the BULLS were a non factor in the 80s. but jordan was ABSOLUTELY a factor.... all time great teams celtics and pistons still spent an innordinant amount of energy stopping a non factor
Bird actually terribly injured his back in 1986. It was a devastating injury. In 87 when the Celts were trying to repeat by the time they got through multiple long eastern conference series rounds including getting physically hammered by the Pistons over 7 games in the championship round, Bird was absolutely toast between his back plus McHale had a fractured foot, and the Chief, Robert Parrish had one or two badly sprained ankles and yet they still had a legit change of closing out the Lakers in that Finals if Bird would have just taken his time on a last 2 second buzzer beater. He made that same shot multiple times in the past with just one second on the clock. Long way of saying to you that by that final season, he was maybe 30% of prime LB 3X consecutive MVP version. Cheers.
I started watching the nba in 1965. Bird is my favorite player of all time. But Jordan is the best Ive ever seen. Jordan and Bird have high respect for each other to this day.
They both played the game in their own unique styles at the highest level. I always thought of mj as a cross of Dominique Wilkins and Clyde Drexler. Bird is Bird. He did everything. He only played 13 seasons because he sacrificed his body in every single game he played in. Not enough can be said about Bird and intangibles. He is the one to jump on a grenade to help
Larry was transformational....as a rookie. Took essentially the SAME team that won 29 games....and had a 61 game winning season. From the MOMENT Larry stepped on the court, the Celtics were a playoff team. Larry MADE the team better....and they continued to get better....or washed out. Larry never settled for less than 100 % effort ...100% desire to win...100% commitment. He led by example. MJ got better himself....but his play was all about self. 63 points....in a loss...is all that needs to be said. And check out Parrish when he talks about leadership ability between Larry and MJ. Parrish played WITH MJ at the end of his career, and saw firsthand the difference. And THAT is why Larry is the GOAT. Larry is the COMPLETE teamplayer...with almost no holes in his game. And if you question Larry's leadership...he was ALSO coach of the year. And Executive of the year. 😉
Larry, bird in with Magic Johnson, dead, coming into the NBA in making an immediate impact, is so uncommon, kudos to them Different styles of leadership but everything has to come together centered around its core. This doesn’t apply to Larry or Mike as they both climbed to the top, but just a general comment im making as I think. I seen players that people say are amazing leaders never win a chip or got damn thing and other players leadership skills be deemed less favorable win it all
Bird was also having back issues towards the end of his career. Having back issues myself, I know how how painful a bad back can be for anyone. Bird was a TOUGH SOB to play through back pain. If bird would have been healthy in his later years he’d have played many more seasons and put a hurting on league.
So we give Bird credit for what he couldve done had he not been hurt but we dont give credit to what Jordan couldve done had he not retired twice? Double standard.
Just a shot out: I like your channel, your style, the way you carry yourself. There was a moment in this vid that's kinda the epitome of you: you pressed pause, apologized, then dropped some casual truth bombs that changed my pov on something I'd been carrying around for decades ( Larry and MJ not being light years away in difference ). Anyway, it's easy to take you and your consistent quality for granted without stopping to say thank you every once in awhile. Thank you. Appreciate you, my dude. 🤙
GREAT reaction my friend....I miss old school NBA when it was blood & guts on the floor but total respect off the floor . There were no " ring chasers " .....they were loyal to their city and loyal to their team & fans . Plus there were rivalries also which made for great bragging rights .
Jordan wasn't as good as Larry because he felt that he needed to make more points than anyone else. Larry figured out how to make his team win without making all of the points even though he could make them. All he cared about was for his team to w
I tried hard not to be bias because i'm a 80's Celtics and a Larry Bird fan. Mike was way ahead of everyone in the league when it comes to athletic ability. Mike was a phenomenal player. He deserved all the accolades he got. He came into the league in 84, took him 7 years to to win the finals. Bird won his second year. Bird also turned a team with a 32 win turn around from the previous year. That was Birds growing pains. I am not diminishing Michael playing ability anyone who does is being disingenuous. Just giving some facts.
How can MJ be the best if he couldn’t beat the best ? And if Bird is a better shooter ( and not to confuse with scorer ) a better passer and a better rebounder , how is Jordan the better player ? …. Sorry , Bird over MJ !
I'm a huge Bird fan, but I only see him in a 3-way tie for first. The other two are Pete Maravich and Bill Russell. If you haven't seen them play, type their names in the search bar and watch. And learn.
Jordan came into the league in 1984. He got beat like a drum for 6 years. While Larry elevated a 29 win team to a 61 win team his first year. Michael is great, but 6 years to "mature" is ridiculous. He wasn't good enough to beat the elite 80s teams. Those guys had to get old and change before he started winning. He dominated a weak 90s era.
I think they're the two best to ever play the game. I grew up watching Larry and the Celtics beat Los Angeles. When Larry retired, Michael made basketball fun to watch like Larry did. When Michael retired, that was the end of the era. The game wouldn't be the same without either one of them.
Having gone over to 90 games thing most realizes is the physicality and the rules were changes, The teams were stacked with best physical and inside game. There were so many injuries and the was backlash by the viewers
I love them both. My untouchable basketball holy Trinity: MJ,Bird, Magic These 3 and any 4 or 5 and i got all the rings, all the MVPs,all of it... That includes playing against LeBron, Durant,Kobe, Steph.
Larry Bird was definitely 1 of the players that adjusted to the NBA really quick in comparison to any other player I've ever seen. Most guys come into the league and they need that time to adjust ...to mature. Before they come into their own so to speak.....but Larry Bird didn't need that. He is a rare Bird indeed! Lol. As great of a player that MJ was.... It took him years before he found it. But that does seem to be the norm for most players.
#LB33 ❤🐦 was awesome, my favorite ❤ for life,he passed the torch to the right guy after he retired, I will say that, mj couldn't beat bird 🐦,but mj did learn ,,it took a team ,(huge compliment from me ) 80's and 90's bball NO JOKE ‼️
Maybe you could do a video about the what ifs list in detail? Grant Hill, Derek Rose, Larry Bird, Penny hardaway (the second greatest pure pg ive ever seen, better on d than magic), tracy mcgrady, bill walton, who else?...?
Individually MJ but in a draft I always take Bird. Bird was a winner from his rookie year and played with a lot of different players and turned them into winners too. Even in college Bird was the only player on the team to play in the NBA. Michigan State had three players go on to the NBA and two others went on to play in Europe. Bird came in with his bb iq and continued to show it as a coach and executive.
I swear we had a huge influx of Great players in the 80's! By the time we got to the 90s.... who was left for MJ to compete with besides Thomas?! Someone that wasn't on the last leg of their career....
I think it just took MJ longer to realize that you had to have a whole team that actually played! He was a little too much like the problem they had in the 70s which is ...I'm gonna go out for mine! For whatever reason it didn't translate that... Just because you can make points ....it doesn't mean you're going to win!
I'm a drag racer at heart, my favorite cars to see run are the sleepers. The stock looking, the rattling POS that might fall apart, yet just tears up the dragstrip. Jordan is the top shelf showed out money is no object race car, Bird was always the sleeper. Jordan was the flashy showy player Bird showed up, did exact what he needed to do to win nothing showy flashy or even fast, he just did what it took even to his own detriment. Also Bird was a true team player, Not saying Jordan hogged the ball, but Bird was an intricate part of an already solid and reliable team he elevated them, they elevated him and together they dominated. While Jordan, while what the bulls needed, would have been good just about anywhere alone. Yes Bird would have been great anywhere, I do not think we'd be having this conversation if Bird was ever with any other team. I can't imagine another team with solid talent, but needed him, not one single one, that match was possibly the most perfect fit ever seen in the NBA
Something nobody talks about is that in Jordan’s 63 point game, his primary defensive assignment(s) for the game took 11 uncontested shots. He also took 41 shots while the rest of the team took 61 shots combined. By contrast, Bird took 27 shots, and the rest of the Celtics took 76. Most will say that it’s because that was because nobody on the Bulls could score except Jordan, but one shot 75% that game, while another shot 57%, and another shot 60%. It’s hard to score without the ball, though.
Isiah is giving the definition of a hot take when he said Jordan was a non-factor. If that statement was from anyone else, it might be a bit different because where did the "Jordan rules" come from...? The Detroit Pistons. It was how the dealt with Jordan. So that tells you that he was one the biggest factors they planned for. Bird broke his back in the offseason in '85, not '88 or '89. This happened right after Jordan entered the NBA. He re-injured it in the '89 or '90 season yet still put up those amazing games against Jordan's Bulls.
How Larry and Magic came in and were instantly successful is uncommon and should be looked at as a compliment and nod to them as opposed to a slight against Mike
It's an easy thing to fall into! Bird always gets knocked for not being naturally athletic and supposedly .. slow all the time! So I expect to hear from other people about how it took MJ longer.... he didn't have the same basketball IQ or court vision for that matter. People are going to compare...🤷. Lol
Buy it or leave it but Mike didnt have it figured out like Larry did coming in. What Larry and Magic did instantly is incredible and I don’t think we’ll ever see it again
When MJ came into the league, graced with superior athleticism, he immediately started putting up great individual numbers. For the team, not so much. It took him what, 4, 5. 6 years to learn how to boost his team into consistent winners. Bird, OTOH, had an immediate impact, from game 1, on his team's ability to win games despite his relative lack of athleticism. He came to the league as a complete player.
@@BU_TV actually, even though Bill Russell was before my time I’m picking him first and praying the other guy picks anybody but Bird. Then if he does pick somebody else not only do I pick Bird second I let the other guy pick the rest of my team and feeling 100 about my chances of winning a series. However, if I’m honest the best I can do for MJ for GOAT is a tie with Larry Joe. The unasked question is what’s the debate if Larry doesn’t shatter his finger before playing his first NBA game, had feet that weren’t both busted and didn’t need a back brace to stand upright? Bird was frighteningly and intimidatingly great. Add health and 40 years of advances in sports science to that legit 6’ 10” frame not to mention the nature of the contemporary game plus a 20 year career and what does that look like? All that being said my favourite Celtic was the Chief! Robert Parish flooring Bill Laimbeer with one swat of his open palm? Gold! I’d love to see a Parish highlight and interview reaction video.
Larry Bird is my all time favorite! He was the reason I started watching NBA! NBA today is full of sissies! And why I say that is, does any of these guys today play hurt like Bird and the players of that era did! One player that comes to mind in today's times he gets bumped and he's flopping on the floor and boo hooing! Also back then when a dude got on a team he stayed on that team until the end, no chasing rings and bouncing from team to team!
I typed all that before they got to all I Said footage lol. I stopped it at the “Non factor” comment then got lost in my typing because I’m not working this am and it played through on my iPad yesterday well last night BUT I didn’t get to watch it. Got wild and I forgot my iPad takes forever to turn off on its on especially if I have a “playlist” rolling
He was indeed a none factor. 80s was stacked. The old dudes were on the decline that's why Jordan started winning. Plus the league made rules that would favor Jordan. He got swept lol. G.O.A.T is Bill Russell 11 out of 13 rings. 9 as a player and 2 as a player - coach
Before my time, but I suspect Russell is the correct choice for #1 pick. One on one I pray the other guy picks anybody but Bird and I’ll take him second with Russel to start my team. But if it’s an open draft and I get #1 pick it’s Larry Joe. I can’t risk Bird being on another team.
what Larry did much better was he played a team sport, MJ lacked in that , as that is WHY the 80's was as it was .... 1 on 1, he could out physical many guys, but BB is a TEAM sport. Larry made everyone on his team shine brighter and MJ did not and Scottie, his main man will tell you he NEVER got the credit he deserved assisting MJ .... Go back and ask ANYONE who played with Bird if they felt that way and they will all tell you what i just told you.
The things with Scottie is Mike himself always credited Scottie at every corner for his contributions and helping take the franchise to unforeseen heights. Scottie is a bit of a sour baby because the general public didnt see it that way.Unfortunately people and media often downplay other players contributions to the superstar leaders. Lebrons first and second options on his super teams never get their credit, but i rarely see Lebron speak up for their sacrifices.
@@BU_TV I don’t recall Pippen being underrated or called out until the years without MJ when he didn’t win. Even so I thought the Chip winning Bulls were great because the team was great.
Jordan is the best athlete-skill player ever. While Bird has the best BBall-IQ and able to make the rest of his team an extension of his game plus incredible skills. Thomas is right, he was a non-factor. You might not agree, but it is the truth, the other stars were the factors. MJ took 6-7 eeasons to win, while Bird took 2 seasons and first season took same team from 29-53 to 61-21 wining Rookie of the year. With all the stars in the 80s Bird became a factor right away MJ was an incredible athlete, won the DNA lottery and he was able utilize these gifts to the max plus having a no quit mentality paired with hard work ethic. I.e. MJ has hands so big that he is able to grab the ball off the dribble with one hand, but not so big that become cumbersome like Shaqs. I remember everybody was in awe with MJs play, that even the refs changed the rules to favor him. Traveling violations were not called on him, offensive fouls were called defensive fouls when benefited MJ and viceversa. That’s why you have so many people hating on MJ and many adoring him. But one thing is for sure. Everybody agrees that MJ had skills and athleticism way beyond everybody else. If you “UA-cam” traveling violations by MJ, you will find more than one video and none of Birds nor Magic. Guaranteed Birds IQ and play was focused in being the best with what you have, but also utilize the rest of the player as an extension of his persona, almost like an extra limbs. Here is we’re MJ and Bird differ the most. While MJ was able to overcome any D on his own, Bird did it by being a puppeteer when using teammates. While both players had equal and above all work ethic, Bird has something that nobody in history has (other than his IQ), he was willing to sacrifice his body every single play, he played with a broken back l, he played with a cracked skull and many other injuries, Bird had zero quit on him. He gave it all, after every game he had to be put in a body brace to maintain the stability of his back, had to be massaged for hours before every game, he couldn’t sit on the bench and still went out there and put an all star performance. After his final contract, he had a clause that the contract was going to renew automatically with an insane increase, but he wasn’t take any money if couldn’t give it all, so he retired. The Celtics collapsed right after. I remember there were proposals like play only home games, crazy eh?. But Bird had too much pride. So retirement was the only way. For me these characteristics make a true GOAT, but people that can’t see beyond rings and skills will always pick MJ before Bird. Not me, not me.
Larry and Magic came into and dominated. Jordan needed 5 or 6 yrs and a completely different team. So what Tomas said is mostly true. Jordan didn't win any championships in the 80s. I'm not saying he wasn't a threat because he was. Bird and Magic dominated in and right out of college.
Your explanation just convinced me that Jordan was out of his league and only started becoming successful when Bird, Johnson, Irvin etc….were no longer in play.
I think If Mike also had a few more quality players early on to compete with the legendary teams back them it would have helped. Those Bulls rosters were dumster fires mostly lmao. Dude was trying to cut through steaks with butter knives
Jud Buechler! Arizona Wildcat when I went there. He was one of the bench “Gumby’s” that came in when Steve Kerr (Steeeeve Kerrrrrr!!) and Sean Elliot were blowing out the opposition.
@@cellohood Yea! And Michael and Scottie would give it to John Paxton for 3'sss and if Toni Kucoc was feelin it they just let him finish out the game's scoring. We could go on and on but they had so many guys knocking down three's in the 4th quarter!✋
@@sickotwist9802 I only rooted for the Bulls when Steve Kerr was playing for them. I was shocked out of NBA fandom not long after Len Bias died and got in to college ball. I’d root for the Spurs when Elliot was playing. I did get back into fandom when Steve became coach of the Warriors and I’ve been fascinated by that dynasty for many reasons not least of which is Curry who is exciting to watch off the ball and affects the total game of both teams in a way similar to Bird.
Btw. This video is very good except it perpetuates the “Larry Bird KICKED the ball over Jordan’s head” nonsense. Curry Kirkpatrick (Sports Illustrated columnist) was a witness to the exchange & he says Larry THREW the ball over Jordan’s head. Larry has a quarterback arm. I defy ANYONE to say they ever saw a bball player, let alone Larry Bird, KICK a basketball!!! Absurd! He THREW it.
Mj when asked who his top 5 players of all time , always starts with Larry bird , and when they protest , says Larry bird was the best small forward by far.....
When you talk about basketball IQ consider that Larry Bird was Rookie of the Year, League MVP (x3), NBA Coach of the Year, and NBA Executive of the Year.
I grew up wanting to be Larry Bird or Magic Johnson then it went to wanting to be Michael Jordan. I can say Jordan will always be my goat but i love all 3 of these guys. They have that Killer instinct that doesn't exist hardly anymore.
Michael Jordan was not better than Bird. He never faced the same degree of talent that Bird faced. He never won 3 MVP's in a row. The first year Bird joined the Celtics the Celtics won 31 more games even though the team did not yet have Mchale or Parish yet on the team but the first year Jordan was on the Bulls the Bulls won only 11 more games even though the Celtics the previous year had won only 2 more games than the Bulls. Even when Scottie Pippen was on the Bulls and Bird's back by then was basically broken Jordan still couldn't stop Bird from scoring even when Pippen helped him double-team him. It also took Jordan a longer time to mature and develop as a player.
Jordan should have had way more MVPs then he even obtained. He got robbed from getting 3 in a row. History is what it is though. Jordan before maturing and fully developing was still God level, and thats scary. Bird was a good defender, and a few years he was great, but he was no where the defensive monster Mike was either.
@@BU_TV Nope, one man shows aren't MVP material, its complete game, assists, rebounds, not just points, passing skills, I loved MJ playing, but Bird was the GOAT
@@dcmfox Your GOAT is your GOAT. Larry is worthy no doubt. Jordans rebounding was great at his position, his passing was well enough. Im not debating that, all im saying is….saying this man is a non factor is wild. In fact any player thats top 10 of all time requires game planning for and factoring in, especially the guy you creating rules for😂
Non factor is not saying he is not a good player or talent....but he did not effect the champions in the eightys....non factor means he did not effect things at the top.
I’m born and raised in Chicago. A diehard Bulls with MJ fan. But when it comes to who’s the Goat? First and foremost remains the fact that MJ was swept twice by Larry. Second and most convincing is Larry’s passing abilities. See that video to give it up for MJ in favor of the Hick from French Lick.
Jordan was.....after Larry retired. And it was his drive and the lessons he learned from Larry that took him to his greatness. Larry was the best throughout the years that he played. I shudder to think about the player Larry would have been had his body stayed strong.
Lol. No. Mj absolutely torched the Celtics playing 1 on 5. But you CANT WIN playing 1 on 5. Especially against 86 boston. He played boston 2x in the playoffs. It was the 3 yrs of Detroit that toughened up the bulls mentally, and you could see the bulls getting better and better each yr. MJ getting to the top was inevitable. What separates MJ is once on top, he stayed there. And no Detroit was NOT old so don't even go there
But he never cut a path through Birds Celtics, the Pistons benefited from the Celtics getting older first and Chicago went through Detroit to get to the finals
@shawn benton every team changes personnel with time but they had the nucleus of their team that finally won a title in time to face Birds Celtics, Jordan Pippin, Horace Grant, Bill Cartwright, hodges and Paxson
Yes, Michael Jordan IS the GOAT. But Larry is certainly up there. I always say my top 2 all time picks are Jordan #1 and Bird #2. (Magic would be my #3 pick fyi). It's important to remember as well that Bird played the MAJORITY of his career with a bad back. He initially injured it in '85 and played 7 years with a bad back.
"Mike was a non factor" "Those years were his growing pains, he was getting better" So...he was a non factor in the 80's. Mike's time was after all of the 80's stars were gone or declining. It's not to take away from Mike, it's just being real.
Larry Bird won rookie of the year. Took the Celtics from 21 wins to 61 win his rookie year with no help. Help came his second year. Plus he was on the all- star team. His rookie year. Bird won a championship his second year. It took Jordan 8 years to win a championship. I get tired of excuses. Just saying
If somebody would say Larry better than Jordan,I honestly can’t debate that,I say Jordan was & still is the most talented player ever seen lace them up.
Jordan is only in the running for GOAT for his '90s era. Please note that the 90s era is when all of the other players started retiring from the 80s era. If you were to somehow magically take all of these players and put them into the league at the same age in their prime? Jordan is going to get blown the fuck out every game.
Mickel Jordan was a great player, but Larry Bird was the greatest player to ever step on a basketball court. He made people great, Jordan made himself great! The two can't be compared
yah Bird was better passer and shooter, Mike was far better defensively and as an overall scorer, but Mike was a more aggressive scorer to be fair. I expect Bird to have the rebounds given height and position
the BULLS were a non factor in the 80s. but jordan was ABSOLUTELY a factor.... all time great teams celtics and pistons still spent an innordinant amount of energy stopping a non factor
Larry was wearing a back brace for part of his final season. There's a game out there where he drops 48 on Portland wearing a brace. Crazy!
I saw parts of it recently unreal
Bird actually terribly injured his back in 1986. It was a devastating injury. In 87 when the Celts were trying to repeat by the time they got through multiple long eastern conference series rounds including getting physically hammered by the Pistons over 7 games in the championship round, Bird was absolutely toast between his back plus McHale had a fractured foot, and the Chief, Robert Parrish had one or two badly sprained ankles and yet they still had a legit change of closing out the Lakers in that Finals if Bird would have just taken his time on a last 2 second buzzer beater. He made that same shot multiple times in the past with just one second on the clock. Long way of saying to you that by that final season, he was maybe 30% of prime LB 3X consecutive MVP version. Cheers.
The best channel.
WHO ME? Thanks!!!
@@BU_TV Of course. Your QI for analysis is unparalleled to none!
I started watching the nba in 1965. Bird is my favorite player of all time. But Jordan is the best Ive ever seen. Jordan and Bird have high respect for each other to this day.
He never beat Larry when it matters though 😮💨 and he had a banged up body to make it worse. Imagine if he was healthy and fit him & Isaiah Thomas
@@jarinxcii263 Jordan still trying to top GOAT Larry. Larry next level nooo question.
Are you aware Jordan NEVER beat bird...?
I would say I agree with a statement that I saw before.. which was MJ was the greatest in the air. Bird was the greatest on the ground!
Which is why he became a great coach and executive!!!!!!! His mental!!!!!
You make no sense.
Dude coaching demeanor was like his play
Yes Non-Factor!
I agree bu
They both played the game in their own unique styles at the highest level. I always thought of mj as a cross of Dominique Wilkins and Clyde Drexler. Bird is Bird. He did everything. He only played 13 seasons because he sacrificed his body in every single game he played in. Not enough can be said about Bird and intangibles. He is the one to jump on a grenade to help
Because he straightedged and finished his mom's concrete driveway instead of hireing out.
17 seasons including the playoff games
Larry was transformational....as a rookie. Took essentially the SAME team that won 29 games....and had a 61 game winning season. From the MOMENT Larry stepped on the court, the Celtics were a playoff team.
Larry MADE the team better....and they continued to get better....or washed out. Larry never settled for less than 100 % effort ...100% desire to win...100% commitment. He led by example.
MJ got better himself....but his play was all about self. 63 points....in a loss...is all that needs to be said.
And check out Parrish when he talks about leadership ability between Larry and MJ. Parrish played WITH MJ at the end of his career, and saw firsthand the difference.
And THAT is why Larry is the GOAT. Larry is the COMPLETE teamplayer...with almost no holes in his game.
And if you question Larry's leadership...he was ALSO coach of the year. And Executive of the year. 😉
We are on the same page 👍
Larry, bird in with Magic Johnson, dead, coming into the NBA in making an immediate impact, is so uncommon, kudos to them
Different styles of leadership but everything has to come together centered around its core. This doesn’t apply to Larry or Mike as they both climbed to the top, but just a general comment im making as I think. I seen players that people say are amazing leaders never win a chip or got damn thing and other players leadership skills be deemed less favorable win it all
Bird was also having back issues towards the end of his career. Having back issues myself, I know how how painful a bad back can be for anyone. Bird was a TOUGH SOB to play through back pain. If bird would have been healthy in his later years he’d have played many more seasons and put a hurting on league.
I have had some back pain and problems, extremely mild,m to what Larry was dealing with, and that shit had me cringing with my little back ailments
So we give Bird credit for what he couldve done had he not been hurt but we dont give credit to what Jordan couldve done had he not retired twice? Double standard.
@@joshm6854 i always do lol
ua-cam.com/video/yxZVxYXvPyQ/v-deo.html
Just a shot out: I like your channel, your style, the way you carry yourself. There was a moment in this vid that's kinda the epitome of you: you pressed pause, apologized, then dropped some casual truth bombs that changed my pov on something I'd been carrying around for decades ( Larry and MJ not being light years away in difference ). Anyway, it's easy to take you and your consistent quality for granted without stopping to say thank you every once in awhile. Thank you. Appreciate you, my dude. 🤙
What he said!
The Chief rules!!! Most underrated Center ever!
My favourite player! I need a Robert Parish highlight (and interview!) reaction video!
GREAT reaction my friend....I miss old school NBA when it was blood & guts on the floor but total respect off the floor . There were no " ring chasers " .....they were loyal to their city and loyal to their team & fans . Plus there were rivalries also which made for great bragging rights .
Jordan wasn't as good as Larry because he felt that he needed to make more points than anyone else. Larry figured out how to make his team win without making all of the points even though he could make them. All he cared about was for his team to w
Mike wanted to win more than anything, just going about it hehe
Larry Larry Larry!!! The real GOAT!
4:06 best way I’ve heard it explained is that Jordan is the greatest but Bird is the best.
I tried hard not to be bias because i'm a 80's Celtics and a Larry Bird fan.
Mike was way ahead of everyone in the league when it comes to athletic ability. Mike was a phenomenal player. He deserved all the accolades he got. He came into the league in 84, took him 7 years to to win the finals. Bird won his second year. Bird also turned a team with a 32 win turn around from the previous year. That was Birds growing pains. I am not diminishing Michael playing ability anyone who does is being disingenuous. Just giving some facts.
Magic and Bird saved basketball from extinction.
Absolutely. Mj, magic and mf BIRD
How can MJ be the
best if he couldn’t
beat the best ? And
if Bird is a better
shooter ( and not to
confuse with scorer )
a better passer and
a better rebounder ,
how is Jordan the
better player ? ….
Sorry , Bird over MJ !
You did a great job on this video great commentary!
Appreciate you! Ty
I'm a huge Bird fan, but I only see him in a 3-way tie for first. The other two are Pete Maravich and Bill Russell. If you haven't seen them play, type their names in the search bar and watch. And learn.
One point: Jordan scored so much not only because he was a great shooter, but because he took so many shots! Bird was more of an all-around player.
Apply pressure! Weapon 23
Jordan came into the league in 1984. He got beat like a drum for 6 years. While Larry elevated a 29 win team to a 61 win team his first year. Michael is great, but 6 years to "mature" is ridiculous. He wasn't good enough to beat the elite 80s teams. Those guys had to get old and change before he started winning. He dominated a weak 90s era.
You think the 90s were weak in general or weaker? Even in his years of growing pains he was already elite.
@@BU_TV Not as strong as the 80s.
Just wish the NBA was like this
I think they're the two best to ever play the game. I grew up watching Larry and the Celtics beat Los Angeles. When Larry retired, Michael made basketball fun to watch like Larry did. When Michael retired, that was the end of the era. The game wouldn't be the same without either one of them.
Having gone over to 90 games thing most realizes is the physicality and the rules were changes, The teams were stacked with best physical and inside game. There were so many injuries and the was backlash by the viewers
Len Bias with Larry Joe would’ve been a huge problem for all opposition. Still remember the heartbreak.
RIP!
Good video
Glad you enjoyed! Thank you!
I love them both.
My untouchable basketball holy Trinity:
MJ,Bird, Magic
These 3 and any 4 or 5 and i got all the rings, all the MVPs,all of it...
That includes playing against LeBron, Durant,Kobe, Steph.
Bird is the word
Lmaaaao
"He still had his craft" exactly right. Many things were taken from Bird but not his craft.
Cant take it!
Larry Bird was definitely 1 of the players that adjusted to the NBA really quick in comparison to any other player I've ever seen. Most guys come into the league and they need that time to adjust ...to mature. Before they come into their own so to speak.....but Larry Bird didn't need that. He is a rare Bird indeed! Lol. As great of a player that MJ was.... It took him years before he found it. But that does seem to be the norm for most players.
Really enjoy your commentary
I second that! Very enjoyable and erudite!
Tysm fam
I need you to keep dropping these unique and clever words on me! Erudite!
#LB33 ❤🐦 was awesome, my favorite ❤ for life,he passed the torch to the right guy after he retired, I will say that, mj couldn't beat bird 🐦,but mj did learn ,,it took a team ,(huge compliment from me ) 80's and 90's bball NO JOKE ‼️
😂 respect
Maybe you could do a video about the what ifs list in detail?
Grant Hill, Derek Rose, Larry Bird, Penny hardaway (the second greatest pure pg ive ever seen, better on d than magic), tracy mcgrady, bill walton, who else?...?
Individually MJ but in a draft I always take Bird. Bird was a winner from his rookie year and played with a lot of different players and turned them into winners too.
Even in college Bird was the only player on the team to play in the NBA. Michigan State had three players go on to the NBA and two others went on to play in Europe.
Bird came in with his bb iq and continued to show it as a coach and executive.
An all-around class act that succeeded in different positions
Bird was a stone Cold killer as a rookie, Everybody else took a few years to develop
Agree it was largely unprecedented with what him and magic did
I love them both. 🐦 is my favorite. But mj is the man
Wish they had more overlapping time
I swear we had a huge influx of Great players in the 80's! By the time we got to the 90s.... who was left for MJ to compete with besides Thomas?! Someone that wasn't on the last leg of their career....
Got to give his props he was a demon
Bird Was Playing 3D Chess In His Rookie Season.
I forget who said it but I I do agree with it....MJ was the goat in the air and Bird was the goat on the ground!
I think it just took MJ longer to realize that you had to have a whole team that actually played! He was a little too much like the problem they had in the 70s which is ...I'm gonna go out for mine! For whatever reason it didn't translate that... Just because you can make points ....it doesn't mean you're going to win!
23:45 look at that scratch on birds neck .
He was warrior
Oh yeah and I agree on He was NOT A NON FACTOR!!!!
BWAHAHAHAHAAAA
Double negative!
I'm a drag racer at heart, my favorite cars to see run are the sleepers. The stock looking, the rattling POS that might fall apart, yet just tears up the dragstrip. Jordan is the top shelf showed out money is no object race car, Bird was always the sleeper. Jordan was the flashy showy player Bird showed up, did exact what he needed to do to win nothing showy flashy or even fast, he just did what it took even to his own detriment. Also Bird was a true team player, Not saying Jordan hogged the ball, but Bird was an intricate part of an already solid and reliable team he elevated them, they elevated him and together they dominated. While Jordan, while what the bulls needed, would have been good just about anywhere alone. Yes Bird would have been great anywhere, I do not think we'd be having this conversation if Bird was ever with any other team. I can't imagine another team with solid talent, but needed him, not one single one, that match was possibly the most perfect fit ever seen in the NBA
once you get to the top 5-10 of NBA of all time, I dont think you can really pick one as the best ever IMO
I think you're right. My favorite is 3 people: Bird, Russell, & Maravich.
Something nobody talks about is that in Jordan’s 63 point game, his primary defensive assignment(s) for the game took 11 uncontested shots. He also took 41 shots while the rest of the team took 61 shots combined. By contrast, Bird took 27 shots, and the rest of the Celtics took 76. Most will say that it’s because that was because nobody on the Bulls could score except Jordan, but one shot 75% that game, while another shot 57%, and another shot 60%. It’s hard to score without the ball, though.
Isiah is giving the definition of a hot take when he said Jordan was a non-factor. If that statement was from anyone else, it might be a bit different because where did the "Jordan rules" come from...? The Detroit Pistons. It was how the dealt with Jordan. So that tells you that he was one the biggest factors they planned for.
Bird broke his back in the offseason in '85, not '88 or '89. This happened right after Jordan entered the NBA. He re-injured it in the '89 or '90 season yet still put up those amazing games against Jordan's Bulls.
Exactly! I couldnt agree more tbh
Michael didn't shine until the elite talent were on their way out.
The building of the Barcelona dream team that’s a good video to watch. It’s about an hour or so
Okay, but how come it took him so long to develop the IQ etc when Bird & Magic didn't have the same growing pains?
How Larry and Magic came in and were instantly successful is uncommon and should be looked at as a compliment and nod to them as opposed to a slight against Mike
It's an easy thing to fall into! Bird always gets knocked for not being naturally athletic and supposedly .. slow all the time! So I expect to hear from other people about how it took MJ longer.... he didn't have the same basketball IQ or court vision for that matter. People are going to compare...🤷. Lol
Byrd stepped into the league as a rookie playing chess….
Yep. I not buying the story it took 7 years for Jordan's to raise his basketball "IQ". LOL.
True
Buy it or leave it but Mike didnt have it figured out like Larry did coming in. What Larry and Magic did instantly is incredible and I don’t think we’ll ever see it again
When MJ came into the league, graced with superior athleticism, he immediately started putting up great individual numbers. For the team, not so much. It took him what, 4, 5. 6 years to learn how to boost his team into consistent winners. Bird, OTOH, had an immediate impact, from game 1, on his team's ability to win games despite his relative lack of athleticism. He came to the league as a complete player.
Bird and MJ are tied at #1, but I’d pick Bird first for my team.
Because of his playmaking?
@@BU_TV actually, even though Bill Russell was before my time I’m picking him first and praying the other guy picks anybody but Bird. Then if he does pick somebody else not only do I pick Bird second I let the other guy pick the rest of my team and feeling 100 about my chances of winning a series. However, if I’m honest the best I can do for MJ for GOAT is a tie with Larry Joe. The unasked question is what’s the debate if Larry doesn’t shatter his finger before playing his first NBA game, had feet that weren’t both busted and didn’t need a back brace to stand upright? Bird was frighteningly and intimidatingly great. Add health and 40 years of advances in sports science to that legit 6’ 10” frame not to mention the nature of the contemporary game plus a 20 year career and what does that look like? All that being said my favourite Celtic was the Chief! Robert Parish flooring Bill Laimbeer with one swat of his open palm? Gold! I’d love to see a Parish highlight and interview reaction video.
Larry Bird is my all time favorite! He was the reason I started watching NBA! NBA today is full of sissies! And why I say that is, does any of these guys today play hurt like Bird and the players of that era did! One player that comes to mind in today's times he gets bumped and he's flopping on the floor and boo hooing! Also back then when a dude got on a team he stayed on that team until the end, no chasing rings and bouncing from team to team!
I think I know who you talking bout!🤭
I think GOAT Trophy is shared, no clear winner, Like T. Brady. OMO
I typed all that before they got to all I Said footage lol. I stopped it at the “Non factor” comment then got lost in my typing because I’m not working this am and it played through on my iPad yesterday well last night BUT I didn’t get to watch it. Got wild and I forgot my iPad takes forever to turn off on its on especially if I have a “playlist” rolling
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
He was indeed a none factor. 80s was stacked. The old dudes were on the decline that's why Jordan started winning. Plus the league made rules that would favor Jordan. He got swept lol. G.O.A.T is Bill Russell 11 out of 13 rings. 9 as a player and 2 as a player - coach
Before my time, but I suspect Russell is the correct choice for #1 pick. One on one I pray the other guy picks anybody but Bird and I’ll take him second with Russel to start my team. But if it’s an open draft and I get #1 pick it’s Larry Joe. I can’t risk Bird being on another team.
what Larry did much better was he played a team sport, MJ lacked in that , as that is WHY the 80's was as it was .... 1 on 1, he could out physical many guys, but BB is a TEAM sport. Larry made everyone on his team shine brighter and MJ did not and Scottie, his main man will tell you he NEVER got the credit he deserved assisting MJ .... Go back and ask ANYONE who played with Bird if they felt that way and they will all tell you what i just told you.
The things with Scottie is Mike himself always credited Scottie at every corner for his contributions and helping take the franchise to unforeseen heights. Scottie is a bit of a sour baby because the general public didnt see it that way.Unfortunately people and media often downplay other players contributions to the superstar leaders. Lebrons first and second options on his super teams never get their credit, but i rarely see Lebron speak up for their sacrifices.
@@BU_TV I don’t recall Pippen being underrated or called out until the years without MJ when he didn’t win. Even so I thought the Chip winning Bulls were great because the team was great.
Jordan is the best athlete-skill player ever. While Bird has the best BBall-IQ and able to make the rest of his team an extension of his game plus incredible skills.
Thomas is right, he was a non-factor. You might not agree, but it is the truth, the other stars were the factors. MJ took 6-7 eeasons to win, while Bird took 2 seasons and first season took same team from 29-53 to 61-21 wining Rookie of the year. With all the stars in the 80s Bird became a factor right away
MJ was an incredible athlete, won the DNA lottery and he was able utilize these gifts to the max plus having a no quit mentality paired with hard work ethic. I.e. MJ has hands so big that he is able to grab the ball off the dribble with one hand, but not so big that become cumbersome like Shaqs. I remember everybody was in awe with MJs play, that even the refs changed the rules to favor him. Traveling violations were not called on him, offensive fouls were called defensive fouls when benefited MJ and viceversa. That’s why you have so many people hating on MJ and many adoring him. But one thing is for sure. Everybody agrees that MJ had skills and athleticism way beyond everybody else. If you “UA-cam” traveling violations by MJ, you will find more than one video and none of Birds nor Magic. Guaranteed
Birds IQ and play was focused in being the best with what you have, but also utilize the rest of the player as an extension of his persona, almost like an extra limbs. Here is we’re MJ and Bird differ the most. While MJ was able to overcome any D on his own, Bird did it by being a puppeteer when using teammates. While both players had equal and above all work ethic, Bird has something that nobody in history has (other than his IQ), he was willing to sacrifice his body every single play, he played with a broken back l, he played with a cracked skull and many other injuries, Bird had zero quit on him. He gave it all, after every game he had to be put in a body brace to maintain the stability of his back, had to be massaged for hours before every game, he couldn’t sit on the bench and still went out there and put an all star performance. After his final contract, he had a clause that the contract was going to renew automatically with an insane increase, but he wasn’t take any money if couldn’t give it all, so he retired. The Celtics collapsed right after. I remember there were proposals like play only home games, crazy eh?. But Bird had too much pride. So retirement was the only way.
For me these characteristics make a true GOAT, but people that can’t see beyond rings and skills will always pick MJ before Bird. Not me, not me.
Larry and Magic came into and dominated. Jordan needed 5 or 6 yrs and a completely different team. So what Tomas said is mostly true. Jordan didn't win any championships in the 80s. I'm not saying he wasn't a threat because he was.
Bird and Magic dominated in and right out of college.
Your explanation just convinced me that Jordan was out of his league and only started becoming successful when Bird, Johnson, Irvin etc….were no longer in play.
I think If Mike also had a few more quality players early on to compete with the legendary teams back them it would have helped. Those Bulls rosters were dumster fires mostly lmao. Dude was trying to cut through steaks with butter knives
If jordan had his championship team in the celtic playoff games, he might have a couple more rings. I respect 23. But love 33.
Michael did not have to have the ball at end of game. He'd ride a hot hand! Scottie,Steve,Tony Jud,whomever.
You musta watch AU games, cuz the MJ *I* saw was a diva gloryhound ball hog who absolutely had to have the ball.
We have seen Michael on plenty of occasions defer at the end of games
Jud Buechler! Arizona Wildcat when I went there. He was one of the bench “Gumby’s” that came in when Steve Kerr (Steeeeve Kerrrrrr!!) and Sean Elliot were blowing out the opposition.
@@cellohood Yea! And Michael and Scottie would give it to John Paxton for 3'sss and if Toni Kucoc was feelin it they just let him finish out the game's scoring. We could go on and on but they had so many guys knocking down three's in the 4th quarter!✋
@@sickotwist9802 I only rooted for the Bulls when Steve Kerr was playing for them. I was shocked out of NBA fandom not long after Len Bias died and got in to college ball. I’d root for the Spurs when Elliot was playing. I did get back into fandom when Steve became coach of the Warriors and I’ve been fascinated by that dynasty for many reasons not least of which is Curry who is exciting to watch off the ball and affects the total game of both teams in a way similar to Bird.
Btw. This video is very good except it perpetuates the “Larry Bird KICKED the ball over Jordan’s head” nonsense. Curry Kirkpatrick (Sports Illustrated columnist) was a witness to the exchange & he says Larry THREW the ball over Jordan’s head. Larry has a quarterback arm. I defy ANYONE to say they ever saw a bball player, let alone Larry Bird, KICK a basketball!!! Absurd! He THREW it.
Aaaaah thanks for that! Now I have seen some players kick the ball during a game😂 I remember T-Mac kicked the ball twice in a row and got ejected😂
@@BU_TV
Man was WEAK!
Mj when asked who his top 5 players of all time , always starts with Larry bird , and when they protest , says Larry bird was the best small forward by far.....
Facts
When you talk about basketball IQ consider that Larry Bird was Rookie of the Year, League MVP (x3), NBA Coach of the Year, and NBA Executive of the Year.
Scary player
!! BIRD 🦅 is the GOAT 🐐!!
Cross breeding!😂
I grew up wanting to be Larry Bird or Magic Johnson then it went to wanting to be Michael Jordan. I can say Jordan will always be my goat but i love all 3 of these guys. They have that Killer instinct that doesn't exist hardly anymore.
MJ has nothing to feel bad about. He tried and put up amazing numbers 👏
I agree with what you are saying about MJ and growth but Magic won a championship his first year and Bird his second
Michael Jordan was not better than Bird. He never faced the same degree of talent that Bird faced. He never won 3 MVP's in a row. The first year Bird joined the Celtics the Celtics won 31 more games even though the team did not yet have Mchale or Parish yet on the team but the first year Jordan was on the Bulls the Bulls won only 11 more games even though the Celtics the previous year had won only 2 more games than the Bulls. Even when Scottie Pippen was on the Bulls and Bird's back by then was basically broken Jordan still couldn't stop Bird from scoring even when Pippen helped him double-team him. It also took Jordan a longer time to mature and develop as a player.
Jordan should have had way more MVPs then he even obtained. He got robbed from getting 3 in a row. History is what it is though. Jordan before maturing and fully developing was still God level, and thats scary. Bird was a good defender, and a few years he was great, but he was no where the defensive monster Mike was either.
@@BU_TV Nope, one man shows aren't MVP material, its complete game, assists, rebounds, not just points, passing skills, I loved MJ playing, but Bird was the GOAT
@@dcmfox Your GOAT is your GOAT. Larry is worthy no doubt. Jordans rebounding was great at his position, his passing was well enough. Im not debating that, all im saying is….saying this man is a non factor is wild. In fact any player thats top 10 of all time requires game planning for and factoring in, especially the guy you creating rules for😂
Non factor is not saying he is not a good player or talent....but he did not effect the champions in the eightys....non factor means he did not effect things at the top.
I’m born and raised in Chicago. A diehard Bulls with MJ fan. But when it comes to who’s the Goat? First and foremost remains the fact that MJ was swept twice by Larry. Second and most convincing is Larry’s passing abilities. See that video to give it up for MJ in favor of the Hick from French Lick.
Larry made other players look stupid!
Jordan was.....after Larry retired. And it was his drive and the lessons he learned from Larry that took him to his greatness. Larry was the best throughout the years that he played. I shudder to think about the player Larry would have been had his body stayed strong.
Lol. No. Mj absolutely torched the Celtics playing 1 on 5. But you CANT WIN playing 1 on 5. Especially against 86 boston. He played boston 2x in the playoffs. It was the 3 yrs of Detroit that toughened up the bulls mentally, and you could see the bulls getting better and better each yr. MJ getting to the top was inevitable. What separates MJ is once on top, he stayed there. And no Detroit was NOT old so don't even go there
But he never cut a path through Birds Celtics, the Pistons benefited from the Celtics getting older first and Chicago went through Detroit to get to the finals
@@jaycockrell7470 who did Jordan have on his team? Bird was playing with 4 other hof...are y'all really having this conversation.
@shawn benton every team changes personnel with time but they had the nucleus of their team that finally won a title in time to face Birds Celtics, Jordan Pippin, Horace Grant, Bill Cartwright, hodges and Paxson
Just seeing these old-school Ballers high lights. A real pleasure to see. Thanks, KFB.
Larry and |Magic were dominating from day 1. MJ only dominated when they retired.
check larry bird alpha male rookie year
Appreciate the recommendation. I’ll add it to the list.
Yes, Michael Jordan IS the GOAT. But Larry is certainly up there. I always say my top 2 all time picks are Jordan #1 and Bird #2. (Magic would be my #3 pick fyi). It's important to remember as well that Bird played the MAJORITY of his career with a bad back. He initially injured it in '85 and played 7 years with a bad back.
All facts! I got Larry 3
Bird was the G.O.A.T of the NBA
"Mike was a non factor"
"Those years were his growing pains, he was getting better"
So...he was a non factor in the 80's. Mike's time was after all of the 80's stars were gone or declining. It's not to take away from Mike, it's just being real.
Agreed...MJ is the GOAT but Bird was also great...In the top 5 of all time
It was sad to see Bird resting and lying on the sidelines while his back was being rehabbed. You just knew it was a matter of time.
Horace Grant “guarding” Bird in double overtime. That is adorable! Phil Jackson’s “genius” on display.
Lmfaaaaaaaao😭😭😂
Jordan and the Bulls were a non factor in the 80's and didn't win championships until all of the best players were on their way out.
Bird came into league w/ that. MJ had to develop it
My top five are 1. Bird 2. Kareem 3. MJ and after that I don't know... Magic or Lebron?
Larry Bird won rookie of the year. Took the Celtics from 21 wins to 61 win his rookie year with no help. Help came his second year. Plus he was on the all- star team. His rookie year. Bird won a championship his second year. It took Jordan 8 years to win a championship. I get tired of excuses. Just saying
Jordan can be the GOAT can die. But a true Legend never does. So with that being said. I would take Larry Jo Legend Bird.
If somebody would say Larry better than Jordan,I honestly can’t debate that,I say Jordan was & still is the most talented player ever seen lace them up.
Michael is the best basketball player ever, but Larry is the best all-around player ever !
i see what ya did there!
The Bulls were a none factor. MJ has never been a none factor. You are 100% correct.
Jordan is only in the running for GOAT for his '90s era. Please note that the 90s era is when all of the other players started retiring from the 80s era. If you were to somehow magically take all of these players and put them into the league at the same age in their prime? Jordan is going to get blown the fuck out every game.
Correction, Jordan and the Bulls did not arrive until Larry Bird retired! MJ was the happiest guy in the NBA when Bird finally called it a career.
That is incorrect! Jordan won his first 2 titles with Bird still in the league. He just wasn't able to reach the CF.
Mickel Jordan was a great player, but Larry Bird was the greatest player to ever step on a basketball court. He made people great, Jordan made himself great! The two can't be compared
You can’t be the Goat & get swept 🧹 by another Goat. MJ was more athletic slasher but Bird better passer, shooter, rebounder.
yah Bird was better passer and shooter, Mike was far better defensively and as an overall scorer, but Mike was a more aggressive scorer to be fair. I expect Bird to have the rebounds given height and position
I don't care what color bird was he could play
He is green forever