The Battle Over Quantum of Solace | A Fan Debate!
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- Опубліковано 26 сер 2024
- It's the battle James Bond Fans have been waiting for....The Battle Over Quantum of Solace. In the defender corner we have David Zaritsky, and in the challenger corner we have Calvin Dyson. The debate over this movie will be waged in our UA-cam arena where blood will be spilled, relationships will be changed, and names will be called. Witness the drama and despair of two different opinions of James Bond's 22nd movie!
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When David is not running an advertising and marketing company, his hobby is The Bond Experience which is primarily a video blog where he discusses Bond experiences and the people and brands that help to create those experiences...
David has been featured and sourced for articles in Time Magazine, The Boston Globe, The Courier Times, USA Today, Star Magazine, MM&M, The Exchange, The Guardian, The New York Times, Bond on Bond, American Media Inc., AP Wire and online social media outlets. David has been a speaker at Johns Hopkin, Hofstra University, Columbia as a Bond Experience expert. His collection represents one of the most complete example of Bond lifestyle items. Invited to cover Tom Ford, Omega, Heineken, Coke, Orlebar Brown, NPeal, Floris, Lock & Co., Sunspel, Turnbull & Asser, and a multitude of location partnership events, David has represented social media experiences for many years. In addition David has provided props and decor for Johns Hopkin Casino Royale and Quantum of Solace Premieres as well as the Devereaux Foundation 007 Fundraiser. The mantra of living like Bond, one moment at a time emanates from a concept of experiencing the joy of collecting small moments in life that add up to amazing journeys and stories....
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Credits:
Co-Editor: Joe Darlington
The Bond Experience is not affiliated with any James Bond copyright holder and is an unofficial entity.
For a pipsqueak, Dominic is startling in hand-to-hand combat. His awe-inspiring rage and relentlessness, primal screams and all, are an 11 on a ten scale.
I like the bit when Camille accuses him of trying to kill her and he just shrugs it off with a 'nobody's perfect' demeanor!
@@jamesatkinsonja The first three Craig Bond films are all great.
It's AFTER the 3 that it's starting to get bad
He did have a weapon and the jump on bond
I love this movie. Its short, fun and has great action. The villian is under utilized but I enjoy Greene as a character. The plot seems the most realistic of any bond movie.
If Greene as a villain came out today it would be better received.
Its my second fav Bond movie lol. Greene pisses me off so he is a good villain imo
Stealing 1/3 of Bolivian water supply is realistic?
Craig looks his best in QOS too. He's not the most handsome guy but in QOS he looks good and his wardrobe is cool.
Ohh it’s the fashion! let’s just cast male models as Bond then.
@@rogerpattube wow thanks for misunderstanding my point.
Sorry. Craig is the least handsome of all the Bonds cast, to date.
Movie still sucks. But yes, he looks better than on the Spectre poster with the goofy ears.
Spectre has the best costume design easily
The fight with Slate is one of the best fights in the series, so well choreographed and brutal. And I actually think it's really well shot and the quick cuts are done effectively for that scene.
I agree! I rewatched it not too long ago, and they actually hold the shots a little longer for that fight. It's really good
That he was a geologist named Slate was a little too tongue in cheek, even for a Bond movie
@@jonathannagel7427 I don't get the connection
@@14AspenDrive "Slate" is a type of rock. Slate was a geologist. That is all.
@@jukeboxjeffrey9102 aaah, thanks
This is the sort of film criticism I like to see. So much modern UA-cam film criticism talks about nothing but plot details, to hear you guys go into editing and shot composition is refreshing
I can't wait. I am one of the percentages of the Bond Community that thinks Quantum of Solace was a really worthwhile film with much in it that was fascinating in terms of Daniel Craig's Bond's journey.
@John Kelly Totally agree. So much that is good. As you said, some problems but so much to cherish. And Craig is so driven. So revengeful. I love his edge so much. And I would say, while there were lots of problems, Marc Forster is an artist. There was no doubt he was striving to create great work, and credit to him for that.
The editing just sucks to me. Other than that I like everything really. Could've been a bit longer too really.
I also defend TWINE. I love how cold 007 is in it.
Same. Featured two of my most underrated franchise characters too, elektra and valentin lol. Denise richards was miscast as christmas, but her performance never detracts enough to not let me enjoy each viewing. A fun flick
Bond is never more cold than when he’s betrayed by love. It plays into his loveless upbringing.
TWINE is highly underrated imo
I love how cold he gets and that's why Craig is my favorite. He does the coldness first, comedy second.
@Teun de Heer Third act of the World is Not Enough devalues it a little to me. It is good though.
Quantum was a film where we saw bond at his most brutal and most human. He had just lost vesper and was struggling with something. We have never seen him like that before.
It’s best watched directly after Casino as a stand alone it’s weak but as an epilogue it’s beautiful.
Novel Bond or one done by Dalton is so much better.
In Craig' movies Bond is always going rogue
Imo License to Kill Bond is the most brutal movie Bond
QoS has a number of really good features:
1) Craig's best acting performance of all his Bond movies;
2) The best wardrobe of the whole series;
3) Some great fighting sequences;
4) A believable plot - by Bond standards.
QoS: 9/10
Thought he acted best in Skyfall but I can see why you think he's best in there. He truly sells how cold and betrayed he feels and how he just wants revenge cause he thinks it'll make him feel better. And the water plot happened in real life.
I agree with those. The problem is the movie is unwatchable. Things are out of frame and the shaky cam is out of this world. Casino Royale does a much better job at shaky cam
@@crobeastness idk why but the shake cam never bothered me that much on first watch and has only gotten better each watch
Besides the editing I really love this Bond movie. It‘s my #2 Craig 007 film and keep rewatching it a lot
I've grown to love this one!
Hated this movie at first, but now it has grown to be one of my favourites, the most gritty and realistic take on bond on screen, love the scenery in it, its 13 years old but still looks very modern.
The film isn’t as bad as people say it was seriously. Yes it’s not CR but remember there was a writers strike during QOS, Daniel C and the director literally wrote scenes themselves.
Honestly Quantum is one of my favorites
Yeah, and all things considered it is far from the worst film in the series. Looking forward to seeing this video when it drops.
THIS RIGHT HERE!!!! This is the point and the movie was still good. (To me)
All of the ideas in the film were GREAT. The script issues were execution, not concept. Also, Matthieu Amalric is a great actor.
So, it sucks but it's OK because there was a writer's strike. The writer's strike is an explanation as to why it sucks, not a reason why it should be considered good.
This was great. More 'battles' over decisive Bond films please!!!
QoS has really grown on me over the last view years, although I very much think of it as an epilogue to Casion Royale, I'd take it over Spectre any day.
@@TheStewynewy dont get me wrong, I dont love it, but its grown on me! 😊
@@TheStewynewy Yup, Spectre was a droll mess.
Qos being a direct sequel itself put a lot of watchers off, including me, as I didn't watch CR and wanted to watch qos, but didn't get a thing. Could only see 20 min. Now I'm kinda fine with it, but still wouldn't rate it above spectre
I made the mistake of seeing QoS in the theatre without ever seeing Casino Royale. big mistake I was lost from the start
@@randomhuman97 I think both are good but I would still put it above Spectre slightly. Idk why people act like Spectre is the worst thing ever.
Always loved the lottery winner line when arriving at the hotel.
It's good - but not quite idiomatic. Spanish speakers - at least European ones - would say "nos tocó la loteria"
@@DHTCF you literally just answered your own questions. They were in South America not Spain. And they aren’t even natives anyway
@@Cj-xt6tv I didn't ask a question
@@DHTCF ok so you have a fallacy in your comment, they ain’t in Spain
@@Cj-xt6tv 🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️
Cierto, no están en España, listillo. Ahora bien, ¿conones algun territorio en el que se usaría “nos hemos ganado la lotería”? No digo que no haya, pero suena raro. Y más aún teniendo en cuenta que Bond es europeo y lo normal sería haber aprendido el español de España. A eso hay que añadir que su pronunciación se parece más a la española que a cualquier americana que yo conozca.
Yeah, a mate of mine at the time QOS came out explained to me that in real life someone tried to steal all of Bolivia's water. He jokingly commented that even the Bond producers thought it was so far fetched trying to steal all of Bolivia's water that for the film they reduced it to just a third of Bolivia's water
Yeah companies privatized Bolivia's water and even charged people to collect rain water. Irl the price hike was more in the film as well.
Idk, China is using loan shark tactics to own the worlds major ports. So for me corrupt organizations exploiting a destabilized countries natural resources isn’t unbelievable.
QOS - most underrated Bond hands down. Over time it will be seen in a much more favourable light
QoS is the Craig Bond film I watch more than any because I keep hoping it'll finally "click". In my opinion, if the villain had been Vesper's boyfriend and that's who Bond was chasing instead of Greene, then I think it could've worked better. Instead, it just segways away from it and sprinkles in moments and then the coda at the end just make it fall flat.
Is 12 years not long enough then?!
@@matthewperris haha you'd think so. I do mostly enjoy the way they tried to tell the story but it was just the execution leaves a lot to be desired.
I love this movie. I felt alone on an island. I appreciate that they trust me to figure it out and dont hold my hand to walk me through each thing.
This might be the most emotion-driven one in the Bond franchise. It really holds up upon repeat viewings unlike many other ones.
Very true
Weirdly one of the bits that I felt lent credibility is when the Special Branch guy he has at gunpoint tells Bond to "piss off". That felt very much like one British serviceman talking to another.
Greene's intro scene is a gag: he says he is too busy ...while playing with the stamp while waiting for general medrano...
If they had fully committed to QoS being a 4th act of CR, it would have benefited from bringing back Martin Campbell. It would have made for more cohesive storytelling and Campbell’s previous experiences with Bond would have helped deal with the impact of the writer’s strike.
With the water plot, QOS was ahead of its time as this is actually an issue right now, especially with private companies like Nestlé who basically steal the water from local comunities to sell it for huge prices just to make profit. And getting access to water will become the future version of getting access to oil in the coming decades.
Stealing water may not have sounded sexy in 2008, but (unfortunately), it sounds sexy now.
The water plot was based on a real thing anyway
I think QoS is seriously underrated. And I agree the fight with Slate is fantastic, you feel every beat. But the editing elsewhere is so chopped up that it’s tiring on the eyes. The story is really condensed, it could have benefited from some breathing time, more scenes with Matthis, more time to connect the dots.
Yea
I just watched Quantum of Solace for the first time since 2008 and I actually had a really good time. I did have some issues with it like how quick the cuts are during the action scenes at the beginning of the film and the theme song Another Way To Die I'm not huge on but other then that it wasn't bad
QOS has the things I look for in a Bond movie. Locations, car chases, fight scenes, water shoots, pretty girls, and nice hotels. You have to watch a few times to get the story straight on what's going on.
Watching Quantum of Solace feels like being in a car accident. exactly the kind of escapism I want from a movie
I absolutely love your debates. You somehow complete each other even when you disagree...and I really like Quantum too, it's a real great one, especially because of the opening chase!
I'm with David on this one. And I wouldn't have been if I hadn't rewatched it once more recently. This film resolves so many loose ends from Casino Royale, both plot wise and psychologicaly for Bond. He's really a man on a mission in this one. There are many visual references to TSWLM in this one, with the desert, dual male/female spies cooperating, the opera scene, and Bond helping a guy fall off a rooftop. Goldfinger reference with the oil covered Fields. And an overall renegade on revenge and scenery feel from License to Kill. Dominic Greene is a decent villain and really gets to up his psychopath level more toward the end. Olga Kurylenko is a good partner for Bond and there is redemption for both at the end. Bond may not have been able to save Vesper, but he gets to do it for another woman in a similar situation at the end, while gaining a better understanding and personal closure. The film also has some good political commentary. Its really amazing how much it is able to do in so little time. It does have its flaws. It is frantic and requires multiple viewings. The casual fan or viewer is likely to be disappointed. The first few action scenes really suffer from the editing before things get better. And for as many loose ends it ties up, Quantum leaves a few undone and opens a few new unresolved questions. Namely, I felt uneasy about the presence of the high ranking British official in Quantum and the movie's half-harted explanation/resolution of it. It's tricky because as a film it does many things well, but as a Bond film it could use more tidiness. Now with Spectre opening up a new universe for better or worse, some of it is making more sense, but some of it is being taken to a new, perhaps unnecessary level. Still, the origins of bond, his learning on the job, his psychological growth as an agent, are all tied up nicely. With the gun barrel at the end signaling, now Bond can get started. An appropriate transition to Skyfall. Its too bad where Spectre has taken it, but perhaps it will all also make better sense after No Time to Die.
Had to come back to this. You're spot on about using Steve McQueen as a role model. I've been saying that since Casino. The three piece suit at the end of Casino reminds me the Thomas Crown Affair, as well as those you mention. And Craig's Bond has been a motorcycle more than once and that's a McQueen thing.
I love the Alicia Keys / Jack White opening song. It doesn't fit the film, but it would be perfect for a more thrilling movie
I must be the only person in the world who loved the song. The bond tune felt ultra cool.
I love the song too
This debate is softening my stance toward Quantum. When it came out, my then estate agent was called Quantum.Not sure if that’d help
Quantum is the only Bond film that is a direct sequel to a previous Bond film. A lot a people object to Quantum because it is not a stand alone film. It is a good Bond film.
I like QoS. But I also exclusively watch it as part of a marathon of the Craig movies.
The song just describe the whole production: it's chaotic
Next to " Die Another Day", I thought this Bond theme was the WORST.
I really liked QOS. I always wished they could have made a sequel to OHMSS where Bond set out for revenge for Tracy’s death. Craig has been a great Bond.
I would argue that's what Licence to Kill is. He's not just avenging Felix and his bride there, his trauma has been triggered, and he's taking the righteous fury he felt towards Blofeld, and giving it to these dealers, instead. Two birds, one stone.
The true Ian Fleming Bond movies : -
On her majesty's secret
Casino royale
Quantum of solace
Licence to kill
This film doesn't feel like a bond film to me (No gunbarrel at the beginning, weird interpretation of how the mi6 building looks (inside), there is nothing suave about Bond in it, he just feels like a generic action hero). I will say though, Spectre made me dislike QOS less - I think it's at least a better film than Spectre.
The lack of gunbarrel at the beginning is a very valid criticism. Every Bond film should have one. No exceptions, no excuses.
I certainly agree that it's better than Spectre. Spectre to me feels like a Frankenstein monster of a movie. The tone is all over the place.
@@THEremiXFACTOR oh, I like Spectre. Why Bond wouldn’t tell M about Mexico is a mystery, and seems a bit silly. But I liked the rest. Mr Hinx is a great villain (another mystery is why Bond didn’t finish him off after the plane chase) and the suit he wears on the train a thing of beauty.
You're bang on. I'm not sure why the Apple MI6 infuriated me so much, but it did.
@@DHTCF They had one at the end of Skyfall too. I liked how they incorporated it into the title sequence for Casino to do something a bit different.
Great debate guys! I love this movie to bits. Easily in my top 5 of the movies. It feels like a revenge movie and the editing just gets my blood pumping. Plus Olga Kurylenko as Camille, one of my favourite Bond girls, great performance.
QoS is awesome.
@@martam4142 100% It has grown on me now. Really love it. Probably my secons most watched Bond film aftwr Tomorrow Never Dies.
I've been in a car crash, and David's point makes sense. The whole movie we are deliberately taken along like we're in the high stress situation ourselves, and so it's hard to take everything in.
I have always hated the public reaction to Quantum. When we are given Bond movie after Bond movie for 50 years-and seemingly forever-it is so fun to be given a movie that is essentially a unique look at a really emotional Bond, who just lost Vesper, reacting to the horrors he’s endured for a few days. The whole movie is James Bond gone insane briefly. Craig plays this situation marvelously. He is exactly what Bond would be in this situation. It’s just another Bond iteration-another shade of Bonds emotional arc. There are many things about Quantum to like. It’s art. It doesn’t have to be rated or compared with things before and after it. And-this is highly defensible-Quantum is the movie where, by its ending scenes, Bond has more personal development than any other movie. I like the movie very much.
This is great! Love both of your viewpoints. I personally love QOS- there's something dangerous and frantic and oh so different than the other Bond films. Love the music- love the pace....theres a vibe that grows over time for me....keep em coming!!
i liked this film after viewing it a second time. This movie's style was so jarring to me that I had to get used to it. I like that it's a revenge film with two protagonists. I'd give it a solid 8.
The caper is very original. Diamonds, oil, gold, etc. - it seemed like every variation had been played out. Water? I'm stunned no one had thought of that. Great fight scene with the would-be hitman. I am in Quantum's corner.
Love this channel, single handedly making me a Bond fan more than a casual viewer
I'm also on the side of QOS-apologists. After a disappointing experience at the cinema, it has really grown on me, to the extent that at one time it was in my top 3 next to CR and OP.
Now that it has shrunk back to size I still like it for what it is and for its central message which is quite the opposite to LTK. I love Greene as a villain, Olga and I will always defend the trash dumpster scene with Mathis' death. I love the score, the photography, the realistic script, the dialogues and the costumes. I LOOOOVE the PTS and the end scene, which is a replica of CR's PTS, but now Bond can see the shades and colours between black and white. He has found a way to do his job without killing so many people, so it really goes full circle to CR.
I do acknowledge QOS' flaws tho, much of the editing, especially of the boat and plane chases, and the plane sequence altogether are terrible. Oh and the gunbarrel before the END TITLES, are you kidding me?
But overall I think QOS gets waaaay too much flak out of disappointment being a direct CR sequel.
Go ahead, defend the dumpster moment! I'm listening
@@benoakes01 Well in the first place I can't really understand what anyone might dislike about the scene.
Second I don't know what else you would have expected Bond to do in this situation.
Third I'll quote Bond himself on this: "He wouldn't mind."
I think I need a re-watch of Quantum after this. Interesting points on both sides! I especially enjoyed that this was a discussion rather than an argument, and also that you both were able to appreciate one another's points of view. Well done! Personally, I am not a fan of QOS, (though the movie has its moments), but that might be due to the fact that it just can't meet the standard set by Casino Royale. It had a lot to live up to, and I'm sure having the writers' strike during production didn't help either. Nonetheless, it is a visually striking film that isn't afraid to flout typical Bond film tropes. I will definitely pay more attention to the score next time!
I’ve always loved Quantum. It’s not as good as Skyfall or Casino but it’s great. Its got a great opener. The camera work at times in the movie reminded me a lot of the Bourne films.
Quantum was the second Bond film I ever saw (the first was Diamonds), so it will always have a special place in my affection.
Hilarious because both are considered bad films but both are films I really enjoy
@@dereklewis4321 Diamonds is bad to me, first one i saw too when I was like 6. I rewatched it and thought it was bad.
"We see the burn marks on her back. Then we understand her back story". Sorry :-)
My brain must have a slow mo
Mode because the editing never bothered me I find it a solid thriller with some nice set ups like the opera sequence and David Arnold's score is superb
You have a good brain then!
This was an unexpected surprise! But could easily have listened for another hour. QoS is my favourite Craig Bond (CR is the "best" though), and the brisk, brutal style works for me. The complaints are usually over exaggerated but I love how it divides the fandom!
Casino Royale was my fave DC Bond. QoS was the worst oof! And----SPECTRE.
"...I don't typically wave the flag... unless it's going to be a defence." That is so brilliant!
I've always felt QoS to be 'just a movie' in the franchise, but then the more people sh** all over it, I just find myself going on about how brilliant it actually is(!). People call it a sequel, but it is quite simply the big budget epilogue that no film needs but I am so thankful to have. I absolutely love this film.
I'm with you David! Quantum has its issues but I just enjoy watching it. I put it on in the background a lot. I would never say it's a great Bond film but I just enjoy watching it. Maybe a guilty pleasure?
The typical Bond scene transition rift that plays as Bond leaves Greene in the desert is one of my favorite moments in the entire film simply because of the soundtrack at that part.
Great part 2 to Casino Royale. People wanted a stereotypical scarred villian but instead got Bond stuck in a Quantum of Solace, ruthless and heartbroken. He was his own enemy. The frenetic editing was trying to hide the violent nature of the kills. They wanted a 12 certificate but Bond was killing without mercy
That fight scene could be studied in film classes. The editing, the sound, the choreography. Only 30 seconds long but it's so well done.
I hated "Quantum of Solace" the first time I saw it in a theater. Since then, it's grown on me - it has a lot of good elements and I've watched it several times. That opening sequence really turned me off the first time I saw it. Now, I look forward to watching it!
QoS is fantastic.
I think QOS is slowly getting better with age. It’s still far from the best but it’s buy no means the worst either. I wasn’t fussed when I first seen it in the cinema but watched again the other day in TV and it was much better than I remember being it.
To this day I still do not understand the hate for this film.
I LOVE QOS. No issues...it is destined to be another OHMSS
spot on
Ahead of it’s time.
Eh I find it boring as hell tbh.
Nope.
Apart from the shaky cam it's the same tone as Casino Royale so don't understand the hate, especially the criticism that Greene doesn't have a ridiculous Blofeld style masterplan.. neither did Le Chiffre..taking over a South American country is boring but playing poker is incredibly exciting?...
Will never understand the hate for QoS. The beginning is great - editing and all, Olga Kurylenko is great, Gemma Arteton is great, the locations are great, the clothing is amazing (remember when jeans were cut for men with calves!)...the elegance of arriving in a Riva at Matthis's villa is hard to top, the Opera...Mr White is never less than great in all 3 films. The choreography of the moment with the Special Branch guy on the roof. relevant...there is humour, and it's good: "Somos profesores en año sabático y acabamos de gainer la lotería!"
On top of this DC has really fleshed out the character, he's in his absolute pomp...let's not forget the instant we get to Skyfall you start the "of course I can run around for 2 hours but only if I tell you how old I feel" trajectory...the end is good. I get that it is absolutely Casino Royale pt2 and so as a stand alone it can be hard to invest in. But it's still great....perhaps it keeps getting better because people keep trying to insist it's bad!
The hate is mainly because of the choppy cuts & editing during the action scenes throughout the movie. The only thing that comes close to that bad in the Bond series is the boat fight at the end of Thunderball. But even that was just one scene, not the entire movie like QOS.
For me, it's that it feels poorly put together. This was the opportunity to set up how the DC era was going to be, but seems like little care and attention was given to it. (I think this is as a result of the writer's strike and Marc Forster's vision for the film). Should have had a gunbarrel at the beginning (CR should have been the only one to break this mould), the title song is poor. Bond feels more like a generic action hero, the main villain is forgetable and there are too many artistic flourishes, that make it quite a hard watch. I also don't like the design of Mi6 in this either (small gripe I know, but it's the small things that count to a Bond fan)
I really like Quantum of Solace!! For me it´s a terrific film!!
Totally agree!
@Raymond Douglas well I don't give a shit.
I've got to defend 'Another Way to Die' but it's my own opinion; it's a good follow-up to the screaming 'You Know My Name' - both somewhat frenetic. Another great takeaway of the film - and very unique to QOS - the graphic design! I love the graphics that accompany the opening, the computer interface graphics M and others use, and they even carry over to the soundtrack album - top-notch!
I love QoS the same way I love Temple of Doom. The danger feels real. Bond here is a badass in this revenge film.
I love this movie but only have 2 complaints for the film.
1st, I'd wish they did a World Is Not Enough style intro. The car chase and foot chase is all pre title sequence. Bond flipping himself with the rope and shooting then fades into the song....would have been easily the best pre title sequence of any film.
2nd, wish the film had just 5 more minutes of screen time to give the villains a little more shine.
@@dereklewis4321 "Bond flipping himself with the rope and shooting then fades into the song....would have been easily the best pre title sequence of any film."
Search "Quantum of Solace Fan-Made Alternate Gunbarrel" - you'll see what could've (and, in my opinion, should've) been.
I think the issue is more with Elvis as a henchman, rather than Greene as a villain. Some Bond villains have been physically weaker maniacal geniuses with a formidable henchman, but Elvis didn't fulfill that role. He was just there 🤷🏼♂️ I think Elvis should have been a tough henchman instead. Having Greene get injured and attempt to flee while his henchman fights Bond would have worked much better imo. That way, the final fight would've been better, and you'd still get that final scene between Bond and Greene
Elvis rules. Kudos to Anatole Taubman.
Not since Rocky vs Drago have we seen such opposing figures do battle. 💪
Impressive to manage a 50 minute retrospective on “Quantum of Solace” without once mentioning the Tosca scene.
My favourite Bond scene!
@@cutthr0atjake Yeah, it is the highlight of the film for me. Then Mr White‘s “Well Tosca isn‘t for everyone“ line. Chef‘s kiss.
For a “bad“ film there is some stunning cinematography in parts.
@@visitforthemusic There may be issues, but I don't think its a "bad" Bond film (I found Spectre worse) and its a lot better than View To A Kill or Octopussy.
I actually like the Craig era Bond films in order of release. Casino is great, QoS best watched as a sequel, Skyfall is a constant "you r old Bond", and Spectre is just... pretty dire.
Even forgetting the excellent suiting, the film feels more like an actual spy film, and less like a Bond is a superhero vs the world's largest tyrant (hi spectre). It's not perfect, but it has style, and a linear story with, tbh, few "wtf?" moments. Skyfall and Spectre have their problems. Skyfall's final act (aka Home Alone) is awful, and Spectre is just a mess through and through. I am with David on this one, but I'm British and feel that generally we see Bond differently to overseas.
Same here
Martin, I just can't do with DC, Connery Moore and Brosnan for me
Skyfall's finale sucks? You're off your marble 😂😂
No Time to Die is a swan song.
Spectre to me felt alot like Live and let die in som respects
You two should do more of these types of videos. You make a great online pair. Keep up the great work
Great discussion to listen too while doing some correction work at work! Cheers guys!
Kinda reminds me of another great duo of Bond aficionados doing a Point-Counterpoint discussion on their channels.
@@actioncom2748 😂🍸
QoS was certainly a grower. I hated the overly fast editing when I saw it in the cinema back in 2008. Liked it more and more from repeated viewings. Craig is just as good as in Casino Royale. Always thought Skyfall was overrated and the less said about Spectre the better.
David, I appreciate this effort for re-evaluating QOS, but for me, there are two things that worked against me being drawn in: the title song (and really, if you're not drawn in by the end of the Bond cocktail, what can one think?) and the environmental angle that feels tacked on. I'm surprised the opera scene didn't receive more discussion, I thought it was very effective.
I’ll be honest, I tried for as long as I could to avoid watch Quantum of Solace because I heard from so many people how bad it was. So when I ended up watching it for the first time I had no expectations for it, but after I watched it I didn’t think it was the dumpster fire that everyone told me it was going to be. Now I did have my frustrations with it. I thought how they edited it was just awful especially because their were action scenes in the film where if they were edited better, those scenes would have been more memorable. I also felt the movie wasted arguably one of the top 10 best Bond girls of all time in Camille Montes. The thing that bugs me the most about this movie is that they chose to name the organization Quantum, and I’m sure like most people I thought at first that the organization was being referenced in the title of the movie. The thing that bugs me about this is that the actual definition of the term “Quantum of Solace” that Fleming created for his short story of the same name I feel like fits incredibly well with where Bond is at in this story. After Vesper’s death Bond is feeling a number of different emotions like sadness, anger, and a feeling of betrayal. And throughout the movie Bond is desperately trying to find Solace in getting revenge for her death. So I just feel like if they didn’t name the organization Quantum, people would like the title of the movie which I know for some people was a criticism of there’s.
They wanted it to be Spectre but they didn't have the rights to the name yet, that's why Greene says "the people i work with" and stuff like that. Yes the editing is seizure inducing.
Just an fyi that there’s something weird with the video’s audio during the second half of the video. Example: at 33 minutes both David and Calvin sound high pitched… just an fyi for QC’ing purposes :)
Love the videos and debates as always!
Surprised at the hatred for Jack White & Alicia Keys duet. I love Another Way To Die! It’s genuinely one of my favourite Bond songs & absolutely suited the tone of the film.
I absolutely agree
'Q.O.S.' probably demonstrates what a Lazenby 'Diamonds Are Forever' would have been like, if it was a clear sequel to 'O.H.M.S.S.' The problem is shoe-horning the revenge follow-through into another Bond story and ending up with neither a satisfying separate adventure, or a full-blooded completion of the loose ends of the previous film. To do a two film story arc requires that the film makers avoid bad luck and limiting circumstances and also can manage to bring their 'A' material twice in a row. That's never easy.
I felt very much inclined to do a fan edit of this one, really just the begining, having snatched Mr White, car chase, etc, and then go straight to the capture of Vesper's boyfriend at the end, bolting it onto Casino Royale. There's an additional missing link to add, in other areas of the rest of the movie to make that work, I suppose - perhaps a little Mathis too. I don't hate this movie, but would rather snatch bits from it to make something of a Casino Royale Redux kind of thing! Don't know why I haven't done it for myself, might just have to! Did however like this reflection!
oh boy the car crash editing thing really struck me. I'm an editor and also I've been in too many car crashes. The fact that the opening car chae hit me and didn't others makes so much more sense to me
This is a great idea for content. It reminds me of the movie commentaries on DVDs in the past, which we don't really watch anymore.
Not as bad as some people make it out to be and considering the writer's strike that clearly affected the production of this film, it is could have been a lot worse.
I like it more than "Spectre" on the basis that it has an excuse for its short comings, it is a follow up film that actually mostly understood the thematic point of the previous film and is mercifully short.
I still think Spectre is good but its the weakest of Craig's for sure.
They nit picked Quantum to death when in reality it was an in your face Bond sequel that was not expected and from the the first shot of the film takes you on a uncontrollable rollacoster ride of Bonds intent to continue a very personal and realistic interpersonal mission that goes as it may in a real life journey and gritty experiences that this character would face and go through.It was such a great representation of what the entire Bond franchise and Fleming's books embody.I absolutely love this film.I loved the song as well by the way.Great commentary and enjoyed the vid.I can't wait for the the lastest Bond installment
I really like it! I remember having a conversation with a few friends, about the most dangerous country we had ever visited, and I said mine would have to be Haiti. One of my friends said, “you have been to Haiti?”, to which I said no! Everyone just laughed and I realized later that night that the film had done such a good job of convincing the viewer that they were with Bond, that my aging brain had somehow convinced myself that I was there at some point in my life! That is the only film which has ever done that to me, and there is something to be said for that reaction to a film!
One detail I find funny is after Bond returns Mr. White to the makeshift HQ, he immediately pours himself about three shots of whiskey. First, they have hard liquor on hand in a top secret makeshift HQ? Second, they have CRYSTAL GLASSES ready for alcoholic Bond to drink from? Haha.
I rewatched QoS for the first time in many years, and I loved it much more than on first viewing. The rooftop chase is amazing, the Opera meeting of all the evil minds is fun and original, and Bond has never looked sexier. I think it has aged well when placed in context of Bond's mindset after Casino Royale and the writer's strike.
The opening scene is one of my favourites for demonstrating High End Steinway Lyngdorf Cinema’s to potential clients.
The Opera scene in this film would be more or less redone [a hell of a lot better] in Mission Impossible: Rouge Nation. Love how Spectre has Mr White saying he objected to Blofeld harming women and children when in Casino he was in league with arms dealer Le Chiffre and in Quantum he's deny people water-sounds consistent to me [oh and when did White having a family ever come up in his first two appearances?]
Thanks to both of you, I finally went ahead and threw together my own Bond top 10 list. Quantum sits at 8.
For completeness, my top 10 has 3 Connerys, 3 Moores, 2 Craigs, a Dalton and a Brosnan.
Here we are again! Quantum is still in my top 10, I just enjoy it. It wraps up CR nicely, including something of an arc for the character of Bond, it's got good action and good characters...to me this feels classic Bond and it just outstrips every Craig film that follows. It's this and CR all the way for me.
@@AnthonyP73I enjoy QoS as well. What is your actual Top 10?
There were quite a few Bond movies that didn't meet expectations over the years. But personally, many of these didn't prove so bad on a second viewing, perhaps some years later. I can't remember yet one that I would consider terrible. Just some that missed their mark on their opening. Quantum of Solace seemed so disjointed and confusing that I can't quite remember the plot today. Let's see how I feel when I watch it a second time, with more measured expectations.
“Another Way To Die” is a top 5 bond song for me, I can’t even explain why, it just goes hard
For me personally, Skyfall doesn’t crack the top 10. In my memory, she did a lot more impressive belting on it, but I revisited it recently and she NEVER does. I don’t know where I got that from. It’s just so limp and uninspired in a way the Jack White & Alicia Keys song isn’t
I like this song a LOT as well. I wouldn't say Top 5. But I definitely like it. Definitely around my Top 10. Definitely in the top half overall out of the whole list.
The problem with this film is that it calls attention to all of Craig's greatest weaknesses.
At his best? He's 'stoic'. At his worst? He's boring and terse. QOS features him as the latter.
At his best? He's a take-charge action hero. At his worst? He's a generic action hero. Here again, QOS features the latter.
It also calls attention to modern movie writers' weaknesses.
Casino Royale is a Fleming novel. At its best, the script for it has traces of that Fleming swagger. (Not always; I _do_ think it has a few missteps)
Quantum of Solace, conversely, comes off like it's trying to squeeze the last atom of Fleming energy out of the Casino Royale toothpaste tube. An atom is about as much as it gets.
I think you maybe are not appreciating the acting he of Craig as a man who lost someone he loves he tries to mascaraed his pain for 2/3 of the movie and he doesn't move forward in a plot of vengeance when agent fields dies and his friend marcus dies he slowly realize that his vengeance is not the the true way of accepting his situation and in the end it seems that he finally rest about vesper
@@a.39886 Exactly
Quantum is the embodiment of the phrase style over content to me. A short Bond film, and yet it feels the longest? It story tells like a child: and then this happened, and then this happened, and then this happened, and then this happened ... never pausing for breath. And then when it's finally over ... you can't remember what happened! The clothes, women , cars, locations, the younger Craig, all look incredible though. Even the poster looks flawless. The shell was perfect, but there was nothing inside. Them tune terrible too. The least rewatchable of all the films to me.
Yep it sucked the big one.
Apparently you don’t ‘ get ‘ Quantum. Incredibly well made , well executed and a story that lets you really peer inside the organization Bond has been up against since the very first Bond .
Not typical of other Bond films. But have watched three times and picked up new stuff each time. Unfortunately the audience is a little too dumb to get it so won’t have another one as intelligent.
I just can't stand the editing. Completely ruined it for me.
@@rogerpattube I don't think I could feel more strongly opposite to you about this film. What it actually has is a great subtle story with a clever continuation of the story and gritty feel from the previous film along with some great set pieces. However, the cinematography and editing (i.e. the style) lets the whole thing down. Instead, it's Skyfall that is all style over substance. It's an amazing looking film due to Roger Deakins cinematogrpahy (and heck, they even have the DB5 in there, if you want to talk about eye candy) but the story is preposterous.
@@edwardchester1 Agree! The plot of QoS is so much more believable and interesting than Skyfall. Those first two CraigBond films felt like they were telling a story that was going somewhere, while Skyfall felt it like it threw that away and rebooted into a less believable, more cartoony universe.
A rare look at calvin without a bowtie
i think most of us can agree: QoS is probably the best film we got out of the writer's strike
Quantum of Solace really is a misunderstood masterpiece that perfectly continues Casino Royale's story.
Love these discussions
Love Q of S: great opening car chase, foot chase, scaffolding fight. Slate fight. Good bad guys, good Bond gals and Felix and Mathis are back!
But, water rights? Exploding hotel...eh yeah.
I have a soft spot for Quantum of Solace, though idk if it was my first bond film, i do remember seeing trailers for it as a kid on tv. But either way, even though i'd seen Casino Royale, as a kid I never thought of Quantum of Solace as a sequel weirdly enough, i dont even remember that ending with Vesper's bf. That's probably also why i don't compare it in my head. But although i wont defend it for its flaws, since they're definitely there, I do just enjoy it.
I know where you’re coming from. For me personally Spectre was the first Bind film that I ever saw and I’ve always enjoyed watching it even though most people hate it.
I rewatched this recently after only having seen it in the theater and being underwhelmed. The movie is better than I remembered, but still has a few problems. I originally didn't like it because of the water monopoly scheme and too much action relative to story. The scheme is more realistic today, so that makes it better. The amount of action is ok, but the shaky cam is even worse than it was back in the day. The only movie that does that style of action cinematography right is Doug Liman's Bourne Identity.
It was supposed to be an emulation of the viewer being in the room, looking over the shoulder of people and moving a little bit like your view shifting around a room. It became a cheap way to make action scenes seem more actiony by cutting every .5 seconds and shaking the camera around and just gives you a headache.
I think my original reaction was because Casino Royale was so good and this movie is just ok.
The water scheme was a thing that actually happened