Happy to help! If you haven't already found it, this blog post series goes into more detail about why we built our system the way we did, including why we chose particular components like the inverter: www.adventurousway.com/blog/rv-electrical-upgrade-part-1-introduction-goals
Adventurous Way just spent my sixth night at an epic overlook in Utah's San Rafael Swell. This morning we (I am with one other Xscaper) are relocating to north of Moab to connect with Dan and others north of Moab for four more nights.
VERY WELL DONE ! Nice, clean installation. Over engineered the way I like it. EMS was added after the first use of our TT. 5+ years ago I was getting paralysis by analysis. So I jumped in with a very simple & basic system. 100W panel & a PMW + 2-6V golf cart batteries. After 1 year I added another 100W panel + a very small inverter + a 2000w inverter / generator. We seldom use the gen but its a nice backup and occasional use. Sun doesn't always shine here in the PNW. We're not full-timers but out every month year round. Boondock ~70%. We are all in at ~ $850. My next project is a DC/DC but will replace my alternator first. Something much larger to cope with the load. Amp rating is fine; but OEM's are not built to run for long periods (heat). It all works for us so far. Just like RV's, no one size fits all. Love your system.
I couldn't agree more, and it sounds like your approach was very similar to ours - start small with a plan to upgrade where necessary depending on what you learn along the way. And yes, you definitely want to make sure your alternator can handle the load. If you are considering upgrading your alternator, you might want to check out this blog post about an upgrade I helped some friends do where we added 2x 50A DC-to-DC chargers to their Airstream: www.adventurousway.com/blog/airstream-electrical-upgrade
@@AdventurousWay WOW thats a lot of amps ! I'm looking at a 370 amp Mechman Alternator. They are not cheap ($600) but built to last under heavy loads. I'm only going to run a 20 amp DC -DC. I'll await your installation of a mini nuclear reactor & cooling tower next.
Thanks for the DETAILED walk through. Answered a lot of questions I had not only about your install, which I've been following since the very first blog post, as well as how Outdoors RV routes things. I'm in the process of doing a scaled down version, using some of the same pieces you did (thank you), with the added need for low temperature non-fulltime use. This 40 minutes told me virtually everything I needed to know about where exactly you routed fresh wire and where you reused the existing. Again, thank you for the insight.
Hey Just watched the 27 upgrades great Video. Now watching this one. Great job on all ideas 💡. You also did a great job on the 3 part video of your camper tour with Outdoors RV. And I just found your Channel yesterday lol Have a great day
Thank you! If you're interested in learning more you might like the video presentation I did about electrical upgrades a little over a year ago: ua-cam.com/video/ZU9zo5BseFo/v-deo.html
Wow, I had no idea of all of the upgrades you did on your trailer when I visited with you in Colorado 2019. The explanation you provided is very helpful with what the components are, how they are connected, and your reasons for the design. We are in the middle of our next upgrade for the power system on our class A. This video has generated ideas for a couple of future upgrades. We are taking the upgrade incrementally. The first step was adding a Victron BMV-712 a couple of years ago so we could know what was happening with our four 6V GC2 flooded lead acid batteries. The second step is upgrading the remote for our Magnum 2000W Inverter/Charger to permit custom charging profiles to support LifePO4 batteries. The final phase of the upgrades for this round of changes will be to replace the Battery Isolation Manager to one that supports LifePO4 batteries and then replace the current GC2 batteries with four Battle Born heated GC2 (BBGC2H). We decided to go with the heated version since we are focused on doing a drop in solution at this time and the current batteries are under the entry way and vented. We wanted heated batteries to minimize the concern if we are in the cold. This approach of minimal changes will result in about $450 of upgrades (Magnum Remote & BIM), $100 in cables, and then the batteries. The benefits of the upgrade will be doubling the usable capacity of the battery bank, reducing weight by about 120lbs, and reduce charging time of the batteries. We will not change any of the rest of the system. We will evaluate the performance of the four batteries over several months. Next year we will add solar to our configuration, add additional batteries (relocated the batteries into a bay from under the steps), upgrade the inverter to have more capacity, change the wiring on the RV to take batter advantage of the increase in battery capacity & inverter. We will likely have at least one Air Conditioner unit with a soft start connected to the inverter at this point. The Smart RV video sounds interesting, I will need to watch that soon.
That's definitely the way to go - do gradual upgrades and evaluate along the way! That way you will learn over time what are your needs and the required capacity. Totally makes sense to have the heated batteries for your use case.
Nice walkthrough on a very nice solar inverter setup. That green stuff on your 40amp anderson connector is not dirt and grime but copper oxide from the copper in the connector. I'm not sure but I don't think you will be able to "self clean" that and it could be degrading your vehicle charging not to mention it could get hot when charging. I would clean it. You really did a good job on designing this system! You also seem to know its function inside and out. I like how you considered the trade off on your needs and system capability. Also a good job of explaining it. So many of the videos I've seen are of the "power it all" variety with 1700 watts of solar and 900 AH of Lithuim batteries. While impressive these can be in excess of $20,000 and prohibitively expensive for most people. My system will be more down to earth.
Thanks Joseph - glad you found the video useful. And I agree, it's comparatively easy to design a big system with no constraints, but when you start to really consider the tradeoffs it becomes much more complicated. As for the green substance on the Anderson connector, I think it's actually Copper (II) Chloride rather than Copper Oxide. Vermont uses a lot of salt (Sodium Chloride) on the roads, and this really takes a toll on any exposed metal on vehicles. The Anderson SB connectors use tinned copper connectors with integral springs that gives them the ability to "self-clean" and remove surface corrosion to prevent arcing - one of the reasons I chose them in the first place. I think the corrosion had built up so much because it had been several months since we last used the connection. It's worth noting that the SB175 connectors are rated to 280A and we're pulling at most around 40A so they're significantly over-specced for the use case. Not an excuse to not keep them clean, but there's a good buffer on conductivity there. Nonetheless, I was also quite surprised how much it had corroded when I showed it on the video, so I went back later and cleaned it - something I'll have to keep on top of now we're living in this climate!
This is what I have been looking for! Thank you so much for your hard work and for creating such an amazing video. We’re new to this life, and always looking at others to learn more. Subscribed! Thanks again.
I'm full-time rving and I'm not giving up all the storage under my bed for batteries. As you mentioned there's not a lot of storage on most small trailers. There has to be a better solution than that .
As full-time RVers in a 25ft travel trailer, we totally understand where you're coming from - storage space is very valuable! The reality is though that batteries and electrical equipment take up space, so the question is where to put them? One option would have been the tongue, but that would leave all the electrical equipment pretty exposed - both to the elements as well as potential theft. Many people choose to mount the batteries in an outside storage bay, but we only have one of those and that's really valuable space for us - we store tools, hookup equipment, camping gear, skis, gas grill, etc in there. We chose to put them under the bed as the location that we could most afford to lose. The space under the bed on our RV is split into two - the bottom half has two drawers, with a divider on top to give the big open cavity. We replaced the thin dividing material with a much stronger frame and plywood layer so we could install the batteries, inverter and other equipment in the top half while still having full use of the drawers underneath. A lot of it really depends on the layout of your trailer, what equipment you want to install (e.g. how many batteries, inverter, etc) and which storage locations are most valuable to you. This has worked out great for us for the past 3 years, and if we did it all again we'd install it in the exact same spot, but that doesn't mean it's the right location for everyone.
Cleanest and best wiring I have every seen in a RV. Most are hack and splice. If I followed you correctly, if you are driving down the road and your alternator or truck battery quits you will draw off your camper until you get to an repair shop. Or did you put a back flow preventer in line somewhere.
Thanks! And yes, the DC-to-DC charger is our solution to prevent the truck battery draining. We did use a continuous duty solenoid as well so that the charger is only turned on when the truck engine is running. That stops the charger draining the battery when the engine is off. However, in the specific case of the alternator failing while driving, our battery would still drain (since the engine is on and the charger is connected). In that situation, assuming we didn't get any error codes on the truck (which we almost certainly would), our battery would eventually die. However, we always carry around a portable battery-based jump starter (which we've used to help other people a few times) that we could use to jump start the truck, and of course we could even use the RV batteries to recharge the truck battery if necessary. We would obviously have to disconnect the DC-to-DC charger by unplugging it to avoid charging loops and draining the battery again, but the nice thing about this setup is the charger is wired separately from the trailer lights, brakes, etc so this wouldn't be an issue.
Hi there! Love this video and can't wait to watch your Smart RV video next! Did you shoot any video of your work to run the AC wiring from the shore power plug to the front junction box? I'd like to do the same, but the distribution panel is in the center of my 280KVS and I'm not very excited about the prospect of pulling down the belly cover just to access that junction box. Thanks! :-)
New Subcriber and great video. I have a suggestion, using your outboard 200w panel through the DC to dc charger is probably not going to work. Putting voltage from two sources like your rooftop solar/ charger and dc to dc at the same time will cause one or both chargers to float down and effectively disable your high amp charge circuit. You have to add those panels into the main solar input somehow to really use the extra panels! Thanks, look forward to looking back at your content now that I've found your channel.
I understand exactly where you're coming from, and I had the same concern. However, in reality there is no issue, largely because of the incredibly flat voltage curve of lithium batteries. We see both chargers operating at full capacity until the batteries reach ~99.5% SoC, and only for that final stage does one of the chargers back off. Having the different solar panel arrays on the same solar charge controller wouldn't work well at all in our setup because the panels are oriented differently.
New to your channel and I’m impressed with your setup. I’d be curious to know if you have a previous video that shows how you routed the new wires and used existing wires as I have a similar travel and plan on installing lithium batteries and an inverter underneath the bed.
Thanks John! We don't have a video about it, but we do have a blog post series on our website with all the details including lots of photos: www.adventurousway.com/blog/rv-electrical-upgrade-part-2-battle-born-lithium-batteries-victron-inverter
Thanks. I’ll soon be upgrading my camper with a similar system. I have the same EMS installed, just nearer the shore power in than at the load center. You mentioned wanting protection from things like low voltage. Wouldn’t the Multi AC out provide a full 120V, adding inverted power if necessary, even if the AC in was sub-par (say 95V or whatever)? Thanks. Hope your travels are going well.
Hey friends! Speaking of solar and Lithium: I worry about wind and potential for the solar panels to turn into frisbee's going down the road. Can you comment in a future video about how secure these are on the roof? ODRV's are fairly thin on top with 3/8" plywood my trusses are only 2x3"s. That is not a lot of meat to fasten into. Thanks!
It was definitely a concern, but as long as you follow all the manufacturers' recommendations you should be fine. In our case using the Renogy brackets, that meant 16 screws per solar panel - they felt super secure and we had no concerns. I haven't heard of any issues among all the people we know with rooftop solar.
Pretty awesome! I do have a question that I’m hoping you can answer. For us, we don’t need a full set up like you have....yet. :). However, it would be awesome to be able to replace our lead acid with lithium. I’m assuming this would not be a swap out, swap in job. Or maybe it is? What would we have to do to switch us over to lithium? Excellent video!
Technically speaking, the lithium batteries can just be a straight drop-in replacement for lead acid batteries, but in reality there are a few things to check / consider: 1) Are your existing chargers (e.g. the converter charger your RV came with, solar charger, etc) compatible with lithium? Some are, some aren't, and some just charge very inefficiently. 2) You'll want to add a shunt - either something like the Victron SmartShunt which just uses Bluetooth, or the BMV-712 like ours which has a display. Without this, you won't know how full or empty your batteries are. 3) Do you want to install the lithium batteries in the exact same spot as the lead acid ones? Low temperature can be a concern (although is often exaggerated) but for us a major factor was not wanting to put almost $3,000 worth of batteries in an unlocked box on the tongue of our trailer. If you're considering Battle Born lithium batteries, my best advice is to give them a call. I've heard excellent things about their customer service team and they should be able to help you out with the specifics of your RV.
Great system! I wish I had one like this! Did I get you right? You don't have a generator at all, you often travel off campground. How do you use your air conditioner? Do you really run it from the batteries?
That’s right, we had no generator while boondocking all across the country! As for our AC, while we can run it just from our batteries / inverter, it wouldn’t last very long - a couple of hours at most. So in reality we just avoided places where we needed to run the AC!
Thank for the answer! One more question please. If I get 30A from my truck DC to DC charger when driving and 30A from my solar panels at the same time do batteries get 60A for charging or still 30A?
It depends if both solar and your alternator are feeding through the same charger. In our case, using the REDARC BCDC1240D, it uses what they call "green charging" - in other words, it prioritizes solar over the alternator charging, up to a maximum of 40A. So if we have 30A of current available from solar, it'll only pull 10A from the alternator. However, the way we wired it up, our rooftop solar panels were connected to a separate solar charge controller - a Victron 100/50 SmartSolar charger. That meant they would always provide power regardless of the truck charger - e.g. when driving down the road. We did have a solar panel input on the REDARC, but only for our portable ground-deploy solar array - our logic being that we would never have the portable solar panel deployed while driving down the road! With this setup, while driving we were able to get a full 40A of charge from our truck alternator PLUS as much solar from our rooftop panels as they could provide.
Hello, I have a question about charing the batteries. I have a set up a similiar system as yours, but I am confused about where the solar charging comes in. Does the positive just go to the positive Buspar and negative to negative Busbar, or do I somehow have to connect my charge controller to the battery directly or to some sort of switch. Thank you!
Nice well-done videos! Quick question though, seems like your rig is only three ish years old? why have you had to replace your roof? as we are in the same model RV you are. thanks for all the info you guys are providing.
Hi, I love your channel. Great video. I'm curious. Fully loaded going down the road, what does your Outdoors RV weigh in at. Thanks for your response. Cheers.
We're on shore power here, so yes, it's being used a little differently to when we're boondocking. However, the power has cut out a few times, either an actual power outage or low voltage as detected by our EMS. Having the battery and inverter capacity to keep things running has been great. As for the DC-to-DC charger, it's very rare that we've used it as a generator while parked, but on the handful of occasions where we've needed it, it's been very useful. We've never had a "real" generator since we've been RVing, and looking back now we wouldn't have used it enough to justify the expense, size and maintenance.
Not at all. The only noise it ever makes is a hum from the cooling fan and that’s only when it’s under very high load - either charging or discharging. I can only think of 1 time in over 4 years of having the system that it’s been loud enough to hear at night and that was a unique situation. You could absolutely put it in the storage bay if you wanted to, but this was a more practical configuration for us.
This video was Incredibly helpful! I am about to start replacing the lead batteries in my trailer with some nice lithium ones. I had a few questions that I was hoping you could answer. I'm trying to do the minimum amount of changes to my electrical system, so #1 do you think it would be safe to put the batteries in a metal box on the tounge? I feel this is more secure than under bay storage. I'd insulate it and add a fan. #2 how does your DC to DC charger charge a lithium battery? I would think that because your lithium batteries charge to 14.4V, why is power not flowing backwards into your 13.4V car batteries? Is this not a concern at all? Thank you!
Thanks Micah! Glad you found it useful. As for installing the batteries in a metal box on the tongue, there’s no reason you can’t - I’ve seen someone else do exactly this. Just make sure you consider security (the batteries are expensive) and environmental concerns (you don’t want them to get too hot / cold). As for the charger we use, it only charges in one direction so no current can flow back to the tow vehicle.
Any time you hook up batteries make sure you secure them.youre putting a lot of faith in cables,connecters,...fuses fuses fuses.you can't have to many.pretty complicated electrical stuff looks intresting,but never use cheep junk in the circuits,batteries and junk =fires.Be safe first,your vid looks good,I don't like mounting components on wood.if a part fails,not good.You know how to build the system,but other folks may try to copy it and have much diffrent results.
Absolutely, building a safe system was our first priority which is why we paid so much attention to carefully securing everything, fusing where relevant, etc. If you're interested in learning more about how we built everything (including the components and tools) then you might like our blog post: www.adventurousway.com/blog/rv-electrical-upgrade-part-2-battle-born-lithium-batteries-victron-inverter
@@AdventurousWay I'm a engineer and built stuff like this years ago. I'm not a fan of solar power..solar power and generated power don't mix well.ruins electronic circuts.dirty power I call it.corrosion in circuits, boards corrode solder joints fail.played with it for years,threw it in trash.Weigh a battery,discharge it,weigh it.charge it with solar,weigh it,now discharge it.now charge it with good ac charger.weigh it again.explain the reason for the diffrent weights!.over time,solar eats the batteries to make power.weigh them for yourself.It don't make sence,but it cost to replace batteries and replace electrical items that fail.especaly converters.
Great explanation of your system: very informative and useful for my future system. QUESTION: If I don't plan to charge from my truck do I still need the Redarc? Would I also be able to incorporate a plug in solar panel on the ground to help charge the Li's? Thank you very much!
Thanks Richard! A DC-to-DC charger like our REDARC BCDC1240D is only needed if you want to charge from your truck. If you just want a ground-deploy solar panel to charge your batteries, a simple solar charge controller is all you need. While MPPT chargers are more efficient, the PWM controllers can work well (you can easily find waterproof ones) and are much cheaper.
@@AdventurousWay Thank you for the reply. That is good news. I'm looking at two of the new SOK 200 AH batteries. Will Prowse loved them and their 1/2 the price of the BB's. Roof size will limit me to two 190's panels. I will add a portable 200 watt suitcase. What I come up short on for a full recharge I have a small dual fuel inverter to top the batteries off with, if needed.
Glad I could help! If you haven't already seen it, check out our blog post about building a DIY 200W portable solar panel: www.adventurousway.com/blog/diy-portable-solar-panel I built it 2 years ago and it's still working great! Very sturdy, folds up easily, and much cheaper than buying one. You'd just need to add a solar charge controller as per the comment above.
Great setup, I did something similar. Do you have any idea what your inverter efficiency is when running a load? (Efficiency measured in terms of 120V output in watt / 12V input in watts). For some reason, my Victron MP 3000W inverter is only getting about 80%--well below the advertised efficiency.
I don't, but anecdotally I'd guess it's somewhere close to what you're seeing. Inverter efficiencies are highly dependent on the load, and it's often not very efficient, particularly for small loads when you factor in the fixed parasitic power draw. It's one reason why we run as many things as possible from DC, and even have a small 500W portable inverter we use to charge Diana's laptop (which can't be charged direct from DC) rather than firing up the big Victron.
Love this channel! We just ordered our Outdoors RV 28DBS. I am looking to do a very similar setup. Do you know what size the main solar wires from the roof are? I am trying to figure out how much current they can safely carry.
Off the top of my head, I think they were 8ga or 10ga - it'd be worth checking with the factory to be sure. That was one of the reasons why we chose to wire our rooftop solar panels in series-parallel, to keep the current a little lower and stay well within the rating of the existing wiring.
@@AdventurousWay Excellent! Good to know. I'm thinking I'll do the same. The RV included kit is a Zamp 30a 12v PWM controller & a single 170w panel - expandable to 510w. Thinking I might buy one more 170w panel & wire them series parallel for a 24v Victron MPPT to Eve, Lishen, or CATL cells. Decisions decisions!
I can't help you on the battery decision, but if you're just doing two 170W panels then I'd probably just wire them in parallel using the existing combiner box as that's designed to take up to 3x 170W panels in parallel and you'd still be well within the ratings of the wiring. Just as a heads up in case you weren't already aware, Victron's naming system for MPPT chargers is / - so for example, a Victron SmartSolar 100/50 like ours can take up to 100V on the input (PV) side and charge at up to 50A. The output charging voltage depends on your battery bank but they don't have separate models for them (like, for example, they do for the MultiPlus range).
@@AdventurousWay Way I should have mentioned we ordered with the max 510w. I was thinking of doing 4x170w panels in series parallel. I'd have to upgrade the rooftop combiner box though. Should be fun!
@@AdventurousWay oh my bad fixed it, still, 3 batteries makes you stuck with 12v, and getting another one to switch to 24v might be awkward since the batteries won't be well balanced.
Switching to 24V in an RV involves more than just rewiring the batteries. There's a lot more detail on why we chose the battery configuration we did in our blog post: www.adventurousway.com/blog/rv-electrical-upgrade-part-1-introduction-goals Although for what it's worth, since then we've added a 4th battery!
Sure. Well, significantly larger for our RV, but in general, yes. And a different charger from the truck. 24V is great but offers no practical advantages in our situation and plenty of downsides. I probably wouldn’t go higher than 12V in an RV until I hit 8 batteries, then I’d jump straight to 48V.
I would love to duplicate your system on our motorhome however it seems very complicated. What information sources did you rely on to educate yourself on components but also installation? Thank you very much!
Thank you! I already had some knowledge of electrical systems, but I still spent literally months researching everything - I read through almost every blog and watched almost every video I could find on the topic. We tried to consolidate all of those learnings into one place on our blog, so I'd recommend reading through this post and follow the links out at each stage for more detail on the components and installation: www.adventurousway.com/blog/perfect-off-grid-rv-solar-system
@@AdventurousWay So helpful that you linked each separate video, almost like a highly organized reference book with chapters. I live in a home in Minnesota, have a travel trailer for summer use, and my 100 watt solar panels (Harbor Freight cheap ones to start simply) are on my south facing deck 365 days per year. I would like to be able to use the trailer on my property in winter, so am trying out the simple solar system to a lead acid battery into the house, where I use with a light bulb and to charge phones and laptops as a backup power source for when the electricity goes out. But I do like to car camp, and also have a Ford F250 as a snow plow truck and towing vehicle. I am an avid skier, as well, and might get a cab over for the pickup to use as a chalet. I suspect variants of Covid will continue into 2023, and want options for dry camping in a resort parking lot, heat source, simple off grid cooking, maybe for weekend ski trips. I've never skied out East, only out West and teach here in the Midwest. I would g to try your neck of the woods next winter! Anyway, I can't express how informative and well put together your system and presentation are! Well done! Very inspiring. Take care, and thanks again 😀
When we installed ours, you had to install the BMV-712 and yes, that does mean a redundant display. They’ve since come out with the SmartShunt which works as you describe which is what I’d use if I were doing it today.
I'm curious about how you rewired the emergency brake system when you moved the batteries from the tongue to under the bed. Usually it's connected directly to the battery through and auto reset breaker. Same with the tongue jack. You seem very thorough with everything else but people should be aware that the emergency brake system should still be functional.
Ours was originally connected directly to the battery, but I rewired it to connect to our new batteries. We did something similar with the emergency brake and 7-pin connector. There's a little more information in our blog post: www.adventurousway.com/blog/rv-electrical-upgrade-part-4-installing-progressive-industries-ems-hw30c#powering-the-tongue-jack
If you have any questions about RV electrical and solar we now offer consultations! Book here: www.buymeacoffee.com/adventurousway/
Super high-end system obviously you spent money but well worth it. Nice clean install well done
You have answered so many of the questions I have about inverter choice. I did not even know about the hybrid.
Happy to help! If you haven't already found it, this blog post series goes into more detail about why we built our system the way we did, including why we chose particular components like the inverter: www.adventurousway.com/blog/rv-electrical-upgrade-part-1-introduction-goals
Great planning led to happy users. Well done.
Thank you! And yes, time spent in the planning phase paid dividends in building a system that really worked for us.
Thank you for sharing all of this information. You did an awesome job. Now that I have seen this video, I want to go to the blogpost. Thanks again.
You are welcome :)
Wow, great job gonna have to watch this video a few more times but exactly what I wanted to do to my trailer, thank you
You inspired me! I am back out in my ORV right now on a ten day excursion. Solar is still delivering!
Also a good reminder I need to cut out a vent for my inverter. Also have the Victron 3000.
Very cool! Where are you heading? I can't wait to see your new setup in person some day!
Adventurous Way just spent my sixth night at an epic overlook in Utah's San Rafael Swell. This morning we (I am with one other Xscaper) are relocating to north of Moab to connect with Dan and others north of Moab for four more nights.
Excellent overview of your system. Very nice and professional work.
Thanks David!
VERY WELL DONE ! Nice, clean installation. Over engineered the way I like it. EMS was added after the first use of our TT. 5+ years ago I was getting paralysis by analysis. So I jumped in with a very simple & basic system. 100W panel & a PMW + 2-6V golf cart batteries. After 1 year I added another 100W panel + a very small inverter + a 2000w inverter / generator. We seldom use the gen but its a nice backup and occasional use. Sun doesn't always shine here in the PNW. We're not full-timers but out every month year round. Boondock ~70%. We are all in at ~ $850. My next project is a DC/DC but will replace my alternator first. Something much larger to cope with the load. Amp rating is fine; but OEM's are not built to run for long periods (heat). It all works for us so far. Just like RV's, no one size fits all. Love your system.
I couldn't agree more, and it sounds like your approach was very similar to ours - start small with a plan to upgrade where necessary depending on what you learn along the way. And yes, you definitely want to make sure your alternator can handle the load. If you are considering upgrading your alternator, you might want to check out this blog post about an upgrade I helped some friends do where we added 2x 50A DC-to-DC chargers to their Airstream: www.adventurousway.com/blog/airstream-electrical-upgrade
@@AdventurousWay WOW thats a lot of amps ! I'm looking at a 370 amp Mechman Alternator. They are not cheap ($600) but built to last under heavy loads. I'm only going to run a 20 amp DC -DC. I'll await your installation of a mini nuclear reactor & cooling tower next.
Thanks for the DETAILED walk through. Answered a lot of questions I had not only about your install, which I've been following since the very first blog post, as well as how Outdoors RV routes things. I'm in the process of doing a scaled down version, using some of the same pieces you did (thank you), with the added need for low temperature non-fulltime use. This 40 minutes told me virtually everything I needed to know about where exactly you routed fresh wire and where you reused the existing. Again, thank you for the insight.
I'm glad you found it helpful!
Hey Just watched the 27 upgrades great Video. Now watching this one. Great job on all ideas 💡. You also did a great job on the 3 part video of your camper tour with Outdoors RV. And I just found your Channel yesterday lol Have a great day
Welcome to our channel Ken and thanks for watching!
Thanks!
Thank you for Super Thanks! Very appreciated!
Great video! I use dielectric grease on my anderson connectors, and seven pin connector. Helps prevent the corrosion perfectly!
Yup, think we need some too! I hadn’t seen the corrosion until filming!
Matt you did an awesome job on this video! Great easy explanation to understand. Thank you!
Thank you! If you're interested in learning more you might like the video presentation I did about electrical upgrades a little over a year ago: ua-cam.com/video/ZU9zo5BseFo/v-deo.html
Wonderfully thorough video. Thanks so much!
Glad it was helpful!
So very helpful, thank you.
You're very welcome!
Bravo!
Thanks!
amazing run through Matt ! I always learn something new when I watch your vids
Thanks Matt - we tried to include as much as possible in the video!
Wow, I had no idea of all of the upgrades you did on your trailer when I visited with you in Colorado 2019. The explanation you provided is very helpful with what the components are, how they are connected, and your reasons for the design. We are in the middle of our next upgrade for the power system on our class A. This video has generated ideas for a couple of future upgrades.
We are taking the upgrade incrementally. The first step was adding a Victron BMV-712 a couple of years ago so we could know what was happening with our four 6V GC2 flooded lead acid batteries. The second step is upgrading the remote for our Magnum 2000W Inverter/Charger to permit custom charging profiles to support LifePO4 batteries. The final phase of the upgrades for this round of changes will be to replace the Battery Isolation Manager to one that supports LifePO4 batteries and then replace the current GC2 batteries with four Battle Born heated GC2 (BBGC2H). We decided to go with the heated version since we are focused on doing a drop in solution at this time and the current batteries are under the entry way and vented. We wanted heated batteries to minimize the concern if we are in the cold. This approach of minimal changes will result in about $450 of upgrades (Magnum Remote & BIM), $100 in cables, and then the batteries. The benefits of the upgrade will be doubling the usable capacity of the battery bank, reducing weight by about 120lbs, and reduce charging time of the batteries. We will not change any of the rest of the system. We will evaluate the performance of the four batteries over several months.
Next year we will add solar to our configuration, add additional batteries (relocated the batteries into a bay from under the steps), upgrade the inverter to have more capacity, change the wiring on the RV to take batter advantage of the increase in battery capacity & inverter. We will likely have at least one Air Conditioner unit with a soft start connected to the inverter at this point.
The Smart RV video sounds interesting, I will need to watch that soon.
That's definitely the way to go - do gradual upgrades and evaluate along the way! That way you will learn over time what are your needs and the required capacity. Totally makes sense to have the heated batteries for your use case.
Great video! Learned a lot!
Glad to hear it!
Nice walkthrough on a very nice solar inverter setup. That green stuff on your 40amp anderson connector is not dirt and grime but copper oxide from the copper in the connector. I'm not sure but I don't think you will be able to "self clean" that and it could be degrading your vehicle charging not to mention it could get hot when charging. I would clean it. You really did a good job on designing this system! You also seem to know its function inside and out. I like how you considered the trade off on your needs and system capability. Also a good job of explaining it. So many of the videos I've seen are of the "power it all" variety with 1700 watts of solar and 900 AH of Lithuim batteries. While impressive these can be in excess of $20,000 and prohibitively expensive for most people. My system will be more down to earth.
Thanks Joseph - glad you found the video useful. And I agree, it's comparatively easy to design a big system with no constraints, but when you start to really consider the tradeoffs it becomes much more complicated.
As for the green substance on the Anderson connector, I think it's actually Copper (II) Chloride rather than Copper Oxide. Vermont uses a lot of salt (Sodium Chloride) on the roads, and this really takes a toll on any exposed metal on vehicles.
The Anderson SB connectors use tinned copper connectors with integral springs that gives them the ability to "self-clean" and remove surface corrosion to prevent arcing - one of the reasons I chose them in the first place. I think the corrosion had built up so much because it had been several months since we last used the connection.
It's worth noting that the SB175 connectors are rated to 280A and we're pulling at most around 40A so they're significantly over-specced for the use case. Not an excuse to not keep them clean, but there's a good buffer on conductivity there.
Nonetheless, I was also quite surprised how much it had corroded when I showed it on the video, so I went back later and cleaned it - something I'll have to keep on top of now we're living in this climate!
Excellent video
Thanks Greg!
Well done video, thanks!
Thank you - glad you enjoyed it!
well done. keep up the videos. very informative.
Thank you!
This is what I have been looking for! Thank you so much for your hard work and for creating such an amazing video. We’re new to this life, and always looking at others to learn more. Subscribed! Thanks again.
You're very welcome - I'm glad you found it useful! Safe travels :-)
Nice work.
Thanks!
Awesome video.
Thanks!
I'm full-time rving and I'm not giving up all the storage under my bed for batteries. As you mentioned there's not a lot of storage on most small trailers. There has to be a better solution than that .
As full-time RVers in a 25ft travel trailer, we totally understand where you're coming from - storage space is very valuable! The reality is though that batteries and electrical equipment take up space, so the question is where to put them?
One option would have been the tongue, but that would leave all the electrical equipment pretty exposed - both to the elements as well as potential theft. Many people choose to mount the batteries in an outside storage bay, but we only have one of those and that's really valuable space for us - we store tools, hookup equipment, camping gear, skis, gas grill, etc in there.
We chose to put them under the bed as the location that we could most afford to lose. The space under the bed on our RV is split into two - the bottom half has two drawers, with a divider on top to give the big open cavity. We replaced the thin dividing material with a much stronger frame and plywood layer so we could install the batteries, inverter and other equipment in the top half while still having full use of the drawers underneath.
A lot of it really depends on the layout of your trailer, what equipment you want to install (e.g. how many batteries, inverter, etc) and which storage locations are most valuable to you. This has worked out great for us for the past 3 years, and if we did it all again we'd install it in the exact same spot, but that doesn't mean it's the right location for everyone.
Cleanest and best wiring I have every seen in a RV. Most are hack and splice. If I followed you correctly, if you are driving down the road and your alternator or truck battery quits you will draw off your camper until you get to an repair shop. Or did you put a back flow preventer in line somewhere.
I forgot that you have DC TO DC charger.
Thanks! And yes, the DC-to-DC charger is our solution to prevent the truck battery draining. We did use a continuous duty solenoid as well so that the charger is only turned on when the truck engine is running. That stops the charger draining the battery when the engine is off.
However, in the specific case of the alternator failing while driving, our battery would still drain (since the engine is on and the charger is connected). In that situation, assuming we didn't get any error codes on the truck (which we almost certainly would), our battery would eventually die. However, we always carry around a portable battery-based jump starter (which we've used to help other people a few times) that we could use to jump start the truck, and of course we could even use the RV batteries to recharge the truck battery if necessary.
We would obviously have to disconnect the DC-to-DC charger by unplugging it to avoid charging loops and draining the battery again, but the nice thing about this setup is the charger is wired separately from the trailer lights, brakes, etc so this wouldn't be an issue.
Hi there! Love this video and can't wait to watch your Smart RV video next! Did you shoot any video of your work to run the AC wiring from the shore power plug to the front junction box? I'd like to do the same, but the distribution panel is in the center of my 280KVS and I'm not very excited about the prospect of pulling down the belly cover just to access that junction box. Thanks! :-)
New Subcriber and great video. I have a suggestion, using your outboard 200w panel through the DC to dc charger is probably not going to work. Putting voltage from two sources like your rooftop solar/ charger and dc to dc at the same time will cause one or both chargers to float down and effectively disable your high amp charge circuit. You have to add those panels into the main solar input somehow to really use the extra panels! Thanks, look forward to looking back at your content now that I've found your channel.
I understand exactly where you're coming from, and I had the same concern. However, in reality there is no issue, largely because of the incredibly flat voltage curve of lithium batteries. We see both chargers operating at full capacity until the batteries reach ~99.5% SoC, and only for that final stage does one of the chargers back off. Having the different solar panel arrays on the same solar charge controller wouldn't work well at all in our setup because the panels are oriented differently.
New to your channel and I’m impressed with your setup. I’d be curious to know if you have a previous video that shows how you routed the new wires and used existing wires as I have a similar travel and plan on installing lithium batteries and an inverter underneath the bed.
Thanks John! We don't have a video about it, but we do have a blog post series on our website with all the details including lots of photos: www.adventurousway.com/blog/rv-electrical-upgrade-part-2-battle-born-lithium-batteries-victron-inverter
Thanks. I’ll soon be upgrading my camper with a similar system. I have the same EMS installed, just nearer the shore power in than at the load center. You mentioned wanting protection from things like low voltage. Wouldn’t the Multi AC out provide a full 120V, adding inverted power if necessary, even if the AC in was sub-par (say 95V or whatever)? Thanks. Hope your travels are going well.
Hey friends! Speaking of solar and Lithium: I worry about wind and potential for the solar panels to turn into frisbee's going down the road. Can you comment in a future video about how secure these are on the roof? ODRV's are fairly thin on top with 3/8" plywood my trusses are only 2x3"s. That is not a lot of meat to fasten into. Thanks!
It was definitely a concern, but as long as you follow all the manufacturers' recommendations you should be fine. In our case using the Renogy brackets, that meant 16 screws per solar panel - they felt super secure and we had no concerns. I haven't heard of any issues among all the people we know with rooftop solar.
Howdy.
What fan and temp controller have you used on the Redarc ?
Thanks
Pretty awesome! I do have a question that I’m hoping you can answer. For us, we don’t need a full set up like you have....yet. :). However, it would be awesome to be able to replace our lead acid with lithium. I’m assuming this would not be a swap out, swap in job. Or maybe it is? What would we have to do to switch us over to lithium? Excellent video!
Technically speaking, the lithium batteries can just be a straight drop-in replacement for lead acid batteries, but in reality there are a few things to check / consider:
1) Are your existing chargers (e.g. the converter charger your RV came with, solar charger, etc) compatible with lithium? Some are, some aren't, and some just charge very inefficiently.
2) You'll want to add a shunt - either something like the Victron SmartShunt which just uses Bluetooth, or the BMV-712 like ours which has a display. Without this, you won't know how full or empty your batteries are.
3) Do you want to install the lithium batteries in the exact same spot as the lead acid ones? Low temperature can be a concern (although is often exaggerated) but for us a major factor was not wanting to put almost $3,000 worth of batteries in an unlocked box on the tongue of our trailer.
If you're considering Battle Born lithium batteries, my best advice is to give them a call. I've heard excellent things about their customer service team and they should be able to help you out with the specifics of your RV.
Great system! I wish I had one like this! Did I get you right? You don't have a generator at all, you often travel off campground. How do you use your air conditioner? Do you really run it from the batteries?
That’s right, we had no generator while boondocking all across the country! As for our AC, while we can run it just from our batteries / inverter, it wouldn’t last very long - a couple of hours at most. So in reality we just avoided places where we needed to run the AC!
Thank for the answer! One more question please. If I get 30A from my truck DC to DC charger when driving and 30A from my solar panels at the same time do batteries get 60A for charging or still 30A?
It depends if both solar and your alternator are feeding through the same charger. In our case, using the REDARC BCDC1240D, it uses what they call "green charging" - in other words, it prioritizes solar over the alternator charging, up to a maximum of 40A. So if we have 30A of current available from solar, it'll only pull 10A from the alternator.
However, the way we wired it up, our rooftop solar panels were connected to a separate solar charge controller - a Victron 100/50 SmartSolar charger. That meant they would always provide power regardless of the truck charger - e.g. when driving down the road. We did have a solar panel input on the REDARC, but only for our portable ground-deploy solar array - our logic being that we would never have the portable solar panel deployed while driving down the road!
With this setup, while driving we were able to get a full 40A of charge from our truck alternator PLUS as much solar from our rooftop panels as they could provide.
So it is better to have two different devices instead of having all in one device, isn’t it? Solar controller and DC-DC charger?
@@8800sebkru Yes.
Hello, I have a question about charing the batteries. I have a set up a similiar system as yours, but I am confused about where the solar charging comes in. Does the positive just go to the positive Buspar and negative to negative Busbar, or do I somehow have to connect my charge controller to the battery directly or to some sort of switch. Thank you!
Nice well-done videos! Quick question though, seems like your rig is only three ish years old? why have you had to replace your roof? as we are in the same model RV you are. thanks for all the info you guys are providing.
We had mold in our roof. More details here: ua-cam.com/video/XLX3ZR2AoLs/v-deo.html
Hi, I love your channel. Great video. I'm curious. Fully loaded going down the road, what does your Outdoors RV weigh in at. Thanks for your response. Cheers.
With full tanks, the trailer weighs in just under the GVWR of 7,500lbs.
How are you using this system now? Using your truck as a generator seems inefficient, at first blush, when you are parked. Are you on shore power?
We're on shore power here, so yes, it's being used a little differently to when we're boondocking. However, the power has cut out a few times, either an actual power outage or low voltage as detected by our EMS. Having the battery and inverter capacity to keep things running has been great.
As for the DC-to-DC charger, it's very rare that we've used it as a generator while parked, but on the handful of occasions where we've needed it, it's been very useful. We've never had a "real" generator since we've been RVing, and looking back now we wouldn't have used it enough to justify the expense, size and maintenance.
Isn’t the Victron Inverter a bit noisy by being under the bed? Seems like it might be better placed in the storage compartment.
Not at all. The only noise it ever makes is a hum from the cooling fan and that’s only when it’s under very high load - either charging or discharging. I can only think of 1 time in over 4 years of having the system that it’s been loud enough to hear at night and that was a unique situation. You could absolutely put it in the storage bay if you wanted to, but this was a more practical configuration for us.
@@AdventurousWay Thanks so much. Great video!
This video was Incredibly helpful! I am about to start replacing the lead batteries in my trailer with some nice lithium ones. I had a few questions that I was hoping you could answer.
I'm trying to do the minimum amount of changes to my electrical system, so #1 do you think it would be safe to put the batteries in a metal box on the tounge? I feel this is more secure than under bay storage. I'd insulate it and add a fan.
#2 how does your DC to DC charger charge a lithium battery? I would think that because your lithium batteries charge to 14.4V, why is power not flowing backwards into your 13.4V car batteries?
Is this not a concern at all?
Thank you!
Thanks Micah! Glad you found it useful.
As for installing the batteries in a metal box on the tongue, there’s no reason you can’t - I’ve seen someone else do exactly this. Just make sure you consider security (the batteries are expensive) and environmental concerns (you don’t want them to get too hot / cold).
As for the charger we use, it only charges in one direction so no current can flow back to the tow vehicle.
Any time you hook up batteries make sure you secure them.youre putting a lot of faith in cables,connecters,...fuses fuses fuses.you can't have to many.pretty complicated electrical stuff looks intresting,but never use cheep junk in the circuits,batteries and junk =fires.Be safe first,your vid looks good,I don't like mounting components on wood.if a part fails,not good.You know how to build the system,but other folks may try to copy it and have much diffrent results.
Absolutely, building a safe system was our first priority which is why we paid so much attention to carefully securing everything, fusing where relevant, etc. If you're interested in learning more about how we built everything (including the components and tools) then you might like our blog post: www.adventurousway.com/blog/rv-electrical-upgrade-part-2-battle-born-lithium-batteries-victron-inverter
@@AdventurousWay I'm a engineer and built stuff like this years ago. I'm not a fan of solar power..solar power and generated power don't mix well.ruins electronic circuts.dirty power I call it.corrosion in circuits, boards corrode solder joints fail.played with it for years,threw it in trash.Weigh a battery,discharge it,weigh it.charge it with solar,weigh it,now discharge it.now charge it with good ac charger.weigh it again.explain the reason for the diffrent weights!.over time,solar eats the batteries to make power.weigh them for yourself.It don't make sence,but it cost to replace batteries and replace electrical items that fail.especaly converters.
Great explanation of your system: very informative and useful for my future system. QUESTION: If I don't plan to charge from my truck do I still need the Redarc? Would I also be able to incorporate a plug in solar panel on the ground to help charge the Li's?
Thank you very much!
Thanks Richard! A DC-to-DC charger like our REDARC BCDC1240D is only needed if you want to charge from your truck. If you just want a ground-deploy solar panel to charge your batteries, a simple solar charge controller is all you need. While MPPT chargers are more efficient, the PWM controllers can work well (you can easily find waterproof ones) and are much cheaper.
@@AdventurousWay Thank you for the reply. That is good news. I'm looking at two of the new SOK 200 AH batteries. Will Prowse loved them and their 1/2 the price of the BB's. Roof size will limit me to two 190's panels. I will add a portable 200 watt suitcase. What I come up short on for a full recharge I have a small dual fuel inverter to top the batteries off with, if needed.
Glad I could help! If you haven't already seen it, check out our blog post about building a DIY 200W portable solar panel: www.adventurousway.com/blog/diy-portable-solar-panel I built it 2 years ago and it's still working great! Very sturdy, folds up easily, and much cheaper than buying one. You'd just need to add a solar charge controller as per the comment above.
Great setup, I did something similar. Do you have any idea what your inverter efficiency is when running a load? (Efficiency measured in terms of 120V output in watt / 12V input in watts). For some reason, my Victron MP 3000W inverter is only getting about 80%--well below the advertised efficiency.
I don't, but anecdotally I'd guess it's somewhere close to what you're seeing. Inverter efficiencies are highly dependent on the load, and it's often not very efficient, particularly for small loads when you factor in the fixed parasitic power draw. It's one reason why we run as many things as possible from DC, and even have a small 500W portable inverter we use to charge Diana's laptop (which can't be charged direct from DC) rather than firing up the big Victron.
The fan where did you get it??
The fan on the charger under the bed? It’s just a computer fan I bought online, probably from Amazon.
You said in the video that the fan runs all the time and has variable speeds, how are you controlling the speed
The fan has a built in temperature sensor that dictates the speed. The hotter it gets, the faster it spins.
Love this channel! We just ordered our Outdoors RV 28DBS. I am looking to do a very similar setup. Do you know what size the main solar wires from the roof are? I am trying to figure out how much current they can safely carry.
Off the top of my head, I think they were 8ga or 10ga - it'd be worth checking with the factory to be sure. That was one of the reasons why we chose to wire our rooftop solar panels in series-parallel, to keep the current a little lower and stay well within the rating of the existing wiring.
@@AdventurousWay Excellent! Good to know. I'm thinking I'll do the same. The RV included kit is a Zamp 30a 12v PWM controller & a single 170w panel - expandable to 510w. Thinking I might buy one more 170w panel & wire them series parallel for a 24v Victron MPPT to Eve, Lishen, or CATL cells. Decisions decisions!
I can't help you on the battery decision, but if you're just doing two 170W panels then I'd probably just wire them in parallel using the existing combiner box as that's designed to take up to 3x 170W panels in parallel and you'd still be well within the ratings of the wiring.
Just as a heads up in case you weren't already aware, Victron's naming system for MPPT chargers is / - so for example, a Victron SmartSolar 100/50 like ours can take up to 100V on the input (PV) side and charge at up to 50A. The output charging voltage depends on your battery bank but they don't have separate models for them (like, for example, they do for the MultiPlus range).
@@AdventurousWay Way I should have mentioned we ordered with the max 510w. I was thinking of doing 4x170w panels in series parallel. I'd have to upgrade the rooftop combiner box though. Should be fun!
@@AdventurousWay Super informative. I was wondering how you were handling the 48V (?) into the battery charger.
That doesn't look like 4/0 awg they look smaller .4/0 awg are almost 1 inch (nit half an inch) it looks like 2/0 awf
Not really sure what to say, they’re 4/0. Maybe camera perspective.
3 batteries at a parallel of 12v is a bit weird, you should have done 4 batteries, 2 in series and 2 groups parallel for 24v.
The batteries are in parallel, not series, so the overall voltage is still 12V.
@@AdventurousWay oh my bad fixed it, still, 3 batteries makes you stuck with 12v, and getting another one to switch to 24v might be awkward since the batteries won't be well balanced.
Switching to 24V in an RV involves more than just rewiring the batteries. There's a lot more detail on why we chose the battery configuration we did in our blog post: www.adventurousway.com/blog/rv-electrical-upgrade-part-1-introduction-goals
Although for what it's worth, since then we've added a 4th battery!
@@AdventurousWay something like the victron 24/12-15A converter would work with mine, rv is probably higher amperage than my 5th wheel.
Sure. Well, significantly larger for our RV, but in general, yes. And a different charger from the truck.
24V is great but offers no practical advantages in our situation and plenty of downsides. I probably wouldn’t go higher than 12V in an RV until I hit 8 batteries, then I’d jump straight to 48V.
I would love to duplicate your system on our motorhome however it seems very complicated. What information sources did you rely on to educate yourself on components but also installation? Thank you very much!
Thank you! I already had some knowledge of electrical systems, but I still spent literally months researching everything - I read through almost every blog and watched almost every video I could find on the topic. We tried to consolidate all of those learnings into one place on our blog, so I'd recommend reading through this post and follow the links out at each stage for more detail on the components and installation: www.adventurousway.com/blog/perfect-off-grid-rv-solar-system
@@AdventurousWay So helpful that you linked each separate video, almost like a highly organized reference book with chapters. I live in a home in Minnesota, have a travel trailer for summer use, and my 100 watt solar panels (Harbor Freight cheap ones to start simply) are on my south facing deck 365 days per year. I would like to be able to use the trailer on my property in winter, so am trying out the simple solar system to a lead acid battery into the house, where I use with a light bulb and to charge phones and laptops as a backup power source for when the electricity goes out. But I do like to car camp, and also have a Ford F250 as a snow plow truck and towing vehicle. I am an avid skier, as well, and might get a cab over for the pickup to use as a chalet. I suspect variants of Covid will continue into 2023, and want options for dry camping in a resort parking lot, heat source, simple off grid cooking, maybe for weekend ski trips. I've never skied out East, only out West and teach here in the Midwest. I would g to try your neck of the woods next winter! Anyway, I can't express how informative and well put together your system and presentation are! Well done! Very inspiring. Take care, and thanks again 😀
I'm lost
So do you know if you need the BMV 712 monitor or can you just install the shunt to the gx display. Seems like it’s redundant to have both displays?
When we installed ours, you had to install the BMV-712 and yes, that does mean a redundant display. They’ve since come out with the SmartShunt which works as you describe which is what I’d use if I were doing it today.
FYI, I've just installed the SmartShunt in our ORV 20RD and it works great.
Total cost?
The total cost of electrical upgrades on the trailer was $7,890.90. This includes only the parts, we did all our own labor.
I'm curious about how you rewired the emergency brake system when you moved the batteries from the tongue to under the bed. Usually it's connected directly to the battery through and auto reset breaker. Same with the tongue jack. You seem very thorough with everything else but people should be aware that the emergency brake system should still be functional.
Ours was originally connected directly to the battery, but I rewired it to connect to our new batteries. We did something similar with the emergency brake and 7-pin connector. There's a little more information in our blog post: www.adventurousway.com/blog/rv-electrical-upgrade-part-4-installing-progressive-industries-ems-hw30c#powering-the-tongue-jack