Hello lovelies! You guys can find the WRITTEN NOTES for this book on my website via this link: www.moaninc.co.uk/homers-iliad/book-18-summary . Hope this helps! xx
Achilles’ sorrow at losing Patroclus is still one of the most heart-wrenching depictions of loss I’ve ever read. And I can never re-read it without imagining Alexander feeling similarly over Hephaestion’s passing.
"I must reject this life, my heart tells me, reject the world of men, if Hector does not feel my battering spear, tear the life out of him, making him pay in his own blood for the slaugher of Patroclus." Thetis let a tear fall and said: "You will be swift to meet your end, child. Your fall follows close on the heels of Hector's own." Achilles: "Then may it come quickly. As things are, I could not help my friend in his extremity. Far from his home he died. He needed me to shield him, to parry the death stroke. For me there's no return to my own country. Not a shimmer of hope did I afford Patroclus, or the other men, whom Hector overpowered. Herere I sat, my weight a burden to the earth. And I am one who knows no peer in war among the Acheaens, though in council there are wiser."
You are helping us a lotttttttttttt, I can't even explain, I don't understand what my teacher teaches in the class but then i come to you and got the whole episode, love love love to you ❤️❤️❤️
you are literally saving my life, after listening your videos, I read the book and I can definately say that it gets soooo much easier to understand while reading! LOVE YOU
I was assigned to read the Iliad for my midterm literature class exam. I didn’t study until the day of the exam and your videos on the Iliad have helped me pass the midterm with a B+ You explain everything so well!!
_”And over against them Antilochus wailed and shed tears, holding the hands of Achilles, that in his noble heart was moaning mightily; for he feared lest he should cut his throat asunder with the knife.”_ 😭
“here in front of your flaming pyre I’ll cut the throat of a dozen sons of Troy in all their shining glory” i don’t think this necessarily means children, a 40 year old man is still someone’s son. maybe it’s translated differently in other versions though, im quoting the Robert Fagles translation here. i love these videos btw! thank you so much for making them!
Yes, we are later told that the 12 young Trojans Achilles sacrifices/kills in revenge for Patroclus at his funeral are youths Achilles captures in battle, so presumably at least teenagers old enough to be sent into combat.
Achilles just standing there without gear and yelling makes the Trojans so afraid, they and their horses trample each other to death. So Achilles literally yells them to death. And that's how the Greeks gets Patroclus' body back.
Thanks, as ever, for a lively, spirited narration. Interested by the insight that Achilles' behaviour at the death of Patroclus is how a female, rather than a male, mourner was expected to behave in that culture (although is Priam's reaction to the death of Hector later in the story somewhat similar?) I had not thought of that before. Minor point, but at 3.22 reference to Achilles pouring Earth over his 'toga', I thought the toga was a specifically Roman garment, 'formal dress' worn to the Senate or a smart dinner, described in one book I read as a 'deliberately impractical' garment, worn to show that the wearer expected to be 'waited on hand and foot'? Not the kind of thing that was suitable to wear to go hunting or plough a field or probably for an army camp lately under attack. I looked at a translation I had and a couple more I found online, and they all said 'scented tunic' rather than 'toga'. 4.15 'female mourners who come out of the ships, all the women that they have that Patroclus knew' The Greeks have not brought any of their own women with them to Troy. These are women from the enemy side whom Achilles and Patroclus enslaved when they conquered and destroyed Trojan cities. Whether, despite that, they mourn Patroclus from genuine affection (even if he has just been eagerly killing Trojan men on the battlefield, off the battlefield he is described as kind), or under compulsion, or to ingratiate themselves with Achilles who is dangerously angry at this point, or what, we are not told.
I’ve gotta tell you, you were right about The Women Of Troy. At first I really really enjoyed it, I liked the new characters they introduced and I thought the stage was set for a really interesting story. But it kinda turns into a slog at some point and I’m having trouble just getting through it. It’s such a shame because there’s so much good stuff here, it’s got something to say, and Pat Barker as an author is immensely talented. For whatever reason it just doesn’t work as well as The Silence Of The Girls. I hope the series continues though and she gets back to form. I did get Daughters of Sparta on audible 2 nights ago though and I’m very excited to start that.
Hector primarily wanted Patroclus’s body to desecrate it. He was gonna put Patroclus’s head on a spike and feed his body to the dogs. This was all to hurt Achilles. The Greeks fought to get Patroclus’s body back both because they loved Patroclus but also because there was a very real fear amongst the Greeks that if Hector _did_ follow through with desecrating Patroclus’s corpse then Achilles would kill _everyone._ Not just all the Trojans but all the Greeks as well. So the focus of the battle on the Greeks’s end was getting Patroclus back to camp so that an already bad situation didn’t become worse.
13.59 Achilles 'does add that he must kill 12 Trojan children' before he buries his friend Patroclus. These will be the 12 who are taking part in the battle in Book 21 whom Achilles captures, and then sacrifices on Patroclus' funeral pyre (along with horses and 2 of Patroclus' dogs!) in Book 23. Hence, presumably, Trojan 'children' in the sense of offspring, but at least adolescent boys by the time they are killed or they would not have been sent out to battle? Little children would not have the strength to bear the arms and armour? Even so, merciless. **** Less savagely, this chapter/Book 18 contains what I think must be the first robots in World literature. Near the end of the Book Thetis visits the blacksmith god Hephaestos's fiery forge to obtain new armour for Achilles. It is not central to the plot so I expect Erica left it out for brevity, but in the Iliad Hephaestos is described as having strange assistants working for him fashioned out of gold, in form like women and having powers of thought and speech and taught skills by the gods. These golden slaves are only in a few lines in the Iliad and I don't know if Homer thought of them as driven by machinery or by magic, or whether he even thought there was a difference between technology and sorcery, but I wish he told us more about these unusual beings. As for the self-propelled, Artificially Intelligent tripods that Hephaestos has made for the gods, while I have very little Greek myself, I understand they are referred to in the Iliad in the original Greek as 'automata' (singular 'autometon'), meaning self-driving, the first recorded use of the word.
Wouldn't that be part of Achilles' armour that Patroclus was borrowing when he was killed? If so, have the Trojans stripped it from Patroclus's corpse as a war trophy/booty, a common practice then?
Erica reading for those under like 50 is mostly just a long word.They don't anymore they watch the movie wyhich in most cases but especally this one would be a very stupid thing
Just thought I’d let you know that I have been listening to the chapters after your summaries every time. 😅🤣Honestly it’s so much more understandable with them you’re the best (also you’re so pretty like how) 🫶🏻❤️
Hello lovelies! You guys can find the WRITTEN NOTES for this book on my website via this link: www.moaninc.co.uk/homers-iliad/book-18-summary . Hope this helps! xx
Achilles’ sorrow at losing Patroclus is still one of the most heart-wrenching depictions of loss I’ve ever read. And I can never re-read it without imagining Alexander feeling similarly over Hephaestion’s passing.
🥺😮💨
"I must reject this life, my heart tells me, reject the world of men, if Hector does not feel my battering spear, tear the life out of him, making him pay in his own blood for the slaugher of Patroclus." Thetis let a tear fall and said: "You will be swift to meet your end, child. Your fall follows close on the heels of Hector's own." Achilles: "Then may it come quickly. As things are, I could not help my friend in his extremity. Far from his home he died. He needed me to shield him, to parry the death stroke. For me there's no return to my own country. Not a shimmer of hope did I afford Patroclus, or the other men, whom Hector overpowered. Herere I sat, my weight a burden to the earth. And I am one who knows no peer in war among the Acheaens, though in council there are wiser."
You are helping us a lotttttttttttt, I can't even explain, I don't understand what my teacher teaches in the class but then i come to you and got the whole episode, love love love to you ❤️❤️❤️
🫶🏼
His over the top mourning reminds me of what he said in the movie Troy "I want what other men want I just want it more"
you are literally saving my life, after listening your videos, I read the book and I can definately say that it gets soooo much easier to understand while reading! LOVE YOU
I LOVE HEARING THIS!!! ❤️
I watch each of your episodes first, then I read it. Sometimes I rewatch your episode. Very helpful. Thank you.
I'm reading simultaneously The Iliad and the song of Achilles. I haven't done a thing rather than cry
This is the appropriate response
@@MoAnInc At this point Achilles and Patroclus are my gay icons in history and that's Canon for me
I was assigned to read the Iliad for my midterm literature class exam. I didn’t study until the day of the exam and your videos on the Iliad have helped me pass the midterm with a B+ You explain everything so well!!
I’m so glad these helped!!! 💗🤓✨
This is so sad, I cried when I read the book and I cried again watching your episode 😭
Thank you so much for making these amazing episodes
I cry literally EVERY TIME 😢 And thank you for watching!!!
_”And over against them Antilochus wailed and shed tears, holding the hands of Achilles, that in his noble heart was moaning mightily; for he feared lest he should cut his throat asunder with the knife.”_
😭
🥺
“here in front of your flaming pyre I’ll cut the throat of a dozen sons of Troy in all their shining glory”
i don’t think this necessarily means children, a 40 year old man is still someone’s son. maybe it’s translated differently in other versions though, im quoting the Robert Fagles translation here.
i love these videos btw! thank you so much for making them!
Yes, we are later told that the 12 young Trojans Achilles sacrifices/kills in revenge for Patroclus at his funeral are youths Achilles captures in battle, so presumably at least teenagers old enough to be sent into combat.
Achilles just standing there without gear and yelling makes the Trojans so afraid, they and their horses trample each other to death. So Achilles literally yells them to death. And that's how the Greeks gets Patroclus' body back.
Thank you so much cutie this was very helpful :)
You’re welcome 😇
Thanks, as ever, for a lively, spirited narration.
Interested by the insight that Achilles' behaviour at the death of Patroclus is how a female, rather than a male, mourner was expected to behave in that culture (although is Priam's reaction to the death of Hector later in the story somewhat similar?) I had not thought of that before.
Minor point, but at 3.22 reference to Achilles pouring Earth over his 'toga', I thought the toga was a specifically Roman garment, 'formal dress' worn to the Senate or a smart dinner, described in one book I read as a 'deliberately impractical' garment, worn to show that the wearer expected to be 'waited on hand and foot'? Not the kind of thing that was suitable to wear to go hunting or plough a field or probably for an army camp lately under attack.
I looked at a translation I had and a couple more I found online, and they all said 'scented tunic' rather than 'toga'.
4.15 'female mourners who come out of the ships, all the women that they have that Patroclus knew'
The Greeks have not brought any of their own women with them to Troy. These are women from the enemy side whom Achilles and Patroclus enslaved when they conquered and destroyed Trojan cities. Whether, despite that, they mourn Patroclus from genuine affection (even if he has just been eagerly killing Trojan men on the battlefield, off the battlefield he is described as kind), or under compulsion, or to ingratiate themselves with Achilles who is dangerously angry at this point, or what, we are not told.
I’ve gotta tell you, you were right about The Women Of Troy. At first I really really enjoyed it, I liked the new characters they introduced and I thought the stage was set for a really interesting story. But it kinda turns into a slog at some point and I’m having trouble just getting through it. It’s such a shame because there’s so much good stuff here, it’s got something to say, and Pat Barker as an author is immensely talented. For whatever reason it just doesn’t work as well as The Silence Of The Girls. I hope the series continues though and she gets back to form.
I did get Daughters of Sparta on audible 2 nights ago though and I’m very excited to start that.
Ah let me know how Daughters of Sparta goes!!!! 🤩
I love all the details he gives on the shield then the rest of the armor is just "he made armor"
they definitely got a lil smth else going on; just like me and the illiad 👍
Don't the Trojans want Patroclus' body to trade it for Sarpidions' because they don't know Zeus already sent it home?
Hector primarily wanted Patroclus’s body to desecrate it. He was gonna put Patroclus’s head on a spike and feed his body to the dogs. This was all to hurt Achilles. The Greeks fought to get Patroclus’s body back both because they loved Patroclus but also because there was a very real fear amongst the Greeks that if Hector _did_ follow through with desecrating Patroclus’s corpse then Achilles would kill _everyone._ Not just all the Trojans but all the Greeks as well. So the focus of the battle on the Greeks’s end was getting Patroclus back to camp so that an already bad situation didn’t become worse.
13.59 Achilles 'does add that he must kill 12 Trojan children' before he buries his friend Patroclus.
These will be the 12 who are taking part in the battle in Book 21 whom Achilles captures, and then sacrifices on Patroclus' funeral pyre (along with horses and 2 of Patroclus' dogs!) in Book 23. Hence, presumably, Trojan 'children' in the sense of offspring, but at least adolescent boys by the time they are killed or they would not have been sent out to battle? Little children would not have the strength to bear the arms and armour?
Even so, merciless.
****
Less savagely, this chapter/Book 18 contains what I think must be the first robots in World literature.
Near the end of the Book Thetis visits the blacksmith god Hephaestos's fiery forge to obtain new armour for Achilles. It is not central to the plot so I expect Erica left it out for brevity, but in the Iliad Hephaestos is described as having strange assistants working for him fashioned out of gold, in form like women and having powers of thought and speech and taught skills by the gods.
These golden slaves are only in a few lines in the Iliad and I don't know if Homer thought of them as driven by machinery or by magic, or whether he even thought there was a difference between technology and sorcery, but I wish he told us more about these unusual beings.
As for the self-propelled, Artificially Intelligent tripods that Hephaestos has made for the gods, while I have very little Greek myself, I understand they are referred to in the Iliad in the original Greek as 'automata' (singular 'autometon'), meaning self-driving, the first recorded use of the word.
I'm confused - I thought that Achilles already had a shield that Chiron gave him?
Wouldn't that be part of Achilles' armour that Patroclus was borrowing when he was killed? If so, have the Trojans stripped it from Patroclus's corpse as a war trophy/booty, a common practice then?
Erica reading for those under like 50 is mostly just a long word.They don't anymore they watch the movie wyhich in most cases but especally this one would be a very stupid thing
😂
Oh my god.good
😱
🫣
You're beautiful 😍
Just thought I’d let you know that I have been listening to the chapters after your summaries every time. 😅🤣Honestly it’s so much more understandable with them you’re the best (also you’re so pretty like how) 🫶🏻❤️
This makes me SO HAPPY!!!!!! Oh my god I’m so glad these are helping you!!! 😍