To address one of the common comments I see on here, the explanation for Dan not being dead (and Jackie not being a lesbian, Becky not dating David etc.), is that the final season of Roseanne was a story written by Roseanne Conner and none of it actually happened. They don't go into much more detail than that.
''Her body, her choice'' I'm tired of hearing that lie. That's another human being that is being incubated. Not a commodity to be traded. Children are not the property of their parents.
@@citycrusher9308 Not a lie though, it's her choice on what she wants to do with herself. while not something that could be traded in simple terms, it is something that can be used as a tool if needed. While I think this is a completely different topic for another place that could involve this conversation to a greater extent, the body is a lot of things and is not a lot of things, but we can't just shove it into one category and say "you can't do this because it's not X" when in another scenario or worded differently, it certainly would be
@@citycrusher9308 The baby doesn't have a self as it's parasite until it's born. That's why birthdays mark the day when the baby became a separate entity and a separate conscience. But since you're a man (just like me) this isn't really a conversation you have any right to be in. The worst impregnating a woman can do to you is require 18 years of child support. The worst impregnating a woman can do to her is death during child birth. So you know, you're taking a lot less responsibility than the mother has to so you're out of your lane to dictate how a woman should handle birth.
Radical Reviewer: Lmao. I never thought of it this way but I'm in the same boat. Never really watched Roseanne, but these videos are really interesting/informative.
Original "Roseanne," 1990s: "these things aren't boys' things, because you're a girl and you're using them" Reboot "Roseanne," 2018: "why are you wearing that? that's for girls and you're a boy" Also the spanking thing... it crosses the line from "inconsistent character writing" to "bad retcon"/"we forgot part of our show's premise."
actually if you watch the episode about the spanking it was about how she did it out of anger and no control. most likely they were disciplining the kids but in a more controlled way and explained why they did it but not on camera as that would be a bad and boring thing to show on the show then what they did with that extreme. she was just more scared for losing control and just hitting instead of properly explaining to him why she was going to spank him.@@squarebearderry
Actually I think this does line up with the double standards of gender nonconformity for boys and girls. I’ve seen this from my own mom who talks proudly of how she was a tomboy most of her life but will in the same breath day a boy shouldn’t be wearing girls clothes
I’m struggling to understand how Roseanne went from profusely apologizing to her son for hitting him to deriding her daughter’s generation for not hitting their kids
Loving the reviews, but I gotta say: Roseanne's transformation from season 9 to 10 isn't that far from the transformation I've seen happen in boomers in my own life. This nationalistic-faux populism we're living through does strange things to people.
I don't live in the U.S. but I see this happening in my country too. Many boomers who used to talk about all the revolutionary things they made happen are now complaining about young people who care about social justice. When I confront them with this, they say that kids these days take it too far and they're spoiled. But that's exactly how the older generation used to see them in the '60's.
Roseanne will need to be reviewed academically in the decades to come for reflecting the changing of a generation's political beliefs. I fear when us Millenials and Zoomers become reactionaries.
Semi-devil's advocate here. BUT, people who were blue dog centrists in the 90s becoming full blown MAGA by the mid-late 2010s, especially as they moved from early-mid 40s to retirement age in small town America is entirely realistic and I've seen it among dozens of people I know personally (having grown up and continuing to live in Appalachia). The Roseanne character's political progression as I just described I think is entirely possible/actually more realistic.
I was thinking the same thing. I know a lot of people who were progressive to a degree get twisted twenty years and become full blown MAGA people. It’s frustrating, but I totally saw it.
@@samirabdel-aziz498 Being a progressive is a lot more work than going MAGA. If you're a progressive, and want to argue your position, you need to read studies, integrate that into your beliefs, etc. You don't have to use any critical thinking to be a good MAGA, you just have to have powerful emotions, and be willing to deny facts as "part of the establishment".
But how do you go from “I’m so sorry I continued the cycle of abuse by hitting you the way my father hit me” to “if you don’t hit your child you’re an idiot and your child thinks you’re an idiot”?
I was thinking the same thing. I grew up in a small town in the Midwest and observed that transformation over the years. I honestly think the rise of Fox News and right wing media has everything to do with it.
I saw this show as a teen as my mom loves it. I didn't care much about it at the time, though. The setting was probably too mundane for a kid my age. However, after randomly stumbled over this analysis, I have to rewatch it with grown-up eyes.
@@originalblob People didn't make a huge deal out of the class consciousness of the show, but it was addressed some. Probably something the media commentators couldn't comfortably address at great length. And maybe that quality didn't register with a lot of people if they didn't think the Connors looked so much working-class as normal.
@@davidm1926, to be honest, as a kid I associated Roseanne more with stuff like "Married with children" than with serious topics. That's because both featured "bad families", as I would have put it back then. I intuitively associated things like lacking education, low income and even overweight with moral failings like lazyness and rudeness. "Married with children" sadly encouraged this notion. Only when I grew up, I realized the difference between a sincere show about lower class people that are normal human beings and the tired bad-taste-jokes of Al Bundy.
@@visaman It is ridiculous to set the bat for raising kids that low. "Welp at least they didn't give then a black eye or break a bone or beat then with a blunt object etc etc". Awesome. Parent of the year.
Bro, I'm Indian raised this shit is norm. Idk, Spankings are fine for certain ages. Not saying everyone does it. Americans thinking it's totally wrong is a little too liberal.
@@Qwistie_ not really. There is a wealth of evidence proving its harmful effects on some kids. And the issue is that we cannot tell whichnods will be scarred by it and which will be fine until it is too late. If you truly think is to liberals and do some research on the actual science psychology and evidence that back up the fact that it is potentially harmful to kids and then see aht you think.
@@VikkiDixx I was spanked as a child, and I was beaten as a wife. There is a major difference between a beating vs a spanking. I never spanked my kid and I don't think I will ever have or need to. But I don't think there is anything wrong with the way my parents raised me. But people who beat others just to satisfy their own emotions is very very wrong.
Ah. Gotta love the “the kids are just 10x worse nowadays so you HAVE to abuse them. Not like the old days where kids had so much respect” Ugh. It’s so gross
That really does just say it all. Old Roseanne: "I hit you because my father hit me and I'm so sorry for treating you like that!" New Roseanna: "Should've spanked him or he'll do it again, trust me! It's the only way they learn!"
What's interesting to me is that in real life, Roseanne claimed she was abused, which is what influenced the storyline about spanking DJ. You would think she wouldn't suddenly forget about that when the show rebooted, even if everyone had forgotten who the character of Roseanne Conner is suppose to be.
Victims of abuse often become abusers themselves due to a lack of control in there lives and many other factors. It's actually the exception to the rule to not become an abuser than it is the other way around. It could also be the very real possibility that Roseanne was simply disenchanted by her leftist beliefs because they didn't turn out to the effective and/or improve her life in any way. A lot of activists end up like Roseanne, especially in their later years; there's only so much shit you can take before you finally snap and go "fine, let's embrace the villainy," in order to survive.
She probably sees it as a good thing that Season 10 Roseanne didn't actually physically strike Harris, despite it still being physical abuse. I think she's just a product of her times... she just genuinely doesn't understand why that was still abuse. I don't think that makes it okay, obviously, but it definitely should inform how we approach the issue.
Joshua Rutterbush it’s not abuse, are you fucking dense? She held her head in the sink but the sprayer was in her hand hosing the back of the little disrespectful twits head! Kids these days have become too goddamn comfortable mouthing off to parents! I don’t know what dumbass generation you spawned from but in my day I would have been spanked and sent to my room no dinner, I didn’t die of starvation in 12 to 16 hrs like you Mickey D eating little shits think you will. But I definitely learned to behave in society and respect my elders!
@@kelleymariejones6388 It's abuse. You were abused, too. I know how to behave in society as well, and respect everyone, not just my elders. I didn't need to be abused to learn that. You on the other hand immediately referred to a stranger on the internet as "dense" and called their generation dumbasses. Your entire attitude is unnecessarily disrespectful and not a great example of how you've learned to behave in society.
John Goodman is an underrated actor. And it's too bad DJ's story was never really hashed out some more. As the only boy of the family in an interracial relationship, he could have had a really great story.
Michael Fishman can’t act. So they can’t give him serious story lines in fear of him not being able to convey what they want to convey. Simple as that.
Just seeing the original of the Roseann apology for spanking her son made me tear up. I had a conversation like that with my mom, for the EXACT same reasons. It’s a real true to life moment that really kicks ya in the gut with how real it is. New Roseann: “If wE don’t spank tHeM they’ll just sIt in tHe CorNeR and wonder WHy we aren’t SpAnKiNg them!”
I loved the original Roseanne - likely a product of my mom's love for the show. I felt your first essay was incredibly thoughtful, interesting, and well put together. While I didn't watch the new episodes beyond the third episode, I was likewise enthralled by this piece. Subbed. Fantastic work!
I was annoyed Emilio and Becky's relationship didn't last longer than a single episode. I feel like they missed an opportunity to endear him to the audience and flesh out his relationship with the family before deporting him.
True but he was in a couple of episodes before they started a relationship and you did see Becky grow to have an affinity for him herself. So I'm hoping that this is something that the audience will root for and will be worked out in the next season.
@@dreamingrightnow1174 I’m late to the party but, it’s also inaccurate because you can’t be *illegal* when you are seeking asylum. The overwhelming majority do not “jump the border”, their Work Visas run out while in America.
I'm really glad you brought up the spanking episode from the revival. It's the only one I've seen of the new series, and it bothered me so much that I haven't watched any other episodes of it. I couldn't support a show that was going to claim hitting children was totally okay, when the original had the exact opposite message.
It can be baffling how people change. My own mother, when she was raising me in the late 80s to the 90s, was very much against spanking, yet when I started having kids in the 2010s, she was telling me I needed to spank them to teach them how to behave.
@aoggrta74 she grabbed her neck, and forced her over the sink?? Also depending on where her face was the kid could have been waterboarded by her own hair.
@@sarahgent2674 My mom drowned me to death every week and it never did me any harm.. Kids these days don't know they're born with their playboxes and wide screen, internet, T.V, wireless telephones! My 21 year old grandson talks to his friends on something called a meat grinder application. I told him if he doesn't find good breeding stock soon he won't have anyone to look after him in his old age but he seems more interested in borrowing my car, to meet his meat grinder friends and spilling what I can only assume is mayonnaise on the drivers seat.
It's not so much that I object to there being a show about a right wing person being portrayed positively- the existence of 'Last Man Standing' is of no consequence to me- it's just that Roseanne Conner was already a character, and rewriting her as a praying, gun loving, old-fashioned, ignorant right wing bigot is just disingenuous. This version of Roseanne Conner is a completely different woman.
@@VegasAceVII Yes. There is no way to change Roseanne Conner's worldview and politics in a way that makes sense. Cutting and pasting new beliefs onto her betrays the character's whole backstory and everything we know about her; she's not the real Roseanne, and this version of the show is not Roseanne. Especially when none of the other characters feel like they've changed that much, but no one points out that Roseanne has really changed or discussing anything in her experience from where we left her in 1997 that gives context to a massive paradigm shift in her thinking. The Conners does lack spark without Roseanne present, but it also feels more truthful to the concept of the original Roseanne.
@@moonlily1 Its because Roseanne, herself has changed drastically since the end of the original series. She's no longer left wing, but a typical MAGA conservative. Her mental health has made her populist, progressive views disintegrate. She's kinda been sold out, since the last show. So, the reboot of the show is just a reflection of how she's become out of touch with working class people and current issues.
The way I look at it is: 9/11 did a number on a lot of people. It's basically responsible for the climate in the USA today (along with the afterath) Roseanne (the character) is the post 9/11 Roseanne. People change as they get older and get beaten down by the world and the media.
@@frymarioball Yes, I know that. And she's within her rights to have and express whatever beliefs she chooses in her personal life (although certainly not free to skirt pushback and consequences as many confused people would like to believe), but it's an artistic foul to cut and paste them onto her character in a way that defies narrative sense. If she wrote a new show that was not Roseanne to be her mouthpiece, that would be fine, but it just doesn't make any sense for Roseanne Conner.
I’ll never forget how I felt after watching the hitting scene when I was a teen and Roseanne apologizing to DJ, my jaw was dropped cuz my dad never apologized for abusing me and knew right then he doesn’t love me. I’m happy to say I never laid a hand on my daughter and broke the cycle. I have no relationship with my “family”, and learned family isn’t blood, family is who is there for you no matter what ✌🏼
My dad used to hit me with the belt. If I started crying, he'd say, "I'll give you something to cry about," and hit me harder. No apologies. So, now, I'm a 48 year old woman (thankfully, no kids) who doesn't cry around anyone. When my big sister died at 42, I stood stone faced around everyone and it took me weeks to finally cry in private. So, yeah, I'm fucked.
I grew up in a small Illinois town, blue collar, parents in and out of working either zero or three jobs at once. Roseanne REALLY resonated with me growing up in the 90s. It's no surprise that Barr is embarrassing and hard to reconcile with, especially in 2019. Anyone with lower income white quasi-conservative parents has seen how you can have a parent go from compassionate and smart to xenophobic and terrible over the course of 15 years. When you say in the beginning that it's as if nothing has changed, it's wrong - the world has changed our old people too.
I'm ... a little disappointed (?) that it's ONLY 47.5 minutes... I may or may not have listened to the first one twice (thrice?) because it was so good and there was so much to absorb...
If nothing else it's a much more interesting reboot than Fuller House. Although, arguably both are just trying to continue doing what they did in the 90s, I guess Roseanne/The Connors themes have been and probably always will be more relevant than the average sitcom. (for better or worse)
I thought the bit about drying nail polish was really cute. My granddad was an old fashioned guy who let love overcome his prejudices, but was still snarky. Very realistic.
I understand why Roseanne's change of heart on spanking would come across as her being out of character/ not the same. Unfortunately, people certainly can change like that. My own mother threatened her father that she would call childhood services if he hit her again when she was a teenager, when I was growing up she had a firm stance that hitting a child was wrong under all circumstances (there were a few instances where she lost control and hit us and the first time it happened she cried and promised to never do that again) these days she thinks maybe corporal punishments should make a comeback because "the younger generations are so fragile and insecure, my generation produced real men and generally people who can tough things out and we were all hit by our parents". It's breaking my heart.
I have a lot of trouble understanding how nineties Rosanne got reremembered as a conservative show. But apparently, it was "conservative" enough, that fox news was celebrating the breakout success of the return of a conservative TV show.
People forget. Happens all the time. There are people who remember 'All in the Family' not as satire, but as though Archie had a good point- or the opposite in that the show was racist in its roots. People also forget what having a celebrity president looks like, and why "trickle down" economics don't work. This is why you can watch documentaries or doc- series about people like Nixon and ask why it feels so familiar despite not having even been born at the time. In short, people are stupid and never learn anything.
There's also the idea that the right rallies around whatever makes them look like minority underdogs fighting against an "elitist" left. To them, a show like Roseanne looks like a relic from a bygone era where creators could make shows about working-class white families before those damn "liberals" went around making every show "politically correct". Of course, you could probably argue that the act of restricting media to remain "politically correct" was even more prevalent in the late-80s/early-90s than today (especially when looking at the non-Roseanne sitcoms at the time), but conservatives tend to over-praise America's past regardless of facts anyway. Plus, a lot of people who considered themselves progressive in the 90s aren't nearly considered as progressive now, likely due to harboring bigoted opinions. For example, many people who are homophobic or transphobic may have grown up with economic views that are more congruent with the Democrats than the Republicans, but their sociopolitical views that were nurtured over America's decades of LGBT+ oppression may be causing them to vote in Republicans who openly express contempt against gay marriage or trans rights. Same goes with Republican voters with strong anti-immigrant stances. It's easier to express hate than to talk about the foundational elements that America could change to support more of its poorer citizens, especially for older generations who have suffered due to the system for so long while America continues getting more and more socially progressive.
It's the same reason why Johnny Cash is considered a conservative. People for some reason associate working class with Republicans, and I don't really understand why
I never thought the sink was full of water and thus roseanne was drowning haley. but your point is valid, it's still physical punishment buy leaning over the sing and spraying her and then defending spanking and forgetting that kind of continuity of the character.
I don't know if you've ever showered with long hair, but that can easily wrap around your face with your head down. Water is the most cohesive of non-metal liquids.
I get what you mean, but there have been numerous accounts of kids dressing as characters or historical figures they idolize and they're still shamed and shunned for identifying with or idolizing someone who doesn't fit their skin tone/gender/etc.
@@acediadekay3793 I find that it’s more of a problem about dressing as stereotypes or coloring your skin to be a different tone. That’s when it becomes cultural appropriation and not appreciation. Dressing as a iconic character or historical figure is fine as long as you aren’t coloring your skin to look like them.
One of the most overlooked reasons of opioid addiction in impoverished communities is directly tied to how insanely overpriced prescription drugs are. If you get surgery and don't have insurance (like Roseanne), painkillers can add a huge cost to an already unaffordable procedure. Meanwhile, local street venders have to stay cheaper than their competitors a few blocks over, and will sell you some for cheap. Regulated pills cost an arm and a leg, but the prices for the unregulated stuff are more affordable than what even most well-insured people can get. And the worst part is, most of these pills enter the market from middle-class people. When I got wrist surgery a few years ago on my parent's insurance, I was prescribed a 20-count of opioids, which was 17 more than I ended up taking. I ended up tossing them after a while because I didn't have a use for them, so it's easy to see how people with insurance can be tempted to sell their excess for quick cash. It's another way medical care under capitalism screws over poor people, and you'd be surprised at how many politicians are actually aware of this.
Not only were you over prescribed, (and lucky for not falling in love w what you were prescribed, and smart for just throwing the extras away), but a lot of people get over prescribed for different reasons: before we got insured, when we lived in a smaller town, my partner was of the opinion that local Drs would slightly over prescribe people in dicey financial shape specifically so those over prescribed persons could sell the excess pills and recoup some of the money they lost to the injury. Which is actually sort of pragmatic if true, but if you already love pills, or have an "addictive personality," it can tighten your bond to the drug, bringing you closer to addiction, or open a gate to the same. Not a great situation! If only it wasn't so damn _expensive_ to be sick or injured! I'm glad you're okay. I wish more people had access to the right number of pain meds for the right reasons, and that it wasn't such a potentially life-ruining event to get injured or sick.
@Luke Wilson can we stop perpetuating opioid hysteria? There are different reasons why people get drugs from the street and its not just "Oh im an addict and these drugs are too expensive"? Its great that you personally didnt need the full RX but there are people who DO need pain medifation to function.
@@andieallison6792 I never intended to perpetuate opioid hysteria (just the opposite), and I know the situation is really nuanced. I was just trying to explain a side of the situation that often gets overlooked in the discourse, though I maybe did it poorly. I'm from Kentucky, one of the states most affected by the opioid epidemic, so I (and many people I know) have lost family/friends to the addiction. That being said, my knowledge still isn't the best, but I try to understand it as well as I can. A lot of the misinformation is victim-blaming, so all I was trying to argue was one of the ways that the problem is far more the fault of a medical system designed to fail the most vulnerable communities than anything else. I'm sorry if my post seemed insensitive or inaccurate, because that isn't what I wanted at all.
The thing is, Roseanne's character changing makes perfect sense. Her changes are exactly what we are seeing, particularly in older people, here in the upper lower class world. We all have that older friend who used to be tolerant, even if they were behind the times, who have been radicalized into Trump followers. The racism was improving, but now they're embracing it because of all the fear mongering. They blame their economic woes on those different from them. What was surreal about it all is that these same people were embracing _Roseanne_ . So they were getting the message they needed to hear and enjoying it. I still sometimes wonder if enduring Roseanne Barr's obvious, conspiracy theory enabled racism would have been worth it to be able to bridge the gap. We had this very liberal show that conservatives were embracing as their own. Instead, they now have Last Man Standing, starring another older person who got more conservative. But his show decided to switch to arguing that his crap was right, reinforcing the male machismo that the previous show rejected. So the divide just gets deeper.
I was about to comment this same thing, with the addition: we see this change in older people (especially post 9/11), but it's important to note that the change didn't happen out of nowhere, an awful lot of the fear-mongering can be traced back to Fox News, a pure propaganda channel whose viewership is primarily older people of roughly Roseanne's age---and that's something that would have been interesting to see the show tackle
Very true. There's also a pattern that I've noticed among older centrists. Their attitudes were considered progressive back when they were younger, but as time moved on and culture continued to change, those same attitudes are now thought of as behind the times and even problematic, and there's a resentment to being called out on it by younger, more engaged people on the left. And a combination of nostalgia and antipathy towards the far left can lead people towards feeling sympathetic for the right, even while they still see themselves as fundamentally progressive.
I don't like the glee that is taken in Roseanne's ousting. Toxic? Sure. DEAL WITH IT, though. This would be an opportunity to set things right. Life and society (to me) used to be about forgiveness and trying to understand. Now it's about leaving people crippled in a ditch if they displease you. Diversity never seems to include diversity of thought, however awful someone's views might be. It feels to me like throwing the baby out with the bathwater. It looks to many like this is the definition of cultural appropriation, too. What was once Roseanne's is now no longer and rebranded to suit the new masters.
Its a shame David wasn't utilized more in the theme of breaking the gender norms in Roseanne, time after time of seasons 1-8 he was most always the punchline for his innate femininity through kindness and a passion for art, and it felt like his status as a pushover was him reflecting those biases back onto himself from a life of being underestimated and underappreciated. Oftentimes toxic masculinity devalues men who aren't "strong enough", and whereas progressive movements often support women not strong enough to support themselves due to low self confidence or relationships wherein they are not given the power the deserve, men like David do not have that support out of conservative chastisement for not being the "provider", our culture can't give the same treatment to men as it is still rooted in its harsh uphold of gender norms. David ran away from his responsibilities because he was lied to about what they entailed - it wasn't about being "man" enough, it was about being there for your family, but in a large way, he was being rooted against from the very offset of the original run.
I do agree with you about how they dogged David's character in the original but in regards to his relationship to Darlene his softness was always part of his appeal for her. Instead it seems like David just kinda bailed when things got too hard, which is also what he did in the original series as well. Even when he comes back its not about the fact he couldn't be the breadwinner it's just that he isn't around generally. I mean considering the fact he bailed for nearly a decade he gets off really easily with both his kids and Darlene.
@@FreyaEinde He definitely gets off easy, there's no excuse for him to abandon his family, that being said I don't think it was because he generally disliked Darlene or the kids, he just had a big confidence problem with being a dad. It isn't like he's lazy, he goes to help the poor when he leaves, as some sort of rectifying act for himself. His aimless fling with Blue felt, again, him trying to patch up his own insecurities. They __are__ just playing off the "hapless loser" archetype, but that very archetype seems to be tied to the long running underestimation and emasculative teasing of his character, be that by the writers or the Conner family; and either way, rooted in what is a dated stereotype of toxic masculinity. Perhaps not unwarranted in some parts of his actions, but still a gender bias over what his role is "supposed" to be. It certainly isn't like they don't touch this idea with Dan.
@@WildSableye See I wish the show had more time to go into that storyline, because even though they're always making the joke that David is just this passive pushover, you can definitely see in places where he uses that characterization to get away with crazy shit. Like it's low key emotionally manipulative. Case in point when he just up and dumped Blue and tries it on with Darlene again. It makes him a lot more believable though and a good character, because he's essentially on paper a good person but he's emotionally dishonest and inconsistent and that's hurtful in a very believable way. I think they kinda pointed out in the episode where they decide to divorce really well.
This may sound crazy but as a gay man I loved that Mark's character wasn't portrayed as sexually confused, but just as a child who liked to wear what he wanted to wear, and it so happens that it doesn't fit the gender norms of society. In a way it's a beautiful side glance to society and their views on gender and the "ideals" that comes with said gender, including clothing. In other words, he isn't wearing a skirt because he's gay or trans, he's wearing it because he thinks he looks great in it. That to me is what society should want to be and encouraged and not make everything about sexuality.
The whole Roseanne-bigoted-toward-her-neighbor thing always reminds me of the episode of King of the Hill when Khan's family moves in next door and Peggy accuses Hank of racism. His response of, "I don't hate him cuz I'm racist. I hate him cuz he's a bad neighbor," always struck me as an apt-yet funny-response. Khan is a "bad neighbor" to Hank largely because of a vast cultural divide that Hank is unable (more than he is unwilling) to cross. It's not overt, explicit racism (unlike Cotton, who's the perfect foil for Hank in that episode), but it's still a hurdle that Hank never really overcomes. Anyway, King of the Hill was great!
But khan wasn't a great neighbor he had a superiority complex, wasn't very nice etc. One of the reasons they moved to Texas was because he had problems with his previous neighbors too
Despite the salt of the Earth persona, Hank was always a complex character, but really, so was Khan. Judge could have made the characters of King of the Hill two-dimensional but instead chose to give them depth (the opposite of what he did with the stereotypical characters in The Goode Family, which is a big reason why that series was uninteresting). And even with all of the disagreements and awkward moments, the series made it pretty clear by the end that Hank and Khan were friends. Peggy and Minh, though...well, that's probably a different story. *lol*
The repeated "how dare you ruin 'x' by bringing politics into it?!" shit is so disingenuous. 'Not talking about politics' just means supporting the status quo. Which, surprise, surprise, is a (right wing) political position.
It's such a privileged person take. I'm Black, and a non-binary woman, my life has always revolved around my identity and my politics. I can't imagine otherwise
Whatever you might think of Rossane Barr, I'm disappointed that you glossed over the fact that she fought tooth and nail to keep the show running without her to keep all those people working on it employed.
Good point but if we're being realistic she wanted the show to fail it must kill her that it suucedded not dissing most would naturally feel that.unfortunatley she has lost it mentally I unfortunately see a very sad out come for her if her or her family doesn't get her help
That's true. Roseanne Barr is a very flawed and unpleasant person, but I don't think that she's evil. I do see some good in her. Considering how bigoted my family is, I've had to learn to see the good in them too, or else I would go crazy.
Citation needed. Besides, not letting her fuck up hurt dozens to hundreds of workers is the least she could do (if she did even do that). I won't give her a metal.
Your first Roseanne vid is what I subbed to you for, you only had like 6k then, I'm glad to see that more than doubled in only a week or so, you deserve it.
I've never watched a single episode of Roseanne but that scene at 15 08 made me tear up. And it made me all the sadder that the season 10 remake didn't actually bother with her apologizing or talking about how she was abused herself when she falls into that same cycle with her granddaughter.
Honestly this is the perfect pace for a deep dive like this, so often these things are full of fluff or so deliberately paced that it becomes background noise one way or another. This feels pretty well edited on the script level without being too fast for the thoughtful implications to sink in. Great job!
the worst part for me was the complete discarding of the cycle of violence issues that held a lot of impact in the earlier seasons, like, completely forgotten. Roseanne now thought that spanking was an ok thing to do to your family when back then, it cause a deep internal look into the negative influences that abusive and controlling family burn into us and causes us to act in ways we severely regret, then Roseanne *apologies* because it *was wrong* of her to hit her child. It was actually introspective, actually talking about how violence sticks inside you and manifests in ways you never thought you could act and hurt your family in the same way you were hurt. All that was just thrown away, I feel hurt by it if I'm honest. I was deeply disappointed.
As someone who watched the original Roseanne as a teen, the reboot brought lots of feels. I'm really relieved that they kept the Connors, because it would have been a shame to end a good show just because Roseanne herself has gone totally loony toons. I don't get it, she was nothing like that in the 90s.
It's called a paradigm shift. A lot of so-called "leftists" back in the 90s have gone straight on conservative now for reasons that aren't exactly clear. It could be due to age, it could be due to economic crisis, or it could be the very real fact that these people were about as "left" as they were a person of color. The reality is, the Conners were never exactly so leftist that they were alienating to a conservative audience and it reflects a lot of the pseudo leftist ideologies a lot of conservatives held back in the 90s.
One thing you have to remember is that, though Roseanne herself helped instill a working class vibe into the original series, with a lot of help, and probably drew on some real life experiences to do so, she wasn't. Roseanne Barr has never been a major world class superstar, but she was already a touring comedian and became a television star afterwards. For the past 40 years, while mirroring the growth into a conservative boomer that the show would showcase and its revival, she's also been living the life of a much wealthier person, with the problems of fame, celebrity, and at least some excess. Combined with her somewhat radical political leanings and the radicalization of politics and general, as well as her authoritarian and very commanding nature even back in the '90s, it's easy to see the path she took to get where she is now.
@@NoirRaven Yeah, it's pretty depressing that they abandoned the left after the fight to get them their rights. And then they vote for the side that's going to re-subjugate them the moment there's a chance. But, conservatives attract people that see belief as fact, so it attracts people that don't know their history.
I mean one thing that might have changed Roseanne's perspective (and Barr's) around racism, is y'know, 9/11. It's weird to think of now, but between the end of the old run and the beginning of the new run, the events of the early 2000's became the past, nearly 20 years of past. Back in 96 she might have said "Who cares?" about Muslims moving in, or even "Which one's a Muslim again?" but for TWO DECADES, the background noise on that particular group of people hasn't been the most positive. Stuff like that sinks in when we aren't paying attention. A lot of people who thought they were progressive got scared back then, fear makes people stupid, and even when the fear went away, the feelings brought up by it can stick around forever if not dealt with, living on under the surface, and showing up in strange places. A better written show might have addressed that. (I'd have preferred Roseanne heard the teller say something racist, and get irritated at how rude she's being, and then one of her family scoff when she said something about it, and her not realize at first that teller sounds just like her, with maybe the family member thinking it was Roseanne herself who said it. Then, Roseanne realizing what a bigot she'd been, try and do something nice. The Conners were always teaching each other, not in a patronizing way, but in a real way, like family does. Calling each other out on their bullshit.) It's interesting to me how this large time gap shook people. Like seeing a old friend after many years there was a sense of betrayal in the way these characters changed, getting older, becoming more entrenched in their views, or picking up new ones that seem out of character. But we don't know what 2001, or 2008, or 2010, or 2012, or 2015 were like for this family. 20 years is a span of time long enough for a lot of change, a lot of damage, and pain. Of course there's room for good things too, but a lot of the time its the losses that cause us to change course. There are adult people who were born after the show ended, and grew up before it came back. Many people watching these videos are too young to have been alive when the show started, I don't think it's all that strange to think these characters changed in ways even they wouldn't understand. Time does that. I was a kid when this show first aired, and though I grew up in another country, it reflected aspects of my life, right down to the dysfunctional family, and a mother with a history of abuse, who could be rough around the edges. These people resonated with me, and I wonder at the things we didn't see, the many things that caused these little changes. In my family, since that time there have been hundreds of changes, big and small, and they've meant the people I grew up with, including myself, have changed drastically. I wish we had a chance to explore that in these characters, the things that happened that they don't even think about, because they're 15 years in the past. The things that they don't even realize changed their lives.
Probably the most interesting rant that I've read in this comment section. The thought of what caused Barr herself to change throughout the years is interesting to ponder, cuz evidently something in the intervening years must have had an effect on her. Unfortunately, I don't think that level of self-criticism and reflection is something her and others alike would care to delve into, but it would make for an interesting study.
@@davistoa I mean to me, from a writing perspective, it would be one of the more important things to delve into with the characters (and a really good source of plots for individual episodes, or short arcs). THe old show was constantly bringing up things from the 70's and 60's, pieces of the past that would make the family reflect on how time changes people. Those years in the early 2000's transformed the world in a whole host of ways we're still feeling the effects of. But I don't know what Barr's agenda was in making the show. As for the woman herself, yeah, it feels like something flipped for her, though she was always course and kind of impulsive, she seemed to be generally benign. Agreed she doesn't strike me as a person too given to self reflection, and there are many others who have undergone similar transformations (while maintaining that they haven't changed at all) who likewise seem disinclined to explore what's behind their current viewpoints. lol It is of course possible I've given too much thought and credit to the writing and writers of a sitcom.
WOW. Your videos are amazing and well-put. :) Roseanne was a show that was BIG in my house. My own mother tried to emulate the character, despite being closer to the last season/real life one. Yikers. But this summation and description of The Conners has piqued my interest from a point of not knowing the show existed.. To genuinely wanting to watch it and see if it retains the sense of emotional support and family that the original show gave me. Only now it's not an escape, it's just a fond reflection. Thank you for your retrospectives, friend!
This channel manages to give really well presented overviews of this show. Covering not just the more interesting plot points and character moments but also putting them into a broader context of things happening behind the scenes as well as the political climate. It's not often I can watch a 47 minute UA-cam video and be completely engrossed to the point where it's over and it only felt like it had been ten minutes ago that I began watching it.
The way you edit and narrate all these reviews of all these shows and all the heart wrenching scenes, I always tear up a little. Especially the abuse section. I never had to deal with it, but it's a very moving scene because so many of my loved ones have dealt with it and seeing them grapple with coping with it and rising above it, hit some heart strings.
Yeah, I see how that would look that way. In America, that is more like a girl's school uniform. That's what I saw when they showed it. The kind girls would wear to private/religious schools in particular.
Iain 97 It’s just a plaid skirt. I had to wear them every day when I attended a private school as a child. They’re traditional uniforms for catholic school girls, which I was eons ago.
@@poordropo1 typical american ignorance. it was a kilt for hundreds of years before america even existed. you arent the centre of the universe. get some perspective.
I think you bring up a great point. I know a lot of people get age, who have basically flipped their political views, from when they were younger. It happens often, and can be addressed... I just don't feel like Bare herself, addressed it properly.
Absolutely, but Roseanne Barr is under no obligation to explain to me why she changed her politics. The writers of the show DO have a responsibility to make me understand why the character of Roseanne acts and thinks so differently then she did previously.
I refer to my other post for why they don't really need to say anything. She's exactly the right demographic for these changes in political thought. She's older, working class, anti-PC, with old-fashioned views. She bought the message of the Republican party that the liberals are the reasons for all her ills, and that going back to the old ways is better. If anything, it's surprising she's held onto any of her old, more liberal views. Sure, I'll agree that it doesn't make rational sense. It's not like conservatives have offered any actual solutions. But it's a change that has happened in our culture, and it would be strange if it had not happened to Roseanne Conner. Barr's change is actually more atypical, and requires a deep dive into the reasons that a certain 4chan conspiracy theory was able to catch on.
@@ZipplyZane It's not that the change is so big as to not be believable, it's that a change that big needs to be shown or at least acknowledged, and based on the video and the comments I've read, the show didn't do that.
Watching these videos reminds me of watching Roseanne reruns before bed in the early 00's with my grandparents. I might have to go back and watch it now. Thanks.
These 2 videos were seriously incredible. Normally I'll just play a video like this in the background while working, but I found myself dropping whatever I was doing and just giving these my full attention. Looking forward to whatever you discuss next.
@@russianbot8576 I did too. I WISH though, that Roseanne ended up grounding D.J. for stealing the car. She was absolutely correct in the beginning. D.J. could have been badly injured or even killed, he could have killed someone else. He could have caused major damage that the family would have been responsible for. There could have been lots of repercussions, and yet the show dropped this when Roseanne smacked D.J. He was also very belligerent and not sorry he took the car at all. Yes, Roseanne was traumatized by her past. It was heartbreaking. But they still should have had her ground D.J. for his behavior.
You should talk about Shameless next. I feel like that show shoots for the same class commentary as Roseanne, but is much smarter about it. That's just my opinion though, I'd love to hear your thoughts
@@justinokraski3796 that's really interesting. Even though that's not technically true, as there are times in Roseanne where the Conners don't have jobs and there are times in Shameless where multiple Gallaghers have jobs at the same time, it does say a lot about our public perceptions of what the "poor" and "working poor" are, and what the differences are.
I subscribed after watching your videos about Sabrina and the Golden Girls. I started watching your playlist yesterday starting with Roseanne. The way it transitions seamlessly into Part 2 is perfection. I recommend everyone watch these videos this way. You do an excellent job mixing in fact with critique. I am looking forward to viewing the rest of the playlist. Cheers!
I’d love for you to do an update on the series now. And can I just say, WOW! Talk about a beautiful, well educated, and sharp mind you have! I have to RAVE about your analysis of this show. Everything from the editing, to your script is so well thought out and poignant yet keeps the viewer entertained and engaged. Good for you man! I look forward to watching more of your videos! 😊😊😊😊🎉😊😊
@@raynafae I watched the first one only and why watch a leftist point of view. Someone ignorant who thinks her tweet was racist. His voice is annoying to me too.
@@Ran-33 Why watch?... Maybe to have a better idea of how to counter their point of view? Commenting without having watched it makes you look a little silly, is all. But hey whatever I often feel pretty similar with people on the right that I find abrasive, so I understand what you mean. Bias is human. Still, Roseanne is on the QAnon/Soros shit which is just cringe, imo.
@@raynafae The whole media and the left is on the Russian collusion conspiracy theory but they're allowed to live in an alternative reality I guess. I predicted that his season 10 video will be anti Roseanne.
I loved the original (I also happen to be working class from Illinois and roughly DJ's age. The original show just felt so much like how I remember growing up. The Mother's Day BBQ episode from season 2 especially reminds me SO much of practically every BBQ I went to as a kid.) And I tried to give the new one a chance, hoping that Roseanne's personal craziness wouldn't bleed too much into it. But the moment I saw the spanking stuff come up, I knew they had lost the original character and this wasn't the same show. I gave up on it after that and celebrated when she got canned. I did watch the first episode of season 11 and thought it was good (better than 10 anyway), but I just couldn't go back to watch anymore. It's better to keep the first 9 (or even better the first 8) seasons, and forget the attempts at revival. But I do love the analysis!
@@moonlily1 I didn't like that either. Though Roseanne being nasty to Jackie was present in the original series too. Jackie was always the one presented as the wacky mess of a sister who Roseanne was completely controlling of. There was a harder edge to that in season 10 though. But there was a harder edge to all of season 10 that just made the whole thing seem much sadder than the struggles they all faced in the first 8 seasons
@@koryschulein7778 It's pretty gross to frame Jackie as being pathetic because she's single, especially after having it been established, after Jackie tried marriage, that she's actually happier single. And I never saw her as a 'mess'- as a single woman, she was free to experiment with different careers, chase dreams and change paths when she wanted to. As a working class mother, experimenting wasn't an option for Roseanne; she didn't have dreams, she just had jobs and did what she had to do.
@@moonlily1 I certainly see the point of what you're saying. And I could have framed what I was saying better than to just blanket call Jackie "a mess." What I really was wanting to say was that Roseanne treated Jackie as a mess that she had to constantly look out for. And the show brought up the way Roseanne controlled Jackie on many many occasions. The season 4 episode "Therapy" kind of encapsulates all of it, though nothing is really resolved in the episode. And later episodes definitely played up Jackie's "wackiness" for laughs. In the two classic TV send-ups Jackie was cast in the roll of the "wacky neighbor" in the Leave It To Beaver parody and was put in the role of Gilligan in the Gilligan's Island sequence.Those sorts or portrayals in the later seasons didn't help how her character was presented.
@@koryschulein7778 Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you see her that way. I agree that the narrative treats her as "a mess" and that's a shame. In truth, I like Jackie better than Roseanne as a character. She has more dimension. And she actually seems to be a really good life coach.
Oh man, not that I didn't sit and watch your first part of this series from start to finish and enjoy every minute of it, but this is what I was hoping the last video was going to touch more on, so thank you so much. Thoroughly entertaining and endlessly insightful. I especially appreciate you bringing up the 'spanking' parallel. I saw that last year and it made me mad. If there was ever a glaring indication 'Roseanne' was no longer "Roseanne", that was it. To answer your question, I think we can have 'Roseanne' _because_ of the absence of Roseanne. "Season 10 was an affront to the brilliant original run, it was clear either the writers didn't know what they were doing, or they let Barr have way too much input, but no amount of superficial nostalgia (like the cameo of Darlene's teacher in the pilot, or Roseanne's post-lottery win jacket from season 9) was going to save it. 'The Conners' to me was like a retry without a mentally unstable, noisy weight, where the cast and crew were able to do the original some justice and deliver to the super fans of the original (like me)
I love and appreciate your intelligent queer-centric honest analytical reviews, I highly enjoyed both these Roseanne videos. Your voice is like a Time Travellers perspective, and your dissertation of this cult classic television phenomenon fulfilled what the public has wondered and desired as a retrospect. I look forward to more reviews and commentary from you, and am thankful to hear a well reasoned dissertation on media so familiar yet filled with concepts somewhat foreign somehow while remaining well balanced with its cadence.
i'm very uncomfortable with the way the audience cheered at Roseanne practically waterboarding her granddaughter, especially coupled with the scenes from the original series...
The Connors and Rosanne are two of my favorite shows. Thank you so much for these two videos.
5 років тому+14
After watching your recap of the first eight seasons, I feel committed to my initial thoughts about S10: it was a _major_ slap in the face of S01-S08 (S09 never happened! LALALALALA!! NOT LISTENING!!!) There were so many elements of S10 that just felt tone-deaf in ways that the previous run simply wasn't, even though it was very much a product of 1988-1997, and watching her _physically assault her own granddaughter_ - that is not the same character who had an emotional breakdown when she slapped DJ after he stole a car in S06. Turning Jackie from a capable and fairly intelligent, albeit neurotic single woman with some low-key bipolar traits, into a dim-witted Rightwing caricature of the Moderate Left was insulting. Seeing Becky fall into a depression hole is given some logic, I suppose - I forget the in-story explanation of Mark's death (or the approximate time, relative to S10, when it happened), but Becky is about 45 in S10, and even that's awfully young to be a widow (well, in this day and age - hell, for the last few generations, TBQH). Still, it feels a bit weird to see her obsess on having a baby, and a bit disconnected from the way Becky was written during S01-S09. She's been a fighter and a survivor, all her life, so seeing her clearly turn into someone with high-functioning clinical depression, while given a logic that makes sense, is jarring enough, but again, putting her on Mission Baby feels a bit phoned-in from the writers room. S10 was generally written to pander to her newfound Right Wing fans who forgot (or were willing to ignore) the show's original run and her various stunts, like that San Diego baseball game. While I'd generally written off Roseanne Barr as high-key garbage, back when her fool-headed opinions about trans people surfaced, I still tuned in, in part for the nostalgia value, in part cos I love the other cast members _so much_ (John Goodman and Laurie Metcalf are criminally underrated, and I wrote several fan letters to Sarah Gilbert, back in fourth and fifth grade; Gilbert is only a couple of years older than me, and her character may have been an influence on myself going goth). I also definitely felt the episode with the Muslim neighbours was totally ham-fisted, and 100% agree with the anonymous S10 Writer: it's totally out-of-character for Roseanne Conner of S01-S09, but more in-line with the real-life Roseanne Barr.
I agree with your final lines... I was never a huge fan of either show... but I'm oddly obsessed with them too... for all the reasons you listed. Thank you so much for all the time and effort put into these. They were phenomenal
17:19 It’s really difficult for some of us to see how much our parents have changed… since 2016. You’re left wondering how much of them was always like that, and how much of the parent you loved is still in there.
Great videos. My wife and I both grew up watching the original series and restarted it when the new show was announced. We brought up a lot of the same points you did your videos. Glad to see someone took the time to make a 2 part video essay and really put in the work to make it great. Fantastic work. You earned yourself a subscriber.
I’m sure I speak for many that we aren’t fans either but stumbled across the first video,watched it and were captivated by it thanks to you. And now we are watching this 😄
Fascinating stuff - I think Roseanne’s comeback really accurately reflected the change in people in that area of the country & class. That’s why I fled there - it’s a sacrifice-zone, and I’m afraid to check-in there after another 20-years passes.
27:58 “determined how their worth is measured over if they can squeeze out a baby.” That’s just wrong. Becky was upset because she may not have wanted children but the idea of it being now closed forever to her was very upsetting. I just don’t understand why you wouldn’t ask a few of your female friends their take on this. You’re trying to be so woke but what you wound up speaking for women and painting them all with the same brush. Pro-choice is just that. A woman can choose to not have children and a woman can choose to have children. Both are completely valid and reasonable options.
Great piece! I really enjoyed this video. Roseanne was all about class consciousness, but elites don't want that idea catching on so they stripped it from the show.
I watched as a kid for a few seasons but gave up around season 3, I checked out a few episodes of both new shows but didn't love that either but I always thought Roseanne was an interesting idea even if it was executed in an appealing manner. This is why I enjoyed both your retrospectives. They summed up the themes and really the experience of the show without making me have to sit through any more episodes. Great work and thanks.
Damn, Roseanne‘s acting in the old run of the series was powerful. The first (and almost last) I heard about her was a news story about one of her controversies but I‘m glad to get a new perspective now. Hopefully I‘ll catch seasons 1-9 on some streaming service some day.
Great job on the videos! I hope The Conners can go on and be great like Roseanne too. It isn't even close yet. But I believe the show can go on without her.
I don’t have time to completely collect my thoughts on this, so I’ll just say that I really appreciate this video which has subsequently made me appreciate those 80’s to 90’s sitcoms. Thanks for that
I think that her change reflects the change of many people in the past 20 years. As a person of the 90's no one cared; now everyone is divided and the Roseanne reboot was successfully showing that. Just like we all have
Great videos on this sitcom, I never even liked it but I saw the show often during its many years of running. I never watched it since the 90's and your vids are the first / only time I've seen anything about the show. Indicating your high quality commentary, I appreciate u
Roseanne was a huge part of my childhood because it was the first time I saw a family on TV that was disfunctional and always holding on with grit and sarcasm. Roseanne reminded me of my mom I. The essential ways. She was snappy, tough, and real. No matter the politics, the show on it's own gave me a realist look at life and how to survive I. This world. I was always a big fan of the episodes where everyone just hung out, like the tornado days episode or all the Halloween episodes. When the revival and spin off happened I valued the constancy of having the show in my life more than I did the messages it was sharing or the stories it was telling. The presence of this realistic family being on television has made me hopeful about the survival or the working class family in this country. We swear and we fight. We aren't all the same racially. I am from a mixed household. The realness of the people makes the shown shine for me even in the face of glaring political missteps and social unrest. If the Conner family survives it all, then it tells people like me living paycheck to paycheck that we have it I. Us to keep going when things don't begin to look like they will change.
A little disappointed you never touched my favorite episode of the series (the funeral of Roseanne’s father), but I understand that had nothing to do with your reading of the series. Nice work!
This & your part 1 were fascinating, well done. I lived without most of Roseanne & will live entirely without the Connors, but you've a great knack for sustaining deep dive, nuanced interest. Thank you. TgT
38:11 *OWNED! TAKE THAT LIBERALS!* But seriously, I love the fact that you saved me a lot of time and bullshit by talking about this series. I loved Rosanne as a kid, but I didn't watch it all the time. When it was rebooted, I didn't watch it, because I knew of the person Rosanne turned out to be outside of that character. Plus, you know, Trump. (Aaaand those conspiracy theories you mentioned her popping off about) Soooooo, yeah. Thanks @José 😁
People who weren't there, can't get how groundbreaking and edgy Rosanna really was. Same thing about alot of shows and comedians we take for granted today. Bill Hicks is a notable Male counterpart to Roseanne. It was shocking to see what happened to the recent season. How it happened. And how much modern liberals had changed in terms of the 80s and 90s liberals. Which I was one. Staying as moderate and progressive as possible now,but leaning to liberal, it's been a trip. Good video!
I just want to say, I love your videos. I never enjoyed Rosanne or shows like it… and I almost didn’t watch these two covering Rosanne, but I’m so glad I did. Ive watched four of your videos this week and have finally subscribed because your thoughtful review of something I’ve always detested gave me enough of a kick to adjust my views. Rosanne still sucks… and I’m probably not going to watch The Connors either… but I have a better perspective and I can see the value in both shows. Thank you!
That spanking episode was fucked up. Corporal punishment does no good because all it teaches the kid is 'do what I say (even if you think it's wrong) or I'll hurt you.' A kid's mind records emotion more than anything else, so instead of remembering what started the whole altercation, what they'll probably remember is that someone they loved and trusted decided to make them feel pain to control them. Just because your parents hit you when you were young doesn't justify you hitting your own kids now!
Thank you for making both of these videos. I never watched the show, but you have instilled a fondness for it in me. You were also shockingly fair in your treatment of Roseanne Bar and I appreciate you did go super far one way or the other
To address one of the common comments I see on here, the explanation for Dan not being dead (and Jackie not being a lesbian, Becky not dating David etc.), is that the final season of Roseanne was a story written by Roseanne Conner and none of it actually happened. They don't go into much more detail than that.
Works for me
''Her body, her choice''
I'm tired of hearing that lie. That's another human being that is being incubated. Not a commodity to be traded. Children are not the property of their parents.
@@citycrusher9308 Not a lie though, it's her choice on what she wants to do with herself. while not something that could be traded in simple terms, it is something that can be used as a tool if needed. While I think this is a completely different topic for another place that could involve this conversation to a greater extent, the body is a lot of things and is not a lot of things, but we can't just shove it into one category and say "you can't do this because it's not X" when in another scenario or worded differently, it certainly would be
@@calaifur It's not herself. The baby is his/her own self, not a limb the mother can cut off.
@@citycrusher9308 The baby doesn't have a self as it's parasite until it's born. That's why birthdays mark the day when the baby became a separate entity and a separate conscience. But since you're a man (just like me) this isn't really a conversation you have any right to be in. The worst impregnating a woman can do to you is require 18 years of child support. The worst impregnating a woman can do to her is death during child birth. So you know, you're taking a lot less responsibility than the mother has to so you're out of your lane to dictate how a woman should handle birth.
Watch Roseanne? Nah
Watch hours of Jose discussing Roseanne? Yes please.
First your great Video and now this one - great day for leftist yt 🙂
Because you have no taste.
Radical Reviewer: Lmao. I never thought of it this way but I'm in the same boat. Never really watched Roseanne, but these videos are really interesting/informative.
@Dave Lb Watch the video.
Yes! He's amazing
Original "Roseanne," 1990s: "these things aren't boys' things, because you're a girl and you're using them"
Reboot "Roseanne," 2018: "why are you wearing that? that's for girls and you're a boy"
Also the spanking thing... it crosses the line from "inconsistent character writing" to "bad retcon"/"we forgot part of our show's premise."
actually if you watch the episode about the spanking it was about how she did it out of anger and no control. most likely they were disciplining the kids but in a more controlled way and explained why they did it but not on camera as that would be a bad and boring thing to show on the show then what they did with that extreme. she was just more scared for losing control and just hitting instead of properly explaining to him why she was going to spank him.@@squarebearderry
Actually I think this does line up with the double standards of gender nonconformity for boys and girls. I’ve seen this from my own mom who talks proudly of how she was a tomboy most of her life but will in the same breath day a boy shouldn’t be wearing girls clothes
I’m struggling to understand how Roseanne went from profusely apologizing to her son for hitting him to deriding her daughter’s generation for not hitting their kids
In real life, Roseanne became a Republican. THAT’S what happened.
this PC generation, can’t even assault your own kids anymore!
Loving the reviews, but I gotta say: Roseanne's transformation from season 9 to 10 isn't that far from the transformation I've seen happen in boomers in my own life. This nationalistic-faux populism we're living through does strange things to people.
My mom always said awful shit, but it's gotten turned up to 11 and she's damn proud of it. Fucking boomers.
I don't live in the U.S. but I see this happening in my country too. Many boomers who used to talk about all the revolutionary things they made happen are now complaining about young people who care about social justice. When I confront them with this, they say that kids these days take it too far and they're spoiled. But that's exactly how the older generation used to see them in the '60's.
Roseanne will need to be reviewed academically in the decades to come for reflecting the changing of a generation's political beliefs. I fear when us Millenials and Zoomers become reactionaries.
@@justinokraski3796 It's already happening. Welcome to the human condition. We become our parents without even realizing it.
F U C K
B
O
O
M
E
R
S
Semi-devil's advocate here. BUT, people who were blue dog centrists in the 90s becoming full blown MAGA by the mid-late 2010s, especially as they moved from early-mid 40s to retirement age in small town America is entirely realistic and I've seen it among dozens of people I know personally (having grown up and continuing to live in Appalachia). The Roseanne character's political progression as I just described I think is entirely possible/actually more realistic.
I was thinking the same thing. I know a lot of people who were progressive to a degree get twisted twenty years and become full blown MAGA people. It’s frustrating, but I totally saw it.
@@samirabdel-aziz498 Being a progressive is a lot more work than going MAGA. If you're a progressive, and want to argue your position, you need to read studies, integrate that into your beliefs, etc. You don't have to use any critical thinking to be a good MAGA, you just have to have powerful emotions, and be willing to deny facts as "part of the establishment".
But how do you go from “I’m so sorry I continued the cycle of abuse by hitting you the way my father hit me” to “if you don’t hit your child you’re an idiot and your child thinks you’re an idiot”?
@@blacklightredlight2945 absolutely! You don’t need to know anything newer than the 50s to be a conservative 😂
I was thinking the same thing. I grew up in a small town in the Midwest and observed that transformation over the years. I honestly think the rise of Fox News and right wing media has everything to do with it.
"A show about the working class made by people who aren't shitty" *casually glances at Malcom in the Middle*
I love Malcom In The Middle
I love the middle
@yossarian Isn't Blackish pretty good?
@@sluttyMapleSyrup blackish isn't middle class
@@tamarleahh.2150 Where did I ever infer the show's family was..?
If you’d told me last year I’d be loving a multi part analysis of Roseanne I’d have called you crazy.
Is this channel full of his best friends or something?
I saw this show as a teen as my mom loves it. I didn't care much about it at the time, though. The setting was probably too mundane for a kid my age. However, after randomly stumbled over this analysis, I have to rewatch it with grown-up eyes.
@@originalblob People didn't make a huge deal out of the class consciousness of the show, but it was addressed some. Probably something the media commentators couldn't comfortably address at great length. And maybe that quality didn't register with a lot of people if they didn't think the Connors looked so much working-class as normal.
The political/satirical implications of your name and profile pic are literally decimating my brain and I’m not sure I’ll ever recover.
@@davidm1926, to be honest, as a kid I associated Roseanne more with stuff like "Married with children" than with serious topics. That's because both featured "bad families", as I would have put it back then. I intuitively associated things like lacking education, low income and even overweight with moral failings like lazyness and rudeness. "Married with children" sadly encouraged this notion. Only when I grew up, I realized the difference between a sincere show about lower class people that are normal human beings and the tired bad-taste-jokes of Al Bundy.
Wow that scene about hitting your children in the original just gave me chills. That was so great.
It's not like she beat him with a Klingon Pain Stick or something.
@@visaman It is ridiculous to set the bat for raising kids that low. "Welp at least they didn't give then a black eye or break a bone or beat then with a blunt object etc etc". Awesome. Parent of the year.
@@sfletch3042 Gen X/Boomer kids childhoods were the best!
Bro, I'm Indian raised this shit is norm. Idk, Spankings are fine for certain ages. Not saying everyone does it. Americans thinking it's totally wrong is a little too liberal.
@@Qwistie_ not really. There is a wealth of evidence proving its harmful effects on some kids. And the issue is that we cannot tell whichnods will be scarred by it and which will be fine until it is too late. If you truly think is to liberals and do some research on the actual science psychology and evidence that back up the fact that it is potentially harmful to kids and then see aht you think.
Roseanne in the finale: We didn't hit our children, as we were hit
Also Roseanne: 14:20
Literally was about to say this like what the fuck?
@@VikkiDixx I was spanked as a child, and I was beaten as a wife. There is a major difference between a beating vs a spanking. I never spanked my kid and I don't think I will ever have or need to. But I don't think there is anything wrong with the way my parents raised me. But people who beat others just to satisfy their own emotions is very very wrong.
Ah. Gotta love the “the kids are just 10x worse nowadays so you HAVE to abuse them. Not like the old days where kids had so much respect”
Ugh. It’s so gross
paymyRent
They had respect bc of the discipline
Discipline isn't abuse you freaking fruit cake.
That really does just say it all.
Old Roseanne: "I hit you because my father hit me and I'm so sorry for treating you like that!"
New Roseanna: "Should've spanked him or he'll do it again, trust me! It's the only way they learn!"
Elias Barrasa. BS.
@@eliasbarrasa7320 where's the line?
They said the same thing when we were kids, and kids today will say the same thing in twenty years.
What's interesting to me is that in real life, Roseanne claimed she was abused, which is what influenced the storyline about spanking DJ. You would think she wouldn't suddenly forget about that when the show rebooted, even if everyone had forgotten who the character of Roseanne Conner is suppose to be.
Victims of abuse often become abusers themselves due to a lack of control in there lives and many other factors. It's actually the exception to the rule to not become an abuser than it is the other way around.
It could also be the very real possibility that Roseanne was simply disenchanted by her leftist beliefs because they didn't turn out to the effective and/or improve her life in any way. A lot of activists end up like Roseanne, especially in their later years; there's only so much shit you can take before you finally snap and go "fine, let's embrace the villainy," in order to survive.
She probably sees it as a good thing that Season 10 Roseanne didn't actually physically strike Harris, despite it still being physical abuse. I think she's just a product of her times... she just genuinely doesn't understand why that was still abuse. I don't think that makes it okay, obviously, but it definitely should inform how we approach the issue.
Joshua Rutterbush it’s not abuse, are you fucking dense? She held her head in the sink but the sprayer was in her hand hosing the back of the little disrespectful twits head! Kids these days have become too goddamn comfortable mouthing off to parents! I don’t know what dumbass generation you spawned from but in my day I would have been spanked and sent to my room no dinner, I didn’t die of starvation in 12 to 16 hrs like you Mickey D eating little shits think you will. But I definitely learned to behave in society and respect my elders!
Kellymarie Jones
If that's true why would she then go on to say that it's bad you're not allowed to spank people?
@@kelleymariejones6388 It's abuse. You were abused, too. I know how to behave in society as well, and respect everyone, not just my elders. I didn't need to be abused to learn that. You on the other hand immediately referred to a stranger on the internet as "dense" and called their generation dumbasses. Your entire attitude is unnecessarily disrespectful and not a great example of how you've learned to behave in society.
John Goodman and Laurie Metcalf are a FIERCE acting duo
💯
I agree.
John Goodman is an underrated actor. And it's too bad DJ's story was never really hashed out some more. As the only boy of the family in an interracial relationship, he could have had a really great story.
You forgot about Jerry.
Maybe their own show huh. Stahp!
Michael Fishman can’t act. So they can’t give him serious story lines in fear of him not being able to convey what they want to convey. Simple as that.
Just seeing the original of the Roseann apology for spanking her son made me tear up. I had a conversation like that with my mom, for the EXACT same reasons. It’s a real true to life moment that really kicks ya in the gut with how real it is.
New Roseann: “If wE don’t spank tHeM they’ll just sIt in tHe CorNeR and wonder WHy we aren’t SpAnKiNg them!”
I loved the original Roseanne - likely a product of my mom's love for the show. I felt your first essay was incredibly thoughtful, interesting, and well put together. While I didn't watch the new episodes beyond the third episode, I was likewise enthralled by this piece. Subbed. Fantastic work!
You show incredible talent. I look forward to your next offering. Have you thought of doing something on another platform. I would tune in to watch!
I was annoyed Emilio and Becky's relationship didn't last longer than a single episode. I feel like they missed an opportunity to endear him to the audience and flesh out his relationship with the family before deporting him.
True but he was in a couple of episodes before they started a relationship and you did see Becky grow to have an affinity for him herself. So I'm hoping that this is something that the audience will root for and will be worked out in the next season.
I just think the deportation would have been more impactful if he had a chance to integrate into the family more.
It’s fitting for the times. I hear what you’re saying regarding how it could have had a stronger impact. But it’s hardly out of context.
Yeah, that was a missed opportunity. Also, I hate when people say "illegals".
@@dreamingrightnow1174 I’m late to the party but, it’s also inaccurate because you can’t be *illegal* when you are seeking asylum. The overwhelming majority do not “jump the border”, their Work Visas run out while in America.
I'm really glad you brought up the spanking episode from the revival. It's the only one I've seen of the new series, and it bothered me so much that I haven't watched any other episodes of it. I couldn't support a show that was going to claim hitting children was totally okay, when the original had the exact opposite message.
It took me back and brought forth tears! One of the better episodes! ;-)
It can be baffling how people change. My own mother, when she was raising me in the late 80s to the 90s, was very much against spanking, yet when I started having kids in the 2010s, she was telling me I needed to spank them to teach them how to behave.
@aoggrta74 she grabbed her neck, and forced her over the sink?? Also depending on where her face was the kid could have been waterboarded by her own hair.
@@sarahgent2674 My mom drowned me to death every week and it never did me any harm.. Kids these days don't know they're born with their playboxes and wide screen, internet, T.V, wireless telephones!
My 21 year old grandson talks to his friends on something called a meat grinder application. I told him if he doesn't find good breeding stock soon he won't have anyone to look after him in his old age but he seems more interested in borrowing my car, to meet his meat grinder friends and spilling what I can only assume is mayonnaise on the drivers seat.
@aoggrta74 that's the most vile shit. If my parent did that to my child, they'd be imprisoned or otherwise never allowed around my life again.
“I’m an American tax payer sometimes” a beautiful line
It's not so much that I object to there being a show about a right wing person being portrayed positively- the existence of 'Last Man Standing' is of no consequence to me- it's just that Roseanne Conner was already a character, and rewriting her as a praying, gun loving, old-fashioned, ignorant right wing bigot is just disingenuous. This version of Roseanne Conner is a completely different woman.
You're correct-- not to mention how poor her acting was, it was like watching someone who only looked like Roseanne Conner.
@@VegasAceVII Yes. There is no way to change Roseanne Conner's worldview and politics in a way that makes sense. Cutting and pasting new beliefs onto her betrays the character's whole backstory and everything we know about her; she's not the real Roseanne, and this version of the show is not Roseanne. Especially when none of the other characters feel like they've changed that much, but no one points out that Roseanne has really changed or discussing anything in her experience from where we left her in 1997 that gives context to a massive paradigm shift in her thinking.
The Conners does lack spark without Roseanne present, but it also feels more truthful to the concept of the original Roseanne.
@@moonlily1 Its because Roseanne, herself has changed drastically since the end of the original series. She's no longer left wing, but a typical MAGA conservative. Her mental health has made her populist, progressive views disintegrate. She's kinda been sold out, since the last show. So, the reboot of the show is just a reflection of how she's become out of touch with working class people and current issues.
The way I look at it is: 9/11 did a number on a lot of people. It's basically responsible for the climate in the USA today (along with the afterath) Roseanne (the character) is the post 9/11 Roseanne. People change as they get older and get beaten down by the world and the media.
@@frymarioball Yes, I know that. And she's within her rights to have and express whatever beliefs she chooses in her personal life (although certainly not free to skirt pushback and consequences as many confused people would like to believe), but it's an artistic foul to cut and paste them onto her character in a way that defies narrative sense. If she wrote a new show that was not Roseanne to be her mouthpiece, that would be fine, but it just doesn't make any sense for Roseanne Conner.
I’ll never forget how I felt after watching the hitting scene when I was a teen and Roseanne apologizing to DJ, my jaw was dropped cuz my dad never apologized for abusing me and knew right then he doesn’t love me. I’m happy to say I never laid a hand on my daughter and broke the cycle. I have no relationship with my “family”, and learned family isn’t blood, family is who is there for you no matter what ✌🏼
Amen!!!
YES! You stopped it. Me too.
My dad used to hit me with the belt. If I started crying, he'd say, "I'll give you something to cry about," and hit me harder. No apologies. So, now, I'm a 48 year old woman (thankfully, no kids) who doesn't cry around anyone. When my big sister died at 42, I stood stone faced around everyone and it took me weeks to finally cry in private. So, yeah, I'm fucked.
@@WastedTalent- I’m sorry you were abused, too 😢
I grew up in a small Illinois town, blue collar, parents in and out of working either zero or three jobs at once. Roseanne REALLY resonated with me growing up in the 90s. It's no surprise that Barr is embarrassing and hard to reconcile with, especially in 2019. Anyone with lower income white quasi-conservative parents has seen how you can have a parent go from compassionate and smart to xenophobic and terrible over the course of 15 years. When you say in the beginning that it's as if nothing has changed, it's wrong - the world has changed our old people too.
This is 100% true. Coming from a fellow small town girl from Illinois.
Lived in Illinois briefly in streator before I moved back to Wisconsin and seen alot of Lanford in streator.
😂sheep on a hit piece 😂 fn morons
I'm ... a little disappointed (?) that it's ONLY 47.5 minutes...
I may or may not have listened to the first one twice (thrice?) because it was so good and there was so much to absorb...
It was a really good breakdown, I'm so glad we got a part two.
I mean the first video covered way more seasons, I would've expected this one to be more about an hour-ish
If nothing else it's a much more interesting reboot than Fuller House. Although, arguably both are just trying to continue doing what they did in the 90s, I guess Roseanne/The Connors themes have been and probably always will be more relevant than the average sitcom. (for better or worse)
Full House has not aged all that well while Roseanne, for all its faults, still manages to be relatable in current times.
I don't even like the show, but have thoroughly enjoyed your two discussions about it. Great work! 👏
I thought the bit about drying nail polish was really cute. My granddad was an old fashioned guy who let love overcome his prejudices, but was still snarky. Very realistic.
🙄🙄🙄
@@anatoliagolden-hall4553 got something to say? No?
I understand why Roseanne's change of heart on spanking would come across as her being out of character/ not the same.
Unfortunately, people certainly can change like that. My own mother threatened her father that she would call childhood services if he hit her again when she was a teenager, when I was growing up she had a firm stance that hitting a child was wrong under all circumstances (there were a few instances where she lost control and hit us and the first time it happened she cried and promised to never do that again) these days she thinks maybe corporal punishments should make a comeback because "the younger generations are so fragile and insecure, my generation produced real men and generally people who can tough things out and we were all hit by our parents".
It's breaking my heart.
I have a lot of trouble understanding how nineties Rosanne got reremembered as a conservative show. But apparently, it was "conservative" enough, that fox news was celebrating the breakout success of the return of a conservative TV show.
I think it has a lot to do with Rosanne herself and her vocal support for Trump.
The right likes to pretend to be the voice of the working class
People forget. Happens all the time. There are people who remember 'All in the Family' not as satire, but as though Archie had a good point- or the opposite in that the show was racist in its roots. People also forget what having a celebrity president looks like, and why "trickle down" economics don't work. This is why you can watch documentaries or doc- series about people like Nixon and ask why it feels so familiar despite not having even been born at the time. In short, people are stupid and never learn anything.
There's also the idea that the right rallies around whatever makes them look like minority underdogs fighting against an "elitist" left. To them, a show like Roseanne looks like a relic from a bygone era where creators could make shows about working-class white families before those damn "liberals" went around making every show "politically correct". Of course, you could probably argue that the act of restricting media to remain "politically correct" was even more prevalent in the late-80s/early-90s than today (especially when looking at the non-Roseanne sitcoms at the time), but conservatives tend to over-praise America's past regardless of facts anyway.
Plus, a lot of people who considered themselves progressive in the 90s aren't nearly considered as progressive now, likely due to harboring bigoted opinions. For example, many people who are homophobic or transphobic may have grown up with economic views that are more congruent with the Democrats than the Republicans, but their sociopolitical views that were nurtured over America's decades of LGBT+ oppression may be causing them to vote in Republicans who openly express contempt against gay marriage or trans rights. Same goes with Republican voters with strong anti-immigrant stances. It's easier to express hate than to talk about the foundational elements that America could change to support more of its poorer citizens, especially for older generations who have suffered due to the system for so long while America continues getting more and more socially progressive.
It's the same reason why Johnny Cash is considered a conservative. People for some reason associate working class with Republicans, and I don't really understand why
I never thought the sink was full of water and thus roseanne was drowning haley. but your point is valid, it's still physical punishment buy leaning over the sing and spraying her and then defending spanking and forgetting that kind of continuity of the character.
I don't know if you've ever showered with long hair, but that can easily wrap around your face with your head down. Water is the most cohesive of non-metal liquids.
I think the show still misses the fact that dressing as Frida is different than dressing like "a mexican" or "a native american"
I get what you mean, but there have been numerous accounts of kids dressing as characters or historical figures they idolize and they're still shamed and shunned for identifying with or idolizing someone who doesn't fit their skin tone/gender/etc.
@@tonyelliott5000 Mr. T was such a popular halloween costume amongst white folks, and people lost their minds debating if it was okay or not
@@acediadekay3793 great example
@@acediadekay3793 Generally yeah, black face is looked down on.
@@acediadekay3793 I find that it’s more of a problem about dressing as stereotypes or coloring your skin to be a different tone. That’s when it becomes cultural appropriation and not appreciation. Dressing as a iconic character or historical figure is fine as long as you aren’t coloring your skin to look like them.
One of the most overlooked reasons of opioid addiction in impoverished communities is directly tied to how insanely overpriced prescription drugs are. If you get surgery and don't have insurance (like Roseanne), painkillers can add a huge cost to an already unaffordable procedure. Meanwhile, local street venders have to stay cheaper than their competitors a few blocks over, and will sell you some for cheap. Regulated pills cost an arm and a leg, but the prices for the unregulated stuff are more affordable than what even most well-insured people can get. And the worst part is, most of these pills enter the market from middle-class people. When I got wrist surgery a few years ago on my parent's insurance, I was prescribed a 20-count of opioids, which was 17 more than I ended up taking. I ended up tossing them after a while because I didn't have a use for them, so it's easy to see how people with insurance can be tempted to sell their excess for quick cash. It's another way medical care under capitalism screws over poor people, and you'd be surprised at how many politicians are actually aware of this.
Not only were you over prescribed, (and lucky for not falling in love w what you were prescribed, and smart for just throwing the extras away), but a lot of people get over prescribed for different reasons: before we got insured, when we lived in a smaller town, my partner was of the opinion that local Drs would slightly over prescribe people in dicey financial shape specifically so those over prescribed persons could sell the excess pills and recoup some of the money they lost to the injury. Which is actually sort of pragmatic if true, but if you already love pills, or have an "addictive personality," it can tighten your bond to the drug, bringing you closer to addiction, or open a gate to the same. Not a great situation! If only it wasn't so damn _expensive_ to be sick or injured! I'm glad you're okay. I wish more people had access to the right number of pain meds for the right reasons, and that it wasn't such a potentially life-ruining event to get injured or sick.
How were they OvErPrEscRiBEd?
@Luke Wilson can we stop perpetuating opioid hysteria? There are different reasons why people get drugs from the street and its not just "Oh im an addict and these drugs are too expensive"?
Its great that you personally didnt need the full RX but there are people who DO need pain medifation to function.
@@andieallison6792 I never intended to perpetuate opioid hysteria (just the opposite), and I know the situation is really nuanced. I was just trying to explain a side of the situation that often gets overlooked in the discourse, though I maybe did it poorly. I'm from Kentucky, one of the states most affected by the opioid epidemic, so I (and many people I know) have lost family/friends to the addiction. That being said, my knowledge still isn't the best, but I try to understand it as well as I can. A lot of the misinformation is victim-blaming, so all I was trying to argue was one of the ways that the problem is far more the fault of a medical system designed to fail the most vulnerable communities than anything else. I'm sorry if my post seemed insensitive or inaccurate, because that isn't what I wanted at all.
The thing is, Roseanne's character changing makes perfect sense. Her changes are exactly what we are seeing, particularly in older people, here in the upper lower class world. We all have that older friend who used to be tolerant, even if they were behind the times, who have been radicalized into Trump followers. The racism was improving, but now they're embracing it because of all the fear mongering. They blame their economic woes on those different from them.
What was surreal about it all is that these same people were embracing _Roseanne_ . So they were getting the message they needed to hear and enjoying it.
I still sometimes wonder if enduring Roseanne Barr's obvious, conspiracy theory enabled racism would have been worth it to be able to bridge the gap. We had this very liberal show that conservatives were embracing as their own.
Instead, they now have Last Man Standing, starring another older person who got more conservative. But his show decided to switch to arguing that his crap was right, reinforcing the male machismo that the previous show rejected. So the divide just gets deeper.
+
+
I was about to comment this same thing, with the addition: we see this change in older people (especially post 9/11), but it's important to note that the change didn't happen out of nowhere, an awful lot of the fear-mongering can be traced back to Fox News, a pure propaganda channel whose viewership is primarily older people of roughly Roseanne's age---and that's something that would have been interesting to see the show tackle
Very true.
There's also a pattern that I've noticed among older centrists. Their attitudes were considered progressive back when they were younger, but as time moved on and culture continued to change, those same attitudes are now thought of as behind the times and even problematic, and there's a resentment to being called out on it by younger, more engaged people on the left. And a combination of nostalgia and antipathy towards the far left can lead people towards feeling sympathetic for the right, even while they still see themselves as fundamentally progressive.
I don't like the glee that is taken in Roseanne's ousting. Toxic? Sure. DEAL WITH IT, though. This would be an opportunity to set things right.
Life and society (to me) used to be about forgiveness and trying to understand. Now it's about leaving people crippled in a ditch if they displease you.
Diversity never seems to include diversity of thought, however awful someone's views might be.
It feels to me like throwing the baby out with the bathwater. It looks to many like this is the definition of cultural appropriation, too.
What was once Roseanne's is now no longer and rebranded to suit the new masters.
Its a shame David wasn't utilized more in the theme of breaking the gender norms in Roseanne, time after time of seasons 1-8 he was most always the punchline for his innate femininity through kindness and a passion for art, and it felt like his status as a pushover was him reflecting those biases back onto himself from a life of being underestimated and underappreciated. Oftentimes toxic masculinity devalues men who aren't "strong enough", and whereas progressive movements often support women not strong enough to support themselves due to low self confidence or relationships wherein they are not given the power the deserve, men like David do not have that support out of conservative chastisement for not being the "provider", our culture can't give the same treatment to men as it is still rooted in its harsh uphold of gender norms. David ran away from his responsibilities because he was lied to about what they entailed - it wasn't about being "man" enough, it was about being there for your family, but in a large way, he was being rooted against from the very offset of the original run.
I do agree with you about how they dogged David's character in the original but in regards to his relationship to Darlene his softness was always part of his appeal for her. Instead it seems like David just kinda bailed when things got too hard, which is also what he did in the original series as well. Even when he comes back its not about the fact he couldn't be the breadwinner it's just that he isn't around generally. I mean considering the fact he bailed for nearly a decade he gets off really easily with both his kids and Darlene.
@@FreyaEinde He definitely gets off easy, there's no excuse for him to abandon his family, that being said I don't think it was because he generally disliked Darlene or the kids, he just had a big confidence problem with being a dad. It isn't like he's lazy, he goes to help the poor when he leaves, as some sort of rectifying act for himself. His aimless fling with Blue felt, again, him trying to patch up his own insecurities. They __are__ just playing off the "hapless loser" archetype, but that very archetype seems to be tied to the long running underestimation and emasculative teasing of his character, be that by the writers or the Conner family; and either way, rooted in what is a dated stereotype of toxic masculinity. Perhaps not unwarranted in some parts of his actions, but still a gender bias over what his role is "supposed" to be. It certainly isn't like they don't touch this idea with Dan.
@@WildSableye See I wish the show had more time to go into that storyline, because even though they're always making the joke that David is just this passive pushover, you can definitely see in places where he uses that characterization to get away with crazy shit. Like it's low key emotionally manipulative. Case in point when he just up and dumped Blue and tries it on with Darlene again. It makes him a lot more believable though and a good character, because he's essentially on paper a good person but he's emotionally dishonest and inconsistent and that's hurtful in a very believable way. I think they kinda pointed out in the episode where they decide to divorce really well.
This may sound crazy but as a gay man I loved that Mark's character wasn't portrayed as sexually confused, but just as a child who liked to wear what he wanted to wear, and it so happens that it doesn't fit the gender norms of society. In a way it's a beautiful side glance to society and their views on gender and the "ideals" that comes with said gender, including clothing. In other words, he isn't wearing a skirt because he's gay or trans, he's wearing it because he thinks he looks great in it. That to me is what society should want to be and encouraged and not make everything about sexuality.
The whole Roseanne-bigoted-toward-her-neighbor thing always reminds me of the episode of King of the Hill when Khan's family moves in next door and Peggy accuses Hank of racism. His response of, "I don't hate him cuz I'm racist. I hate him cuz he's a bad neighbor," always struck me as an apt-yet funny-response. Khan is a "bad neighbor" to Hank largely because of a vast cultural divide that Hank is unable (more than he is unwilling) to cross. It's not overt, explicit racism (unlike Cotton, who's the perfect foil for Hank in that episode), but it's still a hurdle that Hank never really overcomes. Anyway, King of the Hill was great!
But khan wasn't a great neighbor he had a superiority complex, wasn't very nice etc. One of the reasons they moved to Texas was because he had problems with his previous neighbors too
Let alone Cotton was the only person to recognize him as Laotian.
Despite the salt of the Earth persona, Hank was always a complex character, but really, so was Khan. Judge could have made the characters of King of the Hill two-dimensional but instead chose to give them depth (the opposite of what he did with the stereotypical characters in The Goode Family, which is a big reason why that series was uninteresting). And even with all of the disagreements and awkward moments, the series made it pretty clear by the end that Hank and Khan were friends. Peggy and Minh, though...well, that's probably a different story. *lol*
@@paulrainey4990 I mean I can’t blame them, could you be friends with Peggy Hill?
And now KOTH is coming back💯
It’s so odd that people will turn off with “PC / SJW culture” on tv - yet all of everything revolves around politics or messages forever
The repeated "how dare you ruin 'x' by bringing politics into it?!" shit is so disingenuous. 'Not talking about politics' just means supporting the status quo. Which, surprise, surprise, is a (right wing) political position.
@lunaticgenius New word for me, quotidian: of or occurring every day; daily.
Always has, always will. Also Ms Barr had destroyed her career & show not once but twice.
It's such a privileged person take. I'm Black, and a non-binary woman, my life has always revolved around my identity and my politics. I can't imagine otherwise
@@pinkmazohyst well the world doesn't revolve around it, your delusions and dumbassery
Matthew Broderick cosplaying as Cartesian Dualism is the best thing I've seen so far this year. Thank you sir.
he's a murderer you know.
@@dextrodemon
the amount of actors who've joked about getting out of a ticket by writing an autograph, is disturbing
Half of him looked exactly like Beau Bridges.
Torc Handsomeson and also lied about it
My favorite cosplay he did is the one where he cosplayed as a wanted man in Ireland
Whatever you might think of Rossane Barr, I'm disappointed that you glossed over the fact that she fought tooth and nail to keep the show running without her to keep all those people working on it employed.
+
Good point but if we're being realistic she wanted the show to fail it must kill her that it suucedded not dissing most would naturally feel that.unfortunatley she has lost it mentally I unfortunately see a very sad out come for her if her or her family doesn't get her help
That someone is good to the people they like doesn't mean they're not a bigot.
That's true. Roseanne Barr is a very flawed and unpleasant person, but I don't think that she's evil. I do see some good in her.
Considering how bigoted my family is, I've had to learn to see the good in them too, or else I would go crazy.
Citation needed. Besides, not letting her fuck up hurt dozens to hundreds of workers is the least she could do (if she did even do that). I won't give her a metal.
The ecstatic laughter after some of these lines is actually disturbing.
I agree
Because it was too real especially in in the present...I personally liked the 10th season.
People changing in 20 years isn't unbelievable. At least it retcons the horrible last season finale.
And Roseanne can't torture the writers anymore.
The writers are the ones who tortured Roseanne. Idiot.
@@Ran-33 kek
@@Ran-33 LMAO, you keep telling yourself that,
Your first Roseanne vid is what I subbed to you for, you only had like 6k then, I'm glad to see that more than doubled in only a week or so, you deserve it.
Same.
also same
He's using Roseanne's name like any libtard does.
Ran S it’s working, you’re here!
@@Adanmacreates I didn't watch it.
I've never watched a single episode of Roseanne but that scene at 15 08 made me tear up. And it made me all the sadder that the season 10 remake didn't actually bother with her apologizing or talking about how she was abused herself when she falls into that same cycle with her granddaughter.
Honestly this is the perfect pace for a deep dive like this, so often these things are full of fluff or so deliberately paced that it becomes background noise one way or another. This feels pretty well edited on the script level without being too fast for the thoughtful implications to sink in.
Great job!
the worst part for me was the complete discarding of the cycle of violence issues that held a lot of impact in the earlier seasons, like, completely forgotten. Roseanne now thought that spanking was an ok thing to do to your family when back then, it cause a deep internal look into the negative influences that abusive and controlling family burn into us and causes us to act in ways we severely regret, then Roseanne *apologies* because it *was wrong* of her to hit her child. It was actually introspective, actually talking about how violence sticks inside you and manifests in ways you never thought you could act and hurt your family in the same way you were hurt. All that was just thrown away, I feel hurt by it if I'm honest. I was deeply disappointed.
As someone who watched the original Roseanne as a teen, the reboot brought lots of feels. I'm really relieved that they kept the Connors, because it would have been a shame to end a good show just because Roseanne herself has gone totally loony toons.
I don't get it, she was nothing like that in the 90s.
It's called a paradigm shift. A lot of so-called "leftists" back in the 90s have gone straight on conservative now for reasons that aren't exactly clear. It could be due to age, it could be due to economic crisis, or it could be the very real fact that these people were about as "left" as they were a person of color. The reality is, the Conners were never exactly so leftist that they were alienating to a conservative audience and it reflects a lot of the pseudo leftist ideologies a lot of conservatives held back in the 90s.
One thing you have to remember is that, though Roseanne herself helped instill a working class vibe into the original series, with a lot of help, and probably drew on some real life experiences to do so, she wasn't.
Roseanne Barr has never been a major world class superstar, but she was already a touring comedian and became a television star afterwards. For the past 40 years, while mirroring the growth into a conservative boomer that the show would showcase and its revival, she's also been living the life of a much wealthier person, with the problems of fame, celebrity, and at least some excess.
Combined with her somewhat radical political leanings and the radicalization of politics and general, as well as her authoritarian and very commanding nature even back in the '90s, it's easy to see the path she took to get where she is now.
@@NoirRaven Yeah, it's pretty depressing that they abandoned the left after the fight to get them their rights. And then they vote for the side that's going to re-subjugate them the moment there's a chance. But, conservatives attract people that see belief as fact, so it attracts people that don't know their history.
I mean one thing that might have changed Roseanne's perspective (and Barr's) around racism, is y'know, 9/11. It's weird to think of now, but between the end of the old run and the beginning of the new run, the events of the early 2000's became the past, nearly 20 years of past. Back in 96 she might have said "Who cares?" about Muslims moving in, or even "Which one's a Muslim again?" but for TWO DECADES, the background noise on that particular group of people hasn't been the most positive. Stuff like that sinks in when we aren't paying attention. A lot of people who thought they were progressive got scared back then, fear makes people stupid, and even when the fear went away, the feelings brought up by it can stick around forever if not dealt with, living on under the surface, and showing up in strange places. A better written show might have addressed that. (I'd have preferred Roseanne heard the teller say something racist, and get irritated at how rude she's being, and then one of her family scoff when she said something about it, and her not realize at first that teller sounds just like her, with maybe the family member thinking it was Roseanne herself who said it. Then, Roseanne realizing what a bigot she'd been, try and do something nice. The Conners were always teaching each other, not in a patronizing way, but in a real way, like family does. Calling each other out on their bullshit.)
It's interesting to me how this large time gap shook people. Like seeing a old friend after many years there was a sense of betrayal in the way these characters changed, getting older, becoming more entrenched in their views, or picking up new ones that seem out of character. But we don't know what 2001, or 2008, or 2010, or 2012, or 2015 were like for this family. 20 years is a span of time long enough for a lot of change, a lot of damage, and pain. Of course there's room for good things too, but a lot of the time its the losses that cause us to change course. There are adult people who were born after the show ended, and grew up before it came back. Many people watching these videos are too young to have been alive when the show started, I don't think it's all that strange to think these characters changed in ways even they wouldn't understand. Time does that. I was a kid when this show first aired, and though I grew up in another country, it reflected aspects of my life, right down to the dysfunctional family, and a mother with a history of abuse, who could be rough around the edges. These people resonated with me, and I wonder at the things we didn't see, the many things that caused these little changes. In my family, since that time there have been hundreds of changes, big and small, and they've meant the people I grew up with, including myself, have changed drastically. I wish we had a chance to explore that in these characters, the things that happened that they don't even think about, because they're 15 years in the past. The things that they don't even realize changed their lives.
Probably the most interesting rant that I've read in this comment section. The thought of what caused Barr herself to change throughout the years is interesting to ponder, cuz evidently something in the intervening years must have had an effect on her. Unfortunately, I don't think that level of self-criticism and reflection is something her and others alike would care to delve into, but it would make for an interesting study.
@@davistoa I mean to me, from a writing perspective, it would be one of the more important things to delve into with the characters (and a really good source of plots for individual episodes, or short arcs). THe old show was constantly bringing up things from the 70's and 60's, pieces of the past that would make the family reflect on how time changes people. Those years in the early 2000's transformed the world in a whole host of ways we're still feeling the effects of. But I don't know what Barr's agenda was in making the show.
As for the woman herself, yeah, it feels like something flipped for her, though she was always course and kind of impulsive, she seemed to be generally benign. Agreed she doesn't strike me as a person too given to self reflection, and there are many others who have undergone similar transformations (while maintaining that they haven't changed at all) who likewise seem disinclined to explore what's behind their current viewpoints.
lol It is of course possible I've given too much thought and credit to the writing and writers of a sitcom.
WOW. Your videos are amazing and well-put. :)
Roseanne was a show that was BIG in my house. My own mother tried to emulate the character, despite being closer to the last season/real life one. Yikers.
But this summation and description of The Conners has piqued my interest from a point of not knowing the show existed.. To genuinely wanting to watch it and see if it retains the sense of emotional support and family that the original show gave me. Only now it's not an escape, it's just a fond reflection. Thank you for your retrospectives, friend!
This channel manages to give really well presented overviews of this show. Covering not just the more interesting plot points and character moments but also putting them into a broader context of things happening behind the scenes as well as the political climate. It's not often I can watch a 47 minute UA-cam video and be completely engrossed to the point where it's over and it only felt like it had been ten minutes ago that I began watching it.
The way you edit and narrate all these reviews of all these shows and all the heart wrenching scenes, I always tear up a little. Especially the abuse section. I never had to deal with it, but it's a very moving scene because so many of my loved ones have dealt with it and seeing them grapple with coping with it and rising above it, hit some heart strings.
Being Scottish it feels so odd they put Mark(? The grandkid who loves the colourful clothes) in a kilt because... well it’s a kilt
Is it a kilt or a skort? (A skirt/short combination they sell for school uniforms)
Yeah, I see how that would look that way. In America, that is more like a girl's school uniform. That's what I saw when they showed it. The kind girls would wear to private/religious schools in particular.
It wasn’t a kilt, but a plaid skirt.
Iain 97 It’s just a plaid skirt. I had to wear them every day when I attended a private school as a child. They’re traditional uniforms for catholic school girls, which I was eons ago.
@@poordropo1 typical american ignorance. it was a kilt for hundreds of years before america even existed. you arent the centre of the universe. get some perspective.
ive never even seen roseanne and i sat through 2 hours worth of discourse about roseanne. great work!
Same here
THIS is exactly the commentary on the show I was looking for that I never found in any blog. Thank you.
Blog? It’s not 2006 anymore.
@@thefonzkiss 2006 was when I was looking for this kind of commentary on the show.
Roseanne Conner's political opinions were always based on Roseanne Barr's. If the real person can change in 20 years, so can the character.
+
I think you bring up a great point. I know a lot of people get age, who have basically flipped their political views, from when they were younger. It happens often, and can be addressed... I just don't feel like Bare herself, addressed it properly.
Absolutely, but Roseanne Barr is under no obligation to explain to me why she changed her politics. The writers of the show DO have a responsibility to make me understand why the character of Roseanne acts and thinks so differently then she did previously.
I refer to my other post for why they don't really need to say anything. She's exactly the right demographic for these changes in political thought.
She's older, working class, anti-PC, with old-fashioned views. She bought the message of the Republican party that the liberals are the reasons for all her ills, and that going back to the old ways is better. If anything, it's surprising she's held onto any of her old, more liberal views.
Sure, I'll agree that it doesn't make rational sense. It's not like conservatives have offered any actual solutions. But it's a change that has happened in our culture, and it would be strange if it had not happened to Roseanne Conner.
Barr's change is actually more atypical, and requires a deep dive into the reasons that a certain 4chan conspiracy theory was able to catch on.
@@ZipplyZane It's not that the change is so big as to not be believable, it's that a change that big needs to be shown or at least acknowledged, and based on the video and the comments I've read, the show didn't do that.
Watching these videos reminds me of watching Roseanne reruns before bed in the early 00's with my grandparents. I might have to go back and watch it now. Thanks.
These 2 videos were seriously incredible. Normally I'll just play a video like this in the background while working, but I found myself dropping whatever I was doing and just giving these my full attention. Looking forward to whatever you discuss next.
What a lovely unexpected treat on this otherwise miserable Friday night
Larry Sanders grieving after endgame?
This was two years ago but today is Friday and it’s also miserable
That scene where she was apologizing to DJ for hitting him... *not crying not crying*
Glad to see im not the only one
i cried no shame
@@russianbot8576 I did too. I WISH though, that Roseanne ended up grounding D.J. for stealing the car. She was absolutely correct in the beginning. D.J. could have been badly injured or even killed, he could have killed someone else. He could have caused major damage that the family would have been responsible for. There could have been lots of repercussions, and yet the show dropped this when Roseanne smacked D.J. He was also very belligerent and not sorry he took the car at all. Yes, Roseanne was traumatized by her past. It was heartbreaking. But they still should have had her ground D.J. for his behavior.
You should talk about Shameless next. I feel like that show shoots for the same class commentary as Roseanne, but is much smarter about it. That's just my opinion though, I'd love to hear your thoughts
Shameless US vs UK and how each relates to the conditions of the poor in each of those countries would be great, I think.
Roseanne is about the *working* poor. Shameless is about the poor
@@justinokraski3796 that's really interesting. Even though that's not technically true, as there are times in Roseanne where the Conners don't have jobs and there are times in Shameless where multiple Gallaghers have jobs at the same time, it does say a lot about our public perceptions of what the "poor" and "working poor" are, and what the differences are.
Yes!
@@1BlessEdYou ,that would be awesome!
I subscribed after watching your videos about Sabrina and the Golden Girls. I started watching your playlist yesterday starting with Roseanne. The way it transitions seamlessly into Part 2 is perfection. I recommend everyone watch these videos this way. You do an excellent job mixing in fact with critique. I am looking forward to viewing the rest of the playlist. Cheers!
Id love to see something like this about the show "Shameless"
The British or American one?
YES
I’d love for you to do an update on the series now. And can I just say, WOW! Talk about a beautiful, well educated, and sharp mind you have! I have to RAVE about your analysis of this show. Everything from the editing, to your script is so well thought out and poignant yet keeps the viewer entertained and engaged. Good for you man! I look forward to watching more of your videos! 😊😊😊😊🎉😊😊
This video is done so well it should be a course in social studies.
Are you his mother? Exaggerating.
@@Ran-33 Still commenting when you haven't watched the video? :\
@@raynafae I watched the first one only and why watch a leftist point of view. Someone ignorant who thinks her tweet was racist. His voice is annoying to me too.
@@Ran-33 Why watch?... Maybe to have a better idea of how to counter their point of view? Commenting without having watched it makes you look a little silly, is all. But hey whatever I often feel pretty similar with people on the right that I find abrasive, so I understand what you mean. Bias is human.
Still, Roseanne is on the QAnon/Soros shit which is just cringe, imo.
@@raynafae The whole media and the left is on the Russian collusion conspiracy theory but they're allowed to live in an alternative reality I guess. I predicted that his season 10 video will be anti Roseanne.
I loved the original (I also happen to be working class from Illinois and roughly DJ's age. The original show just felt so much like how I remember growing up. The Mother's Day BBQ episode from season 2 especially reminds me SO much of practically every BBQ I went to as a kid.) And I tried to give the new one a chance, hoping that Roseanne's personal craziness wouldn't bleed too much into it. But the moment I saw the spanking stuff come up, I knew they had lost the original character and this wasn't the same show. I gave up on it after that and celebrated when she got canned.
I did watch the first episode of season 11 and thought it was good (better than 10 anyway), but I just couldn't go back to watch anymore. It's better to keep the first 9 (or even better the first 8) seasons, and forget the attempts at revival.
But I do love the analysis!
And what about how emotionally abusive she was to Jackie, who had always been her best friend and a kind of secondary life partner in addition to Dan?
@@moonlily1 I didn't like that either. Though Roseanne being nasty to Jackie was present in the original series too. Jackie was always the one presented as the wacky mess of a sister who Roseanne was completely controlling of. There was a harder edge to that in season 10 though. But there was a harder edge to all of season 10 that just made the whole thing seem much sadder than the struggles they all faced in the first 8 seasons
@@koryschulein7778 It's pretty gross to frame Jackie as being pathetic because she's single, especially after having it been established, after Jackie tried marriage, that she's actually happier single. And I never saw her as a 'mess'- as a single woman, she was free to experiment with different careers, chase dreams and change paths when she wanted to. As a working class mother, experimenting wasn't an option for Roseanne; she didn't have dreams, she just had jobs and did what she had to do.
@@moonlily1 I certainly see the point of what you're saying. And I could have framed what I was saying better than to just blanket call Jackie "a mess." What I really was wanting to say was that Roseanne treated Jackie as a mess that she had to constantly look out for. And the show brought up the way Roseanne controlled Jackie on many many occasions. The season 4 episode "Therapy" kind of encapsulates all of it, though nothing is really resolved in the episode.
And later episodes definitely played up Jackie's "wackiness" for laughs. In the two classic TV send-ups Jackie was cast in the roll of the "wacky neighbor" in the Leave It To Beaver parody and was put in the role of Gilligan in the Gilligan's Island sequence.Those sorts or portrayals in the later seasons didn't help how her character was presented.
@@koryschulein7778 Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you see her that way. I agree that the narrative treats her as "a mess" and that's a shame. In truth, I like Jackie better than Roseanne as a character. She has more dimension. And she actually seems to be a really good life coach.
Oh man, not that I didn't sit and watch your first part of this series from start to finish and enjoy every minute of it, but this is what I was hoping the last video was going to touch more on, so thank you so much. Thoroughly entertaining and endlessly insightful. I especially appreciate you bringing up the 'spanking' parallel. I saw that last year and it made me mad. If there was ever a glaring indication 'Roseanne' was no longer "Roseanne", that was it. To answer your question, I think we can have 'Roseanne' _because_ of the absence of Roseanne. "Season 10 was an affront to the brilliant original run, it was clear either the writers didn't know what they were doing, or they let Barr have way too much input, but no amount of superficial nostalgia (like the cameo of Darlene's teacher in the pilot, or Roseanne's post-lottery win jacket from season 9) was going to save it. 'The Conners' to me was like a retry without a mentally unstable, noisy weight, where the cast and crew were able to do the original some justice and deliver to the super fans of the original (like me)
"Obsessed with it... A little bit" - Me with any project that suddenly consumes my life for a couple of weeks
I love and appreciate your intelligent queer-centric honest analytical reviews, I highly enjoyed both these Roseanne videos. Your voice is like a Time Travellers perspective, and your dissertation of this cult classic television phenomenon fulfilled what the public has wondered and desired as a retrospect. I look forward to more reviews and commentary from you, and am thankful to hear a well reasoned dissertation on media so familiar yet filled with concepts somewhat foreign somehow while remaining well balanced with its cadence.
i'm very uncomfortable with the way the audience cheered at Roseanne practically waterboarding her granddaughter, especially coupled with the scenes from the original series...
I love the Roseanne show, at least the first nine seasons, & I love The Conners!! So thank you very much for these videos!
Where can I watch the reboot with Roseanne? I'm only finding "The Conners"
The Connors and Rosanne are two of my favorite shows. Thank you so much for these two videos.
After watching your recap of the first eight seasons, I feel committed to my initial thoughts about S10: it was a _major_ slap in the face of S01-S08 (S09 never happened! LALALALALA!! NOT LISTENING!!!)
There were so many elements of S10 that just felt tone-deaf in ways that the previous run simply wasn't, even though it was very much a product of 1988-1997, and watching her _physically assault her own granddaughter_ - that is not the same character who had an emotional breakdown when she slapped DJ after he stole a car in S06.
Turning Jackie from a capable and fairly intelligent, albeit neurotic single woman with some low-key bipolar traits, into a dim-witted Rightwing caricature of the Moderate Left was insulting.
Seeing Becky fall into a depression hole is given some logic, I suppose - I forget the in-story explanation of Mark's death (or the approximate time, relative to S10, when it happened), but Becky is about 45 in S10, and even that's awfully young to be a widow (well, in this day and age - hell, for the last few generations, TBQH). Still, it feels a bit weird to see her obsess on having a baby, and a bit disconnected from the way Becky was written during S01-S09. She's been a fighter and a survivor, all her life, so seeing her clearly turn into someone with high-functioning clinical depression, while given a logic that makes sense, is jarring enough, but again, putting her on Mission Baby feels a bit phoned-in from the writers room.
S10 was generally written to pander to her newfound Right Wing fans who forgot (or were willing to ignore) the show's original run and her various stunts, like that San Diego baseball game. While I'd generally written off Roseanne Barr as high-key garbage, back when her fool-headed opinions about trans people surfaced, I still tuned in, in part for the nostalgia value, in part cos I love the other cast members _so much_ (John Goodman and Laurie Metcalf are criminally underrated, and I wrote several fan letters to Sarah Gilbert, back in fourth and fifth grade; Gilbert is only a couple of years older than me, and her character may have been an influence on myself going goth).
I also definitely felt the episode with the Muslim neighbours was totally ham-fisted, and 100% agree with the anonymous S10 Writer: it's totally out-of-character for Roseanne Conner of S01-S09, but more in-line with the real-life Roseanne Barr.
I agree with your final lines... I was never a huge fan of either show... but I'm oddly obsessed with them too... for all the reasons you listed. Thank you so much for all the time and effort put into these. They were phenomenal
17:19 It’s really difficult for some of us to see how much our parents have changed… since 2016. You’re left wondering how much of them was always like that, and how much of the parent you loved is still in there.
Great videos. My wife and I both grew up watching the original series and restarted it when the new show was announced. We brought up a lot of the same points you did your videos. Glad to see someone took the time to make a 2 part video essay and really put in the work to make it great. Fantastic work. You earned yourself a subscriber.
I have been waiting for this second parter which happened to coincide with my my most anticipated second parter
I’m sure I speak for many that we aren’t fans either but stumbled across the first video,watched it and were captivated by it thanks to you.
And now we are watching this 😄
Fascinating stuff - I think Roseanne’s comeback really accurately reflected the change in people in that area of the country & class.
That’s why I fled there - it’s a sacrifice-zone, and I’m afraid to check-in there after another 20-years passes.
You left out the fact David and Darla's son was interested in dating boys in season 2.
That’s horrible
Lol@@stephaniebach__12-24
Your reaction to Matthew Broderick's character's "And I could let you" was priceless! "Hurgh ..."
27:58 “determined how their worth is measured over if they can squeeze out a baby.”
That’s just wrong. Becky was upset because she may not have wanted children but the idea of it being now closed forever to her was very upsetting. I just don’t understand why you wouldn’t ask a few of your female friends their take on this. You’re trying to be so woke but what you wound up speaking for women and painting them all with the same brush.
Pro-choice is just that. A woman can choose to not have children and a woman can choose to have children. Both are completely valid and reasonable options.
Great piece! I really enjoyed this video. Roseanne was all about class consciousness, but elites don't want that idea catching on so they stripped it from the show.
It breaks my heart how old Dan looks
If it'll make you feel better, you should see how Roseanne looks on her UA-cam channel. Shes unrecognizable
Was wondering if another part would come out, nice upload!
I watched as a kid for a few seasons but gave up around season 3, I checked out a few episodes of both new shows but didn't love that either but I always thought Roseanne was an interesting idea even if it was executed in an appealing manner. This is why I enjoyed both your retrospectives. They summed up the themes and really the experience of the show without making me have to sit through any more episodes. Great work and thanks.
Damn, Roseanne‘s acting in the old run of the series was powerful. The first (and almost last) I heard about her was a news story about one of her controversies but I‘m glad to get a new perspective now.
Hopefully I‘ll catch seasons 1-9 on some streaming service some day.
This was one of my favorite shows growing up. I really like and appreciate your videos about it!
Great job on the videos! I hope The Conners can go on and be great like Roseanne too. It isn't even close yet. But I believe the show can go on without her.
Tbh I hope The Conners (show) does end up like Roseanne... the character.
I don’t have time to completely collect my thoughts on this, so I’ll just say that I really appreciate this video which has subsequently made me appreciate those 80’s to 90’s sitcoms. Thanks for that
I think that her change reflects the change of many people in the past 20 years. As a person of the 90's no one cared; now everyone is divided and the Roseanne reboot was successfully showing that. Just like we all have
Great videos on this sitcom, I never even liked it but I saw the show often during its many years of running. I never watched it since the 90's and your vids are the first / only time I've seen anything about the show. Indicating your high quality commentary, I appreciate u
I wasn't even that bothered about the original Roseanne, although I did watch it sometimes, but these are fascinating, thanks!
Roseanne was a huge part of my childhood because it was the first time I saw a family on TV that was disfunctional and always holding on with grit and sarcasm. Roseanne reminded me of my mom I. The essential ways. She was snappy, tough, and real. No matter the politics, the show on it's own gave me a realist look at life and how to survive I. This world. I was always a big fan of the episodes where everyone just hung out, like the tornado days episode or all the Halloween episodes. When the revival and spin off happened I valued the constancy of having the show in my life more than I did the messages it was sharing or the stories it was telling. The presence of this realistic family being on television has made me hopeful about the survival or the working class family in this country. We swear and we fight. We aren't all the same racially. I am from a mixed household. The realness of the people makes the shown shine for me even in the face of glaring political missteps and social unrest. If the Conner family survives it all, then it tells people like me living paycheck to paycheck that we have it I. Us to keep going when things don't begin to look like they will change.
A little disappointed you never touched my favorite episode of the series (the funeral of Roseanne’s father), but I understand that had nothing to do with your reading of the series. Nice work!
This & your part 1 were fascinating, well done. I lived without most of Roseanne & will live entirely without the Connors, but you've a great knack for sustaining deep dive, nuanced interest. Thank you. TgT
38:11
*OWNED! TAKE THAT LIBERALS!*
But seriously, I love the fact that you saved me a lot of time and bullshit by talking about this series. I loved Rosanne as a kid, but I didn't watch it all the time. When it was rebooted, I didn't watch it, because I knew of the person Rosanne turned out to be outside of that character. Plus, you know, Trump. (Aaaand those conspiracy theories you mentioned her popping off about) Soooooo, yeah. Thanks @José 😁
People who weren't there, can't get how groundbreaking and edgy Rosanna really was. Same thing about alot of shows and comedians we take for granted today. Bill Hicks is a notable Male counterpart to Roseanne.
It was shocking to see what happened to the recent season. How it happened. And how much modern liberals had changed in terms of the 80s and 90s liberals.
Which I was one.
Staying as moderate and progressive as possible now,but leaning to liberal, it's been a trip.
Good video!
41:31 I think it's safe to say that we've all wanted to do that to Matthew Broderick at some point in our lives.
No, you wanted to do that to Ferris Bueller. 😉
@@walruswasrob Nah.... Matthew Broderick.
I just want to say, I love your videos. I never enjoyed Rosanne or shows like it… and I almost didn’t watch these two covering Rosanne, but I’m so glad I did.
Ive watched four of your videos this week and have finally subscribed because your thoughtful review of something I’ve always detested gave me enough of a kick to adjust my views. Rosanne still sucks… and I’m probably not going to watch The Connors either… but I have a better perspective and I can see the value in both shows.
Thank you!
That spanking episode was fucked up. Corporal punishment does no good because all it teaches the kid is 'do what I say (even if you think it's wrong) or I'll hurt you.' A kid's mind records emotion more than anything else, so instead of remembering what started the whole altercation, what they'll probably remember is that someone they loved and trusted decided to make them feel pain to control them.
Just because your parents hit you when you were young doesn't justify you hitting your own kids now!
Thank you for making both of these videos. I never watched the show, but you have instilled a fondness for it in me. You were also shockingly fair in your treatment of Roseanne Bar and I appreciate you did go super far one way or the other
40:45 José's voice over syncs really well with the actress on screen speaking for a second and it freaked me out
Third time watching this. Your walk throughs of television of yesteryear are masterclasses in synopsis, investigation, and entertainment.