DO MORMON LEADERS KNOW IT'S FALSE? | Q&A
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- Опубліковано 16 чер 2024
- We answer your questions about progressive Mormons on Twitter, divorce, LDS leaders knowing too much, and more!
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Why don't we ex Mormons call ourselves No-more-mons
Johny Phoenix please, let me hear
🤣
Johny Phoenix oh please, don‘t tease me like that.
@@TheDawastla LOL
better: ex morons
Utah. Geez. I lived in Ogden and in Albertsons, while reaching for coffee yogurt, I was astonished that a woman passing by said SHAME ON YOU. No judgment there.
Did you laugh in her face. I think I would have broken out laughing hysterically
Oh the shame!
im literally at a mormon school rn and your videos help me stay sane lmao thanks qts
gay bitch thoughts and prayers! ❤️
Hang in there! Seriously, that would be tough but you'll get through it ❤️
Let me guess, Northern Utah?
RN did you say? I went to byu-idaho nursing school....where are you going?
@@jenniferwolford7205 "rn" is text shorthand for "right now".
I thought I was relatively non-judgmental as a member, but I was shocked at how many layers of judgment fell away after I left. I was constantly considering morals newly and realising that my judgements were arbitrary.
I wasn't even allowed at my grandfather's funeral back in June because I'm an ex-mormon...😢
Making indigenous peoples skin dark to make them unattractive? Didn't work 😂
Right? 💗
As an ex Mormon I struggle with changes from the church because I feel like they’re now trying to cover up all their weird doctrine, it’s like “just be who you actually are, don’t hide it now that people are talking about it!”
Yes. The church twisted and turns when it doesn't work right. I'm born and raised mormon. I know what is going on. Hmm. Sad.
Yep
Brigham Young was the racist who orchestrated the murders of Joseph, Hyrum and many others. Joseph Smith started a church called the Church of Christ and taught that if anyone teaches or live polygamy unless God outright commands it, will be excommunicated from the church. There were about 40k members of the Church of Christ and they all "owned" the church in-common. Brigham (an agent with a bulge-bracket investment bank called Kuhn Loeb & Company and Rotschild subsidiary) led about 4k or so people away from Joseph and started his own church called the "Church of Latter-day Saints". Brigham taught and lived polygamy and hated black people. Joseph conferred priesthood in 15 black men in his day, and in his US presidential platform, Joseph said he would free all the slaves. After Joseph was murdered, the historian for Brigham's church (Willard Richards) got busy re-writing history. One of the people Brigham had killed was a friend of Joseph Smith (named James Strang). Strang was assassinated on the banks of the great lakes and his assassin escaped on a US Navy boat. Brigham moved his people out west and decades after Brigham had passed, Brigham's church was renamed, "Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints". All these name changes that Brigham's church went through are on the corporate registry for Illinois and Utah, among other places.
@Truth Defender Don't know if you're being sarcastic, but fun fact, apparently it's now not a "sin", but a "transgression", which is apparently less serious. Still homophobic, but they still get to go to heaven they say
Of course. If they let people know what crazy nonsense they are preaching before they are deep enough in nobody will join the cult.
I'm from Dominican Republic and I love you guys so much 💖👏
I'm 21, I was a brainwash fulltime missionary, teacher at the MTC and member of the High Council for a few month till I realize what this was all really about. And now 👐 now I am free 🎉
Adonis Agripino Pilarte congratulations on getting out!
@@ZelphOntheShelf Thank you guys for that, keep up the good work 👏
Wow.
Adonis, glad you got your life back! Best of luck to you.
Adonis Agripino Pilarte
No way I wonder if I ran into you while you were teaching?! I was in the mtc last year in November
I think about this allllll the time. They must know but it's so fulfilling for them financially and socially that they just tolerate it and perpetuate lies. So sad. Zero integrity.
In the midst of leaving. Very hard at the moment.
You'll get there. I'm nearly to the stage of no longer being angry. But not quite.
Good for you!!!!! 💚
I really appreciate the take on progressive Mormons. I tried to be a "progressive Mormon" as a kid/teenager before leaving, but there was too much cognitive dissonance. Part of why I left was knowing that being a member was still endorsed homophobia and sexism, even if I held different opinions and debated with people at church.
The latest Provo Bachelor vid was absolutely brilliant! Thanks for all of the work you put into it...classic!!! Finger guns..lol love you two.
Loved this! Thank you for making it!
Something good in my life: I hit a big milestone of having lost 70lbs!
Something I'm struggling with: I'm trying to be more extroverted and care less about what people think about me. I'm trying to not cower and not be afraid to show my sexuality to the world too. So yeah...
I'm not sure if you meant for this to be derogatory or sincere but I'll go with sincere and say thanks!
Love yourself unconditionally. Work on that until it’s true. I honestly found that this was the key to not caring what others thought, because no matter what they might say, I knew I was okay. Good luck with everything.
Oh man that will be a huge task. I will need that good luck.
Tyler Wilcox I literally used an affirmation- when I felt low, I would say out loud -I love myself unconditionally. Suggestion from a book that I thought was so lame at the time, but it was so hard for me to say at first that I realised that it was true that I didn’t love myself unconditionally, so I gave it a try and it changed how I felt.
The truth is that there are people in my life I love unconditionally and I don’t need them to be perfect or beautiful or even in control of their lives for that to be the case, so why was I refusing to love my flawed self as I was? I always need to be on my own team.
This sounds like me a bit. Affirmations do kind of seem like a lame or pseudo-science concept but I hear a lot about them making positive changes in people's lives. I think I'll have to take it seriously and give it a shot.
I’m so entertained by those Provo’s most eligible videos. Thanks for all the work editing those!
Good news: Just got off the phone with my TBM sister and she loves me even though I left the church.
I’m sorry this was even a question. Good luck!
I got way too happy when I saw they answered my question, I feel accomplished 👏🙌
I’ll share: 1. Something good: Watching you guys makes me laugh 2. Something bad: I hate the fact that I know the church is NOT true. It’s taking me a while to come to terms with that, even though I found out about 2.5 years ago... blocked it for a while and this new year was the time I just couldn’t take it anymore. March 3rd was my last Sunday attending church. It still hurts, but I’ll be Ok.
luv_nane28 dude!!! It’s so rough! I know exactly what you’re talking about it’s somewhat of an existential crisis. Strange suggestion, but doing psychedelics (psilocybin in particular) helped me come to terms with the reality of the religion and instilled a confidence and trust in myself I never had when believing in the church. I was in a constant state of fear where I was thinking “I don’t believe in this but what if it’s true? It must be true if my whole community says it’s true”
A person has 3 Relational Connections in life 1. Their Connection to Jesus Christ and Creator 2. Connection to others and 3. To their own Self
Each of us have to make a personal search and journey and either we are convicted of the Gospel of Jesus Christ /Salvation by Grace of Jesua dying for us to have assurance of Eternal Salvation or we Sent and Reject Love and Truth.
2. In connection to others in Faith community this is our state of our relationship with The Church Community. Often many many crisis of faith are rooted more in Crisis of Church and People rather than a Crisis of Faith in Christ.
Please keep your heart and mind open to the Gospel and Call of Jesus Christ in your life and don't allow bad experiences, misunderstanding/hurt that's from the Church and not from your Original Conviction of Jesus Christ. The Door is always open!
I'm really enjoying your videos. I'm an ex Jehovah's Witness, and there are a whole bunch of similarities to how our two former groups operate. Anyhoo, keep up the great work!
I’m watching this while packing for a youth trip... this is how i have to spend my spring break... excited to go to college and never have to pretend at these things again lol
Olivia Smith hang in there!
Oh the pretending just drains your soul doesn't it Get out soon! Took me three years of being ghost. Ughh
No, Brigham Young was the racist who orchestrated the murders of Joseph, Hyrum and many others. Joseph Smith started a church called the Church of Christ and taught that if anyone teaches or live polygamy unless God outright commands it, will be excommunicated from the church. There were about 40k members of the Church of Christ and they all "owned" the church in-common. Brigham (an agent with a bulge-bracket investment bank called Kuhn Loeb & Company and Rotschild subsidiary) led about 4k or so people away from Joseph and started his own church called the "Church of Latter-day Saints". Brigham taught and lived polygamy and hated black people. Joseph conferred priesthood in 15 black men in his day, and in his US presidential platform, Joseph said he would free all the slaves. After Joseph was murdered, the historian for Brigham's church (Willard Richards) got busy re-writing history. One of the people Brigham had killed was a friend of Joseph Smith (named James Strang). Strang was assassinated on the banks of the great lakes and his assassin escaped on a US Navy boat. Brigham moved his people out west and decades after Brigham had passed, Brigham's church was renamed, "Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints". All these name changes that Brigham's church went through are on the corporate registry for Illinois and Utah, among other places.
@@yohananrhinehart6846 You're spouting a bunch of conspiracy theory nonsense here. Brigham Young loved Joseph Smith, and he had nothing to do with his murder. The names of Smith's killers are well-known. Joseph Smith instituted polygamy into Mormonism, and secretly practiced it, while publicly denying it.
@@randyjordan5521
Willard Richards killed Hyrum Smith, and John Taylor killed Joseph Smith---or so ballistics suggests and circumstantial evidence agrees.
Brigham is in the Illinois state corporate registry as an agent of Kuhn Loeb & Company (a Rotschild subsidiary). I'm not LDS, Randy, but I am a PI and I know how to conduct thorough investigations to win in trial. A PI who cannot do this is useless to his client.
I don't agree with every detail of what Joseph Smith believed, but he was certainly innocent.
Brigham re-wrote history. Brigham was an active Mason and organizer of the assassination of a U.S. Presidential candidate who vowed to end slavery in his Presidential platform (here is a great speech about the founding of this nation, and the real cause of the civil war is also discussed in the latter portion of the speech: ua-cam.com/video/364cxeR5EAg/v-deo.html)
Do you think if Joseph actually practiced polygamy that that fact would have been mentioned when the press talked about a U.S. presidential candidate?
Joseph's lawyer (James Strang) was assassinated on the banks of the Great Lakes and his assassin escaped on a U.S. Navy boat. The purpose of the civil war was not directly about slavery of black people. You should read Lincoln's own words about how much he disliked the black peoples. The U.S. did not want Joseph in office. Polygamy was never in any newspapers of the day at all when Joseph was actually alive. The press would have jumped all over that if a candidate for Pres had more than one wife.
Brigham said believed that polygamy should be lived because Abraham did,etc. Brigham said black people were inferior. Yet Joseph sought to free black people.
When Joseph was around, he spent a lot of time talking to them. When Brigham was around, he sent his own army after the natives and tried to exterminate a great many of them.
You can read all sorts of arguments online and think they are legit, but ALL of them are second-hand; and some have affidavits that they are true; yet the actual deeds of the man on public record tell a different story.
When Joseph organized the Church of Christ (D&C 20:1) he did not incorporate it. And all members of that church possessed it in-common as a mutually held property. New York state archives has no record that the Church of Christ was ever incorporated--it wasn't. Further, Joseph was a well known egalitarian.
Brigham's church, the Church of Latter-day Saints was incorporated and was incorporated early. Brigham's church is on corporate registry for Utah and when the corporation known as the Church of Latter-day Saints changed it's name to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, that too was and is on the corporate registry for the state of Utah.
Joseph conferred priesthood on 15 black men, but I don't have a list of all of them. Here are some of them:
Black Pete (1831 OH), Elijah Abel (1835 OH), Joseph T. Ball (1837 MA), Isaac van Meter (
👋🏽 Hello! As a fellow INTP and ex-mo, I just want to thank you both for being so entertaining and giving me a ton O' great content to binge! Amen 🙏🏽
Funny enough, it was after watching the bachelor videos that I decided I needed to become a patron. I enjoyed those so much, but knew that it had to be hell to put out, and I love you two for doing so ♥️
Excellent video! Enjoyed hearing your answers.
Brigham Young was the racist who orchestrated the murders of Joseph, Hyrum and many others. Joseph Smith started a church called the Church of Christ and taught that if anyone teaches or live polygamy unless God outright commands it, will be excommunicated from the church. There were about 40k members of the Church of Christ and they all "owned" the church in-common. Brigham (an agent with a bulge-bracket investment bank called Kuhn Loeb & Company and Rotschild subsidiary) led about 4k or so people away from Joseph and started his own church called the "Church of Latter-day Saints". Brigham taught and lived polygamy and hated black people. Joseph conferred priesthood in 15 black men in his day, and in his US presidential platform, Joseph said he would free all the slaves. After Joseph was murdered, the historian for Brigham's church (Willard Richards) got busy re-writing history. One of the people Brigham had killed was a friend of Joseph Smith (named James Strang). Strang was assassinated on the banks of the great lakes and his assassin escaped on a US Navy boat. Brigham moved his people out west and decades after Brigham had passed, Brigham's church was renamed, "Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints". All these name changes that Brigham's church went through are on the corporate registry for Illinois and Utah, among other places.
My great Uncle was apart of the seventies and wrote a hymn in the hymnbook before he passed away and my grandfather is a sealer in the temple and has held pretty high positions. He also gave me my patriartical blessing (which nothing he said applies to me in any way) As far as I know they truly believe and are so deep into it that they never knew it was all actually a lie. It makes me cringe soooooo much because my grandfather is old enough to remember the old days where you stood completely naked in the temple. It makes me wonder what these men are thinking? So I agree with what you are saying. You put someone in that sort of position and they will think they are just the salt of the earth and will believe anything those group of people tell them.
Are you related to John Taylor? Just curious
Thank you for the vids x
I’m so in two minds about change within the church. I understand it can make life more tolerable, but part of me wants it to remain the same so that it becomes increasingly obvious how untrue and irrelevant it really is. No progressive change is going to make it true.
I love that one of the ads UA-cam played after this video was just Arcade Fire's Sprawl ii - post-Mormon bands following post-Mormon vlogs. It's a sign. UA-cam is true. Amen.
*stares at mustache until it catches on fire*
Don't you dare. It's adorable. Tanner, I like your face.
Lol!!😂😂😂
(I hope y'all see this.) Funny story, Tanner was my EFY instructor.(go many things) Now when i was fifteen i was very mormon. To me there were normal mormons and then there were super religious "utah" mormons. I put Tanner in the latter category. after leaving the church at 17/18. I was still friends with tanner on facebook and he was posting lots of lds articles and stuff. One day he posted his famous "what is mormonism? what is me?" Video. I didn't even watched it, i just assumed that it was crazy mormon propoganda. I was so appalled that he would make something so self rightous that i just unfriended him. A couple of years later i finally came accross the same video while browsing ex-mormon videos. I decided to finally watch it and have a good laugh. to my amazement i discovered that this video was ANTI!?!?. Omg i was shocked and so happy to find out that Tanner was now an ex-mormon. So then i found zelph and am glad to see that tanner is a happier and cooler person now.
When i watched Jesus camp, i couldn't help but realize how similiar it was to EFY i know that not all mormons go to efy but it would be cool to hear y'all talk about this straight up insane indoctrination experience. Anyway
✌✌❤❤ from Kyler
Hahah AMAZING! Best comment ever! We need to do an efy video soon!
Thanks for posting. (You watched Jesus Camp and lived to talk about it??) LOL
I'm scrolling through youtube videos and I see that this one has 7200 views. Next to this one on the scroll is a speech by the Mormon apologist Daniel Peterson at a FAIR conference which has 2200 views. This Zelph video has been up for a week. The Peterson video has been up for 11 years. That made me chuckle a little.
@Truth Defender I take it from your response that you're a Mormon. "Good job."
I feel like ex-mormons are 1000% more accepting than the general population from growing up in that kind of an environment. Almost every exmo I've met is super non-judgmental and a supporter of those who were oppressed. As a trans guy, I've felt more accepted and loved by exmos than I have by almost any other population.
Idk what makeup you’re using Sam, or possibly none at all, but you look amazing!
Keep up the videos, love your guys channel!
omg love you
I love you, Tanner! Eat your dinner or I'm telling your mom.
Please do a video on MBTI/Jungian Personality Typology! It's seriously so interesting when you get into the cognitive functions. Tanner definitely seems like an ENFP but I wouldn't have guessed INTP for Sam.
I'm an INTP too! Do an episode. I did an informal survey of 50 believing and non-believing Mormons and their Myers Briggs. The results were very interesting.
I asked the F, marry, kill question and I’m so happy at your responses! I just got a new job that will allow me to be home with my spouse at night! And I’m really struggling with feeling like my family and friends still love me after leaving the church... so that’s fun
We hope that gets better for you! 💜
Also, as if an 8 year old can independently decide whether or not to be baptised!
Yesterday I was driving home crying and thought that coming to Utah (almost 4yrs ago) was one of the worst things I’ve done in my life; I learned of the truth of the church. Learning of the truth has been one of the MOST painful things I’ve gone through in my life.
Utah can feel like a giant trap, but I hope you can find some good people there to support you. I had to leave, but I know some people that have managed to be able to stay.
Hope things are better for you now. So sorry for what you went through.
something good: finally getting out of my house and going to college.
something bad: my family thinking I'm going to "hell" cos I'm leaving mormonism and "turning" into a lesbian.
@Vox Populi you know when you quote things that you don't believe in? so... I don't believe I am turning into a lesbian, my parents think that and I am quoting them... I was born gay.
I do think Mormonism is bs, but I think God is bs too, so threatening me with hell is not gonna work. I hope I made my points clear. :)
Good job! Can I ask how long you were a member before you left?
@@bodalix18 18
I like your long videos, but I only watch them when I’m trying to sleep.
Oh kiddos... you rock. Keep it up!
I'm thankful both of you
Zero responsibility of walking hand cart across this country.. if you where at charge. There be no temples ! Good job.
I left the church several years ago (also divorced who left the church with husband towards the beginning of marriage). I recently came across some videos about the inconsistencies and falsehoods found in Mormonism (and your channel!) and got back into the info that's out there challenging the faith. It's much less of an emotional experience now and even entertaining! In one of your videos you talked about people leaving because they ACTUALLY don't believe it's true, and I was like YAS!!! I couldn't put my finger on that and put it into words when I was leaving. My mom thinks I still "know" but don't want to live it. Man, the programming runs deep. Thanks for your channel 💙
Very happy for you pushing through as I remember how unbelievably difficult this was for me years ago.
Entertaining, Well entertain this, Elohim knows everything and is putting you guys on notice.
@@germanslice lol
germanslice I can't. 😂
This is not a game. Elohim is serious. The Star Experience is now going out to the world.
.
My pups are good and I'm enjoying post Mormonism. Something challenging: fending off the still lingering sugar cravings...
Brigham Young was the racist who orchestrated the murders of Joseph, Hyrum and many others. Joseph Smith started a church called the Church of Christ and taught that if anyone teaches or live polygamy unless God outright commands it, will be excommunicated from the church. There were about 40k members of the Church of Christ and they all "owned" the church in-common. Brigham (an agent with a bulge-bracket investment bank called Kuhn Loeb & Company and Rotschild subsidiary) led about 4k or so people away from Joseph and started his own church called the "Church of Latter-day Saints". Brigham taught and lived polygamy and hated black people. Joseph conferred priesthood in 15 black men in his day, and in his US presidential platform, Joseph said he would free all the slaves. After Joseph was murdered, the historian for Brigham's church (Willard Richards) got busy re-writing history. One of the people Brigham had killed was a friend of Joseph Smith (named James Strang). Strang was assassinated on the banks of the great lakes and his assassin escaped on a US Navy boat. Brigham moved his people out west and decades after Brigham had passed, Brigham's church was renamed, "Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints". All these name changes that Brigham's church went through are on the corporate registry for Illinois and Utah, among other places.
Wow.. Yanni is looking GOOOOD for 64. Nice video!
As someone who is binge watching these, this is the happiest I have seen you so far. This has been really good for you I can tell. Ok, but does Banks and Bernie have ADHD? I come here because I went thru a similar life situation from being adopted. Only in my case, I was given up from a devout Mormon single mother and only realized when I was 29 what that really meant when I found her and my birthfamily(I was raised far way from Utah -where I was conceived.) There was a never a chance I would be a convert, I had already been in therapy for several issues -one of them fundamentalist religion however, I kept trying, hoping there was some middle ground. It was sad when I realized years later that I never was going to feel close to any of them. I TRIED so hard for 20 years but I was an oddity/curiosity/and I was, of course, not in the church. I kept telling myself if they had unconditional love, they will be accepting of me if I keep trying! (Ugh.) The last straw was when my half-sister stopped calling me after our families went out for dinner 7 yrs ago. I never knew why until watching your videos the other day and I realized that it was because I had a couple of beers in front of her kids at dinner that night. Thinking back I figured we had known each other for 10 years and surely she would think this was no big deal. Oops. She never said anything, just POOF, my half sister didn't want to know me anymore. Oh, it was also the time my adoptive mother was dying...so there was that...Nothing from her either. I remember thinking what kind of religion breeds these types that turn on their own blood that easily. Certainly not one associated with love. Keep doing what you are doing, you are helping people in ways you cannot imagine.
The reason I know the culture comes from the doctrine and policies is because of how similar the culture can be, even when you’re living it in Australia. We had so many missionaries, etc come to our city and the Mormon cultural differences were not huge.
My cat is afraid of being sucked in a vacuum.
Your cat need not fear because nothing happens in a vacuum.
Miguel Aveiro haha! Nice!
Something awesome? My brother is on spring break in Alabama (where I live) from Wisconsin (where we're from) and he came into work today to surprise me!
Not so good? My tire flew off on the way to work and hit a firetruck then bounced over three lanes of traffic.
Something good pt2: the mechanics who worked on it a few weeks ago were at fault and paid for my tow and all of the necessary repairs for it YAY
Erin Palutsis wow hopefully nobody got hurt! Glad they took responsibility!
Tanner, I want the secrets to your gorgeous hair! What is this beautiful sorcery?! #hairgoals
Yes he has lovely hair
In my own universe I have a temple. And on that temple I put Nelson as my favourite gargoyle
My opinion is that mormon "testimonies" are self hypnosis. They fit the pattern. It would explain why I felt what I did. I think most of the leaders are very sincere and very much subject to the same self hypnosis
I still dont understand how people can read things like the CES letter and remain in the lie??? Lol
I suppose they could read Jim Bennett's response to the CES letter
Four Kids What Next?
Because those of us who trust God more than Google and feast upon his words know that things like the CES Letters and the book of Abraham as false, we recognise them all as priestcrafts.
The reason people leave is not because of what they see, but because of what they don't see, what these priestcrafts are hiding from you and their audiences.
Do you know that Jeremy's letters contain intentional lies, partial truths to give false impressions, only 30% of Jeremy's letters are true.
I'll show you what people fail to tell you about translation of the Book of Abraham by the Egyptologists.
1) People eyewitnessed that Joseph translated a long scroll, a majority of that long scroll was burnt in the Chicago fire. The museum possessed only a fragment of the scroll.
2) Since only a fragment of the scroll survived the Egyptologists only translated a fragment of the book of Abraham.
3) Some of the book of Abraham was not on the scroll but was revelation from God which didn't correlate with the scroll.
4) Joseph Smith never said how he translated the scroll, he never said revelation alone.
About translating the plates with a seer stone.
They fail to tell you that Moses received Revelations through the use of seer stones, even though they believe Moses was a true prophet. Joseph Smith used multiple methods to translate the plates.
To seek valid sources to learn from ask yourself these questions;
1) What's the producer's motive?
2) What's the producer's intention?
3) Does the message make sense?
4) Is the producer qualified to teach this subject?
Like ask yourself, why would the church leave such bad information in plain sight, there must be more to it than the producer's mentioning.
“Hold fast to what you already know and stand strong until additional knowledge comes. …
“… In this Church, what we know will always trump what we do not know.”
www.fairmormon.org/answers/Criticism_of_Mormonism/Online_documents/Letter_to_a_CES_Director
Ok
You seem to have dived in already...keep diving, you might get there eventually 👍
You're a lot more generous than me. I'm convinced that the folks at the top must know.
The book Rough Stone Rolling about Joe's shenanigans really helped me to process the insanity and then escape for real. Highly recommend that book.
I have always wondered if the GAs really truly believe it. I can still see the the first quorum of Seventy being kept in the dark. As for the First Presidency and the 12 they can see first hand what the issues are, I asked myself what would I do in their position. For me the answer would be to resign the position and go into retirement. There is no way that I could perpetuate the mythology.
If rank-and-file people like you and I can realize that it's all bogus, the GAs can too.
Steve Smith: If I was in their position (i.e. in the First Presidency or the 12) I would get up at General Conference and, in front of thousands, say that I no longer believed and why. I would keep talking until I was dragged off the stage.
David Holdstock I had also considered that to including posting high level church Skelton’s IE financial reports on the internet, my concern would be what fall out it would have, how marriages would it, would there be any suicides because of it. People have rapped their life, the whole foundation of their families around his belief system. For myself I really remember that it took a few months of processing information and trying make sense on how be belief in the church could still be true and still come to terms with overwhelming evidence that Joseph Smith was a fraud, my world view was turned on it’s side, it was quite traumatic to say the least, it almost ruined my marriage. I know that there are a lot of Christians out there who say that it let membership find the true Jesus. My response is that human reasoning process dose not work that way if you were betray by your religion you don’t go running after another one. I still believe that there is a God but, I choose no religion, no holy men, no holy books.
Thanks for answering my questions, you 2 rock. Now I am curious after the video. If they believe they becomes Gods/like Gods and created a universe. Whose universe/reality are we in? My guess would be Moroni but I have no idea if there is any official doctrine that goes that far. Or is that even something they think about?
Daniel Barnes We’re in our Heavenly Father’s universe. He is our god. We will be God’s to our eternal increase (spirit children). It’s a big repeating cycle. (I’m exMo and don’t believe this any more.)
@@debbiehoad1850 Right, but is that Elohim ? Or someone else ? Is this even clearly defined as to who the Heavenly Father is ? None of this makes any damn sense and proof that I'd make a horrible Mormon. I think too much and ask too many questions, lol
Daniel Barnes Yes, that’s Elohim.
@@debbiehoad1850 So Elohim was a man who walked on a planet and did something to become exalted/enlightened. (I don't think there is doctrine on whatever he did wherever) Then he created our universe and now hangs out near a planet called Kolob ?
@@debbiehoad1850 Rereading all of this and trying to make sense of it is like reading Thanos's wikipedia page.
Whether or not the leaders believe I have no idea. Is there shady stuff going on we will never hear about? Yep
I was just listening to a Mormon Stories podcast. A man was disfellowshipped and the letter they gave him recommended that (during this period of repentance) he continue to WEAR HIS GARMENTS. And there's more. CONTINUE TO PAY TITHING. Could it be more blatant?
I am a recent law school graduate in Germany and rataking the bar exam to qualify to be a judge. Having trouble getting back into studying bc this week would have been my moms 60th birthday- sie passed away 18 months ago.
Anniloves21 so sorry for your loss ❤️
💔💓💗❣️
Anniloves21, good luck on your exam. Condolences for your mom💖🕊
Deiter sends his regards
Brigham Young was the racist who orchestrated the murders of Joseph, Hyrum and many others. Joseph Smith started a church called the Church of Christ and taught that if anyone teaches or live polygamy unless God outright commands it, will be excommunicated from the church. There were about 40k members of the Church of Christ and they all "owned" the church in-common. Brigham (an agent with a bulge-bracket investment bank called Kuhn Loeb & Company and Rotschild subsidiary) led about 4k or so people away from Joseph and started his own church called the "Church of Latter-day Saints". Brigham taught and lived polygamy and hated black people. Joseph conferred priesthood in 15 black men in his day, and in his US presidential platform, Joseph said he would free all the slaves. After Joseph was murdered, the historian for Brigham's church (Willard Richards) got busy re-writing history. One of the people Brigham had killed was a friend of Joseph Smith (named James Strang). Strang was assassinated on the banks of the great lakes and his assassin escaped on a US Navy boat. Brigham moved his people out west and decades after Brigham had passed, Brigham's church was renamed, "Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints". All these name changes that Brigham's church went through are on the corporate registry for Illinois and Utah, among other places.
I wouldn't take the BAR if I were you, it is owned by the vatican ultimately. You can practice law without being BAR licensed.
All governments on earth use UCC and CFR statutes (etc). And all governments that use UCC and CFR (etc) are fraudsters.
In the US the 'supreme court" had this to say about law:
PER THE UNITED STATES SUPREME COURT REGARDING PRACTICE OF LAW;
1) The practice of Law CANNOT be licensed by any state/State Schware v. Board of Examiners,
2)Brotherhood of Trainmen v. Virginia ex rel. Virginia State Bar (377 U.S. 1); Gideon v. Wainwright 372 U.S. 335; Argersinger v. Hamlin, Sheriff 407 U.S. 425. Litigants may be assisted by unlicensed layman during judicial proceedings.
3) The practice of Law is AN OCCUPATION OF COMMON RIGHT!
Sims v. Aherns, 271 S.W. 720 (1925)
These same standards (or lack thereof) apply in all the governments of the world without exception.
Es gibt hier keine Ausnahmen, Punkt!
I love Florence Welch too :')
Changes are welcome, but not convincing when it comes to explaining an “All knowing god.” The truth about religion is better than wishful thinking.
“People used to be animists, polytheists, monotheists, and they’re getting closer to the true figure all the time.” Bertrand Russel/Christopher Hitchens
WOO! Team ENFP!!
Jenn Wray 🎉
Something good is I'm getting a house with a roommate, challenging is having to move everything out of my Grammy that passed away house because we sold it
Katie Dahlgren sorry about your loss! ❤️
Thank you
Every time y’all shout out ur patrons: 🥺that’s me they’re talking abt Me
Banksy is appropriately named lmao
First of all the republicans and the 12 apostles are one team bruh
Actually delighted to learn Tanner’s a tree boy
Invisible for a day in that setting? RECORD FULLY EVERYTHING
Sam. Good.
WHAT DO YOU GUYS THINK ABOUT ASTRAL PROJECTION I'm curious
Sonja Johansen tanner has got close but never had a full out of body experience
Omg I just realized that I don't have my very own cat..
I don't know who asked that question about the quorum of 12 vs the RNC, but they are my hero.
@11:16…”You’re so bitter and angry”. I call BS! The reason this is my favourite exmo channel is because you guys are *not* bitter and angry. You’re also not strident and as desperate to recruit exmos as the missionaries are to recruit new members.
People like Jimmy Snow make me feel uncomfortable, and even defensive, because he has so *much* loud anger about his upbringing. I haven’t watched a lot of his stuff, but what I have seen is “a lot of sound and fury”
You two get righteously indignant, and yes, sometimes you get a bit angry, but that’s not your whole zeitgeist. As someone teetering on the exmo brink, I appreciate not being yelled at. And of being presented with a balanced narrative.
Kudos, thanks
I’m an enfp!!!
Have you been in touch with the sisters that converted you?
"Wait, lemme get this straight, it's insensitive to Native Americans to say that a fraudulent, racist, culturally imperialistic book is false?
"I might need to write that down."
#CognitiveDissonance
Althusser is the best way to answer this question.
I’d love to visit Utah looks nice I like religious people in general, judge or not, lol
What does “church broke” mean? I have never heard that one before. Context of how you used it suggests indoctrination?
Yes, basically that they’ll do anything for the church!
@@ZelphOntheShelf thank you
Like a pimps hooker.
She broke bro.
She dont think fo hershelf
Something that’s good in my life right now....I love my Job. :)
Something bad...I just want to live with my wife but she is working rurally for another week. :/
Curious Tapir congrats! Not everybody can say that!
Zelph On the Shelf haha thanks.
How do you curl your hair? Such wave envy
With a straightener! I have naturally curly hair so I just do it once and it stays like that until I wash it!
The question about the wife being out of town would no doubt be answered with something about it leading to thinking about adultery
Good thing(s): 1. I'm figuring what I'm passionate about 2. I'm finding an Ex-Mormon community. 3. I'm learning that it's okay to criticize the Church and will eventually reach a place where I realize it's good to criticize it and say the honest truth.
Challenging thing(s): 1. I have two very close friends who are in different places in a "progressive" Mormon journey, and I am glad they are making the Church a little ish better for marginalized people, but I am nearly driven mad by the fact that if I tried to warn them, they probably wouldn't understand and would maybe distance themselves from me until later on.
2. I can't decide whether or through what avenue to go to graduate school. I'm really passionate about medical queer fertility issues. I'm also really passionate about the environment and climate change. I love policy and academic economics (not FOXNews bullshit). I'm really crazy torn. Good problem to have, but I'm running out of decision time as to what I do immediately following undergrad. 3. I sometimes struggle with knowing what my culture is, post-Mormonism. These communities help with that, but like if I marry my partner I don't have a culture to bring to the table with him and I don't want to appropriate items from other folks cultures, even though I gain so much understanding from other people.
4. Are any other ex-mos out there also a little traumatized by collared shirts? Although professionalism is often a cultural and gender litmus test, how do you face these workplace requirements that don't suit how you see yourself and what you want to project forward?
Something good: I'm learning to love myself now that I no longer feel guilty about who I am!!!!!!
Something not so good(besides work that is a given): my boys are going to spend summer with thier dad in a few weeks out of state and I will miss thier cute lil faces.
Ahh hope you’re able to find enjoyment in those few weeks! I can’t imagine how tough that would be! 💜
@@ZelphOntheShelf yeah I'm secretly excited when they are gone so I don't have to be a responsible mom but they are cute and uncle dad does undo good behavior. Shhhh dont tell my boys....lmfao.
Great
Tanner is such an Enfp; that’s why he’s so likable
Omg you guys know MBTI too 😭 how on earth are you real!!!! (INFJ here!)
Something good in my life: After 8 months of pain, 2 doctors, and 3 physical therapists, I finally know what's wrong with my hurt knee.
Something I'm struggling with: This is probably because I just recently learned about church history, but I'm having a difficult time trying not to get my family to leave the church. They're happy in it, and they believe 100%, but it just kills me inside knowing they're in a cult.
Jonny Jonville Jonathan glad you got your knee figured out! And yeah, it can be really hard with family. Sorry you’re going through that!
Jonny,
Your problem is not because of what you see, it's because of what you haven't seen.
All these videos and channels about particular topics of the church, have you ever realised how much the producers are hiding from you and their audiences?
Here's one part Critics fail to share with you.
www.fairmormon.org/answers/Criticism_of_Mormonism/Online_documents/Letter_to_a_CES_Director
About 70% of Jeremy's letters are intentional lies and partial truths designed to deceive members. Like this video, do you know how much Jeremy failed to mention on each topic in his letters?
@greenrussvet
Oh thank you, "lots of love".
You don't need to love me greenrussvet
Wait I thought that Zelph on the Shelf were a married couple who got married while they were part of the church...How did they meet?
We’ve been best friends since college!
My mission president told us he went into Thomas Monson's office and President Monson opened a secret door in the wall to reveal....
...a load of World War 2 movies. And here I was told that the apostles only watch U rated films.
warship
i prefer we'reship
Miguel Aveiro nobody tells me I can’t watch 18 stuff outlander, Rome, Spartacus etc.
What does Zelph mean? I'm a resent exmormon and still don't understand a lot of the stuff.
Mamma Ferret Google “Zelph Joseph Smith” and there’s a whole Wikipedia entry about it.
Brigham Young was the racist who orchestrated the murders of Joseph, Hyrum and many others. Joseph Smith started a church called the Church of Christ and taught that if anyone teaches or live polygamy unless God outright commands it, will be excommunicated from the church. There were about 40k members of the Church of Christ and they all "owned" the church in-common. Brigham (an agent with a bulge-bracket investment bank called Kuhn Loeb & Company and Rotschild subsidiary) led about 4k or so people away from Joseph and started his own church called the "Church of Latter-day Saints". Brigham taught and lived polygamy and hated black people. Joseph conferred priesthood in 15 black men in his day, and in his US presidential platform, Joseph said he would free all the slaves. After Joseph was murdered, the historian for Brigham's church (Willard Richards) got busy re-writing history. One of the people Brigham had killed was a friend of Joseph Smith (named James Strang). Strang was assassinated on the banks of the great lakes and his assassin escaped on a US Navy boat. Brigham moved his people out west and decades after Brigham had passed, Brigham's church was renamed, "Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints". All these name changes that Brigham's church went through are on the corporate registry for Illinois and Utah, among other places.
Honestly I feel like if it affects you how people think of you then you give them to much credit I’ve been a ex no for 3 years now and haven’t really had a bad experience with my family bc I walk around proud of my decisions and therefore they don’t say anything to me about it
Where is Paddington?
Tanners talent would be the ability to grow the most outrageously great long hair for a man!!!! So jealous!!!!
Sam and Tanner amazingly have the same hairstyle more often than not. That’s talented. 😂
I like reading the Book of Mormon. Even when I was in my Faith Crisis. I still read it. I asked myself if it was false, and maybe it was, it was a relative conclusion. The more I read the closer I felt to Christ. So if it's historical side was not accurate, it didn't matter to me anymore. But as time went on I felt the truthfulness of it. I embraced it and told myself that I would continue to embrace it whether it was just inspired document from Joseph and others. Trust me, I went through my own journey of questioning. But why do critics hate on it so much? there is only much to gain from it like parables and examples of following true principles. If we believe in Christ and if he were to handle the book and examine it's contents, he would only say it edified. I have decided that It's true enough for me to keep it a part of my life for good.
Thank you.
ever since leaving the church I've gained a large appreciation for anime tibbys
Good thing: I have a girlfriend who's absolutely amazing
Bad thing: my parents are making me pay tithing on my job while I could be keeping that money for college. Every time I bring up that I'm an adult and can do what I want, they threaten to kick me out. I would love to leave, but still have to look for options.
Hannah James as soon as you can get to college never pay tithing again its guilt trip money making scam, loads of people can’t afford 10 per cent I refused that’s why I left after only a month. No body tells me how to run home finances. Good luck
Go Get'm,,,,, ya hoooooooooooo,,, truth is freedom
If any Lds member says the problem with the churchs culture is through people and not the church respond and say Matthew 12:33"Either make the tree good and its fruit good ,or else make the tree bad and its fruit bad ;for a tree is known by its fruit." the only way to show the Mormons they are living lies is through love and their main enemy Jesus in the New Testament. Matthew 7:15-20 also talks about this in in versus 20 it reads," Therefore by their fruits you will know them." showing them wrong through anger causes resentment but showing them love and kindness will force them to open their hearts.
I honestly think that the GAs all believe it, and the mechanism of the church enables them to continue to believe it
i go with if people want to follow a religion i let them if they don't they don't.
Have you heard of the Kalam Cosmological Argument, The Teleological, or the Ontological Argument for God's Existence? All three are challenging me to believe in God. Please Google and comment back, I would love to hear if you have heard of these and some of the others!!!!!!!!
finding it really funny how watching atheist channels is giving me ads for online Christian miistry training
I remember going to a ward while visiting a friend in Sandy, Utah, while i was still a member. I'm from Dallas. They treated me like trash. I sat in the middle and they purposely sat away from me. It looked like a circle with a dot in the middle. They didn't even want to be near me. I got so fed up I walked back to my friend's house. Juxtapose that with my visit to a Miami ward and they welcomed me and everyone got to know me. Utah Mormons are assholes.
I like to ask Mormons to specify what specific sins I have committed. They can’t come up with any, except I must have sinned because I’m an ex-Mormon.
To go to the Celestial kingdom the highest domain of heaven, you have to be Mormon.
@@drhypno6317 And you know this because?