A couple of three reasons. 1) He still had use for Junior being the lightning rod 2) After listening to the FBI tapes he realized Junior acted due to Livia's deception. 3) Deep down he still loved and respected his uncle.
Hence why when Tony asked Junior, "Don't you love me?" he was silent. He loved him personally like any uncle and nephew... but hated Tony professionally as an usurper.
Deep down Junior also knew he wasn't boss material because people didn't like him. They respected him as much as they had to but he wasn't a good leader in that capacity.
Junior loved the adulation of being boss more. And Tony robbed him of it in different ways. Think if you got to marry the woman of your dreams … but someone else got to sleep with her. Junior had the title …. But never had the power.
The actor Dominic Chianese is an amazing example of not giving up in life because you never know when opportunity knocks I think he was 70 and renting a small apartment when he got the role and what a great character!
One key aspect I think you should have included - before Tony decides to meet with Junior and offer him the position as Boss, he has an appointment with Melfi, where he complains about Livia's resistance to going to a nursing home. Melfi tells Tony that sometimes as the people who raised us get older, they can resent being told what's best for them by adults they still see as children - she suggests to Tony that one tactic he should try with his mother is to allow her to think she's in control and making decisions in her own best interest, when Tony's actually setting things up to steer her in that direction and provide her with the "illusion of control." Of course, Tony fails to practice any of this advice with Livia, but immediately uses it to come up with a plan on how to resolve his dispute with Junior while avoiding a war or losing face.
Tony still goes to see him in the finale after refusing to give Janice money to help him. That scene at Junior's facility was one of the most poignant in the series. Junior's descent into dementia was from a scriptwriter's handbook on what to do with an elderly character, but it was amazingly well-done, mirroring Tony's descent into pettiness/evil/greed. Great point on the FBI possibly saving Junior's life. I still think Tony wouldn't have pulled the trigger on killing him.
Junior was salty, petty, and often came off as an insecure boob. But on multiple occasions he earned the younger generation’s respect by dropping old school gangster wisdom. Even narcissist Tony consulted him when unsure which path to take. Brilliant writing, brilliant acting by Dominic Chianese.
Junior was definitely salty and petty but if you think about it he was undermined and not completely respected amongst his fellow mobsters. First going back to playing second fiddle to his brother Johnny Boy and even losing women to him, and then with Tony and the rest of the crew using him as the proverbial lightning rod while the much younger Tony was seen as the true boss by everybody. You gotta look at it from Juniors perspective. He just wanted respect but truly wasn’t respected, part of that his own fault.
Johnny Boy’s distance(emotionally, due to incarceration and early death) to Tony led him to look for father figures. Dicky and Junior served as father figures at different points in his life. Hell, Both took an interest in young Tony’s life more than his own father.
People don’t realize that in reality, Junior was actually the NICE boss compared to a group of physcopaths. Yes, the man was EXTREMELY petty, but the more times you watch the show, you realize he is the one who is more GENUINLY respected rather than Tony who is respected out of “FEAR OF THE BOSS.” Look at Dickie Moltisanti for example, people say he only had him whacked by Paulie because he felt embarrased, but was actually doing it to get Tony to realize that this wasn’t the right life to live. Dickie was a bad role model who did little to nothing for Tony other than inspire him to pursue the life more. Junior was always doing nice things for the community too like helping the less fortunate and being a friend that the weak and victimed who would help them resolve issues in return for simple favors (free dry cleaning, tailor service, fancy dinners, etc.). Did any one you ever wonder why New York’s “old schoolers” was so hostile towards Tony? Phil and Butchie said it perfectly, “How could NJ let that man walk all over his uncle like that? That man is the real boss and brains!” In reality, Tony did strong arm his only real father figure and send him into a depressive state which to his inevitable downfall from dementia. Not a lot of those guys made it to old age, so when you watch the show again, focus on his scenes and you realize he was actually a pretty wisdomous guy, like an Italian mob wizard or something!! All things that definitely contributed greatly to Tony’s successes. Like I said, the more you rewatch, the more you just realize Tony is not a likeable guy at all!! However, like the topic of this video, Tony definitely knew all this which is why he never considered even harming his uncle. As evil as he was, Uncle Junior may have been the only man in the show other than Artie and Sil who Tony genuinly loved in a sincere way as anybody else who even dared do a fraction of the things his uncle did would have been dead on the spot ages ago.
Junior was a psychopath who killed for petty reasons. That's not up for debate. Killing Dickie had nothing to do with steering Tony towards the Mafia. How do we know this? Junior was the one who schooled Tony after Dickie died. It wasn't Johnny. It was Junior. Secondly, Junior was not a nice boss compared to Tony. The literal first thing Junior did was increase taxes and order Hesh's guys beaten and taxed. The only reason Junior eased up on the gas was because Tony and Johnny Sack called a sitdown. If Junior had maintained control of the family someone else would have killed him. He quickly set himself on the path that got Paul Castellano shot.
Also, old timers in all walks of life tend to respect elders more than the younger generations irregardless of whether or not the respect is warranted. New York mobsters are in New York. Not Jersey. So that's not any actual reason to think Junior is a better boss or nicer boss. Not actually being around people tends to inflate reputations.
If Tony had killed Junior, I think he would have been in trouble with the other mafia families. The other families may have looked at it as a violation being how high ranked he was. Also junior had been in the mafia for most of his life he more than likely had personal relationships with the bosses of the other families
Tony seems to have seperated Junior the uncle from Junior the business rival. As part of their "business", he dealt with Junior by making him a figurehead boss and taking away 95% of his earnings. But as part of their private relationship, he still carried his uncle in his arms at the end of the episode (after Junior fell in the shower).
I believe Jr still had the ability to generate lots of money for the family, whether it be drugs, extortion, gambling etc. Junior was still a big money maker, and in the end that's what it's all about. Jr. was also respected by NY.
Well, I don't know about that. Johnny Sack, underboss of one of the five families, was in on making a fool of Jr and knew of the "lightning rod"-plan all along. This must have become apparent for Jr at one point or another, recalling the meeting about Jr taxing Hesh and how they all played Jr by appealing to his ego, his notion of "being the boss". Drugs? The big conflict between Tony and Jr in season 2 was about Jr wanting to sell cocaine along the garbage routes to get a steady stream of income to pay his legal bills. Tony was against drugs from the beginning and never changed his position about keeping drugs out of his businesses. The risk was too high. Despite causing additional problems for Tony through all six seasons Jr, at least after he got arrested in s. 1, was a big reason that the family bled money because of the trial being costly. I subscribe to the idea of family ties vs criminal family ties and Tony did avenge his Jr trying to kill him by killing all of his capos and foot soldiers. I don't believe Jr would have been killed if he didn't go to jail, the purpose of killing Mikey Palmice and Chucky Signore was to strip him of power (officially, this time) by removing the people who he depended on lower in his hierarchal structure in order to maintain street power.
I always disliked that scene. The first guy misses than literally runs up so close that Tony was able to grab his gun. Then the second idiot shoots his friend in the head and proceeds to do the same thing his buddy did by getting so close that Tony was able to also grab his gun. They could have done better with that hit scene but whatever, still the greatest show of all time.
@@jjones9822yeah that scene is more about setting a precedent that Tony can be killed and JR willing to take him out. Rather than an actual hit. It’s unlike any other hit in the show. The only other missed hit in the show is Chris and Pauly’s infamous Russian kill. 😊
When Junior shot Tony in the season finale, the latter believed until the end of the series that Junior had done it on purpose; that he had betrayed his nephew again. Even when Tony visited Junior and realized that his uncle’s mind had decayed, there’s no indication on whether Tony connected the dots and noticed that Junior may have attacked him under the influence of his dementia.
Tony sheds a tear while leaving, and explaining to Junior that him and his dad ran North Jersey. He realizes in that moment that Junior lost his mind and it wasnt out of ill intent.
@@toddpick8007 correct , junior always loves telling Tony that he was still his boss and ran the family. Him not saying saying that confirmed he wasn’t the same junior
Tony and junior's relationship was definitely complicated eventhough they both plotted to have the other whacked at one point they did love eachother eventhough junior thought he had to take tony out he wasn't happy about it he didn't even want to hear the details from mikey and as angry as tony was I don't think he really wanted junior dead because he had from the time he got out on house arrest to make a move on him but he didn't I know he put him in position to be the front boss and take the heat but that wasn't the only reason tony didn't take him out
Let's not forget that Melfi address this many times, but particularly so just before Tony gets shot by Junior: he's fixated on blaming his mother for all what's wrong in his life, he won't let go of that hatred (we also see this in the 'Camelot' episode), he'd rather think of her mother as this criminal mastermind who totally had Junior for the balls. Accepting Junior's attempted hit on him also means to accept Livia's complexity as a human being, and ultimately, acknowledging that Johnny Boy was a bad father. Also: huge teller that Carmela never forgave Junior.
that episode "where's Johnny" is a hell of an episode, not a mediocre scene in that whole episode and all kinds of different things happen from different storylines, and genius of it is how Tony is mad at Junior for bringing up the varsity shit and asks Junior to not bring it up again and Junior brings it up again and Tony stops talking to him because of it but then later he realizes that Junior actually forgets about that because of his Alzeimer, so it's not that he meant to bring it up two back to back times to hurt Tony, it's that he's being aggressive because of his mental state and he brings it up two back to back times because he doesn't remember that Tony asked him not to bring up the varsity shit, and that's why Tony forgives him at the end of the episode and realizes Junior doesn't even know what he's doing, it's a little detail that I didn't realize until I watched it for a third time, I used to think Junior was being spiteful on purpose but turns out his memory was gone and he was aggressive because he's sick.
As someone who's dealt with that sort of thing, it hit home hard. That, and when Tony asks Junior, "When you repeat these things - why can't it ever ben something nice?"
Junior was more useful alive than dead, but Tony clearly had affection for this uncle. He did fill in as his caretaker when he shot him. Easily could not have and got someone else to do it.
@@punchyMiddleEarthyeah can you imagine if the woke writers of today wrote Sopranos? They’d make Tony go to therapy, Meadow would date a black guy, they’d have a gay mobster at one point. It would be terrible.
I don’t think Tony was built to be a great leader at all. He suffers from panic attacks from stress and anxiety. His decisions are so short sided. How could he think it wouldn’t get back to Junior that he was running things? Also, telling his blabber mouth wife and kids that he was seeing a therapist. He lucked out by overpowering his assassins. He also could have absolutely lost to Richie Aprile in season 2 who was an old school gangster who was NOT intimidated by Tony’s size (very much like Joe Pesci characters). He lucked out when Janice settled that problem. In Better Call Saul/Breaking Bad, Mike tells a great story about a letting a wife beater off the hook when he was a cop. The wife beater ended up killing the wife. Mike said he would never take “half measures” again. Tony always takes half measures. That is the story of his life. Didn’t take over after Jackie and let Junior pretend to be boss; didn’t go all the way therapy so he got worse; didn’t kill junior who ended up shooting him; didn’t do the right thing by handing over Tony B to NY which ended up causing a war. According to Chase, that led to the final scene, fade to black. Killed by a NY hit man. Half measure Tony Soprano!
The main point is that Tony could accept that Junior was following the rules of the life. Tony tricking Junior into believing he’s boss is a killable offense. That’s why he never forgave his mother. She wasn’t in the life so.
If Junior had been murdered by Tony in Season 1 then Tony wouldn’t have had the council and advice he so often needed and he could have been murdered sooner or attempts on his life would have drive Tony to paranoia. Case in point Richy Arprille, Ralph Ciffaretto, the NY Lupertazzi family all would have eventually come gunning for him.
I don't think Tony ever gave up on the outside possiblity of needing to wack Junior It looked like to me in the last scene Tony and Junior had in the hospital Tony was still unsure as to whether Junior was still playing a long game. I think he finally walked away believing Junior truly was in lala land though.
Tony valued blood and was very nostalgic. Hence, why he had such difficulty offing Christopher and Tony B, even though they deserved it many times over. Same goes for Uncle Junior
He only spared Feech because he was popular amongst the guys. He wasn't like Richie where no one lost sleep over his "disappearance". Feech being killed would have put Tony in a bad spot with the crew.
Also another reason for keeping Junior around in later seasons (and maybe my own timeline is messed up) - Nancy Marchand passing. She was the older person who Tony could go to for certain interactions. Ultimately I love that they kept Dominic Chianese around - a fantastic actor and one hell of a singer.
You and others cover a lot of the reasons but I also think when Junior was under investigation and the FBI arrested him Junior refused to talk and all but dismissed the idea Tony was the boss. In that moment, despite the fact the two basically went to war with each other and despite Junior being an old man with no bright future left, refused to sell out Tony. He stuck to the code, protected everyone at a critical moment in which Junior really didn't have much to gain. Junior needed Tony in that moment to help with finances and intimidating the jury, Tony needed Junior's silence, it worked out for both and Junior kept the respect he had.
Junior reminds me of some of my relatives always attacking the younger family members because of their own short comings. Respect your elders ONLY if they are respectful.
I always enjoy your videos. Given the dearth of decent mob movies and series, how much content do you feel you have left? In fairness, now you have done most of the low hanging fruit, some of your more recent videos are super interesting because they get below the surface. Keep up the good work!
I always felt that ultimately Tony's best way of winning was to keep Junior as boss while running the crew away from the spotlights from the law. He knew that by killing Junior, the repercussions from the law and others within the mafia would be impossible, business wise. I am sure some family love was involved and killing a 'made' old man would also potentially bring some shame to the family too.
It was jarring to see Evil Tony, or Final Season Tony, still clearly have love for Junior. Makes me think what if Livia was to have lived long enough to encounter Evil Tony, how would they interact?
Hit it on the head with Tony still saw him as the Uncle who played ball with him as a kid,Junior was in the life with Tony and one of the only people he could talk to about business and Tony did back door him with the Capos so it even out and Tony knew it.
The killing of brother Fredo Corleone turned Michael Correlone into an unredeemable monster. If Tony killed his Uncle he would have been killing off his character at the same time as the audience would never have forgiven him for it. The show needed its strongest character and best actor to be someone the audience actually liked. If he killed his uncle that is all anyone would have seen for the rest of 'The Sopranos' It works for a 2.5-hour movie but not an almost 90 hour saga.
Superb critique once again young man and a salient point to highlight because I'm sure many of us wondered why Tony gave him a pass. Best wishes for Thanksgiving over the Pond there. 👍 🙏🇬🇧
Ya, and I'm playing shortstop for the Mets. You tell me to take a shit on the deck of the Queen Mary, they'll be hosing it down with disinfectant within the hour.
If Tony accepted the fact that he didn’t have the makings of a varsity athlete. The fact that Jun loved him regardless was why Tony forgave him. We all know how important having the makings of a varsity athlete is to Jun.
He left Junior in place because he was a lightning rod for the Feds and indictments. If Junior was dead- it would be Tony as the sole “boss of the family” who they’d be going after. Junior was a shield for Tony and Tony appeased Juniors need to be seen and spoken of as the one calling the shots but really Junior didn’t hold much power at all.
I think it really was just as simple as Tony and Junior loved each other a great deal but Tony's move left him no choice cause he couldn't let an usurpation stand no matter who it was. You can see Junior doesn't want it by the way he avoids talking about it and is throwing up waiting on news when normally he'd be talking their ears off and wanting every detail and would be completely undisturbed, and Tony is very bothered by it even if he seems to accept it. Junior did what he had to do, it failed so Tony responded in kind and started working his way through his crew but only 2 guys in the feds scoop up much of the rest and Junior's incarceration and legal issues take him outta the fight so the threat to T was neutralized and Junior could keep his name by making such a difficult move, win-win really. I also think in a way Junior admired or respected Tony's way of thinking even if it was mad disrespectful and against their codes, T had to respect the fact that Jun did what he had to, both had to respect the fight the other had, and it was better all around for them to put it behind them. Also, Junior's legal issues made it almost impossible for them to continue a war because of the financial strain and near constant surveillance. On top of that Tony needed things that were only found in Junior's head like their car connection, the executive game roster, the union contacts, and who knows how many similar things, on top of all the guidance, mentorship, info on people, walks down memory lane, etc, Junior was valuable to Tony even if T didn't feel a thing for em.
Doubtless Junior loved Tony deep down but as the conversation when Junior was debating Richie Aprile over Tony to Bobby. Even Bobby said he was amazed as Junior’s summation of Tony’s power was dead on. As jealous as Junior could be, he respected Tony as well as loving him.
After he heard the tapes and realized Junior had basically no way or reason on killing him there was no point. I think killing Junior would've only brought bad things.
Tony loved junior & junior loved Tony but juniors resentment of knowing that Tony actually ran the jersey mob behind his bk always limited juniors love for him.
People don't realize Junior was the boss, Tony was the underboss for the entire time. But as he put it the crew only listened to tony "he made the shots" that pissed junior off. Also Tony was business minded. He didn't give in to personal anger but with tracee because he reminded her of Meadow they were about the same age. Tony gets rid of people only if it hurts the business. That's why he took him a while to order the hit on vito. Why didn't he get rid of junior? I think because they are blood related and because of the business perspective. What message does it send to the other mob families if he did? Frequentable guy or not? These families watched out with who they do business with, what kind of individual they're dealing with. At least, in Tony's perspective. He played it smart. He could have been the real boss right away if he wanted to.
It also would have been very difficult for Tony to have Junior killed after season 1 even if he wanted to, as Junior was under constant surveillance by the feds from when his house arrest began until he goes to the mental health facility.
My own observation..if you watch the entire season..it seems like as Junior starts to get his Alsheimers..so does Tony's effectiveness as a boss. I believe as much as Tony thought he could run the family. he always sought Juniors guidance. In the end in that hospital..the last time he saw him in the show..it just seems like you could feel the end of Tony's reign coming one way or another. He had gained so many resentments against him I believe in part because of not having Juniors years of experience of running things to fall back on.
I think he would have but the FBI got to Junior first and it was one of those things were Tony took a step back and realized he still had a use for Junior and he still had respect for him.
Tony Soprano was a savage when he wanted to be, and a grimy snake as well, but he was kind of weak as the boss of the family. He let a few things slide that no real mob boss would let slide. Compared to real life mafia workings, the Sopranos is maybe 50% realistic. Still a great show though, and one of the best tv series ever made, with a ton of superb actors.
You forget during the meeting with the other capo's Tony mentions that JR has New York behind him meaning he has pull with the five families. If he goes down suddenly they all have targets on their backs.
Junior always had the best lines in the whole series but besides that Tony always knew Junior had reason to take him out by going and planting him as boss and the lightning rod for the fbi and still controlling the crew. That was some really underhanded shit..
It made sense that he forgave him after he tried to kill him, but I found it stupid that everyone hated him after he shot Tony given that he obviously wasn't acting consciously.
Junior and Livia and indeed all of Tony's family are symbols of The other family the treachery, the respect, the money, the unambiguous, the disengaged, the disenfranchised, the dead old ways.
Could think of it as Jr isn't a threat by season 2 once his crew was dead and sometimes better to keep your friends close and your enemies closer. Not to mention that he still has value in clout alive than dead and it would look bad to kill him when he wasn't a rat, and forgiving past murders is just a part of the life it's a part of doing business. look at what Johnny sac asked Phil to do, overlook that animal blundetto out of killing his brother for the sake of business
If Jr wanted to he could of backed Richie Aprille and had Tony wacked in season 2. Richie would of been Jr's underboss but Jr thought he was better off with Tony. He knew Tony was still in his pocket.
@@jamesw7072 that is another interesting sign of respect between the two that Jr chooses Tony and lets him in on the betrayal But yeah he could have made a move even with his weakened state
The main reason behind it was that Uncle Junior got indicted before Tony had a chance to kill him. Tony had already put out the order. It hard to kill a man if the Feds have him
It was about Junior being completely powerless while also the focus of the Feds’ investigations. All of Junior’s guys were dead except Bobby Baccala, who was seen as a joke at that time. He was under federal indictment and house arrest. The Feds trying and failing to convict him for RICO was a colossal waste of time and resources for them that they couldn’t put into trying to get Tony. Family may have played a part but Tony was well aware of how important it was to obscure his activities from the Feds. Throwing that away by whacking a guy under indictment would have just moved attention straight back to him. He may have had conflicted feelings but pragmatism about his own ability to operate was the reason IMHO.
Sometimes life isn’t a simple line. I remember reading puzzo writing about Salvatore Giuliano being amazed at being in a round room. I laughed until I tried to remember if I had been in a round room. There are things that motivate a person that are obvious only when we bother to examine them. Lol which I guess is the point of this channel
A couple of three reasons.
1) He still had use for Junior being the lightning rod
2) After listening to the FBI tapes he realized Junior acted due to Livia's deception.
3) Deep down he still loved and respected his uncle.
I was just about to comment this. Exactly
4.) Tony never had the makings of a varsity athlete
@@BostonsF1nest lol
4) he was a mental fucking weakling
I wanted to watch the episodes but I read your comment I sacrificed
Hence why when Tony asked Junior, "Don't you love me?" he was silent.
He loved him personally like any uncle and nephew... but hated Tony professionally as an usurper.
Deep down Junior also knew he wasn't boss material because people didn't like him. They respected him as much as they had to but he wasn't a good leader in that capacity.
It was the pussy eating.
He's also petty as fuck to boot
Junior loved the adulation of being boss more. And Tony robbed him of it in different ways. Think if you got to marry the woman of your dreams … but someone else got to sleep with her. Junior had the title …. But never had the power.
I think that Junior was terrified of Tony. That was the answer that made him weep. He saw the child Tony was within the monster he had become.
The actor Dominic Chianese is an amazing example of not giving up in life because you never know when opportunity knocks I think he was 70 and renting a small apartment when he got the role and what a great character!
Wow
He was in the godfather also
I can't dispute the apartment.. but he's been around for awhile before this role.
uhm,the dude has been in dozens of movies and is an acomplished musician
@@deenman23"Uhm" 🤓☝️
One key aspect I think you should have included - before Tony decides to meet with Junior and offer him the position as Boss, he has an appointment with Melfi, where he complains about Livia's resistance to going to a nursing home. Melfi tells Tony that sometimes as the people who raised us get older, they can resent being told what's best for them by adults they still see as children - she suggests to Tony that one tactic he should try with his mother is to allow her to think she's in control and making decisions in her own best interest, when Tony's actually setting things up to steer her in that direction and provide her with the "illusion of control."
Of course, Tony fails to practice any of this advice with Livia, but immediately uses it to come up with a plan on how to resolve his dispute with Junior while avoiding a war or losing face.
Tony still goes to see him in the finale after refusing to give Janice money to help him. That scene at Junior's facility was one of the most poignant in the series. Junior's descent into dementia was from a scriptwriter's handbook on what to do with an elderly character, but it was amazingly well-done, mirroring Tony's descent into pettiness/evil/greed. Great point on the FBI possibly saving Junior's life. I still think Tony wouldn't have pulled the trigger on killing him.
Tf you want, a boutonniere? 😒
@@dewilew2137 No, I want a ham under my arm.
It was probably the most heartbreaking scene of the whole show Tonys final visit to Junior
My favorite moment of that last scene was when Tony said "you don't know who I am, do you!" That was the moment he knew he'd lost Junior forever
Ambassador hotel!
Junior was salty, petty, and often came off as an insecure boob. But on multiple occasions he earned the younger generation’s respect by dropping old school gangster wisdom. Even narcissist Tony consulted him when unsure which path to take. Brilliant writing, brilliant acting by Dominic Chianese.
Tony wasn't a narcissist
@@thebenevolentsun6575he sure as fuck were or at least became
@@Knifyman Not really, he was a sociopath not a narcissist.
Junior was the narcissist. Tony was a sociopath
Junior was definitely salty and petty but if you think about it he was undermined and not completely respected amongst his fellow mobsters. First going back to playing second fiddle to his brother Johnny Boy and even losing women to him, and then with Tony and the rest of the crew using him as the proverbial lightning rod while the much younger Tony was seen as the true boss by everybody. You gotta look at it from Juniors perspective. He just wanted respect but truly wasn’t respected, part of that his own fault.
Johnny Boy’s distance(emotionally, due to incarceration and early death) to Tony led him to look for father figures. Dicky and Junior served as father figures at different points in his life. Hell, Both took an interest in young Tony’s life more than his own father.
All those hours playing catch!
People don’t realize that in reality, Junior was actually the NICE boss compared to a group of physcopaths. Yes, the man was EXTREMELY petty, but the more times you watch the show, you realize he is the one who is more GENUINLY respected rather than Tony who is respected out of “FEAR OF THE BOSS.” Look at Dickie Moltisanti for example, people say he only had him whacked by Paulie because he felt embarrased, but was actually doing it to get Tony to realize that this wasn’t the right life to live. Dickie was a bad role model who did little to nothing for Tony other than inspire him to pursue the life more. Junior was always doing nice things for the community too like helping the less fortunate and being a friend that the weak and victimed who would help them resolve issues in return for simple favors (free dry cleaning, tailor service, fancy dinners, etc.). Did any one you ever wonder why New York’s “old schoolers” was so hostile towards Tony? Phil and Butchie said it perfectly, “How could NJ let that man walk all over his uncle like that? That man is the real boss and brains!” In reality, Tony did strong arm his only real father figure and send him into a depressive state which to his inevitable downfall from dementia. Not a lot of those guys made it to old age, so when you watch the show again, focus on his scenes and you realize he was actually a pretty wisdomous guy, like an Italian mob wizard or something!! All things that definitely contributed greatly to Tony’s successes. Like I said, the more you rewatch, the more you just realize Tony is not a likeable guy at all!! However, like the topic of this video, Tony definitely knew all this which is why he never considered even harming his uncle. As evil as he was, Uncle Junior may have been the only man in the show other than Artie and Sil who Tony genuinly loved in a sincere way as anybody else who even dared do a fraction of the things his uncle did would have been dead on the spot ages ago.
Junior was a psychopath who killed for petty reasons. That's not up for debate. Killing Dickie had nothing to do with steering Tony towards the Mafia. How do we know this? Junior was the one who schooled Tony after Dickie died. It wasn't Johnny. It was Junior.
Secondly, Junior was not a nice boss compared to Tony. The literal first thing Junior did was increase taxes and order Hesh's guys beaten and taxed. The only reason Junior eased up on the gas was because Tony and Johnny Sack called a sitdown. If Junior had maintained control of the family someone else would have killed him. He quickly set himself on the path that got Paul Castellano shot.
Also, old timers in all walks of life tend to respect elders more than the younger generations irregardless of whether or not the respect is warranted. New York mobsters are in New York. Not Jersey. So that's not any actual reason to think Junior is a better boss or nicer boss. Not actually being around people tends to inflate reputations.
If Tony had killed Junior, I think he would have been in trouble with the other mafia families. The other families may have looked at it as a violation being how high ranked he was. Also junior had been in the mafia for most of his life he more than likely had personal relationships with the bosses of the other families
Tony seems to have seperated Junior the uncle from Junior the business rival. As part of their "business", he dealt with Junior by making him a figurehead boss and taking away 95% of his earnings. But as part of their private relationship, he still carried his uncle in his arms at the end of the episode (after Junior fell in the shower).
I believe Jr still had the ability to generate lots of money for the family, whether it be drugs, extortion, gambling etc. Junior was still a big money maker, and in the end that's what it's all about. Jr. was also respected by NY.
Well, I don't know about that. Johnny Sack, underboss of one of the five families, was in on making a fool of Jr and knew of the "lightning rod"-plan all along. This must have become apparent for Jr at one point or another, recalling the meeting about Jr taxing Hesh and how they all played Jr by appealing to his ego, his notion of "being the boss".
Drugs? The big conflict between Tony and Jr in season 2 was about Jr wanting to sell cocaine along the garbage routes to get a steady stream of income to pay his legal bills. Tony was against drugs from the beginning and never changed his position about keeping drugs out of his businesses. The risk was too high.
Despite causing additional problems for Tony through all six seasons Jr, at least after he got arrested in s. 1, was a big reason that the family bled money because of the trial being costly.
I subscribe to the idea of family ties vs criminal family ties and Tony did avenge his Jr trying to kill him by killing all of his capos and foot soldiers. I don't believe Jr would have been killed if he didn't go to jail, the purpose of killing Mikey Palmice and Chucky Signore was to strip him of power (officially, this time) by removing the people who he depended on lower in his hierarchal structure in order to maintain street power.
Uncle Junior’s mistake was sending Boyz II Men to whack Tony.
I always disliked that scene. The first guy misses than literally runs up so close that Tony was able to grab his gun. Then the second idiot shoots his friend in the head and proceeds to do the same thing his buddy did by getting so close that Tony was able to also grab his gun. They could have done better with that hit scene but whatever, still the greatest show of all time.
Motownphilly back again
@@jjones9822yeah that scene is more about setting a precedent that Tony can be killed and JR willing to take him out. Rather than an actual hit. It’s unlike any other hit in the show. The only other missed hit in the show is Chris and Pauly’s infamous Russian kill. 😊
I hear Next was in the running...
Shawn stockman can’t shoot worth a shit. Joking aside, that is one of the most unrealistic murder attempts. No one is that lucky.
When Junior shot Tony in the season finale, the latter believed until the end of the series that Junior had done it on purpose; that he had betrayed his nephew again. Even when Tony visited Junior and realized that his uncle’s mind had decayed, there’s no indication on whether Tony connected the dots and noticed that Junior may have attacked him under the influence of his dementia.
I think he did, that’s why when he walked off he was crying.
I mean, I think that’s a pretty reasonable conclusion right? That he did forgive junior. It wouldn’t make sense really otherwise.
@@princegobi5992 correct , that was the whole point of their last scene together. It sucked seeing junior not knowing he use to run half of jersey.
Tony sheds a tear while leaving, and explaining to Junior that him and his dad ran North Jersey. He realizes in that moment that Junior lost his mind and it wasnt out of ill intent.
@@toddpick8007 correct , junior always loves telling Tony that he was still his boss and ran the family. Him not saying saying that confirmed he wasn’t the same junior
Tony and junior's relationship was definitely complicated eventhough they both plotted to have the other whacked at one point they did love eachother eventhough junior thought he had to take tony out he wasn't happy about it he didn't even want to hear the details from mikey and as angry as tony was I don't think he really wanted junior dead because he had from the time he got out on house arrest to make a move on him but he didn't I know he put him in position to be the front boss and take the heat but that wasn't the only reason tony didn't take him out
Deep down there was respect for each other and love. In their business, their family ties were stronger than with other mafia members.
Let's not forget that Melfi address this many times, but particularly so just before Tony gets shot by Junior: he's fixated on blaming his mother for all what's wrong in his life, he won't let go of that hatred (we also see this in the 'Camelot' episode), he'd rather think of her mother as this criminal mastermind who totally had Junior for the balls. Accepting Junior's attempted hit on him also means to accept Livia's complexity as a human being, and ultimately, acknowledging that Johnny Boy was a bad father.
Also: huge teller that Carmela never forgave Junior.
that episode "where's Johnny" is a hell of an episode, not a mediocre scene in that whole episode and all kinds of different things happen from different storylines, and genius of it is how Tony is mad at Junior for bringing up the varsity shit and asks Junior to not bring it up again and Junior brings it up again and Tony stops talking to him because of it but then later he realizes that Junior actually forgets about that because of his Alzeimer, so it's not that he meant to bring it up two back to back times to hurt Tony, it's that he's being aggressive because of his mental state and he brings it up two back to back times because he doesn't remember that Tony asked him not to bring up the varsity shit, and that's why Tony forgives him at the end of the episode and realizes Junior doesn't even know what he's doing, it's a little detail that I didn't realize until I watched it for a third time, I used to think Junior was being spiteful on purpose but turns out his memory was gone and he was aggressive because he's sick.
Just goes to show season 1 is amazing.
As someone who's dealt with that sort of thing, it hit home hard. That, and when Tony asks Junior, "When you repeat these things - why can't it ever ben something nice?"
Junior was more useful alive than dead, but Tony clearly had affection for this uncle. He did fill in as his caretaker when he shot him. Easily could not have and got someone else to do it.
Johnny Ola actually survived the assassination attempt by Michael Corleone, then returned to his Soprano family to resume his criminal career.
I heard he knew New Jersey like the back of his hand. :)
Fredo knew Johnny Ola
The De Meo’s were a family not a crew. Tony executed members of Junior’s crew, not “his capo’s.”
They're nothing but a glorified crew
Right. And none of the other capos even liked Junior. Except Richie, but he wasn't out yet in season 1.
If he knew Junior had killed Dickie I wonder would he still spare him?
No but thats not canon, its just rubbish they made up for that BLM movie
@@punchyMiddleEarth very observant. The slip and fall school of Newark
@@punchyMiddleEarthBLM movie?
@@punchyMiddleEarthyeah can you imagine if the woke writers of today wrote Sopranos? They’d make Tony go to therapy, Meadow would date a black guy, they’d have a gay mobster at one point. It would be terrible.
@@aidankeohane3370I think the irony is lost on our friend 😂😂.
Junior: come heavy or not at all
Jinny: understood
🤦♂
I don’t think Tony was built to be a great leader at all. He suffers from panic attacks from stress and anxiety. His decisions are so short sided. How could he think it wouldn’t get back to Junior that he was running things? Also, telling his blabber mouth wife and kids that he was seeing a therapist. He lucked out by overpowering his assassins. He also could have absolutely lost to Richie Aprile in season 2 who was an old school gangster who was NOT intimidated by Tony’s size (very much like Joe Pesci characters). He lucked out when Janice settled that problem. In Better Call Saul/Breaking Bad, Mike tells a great story about a letting a wife beater off the hook when he was a cop. The wife beater ended up killing the wife. Mike said he would never take “half measures”
again. Tony always takes half measures. That is the story of his life. Didn’t take over after Jackie and let Junior pretend to be boss; didn’t go all the way therapy so he got worse; didn’t kill junior who ended up shooting him; didn’t do the right thing by handing over Tony B to NY which ended up causing a war. According to Chase, that led to the final scene, fade to black. Killed by a NY hit man. Half measure Tony Soprano!
I love junior but I wish we had 1 more season of him on the street still
The main point is that Tony could accept that Junior was following the rules of the life. Tony tricking Junior into believing he’s boss is a killable offense. That’s why he never forgave his mother. She wasn’t in the life so.
If Junior had been murdered by Tony in Season 1 then Tony wouldn’t have had the council and advice he so often needed and he could have been murdered sooner or attempts on his life would have drive Tony to paranoia.
Case in point Richy Arprille, Ralph Ciffaretto, the NY Lupertazzi family all would have eventually come gunning for him.
I don't think Tony ever gave up on the outside possiblity of needing to wack Junior
It looked like to me in the last scene Tony and Junior had in the hospital Tony was still
unsure as to whether Junior was still playing a long game.
I think he finally walked away believing Junior truly was in lala land though.
Tony valued blood and was very nostalgic. Hence, why he had such difficulty offing Christopher and Tony B, even though they deserved it many times over. Same goes for Uncle Junior
Tony spared Feech too. Maybe he just has more respect for the old timers.
He only spared Feech because he was popular amongst the guys. He wasn't like Richie where no one lost sleep over his "disappearance". Feech being killed would have put Tony in a bad spot with the crew.
Feech wasn't really spared though, he was condemned to die in prison and never see the free world again.
Tony was going to kill Junior but Junior was miraculous saved by a man from another Galaxy named Tony Egg!
My brudda Billy would still be alive if it wasn't for dat cawksacka pìece Blundetto.
Yea, it's sad when they go young like that
your brother Billy, whatever happened there..
Take it easy
@@Dungeon_of_Rap when they go
That fucking animal Blundetto
Putting aside the blood connection, it was better to fool the cops and feds into thinking they had caught the boss by leaving Junior alive.
Also another reason for keeping Junior around in later seasons (and maybe my own timeline is messed up) - Nancy Marchand passing. She was the older person who Tony could go to for certain interactions.
Ultimately I love that they kept Dominic Chianese around - a fantastic actor and one hell of a singer.
You and others cover a lot of the reasons but I also think when Junior was under investigation and the FBI arrested him Junior refused to talk and all but dismissed the idea Tony was the boss. In that moment, despite the fact the two basically went to war with each other and despite Junior being an old man with no bright future left, refused to sell out Tony. He stuck to the code, protected everyone at a critical moment in which Junior really didn't have much to gain. Junior needed Tony in that moment to help with finances and intimidating the jury, Tony needed Junior's silence, it worked out for both and Junior kept the respect he had.
Johnny Ola always had the makings of a varsity player.
Junior reminds me of some of my relatives always attacking the younger family members because of their own short comings. Respect your elders ONLY if they are respectful.
You never had the makings of a Captain Teebs, running a chain of luxury hotels.
I always enjoy your videos. Given the dearth of decent mob movies and series, how much content do you feel you have left? In fairness, now you have done most of the low hanging fruit, some of your more recent videos are super interesting because they get below the surface. Keep up the good work!
Cineranter your sopranos videos are always top notch, thanks for making them, big fan
“One he loves the man, he his father’s brother and two he has New York behind him” Tony’s words
Which scene?
Mob Boss, Sparano and his glorified crew were handled the beating of a lifetime from Butch.
“I’m sorry who’s speaking is somebody speaking??”
Junior: Believe me there's plenty I'd like to forget.
Tony: Yeah you and me both.
I always felt that ultimately Tony's best way of winning was to keep Junior as boss while running the crew away from the spotlights from the law.
He knew that by killing Junior, the repercussions from the law and others within the mafia would be impossible, business wise.
I am sure some family love was involved and killing a 'made' old man would also potentially bring some shame to the family too.
It was jarring to see Evil Tony, or Final Season Tony, still clearly have love for Junior. Makes me think what if Livia was to have lived long enough to encounter Evil Tony, how would they interact?
Uncle Junior looks like the Six Flags guy.
Hit it on the head with Tony still saw him as the Uncle who played ball with him as a kid,Junior was in the life with Tony and one of the only people he could talk to about business and Tony did back door him with the Capos so it even out and Tony knew it.
Plus, Junior and Tony had a plan to go down to the Bing and f*k 'em all.
Junior really went from mentor to mental. When he tried to make that milkshake, my estimation of him fukin plummeted
The killing of brother Fredo Corleone turned Michael Correlone into an unredeemable monster.
If Tony killed his Uncle he would have been killing off his character at the same time as the
audience would never have forgiven him for it. The show needed its strongest character and best actor to be someone the audience actually liked. If he killed his uncle that is all anyone would have seen for the rest of 'The Sopranos'
It works for a 2.5-hour movie but not an almost 90 hour saga.
Superb critique once again young man and a salient point to highlight because I'm sure many of us wondered why Tony gave him a pass. Best wishes for Thanksgiving over the Pond there. 👍 🙏🇬🇧
Junior had the funniest lines in the entire series!
Ya, and I'm playing shortstop for the Mets.
You tell me to take a shit on the deck of the Queen Mary,
they'll be hosing it down with disinfectant within the hour.
If Tony accepted the fact that he didn’t have the makings of a varsity athlete. The fact that Jun loved him regardless was why Tony forgave him. We all know how important having the makings of a varsity athlete is to Jun.
Junior was the lightning rod who took all the hits
He left Junior in place because he was a lightning rod for the Feds and indictments. If Junior was dead- it would be Tony as the sole “boss of the family” who they’d be going after. Junior was a shield for Tony and Tony appeased Juniors need to be seen and spoken of as the one calling the shots but really Junior didn’t hold much power at all.
I think it really was just as simple as Tony and Junior loved each other a great deal but Tony's move left him no choice cause he couldn't let an usurpation stand no matter who it was.
You can see Junior doesn't want it by the way he avoids talking about it and is throwing up waiting on news when normally he'd be talking their ears off and wanting every detail and would be completely undisturbed, and Tony is very bothered by it even if he seems to accept it.
Junior did what he had to do, it failed so Tony responded in kind and started working his way through his crew but only 2 guys in the feds scoop up much of the rest and Junior's incarceration and legal issues take him outta the fight so the threat to T was neutralized and Junior could keep his name by making such a difficult move, win-win really.
I also think in a way Junior admired or respected Tony's way of thinking even if it was mad disrespectful and against their codes, T had to respect the fact that Jun did what he had to, both had to respect the fight the other had, and it was better all around for them to put it behind them.
Also, Junior's legal issues made it almost impossible for them to continue a war because of the financial strain and near constant surveillance.
On top of that Tony needed things that were only found in Junior's head like their car connection, the executive game roster, the union contacts, and who knows how many similar things, on top of all the guidance, mentorship, info on people, walks down memory lane, etc, Junior was valuable to Tony even if T didn't feel a thing for em.
Doubtless Junior loved Tony deep down but as the conversation when Junior was debating Richie Aprile over Tony to Bobby. Even Bobby said he was amazed as Junior’s summation of Tony’s power was dead on. As jealous as Junior could be, he respected Tony as well as loving him.
I’ve been waiting like patience on a monument for a Mr. Magoo video.
After he heard the tapes and realized Junior had basically no way or reason on killing him there was no point. I think killing Junior would've only brought bad things.
Tony loved junior & junior loved Tony but juniors resentment of knowing that Tony actually ran the jersey mob behind his bk always limited juniors love for him.
I think it was because Tony never had the makings of a varsity athlete
Small hands that was his problem
Maybe Tony was sentimental about playing catch with uncle Junior. He remembers pitching, not catching.
You outta know, sweetie
@@samgrez7140 whadid you say?
@@Rick_Riff what?! We're just breaking balls!?
@@samgrez7140 I gotta take a piss... Heya hold dis BAM!
@@Rick_Riff ah my eye!!!!
Because the game always goin be the game
Always with the sarcasms with you
Jokes aside I have always been asking myself this question. Great vids bruv.
No leeway, no compromise, just stupid Fu Kien jokes.
Bushmen of the Calamari, I love it
People don't realize Junior was the boss, Tony was the underboss for the entire time. But as he put it the crew only listened to tony "he made the shots" that pissed junior off. Also Tony was business minded. He didn't give in to personal anger but with tracee because he reminded her of Meadow they were about the same age.
Tony gets rid of people only if it hurts the business. That's why he took him a while to order the hit on vito.
Why didn't he get rid of junior? I think because they are blood related and because of the business perspective. What message does it send to the other mob families if he did? Frequentable guy or not?
These families watched out with who they do business with, what kind of individual they're dealing with. At least, in Tony's perspective. He played it smart. He could have been the real boss right away if he wanted to.
Great video…thanks!
You made great points love ur videos
Great video. Very aligorical.
It also would have been very difficult for Tony to have Junior killed after season 1 even if he wanted to, as Junior was under constant surveillance by the feds from when his house arrest began until he goes to the mental health facility.
He was dead to him. Livia too.
Because junior made the right decision when he found out he was being used as a front. Tony would of respected that as it’s the life they’ve chose.
nice vid what you want a boutineer ?
Enchiladas tonight.
Tony really wanted to see if he could get his shy running right
Get that guy who ate his Lo mein and Mallo mars.
You may run North Jersey, but you don't run your Uncle Junior, how many hours fucking hours did I spend playing catch with you? 😂
My own observation..if you watch the entire season..it seems like as Junior starts to get his Alsheimers..so does Tony's effectiveness as a boss. I believe as much as Tony thought he could run the family. he always sought Juniors guidance. In the end in that hospital..the last time he saw him in the show..it just seems like you could feel the end of Tony's reign coming one way or another. He had gained so many resentments against him I believe in part because of not having Juniors years of experience of running things to fall back on.
Tony wouldn't kill junior cuz he sees June like a father figure
I think he would have but the FBI got to Junior first and it was one of those things were Tony took a step back and realized he still had a use for Junior and he still had respect for him.
Imagine if Michael Corleone had the same mindset towards Fredo like Tony towards Junior.
Imagine…Fredo represented zero threat afterwards and was almost certainly a dupe anyway.
ITS A RETIREMENT COMMUNITY 5:05
Tony Soprano was a savage when he wanted to be, and a grimy snake as well, but he was kind of weak as the boss of the family. He let a few things slide that no real mob boss would let slide. Compared to real life mafia workings, the Sopranos is maybe 50% realistic. Still a great show though, and one of the best tv series ever made, with a ton of superb actors.
"Peppers and Eggs!? That's what I should have".
You forget during the meeting with the other capo's Tony mentions that JR has New York behind him meaning he has pull with the five families. If he goes down suddenly they all have targets on their backs.
He loved the man.
Honestly Tony loves his uncle
Junior always had the best lines in the whole series but besides that Tony always knew Junior had reason to take him out by going and planting him as boss and the lightning rod for the fbi and still controlling the crew. That was some really underhanded shit..
It made sense that he forgave him after he tried to kill him, but I found it stupid that everyone hated him after he shot Tony given that he obviously wasn't acting consciously.
Junior and Livia and indeed all of Tony's family are symbols of The other family the treachery, the respect, the money, the unambiguous, the disengaged, the disenfranchised, the dead old ways.
Tony knew it was wrong being a back door boss. That Junior was in his right as Boss to clip Tony for meeting behind his back.
Junior as his blocker from the feds was worth more. Plus tony really did love Junior
Plot armor. Writers like writing him armor. What's it matter what people think? Oh....... UA-camrs say that to generate comments. Damn got me again.
The main reason for keeping Jr around was he was the “Lightning Rod” at the top the man with
“stripes” the FBI target
Could think of it as Jr isn't a threat by season 2 once his crew was dead and sometimes better to keep your friends close and your enemies closer. Not to mention that he still has value in clout alive than dead and it would look bad to kill him when he wasn't a rat, and forgiving past murders is just a part of the life it's a part of doing business. look at what Johnny sac asked Phil to do, overlook that animal blundetto out of killing his brother for the sake of business
If Jr wanted to he could of backed Richie Aprille and had Tony wacked in season 2. Richie would of been Jr's underboss but Jr thought he was better off with Tony. He knew Tony was still in his pocket.
@@jamesw7072 that is another interesting sign of respect between the two that Jr chooses Tony and lets him in on the betrayal
But yeah he could have made a move even with his weakened state
2:35 prononuced Mikey PAL ME CE
He does that multiple times in various videos
The main reason behind it was that Uncle Junior got indicted before Tony had a chance to kill him. Tony had already put out the order. It hard to kill a man if the Feds have him
Occam's razor: it's simply plot armor. The only reason Tony is alive and the only reason everyone else too, those that mattered anyway.
Because as far as the Feds knew, they had the boss of Jersey charged and on trial for his life, taking some heat off of him
Good question
It was about Junior being completely powerless while also the focus of the Feds’ investigations.
All of Junior’s guys were dead except Bobby Baccala, who was seen as a joke at that time. He was under federal indictment and house arrest. The Feds trying and failing to convict him for RICO was a colossal waste of time and resources for them that they couldn’t put into trying to get Tony.
Family may have played a part but Tony was well aware of how important it was to obscure his activities from the Feds. Throwing that away by whacking a guy under indictment would have just moved attention straight back to him.
He may have had conflicted feelings but pragmatism about his own ability to operate was the reason IMHO.
Sometimes life isn’t a simple line. I remember reading puzzo writing about Salvatore Giuliano being amazed at being in a round room. I laughed until I tried to remember if I had been in a round room. There are things that motivate a person that are obvious only when we bother to examine them.
Lol which I guess is the point of this channel
He never had the makings of a varsity athlete!
It was a heated gamer moment. Tony understands.
I can put this video in four words. He’s a lightning rod
It was just business, even Tony understood that in the end