3D printing material: When to use PLA, PETG, ABS, TPU, Polycarbonate, Nylon etc.
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- Опубліковано 12 чер 2024
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00:00 Introduction
01:18 PLA
03:41 PETG
06:01 ABS / ASA
07:59 TPU
10:02 Fusion 360 Fundamentals Course
10:23 Nylon
11:23 Polycarbonate
12:05 Honorable Mentions
13:14 + Materials - Наука та технологія
Learn Fusion 360 the easy way: smallbatchfactory.com/fusion-360-fundamentals
PLA is not outdated. It is renewable, cheap, reliable, easy to use and highly available. Yes, PLA flows under pressure but I argue that for drafts, decorative things and iterating PLA is unbeatable. More often than not I can buy really good PLA on discounts today. And for what I do I don‘t want all parts to print shiny as PETG tends to do. Oh and don‘t forget the things like woodfill and such, that works a treat with PLA, with PETG it will be a gloopy mess
As is showed I use PLA even in technical applications if it's appropriate and it never failed me.
pla is not renewable.
@@ageorgiev89Nor is it biodegradable, regardless of its claims
It is, but only at industrial scale at relatively high temperatures. Since it's made from corn starch it's also renewable. That doesn't apply to impure "+" filaments with additives of course.
@SmallBatchFactory the vast majority of pla ends in the trash with everything else. Even if it didn't and people put plastic for recycling, they still won't separate pla specifically for recycling on a global scale. So, just because it technically can be recycled, it doesn't mean anything.
Didnt realize that you're a "New channel" the editing, composition, color and pacing is amazing! Subbed because I can't believe you only have 1k subscribers.
Thanks! Can you believe it was below 700 two days ago? Haha
@@SmallBatchFactory that's insane! At this rate you're grow in no time you got this!
Slicer tuning is an interesting topic for me
Noted! Video is in planning
new guy here- YES slicer tune is a good video to do. For Orca please!
I use PLA for the majority of the things I make, because I actually like the rigidity in most applications. I use PETG when I need functional clips/bending compliance. PLA is one of the most underrated materials nowadays because PETG fever. I see so many failures of PETG when used in mechanical designs where they're under tension or compression. Because of it's flexibility, it can be a bad material for some applications. I also like PLA because it's cheap, and I have access to a recycler that exclusively recycles PLA, so none of my wasted parts are every truly wasted. There's no one material that will work for everything.
I'm totally with you. Just like carbon fiber filaments PETG is a craze where people think it's automatically better in all applications.
plus if you have the equipment to anneal PLA it's way more temperature resistant than people think it can be.
It's extreme, from what I've saw. Didn't have lick trying it in the past but I probably did something wrong. If you have parts where you don't care about 100% accuracy or can account for the deformation this is an awesome technique.
@@SquintyGears I find high end PLA more temperature resistant than most of the tests I've seen online. Multiple times, I've left PLA prints under compression in a car on an 85 degree day with no deformity. Maybe my car just stays cooler than most peoples?
@meikgeik I can imagine that you used PLA+, which contains additional additives that change material properties.
Great overview of the materials, a series on tuning the slicer for materials would be interesting. Perhaps with and example use case for each material and ways of over coming common printing problems that the materials have.
Sounds like a plan! I'll put it on my ToDo list. One video per material seems like a good plan.
@@SmallBatchFactory That sounds perfect!
Detailed slicer settings per material would be great. Non-slicer specific. I’m curious about optimal fan settings myself!
This video is super informative and helpful!
I like your colorful background as well.
Thank you!
I’ve only recently started using ABS and ASA and absolutely love the stuff! But also only started with them since I have a printer with an enclosure. ASA may be my favorite material to print.
For the most demanding parts, PC and PC blends are my go-to. I’m always impressed with how strong that stuff is!
I was also impressed by how PC wasn't strong enough for my printed razor head. But in general it's pretty strong. I'm currently working on a Voron 0.2 with a planed 80c chamber temperature. Can't wait to see how demanding prints turn out with it.
Remarkably good video. Thank you for making it and sharing it.
Thank you!
this is truly a great video, thanks!
I have to thank you for watching, much appreciated!
Great video and great recommendations. Thank you
I thank you for watching :-)
Great video, really well focused and concise. A video or a video series on slicer tuning would be excellent, touching on Klipper and Orcaslicer would be awesome.
Thanks! Slicing is already noted. Klipper is something I can definitely show. Didn't like OrcaSlicer so far but I could go with Super Slicer
very nice overview !
Maaaaaate, your outro gave me a legit heart attack lol. You said "see you in the next one", I go to another browser tab because I assume the video is finito. Then the crackling noises from your outro come in, and I'm thinking my 3D printer is about to explode, because in my head the sound came from that exact direction 😅
Haha! Never leave your browser tabs unattended, surprise outtros in every episode
Very interested to hear your thoughts on slicer tuning!
The filled materials can absolutely have different properties than their unfilled counterparts. Fiber filaments will absolutely be stiffer and a little stronger even through a .4 mm nozzle though only in the xy plane if you have a good quality chopped (or continuous) material and keep it actively dried as fibers will wick more moisture than normal. If you want higher z strength, you need a wider nozzle and taller layers so you aren't aligning all the fibers with the nozzle. It will also raise the hdt a lot which matters for high temp applications like termoform molds. But you are right if you are talking about ground fiber filamments, it just makes things look pretty and absorb more water, and you are very right on the z-hop front.
Of course, what I meant was things like chemical and impact resistance. Real fibers make things a bit stiffer, but things like creep don't change much. IMO most people go for carbon fiber because everyone loves carbon, but in many cases it's just for the feeling.
@@SmallBatchFactory I was under the impression that fibers also serve the purpose of improving printability a bit. Mainly less warping. Is that actually true? I didn't see you mention it.
That's a very good question! I honestly don't know if they help with that and never thought about it. Definitely need to research that.
Great video sir. I will also most likely be checking into your 360 info as I'm trying to learn modeling. I have really started to love tpu for how strong it is and just increasing the info makes very strong parts that even after deformation will mostly return to shape. Only done 95a
Thank you! Don't hesitate to contact me if you have any questions regarding Fusion 360, feedback is always welcome!
TPU is really incredible. I only have cheap 95 rolls here and that was always enough. It can be tough to print sometimes. But a friend of mine does name tags mass production and has a lot of experience to help me out.
Well done, thanks.
I have recently started printing with Colorfabb PHA, and I was pleasantly surprised.
It’s compostable even at home, making it environmentally sustainable like no other 3d printing material.
That sounds like a really good thing! Regular PLA isn't that compostable but at least it's not made from crude oil.
Very helpful, thank you for time
Thank you for watching :-)
@SmallBatchFactory - Thanks for the very useful information. I've just firmly dragged myself into the world of 3D printing only yesterday. I decided (I think wisely) to go for a used *Ultimaker S3* (dual filament) printer, which in my rather limited opinion, has a really easy learning curve and has made it possible for a hobbyist like me, to start printing high quality zero error prints within minutes. I purchased a pre-owned machine, one, because I wasn't sure if I would be interested for long, two, because it came with a dozen new assorted filaments/maintenance kit and spare heads, but most of all, I was totally sold by the printers incredibly easy step-by-step setup process and the intuitive functionality of it's responsive integrated touchscreen. It's integrated heated glass bed (as you mentioned) has already proven itself, I could literally pry finished prints off with ease. No adhesive was required, for any of the first twenty smallish test prints that followed it's initial installation. It's been printing literally non-stop since I gave it a new home! 😉
You've earned my sub! 👍
Thanks! It's definitely more rewarding to get a used high quality machine than a cheap new one. The setup is often easier, especially with automated bed leveling. My Prusa has over 600 printing DAYS and still runs as good as new (if not better since I upgraded a few things).
@@SmallBatchFactory Mine was four years old and well used apparently before I took ownership, but with a little grease and a nozzle clean, it was back to business as usual. I'm now methodically printing my way through a 3D bucket list (with the help of videos like yours)! 😉👍
@Zodliness a bit of maintenance goes a long way. Mine is 6 and as reliable as ever. Someday you'll realize how cool designing your own stuff is :-)
thx for your great job❤
Thank you for watching :-)
Good point about Z-hop, however long travels tend to really bring on stringing and other issues.
Travel is the biggest enemy of course. With no Z hop there's no strong actively pulled from the part and the Nozzle has more time to be wiped. Faster traveling also helps a lot.
Ive mostly switched away from pla, to petg. Most of the stuff I make are for vehicles though, so high temp resistance is very much needed.
I've only ever used PLA, PETG, and TPU so far, but I recently got a new enclosed printer and I'm excited to try ABS and maybe some of the fancier stuff.
Just don't forget to have good ventilation and stay safe. If you're struggling I have a separate video on ABS printing.
Make sure to turn part cooling off. I ruined 5 prints before I found out that was the problem with ABS.
The funny thing is that's a way too generic take. At least if you have an enclosure. My ABS prints improved by a lot when I learned to turn the fan ON. I have a whole video on printing ABS
@SmallBatchFactory what problems were you having? I forgot to mention I also moved supports closer. With the fan on the supports kept failing.
"fried" parts. You can see an example on the Thumbnail of the video. Heat simply accumulated. But I also design to use no supports (in the videos case those were Voron printer parts I just needed to print).
Long story short you can either print rather slow (or a large part) or you will need cooling (as always in a enclosure that is)
Great video.
Point of note though is that what you refer to as creep is typically referred to as Stress Relaxation.
Stress relaxation being the reduction is stress (applied or resisting force) over time while being under constant strain.
Creep is generally the opposite, which is a change in strain (length or deformation) over time while under constant stress.
So creep is rather a loaded part deforming instead of "being compressed for good" with a screw for example?
@@SmallBatchFactory Creep is constant stress over a time interval causing "plastic" deformation. Since in the example it's under a static strain the polymer chains stretch as time goes on and the stress response is reduced. A good example of creep would be a cantilevered beam where it's fixed on one end and the other a load, say a block of steel, is placed causing a constant stress regardless of the deflection of the beam.
@ThunderBird80085 thanks! Learned something new. I always thought it refers to all deformations. Seems like larger channels, where I learned it, get it wrong as well.
subbed, great video and to the point. !
Truly another hit from small batch factory! Danke für das Video
Instant classic :-D ich danke dir für die Treue
I use a glass bed for both my FDM printers. When my PLA/PETG isn't sticking, I heat up the bed to 40°c, apply masking tape evenly across the area I'm going to print on and leave it for a few minutes, then fell it off, this gives me an even coat of a mild tac adhesive. I even keep the strips of tape I used as they're usually good for a couple more applications. After I'm done with my projects I heat the bed up again and clean with alcohol.
Sounds a bit cumbersome to me. I worked with masking tape years ago and never looked back after using my first PEI sheet. Since the I ocassionaly used bare steel for Nylon.
High Speed PLA at 600mms is great for rapid prototying. PLA is great for toys and figures.
I recently discovered Polyterra, it can be cut with a knife. Makes it perfect for prototyping where perfect fit still has to be determined
Great thank you
Cool video; I had no idea there were so many kinds of plastics that were printable with... or even at all, frankly, ha! Now let's see you try to print with Bakelite or shellac, ha!
I've pretty much exclusively used PLA since the printer is indoors, I agree that PLA is much stronger than one usually expect, but the downside of the stiffness is that the part will be more susceptible to impact damage
Yes, definitely. They all have their pros and cons
One of the more annoying things I've had to deal with is the mechanical properties of the materials you mentioned.
I designed a bracket that can be used on old cars (actually have a video on my channel about it) and went through like 30-40 revisions to get it right. Through the revisions I tried different materials and basically everything but PLA was way too flexible and would deform from the counter spring that keeps tension on the headlight bucket. So in the end I just ended up using PLA. Surprisingly it still works even after a year or so. I was really hoping a material like ASA would be the golden ticket, but it's stiffness was no where near PLA.
That's the thing people usually overlook in PLA. The stiffness has its advantages and creep is only an issue if you push it to its limits. An alternative would be Polycarbonate but that's hard to print
You could also bond different parts made with different materials, together using super glue or epoxy. I printed an exterior cover from ASA, but this warped slightly. Glueing this to a PLA stiffener frame straightened out this warp
That's also an option, as long as those materials are easily gluable. I've also fixed spitted layers with a soldering iron and additional filament in the past.
PLA is not.outdated. No matter how expensive the filament you use for the final parts, PLA is still the perfect material for the prototyping process.
I totally agree. It's also more sustainable, especially for throw away prototyping. Plus it's way less hassle and doesn't need to be kept dry like PETG does.
Excellent overview! One thing caught my attention on slicer settings, could you explain further on the Z-hop creating more harm then good and why its a setting you now leave disabled? I have not heard of this being problematic and I use it on my current settings.
I guess I have to put that on my video backlog. Short answer is when you lift the Nozzle your pulling a string away from the part since the filament is still oozing a bit. Without lifting you're wiping the Nozzle on the part while moving the extruder, reducing the stringing.
The lifting part also takes a bit of time. Not much if the printer moves rather slow anyway but on the Voron it was extremely noticeable, almost like lagging in videos.
@SmallBatchFactory Ah, ok. That does make sense, I'll try disabling it and see if I notice any speed/quality improvements. Thanks!
Yes, let me know. There should also be a setting called wipe distance that you can increase. It's basically additional movement back and forth before traveling to make sure oozing has stopped.
I use z-hop on large prints because it eliminates the noise of the nozzle traveling over the infill and also on tall small prints because it reduces the risk of tipping over parts of the print.
I've only used one spool of PLA, and I'm unlikely to use it again unless there's no other option. PETG is my go-to material for most projects, and I'll turn to ABS, PCTG, TPU, Nylon, and carbon-infused filaments when specific properties are required. also when i print TPU or Ninjaflex i usally either use a Textured PEI sheet. or put down a layer of PETG first and print on top of that. it kinda depends on application im printing!
PETG works great in many applications. For prototyping I still prefer PLA. No need to keep it dry for example. A bit of moisture and PETG can give you a lot of stringing.
Putting a PETG layer down for TPU sounds a bit complicated. I always have a bed sheet with an invisible PVA layer on hand.
I use PLA for hydrofoils for my wing surfing. I tried PETg+ but it warps too much printing leading edge down and there's horrid clean-up afterwards fo other orientations. In NZ in the summer if you leave any PLA outside that isn't white, expect warping. I have to pay careful attention to my split wing pieces orientation and part alignment and spacing. And no drying outside in the sun after applying fill either. I use for wing models and make the moulds from my PLA models.
Does it stand up to the water? I've had PLA parts get soaked like a sponge after hours in water. PLA isn't fully water resistant according to some sources.
For your temperature problem you could check out HT PLA. It does shrink a bit though AFAIK.
I use PLA to create the model and then I make a mould from the model. Otherwise the shape would be too inaccurate after composite cladding and strategic reinforcing too difficult.@@SmallBatchFactory
I have a pet Parrot and they are very sensitive due to taking in air more efficiently. Also the are much smaller in body weight (obviously). Teflon can off gas a compound that will kill parrots in minutes. I did a lot of research before deciding PLA was safe. It's possible others like PETG might be ok but I haven't looked into them yet. Despite using good ventilation I just wont take the risk of using anything other than PLA.
Bitte mach ein slicer Settings Video zum Thema retraction ! Und welche Defekte mit welchen Settings zu beheben sind!
I use PETG for most mechanical items. It's more durable, less brittle and doesn't creep as much, but it's not as rigid.
It's usually a good choice. Sometimes I like PLA, often I like ABS. But I also use PETG, especially for snap in parts.
Very good :-)
Pla is honnestlrly usless here in Australia, ive moved on to asa and abs , yes it prints slower then pla , but the benefits outway using pla
That's fair. Here we don't go over 40c in summers and winters are chill
i'd like a video on the best printer settings for PETG from your perspective. I suffer from minor stringing
The video is planed as "how to optimize quality" and since PETG is the nastiest candidate I'll use it as example.
IME nylon needs a glass build plate. Hair spray on top of PVA on top of glass has worked well for me. Only using hair spray the nylon can stick to the glass like petg and break the glass when cooling down. I've printed a lot of the stuff and it still sometimes warps if everything isn't perfect.
I've had OK results with a bare steel plate (Prusa has very strong magnets) and loads of PVA. Just needed a very large brim
Slicer settings please!
I've found that TPU actually has a much higher temperature resistance that PETG. Yes, it gets softer and more flexible when warm, but it does not permanently deform under heat until WELL above what PETG does.
Yes, for the video I've stuck with official numbers but as you say it behaves quite different in reality.
I remember reading somewhere that TPU has glass transition temp of below 0 degrees thus at ambient temp its not rigid, so at higher temps it get a little sticky yet remains somehow intact till its melting point, I ve use it to print cap for car's coolant reservoir and after months in the bonnet its still snug as before.
Would super appreciate chapter markers, hard to figure out at a glance which material is being referred to at a given time.
I've added them. Thought UA-cam would do them automatically but it seems I have to activate them first.
Hi, I am just starting my journey with 3D printing. I wanted to buy some PETG filaments for some prints, which will be used outside. However you mentioned, that it sticked to your nozzel after a failed print.
You said you did somthing with silicon sock to prevent it from happening ever again. I did not fully understand it.
What must I do to be able to print with PETG? Can you help me with that? Or can i just ignore what you said and just print some things with PETG?
Many printers already have a silicone sleeve around the nozzle these days. If not a buying a silicone sock helps preventing the material from sticking to the heater block. The issue is that PETG sticks extremely well to a lot of things. It happens a lot if you haven't leveled your bed properly. Just make sure to not leave the printer unattended when you start out with PETG until you're experienced enough to have your prints not fail.
Bring on the Slicer Tuning!
Quick question: Am I in for a big tackle from Terry if I don't properly recycle my PLA? 😅
Most probably, yes. He also wants you to use refill spools ;-)
Great vid! How about which printer works best with which material? I.e. Ender is good ONLY with PLA, etc.
Thanks for your suggestion! There's no real "this printer doesn't work with material X" except for the three factors I discussed in my "which printer to choose" video. Other than that it's a matter of tuning the machine correctly. Some materials are more beginner friendly than others.
@@SmallBatchFactory ok good to know. I sometimes go around in circles trying to ensure I pick the right machine. I’m living with an Ender 2 and desperately need an upgrade.
I personally love the reliability of the Prusa machines, but that also comes at a cost. Cheaper machines with cheaper parts just tend to give you more headache. Even my Voron had issues last weekend because of cheap extruder gears. Never had that with original Bondtech but they're also 32 bucks just for the gears...
I needed to hand drill and thread holes in a soft PolyUrethane part, it was a nightmare, as I needed to compress the bit for it to bite, but not too much to keep a straight hole, and threading the hole was a nightmare due to the need to take out the tap and remove the residues. Post processing soft material is to be avoided as much as possible
Word! I cleaned the TPU part shown with a scalpel for hours. It's still not clean but good enough. Second print with retraction went a lot better
Regarding Z-Hop, i never managed to print without it, no matter the amount of tuning i pour into my machines... skill issue probably, but one way or another i end up with the nozzle touching some strings and parts detach from the plate
so yes, some insight on slicer tuning would definitely be appreciated
In my experience that's mostly an issue with overhangs curling up and delicate parts in general. I'll include that in the Slicer tuning video and also add "avoid crossing perimeters", which can really help with that issue.
Great video. Can you superimpose the material name on the top corner of each section? For example, while talking about PLA, have that writing on the top corner somewhere
I can't change the video after uploading. You see the material in the timeline chapters at the bottom.
My go-to material nowadays is mostly petg, works well enough and can be left near a window on a sunny day.
Often the benefit's of pla are not worth switching fillaments over.
That's true. Put it behind a window and you're done.
PLA is actually easiest material the print. If you need to be structural you use PLA Plus. Each filament has its pros and cons like for instance, nylon has to be dried before you print and it has to be printed in an enclosure But it is heat resistant
Exactly. That's what a lot of people don't get, there's no "best material", online appropriate use cases.
By the way I've seen your profile picture. A friend of mine develops airsoft upgrade parts that are printed and/or electronic. He's currently working on a Halo like bullet counter for which I did part of the programming. Pretty cool IMO
A very important addition to printing TPU would be the use of isopropanol alcohol to remove the parts after printing. 🙂 A small drop next to the part should be enough to let it creep under and do it's magic.
Oh yes, I've heard of that. Haven't tried it so far and don't know if TPU is resistant to IPA. I personally stick with PVA glue but there are always multiple approaches (plus I bought PVA glue in Liter bottles...)
@@SmallBatchFactory Depends on the polyurethane. Polyurethane can be ether or ester based. Polyester polyurethane is highly resistant to IPA. Polyether polyurethane is less resistant to IPA and might lead to altered characteristics. Common 3D printing TPU is polyester polyurethane afaik... but don't take my word for it. :D
@FactionalSky good to know! I'd guess it wouldn't massively harm it but as always it depends on the manufacturer.
Petg is slightly more difficult than pla to print but compared to other materials as a whole, petg is a well rounded material. Its perfect for most, if not all, my use cases.
My biggest complaint is I have to keep it dry in order to prevent stringing from hell. PLA and ABS are less impacted by this. But in many cases PETG is a very good material. Look at the background, there's 30 kg of PETG :-D
@@SmallBatchFactory i keep my petg in a sunlu dryer box mounted on the top of my printer. I let the dryer run once before printing then run it during a print.
@TheNewBloodDan I have one too but I'm usually to lazy to use it. Plus I also have 2.5 kg spools, they're too big
@@SmallBatchFactory damn son thats alot. thats understandable
Thanks!
Thank you for watching (and super liking) :-)
@@SmallBatchFactory Sascha, if you don't mind I'd like your opinion on something. I will email you.
Sure, go ahead.
NO Z HOP? What?! How do you not get layer shifts?!!??!??? I must hear more.
You don't get layer shifts if you don't have overhangs curling up or overextrusion. It's that simple.
I use what is appropriate for the application. 90% of the time it’s PLA (generally use a PLA+ unless it’s purely decorative). While I love PETG generally when I’m considering it there is something more appropriate for the application like ABS or ASA (as much as I hate printing ABS due to the tight rope walk of keeping it warm and ventilated in my tiny office).
Absolutely the way to go IMO. PLA is perfect for prototyping. Usually PETG is best for technical parts if you don't need the extra heat or impact resistance of ABS or UV resistance of ASA
If a BBQ has a plastic handle, it is much more likely some thermoset plastic like bakelite/phenolic resin as those are much more heat resistant and AFAIK cheaper than the mentioned high performance plastic materials.
That's also possible! Didn't analyze mine in detail. I just saw someone printing a form for his morning eggs that he put directly into the pan while cooking, quite impressive.
PEEK is actually more heatresistant than most thermosetmaterials - especially with endless Fibre reinforcement. Thermosets usually start degrading at around 250-300 degrees under permanent use whereas PEEK only gets a little weaker.
The price is the main argument here I suppose as PEEK (depending on the grade and the additives) can be up to 100 times more expensive per KG
Manufacturers probably cut corners wherever they can so there's probably a few different approaches out there. PEEK is really interesting but as you said it's expensive. Not sure how much at an industrial scale though
@@Averell64 maybe there is some unit mixup, but phenolic resin is good to 300-350 C while PEEK to up to 250 C and melts completely under 350 C.
@@josefjelinek it’s hard to pinpoint an exact breakdown temperature for plastics in general because the degradation is both a function of temperature and time. I can’t really give you too many details but I know for a fact from my line of work that under conditions where the materials is always at 250-300 degrees and under a slight load that PEEK outperforms pretty much all duroplastic resins (though I should mention that in my case everything’s fiber reinforced).
Yes, please, on the slicer tuning; I'm just getting to the point in my 3D printing "career" where I need to learn how to optimize my settings.
Noted :-)
My favourite filament is CC3D 'PC', which is actually 50% PC 45% PETG. Prints super easily and is the best of both worlds. Highly recommend it!
How does it behave in terms of stiffness? PETG is rather flexible while pure PC is the opposite. I have a spool of PC ABS which I have yet to try.
@@SmallBatchFactory I personally believe it's a wonder material. It's more temperature tolerant than straight ABS, prints more like ABS but doesn't need as finer chamber temperature control, nor any fumes. Supports break away easily and it bridges far better.
I've not used PETG CF, but it's how I imagine it to be. Harder, more temp tolerant, 'better'. I use it for small parts because it's the most expensive filament I use (I buy bulk PETG and ABS from Sunlu), but I recently printed a 3rd party part cooling duct with it.
@@MarkusNemesis sounds really interesting! There are way to many filaments out there to try them all nowadays.
@@SmallBatchFactory PC-PETG (which is what I call it) only seems to be sold by this one brand (CC3D). I believe it's because they have a patent on it, and I've only seen it available via Amazon. Definitely worth a look.
@@MarkusNemesis I'll put it on the list after I used up my 75kg of other material I still have. Otherwise my wife might divorce me :-D
You should revisit the information about PETG being usable inside a car Standard cheap off the shelf stuff definitely isn't. Maybe you can find a variant without fillers, but the PETG you'll normally buy, Overture, Hatchbox, Prusa, etc, will not survive in even a moderately hot environment in a car. It won't become a puddle, but it won't retain its shape.
I've made this mistake two different times now, printing a part for a car in PETG, and when hot days come around, it loses almost all of its strength and begins to warp.
At least that's the "common knowledge" floating around the web. Haven't tested it extensively myself. Heavily depends on your climate of course. I can only speak for south Germany
For nylon: hair spray on top of PVA glue on glass. I've had nylon break a glass bed when only using hair spray, and when cooling down after printing and it took a big layer of glass with it. You really need a glass print bed and good first layer otherwise it WILL warp. 100-105 bed, 280 hot end, over 50 chamber for generic pa6. I've printed a lot of nylon and it still warps some times if everything isn't perfect. It also doesn't like speed, 80mm/s max. Kind of flows like petg.
Higher chamber temperature seems to be the biggest factor, but my Prusa doesn't go above 40. I'll need a real heated chamber printer at some point
@@SmallBatchFactory I'm a bit unsure if it will break something, but there are some 300W 24V Heaters available. I thought of putting one inside the Prusa enclosure to heat it up to 50-60°C prior the print. Maybe not during print, because of the air turbulence it will generate.
With the MK4 inside the enclusure, it will also heat up the electronic boards and I'm not sure how they can cope with this extended period of higher heat.
I got a roll of pure PA6, not didn't dare to open it yet. (Also I don't have anything that needs the properties of PA6 right now)
Simply put: DON'T do it! Prusa parts are made of PETG and will get soft. I'm also wary of frying the board, I already had one but it was covered under warranty. No clue if it was the chamber but it definitely contributes.
For anything actively heated you need to keep anything sensitive to heat outside of the chamber. IMO it's not worth the hassle, I'd rather buy a machine with heated chamber where the manufacturer guarantees it will work. Killing your $1000 printer is quite a dare.
@@SmallBatchFactory Sadly, what I thought may happen. Would mean a thorough rework of the printer. Reprint the PETG Parts, active cooling on the boards and steppers. Could use peltier modules for that, because they then heat the enclosure while chilling the components.
I'll try to print without extra heating. Maybe just a longer preheat phase through the bed heating.
Other option is to print the prototype in something easier and then let a company make it out of whatever is needed.
@drstefankrank heat up your chamber with a hair dryer before you start
Pretty much illustrates why I prefer PETG as a model maker, where sanding/priming/painting is a given.
Definitely! Sanding PLA is horrible
BBQ handles made from PEEK? That is interesting - thought it was simply too expensive for any consumer application. From my expierence 420°C Nozzle temperature ought to be enough (maybe even less with very slow printing seeing how the melting point is at around 345°C).
Anyway - very interesting video! Nicely condensed the advantages and disadvantages of each material!
Thanks!
Somebody mentioned it might not be PEEK but some other kind like Bakelite
What is being said at 8:44 about TPU? “turning off …………?? helps, and keep the extruder ……………..??.. to a minimum.”. Yes I am struggling with TPU on a Prusa MK3S+.
"turning off Z-Hop helps and keep the extruder gear tension to a minimum."
Z-Hop is when the print head moves up a little before it moves to another spot on the print. It's prone to pull fine strings. Turning it off wipes the remaining material a bit and reduces those strings.
Extruder gear tension is the pressure on the filament. You adjust that with the screw on the left side of the print head. Keep it as low as the filament runout sensor allows.
Ths Prusa profile is actually quite good, only thing you should activate is a bit of retraction. That reduced my stringing by a lot.
Esun super tough impact resistance is fantastic if you can live with 3 colours imo no need for pet g
Never tried that. To be honest I have so many colors here but when it's time to print something I usually go with black and sometimes white...
You mentioned black coloring protects material from UV rays, helping to limit the rays affect. Wouldn't white material be even better than black material at limitting UV rays?
I'm not sure about that. Many colors degrade under UV light. Black is made using carbon which absorbs the rays and is resistant to UV. White is often made from titanium oxide, could be that it's resistant too.
At 3:10 did you say you printed barstools out of PLA?
Not the stools, just the holders that I hang them on. So it's an iron pipe held up by two shelf brackets and holders in each side made from PLA. They're shown in a bit more detail in the "Cheap Filament" video.
After owning an enclosed printer, ABS for all of the above unless specified to be PLA
Yes, Team ABS!
How do you extract the fumes?
@@MetalheadAndNerd I HAD a carbon hepa filter and a couple of nevermore in the printer and it did very well with the PM sensors I had bought, now the printer is in another tiny room with a couple of noctua fans strapped to my window as exhaust and the sensors read normal and I don't even smell the fumes when I go over to fetch parts
you could easily cut a hole on top of the printer and put a fan on there and get a vent tube to rerout all the fumes out a window and let mother nature deal with them
Yeah, I wear glasses sometimes, and depending on the budget when it's time to get new lenses, sometimes I've gotten that polycarbonate plastic. So I wonder what it looks like to print the clear version of it, although I don't think we could ever make a good lens that way. But when you talk about it as part of the process to make bulletproof glass, you're talking about using it as the sheet between layers of the glass. Right?
There are people out there printing lenses, but it involves a lot of post processing.
You have glass with thin PC sheets but you also have pure PC windows. Depends on the application. PC doesn't shatter like normal glass does so it's used where vandalism is to be expected.
@@SmallBatchFactory: Yeah, I would imagine that lens making would require a ton of post-processing from printing!
Yeah, you might have pure PC windows, but then they wouldn't be bulletproof glass, so the comparison isn't even as "PC vs. normal glass," but "PC vs. glass," since PC is a plastic.
@HelloKittyFanMan at least in Germany we say "glass" if it's see through. Nobody checks upfront if it might be a polymer and then calls it that. At least not outside of industry professionals.
@@SmallBatchFactory: Interesting, you sound more British than German. Well, if it's just windows they're talking about, then they could/should say "bulletproof windows" and then whether it's glass or some other material isn't contested.
Thanks, I'll take that as a compliment! I'm working hard on my accent.
You know how the industry works, they're all about marketing terms.
* "ABS and ASA are *---both---* almost identical..." (I crossed out "both" because "Identical" is a comparison which, without another thing to compare them to, automatically has them comparing to each other.)
I can't get PLA to stick on my PEI sheet. Tried different temps, glue, it just pops off half-way through the print.
Do other materials stick? One major thing is to have the nozzle pretty close to the bed (although I printed PLA by accident with too much distance and it still worked). Do you have a heated bed? Try washing the sheet with soap and dry it thoroughly. Usally PEI works extremely well, but not if it's greasy.
I have to wipe the bed down with isopropyl alcohol after printing PETG before I can get PLA to stick again.
@OzzieKev it's a good habit to get into anyway. I do a quick wipe of the bed before every single print.
I use stock ender 3 to print generic TPU (probably the most rigid type) and instead of printing it without retraction im actually printing it at 8mm retraction at 20-35mm print speed and adjust overlaps setting and prints just fine. The biggest impact is if how dry your filament is.
It works, yes. As I said you have to go really slow. You probably also have very low retraction jerk set for it to work.
I use stock ender 3, 228 nozzle, 40 bed, 60 mm/s. I slow it down to 40mm/s for more difficult prints. I have even had good experience printing ninjaflex 30mm/s.
TPU is not a problem material, it is moisture, user, or machine error. Anyone with these errors are not doing fast or consistent printing regardless of the material.
I'm just surprised somehow that these machines are very versatile also different ways to adjust profiles to suit your setup, i might also try lower retraction and try experimenting again with flexibles. Thanks for the informative video.
Almost anything is possible if you know which settings to adjust. A lot of my friends don't know how to analyze issues. That's probably why Bambu machines are popular
@@SmallBatchFactory true, the fact a year ago i got ender 3 is due to its accessibility in my country, parts are everywhere and low price at the expense of tinkering with it yourself its simple and can be troubleshooted easily as well, if got extra cash probably bambu still good option but for starters ender 3 is still good if you want to get into 3d print you'll learn a lot as you progress just hope they dont get fed up with it when it bogged down occasionally 🤣.
I really like your channel and I think you'll have 50k subs in no time. You're videos are good quality and useful. Whiten your teeth.
Thank you! I sure hope so
I have found formfutura carbonfil is stronger than the base material. Main difference is to get true carbon fiber strands not milled carbon fiber. Also, on my creality k1 mqx I print carbonfil at a higher temperature of 260c and I get very clean prints with very high strength
From what I know it mostly becomes a bit stiffer. So depending on your use that might be what you need. I'm not sure how long these strands really can be before they clogg a Nozzle.
@@SmallBatchFactory thats why I raise print temperature
PETG "even summer heat inside a car is no issue".. *Florida has entered the chat* 🤣
I should've added "central Europe" :-D
I think pla is something I am mostly done buying. It gets stiff and brittle while also having terrible creep. It doesn't make a lot of permanent things very well.
I am using up my stock for disposable prototypes to save my petg for a moment. Petg costs though are in parity now so I have no further incentive to buy pla unless it's a very specially colored rolls.
I think it is still pretty good when printed into very solid parts that don't get heated ever.
Never had any issues as long as I choose the material type appropriately. As you say, PETG is so cheap nowadays. It's just not suited for everything, sometimes you need the stiffness.
I have used PLA from more than 5 years old spools and brittleness never corelated with age.
PETG was “the ABS replacement” since it was easier to print with less warping and better plate adhesion. That was before Bambu came and changed the game. With an enclosed printer there’s really no point of PETG anymore (imho). In fact, I have never even printed PETG since I got my first X1C, mainly since it just cant be printed as fast as ABS and is more prone to stringing.
Definitely, the stringing can be a real pain. ABS prints so much faster. But chemical resistance is where PETG really shines. It also doesn't give off as much fumes as ABS, so there's an up and downside to both.
Many people print in their homes without an exhaust vent. I wouldn't use materials that create toxic fumes at such a degree.
I was very excited when you mentioned creep resistance. In my opinion it is one of the most underrated and ignored material properties. Surprisingly, I haven't any comprehensive video nor written review, that compares different materials with regards to creep. You only touched on PLA and PETG. I would have loved to hear your thoughts on the orhers.
I did a small test myself with surprising results, comparing PLA, PETG, ASA and PC. PLA was as bad as expected. One surprise was that PETG is better but still not great. ASA was very similar. Only PC behaved really good compared to the others.
But that test was only at a single load. So I don't want generalise my results.
Do you know of an in depth examination?
I only have a few infos on this, mainly from the Voron part print guide. Nylon is another creepy material, CNC Kitchen had very bad experience with it. This was mainly about screws getting loose. But some people commented this is not creep but rather static deformation so I'm not 100% sure.
The Voron team specifically recommends ABS/ASA because of this so it's probable you tested deformation under load and not pressure.
You are right, I printed bars, fixed them on one end and put a weight at the opposite end. They flexed considerably. I let them sit 24 hours and measured the remaining deformation after removing the weight. So my use case is mainly springy things. I wasn't aware that creep under pressure without deformation is yet another effect.
Yes, there are different types. The creep under pressure also highly depends on the pressure itself. Not every screw has to be extremely tight, in that case even PLA is fine.
I think most printing materials will stay bent if they're loaded for a prolonged period.
Have you tried using PLA with PETG supports?
Is it possible to print polyethylene?
You mean as in support material or combining both materials into one print?
Pure PET has some downsides AFAIK that's why they added glycolether in PETG. For now I only tried off the shelf metrial.
@@SmallBatchFactory Yes, as a support material.
@christopherd.winnan8701 you could do that, but why would you? PETG is notoriously sticky, so it's hard to remove. Just do them from PLA as well or use something soluble like PVA or HIPS
@@SmallBatchFactoryMy apologies, i was simply repeating what I read.
try pla meta from sunlu, this stuff in unbreakable, not talking trash and i'm not a weak guy. cant break the flowtest walls from 0.4 nozzles. it welds together and flexes too, 180° is doable, it just turns white. it replaces petg for me completly and prints easily at 500mm/s at 25k accel. if more heat resistance is needed, there are better options than petg. one hygroscopic hard and slow to print filament less.
Sounds really interesting! Just ordered some, let's see how that works out!
As you said, nobody seems to bother that they have to constantly dry PETG while PLA is usually fine even after months of exposure.
I like how he does the exact same hand movements the entire video
An Italian-German.
Bapedi Bupedi
I hadn't heard about pla's heat sensitivity, I was about to make a piece for a window blind
Better use PETG or even ABS if you can. Even if the room is air conditioned PLA doesn't stand a chance against direct summer sunlight.
@SmallBatchFactory yeh I will probably try ABS, as i have a reel of that.
I only came across your clip randomly too 👍
Feel free to stay, I have a video about getting perfect ABS results too ;-)
@SmallBatchFactory sweet, will go watch that one for sure.
PLA is an arts and crafts material, IMO
It's also great for prototypes where you just need to get things done. But I even use it in technical applications where appropriate.
Slicer tune🙏
Imo PLA is the best goto for more projects and there are other filaments for more specialised things like Nylon an PC for higher heat environments. Id even go as far to say PETG is outdated with the really good PLA blends that are out there.
In most cases PLA is just absolutely enough. Where PETG shines is flex and chemical resistance. I've used PETG in salt water for years for example. Wouldn't try that with PLA.
Always knowing the best material for the job is a whole profession on its own.
Absolutely and thats the key here I think. But I do think PLA has for some reason a bad reputation. And a lot of people think other filaments are "stronger" when they simply arent. One thing PETG is great for though is a support material for PLA!@@SmallBatchFactory
You haven't experienced the Australian summer heat in a car. PETG has no chance.
You're totally right! Record temperature last year war 38c here. That's probably an average day in autumn for you.
I print 55D usually at 150mm/s
Works good? Which printer? I know people having issues with 85D already.
@@SmallBatchFactory Voron 2.4 R2 with stealthburner
@@SmallBatchFactory of course with direct drive (clockwork 2). With bowden I was printing only 30mm/s
Those Voron tool heads are really something special. I added a "Red Lizard UHF" hotend with custom adapter and it's extremely fast. Plus the motor is extremely close to the extruder itself.
Thumbs up for Tarry Tate
Finally! Somebody appreciating the great Office Linebacker
Hast du ein Lippensyncron Übersetzer benutzt? 🙈 irgendwie passt deine Mundbewegung nicht so recht und ich bilde mir Artefakten ein 🙊 vielleicht werde ich auch irre 😂
Das bin schon ich, aber ich hatte auch das Gefühl, dass ich in OBS Studio (womit ich aufgenommen hab) noch nicht die richtige Verzögerung zwischen Audio und video eingestellt hab. Scheinbar muss ich die noch etwas hoch drehen.
@@SmallBatchFactory 🙊 ok hätte ja sein können, da ich auch immer am abwägen bin ob deutsch oder englisch und man natürlich gern die breitere Masse ansprechen wollen würde 🙈 hab nur das Gefühl ich verstell mich in englisch
In Englisch ist definitiv ein anderes Gefühl. Durch die Arbeit bin ich das inzwischen schon gewohnt. Wobei ich mir die Texte vorher schreib, dann muss ich nur noch ablesen. Synchronisiert würde das bestimmt lustig klingen. CNC Kitchen klingt auf seinem deutschen Kanal auch total anders, mega schwäbisch
I like HIPS not just a support material
Someday I hope to find the time and try the spool I bought ages ago. Didn't want to talk about a material I currently have zero experience with.
I absolutely loathe PETG, I'll pick ABS, nylon or modified PC any day over PETG unless the print is too massive for those materials to make sense.
I always remember that when I print some and it strings because it wasn't dried in a wall. ABS is my darling.
Are you using AI video/audio translation? Just curious.
Nope, what led you to think so? I use a voice isolator to get rid of room noise and a bit of compression + equalizer for a deeper sound.
Someone else asked as well so I'm curious. Seems like I need to adjust the audio delay a bit more to lip sync it better.