I think the biggest error most amateur players make is to hit it hard with a fast swing. A steady swing and getting the ball squarely in the middle of the club face is much more effective than the wild thrash. That's why when you look at a good player they usually have a fairly slow looking rhythmic swing. All the speed comes in the final part just before you hit the ball and it's hard to get that bit of crucial timing correct if you are thrashing at the ball. The best bit advice I was ever given as a junior was from the old pro at Ballycastle golf club, Vince Stewart, - he alway said 'you have to learn to hit it easy to hit it hard' . I am 60 still play off 6.7 and hit the ball 250 to 265 but more importantly 70% of my drives stay on the fairways.
Wow that's amazing , you are more accurate than Collin morikawa a mayor winner and number 10, perhaps you should give the other 190 PGA Tour pros some advice to improve their accuracy.
I disagree nothing wrong with smashing the ball if you move your body right and put in the practice time I started golfing 3 months ago and can already hit over 320 and weight 155.
I can verify my drives at my local range, I've even used my range finder to check accuracy of the distances. The range tops out at about 305 (woods cut off the back). My drives consistently reach those woods. Here's the thing. my putting and my accuracy with said driver arent great (big slices etc) , so while yes I can rocket a ball out a long way, that doesn't mean im an above average golfer, just an above average club speed.
By consistent, I mean I have played about 7 or 8 rounds. But I practice with smaller irons on a par 3 course more often. 1x a week for the past 3 months. Sw 100-120, GW 120-140, PW 140-160. Anything less than 100 could be any club depending. I stink too, 22 handicap according to Garmin. But, I have those clubs pretty dialed in.
What a thoughtful and informative video. Sam Tremlett’s delivery is a joy to listen to, very professional and interesting. I think most club players worry that they are not striking the ball as well as they should, or could be - whereas this video demonstrates that they are probably not as bad as they may believe. I have been playing with the guys in my four-ball for many years and we all have deteriorated in distance as we age but at least this proves that we are still playing pretty well (new WHS approx 20hcp), considering the youngest of us, myself, being in early 60s and still hitting it average 220-250yds total (carry and roll-out). I am disappointed that I can’t quite get it up closer to 300 as I used to 10 years ago but that’s ageing for you! Thank you for posting. Great video!!
Good information, it gives me a reference point on comparison with the best in the game, as well as my peers. Would like to see PW, 7i, 5 I, and 3w averages.
I'm a vintage golfer myself, playing old-school gear, such as persimmon woods, forged blade irons, and a hickory shafted putter, and I'm 67. With my persimmon Hogan driver I average about 210 yards, with my longest being in the 230-240 range. I play from the red tees, since I've lost a lot of distance due to age. However, I'm OK with the distances I get, since I'll never play on the PGA Tour, and I play golf just for fun.
@@LemThurdy420 not really. The feeling you get when you hit a persimmon driver right on the screws is indescribable! Same with hitting a forged blade iron. Golf is a lot more than mere distance.
golf is fun as heck, eh! Maybe this is because I think the grass is greener, but as someone who can hit it far - golf is most fun when you're picking your spots, at any distance :D I love hitting 4 irons in a row on a par 5 lol maybe even 5 or 6 aha
I'm a budget golfer. I inherited, and started playing with, my dad's clubs that I kind of inherited after he passed away (Mom was just going to donate them to a thrift store, since none of the rest of us played golf...but I was interested in trying it out, at least...) It was another 15 years before I finally got around to using them. Had to replace the driver right away as a big chunk of the head broke off the first time (ONLY time) I used it (no, I didn't hit the ground, or a tree, or anything except the ball). I'm also about 6" taller than Dad was, so his clubs were uncomfortably short. But I don't make anywhere near enough money to go spend $1000 on (budget) custom-fit clubs...but I found a set I liked at a thrift store. Upgraded a couple of years ago--with another, newer, thrift store set of irons, and some substituted hybrids and wedges that I've picked up here and there. I don't think I've paid more than $45 for anything in my bag, and probably under $100 for the entire kit (except my rangefinder...which, while still a bargain-basement model, probably cost more than all my clubs combined). As long as you're enjoying what you're doing on the course, play with what you like. Golf has this weird elitist streak which, fortunately, I see far more often in commentary here than I see on the course--to listen to some of the comments on here, anyone who's using clubs made more than five years ago, or who doesn't regularly break 85, should drop the game. Fortunately, at least at the courses where I play, players are more interested in whether or not you're enjoying being out on the course than assessing your gear or questioning whether or not you're "good enough" to even play with them. Not everyone plays golf to smash 350 yard drives and break par on every other hole. Some of us are enjoying the fresh air and the scenery and appreciating the chance to move and stretch in ways that our 'normal' lives don't often allow us to do. Of course, we still like a good, solid drive and are thrilled with pars and birdies...but they're gravy, they don't define what a good day of golf is for us. If your time on the course is fulfilling your needs, it's nobody's business but your own what kind of clubs you play with.
Been there. It's best just to let the game speak for itself. I stopped saying what I shoot as soon as I realized I wasn't fully understanding the swing and what I was trying to achieve. It also helped me focus more and not worry about trying to impress anyone. Doing pretty good now because of it.
I am a 72 year old golfer, reaching scratch handicap in my 20's, now 8.6. Recently had a driver optimisation session, and with the best of a selection of shafts, increased clubhead speed by 3 mph and carry by 15 yards.
This information is excellent to know! I always thought my drives weren't good, but know I know they're good so start working on other things instead and start smiling more of the TEE!
I think you'll find that the biggest difference between high handicappers and low is the game inside 100 yards although I agree with the stats that there is a strong correlation with driving distance.
The match b/w Cantlay and Bryson shows there's more than one way to get it done. I play with plenty of guys who hit it 40 yards further, but I can still beat them. It's how many, not how.
@@davidsnyder8503 yes, I played golf once with a former coworker, an Irish guy, who proceeded to stomp my ass with nothing but 7 iron down and he only hits that 7 iron 165 or so! I learned that day that fairway finder shots are far more valuable than those miracle 300 yarders or those eagle attempts!!! I couldn't believe how good he played while never hitting it more than 180!
Also course management/decision making. My course has several holes where left side or right side of fairway make a significant difference for approach to green. Same with mishits to the rough, I see so many players fight their way down the rough instead of getting to a good position for the next shot.
Drive for show, put for dough. I am usually within a 9 iron from my drives apart from par 5. Then it goes downhill. That’s the difference of an average golfer and a good golfer. One of my golf partners is often in trouble off the tee but nearly always gets himself onto the green with his short game. He is single figures. That’s the fun of golf!
To be fair.. I think more newer golfers have taken up the sport.. bringing down the group average. Arguably.. the distance should be gaining by a few inches every year.. and not 10 yards. But I agree the clubs can’t get that much better.
How much is the player's ability to strike well and how is the club technology. clearly, the skill is a constant and the technology is not helping much. Given the new advances in knowledge and training techniques, I would expect those that get lessons and apply themselves should play better but it's marginal I think. I remember playing in the Philippines at a local course where the club champ played a round against a local caddie, the caddie won and he was self-taught with an old eclectic bag built up of gimmies over years. Skill trumps all in golf.
I hate be disagreeable, but the average PGA Tour driving distance in the 1970s was 250 yards, in 2021 it is 295 yards. So maybe it is like inflation, from one year to the next there does not seem to be much change, but over 50 years there is a LOT of change. In the 1970s the US median home price was about $25000, in 2021 it is about $375,000.
@@warrenb2856 lol Yes indeed, Titanium oversized heads and the new balls made a huge impact, but I think in the last 15 years not much change. Amazing to think how far the guy's hit in the 60/70's with those clubs and balls. What was the price of a driver in 1970? dam near $1000 NZD here in New Zealand 2021.
Thanks for this would like to see the results for irons. Funny how in Summer with hard ground, wind behind and down hill that distance becomes the "norm" for some.
I wonder how they factor in consistency. I'm pretty athletic, can hit it over 300 - but it's all over the place. if they count me at 300, then technique makes even more of a difference because I'm only actually hitting a couple 300 yard drives in the fairway out of my entire round. Really working on consistency, I love a nice popcorn hitter who can hit it where they want, that's real golfing. I love a good solid lay up shot, maybe my favorite shot in golf.
@@truecrimejungle How old are you? In my younger days - in my 20s back in the 1980s, I could hit 250-260- but never 300 so you are hitting pro distance there. Of course balls and equipment have advanced since then, but still 300 is very good. Anyways I'm in my 50s now and started up again last year after 18 years away from golf. In my 50s now and I a quickly discovered I could not get my body to swing as fast. So instead I have been focussing on hitting straight and also being lethal with a wedge from between 80-100 yards. Ive always been a decent irons player but atrocious with my driver - terrible slicer. Been working really hard on driver recently trying to eliminate that slice and yesterday I finally cracked it. I had a eureka moment after watching an instructional video and that did it. Yesterday I hit 5 drives 250 straight as an arrow. My point being - I reckon I swung not more than 85mph - it felt slow - and yet I felt the power. I run a video blog here on youtube and I will be doing a post on what changed my drive swing. I would be interested to know how fast you reckon you are swinging?
@@pilgrimgolfer9705 if he's hitting around 300 the speed is likely around 110-115mph. I usually hit around 270-280 with around a 100-105mph speed. Carry distance correlates to around 2.5x-2.7x the swing speed
1:20 That's actually quite impressive. Goes to show how many enthusiastic new golfers are in the game. Not just people new to the game, but people that are new and would get into Arcos as well.
Me(30) and my wife(27) just started playing this year. We are having fun but it is very challenging. For context we are both athletic and have played about 6 times and about 10times at the range, no lessons yet. I’m not sure if the video numbers are carry distance or not but our stats when making contact are as follows: Me- ~230-260 carry with an occasional 270-280 mystery. Her- ~190-210 with an occasional 220-230 she seems much more consistent with her driving distance. Overall our consistency is kinda trash but those few great shots really keep you coming back. Got my first birdie a couple weeks ago.
I started golfing around 2 months ago. I have a horrible slice about 60% of the time but when it all comes together I can get out to ~275. Gonna take some lessons this winter.
I appreciate the work that went into this. I should be hitting around 180-210 based on your analysis. My swing speed is probably lower than average though. I'm curious how driver loft plays a role in this analysis. I suppose we can assume that these measurements are based on players that have optimized their driver loft based on their swing speed, which is still a factor I need to determine for myself. I recently moved to a driver with lower loft (from 10° to 9.5°) but based on my guess at my swing speed I need to be moving to a higher loft like 12°. My swing speed is quite low I imagine so a higher loft would benefit me.
Being able to hit it long with a driver helps make the game so much easier. Like time to get off the putting green and hit the driving range type of thing.
I feel a bit better about my driver range after watching this video. I am in the range of my handicap and within range of my handicap goal. Thanks for posting this video!
I remember when I started to play golf again after 30 years (after playing a little bit as a student in my youth) how impressed I was with my first session at the driving range. I was easily driving it 30 meters or more past the 200 meter marker. I couldn't understand why many people would believe that it was such a big deal to hit it past 200 meters. With just a little bit of practice I could get beyond 300 meters easily, I thought. I became almost convinced that it must just be my natural talent - until I realized that I was confusing the 150 meter with the 200 meter marker.
Completely validates what I thought was the case through observation. I'm 49 and I've been playing golf for 3 years now. My drives average around 220 yards, whilst more experienced players with better technique are hitting comfortably further, despite often being less athletic. I'm obviously going to lose distance as I get older, so I intend to improve my technique to compensate. The data in this video would appear to suggest its perfectly possible, so hard work is the plan.
This bears out what I've known for years - that the vast majority of amateur golfers have no business hitting from the tips, or even one tee up from the tips. It is pure ego. How many times have I seen someone hit from a back tee on a 410 yard par 4, only to hit it a maximum of 180 yards. Now the approach to the green is still wildly unreachable even if they teed the ball up again and hit driver. Moving up to a more realistic distance not only makes the game more enjoyable, it speeds things up.
I agree. I argue with people that I play with about tee boxes. I have a short drive of about 190. When I play par 4 holes north of 360 yards, I tell them that I should move up to the "senior" tees. The PGA and USGA agree that the tee box should be chosen by how far you hit your drive, not how old you are. It's frustrating playing 4 or 5 holes a round that are farther than you can reach in two shots or three shots(for par 5 holes).
I played with two 60 year olds the other day. Before the round started they told my buddy and I that they will be playing from the red tees and I mentioned that I should probably play with them(partly joking). They then asked me how old I was and I said I was 50, their response was in 10 more years you can. Of course they proceeded for the rest of the day to hit the ball 250 yards on their drives and even drove the green on some short par four dogs legs. Oh well, I enjoy playing and don’t want to sound like a poor sport(which I probably already do, lol).
Wow I have a lot more distance than I thought. I'm 31 years old, about a 15-20 handicap, but drive it around 275, sometimes hitting just over 300 when I really get a hold of it. My irons are ok, but my short game has always been my weakness. Been working on that all summer and has really improved!
@@alienrenders hell...there is a guy right now claiming 165+ with a God damn 8 iron that is traditional lofted in this same comment thread! He would need a 115mph club head speed to do that! Anyone know how damn hard it is to swing an 8 iron 110+mph!?
@@davids9192 Absolutely. Mine travel total anywhere from 190-300 yards, the 300 being once a year in perfect conditons . The issue with the majority is they take that drive they hit once a year and class it as their average lol.
At 47 I hit the ball further and straighter as I've spent more time on technique and rounds played. I love golf, but as a young man I didnt understand the subtleties. UA-cam, seriously changed my game. Wish Ialong it all along.
I use Arccos for data. It gives you a rating in each aspect of the game ( Driving, Approach, Short , Putting) At handicap 12 ( until winter struck) Arccos allows me to compare how I am travelling in comparison to scratch or any other handicap I choose. At age 67 and new-ish to golf, I chose handicap of 8 as my target, thinking I probably don't have enough time left to make scratch. Anyway, if I use your figures of 202 yards for a 65 year old, my 198 yards in winter isn't too bad. I get 214.5 yards in summer, when we get roll on the fairways. Arccos consistently tells me that Driving is my weak area, due to lack of distance for my handicap, so knowing this data with an age filter is encouraging.
@@warrenb2856 thanks mate. We are still in lock down and golf is closed, so no practice for weeks to come . At least our course is drying out after a very wet winter. Missing ideal spring conditions is hurting !
I feel a LOT better now when I only hit my driver 230. Being 26 handicap there is still hope for me on getting to the 250+ range I feel now. Also I can tell my friends now I’m above average in length haha.
@@gowithgid3274 I play whites (which is middle most the courses around me). I just started playing like 6 months ago so just wanted to hit the ball constantly first, before I took lessons which I do plan on doing very soon. Goal is to try and get the single digits in a few years. Mostly just work on my putting (a ton), chipping, and pitching at the moment (since those are the aspects I definitely enjoy the most). My iron play is definitely my biggest weakness though. Followed my inconstancy on tee shots. Either I really have it, or I don’t at all haha.
@@ShawnyBGolf That's why I mention your iron game. Also---any instructor might want you to dial back the drive to keep it playable. Welcome to the most fun and frustrating game in the world. :-)
@@gowithgid3274 yeah I just started using driver a few weeks ago (actually use my buddies because he begged me to, because I don’t have one and mostly use my 5 wood haha) I swing it maybe 2/3rds speed (learned I hit it harder taking a slow easy swing then trying to crush it haha) and it doesn’t seem to really go to far off into the rough it does. Again I might only use it maybe 3/4 holes if I’ve been swinging my 5 wood well that day. I’m 6’7 and use to play college football so I think my long arms and just natural strength might be what leads to that distance, not so much trying to kill it to get that distance. My iron play definitely what leads to my high scores, since if I go practice I only go to the chipping and pitching area haha. Definitely appreciate all the tips and tricks. Definitely need it while I grow as a player and document it all on here too haha.
The fact that my drive lives in the scratch player territory (about 260-270 yards) but my scores live in the 30 Handicap territory proves I really need to work on my short game.
@@jeromeo12 that's only partially true, I've really been working hard on that one aspect of my game as my goal this summer was to adjust my wood swing mechanics to rid myself of a life long slice. I've succeeded and have seen it bear fruits of extra yardage. Truth be told, I'm more of a 230-250 hitter who have hit about 260-270 25% like you said, but without the penalty strokes. I lose a lot less golf balls nowadays, so my bad golf floor has risen to natural double / triple bogeys, and my good golf is in the par / bogey range. I've even had a couple of birdies on par 5's... something that never happened before. Shawn Clement's UA-cam channel has helped me so much. My focus is now shifting to 100 yards to the pin, where I hear real golf is played. I'm ready to tackle that area.
I generally notice different then this Graph with amateurs . The ones who hit it the farthest often have worst handicaps cus they are trying to crush the ball. But as they get better the slow their swing down a little and lose some yards but gain control. My self who's about a 25 handicap in general I've gotten down to a 20 by only doin 3\4 driver swing .
slowing the swing can cause issuse as well, but we all know higher swing speeds = higher ball speeds = more distance, but it wether you can control face to path!! but a smooth swing looks slower but if you mesure the swing speed it hasn't change.
I find this really useful. I am 57 and play off 12 with an average driving distance of 220. I was speaking to some old college buddies recently who both swear blind that they drive 250 despite having handicaps over 25. I was starting to think that I must be deteriorating really fast and have spent the last month trying to up my swing speed to very little effect apart from a more ragged looking swing and a few more lost balls. I think I'll just go back to being Mr Average.
Keep in mind that there are three totally different things a person could be thinking in terms of when talking about their driving distance. They could be thinking about: 1. Average "Long shot", i.e. "How far does the ball go when they strike it perfectly?" 2. Performance Average, i.e. "What is the average if you exclude the really bad hits?" 3. Real Average, i.e. "What is the average of all shots, both good and bad?" I would bet that the 250 number your friends gave you was their average long shot. If you factor in worm burners, sky shots, and shots that hit trees, their real average is probably closer to 200. Thus, if your real average is 220, you are probably hitting it further than they are.
I carry driver around 250 on a good strike. I’ve played with plenty of guys that say they hit the ball 300 but none of them hit even as far as me. Nobody knows how far they hit the ball.
Being a beginner golfer myself only playing for 3 months, I'm about a 25 handicap but usually drive about 260, with the odd occasion of hitting it close to 280 or 290.
@@andymckenzie9040 I'm down to about a 16 handicap now, usually hit it about 280 and 300+ when the fairway is wide open and I can go for it. Short game is pretty decent, most of the time, I hit a bad shot towards the green 100 and so on out and it causes me to lose strokes.
The arccos data is a little misleading. It takes into account ALL tee shots from Par 4s and Par 5s. I'm a perfect example of the data not matching up. Arccos says I hit my driver 270 and 3W 245, but my average "drive" is just barely over 200. This is because my local muni is very short and I rarely use anything bigger than a 5 iron off the tee.
I would bet the top guys on the senior tour have a similar driving average as the top 10% of pros, on average. The senior tour players are going to have a much tighter standard deviation on their average.
Same - as a 56 yo 11 hcap, that's what I thought was missing from the data - stats from the champions tour. Would love to know Bernhard Langer's driver stats for 2021. Lee Westwood (and Phil) are impressively long for their age.
My Arccos smart distance is 247yds, low at 226yds and high at 263yds. My longest is 316yds (down hill, down wind, rock hard fairway😁). I’m 48 years old and have an 11 handicap index
I gave up counting in my last round after +38 over 13 holes.... but I hit 270 yard dead straight drives on more than one occasion. See you on the Tour next year guys and girls!
The course I can get onto locally with minimum hassle is tight and short, so I have gravitated to a low fairway finder shot. If I ever get to a more open longer course I'll probably swing out of my shoes and slice it God knows where 😂
According to 3 different GPS golf apps, I can drive 260 regularly and have gone 290-298 with some lucky bounces, but I still am a 23hdcp. Guess I need to work on other aspects of my game. haha
For me it's all about the 100 yards and in that makes the difference. I score in the 90's. I recently gave my friend my really nice, practically new driver since he really needed a new one (Super nice friend practically family and he was the one who introduced me to golf). While I waited for my new driver to come I played a round with my longest club being a 2 hybrid (I don't use woods, can't hit them) and I shot a 91. Got my new driver a few days later, practically the same one I gave my friend and shot a 100 the following week. The difference, the round WITHOUT the driver, my short game was not that bad that day and was hitting my 2 Hybrid off the tee 195 - 215 pretty straight. The round WITH my driver, driving was pretty good but had a horrible short game that day, missed a lot of putts and chunked a lot around the green, I was using a new putter too. So if I can better my short game ( Working on it) I know I can shoot in the 80's. 5' 8, 47 with my average driving distance 235-250. SHORT GAME my friends...Short Game.
I’m 54 and have only been playing for about a year but do practice a lot. I’m 6 foot 240 if that matters. I shoot in the low 90s but have lots of room to lower this. My biggest weakness is putting and accuracy on those shots within 100 yards. My driver is a Ping G (2016) set at 9 degrees. I carry around 220 with total distance around 250. I can probably increase this some but Ive played a few times with a coworker who is a 62 year old scratch golfer. My drives are right with his. I’m fine with my distance and since changing to a single plane swing they’re all pretty much straight which at this point I’ll certainly take. I used to slice a lot.
I always am skeptical when guys claim they hit 300 yards. This is my first year really seriously playing golf. I’m 270- 275 on average with one that got to 300 with a very good tail wind. As a 40 year old 18 handicap, I’m liking the numbers and feel like my handicap will be dropping as I improve my short game.
I think that there is a slight flaw in this data model, in that as you age your distance reduces, therefore your handicap will likely increase. Because you are measuring the same handicap at all ages you're missing those players whose handicap has increased because their distance has decreased. What you're essentially measuring is those players who can maintain a low handicap while ageing. Correcting this would be a quite complex process of calculating what percentage of each age range is 0, 10 or 20 handicap then somehow adjusting the distances according to this additional data.
I use shotscope so have on-course data. I’m 45 and a 12 handicap. I average around 260 yards. Most of the single handicappers I’ve played with at my course are older guys with fantastic short games. They putt and chip so damn well. I’m longer than most of them, can’t putt near as well. I also found that my handicap dropped nicely from 15 to 12 when I stopped reaching for driver all the time, and instead thought more about what I needed to hit off the tee for the distance I want into the green. Some holes are easy par holes now because it’s just a smooth 4 iron off the tee avoiding all the danger that the driver would expose me to.
Im not a big guy and I’m a 9 hcp I drive the ball 265-270 7-10 times but I’ve had a lot of lessons on just my driver and I’m 21 and most of my buddies drive around the same except my buddy who drives about 290 very cool video to know we drive the ball well but my putting and wedges need work
Interesting to see how this is all broken down. I have also seen tables for every club out there and their respective distances. What they don't mention is that if all these clubs are taken off the tee for measurement. I hit far longer than the charts and this video show, but since the driver is measured off the tee, I measure all my other irons off the tee as well. It's after the tee shot and before 80 yd where I can be wildly inconsistent. I can hit my five iron 180 from the fairway, but I can also hit it 110 if I end up taking half the county with me before I hit the ball. I may be 56, but I'm also 6'7, and in fairly decent shape. Only been playing for about a year and a half, but I'm addicted and I can see myself playing this for the rest of my life!
I have cranked it 315 but am much more comfortable at 240-260’ish, playing it where I want to go. I have a Ping G425 SRT and I’m 55 yrs old. Hit em straight is what matters as we seen this weekend in the BMW opening
I have found that , I seem to lose distance even with a good strike in the middle with the ball launching very high, in the air long yes , way high yes but not skyed but can tell the height is losing distance
I am not surprised to see that most amateur men don't hit it as far as they profess. As a 66 year old 12 handicap the greatest thing that would help me is from 60 yards in.
Good to hear age is not the factor but ability. I hardly use Driver - I hit 3 wood 220yd and depending on roll can get to 240+yds and I am 65. It is better to be on short grass at those distances than lost or in the rough on any par 4 that is 400yds or less.
Problem with comparing the driving distance stat within Arccos is that it takes all drives on par 4 and 5 regardless of club so it will skew down the data. It would be more helpful to compare the driver club distance which I don’t think was done here.
Driving distance is 50% equipment / 50% your physical condition. Age could challenged here. I know a 48 year old who does heavy physical training, ( cross training solely for be fit at golf) Occupation Architect , drive is 250+ yards on flat fairways-290+ yards on hilly fairways, with the odd 310 yard drive. Balls mostly lake style, or what be found in the rough. Staff is a stiff shaft solely for accuracy, reg flex just too whippy.
I’m a +14 handicap and only hit it 225 (average) and 250 (maximum) carry. I played a 9 hole course today and shot -1…….so distance isn’t everything. I drive better and straighter when I hit it slowly.
One thing I just tried at the range was to swing my driver like I wanted to hit it 175 yards, not 300.... I became more accurate and the ball even went almost as far. Some went further than 300.
Players inflated views of their distance is one of the reasons for slow play. They stand waiting at 200 metres for the green to clear with their 3 wood, and can only hit it 175.
Agreed, but on the other hand as someone who hits far (for a high hcp amateur) i have been told you can’t reach them and created dangerous situations. Rather be safe than sorry tbh
I understand where you are coming from. But these golfers could not hit it 175 metres if they fired it out of a gun. And in the meantime, the blokes on the tee behind are twiddling their thumbs. All I am saying is that if you're 200m out and the last time you hit it that far was in the Hogan era, then get on with it. Cheers.
Need to agree this is a misconception. Trying to shorten the gap between flights doesn’t help with slow play. I think most of the time it’s just golfers’ weird belief they can somehow conjure up through deep meditation, meticulous analysis and excessive pre-shot routine to hit a miracle shot. The other problem is an overly distracted attitude on the course, not playing ready golf and getting in the way of flight mates.
Waiting to clear the green is not bad. Slow play is from players who take too long on the green and are not ready when it is their turn to putt. Also, players who take more than 1 practice swing that top the ball regularly.
Not sure what my handicap is but been shooting low 80s and broke 80 with 79 two weeks ago.. Been total carrying around 275 on my best strikes.. I mainly know that because my local coarse has a 276 par 4 that I've drove the green a few times on this year. My driver is my best club though.
Who is the shortest hitting scratch handicapper you have seen? How far were they hitting their driver? I think you have to consistently hit it at least 250 yards (total) to be scratch
I know when I was using arccos a few years back, I was surprised how low my average drving distance was, my inconsistency a significant factor in reducing that average number - and that's probably key, hit down the fairway 90 percent of the time, but shorter, and your average will go up - because the ball isn't clattering the trees or snagging the rough and hazards every few holes.
I agree. I don't envy guys who can drive 50 yards further while I stay in the fairway. The second shot on most holes is the key to a lower score i.e. chip vs put.
Do we know if the data only refers to shots that hit fairway or all shots made with the driver? I'm a 16.2 hcp and average 238 yards according to my Arcoss data. When I pure it (to my abilities) I'm in the 280 region. Was under the impression that i was hitting them short. This is a nice boost for confidence. 🙂
I doubt fairway or not is considered. Whatever is longest is what they'll give you. We're talking about amateurs, usually mid to higher handicappers. 99.9% don't have a way to measure. It's a guess at best.
Leave the ego at home and hit it slow and consistent swing and watch how much further you can actually hit it and on the fairways The harder I try to hit it the more I slice it off the tee so keep it simple and just stroke to down the fairway better to be 240/250 down the middle than 280+ in the trees or rough playing a recovery second shot
Interesting - what does it all mean? 🤔 I am a high handicapper - over 35 - playing at a tough course (even the scratch golfers call it tough), am over 60, a female amateur golfer and I drive it a total distance of 230-240 yards into the fairway. My distance is longer than a 30 year old 0HCP amateur woman’s golfer. It appears I am outlier based on your stats for amateurs female golfers. These are on course stats. At the range, I tend to hit it even longer as there is no penalty for slightly off-centre shots (measured with my Swing Caddy and visual markers on the course). P.S.: I used to compete at college level in discus and javelin throwing (was long in those sports and did hit a long ball in cricket 🏏).
Do the averages factor in which club is being used? For example, are only tee shots with the driver included or does it include any club hit off the tee? This might explain why Collin Morikawa’s average is lower - he might club down more often off the tee.
Its nice to average PGA tour numbers myself. However at an 11 handicap, 300 yard drives off line can make for a hell of a scramble from the woods. Golf gods giveth and taketh.
I think it's meaningless to talk about total distance because run out will vary from course to course. On our course in winter total distance = carry distance because the ball stops dead in the wet conditions. On a dry, sandy links course with tight turf total distance will be much further. Distance will also vary from country to country because temperature and wind conditions play a big part.
The problem is that most people confuse their best drive with their average drive. I couldn't tell you my average but I could tell you how long my better drives are. However, that was not the question.
Interesting video. But i would have liked to see how pros hit it when they get older. Like on the Senior Tour, to compare with elder ameteurs. By the why i'm 37 now and i think im loosing distancie. I did not play golf when i was 25, so i cant compare but for sure that then i would have hit it way longer. Like when i was 15, i didnt even see the ball when i hit it, nor with my woods nor with my irons... it was desespering every time i went to play i didnt even want to hit it hard but i didnt even see tha ball come out when i hit it.. thats one of the reasons i quite golfing back then.. and Intel i was 29 or 30 i didnt went back to golf. But then i had an injury on my back so i couldnt do my best.. and now i have no injuries but im getting old... so now ive lost distance. But im still on the average for amateurs of my age i would say.
I'm 73, and I would have been about 65 when I hit 300 yards as measured on my garmin s2. I remember it was the easiest drive I have ever made, I must have done something right that day because I've never done it again. I remember just starting my backswing and it was just as if I dropped my arms and the ball flew.
I know 30 handicap players that hit it over 270, but usually onto the next fairway. Handicap has nothing to do with how far you hit it. It can help but there are so many other aspects to golf.
I play off 21, and I hit my 3 wood between 280-300 when I strike it well (don't hit Driver as I lack control), but lack the consistency. I'm 19 though and I play with steel stiff shafts, for reference I hit my PW 135, 7 iron 174, 4 iron 220, etc. Just get in my head too often and every other shot i'll duff it, top it, push it, or hook it.
@@2partiesnotpreferred226 My best rounds I play around +15. So it's just a matter of consistency because my worst rounds can even be as bad or worse as 30 over. I've been playing golf for about 8 months, so I guess it'll just come with some more time. I aim to be in single digits within a year
Not sure where the normal line is, but I've been fortunate. 52 this year, 5'6" (depending what convenience store I'm in) and have hit long most of my life. 364, 363 last year, several 340's, 361 is the longest this year. Yes, with witnesses. Attempted the amateur senior long drive two years ago, but that's a story by itself. Had a compression spine fracture five years ago, and healed and thankfully can still play golf and hit long. Just saying you can be an amateur and hit long. Handicap is around 6 right now with the heat of summer in the SE. Control is more important than distance, but had a round this summer with 274 being my shortest drive that day, with a witness. Maybe just lucky, it's more about training right. Wrote a book on it. Those that are hitting 230 without injuries or 70yr+......you'd be surprised how easy that is to fix.
@@stephens9462 I think he hit one 492 in competition with a long shaft , fast landing area for roll out and on the west coast where the ball flies farther. Is it a bomb? Absolutely. “The idea guy” is hitting 360 plus in a round with a stock driver at 52 years old. And he wrote a book on long driving. I wouldn’t mind seeing his swing and checking out the book. I would think he would want to sell his book.
Its nice to see honest data or un biased. I am always think I should hit longer based on what i here others saying. But nice to know these are all fish stories. I am happy with my distance. Some holes it 205 and others 230 carry. I seem to max out at 96mph(92 on bad swings or miss hits). I can get 103mph but this is usually after doing some running/fitness before golf. Get those muscles warmed up.
Man I didn't even think Arccos could be selling that information to manufactures. Wonder what that will mean for future clubs. If they will start shorting us on tech, improving it, or leaving it the same?
1) Does the data only take into account shots hit with Driver? 2) Is this global data? If so, for comparison purposes, folks might want to take into consideration whether they play in a cold country on often soft ground. 3) Does the data take into account all the duffed / chunked / skied shots that only go 100 yds etc?
Does Arccos allow you to delete topped drives, or drives cut way short by trees and such? If it doesn't, then the averages make sense, but how useful is the data for making club choices? I mean if you hit 10 drives, 8 go 270, and you top 2 of them 20 yds, then your average will be like 220.
I'm not sure of the exact algorithm, but Arccos removes the extraordinarily high and extraordinarily low shots and comes up with an "expected" distance. It is what length of shot you should hit on a well, not perfectly, struck ball.
Interesting, average total driving distance has actually decreased 5 yards the past 3 years. More forgiving drivers? Is there a correlation to fairways hit?
I'd guess that the age of the average golfer has increased a bit over the last 3 years AND that a bunch of new golfers have joined the ranks lately, whose technique is not (yet) optimal. The drivers "distance" has barely changed over the last 10 years... Now, typically, my drives do indeed go further when on the fairway (more roll, and they were, likely, hit more "squarely" so with less power loss in spin).
I've def hit some more forgiving drivers that cost some distance over the years. The g400 has been the best distance and consistency driver I've hit so far. So many new models every year and not all years have improvements. Wish they would let me test, because once you start knowing what to look for, it saves some wasted money.
there is an error in your video... your graph says 10 HCP and the oval in the fairway says 15. I am going to assume 15 is the intended correct one as it is half way between 0 and 30. PLS CONFIRM
i average 450 yards off the tee
I’m glad yer here
waddaplaya...
waddaman!!!
Well keep practicing then. You’ll hit it well eventually. It took time to get to my 6000 yard average.
with 2 strokes! 😁😂
I think the biggest error most amateur players make is to hit it hard with a fast swing. A steady swing and getting the ball squarely in the middle of the club face is much more effective than the wild thrash. That's why when you look at a good player they usually have a fairly slow looking rhythmic swing. All the speed comes in the final part just before you hit the ball and it's hard to get that bit of crucial timing correct if you are thrashing at the ball. The best bit advice I was ever given as a junior was from the old pro at Ballycastle golf club, Vince Stewart, - he alway said 'you have to learn to hit it easy to hit it hard' . I am 60 still play off 6.7 and hit the ball 250 to 265 but more importantly 70% of my drives stay on the fairways.
My back and shoulder wish I read this comment a year ago.
Slow easy swing with large headed clubs for me from now on.
Wow that's amazing , you are more accurate than Collin morikawa a mayor winner and number 10, perhaps you should give the other 190 PGA Tour pros some advice to improve their accuracy.
Check out Zen Golf's video with Mark Foster who articulates this sentiment very well.
I disagree nothing wrong with smashing the ball if you move your body right and put in the practice time I started golfing 3 months ago and can already hit over 320 and weight 155.
@@Jman-co7xw brilliant - I look forward to see you on the European Tour in the near future 👍
8 out of 10 comments on this post claim to be driving well above average. Sounds about right.
Probably because “drives” are scratch caliber but short game and green play are the mid to high handicap… just a thought.
I can verify my drives at my local range, I've even used my range finder to check accuracy of the distances. The range tops out at about 305 (woods cut off the back). My drives consistently reach those woods. Here's the thing. my putting and my accuracy with said driver arent great (big slices etc) , so while yes I can rocket a ball out a long way, that doesn't mean im an above average golfer, just an above average club speed.
Can't drive to save my life. I may hit 260 with a banana ball. But I hit the sweet spot a lot with my irons. 4 iron consistent to 190-230.
By consistent, I mean I have played about 7 or 8 rounds. But I practice with smaller irons on a par 3 course more often. 1x a week for the past 3 months. Sw 100-120, GW 120-140, PW 140-160. Anything less than 100 could be any club depending. I stink too, 22 handicap according to Garmin. But, I have those clubs pretty dialed in.
What a thoughtful and informative video. Sam Tremlett’s delivery is a joy to listen to, very professional and interesting. I think most club players worry that they are not striking the ball as well as they should, or could be - whereas this video demonstrates that they are probably not as bad as they may believe. I have been playing with the guys in my four-ball for many years and we all have deteriorated in distance as we age but at least this proves that we are still playing pretty well (new WHS approx 20hcp), considering the youngest of us, myself, being in early 60s and still hitting it average 220-250yds total (carry and roll-out). I am disappointed that I can’t quite get it up closer to 300 as I used to 10 years ago but that’s ageing for you! Thank you for posting. Great video!!
Thanks, I feel much better about my drive distance, seeing the stats!
Good information, it gives me a reference point on comparison with the best in the game, as well as my peers. Would like to see PW, 7i, 5 I, and 3w averages.
I'm a vintage golfer myself, playing old-school gear, such as persimmon woods, forged blade irons, and a hickory shafted putter, and I'm 67. With my persimmon Hogan driver I average about 210 yards, with my longest being in the 230-240 range. I play from the red tees, since I've lost a lot of distance due to age. However, I'm OK with the distances I get, since I'll never play on the PGA Tour, and I play golf just for fun.
You'd have more fun playing modern equipment
@@LemThurdy420 not really. The feeling you get when you hit a persimmon driver right on the screws is indescribable! Same with hitting a forged blade iron. Golf is a lot more than mere distance.
golf is fun as heck, eh! Maybe this is because I think the grass is greener, but as someone who can hit it far - golf is most fun when you're picking your spots, at any distance :D I love hitting 4 irons in a row on a par 5 lol maybe even 5 or 6 aha
@@stratovani
I agree. I’d rather shoot 85 with 30 year old forged blades than 83 with $2000 worth of max GI irons
I'm a budget golfer. I inherited, and started playing with, my dad's clubs that I kind of inherited after he passed away (Mom was just going to donate them to a thrift store, since none of the rest of us played golf...but I was interested in trying it out, at least...) It was another 15 years before I finally got around to using them. Had to replace the driver right away as a big chunk of the head broke off the first time (ONLY time) I used it (no, I didn't hit the ground, or a tree, or anything except the ball). I'm also about 6" taller than Dad was, so his clubs were uncomfortably short. But I don't make anywhere near enough money to go spend $1000 on (budget) custom-fit clubs...but I found a set I liked at a thrift store. Upgraded a couple of years ago--with another, newer, thrift store set of irons, and some substituted hybrids and wedges that I've picked up here and there. I don't think I've paid more than $45 for anything in my bag, and probably under $100 for the entire kit (except my rangefinder...which, while still a bargain-basement model, probably cost more than all my clubs combined).
As long as you're enjoying what you're doing on the course, play with what you like. Golf has this weird elitist streak which, fortunately, I see far more often in commentary here than I see on the course--to listen to some of the comments on here, anyone who's using clubs made more than five years ago, or who doesn't regularly break 85, should drop the game. Fortunately, at least at the courses where I play, players are more interested in whether or not you're enjoying being out on the course than assessing your gear or questioning whether or not you're "good enough" to even play with them.
Not everyone plays golf to smash 350 yard drives and break par on every other hole. Some of us are enjoying the fresh air and the scenery and appreciating the chance to move and stretch in ways that our 'normal' lives don't often allow us to do. Of course, we still like a good, solid drive and are thrilled with pars and birdies...but they're gravy, they don't define what a good day of golf is for us. If your time on the course is fulfilling your needs, it's nobody's business but your own what kind of clubs you play with.
I know so many guys who swear they hit it 250 or more, go Golfing and they barely break the 200 mark!!
Been there. It's best just to let the game speak for itself. I stopped saying what I shoot as soon as I realized I wasn't fully understanding the swing and what I was trying to achieve. It also helped me focus more and not worry about trying to impress anyone. Doing pretty good now because of it.
@@wth.happened You're full on lying lol
@@wth.happened up there with Bryson on a good day huh? good stuff man.
Where's your course? the moon?
I am a 72 year old golfer, reaching scratch handicap in my 20's, now 8.6. Recently had a driver optimisation session, and with the best of a selection of shafts, increased clubhead speed by 3 mph and carry by 15 yards.
This information is excellent to know! I always thought my drives weren't good, but know I know they're good so start working on other things instead and start smiling more of the TEE!
While my HCP is high, I see it slowly decreasing soon since my driving distance is there. Great insight
I think you'll find that the biggest difference between high handicappers and low is the game inside 100 yards although I agree with the stats that there is a strong correlation with driving distance.
Most definitely!!!! I have no long ball, but I'm killer with my short irons and wedges!
The match b/w Cantlay and Bryson shows there's more than one way to get it done. I play with plenty of guys who hit it 40 yards further, but I can still beat them. It's how many, not how.
@@davidsnyder8503 yes, I played golf once with a former coworker, an Irish guy, who proceeded to stomp my ass with nothing but 7 iron down and he only hits that 7 iron 165 or so! I learned that day that fairway finder shots are far more valuable than those miracle 300 yarders or those eagle attempts!!! I couldn't believe how good he played while never hitting it more than 180!
Also course management/decision making. My course has several holes where left side or right side of fairway make a significant difference for approach to green. Same with mishits to the rough, I see so many players fight their way down the rough instead of getting to a good position for the next shot.
Drive for show, put for dough.
I am usually within a 9 iron from my drives apart from par 5. Then it goes downhill. That’s the difference of an average golfer and a good golfer.
One of my golf partners is often in trouble off the tee but nearly always gets himself onto the green with his short game. He is single figures.
That’s the fun of golf!
Proves how the club manufacturers have been conning golfers for years with regards to driver distance improvements.
Club matters for one reason. Comfort.
To be fair.. I think more newer golfers have taken up the sport.. bringing down the group average. Arguably.. the distance should be gaining by a few inches every year.. and not 10 yards. But I agree the clubs can’t get that much better.
How much is the player's ability to strike well and how is the club technology. clearly, the skill is a constant and the technology is not helping much. Given the new advances in knowledge and training techniques, I would expect those that get lessons and apply themselves should play better but it's marginal I think.
I remember playing in the Philippines at a local course where the club champ played a round against a local caddie, the caddie won and he was self-taught with an old eclectic bag built up of gimmies over years. Skill trumps all in golf.
I hate be disagreeable, but the average PGA Tour driving distance in the 1970s was 250 yards, in 2021 it is 295 yards. So maybe it is like inflation, from one year to the next there does not seem to be much change, but over 50 years there is a LOT of change. In the 1970s the US median home price was about $25000, in 2021 it is about $375,000.
@@warrenb2856 lol Yes indeed, Titanium oversized heads and the new balls made a huge impact, but I think in the last 15 years not much change. Amazing to think how far the guy's hit in the 60/70's with those clubs and balls. What was the price of a driver in 1970? dam near $1000 NZD here in New Zealand 2021.
Thanks for this would like to see the results for irons. Funny how in Summer with hard ground, wind behind and down hill that distance becomes the "norm" for some.
Very encouraging to know that technique plays a more important factor than athleticism.
I wonder how they factor in consistency. I'm pretty athletic, can hit it over 300 - but it's all over the place. if they count me at 300, then technique makes even more of a difference because I'm only actually hitting a couple 300 yard drives in the fairway out of my entire round. Really working on consistency, I love a nice popcorn hitter who can hit it where they want, that's real golfing. I love a good solid lay up shot, maybe my favorite shot in golf.
@@truecrimejungle How old are you?
In my younger days - in my 20s back in the 1980s, I could hit 250-260- but never 300 so you are hitting pro distance there. Of course balls and equipment have advanced since then, but still 300 is very good. Anyways I'm in my 50s now and started up again last year after 18 years away from golf. In my 50s now and I a quickly discovered I could not get my body to swing as fast. So instead I have been focussing on hitting straight and also being lethal with a wedge from between 80-100 yards. Ive always been a decent irons player but atrocious with my driver - terrible slicer. Been working really hard on driver recently trying to eliminate that slice and yesterday I finally cracked it. I had a eureka moment after watching an instructional video and that did it. Yesterday I hit 5 drives 250 straight as an arrow. My point being - I reckon I swung not more than 85mph - it felt slow - and yet I felt the power. I run a video blog here on youtube and I will be doing a post on what changed my drive swing.
I would be interested to know how fast you reckon you are swinging?
@@pilgrimgolfer9705 if he's hitting around 300 the speed is likely around 110-115mph. I usually hit around 270-280 with around a 100-105mph speed. Carry distance correlates to around 2.5x-2.7x the swing speed
@@pot10 Hey thanks for the info - appreciated!
1:20 That's actually quite impressive. Goes to show how many enthusiastic new golfers are in the game. Not just people new to the game, but people that are new and would get into Arcos as well.
Me(30) and my wife(27) just started playing this year. We are having fun but it is very challenging. For context we are both athletic and have played about 6 times and about 10times at the range, no lessons yet. I’m not sure if the video numbers are carry distance or not but our stats when making contact are as follows: Me- ~230-260 carry with an occasional 270-280 mystery.
Her- ~190-210 with an occasional 220-230 she seems much more consistent with her driving distance. Overall our consistency is kinda trash but those few great shots really keep you coming back. Got my first birdie a couple weeks ago.
I started golfing around 2 months ago. I have a horrible slice about 60% of the time but when it all comes together I can get out to ~275. Gonna take some lessons this winter.
As I’ve gotten older, I’m 57, my distance has remained the same. I average 230 off the tee. I’m a 10 handicap and I’ve gotten to 7.
Well you must hit it straight which is more important than a long drive.
The less distance I try to get out of my clubs, the better I score. In fact, my third best round of the year, I didn’t use my woods.
Did you use them for your first best round
I tend to get better average results with good tempo. The club head speed is down slightly vs. going after it but I get the center more consistently.
@@sebas_akgvi9695 Sparingly
@@JammastaJ23 That’s the reality of it right there
Use your putter all the way round, test your theory.
I appreciate the work that went into this. I should be hitting around 180-210 based on your analysis. My swing speed is probably lower than average though. I'm curious how driver loft plays a role in this analysis. I suppose we can assume that these measurements are based on players that have optimized their driver loft based on their swing speed, which is still a factor I need to determine for myself. I recently moved to a driver with lower loft (from 10° to 9.5°) but based on my guess at my swing speed I need to be moving to a higher loft like 12°. My swing speed is quite low I imagine so a higher loft would benefit me.
Westhill? My step father was the captain there for years, amazing to see this on UA-cam!!
Try the tilt and stack method, changed my game completely
I'll bite, what is the tilt and stack method?
@@buckybarnes3803 The guy I follow is Tom Saguto here on UA-cam but there are others
Being able to hit it long with a driver helps make the game so much easier. Like time to get off the putting green and hit the driving range type of thing.
I feel a bit better about my driver range after watching this video. I am in the range of my handicap and within range of my handicap goal. Thanks for posting this video!
I remember when I started to play golf again after 30 years (after playing a little bit as a student in my youth) how impressed I was with my first session at the driving range. I was easily driving it 30 meters or more past the 200 meter marker. I couldn't understand why many people would believe that it was such a big deal to hit it past 200 meters.
With just a little bit of practice I could get beyond 300 meters easily, I thought. I became almost convinced that it must just be my natural talent - until I realized that I was confusing the 150 meter with the 200 meter marker.
I hit a driver on a good day about 180 - 190yds sometimes 200yds if it rolls
Completely validates what I thought was the case through observation.
I'm 49 and I've been playing golf for 3 years now. My drives average around 220 yards, whilst more experienced players with better technique are hitting comfortably further, despite often being less athletic. I'm obviously going to lose distance as I get older, so I intend to improve my technique to compensate. The data in this video would appear to suggest its perfectly possible, so hard work is the plan.
This bears out what I've known for years - that the vast majority of amateur golfers have no business hitting from the tips, or even one tee up from the tips. It is pure ego. How many times have I seen someone hit from a back tee on a 410 yard par 4, only to hit it a maximum of 180 yards. Now the approach to the green is still wildly unreachable even if they teed the ball up again and hit driver. Moving up to a more realistic distance not only makes the game more enjoyable, it speeds things up.
I agree. I argue with people that I play with about tee boxes. I have a short drive of about 190. When I play par 4 holes north of 360 yards, I tell them that I should move up to the "senior" tees. The PGA and USGA agree that the tee box should be chosen by how far you hit your drive, not how old you are. It's frustrating playing 4 or 5 holes a round that are farther than you can reach in two shots or three shots(for par 5 holes).
When 3wood is your standard second shot on par 4 you're at the wrong tees.
that's why you get a higher handicap... so you can take more shots... because you can't reach the greens in regulation.
@@timothynash2993 I didn't know that. That's actually really nice to know.
I played with two 60 year olds the other day. Before the round started they told my buddy and I that they will be playing from the red tees and I mentioned that I should probably play with them(partly joking). They then asked me how old I was and I said I was 50, their response was in 10 more years you can. Of course they proceeded for the rest of the day to hit the ball 250 yards on their drives and even drove the green on some short par four dogs legs. Oh well, I enjoy playing and don’t want to sound like a poor sport(which I probably already do, lol).
Wow I have a lot more distance than I thought. I'm 31 years old, about a 15-20 handicap, but drive it around 275, sometimes hitting just over 300 when I really get a hold of it. My irons are ok, but my short game has always been my weakness. Been working on that all summer and has really improved!
Strange, going off comments on UA-cam videos you would swear the average carry was 310!
LMFAO! There is a difference in UA-cam yards and GPS yards!
Underrated comment. I swear everyone on youtube can challenge Dechambeau with their driver.
@@alienrenders hell...there is a guy right now claiming 165+ with a God damn 8 iron that is traditional lofted in this same comment thread! He would need a 115mph club head speed to do that! Anyone know how damn hard it is to swing an 8 iron 110+mph!?
You only have to look at club members driving in front of you and in reality most are struggling to get much past 200 yards. Easy to verify with GPS(
@@davids9192 Absolutely. Mine travel total anywhere from 190-300 yards, the 300 being once a year in perfect conditons . The issue with the majority is they take that drive they hit once a year and class it as their average lol.
At 47 I hit the ball further and straighter as I've spent more time on technique and rounds played. I love golf, but as a young man I didnt understand the subtleties. UA-cam, seriously changed my game. Wish Ialong it all along.
Exactly, at 58 I hit further and much more consistently than at 38.
I use Arccos for data. It gives you a rating in each aspect of the game ( Driving, Approach, Short , Putting) At handicap 12 ( until winter struck) Arccos allows me to compare how I am travelling in comparison to scratch or any other handicap I choose. At age 67 and new-ish to golf, I chose handicap of 8 as my target, thinking I probably don't have enough time left to make scratch. Anyway, if I use your figures of 202 yards for a 65 year old, my 198 yards in winter isn't too bad. I get 214.5 yards in summer, when we get roll on the fairways. Arccos consistently tells me that Driving is my weak area, due to lack of distance for my handicap, so knowing this data with an age filter is encouraging.
If you new-ish to golf at 67 years of age and you have a 12 handicap you should be very proud! You are going to sub 8 I am sure!
@@warrenb2856 thanks mate. We are still in lock down and golf is closed, so no practice for weeks to come . At least our course is drying out after a very wet winter. Missing ideal spring conditions is hurting !
I feel a LOT better now when I only hit my driver 230. Being 26 handicap there is still hope for me on getting to the 250+ range I feel now. Also I can tell my friends now I’m above average in length haha.
If you can hit a drive 230 and play the middle tees and carry a 26 handicap might I suggest you find a teaching pro to work on your iron game. :-)
@@gowithgid3274 I play whites (which is middle most the courses around me). I just started playing like 6 months ago so just wanted to hit the ball constantly first, before I took lessons which I do plan on doing very soon. Goal is to try and get the single digits in a few years. Mostly just work on my putting (a ton), chipping, and pitching at the moment (since those are the aspects I definitely enjoy the most). My iron play is definitely my biggest weakness though. Followed my inconstancy on tee shots. Either I really have it, or I don’t at all haha.
@@ShawnyBGolf That's why I mention your iron game. Also---any instructor might want you to dial back the drive to keep it playable. Welcome to the most fun and frustrating game in the world. :-)
@@gowithgid3274 yeah I just started using driver a few weeks ago (actually use my buddies because he begged me to, because I don’t have one and mostly use my 5 wood haha) I swing it maybe 2/3rds speed (learned I hit it harder taking a slow easy swing then trying to crush it haha) and it doesn’t seem to really go to far off into the rough it does. Again I might only use it maybe 3/4 holes if I’ve been swinging my 5 wood well that day. I’m 6’7 and use to play college football so I think my long arms and just natural strength might be what leads to that distance, not so much trying to kill it to get that distance. My iron play definitely what leads to my high scores, since if I go practice I only go to the chipping and pitching area haha. Definitely appreciate all the tips and tricks. Definitely need it while I grow as a player and document it all on here too haha.
your packing HEAT! Dont forget it.
The fact that my drive lives in the scratch player territory (about 260-270 yards) but my scores live in the 30 Handicap territory proves I really need to work on my short game.
You probably take a lot of penalty strokes too. And you probably hit 260-270 only 25% of the time with a 30 cap.
@@jeromeo12 that's only partially true, I've really been working hard on that one aspect of my game as my goal this summer was to adjust my wood swing mechanics to rid myself of a life long slice. I've succeeded and have seen it bear fruits of extra yardage. Truth be told, I'm more of a 230-250 hitter who have hit about 260-270 25% like you said, but without the penalty strokes.
I lose a lot less golf balls nowadays, so my bad golf floor has risen to natural double / triple bogeys, and my good golf is in the par / bogey range. I've even had a couple of birdies on par 5's... something that never happened before. Shawn Clement's UA-cam channel has helped me so much. My focus is now shifting to 100 yards to the pin, where I hear real golf is played. I'm ready to tackle that area.
I generally notice different then this Graph with amateurs . The ones who hit it the farthest often have worst handicaps cus they are trying to crush the ball. But as they get better the slow their swing down a little and lose some yards but gain control.
My self who's about a 25 handicap in general I've gotten down to a 20 by only doin 3\4 driver swing .
slowing the swing can cause issuse as well, but we all know higher swing speeds = higher ball speeds = more distance, but it wether you can control face to path!! but a smooth swing looks slower but if you mesure the swing speed it hasn't change.
I find this really useful. I am 57 and play off 12 with an average driving distance of 220. I was speaking to some old college buddies recently who both swear blind that they drive 250 despite having handicaps over 25. I was starting to think that I must be deteriorating really fast and have spent the last month trying to up my swing speed to very little effect apart from a more ragged looking swing and a few more lost balls. I think I'll just go back to being Mr Average.
Keep in mind that there are three totally different things a person could be thinking in terms of when talking about their driving distance. They could be thinking about:
1. Average "Long shot", i.e. "How far does the ball go when they strike it perfectly?"
2. Performance Average, i.e. "What is the average if you exclude the really bad hits?"
3. Real Average, i.e. "What is the average of all shots, both good and bad?"
I would bet that the 250 number your friends gave you was their average long shot. If you factor in worm burners, sky shots, and shots that hit trees, their real average is probably closer to 200. Thus, if your real average is 220, you are probably hitting it further than they are.
I carry driver around 250 on a good strike. I’ve played with plenty of guys that say they hit the ball 300 but none of them hit even as far as me. Nobody knows how far they hit the ball.
Around 200 I think.
Edit: Just finished video and realised it's exactly per the age and handicap ratings, very accurate mate!
Nice data, well presented. Thanks
Being a beginner golfer myself only playing for 3 months, I'm about a 25 handicap but usually drive about 260, with the odd occasion of hitting it close to 280 or 290.
Your short game must be awful then
@@andymckenzie9040 I'm down to about a 16 handicap now, usually hit it about 280 and 300+ when the fairway is wide open and I can go for it. Short game is pretty decent, most of the time, I hit a bad shot towards the green 100 and so on out and it causes me to lose strokes.
The arccos data is a little misleading. It takes into account ALL tee shots from Par 4s and Par 5s. I'm a perfect example of the data not matching up. Arccos says I hit my driver 270 and 3W 245, but my average "drive" is just barely over 200. This is because my local muni is very short and I rarely use anything bigger than a 5 iron off the tee.
As a very senior golfer playing of 12 it would be interesting in ur next study to show stats from the top pros on the seniors tour
I would bet the top guys on the senior tour have a similar driving average as the top 10% of pros, on average. The senior tour players are going to have a much tighter standard deviation on their average.
Same - as a 56 yo 11 hcap, that's what I thought was missing from the data - stats from the champions tour. Would love to know Bernhard Langer's driver stats for 2021. Lee Westwood (and Phil) are impressively long for their age.
My Arccos smart distance is 247yds, low at 226yds and high at 263yds. My longest is 316yds (down hill, down wind, rock hard fairway😁). I’m 48 years old and have an 11 handicap index
I gave up counting in my last round after +38 over 13 holes.... but I hit 270 yard dead straight drives on more than one occasion.
See you on the Tour next year guys and girls!
The course I can get onto locally with minimum hassle is tight and short, so I have gravitated to a low fairway finder shot. If I ever get to a more open longer course I'll probably swing out of my shoes and slice it God knows where 😂
According to 3 different GPS golf apps, I can drive 260 regularly and have gone 290-298 with some lucky bounces, but I still am a 23hdcp. Guess I need to work on other aspects of my game. haha
Short game is where most of your strokes add up, so drop the woods and focus on distance control with the short irons and putting.
For me it's all about the 100 yards and in that makes the difference. I score in the 90's. I recently gave my friend my really nice, practically new driver since he really needed a new one (Super nice friend practically family and he was the one who introduced me to golf). While I waited for my new driver to come I played a round with my longest club being a 2 hybrid (I don't use woods, can't hit them) and I shot a 91. Got my new driver a few days later, practically the same one I gave my friend and shot a 100 the following week. The difference, the round WITHOUT the driver, my short game was not that bad that day and was hitting my 2 Hybrid off the tee 195 - 215 pretty straight. The round WITH my driver, driving was pretty good but had a horrible short game that day, missed a lot of putts and chunked a lot around the green, I was using a new putter too. So if I can better my short game ( Working on it) I know I can shoot in the 80's. 5' 8, 47 with my average driving distance 235-250. SHORT GAME my friends...Short Game.
I’m 54 and have only been playing for about a year but do practice a lot. I’m 6 foot 240 if that matters. I shoot in the low 90s but have lots of room to lower this. My biggest weakness is putting and accuracy on those shots within 100 yards. My driver is a Ping G (2016) set at 9 degrees. I carry around 220 with total distance around 250. I can probably increase this some but Ive played a few times with a coworker who is a 62 year old scratch golfer. My drives are right with his. I’m fine with my distance and since changing to a single plane swing they’re all pretty much straight which at this point I’ll certainly take. I used to slice a lot.
I always am skeptical when guys claim they hit 300 yards. This is my first year really seriously playing golf. I’m 270- 275 on average with one that got to 300 with a very good tail wind. As a 40 year old 18 handicap, I’m liking the numbers and feel like my handicap will be dropping as I improve my short game.
That's actually good numbers for a serious year. It's not hard to break the 300 when you're that close.
I can hit a lob wedge 150 yards. (From the green side bunker).
I think that there is a slight flaw in this data model, in that as you age your distance reduces, therefore your handicap will likely increase. Because you are measuring the same handicap at all ages you're missing those players whose handicap has increased because their distance has decreased. What you're essentially measuring is those players who can maintain a low handicap while ageing. Correcting this would be a quite complex process of calculating what percentage of each age range is 0, 10 or 20 handicap then somehow adjusting the distances according to this additional data.
I use shotscope so have on-course data. I’m 45 and a 12 handicap. I average around 260 yards.
Most of the single handicappers I’ve played with at my course are older guys with fantastic short games. They putt and chip so damn well. I’m longer than most of them, can’t putt near as well.
I also found that my handicap dropped nicely from 15 to 12 when I stopped reaching for driver all the time, and instead thought more about what I needed to hit off the tee for the distance I want into the green. Some holes are easy par holes now because it’s just a smooth 4 iron off the tee avoiding all the danger that the driver would expose me to.
Im not a big guy and I’m a 9 hcp I drive the ball 265-270 7-10 times but I’ve had a lot of lessons on just my driver and I’m 21 and most of my buddies drive around the same except my buddy who drives about 290 very cool video to know we drive the ball well but my putting and wedges need work
Interesting to see how this is all broken down.
I have also seen tables for every club out there and their respective distances. What they don't mention is that if all these clubs are taken off the tee for measurement. I hit far longer than the charts and this video show, but since the driver is measured off the tee, I measure all my other irons off the tee as well. It's after the tee shot and before 80 yd where I can be wildly inconsistent. I can hit my five iron 180 from the fairway, but I can also hit it 110 if I end up taking half the county with me before I hit the ball. I may be 56, but I'm also 6'7, and in fairly decent shape. Only been playing for about a year and a half, but I'm addicted and I can see myself playing this for the rest of my life!
I have cranked it 315 but am much more comfortable at 240-260’ish, playing it where I want to go. I have a Ping G425 SRT and I’m 55 yrs old. Hit em straight is what matters as we seen this weekend in the BMW opening
Very interesting data, Thank you
I have found that , I seem to lose distance even with a good strike in the middle with the ball launching very high, in the air long yes , way high yes but not skyed but can tell the height is losing distance
Great video......but - any stats for the PGA Champions Tour?
I am not surprised to see that most amateur men don't hit it as far as they profess. As a 66 year old 12 handicap the greatest thing that would help me is from 60 yards in.
Good to hear age is not the factor but ability. I hardly use Driver - I hit 3 wood 220yd and depending on roll can get to 240+yds and I am 65. It is better to be on short grass at those distances than lost or in the rough on any par 4 that is 400yds or less.
Problem with comparing the driving distance stat within Arccos is that it takes all drives on par 4 and 5 regardless of club so it will skew down the data. It would be more helpful to compare the driver club distance which I don’t think was done here.
It's done by club. So long as the user has registered their driver correctly this will be data for driver use. Cheers
There are allot of amateurs and several guys I play rounds with that hit the golf ball a country mile. Makes the long par 4's so much easier.
Driving distance is 50% equipment / 50% your physical condition.
Age could challenged here.
I know a 48 year old who does heavy physical training,
( cross training solely for be fit at golf)
Occupation Architect , drive is 250+ yards on flat fairways-290+ yards on hilly fairways, with the odd 310 yard drive.
Balls mostly lake style, or what be found in the rough.
Staff is a stiff shaft solely for accuracy, reg flex just too whippy.
I’m a +14 handicap and only hit it 225 (average) and 250 (maximum) carry. I played a 9 hole course today and shot -1…….so distance isn’t everything. I drive better and straighter when I hit it slowly.
+14? Give it a rest!🤣
Swing better. Play better. Score better.
Insightful as always GM
I be happy with 190 down the middle haha
I'm 65 and can hit a tennis ball 250 yards with a broom! I can't seem to hole a putt with the flag in though?
Very interesting. Thanks.
I’m 62. I drive it straight 200. Then I wood it 175. Then I pitch it on. Then I two put it and move on to the next hole.
I'm an amateur and can drive the ball anywhere from 30 - 300 yards depending on the day lol but probably average 180-220
30-300 lol. I hear that. Also constantly left and right.
I’m not really bothered how far I can hit the ball, as long as I’m having fun.
Accuracy over distance. Accuracy will lower scores.
One thing I just tried at the range was to swing my driver like I wanted to hit it 175 yards, not 300.... I became more accurate and the ball even went almost as far. Some went further than 300.
@@BlackWat3rGTR The more relaxed you are the better you seem to hit the ball 👍🏌️♂️
That’s something a short hitter would say…
then why are you watchin this video my guy?
Players inflated views of their distance is one of the reasons for slow play. They stand waiting at 200 metres for the green to clear with their 3 wood, and can only hit it 175.
Agreed, but on the other hand as someone who hits far (for a high hcp amateur) i have been told you can’t reach them and created dangerous situations. Rather be safe than sorry tbh
I understand where you are coming from. But these golfers could not hit it 175 metres if they fired it out of a gun. And in the meantime, the blokes on the tee behind are twiddling their thumbs. All I am saying is that if you're 200m out and the last time you hit it that far was in the Hogan era, then get on with it. Cheers.
Need to agree this is a misconception. Trying to shorten the gap between flights doesn’t help with slow play. I think most of the time it’s just golfers’ weird belief they can somehow conjure up through deep meditation, meticulous analysis and excessive pre-shot routine to hit a miracle shot. The other problem is an overly distracted attitude on the course, not playing ready golf and getting in the way of flight mates.
Waiting to clear the green is not bad. Slow play is from players who take too long on the green and are not ready when it is their turn to putt. Also, players who take more than 1 practice swing that top the ball regularly.
Yeah, then they pull to the next tee box and wait for the person in front of them….. you’re really just saying hurry up and wait
Not sure what my handicap is but been shooting low 80s and broke 80 with 79 two weeks ago.. Been total carrying around 275 on my best strikes.. I mainly know that because my local coarse has a 276 par 4 that I've drove the green a few times on this year. My driver is my best club though.
Great topic!
Who is the shortest hitting scratch handicapper you have seen? How far were they hitting their driver? I think you have to consistently hit it at least 250 yards (total) to be scratch
I know when I was using arccos a few years back, I was surprised how low my average drving distance was, my inconsistency a significant factor in reducing that average number - and that's probably key, hit down the fairway 90 percent of the time, but shorter, and your average will go up - because the ball isn't clattering the trees or snagging the rough and hazards every few holes.
I agree. I don't envy guys who can drive 50 yards further while I stay in the fairway. The second shot on most holes is the key to a lower score i.e. chip vs put.
Do we know if the data only refers to shots that hit fairway or all shots made with the driver?
I'm a 16.2 hcp and average 238 yards according to my Arcoss data. When I pure it (to my abilities) I'm in the 280 region.
Was under the impression that i was hitting them short.
This is a nice boost for confidence. 🙂
I doubt fairway or not is considered. Whatever is longest is what they'll give you. We're talking about amateurs, usually mid to higher handicappers. 99.9% don't have a way to measure. It's a guess at best.
Quite shocked when comparing my Inrange stats to these Arcos ones… nice to know I’m above average 😅, just tells me that my course management sucks 😢
Leave the ego at home and hit it slow and consistent swing and watch how much further you can actually hit it and on the fairways
The harder I try to hit it the more I slice it off the tee so keep it simple and just stroke to down the fairway better to be 240/250 down the middle than 280+ in the trees or rough playing a recovery second shot
Interesting - what does it all mean? 🤔
I am a high handicapper - over 35 - playing at a tough course (even the scratch golfers call it tough), am over 60, a female amateur golfer and I drive it a total distance of 230-240 yards into the fairway. My distance is longer than a 30 year old 0HCP amateur woman’s golfer. It appears I am outlier based on your stats for amateurs female golfers. These are on course stats.
At the range, I tend to hit it even longer as there is no penalty for slightly off-centre shots (measured with my Swing Caddy and visual markers on the course).
P.S.: I used to compete at college level in discus and javelin throwing (was long in those sports and did hit a long ball in cricket 🏏).
Do the averages factor in which club is being used? For example, are only tee shots with the driver included or does it include any club hit off the tee? This might explain why Collin Morikawa’s average is lower - he might club down more often off the tee.
Its nice to average PGA tour numbers myself. However at an 11 handicap, 300 yard drives off line can make for a hell of a scramble from the woods. Golf gods giveth and taketh.
My Arccos driver dashboard shows average of 208yds with a range of 187-239yds. I am off 20.8 and 66 years old.
I think it's meaningless to talk about total distance because run out will vary from course to course. On our course in winter total distance = carry distance because the ball stops dead in the wet conditions. On a dry, sandy links course with tight turf total distance will be much further. Distance will also vary from country to country because temperature and wind conditions play a big part.
Inbee Park is one of the shortest hitters but still a top player at the LPGA. Former world #1 if I'm not mistaken
Yip and same with Lydia Ko who was LPGA world number 1 too
The problem is that most people confuse their best drive with their average drive. I couldn't tell you my average but I could tell you how long my better drives are. However, that was not the question.
I'm confused. I'm a first year golfer driving a ball consistently 280-290 yards with a club that's not even fitted for me. What do I do with this?
Data makes a lot of sense! I don't feel so bad now knowing I'm in the average for my age and handicap!!!
Interesting video. But i would have liked to see how pros hit it when they get older. Like on the Senior Tour, to compare with elder ameteurs.
By the why i'm 37 now and i think im loosing distancie. I did not play golf when i was 25, so i cant compare but for sure that then i would have hit it way longer. Like when i was 15, i didnt even see the ball when i hit it, nor with my woods nor with my irons... it was desespering every time i went to play i didnt even want to hit it hard but i didnt even see tha ball come out when i hit it.. thats one of the reasons i quite golfing back then.. and Intel i was 29 or 30 i didnt went back to golf. But then i had an injury on my back so i couldnt do my best.. and now i have no injuries but im getting old... so now ive lost distance. But im still on the average for amateurs of my age i would say.
Great job there. Those numbers are spot on for me. +3 and 275ish yds @51yrs
What course do you play at out of curiosity? 👍
@@tatchy1001 lower South Island of NZ.
Great stats,the table in the video shows a 10 HCP but the distance indicated on the fairway bubble indicates a 15 HCP. Which HCP is correct?
I'm 73, and I would have been about 65 when I hit 300 yards as measured on my garmin s2. I remember it was the easiest drive I have ever made, I must have done something right that day because I've never done it again. I remember just starting my backswing and it was just as if I dropped my arms and the ball flew.
I know 30 handicap players that hit it over 270, but usually onto the next fairway. Handicap has nothing to do with how far you hit it. It can help but there are so many other aspects to golf.
I play off 21, and I hit my 3 wood between 280-300 when I strike it well (don't hit Driver as I lack control), but lack the consistency. I'm 19 though and I play with steel stiff shafts, for reference I hit my PW 135, 7 iron 174, 4 iron 220, etc. Just get in my head too often and every other shot i'll duff it, top it, push it, or hook it.
@@2008aner they are good numbers. I need to play and practice a lot to shoot single figures. Don't be so hard on yourself.
@@2partiesnotpreferred226 My best rounds I play around +15. So it's just a matter of consistency because my worst rounds can even be as bad or worse as 30 over. I've been playing golf for about 8 months, so I guess it'll just come with some more time. I aim to be in single digits within a year
Not sure where the normal line is, but I've been fortunate. 52 this year, 5'6" (depending what convenience store I'm in) and have hit long most of my life. 364, 363 last year, several 340's, 361 is the longest this year. Yes, with witnesses. Attempted the amateur senior long drive two years ago, but that's a story by itself. Had a compression spine fracture five years ago, and healed and thankfully can still play golf and hit long. Just saying you can be an amateur and hit long. Handicap is around 6 right now with the heat of summer in the SE. Control is more important than distance, but had a round this summer with 274 being my shortest drive that day, with a witness. Maybe just lucky, it's more about training right. Wrote a book on it. Those that are hitting 230 without injuries or 70yr+......you'd be surprised how easy that is to fix.
Post a video of your swing on your channel. I’d like to see a 360 plus drive. Your blowing it past Kyle Berkshire.
@@richardlowe8062 Kyle is in the 400s in competition.
@@stephens9462
I watch Kyle’s golf blogs. 340 is a good drive when not on the Las Vegas runways.
@@richardlowe8062 well maybe when he’s playing an actual round of golf but in competition I believe I’ve seen 440.
@@stephens9462 I think he hit one 492 in competition with a long shaft , fast landing area for roll out and on the west coast where the ball flies farther. Is it a bomb? Absolutely.
“The idea guy” is hitting 360 plus in a round with a stock driver at 52 years old. And he wrote a book on long driving. I wouldn’t mind seeing his swing and checking out the book. I would think he would want to sell his book.
Its nice to see honest data or un biased.
I am always think I should hit longer based on what i here others saying. But nice to know these are all fish stories.
I am happy with my distance. Some holes it 205 and others 230 carry. I seem to max out at 96mph(92 on bad swings or miss hits). I can get 103mph but this is usually after doing some running/fitness before golf. Get those muscles warmed up.
Man I didn't even think Arccos could be selling that information to manufactures. Wonder what that will mean for future clubs. If they will start shorting us on tech, improving it, or leaving it the same?
1) Does the data only take into account shots hit with Driver?
2) Is this global data? If so, for comparison purposes, folks might want to take into consideration whether they play in a cold country on often soft ground.
3) Does the data take into account all the duffed / chunked / skied shots that only go 100 yds etc?
Does Arccos allow you to delete topped drives, or drives cut way short by trees and such? If it doesn't, then the averages make sense, but how useful is the data for making club choices? I mean if you hit 10 drives, 8 go 270, and you top 2 of them 20 yds, then your average will be like 220.
It knows. I don’t know how, but it eliminates the outliers. This includes ones that you mash, until that becomes the norm.
I'm not sure of the exact algorithm, but Arccos removes the extraordinarily high and extraordinarily low shots and comes up with an "expected" distance. It is what length of shot you should hit on a well, not perfectly, struck ball.
Interesting, average total driving distance has actually decreased 5 yards the past 3 years. More forgiving drivers? Is there a correlation to fairways hit?
Good question
I'd guess that the age of the average golfer has increased a bit over the last 3 years AND that a bunch of new golfers have joined the ranks lately, whose technique is not (yet) optimal. The drivers "distance" has barely changed over the last 10 years... Now, typically, my drives do indeed go further when on the fairway (more roll, and they were, likely, hit more "squarely" so with less power loss in spin).
I've def hit some more forgiving drivers that cost some distance over the years. The g400 has been the best distance and consistency driver I've hit so far. So many new models every year and not all years have improvements. Wish they would let me test, because once you start knowing what to look for, it saves some wasted money.
there is an error in your video... your graph says 10 HCP and the oval in the fairway says 15. I am going to assume 15 is the intended correct one as it is half way between 0 and 30. PLS CONFIRM