I'm a native Croydonian, and my late dad was a railway guard who often worked the original Addiscombe - Elmers End branch, so thanks for the nice nostagia trip!
Me too, born in Mayday hospital, my late father was relief signalman based at Elmer's End signalbox working from anywhere along the line at any given time, I remember him taking me as a nipper into the mighty Gloucester Road Junc Odeon signalbox that stood athwart the complex junction covering the E Croydon mainline, the Selhurst lines, the lines down to W Croydon, they removed it when they relaid the whole junction layout and removed Norwood Jnc Odeon as well. In the mid eighties I was TOPsman at Norwood and because my father had taught me how to run a NX panel, I was also in charge of the NX sub panel in the TOPs cabin, I had to ring London Bridge for permission token for a train exiting the yard or they would ring me to ask for token entry and they knowing my dad was over on the SE panel would rib me rotten every call... They never forgave me for a prank myself as Waterloo lampsman and Waterloo stores pulled when we issued 1950's "Weskit" uniforms to all the signalling staff at London Bridge, we had been told to burn them in a skip but called all the uniform sizes up on the microfiche and did the issue forms, nearly caused the NUR to call a down tools across the region but immensely funny :)
@@caramelldansen2204 so true....though I am hopeful now that with Combined Authorities and City Deals many more larger towns and city's will get similar systems. If small towns in Germany can do it then I'm sure we can...it just takes MPs to be willing to fund things.. Especially if it can be proven by the City of Coventry that their Very Light Tram system can work...so far it's working out to be £7million per km rather £35million per km.
As a result of this video, I have decided that my favorite tram stop is Elmers End. The story behind the name maybe worthy of a video. The question is - Would such a video have a G rating! An interesting aside is that the original buildings and platform at Woodside were made of, well, wood!
I did work for a while til it closed at Muirheads, think that was the last mega factory left in South London, had several cavernous canteens and I worked in the specials department stores, there were quite a lot of work store departments at the place, our stores were for the parts to make guidance systems and all very top secret and some of the components cost hundreds of pounds each like jewelled bearing assy's, coated laminates in a stack because of their special coating were like 10 grand a stack. They closed the factory down and moved to a small industrial unit between Penge West and Anerley stations then just disappeared. I was always reminded of the film "I'm Alright Jack", Muirheads had the hooters, the clocking in cards, the bustle and hum of many machines and electric tugs around the place, such a shame its gone :(
Ah, Whoodside. In the '70s, according to the posh station announcers, that was on the Haddiscombe branch. Further up the line, trains ran to Helmers Hend, Heden Park, Whest Whickham an' 'Ayes.
Woodside is certainly my favourite tram stop for living up to its name. The timber yard next to it means it actually smells of wood, and it also has small wooded area on the other side of the tracks due to the trees in Ashburton Park 🌳🌳🌳
That bridge-station reminds me of a bunch of stations like that in Paris. In the 19th century there was a complete circle steam pulled railway around Paris - the Petit Ceinture (little belt) but it closed in the 1930s having been usurped by the metro. Then in the 2000s the circle became required again as more people lived in the suburbs and wanted inter-suburb links without going via the centre - so they built a tramway - on the roads that follow the same route as the Petit Ceinture where you can still find rails installed and the odd signal light forever at red. Weird planners!!
Or appropriate adaptation to changing needs. In London the development of the Overground circuit (Clapham Junction to Highbury and Islington) could be seen similarly and again has been a major success.
If any want to know more, Tim of "The Tim Traveller" did a video about the Petite Ceinture about 3 years ago: ua-cam.com/video/IovEyB2EYoM/v-deo.html . Much of the old route has been converted to trails, though stretches are still abandoned. SNCF (France's national rail) apparently still owns the right-of-way too, so maybe one day the Petit Ceinture will see trains again if the parallel trams and busses get too crowded. 🙂
When they were building the Trams in West Croydon they ripped up the tarmac and found ... the rails of the trams from last century had simply been built over so were still there. It held up construction.
It's surprising how successful some lines can be when they are modernised, tidied up and given a frequent service. Back in the mid 70s I used to travel a bit from Surbiton to Waddon Marsh, via Wimbledon. Though electrified, the single track line from Wimbledon had semi derelict stations, used a gloomy old two coach multiple unit with an hourly service (I think) and only seemed to have about half a dozen passengers on it off peak. Decades later I used the Tramlink service and the contrast couldn't have been greater. Bright trams, clean tramstop shelters, frequent services, packed coaches. Where did all the extra passengers come from?
i would not trust BR usage figures, notrious for being underestimates and strange reasons for closures. we just want to close the line, so dont pay attention to our maths or conclusions.
It wasn't just the Addiscombe branch, the whole of the Hayes line was losing traffic in the 60s/70s. I helped carry out a survey of ex-season ticket holders to try and find out where they had got to!
The general move out of "londoners" to Crawley as new town, and new migrants tended to move to Zone 2 leaving more retirees in the Zone 5/6 area ? (+ drive to Bromley/Croydon?)
@@JamesPetts I feel sure all the men died or took retirement by age of 60 and the women worked locally, no one sold their houses until the women died aged 90 so no one new coming into the area of the stations (plus more trains from east croydon than anywhere else more direct and faster to London Bridge and Victoria
I am ashamed to say that despite living in Tooting, and regularly attending a training placement in Croydon, from 2013 to 2017, I never once rode the trams. I nearly collided with one once, but that is another story. Despite this embarrassing admission I found this video very interesting, so either I am every bit as nerdy as you are Jago, or maybe it isn't quite as nerdy as you might imagine.
Tooting to Croydon was Tram (old)/Trolleybus land. Now the 264 nearly functions to get you there if you can cope with the lack of progress in Mitcham and Mitcham Common due to traffic congestion, taking a 280 to Mitcham Tramstop does not really save much time
Many thanks for this picturesque snapshot of 'how to' and 'how not to' do urban transport. Who would have thought in BR days that connecting up lines to suit where people wanted to go, and then running a more frequent service, would have resulted in a run-away success? - well, actually, RailFuture, a lot of the rail user groups around the UK, and many frustrated would-be public transport users, as well as citizens in mainland Europe who take their tram services as a matter of course ... It would be interesting to find out what the stages were in converting local politicians and other Croydon area 'stakeholders' into tramway-lovers.
I like the tram stop which is near a large cemetery - I cannot recall its name as I live outside London and rode most of the tram network one day - probably as I like cemetries and zombie invasions :)
Plenty of Cemetaries short walks from tram / rail stops. Figgs Marsh at Mitcham , Rowan Lane nearish Eastfields (bit of a walk really / 152 bus) Gap Road Wimbledon. a Pair at Blackshaw Road - Tooting Broadway as is Garrett Lane . Therapia Lane and walk to Mitcham Road for the Croydon one.
Birkeck is right next to Beckenham Crematorium/ Cemetery, where W G Grace and Thomas Crapper amongst others currently reside, the tram line then wraps around the cemetery to Harrington Road stop.
@@highpath4776 The tram stop at Harrington Road is at the West entrance of Beckenham Cemetery, Birkbeck being at the East end and further from the cemetery entrance. Another famous-ish person buried there is the Rev. Arthur Tooth who was in charge of the convent in what is now Woodside Park adjacent to the tram line and which used to be my local library (I grew up thinking that all libraries had rooms that led off cloisters). I grew up in a house on Estcourt Road, the tram stop called Arena is at the bottom of the Road and my grandmother lived in Harrington Road. I could never have imagined that one day I could get on a train to grandmother's house. She used to take me down the road to Beckenham Cemetery to look after her husband's grave and then we would visit the ornamental ponds and waterfall which are still there.
Perhaps somewhat out-of-area for you, Mr. Hazzard (but, there again, so was Edinburgh), but how about a vid. about the Blackpool trams - both Heritage and "Bendy"? You might time this to cover the opening of the new Blackpool North branch this spring.
I worked for B.R. in Charing Cross Control Room from 1979-83. This was just in time to witness the very end of a one-journey, weekday evening peak train from Charing Cross to Sanderstead via the Mid Kent. I can't remember the actual departure time.
There were a few more peak hour trains, but they only ran as far as Selsdon which was the station just by the junction with the East Croydon-Sanderstead-Oxted line. The one train to Sanderstead seemed to be the equivalent to a Parliamentary service. They ran empty because the line didn't go anywhere where most people wanted to. It was basically an alternative route to London much slower than going from East Croydon. Now it goes into Croydon itself and is immensely more useful, especially with the New Addington extension. I reckon the Selsdon/Sanderstead service only lasted as long as it did because BR were reluctant to close an electrified line. The SR I believe electrified it as a possible bypass to East Croydon, anticipating electrification to Oxted which didn't in fact occur until 1987, after the Woodside line had closed.
@@iankemp1131 Thank you for this very detailed and informative reply. So, I wasn't suffering "false memory syndrome" with my recollection of this train! Of the same era (1979) was a 3-coach Oxted unit running from Charing Cross at the rear of the 18:45 to Hastings, being detached at Tonbridge and running through to Eridge.
@@stuarthall6631 Thanks, I didn't know about that one! Again I travelled on Tonbridge-Eridge just before it closed round 1986 and took some cine film. But now most of it is happily open again as the Spa Valley Railway. Still, it feels as if it could have been a useful cross-country route from Brighton to Tonbridge and the Medway if Lewes-Uckfield hadn't been closed.
@@stuarthall6631 I remember seeing them thunder through Grove Park, looked tres odd. SR were always trying weird stuff to see if it caught on, to date the old Hasting's DMU's just have no peer, sleek, fast, had a decent buffet, comfy too compared to the train I caught ten years ago to St Leonards which was awful and I got a black eye when the stupid thing bucked on a point, carriage went bang and of course I was akip with me head up against the side. My two ideal consists were a 12 pack of Hastings or the equally as awesome 13 coach 4CEP-4CEP-4CEP-MLV, 16 coaches rated power and 13 coaches weight and pre-Jaffa the buffets on them were pretty good too.
A favourite tram stop is a perfectly normal thing to have, I’d say! Personally I’m partial to Wandle Park. Always really enjoy these tram videos, looking forward to seeing the future ones on Croydon’s disused railways!
2:24 How many sides would Woodside have, if Woodside would not do? :) What wood be really good, is if some sort of use could be found for that really quite elegant little station building. At least it's well kept, but currently looks sad, with its boarded up windows.
Hi Jago. For years, I've wondered if there was a disused line at Woodlands Way/Bridge at Putney between Putney and Wandsworth Town stations. There are two tunnels with shrubs growing beneath. Would you be able to make a vid about this if you cn please?
This is really interesting. The Woodside tram stop obviously has such a great history. The London Trams are great, it would be cool if they were more integrated with the rest of the TfL network at places other than Wimbledon, but I suppose you can’t have everything!
Some of the stations along the mid kent have interesting architecture, in some ways Clock House just north of Elmers End looks similar to what Woodside would have looked like when it was an operational rail station
Can you do more on the Sanderstead branch please. Always fascinated me as it declined in the 1960s and 70s... Bingham Road, Coombe Road ... Selsdon etc
As I commented myself above, I worked for B.R. in Charing Cross Control Room from 1979-83. This was just in time to witness the very end of a one-journey, weekday evening peak train from Charing Cross to Sanderstead via the Mid Kent. I can't remember the actual departure time.
I guess the Croydon Corporation Trams and Tilling for General Buses really dealt with most of the passengers, with even the Green Line coaches picking up commuters until the late 1960s
I enjoyed this very much as I lived on Lower Addiscombe Road in the early '90s and remember both Woodside and Addiscombe stations as quite attractive buildings from a bygone time. There was also lots former railway architecture in Addiscombe in the form of bridge abutments, poles, electrical boxes and assorted lineside buildings, some abandoned and others repurposed. Almost all of it swept away by the Tramlink.
@@marksims3904 You were up by Nicholson Road. One of my flatmates at 287 above the Harlequin Hair Salon got pulled by the Old Bill, drunk on his 21st birthday, trying to pinch the road sign. He was Dave Nicholson!
i used to fly to Gatwick from Dublin, then get the Southern train to East Croydon, then get the tram to West Croydon, another train to Wallington then to visit my Grandparents...sadly no longer with us. but just shows how light rail or Trams for me are very important and should be more of them.
2:24 Isn't it meant to be pronounced more like "Sarnderstead"? I haven't lived in South Croydon for over 15 years now, but that's how I remember everyone pronouncing it.
We have Woodside Park on the Northern Line. Very picturesque ex Steam Line and it shows. It even has a Victorian Post Box inset into the front wall of the booking office where the buses turn. One of my favourite stations.
You may have asked yourself question what is your favorite tram stop ? but have you ever asked yourself the question if you where a tram stop which tram stop would you be?
Curious about the old station building -- does TFL own the building? Is it use for anything? Call me werid, strange, kid at heart, whatever, but I'd love to have an office with a window overlooking the tracks where I could see the trams pass through. Somebody should make that happen!
Yeah looks as though it was boarded up years ago and just abandoned. Shame. I’m quite lucky in that my kitchen and dining room overlook a mainline railway (Arun Valley Line - about 50 metres away) so I can enjoy watching the trains over a meal and whilst doing the washing-up!
TFL doesn't own it. At the time of closure, it was owned by Railtrack, but I don't know how its ownership has changed since then. It doesn't appear on the ORR list of "station assets", but it might be another class of infrastructure. It might also be owned by a property development company that took over the Railtrack assets that were not transferred to Network Rail in 2002.
0:58 You know, this was the first time I even heard of the The Mid-Kent railway. I can imagine why the Big 4 are the talking point to most people: it is a whole lot easier to comprehend! 0:28 Given that you were talking about the situation of South London's railways at the time, it gives me an idea for a topic you could cover if you feel like it: A family tree of London's railways going from railways like the Mid-Kent railway, to the the Big 4 like the Southern railway. Then to BR, and even perhaps today.
I always associate trams with Abroad. The idea of something so exotic in South London (Not to mention exotic places in the North) sets my pulse racing.
I think I only ever travelled two or three times Wimbledon to West Croydon (Table 2) and never on the Addiscombe Branches, despite cycling to Lower Addiscombe Road to get cheap bargain LPs in the 1970s. We also had a friend in West Wickham but we always drove the them for Sunday Tea
If you really want to get nerdy- "All the tram stops with Jago Hazard" or get really nerdy and wait for the bus pass and do all the bus stops but I think John Shuttleworth's done/ is planning something like that already (Radio Shuttleworth). I believe the Scottish bus pass takes you all over Scotland though. Trams are great. Low coefficient of friction, train formation, high capacity and segregation which keeps them moving/prioritises them. Brilliant. But you can only take bikes on the Edinburgh trams. This peeves me in Manchester for example where the railway is now a tramway. Bikes and trains and trams are made for each other (this really is a big topic!).
I don't know if these mad rules still apply, but inexplicably when the Tramlink opened you could only buy a ticket at a dispenser at the stop (thus missing your tram) and your ticket had to be bought half-an-hour before you rode (so you couldn't get one for your ride home when you came to work in the morning). Some useful bus routes (eg if I remember, the 54 from Woolwich) were cut short simply so that you had to break your journey and use one of their dreary cream and dogmeat coloured trams
A classic example of appropriate adaptation of a rail route to modern needs. The key difference was the new link from Addiscombe into Central Croydon so that it effectively served local transport needs rather than being a slow duplicate route to London. I travelled on the Woodside-Sanderstead branch just before it closed along with a few railway enthusiasts. It ran peak hours only and the surprise was that it has lasted so long; BR/SR were embarrassed to close an electrified line. Good that the track bed was safeguarded so that it could be reused when the time came. The last section into Addiscombe was closed and Addiscombe tram stop is what used to be Bingham Road on the Sanderstead line.
The author R F Delderfield lived in Addiscombe from 1918 to 1923 but in his autobiography he said he walked to Woodside to catch the train as it saved a halfpenny a day. The Avenue series of books is based on his time there.
There used to be a depot at Addiscombe - this must have stopped the line being abandoned even earlier. During the conversion to tramway there was one signal Woodside that remined, fully lit, for a long time after the track had been removed. Centrally controlled signalling systems are a devil to amend.
When going to East Croydon from Catford we used to take the 54 bus instead of the Hayes train from Catford Bridge and changing at Elmers End for Adiscombe, which is but a stone's throw from East Croydon station.
I have a favourite; it is St Andrew Square, Edinburgh. A bit messed up at the moment, as the new bit to Newhaven is getting finished. There is a very large stick in St Andrew Square, with a statue of a bloke on top of it, who isn't St Andrew - he, being a Saint, would probably not need a stick to stand on, and certainly pigeons would not poo on him.
And here I was thinking that I was a tram nerd because I have a favourite tram route in Melbourne.....the No. 96 to the South Melbourne Market and St Kilda Beach ua-cam.com/video/qXlPg2CoH08/v-deo.html but having a single favourite tram stop .... that is "nerdiness" on another level!😜 Loving your content 😀
I'm very bored at work, so I asked chatgpt to write a review of a wc in your style... I don't think you'll be out of work any time soon, enjoy: "What's up, fam? JagoHazzard here, and today I'm going to be reviewing a true masterpiece of human engineering - the one and only portapotty. If you're like me and you enjoy the finer things in life, you'll know that nothing beats the sweet aroma of a plastic box filled with human waste. So, without further ado, let's dive into this thing. First off, let's talk about the aesthetics. I mean, what's not to love? It's a small, cramped space with a door that barely closes. It's like a tiny sauna, but instead of relaxation, you get the joy of taking a dump. And the smell? Oh man, it's like a combination of raw sewage and stale Doritos. Delicious. Now, let's get down to business. Functionality-wise, this portapotty is a real gem. It's got a nice little seat that'll give you a cramp in your butt cheeks after a few minutes, and there's just enough space to do your business without feeling like you're in a coffin. Plus, the toilet paper dispenser is a nice touch. It's like they knew you'd need to wipe after dropping a bomb in there. And finally, the smell. Let me tell you, this thing is like a breath of fresh air. If you're into that whole 'wading through a sea of sewage' vibe, this is the place for you. Just make sure you don't pass out from the fumes before you're finished. So that's it for today's video, guys. You're my trusty toilet paper to this week's pile of poo, as we explored the wonderful world of portapotties. Thanks for sticking around, and if you ever find yourself in need of a quick pit stop, just remember the good ol' plastic box. Until next time, you're my loyal viewers to this week's content. Peace out!"
"and sometimes they built lines just because they could" ...Glances guiltily at my Transport Fever 2 layout running in the background that looks like a glimpse into the eye of chaos...
The name Woodside is one of several references, along with Norwood and Forest Hill, to the ancient Great North Wood which once covered the whole area. The only surviving parts the wood are, ironically, saved by present of former railway lines: a small area close to Honor Oak Park and Sydenham Hill Woods along the former trackbed of part of the old Crystal Palace High Level line.
Interesting covering Norwood and Woodside as John Rodger's afternoon sunday walk vid released at 5pm covered The London Loop Crystal Palace to Streatham showing some of the areas of the North Wood still believed to be extant.
Two questions: 1) you mentioned offloading horses. Were the railways routinely used to to transport equines? 2) You also mentioned that Woodside had a shop. Was this a forerunner of the semi-malls we get today in major stations like Kings Cross and Victoria? Excellent video as always.
Ventilation is hard to model and caused the late stage month-long delay in opening New York’s most recently completed mega project, at Grand Central. They built doors as a quick fix. But being a v.s. nerd, you knew that. Also v.s.’s caused some siting issues for new tunnels in Baltimore, Maryland. It’s worth looking at just for the original plan of new tunnels weaving under each other to reach more convenient platforms at the station. Yet all that was simplified to fewer tunnels. Oldest railway in the U.S. was in Balto.
I hadn't realised that the branch still had a service right up until the tram takeover works started. I always thought it had lain disused for some years (or even decades) before conversion.
As a relief booking clerk, I spent at week at Addiscombe in 1984 (it was still SED before sectorisation moved us to Areas). Every morning I went up to Woodside to collect the excess fares the Railman had taken (Woodside was staffed at the time), had a Greek coffee and travelled back to Addiscombe. Days were spent with drivers popping in for a cup of tea before taking the, "Pop-pop" back to Elmers End and the Railman who was also a part time cabaret singer specialising in Lionel Richie covers - this was at the time of Richie's famous hit, "Hello" etc. Happy Days😂.
Incidentally there's also a station in New Zealand that's named Woodside. It's on the Wairarapa Line and served by Masterton to Wellington passenger trains, and prior to the late 1950s it was also the junction for a short branch to Greytown. As for how it got the name Woodside, I don't know.
From Corydon to Elmer's End,gluing the system together! The place names in South London are fascinating,please keep up on the old Southern[LB&SC,LSWR,SECR,LCDR lines]as they seemingly went hither,thither,and yon! Thank you,Jago,for another foray into London history 🙏 🙌 👏! Thank you 😇!
What has become of the station building? Is see everything is boarded up, but it's a perfect place for either a venue or maybe even a small house. I mean, how cool would it be to have a door straight onto the platform? 🤣🤣🤣
Woodside looks like Clock House station which is further up the line. This entire line would have been a branch of the Fleet line had it been built. There used to be peak trains in the 1990s from Charing Cross to Addiscombe, calling at Waterloo East then non stop to Catford Bridge, New Beckenham, Elmers End, Woodside and Addiscombe
Why does your future video have an abandoned track bed? I didn't even know that videos could possess such attributes. (You're not the only nerd here you know!)
I went to Beavers in a scout hut off Birdhurst Rise besides the closed Addiscombe Branch in the mid 80's. I was convinced that trains still went by when I was there but they can't have. I guess the passage of 37 years has played tricks with my memory.
An orange Line to Sanderstead via Woodside and the Hayes Branch to the ELL would seem to have some usefulness. Many of the large villas in Sanderstead are being demolished for 2 bedroom flats
About as nerdy as I am, when I win the lottery, I'll buy myself a Black Five....or a couple, or handful....you know, I've always liked those GWR Castle and Kings classes, then again, those Royal Scots....🤨🤔 Right, that's the kettle....I need a cuppa! 😉😆😂
I'm a native Croydonian, and my late dad was a railway guard who often worked the original Addiscombe - Elmers End branch, so thanks for the nice nostagia trip!
Me too, born in Mayday hospital, my late father was relief signalman based at Elmer's End signalbox working from anywhere along the line at any given time, I remember him taking me as a nipper into the mighty Gloucester Road Junc Odeon signalbox that stood athwart the complex junction covering the E Croydon mainline, the Selhurst lines, the lines down to W Croydon, they removed it when they relaid the whole junction layout and removed Norwood Jnc Odeon as well. In the mid eighties I was TOPsman at Norwood and because my father had taught me how to run a NX panel, I was also in charge of the NX sub panel in the TOPs cabin, I had to ring London Bridge for permission token for a train exiting the yard or they would ring me to ask for token entry and they knowing my dad was over on the SE panel would rib me rotten every call... They never forgave me for a prank myself as Waterloo lampsman and Waterloo stores pulled when we issued 1950's "Weskit" uniforms to all the signalling staff at London Bridge, we had been told to burn them in a skip but called all the uniform sizes up on the microfiche and did the issue forms, nearly caused the NUR to call a down tools across the region but immensely funny :)
It's not nerdiness, it's an appreciation of the magic of the everyday!
Well put, @Apollo!
If you don’t have a nerd interest, then your life is poor .
The Croydon Tramlink was a very sensible way of making "useless" railway branch lines useful again.
If only the rest of the country got that treatment.
@@caramelldansen2204 so true....though I am hopeful now that with Combined Authorities and City Deals many more larger towns and city's will get similar systems. If small towns in Germany can do it then I'm sure we can...it just takes MPs to be willing to fund things..
Especially if it can be proven by the City of Coventry that their Very Light Tram system can work...so far it's working out to be £7million per km rather £35million per km.
@@paintedpilgrim We shouldn't have to wish upon a star for basic social services.
no such thing as a useless railway branch, only uselessly incompetent government / local councils
@@idot3331 If we build it, they will come.
As a result of this video, I have decided that my favorite tram stop is Elmers End. The story behind the name maybe worthy of a video. The question is - Would such a video have a G rating! An interesting aside is that the original buildings and platform at Woodside were made of, well, wood!
I did work for a while til it closed at Muirheads, think that was the last mega factory left in South London, had several cavernous canteens and I worked in the specials department stores, there were quite a lot of work store departments at the place, our stores were for the parts to make guidance systems and all very top secret and some of the components cost hundreds of pounds each like jewelled bearing assy's, coated laminates in a stack because of their special coating were like 10 grand a stack. They closed the factory down and moved to a small industrial unit between Penge West and Anerley stations then just disappeared. I was always reminded of the film "I'm Alright Jack", Muirheads had the hooters, the clocking in cards, the bustle and hum of many machines and electric tugs around the place, such a shame its gone :(
Ah, Whoodside. In the '70s, according to the posh station announcers, that was on the Haddiscombe branch. Further up the line, trains ran to Helmers Hend, Heden Park, Whest Whickham an' 'Ayes.
Parker from Thunderbirds? 🚀
@@AtheistOrphan The role model for '70s announcers across the South East, well spotted.
Woodside is certainly my favourite tram stop for living up to its name. The timber yard next to it means it actually smells of wood, and it also has small wooded area on the other side of the tracks due to the trees in Ashburton Park 🌳🌳🌳
The timber yard won't last long; London is very anti-business these days, unless it's a coffee shop or an american candy and money laundering store.
@@Skorpychan That sounds like just one shop,Starbucks !!
That bridge-station reminds me of a bunch of stations like that in Paris. In the 19th century there was a complete circle steam pulled railway around Paris - the Petit Ceinture (little belt) but it closed in the 1930s having been usurped by the metro. Then in the 2000s the circle became required again as more people lived in the suburbs and wanted inter-suburb links without going via the centre - so they built a tramway - on the roads that follow the same route as the Petit Ceinture where you can still find rails installed and the odd signal light forever at red. Weird planners!!
Or appropriate adaptation to changing needs. In London the development of the Overground circuit (Clapham Junction to Highbury and Islington) could be seen similarly and again has been a major success.
If any want to know more, Tim of "The Tim Traveller" did a video about the Petite Ceinture about 3 years ago: ua-cam.com/video/IovEyB2EYoM/v-deo.html .
Much of the old route has been converted to trails, though stretches are still abandoned. SNCF (France's national rail) apparently still owns the right-of-way too, so maybe one day the Petit Ceinture will see trains again if the parallel trams and busses get too crowded. 🙂
When they were building the Trams in West Croydon they ripped up the tarmac and found ... the rails of the trams from last century had simply been built over so were still there. It held up construction.
It's surprising how successful some lines can be when they are modernised, tidied up and given a frequent service. Back in the mid 70s I used to travel a bit from Surbiton to Waddon Marsh, via Wimbledon. Though electrified, the single track line from Wimbledon had semi derelict stations, used a gloomy old two coach multiple unit with an hourly service (I think) and only seemed to have about half a dozen passengers on it off peak. Decades later I used the Tramlink service and the contrast couldn't have been greater. Bright trams, clean tramstop shelters, frequent services, packed coaches. Where did all the extra passengers come from?
i would not trust BR usage figures, notrious for being underestimates and strange reasons for closures. we just want to close the line, so dont pay attention to our maths or conclusions.
It wasn't just the Addiscombe branch, the whole of the Hayes line was losing traffic in the 60s/70s. I helped carry out a survey of ex-season ticket holders to try and find out where they had got to!
The general move out of "londoners" to Crawley as new town, and new migrants tended to move to Zone 2 leaving more retirees in the Zone 5/6 area ? (+ drive to Bromley/Croydon?)
Gotham City probably.
And where had they got to?
@@JamesPetts Good question. I don't think we got enough replies to come to any conclusions!
@@JamesPetts I feel sure all the men died or took retirement by age of 60 and the women worked locally, no one sold their houses until the women died aged 90 so no one new coming into the area of the stations (plus more trains from east croydon than anywhere else more direct and faster to London Bridge and Victoria
I like Woodside too. Nice layout......it almost begs to be modeled 🚋🚋🚋🚋🚃🚃🚃🚃🚉🚊🚉🚊! And I don't even live there 😁💥😮!
I am ashamed to say that despite living in Tooting, and regularly attending a training placement in Croydon, from 2013 to 2017, I never once rode the trams. I nearly collided with one once, but that is another story. Despite this embarrassing admission I found this video very interesting, so either I am every bit as nerdy as you are Jago, or maybe it isn't quite as nerdy as you might imagine.
Tooting to Croydon was Tram (old)/Trolleybus land. Now the 264 nearly functions to get you there if you can cope with the lack of progress in Mitcham and Mitcham Common due to traffic congestion, taking a 280 to Mitcham Tramstop does not really save much time
Back in the eighties every weekend I would be found in Tooting's Castle, some rare mod and ska nights to be had :)
Many thanks for this picturesque snapshot of 'how to' and 'how not to' do urban transport. Who would have thought in BR days that connecting up lines to suit where people wanted to go, and then running a more frequent service, would have resulted in a run-away success? - well, actually, RailFuture, a lot of the rail user groups around the UK, and many frustrated would-be public transport users, as well as citizens in mainland Europe who take their tram services as a matter of course ... It would be interesting to find out what the stages were in converting local politicians and other Croydon area 'stakeholders' into tramway-lovers.
I like the tram stop which is near a large cemetery - I cannot recall its name as I live outside London and rode most of the tram network one day - probably as I like cemetries and zombie invasions :)
Plenty of Cemetaries short walks from tram / rail stops. Figgs Marsh at Mitcham , Rowan Lane nearish Eastfields (bit of a walk really / 152 bus) Gap Road Wimbledon. a Pair at Blackshaw Road - Tooting Broadway as is Garrett Lane . Therapia Lane and walk to Mitcham Road for the Croydon one.
Birkeck is right next to Beckenham Crematorium/ Cemetery, where W G Grace and Thomas Crapper amongst others currently reside, the tram line then wraps around the cemetery to Harrington Road stop.
@@highpath4776 The tram stop at Harrington Road is at the West entrance of Beckenham Cemetery, Birkbeck being at the East end and further from the cemetery entrance. Another famous-ish person buried there is the Rev. Arthur Tooth who was in charge of the convent in what is now Woodside Park adjacent to the tram line and which used to be my local library (I grew up thinking that all libraries had rooms that led off cloisters). I grew up in a house on Estcourt Road, the tram stop called Arena is at the bottom of the Road and my grandmother lived in Harrington Road. I could never have imagined that one day I could get on a train to grandmother's house. She used to take me down the road to Beckenham Cemetery to look after her husband's grave and then we would visit the ornamental ponds and waterfall which are still there.
@@aelfweard9242 Thanks I think the stop i was referring to was Birkbeck
Perhaps somewhat out-of-area for you, Mr. Hazzard (but, there again, so was Edinburgh), but how about a vid. about the Blackpool trams - both Heritage and "Bendy"? You might time this to cover the opening of the new Blackpool North branch this spring.
I worked for B.R. in Charing Cross Control Room from 1979-83. This was just in time to witness the very end of a one-journey, weekday evening peak train from Charing Cross to Sanderstead via the Mid Kent. I can't remember the actual departure time.
Perhaps the one through service might explain the lack of passengers
There were a few more peak hour trains, but they only ran as far as Selsdon which was the station just by the junction with the East Croydon-Sanderstead-Oxted line. The one train to Sanderstead seemed to be the equivalent to a Parliamentary service. They ran empty because the line didn't go anywhere where most people wanted to. It was basically an alternative route to London much slower than going from East Croydon. Now it goes into Croydon itself and is immensely more useful, especially with the New Addington extension. I reckon the Selsdon/Sanderstead service only lasted as long as it did because BR were reluctant to close an electrified line. The SR I believe electrified it as a possible bypass to East Croydon, anticipating electrification to Oxted which didn't in fact occur until 1987, after the Woodside line had closed.
@@iankemp1131 Thank you for this very detailed and informative reply. So, I wasn't suffering "false memory syndrome" with my recollection of this train! Of the same era (1979) was a 3-coach Oxted unit running from Charing Cross at the rear of the 18:45 to Hastings, being detached at Tonbridge and running through to Eridge.
@@stuarthall6631 Thanks, I didn't know about that one! Again I travelled on Tonbridge-Eridge just before it closed round 1986 and took some cine film. But now most of it is happily open again as the Spa Valley Railway. Still, it feels as if it could have been a useful cross-country route from Brighton to Tonbridge and the Medway if Lewes-Uckfield hadn't been closed.
@@stuarthall6631 I remember seeing them thunder through Grove Park, looked tres odd. SR were always trying weird stuff to see if it caught on, to date the old Hasting's DMU's just have no peer, sleek, fast, had a decent buffet, comfy too compared to the train I caught ten years ago to St Leonards which was awful and I got a black eye when the stupid thing bucked on a point, carriage went bang and of course I was akip with me head up against the side. My two ideal consists were a 12 pack of Hastings or the equally as awesome 13 coach 4CEP-4CEP-4CEP-MLV, 16 coaches rated power and 13 coaches weight and pre-Jaffa the buffets on them were pretty good too.
A favourite tram stop is a perfectly normal thing to have, I’d say! Personally I’m partial to Wandle Park.
Always really enjoy these tram videos, looking forward to seeing the future ones on Croydon’s disused railways!
Lloyd Park is also nice.
0:22 'light' rail schemes make 'heavy' use of old railways. Indeed!
2:24 How many sides would Woodside have, if Woodside would not do? :)
What wood be really good, is if some sort of use could be found for that really quite elegant little station building. At least it's well kept, but currently looks sad, with its boarded up windows.
Hi Jago. For years, I've wondered if there was a disused line at Woodlands Way/Bridge at Putney between Putney and Wandsworth Town stations. There are two tunnels with shrubs growing beneath. Would you be able to make a vid about this if you cn please?
Coombe of course is a Wooded Valley. So Addis Coombe is the Wooded Valley with the plastic bins and dustpan brushes.
Lol
This is really interesting. The Woodside tram stop obviously has such a great history. The London Trams are great, it would be cool if they were more integrated with the rest of the TfL network at places other than Wimbledon, but I suppose you can’t have everything!
Re-opening the junction onto the New Addington Road (for divergence to South Croydon/Sanderstead has some appeal.
I'm surprised that Shirley only transport is buses but I don't know other parts of Croydon that doesn't have many transport
They're _sort of_ integrated with the Overground at West Croydon.
Some of the stations along the mid kent have interesting architecture, in some ways Clock House just north of Elmers End looks similar to what Woodside would have looked like when it was an operational rail station
Can you do more on the Sanderstead branch please. Always fascinated me as it declined in the 1960s and 70s... Bingham Road, Coombe Road ... Selsdon etc
As I commented myself above, I worked for B.R. in Charing Cross Control Room from 1979-83. This was just in time to witness the very end of a one-journey, weekday evening peak train from Charing Cross to Sanderstead via the Mid Kent. I can't remember the actual departure time.
So would a commuter from Selsdon be "Selsdon Man"?
I guess the Croydon Corporation Trams and Tilling for General Buses really dealt with most of the passengers, with even the Green Line coaches picking up commuters until the late 1960s
@@robertwilloughby8050 Definitely not in my case... and the station was nowhere near Selsdon in fact. Selsdon Road more like it
@@robertwilloughby8050 Or woman, maybe?
I enjoyed this very much as I lived on Lower Addiscombe Road in the early '90s and remember both Woodside and Addiscombe stations as quite attractive buildings from a bygone time. There was also lots former railway architecture in Addiscombe in the form of bridge abutments, poles, electrical boxes and assorted lineside buildings, some abandoned and others repurposed. Almost all of it swept away by the Tramlink.
Me too, I lived a 175 Lower Addiscombe Road from 1996 to 2002 when I moved home to Felixstowe, loved the tram service. Clean, reliable, fun.
@@marksims3904 You were up by Nicholson Road. One of my flatmates at 287 above the Harlequin Hair Salon got pulled by the Old Bill, drunk on his 21st birthday, trying to pinch the road sign. He was Dave Nicholson!
wonderful history
i used to fly to Gatwick from Dublin, then get the Southern train to East Croydon, then get the tram to West Croydon, another train to Wallington then to visit my Grandparents...sadly no longer with us.
but just shows how light rail or Trams for me are very important and should be more of them.
2:24 Isn't it meant to be pronounced more like "Sarnderstead"? I haven't lived in South Croydon for over 15 years now, but that's how I remember everyone pronouncing it.
Yes it was always pronounced Sarnderstead, especially among the well to do folk that lived there.
Yeah I’ve always pronounced it that way, as did my father, who spent his entire working life on ‘The Southern’.
We have Woodside Park on the Northern Line. Very picturesque ex Steam Line and it shows. It even has a Victorian Post Box inset into the front wall of the booking office where the buses turn. One of my favourite stations.
You may have asked yourself question what is your favorite tram stop ? but have you ever asked yourself the question if you where a tram stop which tram stop would you be?
I'd be Arena then I could give the performance of a lifetime instead of being the nobody that is me !!
Curious about the old station building -- does TFL own the building? Is it use for anything? Call me werid, strange, kid at heart, whatever, but I'd love to have an office with a window overlooking the tracks where I could see the trams pass through. Somebody should make that happen!
Yeah looks as though it was boarded up years ago and just abandoned. Shame.
I’m quite lucky in that my kitchen and dining room overlook a mainline railway (Arun Valley Line - about 50 metres away) so I can enjoy watching the trains over a meal and whilst doing the washing-up!
TFL doesn't own it. At the time of closure, it was owned by Railtrack, but I don't know how its ownership has changed since then. It doesn't appear on the ORR list of "station assets", but it might be another class of infrastructure. It might also be owned by a property development company that took over the Railtrack assets that were not transferred to Network Rail in 2002.
0:58 You know, this was the first time I even heard of the The Mid-Kent railway. I can imagine why the Big 4 are the talking point to most people: it is a whole lot easier to comprehend!
0:28 Given that you were talking about the situation of South London's railways at the time, it gives me an idea for a topic you could cover if you feel like it:
A family tree of London's railways going from railways like the Mid-Kent railway, to the the Big 4 like the Southern railway. Then to BR, and even perhaps today.
Considering I derive joy from this channel, I’d say you’re nerdy.
I always associate trams with Abroad. The idea of something so exotic in South London (Not to mention exotic places in the North) sets my pulse racing.
I think I only ever travelled two or three times Wimbledon to West Croydon (Table 2) and never on the Addiscombe Branches, despite cycling to Lower Addiscombe Road to get cheap bargain LPs in the 1970s. We also had a friend in West Wickham but we always drove the them for Sunday Tea
Need to take the tram one day around South London. It looks like a great transport hub!
If you really want to get nerdy- "All the tram stops with Jago Hazard" or get really nerdy and wait for the bus pass and do all the bus stops but I think John Shuttleworth's done/ is planning something like that already (Radio Shuttleworth). I believe the Scottish bus pass takes you all over Scotland though.
Trams are great. Low coefficient of friction, train formation, high capacity and segregation which keeps them moving/prioritises them. Brilliant. But you can only take bikes on the Edinburgh trams. This peeves me in Manchester for example where the railway is now a tramway. Bikes and trains and trams are made for each other (this really is a big topic!).
I don't know if these mad rules still apply, but inexplicably when the Tramlink opened you could only buy a ticket at a dispenser at the stop (thus missing your tram) and your ticket had to be bought half-an-hour before you rode (so you couldn't get one for your ride home when you came to work in the morning). Some useful bus routes (eg if I remember, the 54 from Woolwich) were cut short simply so that you had to break your journey and use one of their dreary cream and dogmeat coloured trams
A classic example of appropriate adaptation of a rail route to modern needs. The key difference was the new link from Addiscombe into Central Croydon so that it effectively served local transport needs rather than being a slow duplicate route to London. I travelled on the Woodside-Sanderstead branch just before it closed along with a few railway enthusiasts. It ran peak hours only and the surprise was that it has lasted so long; BR/SR were embarrassed to close an electrified line. Good that the track bed was safeguarded so that it could be reused when the time came. The last section into Addiscombe was closed and Addiscombe tram stop is what used to be Bingham Road on the Sanderstead line.
Thanks for making these videos, you do a great job at explaining the odd quirks and station histories of London rail stations
Such a shame that the building is unused - it would make a wonderful café with superb views of the trams passing underneath! ;-)
It's almost as if high frequency encourages riders. Crazy!
The nerdery is why we're here, my man.
Always.
Great vid as always Jago 👍
The author R F Delderfield lived in Addiscombe from 1918 to 1923 but in his autobiography he said he walked to Woodside to catch the train as it saved a halfpenny a day. The Avenue series of books is based on his time there.
His autobiography is great to read as well.
Is the sign on map above Woodside a Golf Club or place of Ancient Battle ? (same difference really)
DLR computer system designed by Hornby Railways. A toy railway system that works
There used to be a depot at Addiscombe - this must have stopped the line being abandoned even earlier. During the conversion to tramway there was one signal Woodside that remined, fully lit, for a long time after the track had been removed. Centrally controlled signalling systems are a devil to amend.
On a scale of nerdyness that is pretty far up there. In fact if it was on a scale of wind speed it would be a veritable hurricane.
Meet lift (elevator) nerds. More popular than escalator buffs, probably.
It's unfortunate the building is now standing unoccupied. Surely something could be made of it. Museum perhaps?
Great idea but sadly not economically viable.
@@AtheistOrphan Yes, you might be correct. I don't live around there, so people from the area would know better.
Love to hear more about the Addiscombe branch!!!
In my estimation, you're not just a nerd, but a Master Nerd as your are both the noun and the verb by defininition! Keep up the great work. Cheers!
When going to East Croydon from Catford we used to take the 54 bus instead of the Hayes train from Catford Bridge and changing at Elmers End for Adiscombe, which is but a stone's throw from East Croydon station.
You never cease to entertain me Jago, side note, I do believe that every where should have a tram, it's an amazing invention
its a pity the dlr and the tramway couldnt connect up,rather then use the 54 bus route,between the two.
The railway companies really were just playing a large scale game of _Ticket to Ride_ in the late Victorian period.
The trams are lovely. I’ve never been on one though.
We recently had a holiday in Blackpool and theirs are fantastic!
I have a favourite; it is St Andrew Square, Edinburgh.
A bit messed up at the moment, as the new bit to Newhaven is getting finished.
There is a very large stick in St Andrew Square, with a statue of a bloke on top of it, who isn't St Andrew - he, being a Saint, would probably not need a stick to stand on, and certainly pigeons would not poo on him.
And here I was thinking that I was a tram nerd because I have a favourite tram route in Melbourne.....the No. 96 to the South Melbourne Market and St Kilda Beach ua-cam.com/video/qXlPg2CoH08/v-deo.html
but having a single favourite tram stop .... that is "nerdiness" on another level!😜
Loving your content 😀
I'm very bored at work, so I asked chatgpt to write a review of a wc in your style... I don't think you'll be out of work any time soon, enjoy:
"What's up, fam? JagoHazzard here, and today I'm going to be reviewing a true masterpiece of human engineering - the one and only portapotty. If you're like me and you enjoy the finer things in life, you'll know that nothing beats the sweet aroma of a plastic box filled with human waste. So, without further ado, let's dive into this thing.
First off, let's talk about the aesthetics. I mean, what's not to love? It's a small, cramped space with a door that barely closes. It's like a tiny sauna, but instead of relaxation, you get the joy of taking a dump. And the smell? Oh man, it's like a combination of raw sewage and stale Doritos. Delicious.
Now, let's get down to business. Functionality-wise, this portapotty is a real gem. It's got a nice little seat that'll give you a cramp in your butt cheeks after a few minutes, and there's just enough space to do your business without feeling like you're in a coffin. Plus, the toilet paper dispenser is a nice touch. It's like they knew you'd need to wipe after dropping a bomb in there.
And finally, the smell. Let me tell you, this thing is like a breath of fresh air. If you're into that whole 'wading through a sea of sewage' vibe, this is the place for you. Just make sure you don't pass out from the fumes before you're finished.
So that's it for today's video, guys. You're my trusty toilet paper to this week's pile of poo, as we explored the wonderful world of portapotties. Thanks for sticking around, and if you ever find yourself in need of a quick pit stop, just remember the good ol' plastic box. Until next time, you're my loyal viewers to this week's content. Peace out!"
"and sometimes they built lines just because they could"
...Glances guiltily at my Transport Fever 2 layout running in the background that looks like a glimpse into the eye of chaos...
"Train companies build lines to compete each others" You have awakened my PTSD from dealing with Transport Tycoon AI rivals.
norwood The Wood North of Croydon . Which makes the South North Wood a bit of a compass nightmare
The name Woodside is one of several references, along with Norwood and Forest Hill, to the ancient Great North Wood which once covered the whole area. The only surviving parts the wood are, ironically, saved by present of former railway lines: a small area close to Honor Oak Park and Sydenham Hill Woods along the former trackbed of part of the old Crystal Palace High Level line.
So, "the wood north of the valley of crocuses"? Sounds lovely.
Interesting covering Norwood and Woodside as John Rodger's afternoon sunday walk vid released at 5pm covered The London Loop Crystal Palace to Streatham showing some of the areas of the North Wood still believed to be extant.
Is that folk getting off at Addiscombe in the Evening , or Morning. We need an historical Geoff to do least used Beeching Cut station in London
Nerdiness is good. 🤓👍
I like the London Assay Office and everything associated with silversmithing so I totally get it. 👍
Jago, do you just know all this stuff because you're such a nerd, or do you have to look it up and learn it all in advance?
Two questions:
1) you mentioned offloading horses. Were the railways routinely used to to transport equines?
2) You also mentioned that Woodside had a shop. Was this a forerunner of the semi-malls we get today in major stations like Kings Cross and Victoria?
Excellent video as always.
I was obsessed with HS1 ventilation shafts and head-houses. How about that for nerdyness?
They'll be even better after the ULEZ expansion !!
Ventilation is hard to model and caused the late stage month-long delay in opening New York’s most recently completed mega project, at Grand Central. They built doors as a quick fix. But being a v.s. nerd, you knew that. Also v.s.’s caused some siting issues for new tunnels in Baltimore, Maryland. It’s worth looking at just for the original plan of new tunnels weaving under each other to reach more convenient platforms at the station. Yet all that was simplified to fewer tunnels. Oldest railway in the U.S. was in Balto.
If you do more of these tram videos (which I really hope you do!) in your outro you should call them Tales from the Trams 😂
I hadn't realised that the branch still had a service right up until the tram takeover works started. I always thought it had lain disused for some years (or even decades) before conversion.
Great channel. 👍🏻
The station looks derelict at this point. Surely it could be reused for a shop or a restaurant.
wonderful work Jago.. I also worked on the building of Tramlink for the Construction JV!!
Looking forward to your collab with G Marshall, “All the Tram Stops”
(All of them)
0:08......answer......very. thats why we love your videos 😎
Cracking video sir, now do a video on the becontree estate railway!
7.46632 % nerdy
I just can’t help but look at the station and envision a duplex….
As a relief booking clerk, I spent at week at Addiscombe in 1984 (it was still SED before sectorisation moved us to Areas). Every morning I went up to Woodside to collect the excess fares the Railman had taken (Woodside was staffed at the time), had a Greek coffee and travelled back to Addiscombe. Days were spent with drivers popping in for a cup of tea before taking the, "Pop-pop" back to Elmers End and the Railman who was also a part time cabaret singer specialising in Lionel Richie covers - this was at the time of Richie's famous hit, "Hello" etc. Happy Days😂.
When it was a Railway Station it got no passengers and now it’s a tram stop and has nearly Half a Million! Time to expand the Tram Network
My favourite stop is the one that gets you the heck out of Croydon!
Incidentally there's also a station in New Zealand that's named Woodside. It's on the Wairarapa Line and served by Masterton to Wellington passenger trains, and prior to the late 1950s it was also the junction for a short branch to Greytown. As for how it got the name Woodside, I don't know.
I am in awe of your knowledge and how you make these videos os very interesting. Well done.
On West Midlands Metro I like Bilston because it's pretty obvious it had a past as a railway station.
Another great video, Jago..I really must try the trams, the next time I visit the UK...
From Corydon to Elmer's End,gluing the system together! The place names in South London are fascinating,please keep up on the old Southern[LB&SC,LSWR,SECR,LCDR lines]as they seemingly went hither,thither,and yon! Thank you,Jago,for another foray into London history 🙏 🙌 👏! Thank you 😇!
That must be where my neighbour Cory comes from!
What has become of the station building? Is see everything is boarded up, but it's a perfect place for either a venue or maybe even a small house. I mean, how cool would it be to have a door straight onto the platform? 🤣🤣🤣
Who was Elmer ?
I’m actually looking into this question.
@@JagoHazzard Probably related to Haydon.
More former disused lines, please
Woodside looks like Clock House station which is further up the line.
This entire line would have been a branch of the Fleet line had it been built.
There used to be peak trains in the 1990s from Charing Cross to Addiscombe, calling at Waterloo East then non stop to Catford Bridge, New Beckenham, Elmers End, Woodside and Addiscombe
Thank you Dr Beeching
Why does your future video have an abandoned track bed? I didn't even know that videos could possess such attributes. (You're not the only nerd here you know!)
See Geoff Marshall Visiting the closed stations/ lines of London
@@highpath4776 You missed my grammatical point.
@@thomasm1964 Ah yes, the book of English Possessives written by a man with a wooden leg called Tom
@@highpath4776 Yup!
I look forward to more tram stories. I'm less familiar with that part of Greater London, although I have travelled between East Croydon and Wimbledon.
I went to Beavers in a scout hut off Birdhurst Rise besides the closed Addiscombe Branch in the mid 80's. I was convinced that trains still went by when I was there but they can't have. I guess the passage of 37 years has played tricks with my memory.
Please make the proposed Addiscombe episode! I'm loving all the history and images of the area where I grew up. 😊
Very interesting Jago, thank you
I hope they save the building
An orange Line to Sanderstead via Woodside and the Hayes Branch to the ELL would seem to have some usefulness. Many of the large villas in Sanderstead are being demolished for 2 bedroom flats
High path:
How are you now? I hope you are in a better place now.
About as nerdy as I am, when I win the lottery, I'll buy myself a Black Five....or a couple, or handful....you know, I've always liked those GWR Castle and Kings classes, then again, those Royal Scots....🤨🤔
Right, that's the kettle....I need a cuppa! 😉😆😂