You explained it well. Have always heard was balanced valve. The pressure assist makes more sense. Do you know if the P3 valve will work in the problematic P2. Friend has replaced P2 valve 3 times now. Still doesn't work. I know he would never buy another RTI.If we can put the P3 valve in. He might feel better about the RTI brand
Thanks for the info. Whilst it is good to move forward/adapt ...maybe sometimes.. I think i will miss the ease of use and working of what i enjoyed of RTI. Just seems more of to go wrong that was never there or a problem before. Just gives me interpretation to go forward with it. Maybe will go for it after a long while after we see/hear results
I appreciate all the R&D from RTI and I’m watching the P3 closely. I have two Prophet Performance P1s. I only shoot pellets and love the simplicity and reliability of my P1s. I’m not certain what problem RTI is trying to solve via moving to a balanced valve. I will have to be convinced that it will benefit us pellet shooters. If the sole purpose is to provide more power for slug shooting, then I’ll stick with my P1s. (maybe even buy a nice used 3rd P1, lol)
You are absolutely right. P-3 does not bring any advantages to you if you use only pellets and you shoot at moderate powers. You might get the benefit of slightly higher efficiency and bigger shot count due to the fact that you could get the same power at lower pressure with P-3. You are also right about complexity. It might seems like I am against advancement and P-3 in general but that is not the case at all, I am just simply giving honest answer to direct question and your needs. I prefer P-3 because I do love to shoot at higher powers, also , those higher powers not only enable to use slugs but also bigger calibres while still retaining the option for low powers and efficiency. The sacrifice is more complexity. I would continue to use your P1's if I were you.
Thanks for the information, I have once told you that I have Rti prophet 2 and that after the first mistakes of the valve it was correct and I am very happy, now for me I do not see that it is all an advantage that the assisted valve discharges so suddenly The air in the barrel seems a bit abrupt to me and could affect the precision, that's why my question is the new Rti Mora has a device that can regulate the passage of air enough to attenuate the air blow, I mean the one that is close of the variable regulator pressure gauge is like a wingnut that can be turned, thanks
This could only be an issue for pellets, not for slugs. But when you shoot pellets, you can set the pressure to ridiculous low levels and get excellent accuracy. I have teste a few pellets already and the accuracy is excellent. I have a lot of videos already prepared but I am just struggling for time to exit them...
Honestly I did not keep the P2 after the videos I made, so I cannot compare. I do still have P-3 and I intend to keep it. I didn't have problems so far and also the main goal of P-3 was to address the issues with P2 and add features... Also, I get RTI products in very early stage, most of them are still in prototype or preproduction stage, so my experiences might not be what other people have.
Hello Gregor, I have a problem with the P3 which comes up very frequently: I have air leak from the breach, which indicates a faulty valve I suppose. The valve itself and the chamber look o.k, as well as the valve housing, tgerefore is it correct to assume that the problem may be the o ring that goes over the housing and seats in the guns action ? How xan I remove this without scratching the surrounding netal ? Im I correct in assuming that this is the problem ? I really look forward to your reply. Many thanks
It is possible that the problem is that o-ring, but I still put bigger probability to the valve even if you don't see that there is anything wrong with it. I never had to remove that seal, but you are right, it is quite risky. There is a similar O-ring on K1 and KG1 that I did had to replace and it was a nightmare. One of my viewers actually made me a tool to for this removal afterwards that is basically a bent needle tip on a longer thicker rod. The trick it to just pierce through the o-ring and not go all the way to the aluminium. But I would still put my bet on the valve. Try to replace that first... BTW: can you hear the leak? If so, odes it sound different at different pressures? Does the sound different after each shot? Also possible is that the o-ring in the chamber where the valve goes in (and the valve spring) is leaking. Actually, that one is higher probability than the one you mentioned as well.
@@gregorkamensek3923 Thank you for your reply. I can gear the leak, less noisy at the begining but becoming louder and constand after I take a few more of shots. No difference at different bottle pressures until the bottle is completely empty
@@andreascharalambous6992 OK. that helps. Can you also check to what pressure the regulated pressure raises? It is possible that if the pressure does not get high enough that the valve does not seal... You should get to at least about 150 bars, then dry fire it a few times. This helps the valve to properly seat. All this is with assumption that the valve is not sealing which most likely scenario. If you have possibility, try to get another valve and when you replace it also replace the o-ring in the valve chamber...
@gregorkamensek3923 thanks Gregor, this means that I shall have to increase the reg. pressure to 150 bar or higher. I shall do as you recommend, let us hope it works.
Hi. I'm having a problem with my p3. I'm getting a small puff of air and a ping from the top of the butt pad. In-between the top of pad and body of the rifle.
Have you experienced an issue with the regulator of the P3? For me it seems the reg is sticking. So not filling after every shot. Or filling very slow. The reg is not screwed in too far so it does not block the air going in to the low pressure tube...
@@gregorkamensek3923 I mean the issue I have is not that the regulator is too far screwed into the regulator body (this closes a via hole so that air won't go quickly through the regulator). My question is did you encounter any issues with the regulator? I have installed a digital gauge on the low pressure part and it seems the regulator sticks / does not let any air through after a shot. Only after a few shots air is let through but even then it is very slow to get back to the set point.
@@AirgunNLOk, I understand. I did not have this issue, but I do see a potential scenario to have this issue when shooting at relatively low powers / small calibres. It could happen because the plenum is extremely big and the regulator have some hysteresis... Can you tell me what is your reg pressure setting and how much does the pressure drop after the shot?
Honestly, I don't know. It is still very similar to P2 so I don't know if it actually makes any sense. Most of the things that are actually different are explained in this video...
It is virtually the same, maybe slightly easier to service... P2 valve might produce ever so slightly higher power but the difference is so small it would be hard to notice.
Gregor nice video and explanation can I ask you something: if I mount the rpb barrel on a prophet 1 or priest that have only 1 screw to lock the barrel it need the oring under the screw or not? Thank you!
Thanks. It is recommended that you have an o-ring, otherwise you will have slight blowby. It will not effect the power and accuracy in a noticeable way though and you will barely be able to notice the blowby...
@@gregorkamensek3923Perfect thank you ! Another question the new valve can be mounted on the priest/prophet block aswell or only on prophet 2 and 3 ? Thank you !!
@@kasakikasaki1880 The P-3 has a complete redesign of the body so there is not much backwards compatibility. RTI build the first pressure assisted system with P2 which was basically modified P1, but there turned out to be some issues because assisted valves are more sensitive to correctly seal, so the moved very fast to P-3 which has completely rebuild body for pressure assisted system...
Hy Gregor , if one is looking for shoot some heavy slugs (like 40gr in .22 or 50/60 gr in .25) at very high power , it needs max valve dwell so to achive it , wich is the best method to reduce the hole diameter in the valve stem? Maube filling it with some matherial and redrill a smaller hole ? If the hole is 0.8mm , wich would be a good new size ? 0.5 or 0.4 mm ? Would be nice if rti or some good tuners ( like you 😁) could modify the valve stem for high power / heavy slugs shooters .
Hi. If you test and you find that you are getting lower power with 40 grain than with lower weight, then you can use one of the methods I mentiond as you described your self but I would rather enlarge the cup/cilinder volume in which the valve rides... That is much easier. You can drill the hole to be deeper (but be careful that you don't drill through it). I would advise to use 4,5 mm drill bit so the valve spring still sits on the same position (If I recall correctly, the spring diameter is 5 mm but you should check to make sure). If you prefer to reduce the hole diameter in the valve instead, just keep in mind that the effect will be the square to diameter (for example, if you decrease the hole to half the current diameter, the valve will stay opened 4x as long at it was before). Not sure what is the best option to reduce the hole size, the air flow and pressure through that hole is quite high so whatever you do, make sure it is firmly attached to the valve.
Hi, Good vid, well explained. Maybe this question has been asked before, but what are the limits concerning heavier slugs? Are 68 grain .30 Zan or 40 grain .22 Zan ok to shoot without valve-closing issues? Thanks.
Ok, good news. I have a custom .30 700mm barrel which works fine on P1 performance with 50.15 gr. That gives me on average 140 joules, but thats the limit regarding hammersping tension. The idea is to buy P3 naked and build it using P1 parts, 700mm barrel and shoot heavier slugs. Now that there seems no issue with the valve and heavier slugs, i can continue. Thanks.
@@JV-rg1udI can tell you that I got about 180 joules with JSB slugs and 187 joules with 100 grain zan slug with 9 mm 700 mm barrel... I believe the reg was at about 180 bars...
Ok nice, assuming you got 180 joule with .30 jsb(50.15) out of a P3 with 700mm barrel? If you got it out of a P1 it would be very impressive and then I have a lot of tuning to do.
Constant development by RTI. The assisted valve when perfected is a excellent method. Those of us with the troublesome P2 will probably be better off replacing the block for the latest P3 version. Will that be a option offered?
RTI made a very rookie mistake this launch. Their review for western Europe by AAR was really bad, they probably gave him poor material compared to this guy, which even has a cut block. This completely changes my opinion on the gun. It is really a shame, because there are very few (and small, obviously) serious channels that arent FX chills and a launch of this kind could tip the game in RTIs favour.
Hallo Gregor, It has taken a LONG time to get this video but I can now appreciate how RTI has accomplished this task. Very nice that the valve seat at the opening of the throat is a separate component so that if something strange happens and the valve leaks, which is what I was afraid of, the whole part can be replaced without sacrificing the the gun body. How are you finding leakage through the rear chamber?
You mean the rear bleed valve? Or the blowby if the o-ring is not inserted on the valve steam? Bleed valve is OK, I use it frequently if I need to empty the gun. I don't have an o-ring inserted and I don't notice any blowby...
Thanks :) The gun is tuned to get about max power at the pressure range it is designed for. You should only make changes to the hole if you know what you are doing (not just based on my video), so a good criteria would be: "if you don't know what hole I am talking about, then don't mess with it". I mean no disrespect with this statement, just consider this before you make mods as these mods would be what I would reserve only for "experts"... The hole I am referring to is the tinny hole that is in the valve stem.
@@gregorkamensek3923 ok gregor grazie mille gentilissimo come sempre un ultima cosa che ti chiedo il martello della Prophet 1 può andare bene per la Prophet 2? Dato che lo spillo della valvola è il secondo martello che mi rompe grazie mille
@@gregorkamensek3923 ok gregor i Could put the Hammer of the Prophet 1 on the Prophet 2 because they are 2 hammers that the valve needle breaks on the p2
@@matteopierotti7687Ok, that is better. The hammer of P1 is too heavy for P2 because P2 already uses assisted valve. But I doubt that the hammer is to blame that the vale needle breaks...
I have a RTI #1 and a # 2 I was told before putting my money down the 22 had the RPB barrel that shoots slugs and pellets well, Well my gun has a LW barrel, I was sent a new and improved valve that I had to install my self, That sucked. Now you tell me all this new stuff on the RTI P 3 ,, I got kind of burned on what you say and what you sell,, So I am going to pass and look for a gun that is a little more honest ,,, Mike Williams
Mike, I'm not actually 100% sure what you are saying. Can you be more specific about the barrel type and elaborate on what happened regarding the 'New and Improved' valve?
I put my money down on a RTI P 2 with all the hype about the new barrel RPB Barrel I was sent a 22 P2 with a LW barrel, Whats so confusing about that, When I ask about it I was told the RPB barrel does not come in 510 mm ... I should have been told that upfront .Someone on the AGN site sent me a new valve everyone had problems with, I changed it out and the new valve seems to be working alright. @@redgum1340
p3 the worst garbage I bought, bad trip valve, hammer breaks, bad pressure regulator, bad sidelever, rti must change all the engineering if you want to continue selling because they are a disaster
Awesome video! A lot of good stuff on the P3! Thanks for sharing
You explained it well. Have always heard was balanced valve. The pressure assist makes more sense. Do you know if the P3 valve will work in the problematic P2. Friend has replaced P2 valve 3 times now. Still doesn't work. I know he would never buy another RTI.If we can put the P3 valve in. He might feel better about the RTI brand
It won't fit in P2 unfortunately.
P2 buyers were just guinea pigs. Me included.
Lesson learnt.
Thanks for the info. Whilst it is good to move forward/adapt ...maybe sometimes.. I think i will miss the ease of use and working of what i enjoyed of RTI. Just seems more of to go wrong that was never there or a problem before. Just gives me interpretation to go forward with it. Maybe will go for it after a long while after we see/hear results
Always moving forward.
I appreciate all the R&D from RTI and I’m watching the P3 closely. I have two Prophet
Performance P1s. I only shoot pellets and love the simplicity and reliability of my P1s.
I’m not certain what problem RTI is trying to solve via moving to a balanced valve. I will have to be convinced that it will benefit us pellet shooters. If the sole purpose is to provide more power for slug shooting, then I’ll stick with my P1s. (maybe even buy a nice used 3rd P1, lol)
You are absolutely right. P-3 does not bring any advantages to you if you use only pellets and you shoot at moderate powers. You might get the benefit of slightly higher efficiency and bigger shot count due to the fact that you could get the same power at lower pressure with P-3.
You are also right about complexity.
It might seems like I am against advancement and P-3 in general but that is not the case at all, I am just simply giving honest answer to direct question and your needs. I prefer P-3 because I do love to shoot at higher powers, also , those higher powers not only enable to use slugs but also bigger calibres while still retaining the option for low powers and efficiency. The sacrifice is more complexity.
I would continue to use your P1's if I were you.
Thanks for the information, I have once told you that I have Rti prophet 2 and that after the first mistakes of the valve it was correct and I am very happy, now for me I do not see that it is all an advantage that the assisted valve discharges so suddenly The air in the barrel seems a bit abrupt to me and could affect the precision, that's why my question is the new Rti Mora has a device that can regulate the passage of air enough to attenuate the air blow, I mean the one that is close of the variable regulator pressure gauge is like a wingnut that can be turned, thanks
This could only be an issue for pellets, not for slugs. But when you shoot pellets, you can set the pressure to ridiculous low levels and get excellent accuracy. I have teste a few pellets already and the accuracy is excellent. I have a lot of videos already prepared but I am just struggling for time to exit them...
Dober video!
Hvala
Ni za kaj :)
Hi Gregor.Good video.Just want to find out, how does the reliability on P3 compare to P2?
Honestly I did not keep the P2 after the videos I made, so I cannot compare. I do still have P-3 and I intend to keep it. I didn't have problems so far and also the main goal of P-3 was to address the issues with P2 and add features... Also, I get RTI products in very early stage, most of them are still in prototype or preproduction stage, so my experiences might not be what other people have.
Hello Gregor, I have a problem with the P3 which comes up very frequently: I have air leak from the breach, which indicates a faulty valve I suppose. The valve itself and the chamber look o.k, as well as the valve housing, tgerefore is it correct to assume that the problem may be the o ring that goes over the housing and seats in the guns action ? How xan I remove this without scratching the surrounding netal ?
Im I correct in assuming that this is the problem ?
I really look forward to your reply. Many thanks
It is possible that the problem is that o-ring, but I still put bigger probability to the valve even if you don't see that there is anything wrong with it. I never had to remove that seal, but you are right, it is quite risky. There is a similar O-ring on K1 and KG1 that I did had to replace and it was a nightmare. One of my viewers actually made me a tool to for this removal afterwards that is basically a bent needle tip on a longer thicker rod. The trick it to just pierce through the o-ring and not go all the way to the aluminium. But I would still put my bet on the valve. Try to replace that first... BTW: can you hear the leak? If so, odes it sound different at different pressures? Does the sound different after each shot?
Also possible is that the o-ring in the chamber where the valve goes in (and the valve spring) is leaking. Actually, that one is higher probability than the one you mentioned as well.
@@gregorkamensek3923 Thank you for your reply. I can gear the leak, less noisy at the begining but becoming louder and constand after I take a few more of shots. No difference at different bottle pressures until the bottle is completely empty
@@andreascharalambous6992 OK. that helps. Can you also check to what pressure the regulated pressure raises? It is possible that if the pressure does not get high enough that the valve does not seal... You should get to at least about 150 bars, then dry fire it a few times. This helps the valve to properly seat. All this is with assumption that the valve is not sealing which most likely scenario. If you have possibility, try to get another valve and when you replace it also replace the o-ring in the valve chamber...
@gregorkamensek3923 thanks Gregor, this means that I shall have to increase the reg. pressure to 150 bar or higher. I shall do as you recommend, let us hope it works.
Hi. I'm having a problem with my p3. I'm getting a small puff of air and a ping from the top of the butt pad. In-between the top of pad and body of the rifle.
Straight into my ear.
Have you experienced an issue with the regulator of the P3? For me it seems the reg is sticking. So not filling after every shot. Or filling very slow. The reg is not screwed in too far so it does not block the air going in to the low pressure tube...
Not sure I understand your issue correctly. Is the stainless part not screwed in correctly?
@@gregorkamensek3923 I mean the issue I have is not that the regulator is too far screwed into the regulator body (this closes a via hole so that air won't go quickly through the regulator). My question is did you encounter any issues with the regulator? I have installed a digital gauge on the low pressure part and it seems the regulator sticks / does not let any air through after a shot. Only after a few shots air is let through but even then it is very slow to get back to the set point.
@@AirgunNLOk, I understand. I did not have this issue, but I do see a potential scenario to have this issue when shooting at relatively low powers / small calibres. It could happen because the plenum is extremely big and the regulator have some hysteresis... Can you tell me what is your reg pressure setting and how much does the pressure drop after the shot?
@@gregorkamensek3923 reg is set to about 145 bar. Default plenum size. Caliber is .25.
Pressure drop is about 3-5 bar I think.
@@AirgunNL OK, thanks for the info. It is possible that it is a regulator problem. I would definitely have it checked out...
Hey Gregor, any plans to do a disassembly/assembly video on the the P-3?
Honestly, I don't know. It is still very similar to P2 so I don't know if it actually makes any sense. Most of the things that are actually different are explained in this video...
Thank you for the video. Well explained. How does it compare with the assisted valve design of the Prophet 2?
It is virtually the same, maybe slightly easier to service... P2 valve might produce ever so slightly higher power but the difference is so small it would be hard to notice.
I should point out that I haven't focused on disassembly of P2, I was only talking performance wise...
Gregor nice video and explanation can I ask you something: if I mount the rpb barrel on a prophet 1 or priest that have only 1 screw to lock the barrel it need the oring under the screw or not? Thank you!
Thanks. It is recommended that you have an o-ring, otherwise you will have slight blowby. It will not effect the power and accuracy in a noticeable way though and you will barely be able to notice the blowby...
@@gregorkamensek3923Perfect thank you ! Another question the new valve can be mounted on the priest/prophet block aswell or only on prophet 2 and 3 ? Thank you !!
@@kasakikasaki1880 The P-3 has a complete redesign of the body so there is not much backwards compatibility. RTI build the first pressure assisted system with P2 which was basically modified P1, but there turned out to be some issues because assisted valves are more sensitive to correctly seal, so the moved very fast to P-3 which has completely rebuild body for pressure assisted system...
Hy Gregor , if one is looking for shoot some heavy slugs (like 40gr in .22 or 50/60 gr in .25) at very high power , it needs max valve dwell so to achive it , wich is the best method to reduce the hole diameter in the valve stem? Maube filling it with some matherial and redrill a smaller hole ? If the hole is 0.8mm , wich would be a good new size ? 0.5 or 0.4 mm ? Would be nice if rti or some good tuners ( like you 😁) could modify the valve stem for high power / heavy slugs shooters .
Hi. If you test and you find that you are getting lower power with 40 grain than with lower weight, then you can use one of the methods I mentiond as you described your self but I would rather enlarge the cup/cilinder volume in which the valve rides... That is much easier. You can drill the hole to be deeper (but be careful that you don't drill through it). I would advise to use 4,5 mm drill bit so the valve spring still sits on the same position (If I recall correctly, the spring diameter is 5 mm but you should check to make sure).
If you prefer to reduce the hole diameter in the valve instead, just keep in mind that the effect will be the square to diameter (for example, if you decrease the hole to half the current diameter, the valve will stay opened 4x as long at it was before). Not sure what is the best option to reduce the hole size, the air flow and pressure through that hole is quite high so whatever you do, make sure it is firmly attached to the valve.
Hi,
Good vid, well explained.
Maybe this question has been asked before, but what are the limits concerning heavier slugs?
Are 68 grain .30 Zan or 40 grain .22 Zan ok to shoot without valve-closing issues?
Thanks.
I haven't tested those in particular, but I tested 100 grain in 9 mm with 700 mm barrel so there should be any issues with .30 68 grain either.
Ok, good news.
I have a custom .30 700mm barrel which works fine on P1 performance with 50.15 gr.
That gives me on average 140 joules, but thats the limit regarding hammersping tension.
The idea is to buy P3 naked and build it using P1 parts, 700mm barrel and shoot heavier slugs.
Now that there seems no issue with the valve and heavier slugs, i can continue.
Thanks.
@@JV-rg1udI can tell you that I got about 180 joules with JSB slugs and 187 joules with 100 grain zan slug with 9 mm 700 mm barrel... I believe the reg was at about 180 bars...
Ok nice, assuming you got 180 joule with .30 jsb(50.15) out of a P3 with 700mm barrel?
If you got it out of a P1 it would be very impressive and then I have a lot of tuning to do.
Or are both 9mm / 700mm?
Constant development by RTI.
The assisted valve when perfected is a excellent method.
Those of us with the troublesome P2 will probably be better off replacing the block for the latest P3 version.
Will that be a option offered?
Honestly. I don't know, I had the P2 for very brief time and I did not focus on the assembly as I did on P-3
Cuánto sería la autonomía
RTI made a very rookie mistake this launch. Their review for western Europe by AAR was really bad, they probably gave him poor material compared to this guy, which even has a cut block. This completely changes my opinion on the gun.
It is really a shame, because there are very few (and small, obviously) serious channels that arent FX chills and a launch of this kind could tip the game in RTIs favour.
Hallo Gregor, It has taken a LONG time to get this video but I can now appreciate how RTI has accomplished this task. Very nice that the valve seat at the opening of the throat is a separate component so that if something strange happens and the valve leaks, which is what I was afraid of, the whole part can be replaced without sacrificing the the gun body. How are you finding leakage through the rear chamber?
You mean the rear bleed valve? Or the blowby if the o-ring is not inserted on the valve steam?
Bleed valve is OK, I use it frequently if I need to empty the gun. I don't have an o-ring inserted and I don't notice any blowby...
Ciao gregor il buco da stingere quale sarebbe quello dietro o il buco dello spillo? E quanta potenza si ottiene di più ? Grazie gregor sei il migliore
Thanks :) The gun is tuned to get about max power at the pressure range it is designed for. You should only make changes to the hole if you know what you are doing (not just based on my video), so a good criteria would be: "if you don't know what hole I am talking about, then don't mess with it". I mean no disrespect with this statement, just consider this before you make mods as these mods would be what I would reserve only for "experts"... The hole I am referring to is the tinny hole that is in the valve stem.
@@gregorkamensek3923 ok gregor grazie mille gentilissimo come sempre un ultima cosa che ti chiedo il martello della Prophet 1 può andare bene per la Prophet 2? Dato che lo spillo della valvola è il secondo martello che mi rompe grazie mille
@@matteopierotti7687Not sure I understand, I think that google translator is not properly translating. Can you write in English?
@@gregorkamensek3923 ok gregor i Could put the Hammer of the Prophet 1 on the Prophet 2 because they are 2 hammers that the valve needle breaks on the p2
@@matteopierotti7687Ok, that is better. The hammer of P1 is too heavy for P2 because P2 already uses assisted valve. But I doubt that the hammer is to blame that the vale needle breaks...
I have a RTI #1 and a # 2 I was told before putting my money down the 22 had the RPB barrel that shoots slugs and pellets well, Well my gun has a LW barrel, I was sent a new and improved valve that I had to install my self, That sucked. Now you tell me all this new stuff on the RTI P 3 ,, I got kind of burned on what you say and what you sell,, So I am going to pass and look for a gun that is a little more honest ,,,
Mike Williams
I am sorry this happened to you. I wish you all the best.
Mike, I'm not actually 100% sure what you are saying. Can you be more specific about the barrel type and elaborate on what happened regarding the 'New and Improved' valve?
I put my money down on a RTI P 2 with all the hype about the new barrel RPB Barrel I was sent a 22 P2 with a LW barrel, Whats so confusing about that, When I ask about it I was told the RPB barrel does not come in 510 mm ...
I should have been told that upfront .Someone on the AGN site sent me a new valve everyone had problems with, I changed it out and the new valve seems to be working alright.
@@redgum1340
Very robust looking parts.
p3 the worst garbage I bought, bad trip valve, hammer breaks, bad pressure regulator, bad sidelever, rti must change all the engineering if you want to continue selling because they are a disaster