This is a fragment from Luke: “Why were you searching for me?” he asked. “Didn’t you know I had to be in my Father’s house?”. I was always fascinated by that simple answer. I mean clearly, where could the son be elswhere besides his fathers house? At the same time there's something less obvious about this. The people looking for him it seems to me, are functioning on a lower level o reality. They try to search for him in other places based on causality maybe or factuality, the laws that govern this world. And it might be a stretch but to me it seems that in a way he's saying look, I'm not of this world, my nature is that of my Father therefore you couldn't find me. If you where to have Faith that I am the Son of God you wouldn't have to look for me because you'd know that the son belongs in father's house and he's nowhere else to be found besides that where he belongs.
According to scripture, both Mary and Joseph know who he was from the beginning. Magi and shepherds came to honor his arrival on earth. Herod killed all male infants two years and younger in an attempt to assassinate him. It would not at all be strange for him to know from the beginning who he was, given all around him knew and they raised him to be that. In fact, it would be very strange if he did not know.
I never thought of that 🤔 (Regarding the traditional story of Mary being raised in the temple, my confidence in its historicity grew the other day because of some things Sister Vassa Larin said. I don't remember exactly but there's some archaeological evidence to corroborate it.)
I don't think Jesus had an objective knowledge of being God. That would not make him truly human. However as the One who came from the bosom of the Father, we can expect that he had a deeply subjective experience of being in a special and unique relationship with God as His Father, as His Abba. That is what we see in the Scriptures and we also see that he understood his Mission as seeking to draw his disciples into that same intimacy he had with God as His Father.
I met a few people that are far in their spiritual awakening process and they just talk about infinite love an awareness being the nature of reality. I think by listening to these people and experiencing this yourself you will get close to the reality of what Jesus experienced.
Maybe, but this is easy to fake, and getting there genuinely requires going down to the bottom (at least in my experience that’s required before you even know fully which way is up). In the era of influencers (as opposed to leaders) it seems to me increasingly important to rely on traditions that have stood the test of time. I haven’t found a better way to distinguish genuine from the not so genuine - even that is not a guarantee, of course. It may be the best option we have right now, and I find that the majority of folks using that kinda new age language are often less tied to thousand year traditions
That's completely and totally not true, I know exactly those kind of people and they're not "far in their spiritual awakening process" by any stretch of the imagination, they're delusional. Truly "advanced" spiritual people are disciplined, humble, and grounded. The woo woo types proclaiming "infinite love" have merely spiritually inflated their egos and think that having a spaced out hippie understanding of reality is the same thing as being truly spiritual when it's anything but.
Imagine. As they sit down to have lunch one day after making a nice table and chair set. Jesus: " hey Johnno, I think I am God" John: " Yeh right Josh".
Well, that's part of it. He did grow in wisdom and stature, and in favor with God and man. The temple tradition was connected to the prophetic tradition; Jesus may well have had visions. Maybe I'll talk about this stuff in a video 😉
No, this is Nestorianism. There is no created/human hypostasis in Christ. There is only one Person in Christ, the 2nd Person of the Holy Trinity, the Logos. He didn't need to "develop" or "grow" in stature and wisdom like we do.
@@06rtm I dont think he is omniscient. He said that only the father knows the time of the day of judgment. At least, here on earth, he was fulfilling the role of man, so he could definitely grow in stature and favor with the Father. But he always made the right things because he was "the right things" (Logos) incarnated.
Is 7:16 and Heb 5:9. . He did things wrong but he never sinned. Making a mistake is not sinning if you learn from it. It says He became the Son of God, like a man. He rejected the wrong and chose the right. When He had been baptised it says" Today you have become My Son". He was human like you and me. He became Gods Son like you and me if you believe it.
This is a fragment from Luke: “Why were you searching for me?” he asked. “Didn’t you know I had to be in my Father’s house?”. I was always fascinated by that simple answer. I mean clearly, where could the son be elswhere besides his fathers house? At the same time there's something less obvious about this. The people looking for him it seems to me, are functioning on a lower level o reality. They try to search for him in other places based on causality maybe or factuality, the laws that govern this world. And it might be a stretch but to me it seems that in a way he's saying look, I'm not of this world, my nature is that of my Father therefore you couldn't find me. If you where to have Faith that I am the Son of God you wouldn't have to look for me because you'd know that the son belongs in father's house and he's nowhere else to be found besides that where he belongs.
According to scripture, both Mary and Joseph know who he was from the beginning. Magi and shepherds came to honor his arrival on earth. Herod killed all male infants two years and younger in an attempt to assassinate him. It would not at all be strange for him to know from the beginning who he was, given all around him knew and they raised him to be that. In fact, it would be very strange if he did not know.
The Theotokos was also raised in the temple, according to legend. So it is surprising that she wouldn’t know where he would be.
I never thought of that 🤔 (Regarding the traditional story of Mary being raised in the temple, my confidence in its historicity grew the other day because of some things Sister Vassa Larin said. I don't remember exactly but there's some archaeological evidence to corroborate it.)
I don't think Jesus had an objective knowledge of being God. That would not make him truly human. However as the One who came from the bosom of the Father, we can expect that he had a deeply subjective experience of being in a special and unique relationship with God as His Father, as His Abba. That is what we see in the Scriptures and we also see that he understood his Mission as seeking to draw his disciples into that same intimacy he had with God as His Father.
I met a few people that are far in their spiritual awakening process and they just talk about infinite love an awareness being the nature of reality. I think by listening to these people and experiencing this yourself you will get close to the reality of what Jesus experienced.
Maybe, but this is easy to fake, and getting there genuinely requires going down to the bottom (at least in my experience that’s required before you even know fully which way is up). In the era of influencers (as opposed to leaders) it seems to me increasingly important to rely on traditions that have stood the test of time. I haven’t found a better way to distinguish genuine from the not so genuine - even that is not a guarantee, of course. It may be the best option we have right now, and I find that the majority of folks using that kinda new age language are often less tied to thousand year traditions
That's completely and totally not true, I know exactly those kind of people and they're not "far in their spiritual awakening process" by any stretch of the imagination, they're delusional. Truly "advanced" spiritual people are disciplined, humble, and grounded. The woo woo types proclaiming "infinite love" have merely spiritually inflated their egos and think that having a spaced out hippie understanding of reality is the same thing as being truly spiritual when it's anything but.
Imagine. As they sit down to have lunch one day after making a nice table and chair set.
Jesus: " hey Johnno, I think I am God"
John: " Yeh right Josh".
what’s crazy is that’s actually fairly plausible albeit a tad reductive
Well, that's part of it. He did grow in wisdom and stature, and in favor with God and man. The temple tradition was connected to the prophetic tradition; Jesus may well have had visions. Maybe I'll talk about this stuff in a video 😉
No, this is Nestorianism. There is no created/human hypostasis in Christ. There is only one Person in Christ, the 2nd Person of the Holy Trinity, the Logos. He didn't need to "develop" or "grow" in stature and wisdom like we do.
@@panokostouros7609 Luke 2:52 - And Jesus increased in wisdom and in stature and in favor with God and man.
If Jesus is God, then how could he grow in stature with God? How could he grow in wisdom if he was born omniscient?
@@06rtm I dont think he is omniscient. He said that only the father knows the time of the day of judgment. At least, here on earth, he was fulfilling the role of man, so he could definitely grow in stature and favor with the Father.
But he always made the right things because he was "the right things" (Logos) incarnated.
@@gadsnow42 Okay that makes sense. I would like to hear Jonathan go further into this idea.
Is 7:16 and Heb 5:9. . He did things wrong but he never sinned. Making a mistake is not sinning if you learn from it. It says He became the Son of God, like a man. He rejected the wrong and chose the right. When He had been baptised it says" Today you have become My Son". He was human like you and me. He became Gods Son like you and me if you believe it.
No incorrect He was always God, scripture teaches this clearly
@@livingtribunal3317 But it also says. " When is old enough to reject the wrong and choose the right " it also says He is the son of man.