed because his hind quarters are engaged causing a higher loose carrige in the front you can do this with a snaffle.
She is forcing the horse to bend his head by the shear power of her reins
This is absolutely disgusting. A pain to watch...
What an embarrassment to the sport and Canada 🇨🇦 please take our flag off your pad
Oh please stop pulling on the reins ! The horse is going nuts. You should learn to ride all lessons with simple bridle, keeping the horse nose infront of the vertical. Only when you can make it, take the double bridle.
Awful to see! This is not how good dressage should be! It should be gentle, soft, kind and in harmony with the horse and respect for the horse.
What a beautiful boy !... High spirited. Just like mine...now I know what to expect lol....i agree with other comments...the horse is trying to tell her...
I don't think you should expect this unless you ride in rolkur.
Clearly too much horse for her. Fear written allover her!
The sad part is money is doing the talking here , You can see how the horse is working his mouth he isn't happy , but t the money is more important, The horse knows what they want him to do but he is in some kink of discomfort
OMG... Haven't you had a bad day at work... Like no one has ever been stressed in their life. Looks like she has a high energy horse to me and may have some anxiety about the surroundings. Wouldn't you have anxiety if you had to preform at an event or give a speech. I think she is doing a great job. You have to know the whole picture before you can critizise. Besides most of you probably don't have a clue... Are you riding a Grand Prix horse at International levels?
Kerry take your blinders off and you'll c what we're talking about
Kerry- I have world class jumping horses and wow yes they have many many many moments from sheer arrogance to headaches after travel making them buck and kick and not able to work their best that day but for the love of God if you love a horse you work with them and are not a warning them. This is the ugliest riding have seen at this level. That poor horse never gets a reward for his effort. I am sure he hates that rider. She'll never win because her horse's hearts aren't in it because of her evil hands. Winning is done with that extra special effort that only a confident, happy horse can provide a loving rider. This lady riding here- wow. I suppose she can send us postcards from hell and explain what ya like. No person who handles a horse like this goes to heaven. Period.
@@9766Kerry Hyperflexion is the problem here. The horse is ruined by a rider who is ignorant and had a bad instructor or else she is simply a mean unethical b--- who learned from Anky that you can shortcut dressage training and still win gold medals. It's not a simple case of the horse having a bad day.
I would like to add to my previous comment that it is my impression that the horse is very sensitive and tries very hard but there is a lot of miscommunication going on as well where the horse responds to what the rider is asking without realising what she is asking for at that moment. I have a very sensitive horse myself and I call her the "100% passmark mistress". If I get it only 98% right I don't get it, if I give too strong an aid she complains and if i breathe more deeply into one side of my chest she responds. So if I'm not mindful of what I'm doing things look a bit similar to what I see in these video clips. Except that I'm not aspiring to go to the Olympics in this life. When you understand a horse like that I think you can have the ride of a lifetime, sadly it looks like Karen Pavicic did not understand her horse.
Sickening!!!!!!!
WHAT THE ACTUAL HECK IS THAT?!?! THIS IS CALLED A "GOOD RIDER"? poor horse! she's riping the hell out of it's mouth!! This isn't a good rider at all! If it's a good rider she would ride without spears, withour bridles and with relationship with the horsr, this horse is clearly upset with her and she acts like the horse is some kind of metal robot with no feelings and no limits, the horse feels you know?
These riders are not interested in being good riders, their mission is to achieve greatness.
That horse is in agony ! Utter discomfort and should be brought back to the basics !
Sometimes a partnership just doesn't work. Dissimilar in personality or clashing of personality of rider and horse... it happens!
Yes, particularly when one is an abuser... it happens!
It is never fair to create a 'worst moments' medley. Could could do so with anybody's ride. Watching your footage gives a completely false impression of what went on especially when any 'bad moments' are emphasized using slow motion and putting dramatic music undereneath along with your own interpretation of what is going on. You are doing both the horses and the sport a massive disfavor because you are lashing out at what seems to be anybody competing in the sport. Why don't you try a different approach and try to hold yourself to the high standards you are trying to set for others? Have you even tried riding? If so I'd be very happy to film you on a few horses we are brought for correction and use the newly developed tool we have to measure rein-pressure so you can prove how you master the tast of riding a horse with upcoming tension from being asked for a difficult task without any physical impact. Please feel free to contact me I will pay for your lodging and food and provide both the horses, ring and setup and then we can see how you think it should be done correctly :)
+Kareen Heineking-Schuette Have you also watched Karen's blue tongue videos?? I can't make those up. Shitty riding is shitty riding, and I would be happy to come ride for you. I am very good rider and I have nothing to prove, so I would be happy to live stream it to dressage hub. The difference being, Karen has had this horse for years, it is not a horse she is fixing, she trained it and now someone else is fixing it. I am also an amatuer, she is supposedly an Olympic calibre rider, whose boyfriend couldn't even bully the judges enough to get on the team so she went after the judges herself.
I've been riding 38 years. I have all my horses do a couple core years of basic to too 3 level complete dressage formal and then onto Equitation, Hunter's or Jumpers and can honestly say Yiu'd never have caught me once in my life riding this harshly. If someone can ride this harshly more than once on any horse that is not running into traffic and must be stopped- then they absolutely qualify as a for shit rider. Period. This is animal abuse.
@@cade_gov7977 I don't think DressageHub is rude. In fact, she or he reminds me of a young Marti Masters 40 years ago when I decided to confront the Arabian Horse Association of Michigan about the abuse of halter horses - years before confronting abuse became a fad - and later I confronted a national callibre trainer regarding his treatment of a certain "Yesterday's Love". I owned Michigan's top winning 5-year old Arabian stallion, who was a futurity graduate as a colt, and I can count the fingers on both hands how many "nationally acclaimed" trainers wanted to show my boy to the U.S. and Canadian Nationals. I said "no" to all of them.
Abuse in the eyes of a true equestrienne is easy to recognize. .
Wow, harsh hands on that rider. Not to mention, it seems like he has just had his neck cranked into a form with no regard to actual collection. His back is dipped and there is no drop in in the hind legs/haunches to provide lift. No wonder he is so uncomfortable. Classical dressage principles really need to be brought back into style.
Poor horse, it's all about the ribbon!!!!!!
+Tami Kahler she dragged this horse all over the world desperately trying to qualify for the Olympics.
Tami Kahler why is he a "poor horse"??
Ceilidh Eyford, when a horse is a tool of someones fame the horse suffers!!!
DressageHub, I know, and then she sends me a dumbass question and questions why it's a poor horse!
I should have told her.....I don't do stupid!! :)
Tami Kahler not all the time. And this lady isn't doing anything wrong to the horse
Love it!
do you ride this level for a living? how about the change of tortilla ? give the professional jockeys a break , unless u don't ride it you don't know it< we all love are horses!
I would argue that Karen loves herself more than horses...and as for me, I just want the tortilla you mentioned.
Between the hands, the feet and her seat, the horse is getting multiple mixed messages. No wonder he is acting up. She needs to learn that horses want to please the rider, but we need to give them clear signals. The rider is a hot mess.
It doesn't matter on what level you ride on. Horse training and riding should not cause pain for the horse. It doesn't matter what you are trying to achieve or if you do this for a living or not. If you can't handle a living being with respect (always!) and rather put money and / or winning before that innocent animal, you are not qualified for being a rider and should definitely try yourself in some other sport.
Success does not mean not abusive. And there are plenty of people who know exactly what they are looking at.
This is terrible
can you say "death grip"! very sad
unfrigging believable! this is called a sport! its sickening
My ponies would make her eat dirt.
Get another rider who thinks horses are machines, disgusting
Why do you make such à fuss. Sometimes horses are difficult. She isn't beating this horse or kicking with her Spurs. She is just trying to get him to cooperate
+angela if you think this is n acceptable way of riding I feel sorry for your horse, try watching a Charlotte or Steffen warm up.
You should also watch Karen's Blue Tongue video: ua-cam.com/video/Gt0Ira56RU0/v-deo.html
angela and sometimes people are difficult!!!!!!!!! Your poor horse!!!!!!!!
+angela sometimes??? Sure.... This was filmed over ten different shows and includes more than 20 video clips.
Not one person said the rider was mistreating the horse .