IF transistors that were very popular in the 70-80s in Europe were the BF198 (for agc stage) and the BF199. Just a suggestion for a p/n to try. Also, another RF transistor for quite universal uses still in production is the KSP10 (former MPSH10) available in TO92 and SOT23 packages.
Very intriguing. I remember the TV techs couldn't fix our TV back in the early 70's, so my father bought a new one. I wish I had someone like you back then to fix it. It was a black bar, 1/3 of the screen, slowly moving from top the bottom. Smacking the TV sometimes helped, but it kept coming back.
Sounds like power line AC hum getting into the signal. Could be a filter cap, but it also might be a heater to cathode short. If that was in the picture tube, it would have been time to get a new set.
In context, many of the repair technicians chronological this set would have never gotten far into the troubleshooting and never to repair. Here are the Vintage Television Repair Eras and usual mood of the technicians. 1950-1970, almost every job is tubes and wired chassis. RCA platform and highly consistent issues. Hybrids are zero to little. Buying a home and making family. 1965-1980, printed circuit boards are replacing all new manufacturing of televisions. Tubes and CRTs are baking the PCs. New problem with PC breaks. But mostly RCA derivatives so troubleshooting is straightforward. Kids are fun and my wife is still hot. 1970-1980, hybrid sets and the mix of tubes, more powerful than ever CRTs, ovenexcated the PCs, one off transistors, and first-generation demodulation ICs. Rerun RCA platforms were gone from new manufactured sets, so circuit and system designs were often newish. Transistors were odd and theoretical. All kinds of heat, intermittents, etc. Manufacturing standards were declining in this stretch. Why the heck did I get married?
The funny thing is that the tv, with over 7,000 operating hours, has been in use longer than the average newly purchased flat screen television gets before it is thrown away 👍
That's not true at all. My LG 32GK650F has 10289 Hours total power on time. There are still loads of old 1080p plasma TVs about. Market place is flooded with them and lots of people use them as bedroom TVs
@kinkykane0607 We have an old Sony Bravio from 2008 with CFL back lighting and it's been operated daily for 12 hours a day for 16 years. Still works like new. That's about 70,000 hours.
How interesting the solid state components are failing and the vacuum tubes are surviving! I guess transistors of this set's era were not up to modern standards of reliability or tolerance.
Funny though cause I've seen plastic early 2000's tv's that have been running in doctors offices with probably 10yrs power on time at this point, evident by dust caked on the wall behind them just from convective air flow. No repairs obviously, and still watchable. So they clearly figured out the transistor problem eventually. I'd bet that if capacitors were better, the all tube sets would do the same.
(@17:28) It looks like there’s a crack in the PCB between L212 and L213, but maybe it’s just a hair, or a spiderweb. The innards of the set are more interesting than the front of the set. 😊 The nice warm glow of the filament-filled vacuum bulbs. 😅
Percussive troubleshooting is an old school technique. Use all the senses, listen, look, smell, feel for heat, use cold and hot. I have seen automotive mechanics lick the dipstick to check for gas and coolant in the oil, but I don't think I would do that, well perhaps a 9 volt transistor battery.
A surface mount transistor in a 1960's Packard Bell TV? I'm sitting here thinking to myself, "This is a test! This is ONLY a test! This is ONLY a test!" lol🤣
When I have to solder to a SOT23 package, I put it on a solder perfboard. At an angle you can solder all the pins on the 0.1" grid. Then solder large wires to the board.
I've seen these kind of faults before it is most likely a semiconductor junction fracture, either a transistor base emitter junction break or diode the best way to track this is freezer gas. Also if using a higher frequency transistor than the circuit requires, can amplify unwanted noise. Small noise signals often get discarded through a circuit if it has low band pass, but if you chose a higher frequency transistor that operates outside the normal bandwidth of the signal path it can act as an antenna and introduce harmonics into the signal path.
Even if it’’s fused internally it wouldn’t hurt to externally fuse it. That way if it crowbars you would just have to change the external fuse and not have to open up the device to change the internal fuse. Ricky from IBM
Interesting to see that the transistors are failing before the remaining unchanged electrolytic capacitors. Also that such an old C.R.T. is still showing very good emissions. I suppose it was relatively early days for transistors in T.Vs. and their reliability after so long unused can't have been improving over time...
We had a Philco-Ford hybrid with an IF transistor open (forget which stage). Replaced with an ECG equivalent. It "worked' sort of, but AGC action was screwed up. Rather than trying to re-engineer it, ordered the proprietary Philco transistor by part#, and that fixed it.
There are certain applications when only the original part will work - that IF stage is one of them. I remember repairing a Hitachi SS TV in the 80s for a vertical problem, and I could not get the linearity acceptable (tried ECGs, SKs, HEPs, etc.) I ordered the originals from Hitachi (they were also germaniums to boot!) and that fixed it.
I installed the DC version of that meter about a year ago to measure the yield from my solar panels, so far so good. It looks the same but comes with shunt rather than a current transformer. When it gets up to 1000Wh the meter switches to display kWh and it counts up to at least 999kWh.
I have a DC version with shunt on the inverter battery input, going into the 4th year of 24/7 operation and it just clicked over to 1401 kwhrs total energy delivered to the inverter since spring of 2020, so they do roll past 999 kwhrs .
you have to be careful replacing tv IF transistors as some may need to be a 'forward gain control' type, the gain reduces with collector voltage, not bias current like 'normal' types,
The CE marking should be a EU safety certificate. But those ones have the C and the E too close to each other, which is instead a "China Export" marking. You can look up "CE certification real vs fake" to see the comparison between the 2 markings.
Any device that do the product of V*I samples on each sample cicle will get Wh, but if they decided to calculates Irms and Vrms, then, they are let with VA. Still you need to sample V and I and acumulate them during an interval. This is done around 2 or 3K times a sec on meters. Var is easy, same as Wh but with V shifted 90 degrees. This is very easy once you have the qeue of samples, just pick always not the actual one but one is old by 90 degree, tipically the samples used 10 cycles ago (simplified).
I think channel 3 there is picking up the sound of R2-D2 trying to imitate a 56k dial-up faxmodem. Back when a small video would take hours to download, and cost $500 in phone bills. Whoever said the old days were better, well, they suck. 🤣
40:19 So this thing, in its 7327 hours of on time, ingesting 250W power as we saw, burned about 1832 kWh worth of energy. That would cost you here in the north of Italy about 660 Euros... just to watch shitty commercials and brainless TV shop stuff 😅 If this isn't luxury, then what it is? 🤩 To put it in another perspective: that 304 kWh what it consumed since the installation of that meter (which happened maybe around the beginning of November 2023?) is the average 2-months consumption of my _whole_ home - with TV, Hifi, my electronics lab, fridge, lighting, hairdryer etc... _everything_ not just a TV 😅You can imagine what the world's energy demand would be if the technology was still at this vacuum tubes level... 😱
Maybe The news director at Fox 11 wasnt able to get the usual News guy in to talk about the pursuit ,but noticed the Golf commentator was in the building, So the News director thought Why not put the Golf guy on to tell viewers whats going on .
Its mostly because of the temperature changes caused by tubes nearby. Transistor chip itself is still ok, but the incase connection between chip and legs breaks.
My Kenwood TK-60U had a transistor on the IF board that would drop out. If I held the tip of my soldering iron on it and heated it up, it would work for about a month before it would drop out again. My guess is probably tin whiskers. I’d be curious if the same is going on with the transistors in this TV?
Wow - such a great channel! Wondering if you'd be up for repairing a Sony Micro TV 4-203 UW? It's mint externally, needs some love on the inside. Let me know!
Modern TV is so depressing. Don't know what's worse. Canned laughter at those profoundly unfunny script lines. Over the top sports commentary on police pursuit chases. Or the mindless propaganda "experts" gaslighting us how a blatantly rigged erection was like totally fair and honest. The toxicity of the home shopping network pales in comparison. This is why people never watch TV anymore.
The day we cut off the Network Sewer Pipe from entering our home, our mental health began to improve. That was 2011. Shango is the most "TeeVee" that my wife and I see now.
Ooh,that "fat iron " looks intriguing ,perhaps you could open a second channel and give expert commentary and review on the latest HSN product. Are you losing picture tube emission by the way, or high voltage down? On video it just reminds me of a tired picture tube appearance .
How can I contact shango? I have this really really cool tec tel rad radio telephone on its way from eBay. Thing looks like the red phone the president would pick up. 3 channels crystal controlled, tube, not sure if it's on 27mhz but I think so. Can't find any info on it as far as a manual or service data or who made it. I figured he could tell me better where to look, he seems to identify even just bare chassis easily and find data. Maybe I'd see if shango can revive it. I'm a ham general class, upgrading to extra tomorrow actually. 3/2. Anyway I could handle fixing it if I located some data
I wonder if those IF transistors were silicon or germanium? And I'll bet that when the bias pot burned up, it made quite a sm0ke show with 400v across it lol
8:40 - it sounds like a heavy oscillation happening. That could be intermittent... Still haven't seen the rest of the video. Could it be a too strong signal? Edit: after the fix it seems that the amplification is too strong. The picture has a much wider dynamic range than what it is in the previous videos and now it is somewhat unpleasant to watch.
I bought a very nice ITT golf Europe transistor radio that worked perfectly, put it in the cupboard half a year later, I wanted to try it, then the FM band was completely dead. short wave between wave and long wave band still works perfectly
why i got rid of tv nothing on but bs well got that CUE streaming crap now its loads better than att uverce or direct tv by far remind me of old satilight tv and new on-demand mixed
Thanks for keeping us updated! Here's some more help with the operating costs.
Hey Shango! Greetings from Maine. Love your videos. In a local antique store I saw an Admiral from 1949. I have pictures.
Wow, that'll be at 8k hours pretty soon.
This is a great series. Really goes to show how well used some of the old devices are.
IF transistors that were very popular in the 70-80s in Europe were the BF198 (for agc stage) and the BF199. Just a suggestion for a p/n to try. Also, another RF transistor for quite universal uses still in production is the KSP10 (former MPSH10) available in TO92 and SOT23 packages.
Very intriguing. I remember the TV techs couldn't fix our TV back in the early 70's, so my father bought a new one. I wish I had someone like you back then to fix it. It was a black bar, 1/3 of the screen, slowly moving from top the bottom. Smacking the TV sometimes helped, but it kept coming back.
Sounds like power line AC hum getting into the signal. Could be a filter cap, but it also might be a heater to cathode short. If that was in the picture tube, it would have been time to get a new set.
@@russellhltn1396 Sometimes you can isolate a short in the crt with an isolation transformer, cheaper than replacing a crt.
@@zulumax1Yes, but than resolution goes down significantly due to high capacitance of that transformer.
Easy - open ground.
35:40 Had to pause and watch the music video for that song and it just about EOL'd my NEC MultiSync monitor. Thanks for that.
In context, many of the repair technicians chronological this set would have never gotten far into the troubleshooting and never to repair. Here are the Vintage Television Repair Eras and usual mood of the technicians.
1950-1970, almost every job is tubes and wired chassis. RCA platform and highly consistent issues. Hybrids are zero to little. Buying a home and making family.
1965-1980, printed circuit boards are replacing all new manufacturing of televisions. Tubes and CRTs are baking the PCs. New problem with PC breaks. But mostly RCA derivatives so troubleshooting is straightforward. Kids are fun and my wife is still hot.
1970-1980, hybrid sets and the mix of tubes, more powerful than ever CRTs, ovenexcated the PCs, one off transistors, and first-generation demodulation ICs. Rerun RCA platforms were gone from new manufactured sets, so circuit and system designs were often newish. Transistors were odd and theoretical. All kinds of heat, intermittents, etc. Manufacturing standards were declining in this stretch. Why the heck did I get married?
donut shops and Skyrizi , keeping Americans healthy
The funny thing is that the tv, with over 7,000 operating hours, has been in use longer than the average newly purchased flat screen television gets before it is thrown away 👍
That's not true at all. My LG 32GK650F has 10289 Hours total power on time. There are still loads of old 1080p plasma TVs about. Market place is flooded with them and lots of people use them as bedroom TVs
@kinkykane0607 We have an old Sony Bravio from 2008 with CFL back lighting and it's been operated daily for 12 hours a day for 16 years. Still works like new. That's about 70,000 hours.
Dam that's impressive :) I wonder how long these modern TVs & monitors can last :)@@JerrySpann-fn4kw
What a nice Set. 🤗
best channel ever
Testing the transistor through the bag. I like how your brain works.
How interesting the solid state components are failing and the vacuum tubes are surviving! I guess transistors of this set's era were not up to modern standards of reliability or tolerance.
And the baking effects in hybrid sets became better known over years.
Funny though cause I've seen plastic early 2000's tv's that have been running in doctors offices with probably 10yrs power on time at this point, evident by dust caked on the wall behind them just from convective air flow. No repairs obviously, and still watchable. So they clearly figured out the transistor problem eventually. I'd bet that if capacitors were better, the all tube sets would do the same.
That's over 300 days of continuous operation. Picture still looks great.
(@17:28) It looks like there’s a crack in the PCB between L212 and L213, but maybe it’s just a hair, or a spiderweb. The innards of the set are more interesting than the front of the set. 😊 The nice warm glow of the filament-filled vacuum bulbs. 😅
Whack it a few times.... to make sure. 14:17 This is an example of old school deep knowledge.
Percussive troubleshooting is an old school technique. Use all the senses, listen, look, smell, feel for heat, use cold and hot.
I have seen automotive mechanics lick the dipstick to check for gas and coolant in the oil, but I don't think I would do that, well perhaps a 9 volt transistor battery.
The occasional comment about things is the best part.
A surface mount transistor in a 1960's Packard Bell TV? I'm sitting here thinking to myself, "This is a test! This is ONLY a test! This is ONLY a test!" lol🤣
Would be great to document the decay of the picture bulb !!!!. This PB is doing a great work !!
He is, he tested it around 5k hours I believe.
It is showing signs of wear that it isn't as fresh as when it went into service.
wow the LED displays sure to Rock our world~
Gorgeous set
I would use a Thermal Imaging Camera. When it goes off, see if any of the tubes Cool Down, may lead you to the problem...
Exactly, apparent power, Shango!
When I have to solder to a SOT23 package, I put it on a solder perfboard. At an angle you can solder all the pins on the 0.1" grid. Then solder large wires to the board.
Thanks!
39:40 JFC that was hilarious. Needed that laugh.
I've seen these kind of faults before it is most likely a semiconductor junction fracture, either a transistor base emitter junction break or diode the best way to track this is freezer gas. Also if using a higher frequency transistor than the circuit requires, can amplify unwanted noise. Small noise signals often get discarded through a circuit if it has low band pass, but if you chose a higher frequency transistor that operates outside the normal bandwidth of the signal path it can act as an antenna and introduce harmonics into the signal path.
My contribution to the California Controller's Office.
Even if it’’s fused internally it wouldn’t hurt to externally fuse it. That way if it crowbars you would just have to change the external fuse and not have to open up the device to change the internal fuse.
Ricky from IBM
My old TV from 1976 Receives only Anaog Radio over the Air :D
Interesting to see that the transistors are failing before the remaining unchanged electrolytic capacitors. Also that such an old C.R.T. is still showing very good emissions. I suppose it was relatively early days for transistors in T.Vs. and their reliability after so long unused can't have been improving over time...
The transistor failures are the biggest surprise here. Going smd seems so strange in such a huge set.
It’s good to see the tv is still running. “Turn Down For What” by Lil Jon is a good workout song too.
Shango Time 👍🏻
We had a Philco-Ford hybrid with an IF transistor open (forget which stage). Replaced with an ECG equivalent. It "worked' sort of, but AGC action was screwed up. Rather than trying to re-engineer it, ordered the proprietary Philco transistor by part#, and that fixed it.
There are certain applications when only the original part will work - that IF stage is one of them. I remember repairing a Hitachi SS TV in the 80s for a vertical problem, and I could not get the linearity acceptable (tried ECGs, SKs, HEPs, etc.) I ordered the originals from Hitachi (they were also germaniums to boot!) and that fixed it.
That's interesting. Didn't know there were still germaniums in use into the '80s!
Quality made in Cheapina AKA China but it guess some stuff works. But love my Saturday Shango time with coffee.
thx for brief shot of My Cousin Vinney as now I'll sesrch it out to watch the whole thing..
It's funny that when you switch from a picture of the CRT to say, the back of the set, my brain says "now that's a good picture"
Thanks
CE is the periodic table symbol for Chinesium.
Yes. It was the EU compliance mark, but China quickly adopted it with minor change as China Export :-)
@@xsc1000One has a space, the other does not.
I installed the DC version of that meter about a year ago to measure the yield from my solar panels, so far so good. It looks the same but comes with shunt rather than a current transformer. When it gets up to 1000Wh the meter switches to display kWh and it counts up to at least 999kWh.
I have a DC version with shunt on the inverter battery input, going into the 4th year of 24/7 operation and it just clicked over to 1401 kwhrs total energy delivered to the inverter since spring of 2020, so they do roll past 999 kwhrs .
“I’ve made a radio out of it”😂😂😂
The hour meter at 7327 hours does not align with the new Wh meter at 304kWh. For 304 kWh, the 248.2 W TV would run for 1224.8 hours. Start at 40:21.
11:58 he took off is his new Honda!
He is still waiting for the VTEC
As always great video ! Thanks Shango ! I really enjoy and learn from your videos. Thanks again.
you have to be careful replacing tv IF transistors as some may need to be a 'forward gain control' type, the gain reduces with collector voltage, not bias current like 'normal' types,
My Cousin Vinny!!!
Super Blow!
"Trust the random old guy talking infront of his messy bookcase" 30:53
Shango Saturday! My favorite UA-cam day! Wow, 2 F-bombs in 1 Shango...Go Boy!
Would using something like Freeze spray (or tuning a can of Dust spray up-side-down) work on isolating the issue?
The CE marking should be a EU safety certificate. But those ones have the C and the E too close to each other, which is instead a "China Export" marking.
You can look up "CE certification real vs fake" to see the comparison between the 2 markings.
Good morning.
Should’ve compared it to a modern day flatscreen TV as well
Stalking, with dogged determination, the elusive reticent, even secretive...WILD INTERMITTENT failure!!!😮 oooooh!
The device im guessing can do real power (knowing power factor) since it is ac line powered and knows the phase angle.
Any device that do the product of V*I samples on each sample cicle will get Wh, but if they decided to calculates Irms and Vrms, then, they are let with VA. Still you need to sample V and I and acumulate them during an interval. This is done around 2 or 3K times a sec on meters. Var is easy, same as Wh but with V shifted 90 degrees. This is very easy once you have the qeue of samples, just pick always not the actual one but one is old by 90 degree, tipically the samples used 10 cycles ago (simplified).
@11:43 - The city of my birth. Daniel Freeman Hospital is now gone I understand.
got one "oscilloscope" in the square chinese box as this one~ haven't fired it up yet~
I think channel 3 there is picking up the sound of R2-D2 trying to imitate a 56k dial-up faxmodem. Back when a small video would take hours to download, and cost $500 in phone bills. Whoever said the old days were better, well, they suck. 🤣
Can somebody please list Shango as national herritage?
My week is complete now. Update on the bell. That tv will outlast us all.
40:19 So this thing, in its 7327 hours of on time, ingesting 250W power as we saw, burned about 1832 kWh worth of energy. That would cost you here in the north of Italy about 660 Euros... just to watch shitty commercials and brainless TV shop stuff 😅 If this isn't luxury, then what it is? 🤩
To put it in another perspective: that 304 kWh what it consumed since the installation of that meter (which happened maybe around the beginning of November 2023?) is the average 2-months consumption of my _whole_ home - with TV, Hifi, my electronics lab, fridge, lighting, hairdryer etc... _everything_ not just a TV 😅You can imagine what the world's energy demand would be if the technology was still at this vacuum tubes level... 😱
Is the yellow orange edging beginning cataract?
Excellent question.
Maybe The news director at Fox 11 wasnt able to get the usual News guy in to talk about the pursuit ,but noticed the Golf commentator was in the building, So the News director thought Why not put the Golf guy on to tell viewers whats going on .
the 'CE' mark is for 'Chinese Export'.....cheers.
Interesting that transistors are failing before the tubes when tubes are known to be a "consumable" item.
Its mostly because of the temperature changes caused by tubes nearby. Transistor chip itself is still ok, but the incase connection between chip and legs breaks.
Donut-themed episode. I like it.
Need to get a few smd breakout boards make life a little easier 😂
Shango I found a company that makes adapters to mout that style of transistor into old style I am ordering a some for just stuff like that !
Wtf for? Just use a through hole part.
Pro tip, if you are being chased by the police, stay away from donut shops 😁
My Kenwood TK-60U had a transistor on the IF board that would drop out. If I held the tip of my soldering iron on it and heated it up, it would work for about a month before it would drop out again. My guess is probably tin whiskers. I’d be curious if the same is going on with the transistors in this TV?
It may be either tin wiskers or just broke connection between chip and legs. It depends on the material of the case.
Nice picture, too bad the crt has cataract... Not awful mind you, but it takes away from the picture quality.
Tiger Woods always said, the worse miss is the two way miss. No way to know what is what.
Wow A shooting suspect going fast plus hear is your free heart attack sorry Donuts
Shango's TV Repair Service. No job too big. Sorry, your set's going to the shop! There'll be no Nick at Night tonite.
Wow - such a great channel! Wondering if you'd be up for repairing a Sony Micro TV 4-203 UW? It's mint externally, needs some love on the inside. Let me know!
11:38 Randy’s Donuts…
35:35 Mumble rap.
the "fuse" is probly that 51-ohm resistor
Modern TV is so depressing. Don't know what's worse. Canned laughter at those profoundly unfunny script lines. Over the top sports commentary on police pursuit chases. Or the mindless propaganda "experts" gaslighting us how a blatantly rigged erection was like totally fair and honest. The toxicity of the home shopping network pales in comparison. This is why people never watch TV anymore.
The day we cut off the Network Sewer Pipe from entering our home, our mental health began to improve. That was 2011. Shango is the most "TeeVee" that my wife and I see now.
@@TechGorilla1987 Same. My wife still does some tv shows on Prime, I have been strictly UA-cam for a decade now...
Unplugged mine in 1999 here in Australia, in mid 1995 TV here started to become woke and it was downhill since then, TV is just revolting now in 2024.
No car chases in Cincy.
Being used to 625 lines colour in the UK the 525 line system lines are so course, I'm amaised anybody watched tv in the USA.
Ooh,that "fat iron " looks intriguing ,perhaps you could open a second channel and give expert commentary and review on the latest HSN product. Are you losing picture tube emission by the way, or high voltage down? On video it just reminds me of a tired picture tube appearance .
Fred Sanford of TV Repair. Bang or whack the side and top of the TV
This is bit off topic but i have collected two Tv one from 1980 and from 1990. Watching this reminds me to get these powered up again.
How can I contact shango? I have this really really cool tec tel rad radio telephone on its way from eBay. Thing looks like the red phone the president would pick up. 3 channels crystal controlled, tube, not sure if it's on 27mhz but I think so. Can't find any info on it as far as a manual or service data or who made it. I figured he could tell me better where to look, he seems to identify even just bare chassis easily and find data. Maybe I'd see if shango can revive it. I'm a ham general class, upgrading to extra tomorrow actually. 3/2. Anyway I could handle fixing it if I located some data
I wonder if those IF transistors were silicon or germanium? And I'll bet that when the bias pot burned up, it made quite a sm0ke show with 400v across it lol
Look through the past videos, I think the flame out is in one of the early series on this set.
@@zulumax1It is
They were silicon transistors.
The police chase isn't O. J. again, is it?
8:40 - it sounds like a heavy oscillation happening. That could be intermittent... Still haven't seen the rest of the video. Could it be a too strong signal?
Edit: after the fix it seems that the amplification is too strong. The picture has a much wider dynamic range than what it is in the previous videos and now it is somewhat unpleasant to watch.
Sounds like My Cousin Vinny.
I bought a very nice ITT golf Europe transistor radio that worked perfectly, put it in the cupboard half a year later, I wanted to try it, then the FM band was completely dead. short wave between wave and long wave band still works perfectly
It's called medium wave, not "between wave".
Mr electricity can diagnose any circuit with just an analog meter set on 1k ohm.
I see the problem see all those cat hairs they probably pissed on it
Give us a link to that China inline amp meter!!
why i got rid of tv nothing on but bs well got that CUE streaming crap now its loads better than att uverce or direct tv by far remind me of old satilight tv and new on-demand mixed
304 kilowatthours
get all "Fargo" is what one dude said~?? huh huh
seems like a modulator problem
Hi Shango
"Valves are unreliable...go solid state"