The One Risk Nobody Talks About
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- Опубліковано 10 чер 2024
- Every European investor in ETFs and stocks needs to be aware of this risk!
🇪🇺 Best broker in Europe (ETFs): angelo.fi/ibkr
You may be shocked to hear how little is actually protected via the investor compensation scheme in Europe compared to the US, if a broker fails and is unable to return your shares in ETFs or stocks! Let's take a closer look at this rarely discussed topic and find the best ways to protect our investments long-term!
My Favorite Brokers (ETFs, Stocks and Bonds):
🇪🇺 Interactive Brokers: angelo.fi/ibkr
🇪🇺 Trade Republic (4% interest p.a.): angelo.fi/trep
🇪🇺 Scalable Capital: angelo.fi/scalable
🇩🇪🇦🇹 Easiest for Germany & Austria: angelo.fi/etfs
👉 Compare ETFs & Stocks: angelo.fi/comp
My Top 3 in P2P Lending:
📌 Esketit (0.5% bonus): angelo.fi/esketit
📌 Mintos: angelo.fi/mintos
📌 Viainvest (1% bonus): angelo.fi/viainvest
💰 All P2P deals & conditions: angelo.fi/all
Where I Buy Bitcoin & Ethereum:
⚡ Bitvavo (10€ bonus): angelo.fi/bit
I Hold My Emergency Fund (Cash) Here:
🇪🇺 4% interest p.a. (€100K deposit guarantee!): angelo.fi/save
📈 What I Use to Track my ETFs: angelo.fi/getq
🏠 All my investments & accounts: angelo.fi/tools
Watch these next:
🎥 How to transfer ETFs between brokers: • I Moved My ETF - Here'...
🎥 ETF Taxes in Europe! (0-41%): • ETF Taxes in Europe! (...
🎥 7 Years of ETF Investing: What I Learned: • 7 Years of ETF Investi...
00:00 You need to be aware of this risk as a European investor
02:10 The bank deposit guarantee
02:55 Two important layers of protection in addition to Investor compensation
06:35 What if everything fails and we need to rely on investor compensation schemes?
08:53 How can we protect our investments in stocks & ETFs?
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Some of the links are affiliate links, which help support me and the UA-cam channel. Still, none of the links are sponsored.
Disclaimer: I am only sharing my own experience. I'm not a financial advisor and you should always do your own research and due diligence before investing. Investing involves risk of losses.
Am I overreacting or are you also upset about the low investor protection in Europe?
🇪🇺Interactive Brokers: angelo.fi/ibkr
🇪🇺Trade Republic: angelo.fi/tr
🇪🇺Scalable Capital: angelo.fi/sca
🇦🇹🇩🇪Germany & Austria only: angelo.fi/atde
👉Compare ETFs: angelo.fi/comp
⚡Where I buy crypto: angelo.fi/bit
💶4% interest savings account: angelo.fi/save
your reaction is rational.
Agree with everything. To add a bit of context, cash in banks is part of the balance sheet of the bank. So if they go bankrupt, it is considered part of the assets/liabilities of the bank. As you explained, that is different for brokers with separate accounts. If protection for cash should be 5x, 10x or more the protection of equities that is an interesting discussion. Best would be 1) option for cash to be depositied directly with the ECB at return that ECB is paying for cash to commercial banks 2) significantly higher protection for stocks held in brokers (at least 50K)
Thanks!!! I was searching this for the last week. You nail it!!
Very well done Angelo, someone at last needed to talk about this!!
On one hand European states progressively raise retirement age limits and pass on the responsibility and risk of building a viable retirement fund to citizens (which one can argue is reasonable to a certain extent) and one the other hand EU and the states do not provide the tools to people (such as sufficient capital guarantees) so that they feel safe enough about their hard-earned invested money. Something needs to change rather soon!!
Exactly. Unfortunately I have the impression that at EU level, the they don't want this change and are rather looking into ways to tap into that money when needed.
Add to that the insane capital gain tax, they want everyone to work and not retire.
Nobody, no government anywhere in the world will guarantee your investments. You invest in the stock markets, equity, bond funds etfs etc at your own risk. If the index crashes that's life, you just have to wait for it to hopefully recover. This video is a bit misleading. If your etfs closes I've been told you will be given prior notice and you can cash it in before it closes or wait for it to close and the etf provider should return your money.
@@fredatlas4396 You have no idea what you are talking about, which is even more astonishing given that the video clearly explained the risk. The problem is not about "index crashing" or if "ETFs close" but if your broker committed fraud and then is not willing (or rather not capable) to correct the fraud. To give a direct example: If you have invested 300k in e.g. a MSCI World ETF via Interactive Brokers (IB) you run the (theoretical) risk that IB committed fraud while investing the money. What does that mean? Well, you think you have 300k in the ETF but actually IB used the money (in a fraudulent way) to do something completely different, e.g. to pay its executives a bonus or something else (does not matter what, it just matters, that it did not use the money to buy the ETF shares). Now, if IB were to go broke in non-fraudolent scenarios this would not be an issue, since your ETFs would be separate from the brokers assets. But in this case you do NOT have the ETF shares, you only believed you had them since IB made you believe so (fraud!). In fact you do not own any ETF shares and since IB went broke it cannot compensate for the fraud one of its employees committed. In that case the only thing you will get back of your 300k are 20k in Europe (!!). That's it - this has nothing to do with how indices go or whether ETFs are "closed". Simply the fraud protection in the EU for these cases is just 20k.
Wow! This is shocking! I didn't know the protection was so low. Congratulations on your 300!
Very well done Angelo, someone at last needed to talk about this!!
I never knew this. Thank you for discussing it!
As always an outstanding video, Angelo!
Thanks for sharing this info
Thanks for another great video Angelo! Could you please do one on UCITS ETFs? I'd like to know why our expense ratios are so much more than the ETFs in US. Take care!
One more realistic video, without any fake "positive thinking" and only real important things talked about. Appreciate your videos a lot.
Thanks for addressing the topic many of us wanted to understand better. I wanted to understand this and saw people discussing this topic on reddit. I have shared this video with those subreddit forums.
Thank you so much for your channel!
great video. Thanks!
Thank you Sir!
Thanks for all your vids mate! Great to have a channel focusing on Europe. Really helpful and definitely will change to ibkr as well from DeGiro. Also going from vwrl to vwce with a big lump sum investing that we hopefully can do soon and from that moment coastfire :). Greetings from Spain!
Hello Angelo, this was literally my main concern when I started (2 month ago). Because when I think of a long term investment(40 years), security is the number one priority. It's very odd that so many youtuber investors are talking about, "best ETF" "low fees" "best broker" but then miss the most important factor, to have your money in the end.. thank you. Saved the video for the future to rewatch!
What a great video. Thank you for the information.
Thank you for discussing this topic! Literally none talks about it.
Super informative video, thanks!
Good one Angelo, 20k as insurance is nothing and has to be adjusted according to inflation.
These concerns should probably be addressed to local and EU consumer organizations
Thanks for this kind video.
It will affect my future decisions and investment transfer.
This channel inspire me from 2021 about investing...
Great content!
Hi Angelo! Love your channel!
Could you make a video on portfolio trackers best suited for people like us, european retail investors?
Hi Angelo, thank you for your awesome content!! I would love to see a video with a step by step on how to open an account on Interactive brokers.
Hi, great stuff. That was the first thing I was questioning after getting some first money to invest. The second is how to crate payout "structure" to have smallest amount of money being spend on taxes when we retire early.
Great video! This is a subject that no one breaches in UA-cam especially for EU investors. Thank you for the information Angelo!
Is Interactive broker Europe a separate entity from the US one? In other words, are we being taxed twice from Interactive Broker(once for US taxes and secondly we ALSO pay local taxes? (by the way, you can open a LLC entity in the US with $200 and invest your funds under the LLC)
Hi,Birdwingo same proctection as IB I think?
Grateful for this analysis. It is actually very hard to find credible info on this, especially on 'what if' scenarios. I think it is also important to mention that IB cover DEPENDS on your location, some fall under Ireland, others under Hungary/Central Europe. Central Europe accounts do actually cover 100.000 EUR in contrast to Ireland's 20.000.
As far as I'm aware, IBCE is no more and everyone in Europe was moved to IBIE.
@@AngeloColomboFi I think they are still in the transition process, but the direction of travel is clear (towards Ireland, meaning 20.000 only) and definitely not in the interest of investors :)
I think in this case it depends, a lot of investors complained about having their investments in Hungary and not being able to use certain features due to limitations. I remember plenty of threads on Reddit with people wanting to move from IBCE to IBIE
In Europe, they just want you to put your money in the banks so that they eat it twice, once by heavy Tax you pay and secondly by inflation they are responsible for !!
Thank you very much for touching on that sensitive topic. I subscribed to your channel after watching this video
Hi Angelo. What is your opinion about XTB?
Probably fine, as long as you're investing in actual ETFs/stocks and not CFDs or anything similar.
Thank you for the video! I kept looking info for this topic but there wasn't someone talking about it in more detail. My only question is: who funds the 20.000 euros if the broker bankrupts?
Thank you so much for the video! What about Raiffeisen depot (Austria)? Safe? Should I look for another broker?
Safe but very expensive. Flatex is a much better option, while still taking care of any taxes for you in Austria: angelo.fi/flatex
Very good video, as usual. :-)
Regarding the 4 brokers you have...a question.
As for Flatex...is it Degiro?
Flatex owns (Flatex) Degiro, but flatex, the bank itself, is only available to very few countries i think, just Austria and germany.
Flatex has no share lending, is profitable and is a publicly listed company (FlatexDegiro), therefore they're a great option! The broker itself is still separate from Degiro, which they acquired.
So would it be a good option to open an account with a US-based broker? And if we buy stocks via Interactive Brokers but in the US market, would it be a different scenario?
thank you. Out of curiosity why dont you use saxobank?
They have (or had?) high fees when I last looked at them. I also don't see any added benefits over using IBKR and Trade Republic
Very nice and important video to discuss and highlight to European investors. Thank you for summing this up. Very valuable video!👍
And let me ask if you know, is it possible to transfer stocks and ETF's from eToro to Interactive Brokers ?
I'm asking as I plan to move all to IBKR exactly because of todays discussed topic from you.
Thanks in advance and continue with the good work.🙂
Thank you David! Sadly it doesn't seem like you can transfer anything from eToro:
"The eToro investment platform is NOT an exchange or a marketplace, and it is therefore not possible to initiate a stock transfer between eToro and a third-party venue (and vice versa). This means that all positions that are opened with eToro must be closed with eToro."
@@AngeloColomboFi Thank you very much for checking on this and sharing the info. Only it is a sad thing since I would need now to close all positions and pay for capital gain and only then buy the same on IBKR.
But it's still some gain, right...and we learn each day something new. 🙂
Thank you, Angelo, for speaking up about such an important financial topic. What about the Italian broker Directa? Is it comparable to Trade Republic or IB in terms of reputation and solidity?
My pleasure! You should probably ask my friend Giorgio aka. Mr. Rip about this, he might now more with his Italian audience :)
www.youtube.com/@mr_rip
Thank you to share this with us. Question out topic, do you think that using Getquin is safe?
Thanks in advance
Andrea
My pleasure! Do you mean connecting your broker to Getquin? I do think so, but I'm a bit paranoid when it comes to security, so I still track everything in Portfolio Performance first and then import the csv files in Getquin so that everything is a lot nicer to look at and track
Thank you for your answer!!! I will have a look ☺️
@@AngeloColomboFiis porfolio performance another app to track investments?
Thank you for your answer ☺️
As im not from Europe with ibkr from africa im under ibkr us scheme as my papers say and thats good
It is about limiting freedom
So if we own US stocks they should be protected up to 500k, right?
Hi Angelo, i am down from 40 PAC to 30 PAC, i ve taken off us stocks pacs since i found out there are double taxation of the profits from them us and italy, i countinue to keep us based etf's i hope this double taxation issue isnt the case for them like indiviudual stocks and i stopped buying cryptos now buying only crypto etfs
Here in the UK which is no longer in the EU for some time now, you get up to £85000 protection for each bank account or investment platforn you have, but if your investments do very badly there's no protection for that. And if the 2 banks you have money in for example are both owned by the same company, Part of the same business you only get £85000 protection over both not £170000. Plus ETF,S aren't covered under the UK Fscs government scheme. Plus no government anywhere in the world , nobody will compensate anyone for loses in their investment if the index, stock etc crashes. You invest at your own risk. And the money in your account is kept separate from the brokerage company
What about investing in the US from the EU? Would that be impossible?
T212 also have investor fund insurance up to 1M for each iinvestor
That one is sadly pretty worthless, since you don't know the total for all customers. Most likely not more than 20 million € or so for all clients combined
Hey Angelo, new subscriber here, great insighs. Do you have a Schenkungsteuer in Austria like that in Germany? I never fully understood that tax so just to be sure me and my wife have different accounts both on scalable capital. I see you and your wife have joint account. I am curious whats your opinnion on that. Thanks.
Thank you! No, we luckily have no Schenkungssteuer in Austria. We also have separate accounts, because in Austria we're still taxed individually even as a married couple (no tax advantages in this regard).
Thanks for the video. Very important topic. You mention that you are “close” to retirement. Can you share your “retirement plan”?
My pleasure! I talked about it in these two videos: ua-cam.com/video/HCwoH-W25bQ/v-deo.html and ua-cam.com/video/b_TXq9H8prQ/v-deo.html
Hi Angelo, I see that Mintos is crowdfunding and has offered early access to Mintos users to invest. Do you have any thoughts on this?
I mentioned it in my last video, since I have no experience with crowdfunding and I'm happy with my existing investments I won't be joining personally
Hi Angelo, your videos are always very valueable, thanks for the work and creative thinking. ı am a Turkish resident and IBKR account in US. It says the following in their website 'The securities portions of your account is insured for up to $30 million regardless of your country of residency.' so I cannot releta to what you described as 500 T$. may be security do not contain ETF's. Can you clarify? many thanks
As a Turkish resident, you most likely you fall under the SIPC insurance, so your account should be covered up to $500K
Angelo, what about Scalable Capital? Are they safe for etf savingplan?
Yes, Scalable is an excellent option as well with no share lending, that's regulated in Germany.
Please do a Video- how to file TAX Profit/Lose with Austrian Authority for Interactive Brokers (EU) investor.
is XTB a good choise to get my investments protected?
As long as you're buying physical ETFs or stocks and not CFDs or derivatives then I do think they should be fine!
Could you do a review of XTB and Freedom 24 regarding this topic aswell?
Thank you!
XTB is probably fine, as long as you hold physical ETFs/stocks instead of CFDs or other forms of derivatives. With Freedom24 I wouldn't feel too comfortable holding over €20K personally, as they're based in Cyprus and their holding company in Kazakhstan doesn't have the cleanest record: www.cnbc.com/2023/10/06/doj-scrutinizing-kazakh-freedom-holding-after-hit-by-short-sellers.html
Thank you Angelo! I have also opted for diversifying across a few brokers, but definately not ideal. Lets hope the EU get their act together soon!
Didn’t know the asset protection was so low when it comes to fraud! Thanks for the information!
Yes, now you know why you really have to dig deep to find this information on any European broker's website :/
Please note that in Europe is commonplace, for an investor, to have two or more bank accounts. Usually the first one is with a traditional "physical" bank and the second one is with a "modern", "virtual" or "digital" one. Moreover, it is quite common to have one or more trading account with one or more broker, beside the bank accounts. The typical european investor has only 30% - 70% of its money invested in financial instruments (liquidity, ETF, stock and bonds). The rest is usually invested in real estate, physical Gold and other "physical" instruments. A few investors also have *foreign* (and legitimate) bank account, usually in US$ or Swiss Francs.
He probably knows, as he's also from Europe.
Besides, 2-3 bank accounts don't protect your 500k investment in securities/ETFs, you'd only get 20k each.
In the US, you wouldn't have to worry at all about having 500k at one broker.
Thank you so much, just found you on YT, a new member. I was looking for this. Do you know anything about Mexem?
My pleasure! As far as I know, Mexem is an introducing broker for Interactive Brokers. You'll get lower fees signing up to Interactive Brokers directly though: angelo.fi/ibkr
@@AngeloColomboFi thank you!! Know what to do 👍 glad I found you
Amazing, my two brokers (DeGiro and T212) are listed as not as secure haha
Again, all of this is just about theoretical "what if" scenarios and trying to minimize any potential risk as far as possible. And of course everyone has their personal preference and gut feeling when it comes to these decisions. You can actually opt out of share lending on T212 now, something I hadn't noticed when I recorded.
When we buy shares on Degiro, we don’t actually own them? Or is just them can lend our owned shares? Would it be possible to transfer from Degiro to IBKR?
You still own them, Degiro simply has the right to generate revenue from them by lending them out against collateral. Yes, I've done that myself here: ua-cam.com/video/1IT9O5WyF30/v-deo.htmlsi
Thank you for this video. You cover a very important topic that is rarely discussed on YT. I am currently using etoro. What do you think about this platform? Shall I diversify using another broker to spread the risk? Thanks a lot for your insight.
eToro is in my opinion one of the worst platforms for long-term investing. It's based in Cyprus, a country known for limited supervision of financial institutions. You should watch Angelo's video called 'The BEST BROKERS for Europeans in 2024 (ETFs & Stocks)'. He also addresses eToro in that video.
You're very welcome! Etoro wouldn't be my first choice long-term, I talked about why here: ua-cam.com/video/4B05bx3pHT8/v-deo.html
@@AngeloColomboFi thanks a lot for taking the time to answer. I’ll watch your video.
Hallo Angelo, is it better to add to ur account that u have accumulated some money in or to start from scratch in another broker buying the same ETF ! Or technically its the same because mon3y will get affected by the same percentage yearly nearly 8% !
The same ETF will have identical returns no matter if it's held on one or several brokers.
Thanks for that Angelo. I knew nothing about this topic.
I’d like to ask you what’s your take on socially responsible investing. You don’t hear a lot talking about ESG anymore and I’m concerned with “green washing” frankly. Do you know for example any good green ETF (for example in renewable enwrgy sources) that might perform well from a risk/reward standpoint?
Green bonds, to my knowledge, don’t offer great returns compared to even other bonds so there’s only the “altruistic” element that justifies it as an investment.
Thanks!
I'm not a fan of ESG investing, because the rules regarding which company is considered "good" or "bad" are changed all the time and seem to really be personal preference of the index providers or fund managers. Some funds even exclude Tesla for political reasons. There's a reason why ESG investing is pretty much dead in the US, it's just Europe where this keeps getting forced on us by the EU.
I definitely don't think there's a reason to believe ESG investing would lead to better long-term returns vs. just passively buying the market as a whole
@@AngeloColomboFi Great thanks Angelo!
There is a second risk for us EU investors, that is the Euro/Dollar currency risk. How can I limit this risk? My ETF portfolio consists of IWDA and EMIM, what is your view on this?
It's both a risk and opportunity, as you're investing into thousands of stocks operating in different currencies. Trying to hedge against it makes no sense in my opinion when investing globally, unless you're convinced the EUR will be the best performing currency (which I certainly don't)
I'm wondering how I can buy SCHD from IB as where I try to buy it I get a message saying I need a NEN in English. How can I have it, I'm from Spain!
Gotta use options son
Hi Angelo,
Does that mean Flatex also involves with share lending? I am now worried as I recently opened and started using Flatex as my investment broker. I chose it because they would take care of tax filing for me (I live in Austria btw), but I oversaw this! Thanks for pointing it out!
I really wanted to stay away from Interactive Brokers because I did not want to bother with the tax filing. Do you suggest I switch to Trade Republic?
Nope, Flatex is great! No share lending, profitable, publicly listed company and tax-easy for Austrians 👌
@@AngeloColomboFi Thats a relief, thanks a lot!
Btw, if its an interesting topic to cover, please do one explaining the ETF taxes in Austria? I saw your video on the ETF taxes on Europe and you covered Austria briefly. However, I am still struggling to understand them in detail and the calculation of taxes you showed for individual ETFs in the excel file. You could share your experiences, also maybe sharing the tax rates you were charged.
Can you make a video for Freedom 24?
Thanks in advance!
I mentioned Freedom24 here: ua-cam.com/video/4B05bx3pHT8/v-deo.html
I wouldn't feel comfortable holding more than €20K there personally, but that's just my personal opinion
@@AngeloColomboFiThank you for the information! 🙏🙏🙏
Angelo, could you do some analysis of complaints with Trade republic on Reddit and other online forums?
I already contacted Trade Republic about it, they informed me that improving customer service times is currently their top priority, they've simply been overwhelmed by the number of new customers the past few months.
Angelo is there any “central authority” that we verify that INDEED all the stocks in IBKR belong to us? I know if we ask the company will tell us that you can transfer them and it’s enough. BUT I want someone ELSE from central authority to verify from OUTSIDE of the company to verify what exactly holdings are registered in my name. Is it possible?
how about your flatex? save enough?
Yes, Flatex is great! No share lending, profitable and also a publicly listed company
I remember when I first registered on DeGiro and saw this 20k thing that it shocked me :/ I did not look up how it would compare to the US, but just remember feeling very uneasy about it, and agree that it makes no sense that it's so much lower than the deposit guarantee...
Hi Angelo, what about Revolut? There is a 20k limit but are the shares/ etf under the clients ownership or is it risky as well ?
Revolut is using 3rd party brokers (DriveWealth LLC) for your shares. You need to get familiarized also with T&C of that broker in terms of investor protection and operation of your shares. And then let me know as well. I have been trying to do the same for a while now. 😂
As far as I'm aware, you're not able to transfer shares away from Revolut, meaning you're locked in to the broker. That in itself is already a no-go in my opinion. Haven't looked into it that much further yet.
@@AngeloColomboFiindeed, as it currently stands, you cannot transfer shares. But the big ambiguity is around the protection
i created my Interactive broker account.Planning to move my stuff there and not keep more than 20k in Revolut. I think thats the safest and easiest
Trading 212 has FSCS protection up to £85,000. Its also registered not only in Cyrpus and Bulgaria, but the UK and Australia also.
Yes, but only if you're based in the UK. EU customers fall under the Cyprus regulation and the €20K compensation in that country. Again, everyone has their personal preferences with these decisions, which is totally fine!
is it limited to 20K? Because the document you showed in the beginning states "a minimum level of 20K"
Sadly most countries only offer the minimum, yes. Only very few in the EU have slightly higher limits (eg. France has 70K, Portugal 25K, Greece 30K), but that's clearly not close to enough either and you would have to use a broker that's based in those countries.
I didn't fully understand the limits with Degiro. But out of curiosity, is there a way to transfer ETF shares from DeGiro to Trade Republic?
Yes there is, just email both involved parties and customer support will reply
What do you mean? Degiro has the same 20K investor compensation and 100K guarantee for cash deposits. They simply lend out shares, which is a small added risk.
Yes, here is what I did to transfer shares from Degiro to IBKR, you can do the same to transfer them to Trade Republic instead: ua-cam.com/video/1IT9O5WyF30/v-deo.html
On Trade Republic, how can a share belong to you if they also offer fractional shares?
Full shares are entirely yours and fractional shares (eg. 0.33 shares if you hold 170.33 for example) are also legally yours and protected, but Trade Republic has to buy the full share itself and assign the fractions to each investor in its own books.
Any thought about Directa? (Italian broker)
Haven't looked into it much, you should probably ask my friend Giorgio aka. Mr. Rip about this, he might now more with his Italian audience :)
www.youtube.com/@mr_rip
@@AngeloColomboFi of course I follow him! Thank you anyway for the answer and above all for your videos, I’m close to be a “VWCE maximalist” and I’m “pushing” all your videos to my 25 yo son so he will start investing sooner and better than his dad!
Very nice video, I was searching for this information and I feel it is unfair to only have 20,000 EUR investor compensation scheme !! Thank you very much for this video
What if you open a "depot" in a bank (for example Reiffeisen). Is that also transferable and safe?
The 20K investor compensation still applies, but it should still be safe and transferrable, although likely with high fees for the transfer
High fees on your total account value and orders very likely as well.
Banks are usually terrible as brokers, way too expensive.
This is even more joke if you consider how much effort was put by EU to implement PRIIPs/KIDs regulation to "protect" investors. Which in reality protect you totaly in many cases - from making any investments into ETFs. But you can still buy single stocks from the same ETF.
Just like removing our option to be SIPC insured up to $500K on IB after Brexit and forcing us to take the €20K protection instead. Clearly in our best interest 🙄
This is why I prefer real estate. Tangible asset.
I already knew these numbers, but I'm glad you put the info out there for everyone. It's really annoying. As you said, this basically is like the EU sending a message that investing is bad, and we are gamblers not deserving proper institutional protection for investments. Then they wonder why the European economy is not growing more (among other reasons as well)
What are you opinion on XTB? I use it in Portugal
tambem gostava de uma opiniao à certa da XBT, vejo os videos do Tiago Ramos e sei que os nossos ETFs/Ações estão protegidas e consegues passar para outra corretora caso a XTB for abaixo mas apenas se tiveres uma fração inteira do teu ETFs/Ação, mas não percebo esta proteçao de 20mil que ele esta a falar, se eu tiver 50mil investido so consigo transferir 20 mil para outra corretora?
Se tiveres ações/etf inteiros conseguirás transferir tudo pra outro broker "facilmente" . Coisas fracionadas , se houver falência vai ser complicado pra não dizer impossível (realisticamente)
@@luisfernandes2522 mas ai a minha recomendação é nunca comprares ações ou ETFs fracionados, seja e que Broker for
para mim não ha problema com etfs fracionados, acho um bocado dificil alguem a longo prazo não ter ainda umas quantas frações por inteiro.@@luisfernandes2522
@@user-fo1yl5jg7i os 20mil é para dinheiro que esteja na conta mas não esteja investido. Ações e etfs são propriedade tua e podes ter até 1 milhão que continuará a ser tua. O que estiver fraccionado não te pertence porque não existem ações fraccionadas. O que acontece nestes casos é o broker comprar a ação e dividir em pedaços. Mas aí a ação é dele. Só com unidades completas é que serás o dono.
What's you'r opinion about Scalable ?
I like them, never had any issues. Their custodian bank (Baader Bank) can be a bit slow though compared to Trade Republic & IBKR when it comes to deposits & withdrawals
@@AngeloColomboFi thanks for the great answer !
Investor protections should not exist. It's just bailing out people with tax payer money. I really don't understand how you would think increasing deposit guarantees should be a positive.
Since the deposit guarantee fund has very limited funds it is maybe enough to cover 1 or 2 small banks, anything above that would need to be pitched in by the ECB, which would cause massive inflation.
Is there a way to check that indeed our investments is in our name?
Usually they're in the broker's name at the depositories and the broker keeps precise records of how much each investor owns.
But if the ETFs are deposited in your name in a separate institution e.g. HSBC in the case of Trade Republic, the only way the investor compensation scheme would ever apply is fraud. If someone were worried could they not independently contact HSBC (or whomever is holding the ETFs) and verify that what they have in reality matches what the broker tells them?
Yes, fraud is the only scenario where this would ever be needed. So it's close to impossible for any of us to ever need to make use of the €20K insurance when using well-regulated brokers. I still think the insurance amount should be increased significantly to add an extra layer of safety, as is the case in the US. Sadly that's not possible for us, but regulators regularly review that the amount of assets held at the depositories match client assets on brokerage accounts.
Trade Republic is great, no doubts. But it's not available in most of European countries.
I mean 17 countries is not too bad, but it's sadly limited to the eurozone for now
Ich denke, ich hab das ( Investment Compensation) nicht so ganz verstanden. Also wenn Scalable bspl. Pleite geht, dann werden meine Aktien und Etfs auf einen anderen Broker übertragen. Weil es hier um ein "Sondervermögen" geht. Das Geld in meinem Depot bzw. in meinem Verrechnungskonto ist bis 100 Tausend Euro gesichert.
In welchem Fall denn werde ich nur 20 Tausend Euro zurückbekommen ? 😅
Im sehr unwahrscheinlichen Fall von Betrug (z.B. Aktien/ETFs wurden nicht gekauft oder sind bei Pleite des Brokers aus welchem Grund auch immer nicht auffindbar), ist dieses Vermögen nur bis 20.000€ abgesichert.
@@AngeloColomboFi Danke für die Erklärung !
EU investor landscape is dominated by institutional investors, as Europeans are generally savers not investors. Whereas in Australia if a broker goes bust they transfer your shares to another broker.
From what I've been reading, assets in IBKR and most brokers are not really in your name, but rather in "street name", so what the video says in terms of custody is misleading. Your name is not on the registry when you buy something, but instead, the name of the broker appears. So while one has the right of ownership, one doesn't have true ownership. Since only the broker has internal information saying who owns what, if they go bankrupt...I've also read that some brokers do give you true ownership, but they are a lot more expensive. You can request to have them held in your name directly (not with IBKR apparently), though this is unusual and may impact the services available to your account.
Any insight on how that affects business accounts that have LEI? I'm just guessing, if you're right, that true ownership you can get buying shares through every-day 'true' banks that charge you like 20 euros for transaction.
With ETFs there is no way to have your own name show up all the way down the custody/depository chain or if there is, it's prohibitively expensive. However, you are the ultimate beneficial owner of the shares. A broker going bankrupt doesn't change anything, your shares remain yours and can't be touched. The only exception is if fraud is involved, which is why you should pick well-regulated options that are regularly checked.
This is shocking. Time to change this together
Governments always support banks that's why the compensation is way larger. They don't want people taking cash from banks and investing it with brokers.
I have the same impression
the 100k€ is actual just for the "cash" that you have deposited at said broker...
In germany at least, your stocks/Etfs/bonds etc are not part of the "insolvenc-mass" if said broker would go bankrupt, the stocks are fully OWNED by you, yes the stocks are stored at the Bank-depot like "baader bank" or others, but they are "Sondervermögen" and therefore cant be used to pay debts the broker or bank has... funnily enough, there is only one broker that i know of, where the stocks etc... arent "sondervermögen" and thats "interactive brokers" xD
which is tbh kind sad, since it offers way more stocks and bonds be it mexican, indian or generally more stocks from "non-Western" countries
What you're talking about are segregated accounts that exclusively belong to customers, it's the same on German brokers and IBKR. In either case they're protected from bankruptcy.
Make sure you double-check whatever source you got that info from, as it's nonsense.
tbh i dont know if im 100% right because there is no clear answer in various german forums, but thats how i interpret the law any many others so dunno @@AngeloColomboFi
Thats true. Only your Cash assests are above 100k in danger if the Bank got bankrupt. If your assests are All in ETF, they Do not belong to the Bank and are untouchable. So, I dont know why making a Big Deal about it. And even if you have over 100k Cash - just Split it and deposit it to different banks.
Is it possible to transfer investment from Trading 212 to Interactive Brokers? Is there fee for that?
Seems like Interactive Brokers is not on the list: helpcentre.trading212.com/hc/en-us/articles/16049242628381-What-are-the-supported-brokers-for-portfolio-transfers
Perhaps because they're using IBKR in the backend themselves?
That is a good question for their customer support, because they have this quote elsewhere on their website: 'We work with Interactive Brokers, one of the largest brokers in the world, to help safeguard your assets. Our relationship with Interactive Brokers is governed by custody agreements that meet the Safeguarding of Client Assets rules...'
They are rolling out this feature now, and it is free.
@@AngeloColomboFiapparently IBKR will be supported later
You are right. I looked it up in February when they started to roll out this feature, and it was definitely there, but since them they have trimmed the list quite a lot@@centrino538
LIghtyear: Your US securities are held with our partner Alpaca, who is FINRA regulated and a registered member of the SIPC. This means your US securities are protected up to the value of $500,000 should Alpaca fail.
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Yes, all Lightyear customers have their assets covered up to the amount of 20,000 EUR by the Estonian Investor Protection Sectoral Fund.
I personally stopped with Trade Republic's 4% interest rate a few days ago. As far as I know, this is still under partner banks and not under their own banking license. I, and all my acquaintances, fall under Citibank, German Branch. This bank is covered by Ireland's deposit guarantee scheme. Ireland only issues checks for the deposit guarantee scheme, these are no longer legal tender in the Netherlands since 2011. I contacted Trade Republic; there is no way to switch partner banks. In addition, I have contacted the DGS in Ireland; they indicate that checks are still the only possible means of payment. So the Irish deposit guarantee scheme is pretty much useless to us. I guess it's useful for others to be aware of this and check for themselves if the same applies to them.
how can you check which bank do you fall under if you have cash in Trade Rep?
I understand, hopefully they'll be able to run everything through their own bank soon and we can forget all about this. My account is with Deutsche Bank in Germany, but I wouldn't be too worried about Citibank either, as it's one of the largest banks worldwide and likely systemically important. But of course I'd also be pissed if I had to find a way to somehow get my money back via cheque 😅
@@AngeloColomboFi Yeah, I hope Trade Republic will start using its own banking license soon. In any case, I'm still excited about the future of Trade Republic and look forward to the payment card.
@@MrSunys You can check the BIC in the app when you click your letter circle in the top-left corner. The BIC is below the IBAN of your account. CITIDEFF = Citibank. I am not sure about other BIC's, but a simple Google search should give you an answer.
Going to report on the card as well soon, just got mine a week ago here in Austria! As an affiliate I got mine early so that I can test it out, I think they're only starting to roll it out in countries other than Germany now
Can you recommend any reliable brokers in Finland?
My two favorite brokers Interactive Brokers and Trade Republic (linked in the description) can be used in Finland as well 👌
Is Degiro safe?
Most likely yes, but the share lending by default introduces some counterparty risk and can mess with proper asset segregation
@@AngeloColomboFi thank you for replying, I have a custody account in DEGIRO
In that case absolutely!
As a European I prefer the US. market over Europe. US doesn't have a bear next door to threaten them, but we do.