One important thing for people to remember is what your BCD is capable of holding. Check your manual. Some BCD's for example aren't rated to hold a tank greater than 95cf. So you go and buy a 117cf and it's too heavy, it damages your BCD over time. Also your BCD won't provide you enough buoyancy if the tank is too large. You can't just chuck any tank or double tanks on any BCD.
Jay, just saw this in reality, a diver with a 35 lb lift wing with Steel Single Tank Adapter, Steel Back Plate a nd diving a HP 120.... and No Drysuit folks...5mm wet
Mike, using a steel 100 is so nice; less lead in the BCD, weight is more centralized on your center of mass and same basic size as an AL80. And like you said, that 20% more air can't hurt having it there, just in case.
@@Will-ol9lp I always follow the rule of 1/3 but I encounter too many cruise ship divers that don't pay attention to their remaining air, it is like they depend on the dive master to tell them when it is time.
Here in Australia the majority of tanks people use are steel, it's rare to see aluminium tanks being used. As for diving all the time with nitrox, well that becomes very expensive here where I dive in Melbourne, $28 per fill as opposed to $8 for air. Most people dive on air. Don't get me wrong nitrox is great but you have to be a lot more careful with watching your depth than you do with air. I do however like your system in the states where you only hydro your tanks every five years, here it has to be every year. Great video, keep them coming.
Thanks Ketsu about the reality of diving with Nitrox in your part of the world. When I was stationed in La Maddelena, Sardinia back in 1981-83 most everyone owned steel tanks and Nitrox was not really available. Thanks for watching our videos and your comments are appreciated !
I had a Steel 63. It was made by XS Scuba. It failed Hydro last year. I was so bummed. That was my favorite tank for beach dives because it was so compact. And apparently no one makes a 63 steel anymore. 80 is the smallest now.
Thank You Bob! 😊 very informative! With this info. I'm up to date with tanks. Glad you've made this very clear understanding video about tanks now a days. 😃
I have two comments. Number one is there are 63 ft.³ aluminum cylinders that are often used by smaller people because they typically use less air any given dive. Number two is I highly recommend that you don’t touch uncoded lead weights. Lead is really dangerous to touch. I only use coated lead weights and I don’t have to worry about actually touching the lead. Final thought, and that is most dive shops that rent equipment to students and to certified divers use aluminum cylinders. They’re almost a third less in cost and that adds up when you have 50 cylinders available for everyone to rent.
Thanks GweedMan for your comment/question. First, Yes there are Alum 63cft tanks available. Take a look at this recent vid I uploaded ua-cam.com/video/5K_ySvCrt28/v-deo.html . When it comes to lead, just touching it is not dangerous, if it is cut or sanded causing dust or particles and breathed in, that's not good. Also smelting it the resulting fumes are very very bad if ingested. Hmmm, I beg to differ with you on your saying "1/3 the cost"... Steel painted 100's are about 30% more than the 80 Alum. tanks. But you are correct even that makes a big difference when it comes to 50 tanks. I might add that a 100 cft tank, on "some" divers, can cause one to cross into Deco if using air. Thanks so much for taking time to send a comment. Regards Bob C
Hello. I realize this is an Old Video. I am currently enrolled in Padi OW Class. We used "80" Aluminum Tanks. Would've liked to have been able to use the Steel. As I am 5'4" tall. Aluminum tank stuck out too far. Several inches past my butt. Today was my Day 2 of the Pool Training. We finished about 2 hours early. And was given Free Swim time. I used mine all the way down to 500. It became too buoyant even with 10 Pounds Lead in the BCD. Once I get Certified, I may look into the Steel tank option due to my Height.
Hey Chris, Thanks for the note even if the video has been up a while. Congrats on getting your Scuba pool skills done... And yes the majority of shopes/rentals use Alum 80's. They are kinda an industry standard, like a speed limit in a way. If you are somewhat vertically challenged, the Alum 80 can be a pain in the butt or neck/head literary depending on how high or low you've got it mounted. Yes sir, there is a bit of a weight change in them as you breath them down. To your issue. I would suggest you consider getting a steel compact 80, it's about the same height as an Alum 63. Plus it has better characteristics for buoyancy trim. Think I'll do a short video on this. Thanks Bob C
Not sure why nobody has commented. Great video and comparison of different tanks. Thank you very much. I need more bottom time and less weight in my BCD. I don't anticipate using a steel tank in salt water. Most travel destinations use the aluminum 80's. How much extra care do you have to give steel tanks over aluminum?
It's an interesting question Sean, sorry for the delayed response. Ensuring you rinse both Steel or Alum is paramount to both their maintenance. I've seen many Aluminum tanks come in for filling that are in far worse shape on the outside, than Steel that have an equal number of saltwater dives. Ensuring neither tank is breathed down to zero psi and stored is critical for the condition of the inside of any tank. Quality of the filling station air is also high on the list too. Overall benefits of diving Steel far out-weigh the slight cost difference, especially the extra "Bottom Time" you'll get from a 100 or 117 for example.
Hi, i enjoyed your explanation of steel vs aluminium SCUBA tanks. I like the steel 80 for spine issues, if not the 100 steel absolutely. Store location ? Well Done 👍
Thanks Mark, Must agree if I'm diving for fun and everyone is on 80's then I like the compact size of the Steel 80. In reality I normally use a HP71 mostly and if with students of any kind then steel 100, with them I like having 20% more in case I need to spend extra time with one that is having issues.
Thanks David... and when the majority of tanks are filled they heat up, when they cool there is a loss of rated pressure and add to that when we dive the mass majority of diving is done in water cooler than nominal air temps resulting in a further drop in tank temp reducing rated pressure further ... or approximately 20% more air ... in MOST cases. And yes if cave fills or under fills or aluminum vs steel true capacities are applied ....then both our comments mean little to nothing Thanks again for your comments
Well, an 80 holds 20% less air than a 100. One thing to remember is that often you won’t be able to completely fill a steel tank to 3400 because some dive boats will only fill them to 3000. Even at 3000 the 100 will still have 87 cf of air.
That’s good to her. Then they really should have there C card taken away. It’s like the dive master says sets the dive in feet. Doesn’t mean that everybody can dive that depth as you know. I used to live in and dive in cold waters and now I live in Fl and watching people not pay attention to what they are doing on the dive and then step in and explain why we do this in our spot. Have a safe dive and keep on diving
I was just watching your video on high vs low pressure tanks. You did tell the viewers that a Din regular can take more pressure then a Yolk regulators can. Because the person who buys a high pressure tank can do some damage to there Yolk configuration regulators because of that higher pressure tank you should share that with the viewers
I can't disagree with you Will. The mass majority of regs today can pretty much handle these higher rated tank pressures. Problems can vary due to status of a regulator's maintenance history and accuracy of service by a given tech. Additional issues can be caused by over zealous pressurization and doubling of burst discs on various tanks for what's known as "cave fills". Lots of horror stories and fairy tales out there too.
In my 50 years of diving and for example the past 15 or so I always use Yoke regs and own tanks with Pro or convertible valves. Many divers buy into the "only DIN" for me attitude and that's ok too. Many of these videos could be an hour or two long but best to keep them some what shorter and therefore it's difficult to say everything. Thanks for your thoughts
@@kanthanok Because CF tanks won't last nearly as long. Tanks get beat up in transit and during dives overall. If just a single CF wrap is compromised, the entire tank is trashed. They also only have a 15 year lifespan where as steel and aluminium are good until they fail. I have a 50cf aluminium for teaching in the pool. It was made in 1978. I do the visuals (certified to do them) every year, hydro every 4 years and about 9 months. Never had any problems with it. And as Ronin said, there isn't a whole lot of point in a lighter tank if you're just going to have to weigh yourself down even more with lead due to the buoyancy attributes of a CF tank.
At around 1:35 you mention negative 4.2 lbs. This same term is brought up several times and I’m trying to wrap my head around it. Tanks weigh ‘x’ when empty Tanks weigh x + compressed air. But never below x?
There are some steel tanks that are Neg buoyant when full and + buoyant when empty.....and some that are Neg buoyant full and still Neg Buoyant but less so, when empty. You just need to check their specs to know which is what.
I'm confussed. Why did he say to use nitrous if using the 100c.f. tank? Why does the size of the tank have to do with whether or not you use nitrox or not?
Let me put it this way. On air ( _rounded numbers_ ) 79%N2 and 21%O2 the NDL or No Decompression limit (also known as No Stop Time) at 60' is roughly 52-55 mins, depending on the dive tables, Algorithm and conservativism you're using. *"Most"* divers, and again I'm saying "most" divers can't quite stay there that long on a 80cft tank. Average is around 40-45 mins. That keeps them just a few minutes away from NDL... good. Now take a 100cft tank, *APROX* . 20% more gas *we will call it,* and if the 80cft norm is, we will call it 45 mins for safety sake, then the 100 would give them APROX 9 mins more bottom time, *OR APROX* . 55 mins which rubs up against that AIR NDL of 52-55. If you use the most popular mix of *NITROX* , not Nitrous (BIG DIFFERENCE) the 60' NDl on 32% (68%n2 & 32%O2) is 90 mins.... a much safer way of diving even if you dive a 80, 100, 117, 120 or 133cft tank. Yes, depth has a lot to do with this, but I use the 60' number as that's the *suggested* max depth of an Open Water diver. Now, *you may be* one of those people that push the limits of everything, and that's on you, because there's only one butt connected to the tank you're wearing, and it's the one that will be sitting in that recompression chamber. That's why I always say, *"DIVE SAFE OUT THERE".*
Thanks Always great to have practical experienced advise. Im new open water trained and fresh with lots to learn. Assuming one should have a buddie , i would need to purchace 2 tanks as not to be limited to the partners (usual) volume supply? Also how durable are they? What quallity of paint are they protected with? And can the normal dive boat compressor handle the extra pressure? Would i be always debating with the boat hand to pump extra into the tank?
Thanks Geoff for your comments, you know even if your buds dive 80's I'd still get a Steel 100 for general recreational diving. Having 20% more air never hurts and it costs the same to fill. Now your boat compressor comment can have some validity. Many boat compressors are smaller units and must work pretty hard to get to that 3500psi mark. Many boat owners with these compressors will have LP95 steel tanks that are 2400psi and save the strain on their compressors of dealing with that extra 1k+psi Most of the Blue Steel tanks like Faber can be had in Galvanized editions... in general the painted ones are fairly durable.
Steel tanks are built tough that's why they're pricey and don't dent easily. Aluminum tanks are cheap, heavy, and dent easily because the aluminum is a soft metal.
Yup down here in Fl we have lots of caves and some visitors try that crap and some dive shops will fill there tanks and do an injustice to our sport that way. I was trained by old diver and drilled Day one that you are responsible for your life and your buddy’s life as well when you dive so that the time and do it right. Besides being a professional PADI 5 star he’s also a commercial diver as well and we where truly blessed to have him teach us one on one
I dive steel 100's and want to begin carrying a separate alternate air source in a sidemount configuration. would you suggest I stick with steel, say an 80 or even smaller. or is an aluminum 80 ok
Ranger, thanks for the question but a few questions for you first. One- Are you Nitrox certified? Two- Are you formally trained in Deco Procedures? Three- Why do you want to carry an Alt. in this method??? Last- What type of diving are you involved in to use this rig??? My reply to your question will vary depending on your answers. Sadly in Scuba terminology is king. An example is in your question {"alternate" air source vs "redundant" air source).
@@DiversSupplyYT thank you for taking the time to answer my question in such a detailed manner. I am AOW nitrox certified. to clarify my intent is for the extra cylinder to be used as a redundant air source. I was looking at side mount configuration due to comfort of carrying a large cylinder. on a side note I am looking to begin Tec diving so if I can have similar setups all more the better. lastly, deco is not an issue as I do not dive deeper than 50' at my local lake and this cylinder is meant strictly for redundancy and not as a spare or to extend my bottom time. I'd like to stick with steel because it's what I know but aluminum is obviously more cost friendly.
Wow ok, so as AOW and Nitrox diving on 100's likely you maybe doing some spearfishing I'll guess. - If that's the case then the term redundant is correct. Tank and reg set on it. Many folks spearfishing don't hang right together so a Solo diver approach is needed. - If you're an artifact diver same issue. Personally the redundant air source can't be faulted in these cases. If the above doesn't apply then a 19cft- or even 30cft tank will easily get you to the surface. Slinging an 80cft tank is a "chunk" to drag around as an emergency air source. With 32ean at 60' your normal NDL is 90min... you're not going to hit that on a 100cft back gas. Please make sure you're getting properly trained for what you're under taking. Don't be a gear junkie and BIGGER is not always better or wiser. Call me here at the Jax store if you'd like to discuss.... Bob C
@@DiversSupplyYT I'm actually laughing to myself right now as to how spot on you were with your assessment of my activities based on the information i provided. talk about hitting the nail on the head! these are the exact reasons I am looking to add a redundant air supply for safety. I didn't lead with that because alot of people get weird when you mention solo diving or being away from your buddy. that being said, what would you recommend?
@@Ranger_k16 It makes a difference when real experience is applied to advice given... 49 yrs of diving reality accounts for something... if done correctly. So to answer your "what do I recommend". Again a question or two for you will guide my answer. Diving 100's and I take that as a single 100 as back gas. Also nitrox use as well. If you're diving 32ean and using 1.4 as your tox limit then your spending your time in the 80-110' range. If you're using 1.6 then likely you're in the 100-120' range. Let's use the 90-110 average... you could comfortably use a 19cft pony/bailout depending your verbiage. It could get you to the surface from that range without you having to risk DS due to an excessive ascent rate. Using a Bailout/Pony is considered an emergency, so no safety stop is involved. Before betting my life on this combo, I'd suggest some practice ascents from say 60', 80' and then 100' (not back to back of course) and check the 19's pressure at the end of each. Solo diving is no more risky than regular NDL buddy diving. If you're trained and properly equipped.
@@DiversSupplyYT thanks so much! Somehow I missed that you said that the first time watching the video, but saw that you actually mentioned the second time. Thanks again!
and these days ... do not buy a used 20 year old or older Aluminum tank ! some Dive shops are now refusing to service or air fill them and I am told that the entire state of Florida will not service or air fill them anymore .
@@DiversSupplyYT My 3 tanks were made in 1979 and I use them a lot and keep the Hydro and Visual up to date .... well this year I walked into a local dive shop with two of them and the owner nearly POOPED his pants as if I was pointing a gun at his head !!! He goes on to tell me that its too dangerous to service or air fill them because the might EXPLODE !!! He said to toss them in the garbage ... So I took them to another shop and they gladly took my money and did visuals eddie's hydros and air fills ..
@@diverdave4056 Some shops will do fills if they did the Hydro work. I know the Jacksonville store does in house Hydros/VIPs and will then fill the tanks. Lots of places say no, even if the Hydro/ VIP is current and of course that's their choice.
People saying this video is great...WTF? 1: The sound quality is awful. Okay, that's not technical but if you want to make a video, get good sound. 2: In a video titled "basic" and explaining the simplest things, he jumps from "This tank is 31 lbs" to "This tank is -4.2" without ANY mention of how that happened. 3: He jumps topics from amount of air, to valve type, to using Nitrox, to size, to weight -- Focus! 4: He says a 100 cubic foot cylinder will give you 20% more air than an 80. It's 25%. No big deal but you're the expert. Just get it right. It's the right concepts to be focused on but the presentation is horrible.
Gary thanks for your comments. Now am I a subject matter expert on video product and tank manufacturing, well that is subjective, just look at your comments, among all the others. Can I except criticism, you bet, I’m reading yours, as well as the others I receive. I strive, since I began diving in 1970 (still have my original dive card) , enjoying photography at 9 and 3 years ago being involved in video production not to believe I know it all, because I don’t. My grandfather told me, “the person that thinks they know it all, has got a lot to learn”. As I say in many of my videos, I accept ALL comments positive or negative, so thanks for yours.
@@DiversSupplyYT That's a wonderful attitude. I try to remember to be that open to criticism and fail more than I succeed, so GOOD ON YOU!! >>> I'm sure you are an absolutely great diver and a wonderful human being. Even in the video it comes through how honest and kind you are. >>> It's very hard to be both good at something and good at explaining something. They are not at all the same thing. >>> I think you have the manner, knowledge, and care to be an excellent instructor. As I said, just try more to pick a focus and to keep in mind what level audience any particular video is going for. >>> If you ever want help looking at a script or reviewing a video before posting, I'd be happy and honored to help!
One important thing for people to remember is what your BCD is capable of holding. Check your manual. Some BCD's for example aren't rated to hold a tank greater than 95cf. So you go and buy a 117cf and it's too heavy, it damages your BCD over time. Also your BCD won't provide you enough buoyancy if the tank is too large. You can't just chuck any tank or double tanks on any BCD.
Jay, just saw this in reality, a diver with a 35 lb lift wing with Steel Single Tank Adapter, Steel Back Plate a nd diving a HP 120.... and No Drysuit folks...5mm wet
Thank you, great information. Appreciated it. Safe diving
Thanks Luiz Carlos for your comments !
Great discussion on tanks, I like the idea of the smaller tank weight but love the idea of the 100 cf tank and the extra safety margin of air.
Thanks Mike. Having all these benefits the 100cft steel brings to diving shows you why it is the top selling steel tank.
One should always fellow the rule of 1/3 s so one doesn’t have to rely on a bigger tank for safety. That tells me a lot about people’s diving habits.
, sorry to say but most divers only look at one thing, pressure gauge and don't pay attention to 1/3 rule.
Mike, using a steel 100 is so nice; less lead in the BCD, weight is more centralized on your center of mass and same basic size as an AL80.
And like you said, that 20% more air can't hurt having it there, just in case.
@@Will-ol9lp I always follow the rule of 1/3 but I encounter too many cruise ship divers that don't pay attention to their remaining air, it is like they depend on the dive master to tell them when it is time.
Here in Australia the majority of tanks people use are steel, it's rare to see aluminium tanks being used. As for diving all the time with nitrox, well that becomes very expensive here where I dive in Melbourne, $28 per fill as opposed to $8 for air. Most people dive on air. Don't get me wrong nitrox is great but you have to be a lot more careful with watching your depth than you do with air. I do however like your system in the states where you only hydro your tanks every five years, here it has to be every year. Great video, keep them coming.
Thanks Ketsu about the reality of diving with Nitrox in your part of the world. When I was stationed in La Maddelena, Sardinia back in 1981-83 most everyone owned steel tanks and Nitrox was not really available.
Thanks for watching our videos and your comments are appreciated !
Nitrox isn’t available in the USVI
In salt water, that's the best way to go in regards to inspection intervals. A lot can happen in 5 years to a scuba cylinder.
I had a Steel 63. It was made by XS Scuba. It failed Hydro last year. I was so bummed. That was my favorite tank for beach dives because it was so compact. And apparently no one makes a 63 steel anymore. 80 is the smallest now.
Yes sir, That was a great tank...
@@DiversSupplyYT anyone know why they stopped making it ?
Fantastic Video, thank you for your time editing and producing this video!
Thank you Grayson for commenting, I do appreciate it !
Thank You Bob! 😊 very informative! With this info. I'm up to date with tanks. Glad you've made this very clear understanding video about tanks now a days. 😃
Thanks for you comments Lukas,. Regards Bob C
Thanks for this video! You always explain thing on a way that I understand and answer all my questions! Thanks.
You are so welcome Ulises. I do my best not to try and sell but just talk to viewers like they are my friends ! Thanks for the note. Bob C
I have two comments. Number one is there are 63 ft.³ aluminum cylinders that are often used by smaller people because they typically use less air any given dive. Number two is I highly recommend that you don’t touch uncoded lead weights. Lead is really dangerous to touch. I only use coated lead weights and I don’t have to worry about actually touching the lead. Final thought, and that is most dive shops that rent equipment to students and to certified divers use aluminum cylinders. They’re almost a third less in cost and that adds up when you have 50 cylinders available for everyone to rent.
Thanks GweedMan for your comment/question. First, Yes there are Alum 63cft tanks available. Take a look at this recent vid I uploaded ua-cam.com/video/5K_ySvCrt28/v-deo.html .
When it comes to lead, just touching it is not dangerous, if it is cut or sanded causing dust or particles and breathed in, that's not good. Also smelting it the resulting fumes are very very bad if ingested.
Hmmm, I beg to differ with you on your saying "1/3 the cost"... Steel painted 100's are about 30% more than the 80 Alum. tanks. But you are correct even that makes a big difference when it comes to 50 tanks.
I might add that a 100 cft tank, on "some" divers, can cause one to cross into Deco if using air.
Thanks so much for taking time to send a comment. Regards Bob C
Hello. I realize this is an Old Video. I am currently enrolled in Padi OW Class. We used "80" Aluminum Tanks. Would've liked to have been able to use the Steel. As I am 5'4" tall. Aluminum tank stuck out too far. Several inches past my butt. Today was my Day 2 of the Pool Training. We finished about 2 hours early. And was given Free Swim time. I used mine all the way down to 500. It became too buoyant even with 10 Pounds Lead in the BCD. Once I get Certified, I may look into the Steel tank option due to my Height.
Hey Chris, Thanks for the note even if the video has been up a while.
Congrats on getting your Scuba pool skills done... And yes the majority of shopes/rentals use Alum 80's. They are kinda an industry standard, like a speed limit in a way.
If you are somewhat vertically challenged, the Alum 80 can be a pain in the butt or neck/head literary depending on how high or low you've got it mounted.
Yes sir, there is a bit of a weight change in them as you breath them down.
To your issue.
I would suggest you consider getting a steel compact 80, it's about the same height as an Alum 63. Plus it has better characteristics for buoyancy trim. Think I'll do a short video on this. Thanks Bob C
@@DiversSupplyYT Thank you Bob
Not sure why nobody has commented. Great video and comparison of different tanks. Thank you very much. I need more bottom time and less weight in my BCD. I don't anticipate using a steel tank in salt water. Most travel destinations use the aluminum 80's. How much extra care do you have to give steel tanks over aluminum?
It's an interesting question Sean, sorry for the delayed response. Ensuring you rinse both Steel or Alum is paramount to both their maintenance. I've seen many Aluminum tanks come in for filling that are in far worse shape on the outside, than Steel that have an equal number of saltwater dives.
Ensuring neither tank is breathed down to zero psi and stored is critical for the condition of the inside of any tank. Quality of the filling station air is also high on the list too.
Overall benefits of diving Steel far out-weigh the slight cost difference, especially the extra "Bottom Time" you'll get from a 100 or 117 for example.
Hi, i enjoyed your explanation of steel vs aluminium SCUBA tanks. I like the steel 80 for spine issues, if not the 100 steel absolutely. Store location ? Well Done 👍
Thanks Mark, Must agree if I'm diving for fun and everyone is on 80's then I like the compact size of the Steel 80.
In reality I normally use a HP71 mostly and if with students of any kind then steel 100, with them I like having 20% more in case I need to spend extra time with one that is having issues.
Not to get too technical on you, but 100 gives you 25% more air than 80. 100 - 80 = 20. 20/80 = 0.25.
Thanks David... and when the majority of tanks are filled they heat up, when they cool there is a loss of rated pressure and add to that when we dive the mass majority of diving is done in water cooler than nominal air temps resulting in a further drop in tank temp reducing rated pressure further ... or approximately 20% more air ... in MOST cases.
And yes if cave fills or under fills or aluminum vs steel true capacities are applied ....then both our comments mean little to nothing
Thanks again for your comments
Well, an 80 holds 20% less air than a 100. One thing to remember is that often you won’t be able to completely fill a steel tank to 3400 because some dive boats will only fill them to 3000. Even at 3000 the 100 will still have 87 cf of air.
No, an 80 holds 25% less air than a 100. 20 is 1/4 of 80. 80+20 is 100. But an aluminum 80 is really 77 cf, anyhow. :)
That’s good to her. Then they really should have there C card taken away. It’s like the dive master says sets the dive in feet. Doesn’t mean that everybody can dive that depth as you know. I used to live in and dive in cold waters and now I live in Fl and watching people not pay attention to what they are doing on the dive and then step in and explain why we do this in our spot. Have a safe dive and keep on diving
I was just watching your video on high vs low pressure tanks. You did tell the viewers that a Din regular can take more pressure then a Yolk regulators can. Because the person who buys a high pressure tank can do some damage to there Yolk configuration regulators because of that higher pressure tank you should share that with the viewers
I can't disagree with you Will. The mass majority of regs today can pretty much handle these higher rated tank pressures.
Problems can vary due to status of a regulator's maintenance history and accuracy of service by a given tech.
Additional issues can be caused by over zealous pressurization and doubling of burst discs on various tanks for what's known as "cave fills".
Lots of horror stories and fairy tales out there too.
In my 50 years of diving and for example the past 15 or so I always use Yoke regs and own tanks with Pro or convertible valves.
Many divers buy into the "only DIN" for me attitude and that's ok too.
Many of these videos could be an hour or two long but best to keep them some what shorter and therefore it's difficult to say everything.
Thanks for your thoughts
Thanks for this good video
Do you have any recommendations for carbon fiber scuba tanks ?
This is not a joke, just stay away from CF scuba tanks...
@@DiversSupplyYT why could you please kindly list me some reasons?
@@kanthanok Because CF tanks won't last nearly as long. Tanks get beat up in transit and during dives overall. If just a single CF wrap is compromised, the entire tank is trashed. They also only have a 15 year lifespan where as steel and aluminium are good until they fail. I have a 50cf aluminium for teaching in the pool. It was made in 1978. I do the visuals (certified to do them) every year, hydro every 4 years and about 9 months. Never had any problems with it. And as Ronin said, there isn't a whole lot of point in a lighter tank if you're just going to have to weigh yourself down even more with lead due to the buoyancy attributes of a CF tank.
At around 1:35 you mention negative 4.2 lbs.
This same term is brought up several times and I’m trying to wrap my head around it.
Tanks weigh ‘x’ when empty
Tanks weigh x + compressed air.
But never below x?
There are some steel tanks that are Neg buoyant when full and + buoyant when empty.....and some that are Neg buoyant full and still Neg Buoyant but less so, when empty.
You just need to check their specs to know which is what.
Great info, thanks
Thanks Logan, Glad it was helpful. Regards Bob C
Solid advice.
Thanks Much SBB !
i am very interested in scuba diving! where would i buy a quality tank along with a quality regulator?
Call us of course !
Awesome video very informative👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
Thanks Sharon ! Regards Bob C
I'm confussed. Why did he say to use nitrous if using the 100c.f. tank? Why does the size of the tank have to do with whether or not you use nitrox or not?
Let me put it this way. On air ( _rounded numbers_ ) 79%N2 and 21%O2 the NDL or No Decompression limit (also known as No Stop Time) at 60' is roughly 52-55 mins, depending on the dive tables, Algorithm and conservativism you're using.
*"Most"* divers, and again I'm saying "most" divers can't quite stay there that long on a 80cft tank. Average is around 40-45 mins.
That keeps them just a few minutes away from NDL... good.
Now take a 100cft tank, *APROX* . 20% more gas *we will call it,* and if the 80cft norm is, we will call it 45 mins for safety sake, then the 100 would give them APROX 9 mins more bottom time, *OR APROX* . 55 mins which rubs up against that AIR NDL of 52-55.
If you use the most popular mix of *NITROX* , not Nitrous (BIG DIFFERENCE) the 60' NDl on 32% (68%n2 & 32%O2) is 90 mins.... a much safer way of diving even if you dive a 80, 100, 117, 120 or 133cft tank.
Yes, depth has a lot to do with this, but I use the 60' number as that's the *suggested* max depth of an Open Water diver.
Now, *you may be* one of those people that push the limits of everything, and that's on you, because there's only one butt connected to the tank you're wearing, and it's the one that will be sitting in that recompression chamber.
That's why I always say, *"DIVE SAFE OUT THERE".*
Thanks
Always great to have practical experienced advise. Im new open water trained and fresh with lots to learn.
Assuming one should have a buddie , i would need to purchace 2 tanks as not to be limited to the partners (usual) volume supply?
Also how durable are they?
What quallity of paint are they protected with?
And can the normal dive boat compressor handle the extra pressure?
Would i be always debating with the boat hand to pump extra into the tank?
Thanks Geoff for your comments, you know even if your buds dive 80's I'd still get a Steel 100 for general recreational diving. Having 20% more air never hurts and it costs the same to fill.
Now your boat compressor comment can have some validity. Many boat compressors are smaller units and must work pretty hard to get to that 3500psi mark.
Many boat owners with these compressors will have LP95 steel tanks that are 2400psi and save the strain on their compressors of dealing with that extra 1k+psi
Most of the Blue Steel tanks like Faber can be had in Galvanized editions... in general the painted ones are fairly durable.
Steel tanks are built tough that's why they're pricey and don't dent easily. Aluminum tanks are cheap, heavy, and dent easily because the aluminum is a soft metal.
Thanks I needed this.
Glad I could help
Yup down here in Fl we have lots of caves and some visitors try that crap and some dive shops will fill there tanks and do an injustice to our sport that way. I was trained by old diver and drilled Day one that you are responsible for your life and your buddy’s life as well when you dive so that the time and do it right. Besides being a professional PADI 5 star he’s also a commercial diver as well and we where truly blessed to have him teach us one on one
You do know being a PADI 5 star doesn't mean anything, right?!
valuable instruction, 'tanks' for the info! 😏
Glad it was helpful! Best Regards AZZA Bob C
Great information.
Thanks Thomas ! Nice to get feed back.RegardsBob C
I dive steel 100's and want to begin carrying a separate alternate air source in a sidemount configuration. would you suggest I stick with steel, say an 80 or even smaller. or is an aluminum 80 ok
Ranger, thanks for the question but a few questions for you first.
One- Are you Nitrox certified?
Two- Are you formally trained in Deco Procedures?
Three- Why do you want to carry an Alt. in this method???
Last- What type of diving are you involved in to use this rig???
My reply to your question will vary depending on your answers.
Sadly in Scuba terminology is king. An example is in your question {"alternate" air source vs "redundant" air source).
@@DiversSupplyYT thank you for taking the time to answer my question in such a detailed manner.
I am AOW nitrox certified. to clarify my intent is for the extra cylinder to be used as a redundant air source.
I was looking at side mount configuration due to comfort of carrying a large cylinder. on a side note I am looking to begin Tec diving so if I can have similar setups all more the better.
lastly, deco is not an issue as I do not dive deeper than 50' at my local lake and this cylinder is meant strictly for redundancy and not as a spare or to extend my bottom time.
I'd like to stick with steel because it's what I know but aluminum is obviously more cost friendly.
Wow ok, so as AOW and Nitrox diving on 100's likely you maybe doing some spearfishing I'll guess.
- If that's the case then the term redundant is correct. Tank and reg set on it. Many folks spearfishing don't hang right together so a Solo diver approach is needed.
- If you're an artifact diver same issue.
Personally the redundant air source can't be faulted in these cases.
If the above doesn't apply then a 19cft- or even 30cft tank will easily get you to the surface.
Slinging an 80cft tank is a "chunk" to drag around as an emergency air source.
With 32ean at 60' your normal NDL is 90min... you're not going to hit that on a 100cft back gas.
Please make sure you're getting properly trained for what you're under taking.
Don't be a gear junkie and BIGGER is not always better or wiser.
Call me here at the Jax store if you'd like to discuss....
Bob C
@@DiversSupplyYT I'm actually laughing to myself right now as to how spot on you were with your assessment of my activities based on the information i provided. talk about hitting the nail on the head!
these are the exact reasons I am looking to add a redundant air supply for safety. I didn't lead with that because alot of people get weird when you mention solo diving or being away from your buddy. that being said, what would you recommend?
@@Ranger_k16 It makes a difference when real experience is applied to advice given... 49 yrs of diving reality accounts for something... if done correctly.
So to answer your "what do I recommend". Again a question or two for you will guide my answer.
Diving 100's and I take that as a single 100 as back gas. Also nitrox use as well. If you're diving 32ean and using 1.4 as your tox limit then your spending your time in the 80-110' range. If you're using 1.6 then likely you're in the 100-120' range.
Let's use the 90-110 average... you could comfortably use a 19cft pony/bailout depending your verbiage.
It could get you to the surface from that range without you having to risk DS due to an excessive ascent rate.
Using a Bailout/Pony is considered an emergency, so no safety stop is involved.
Before betting my life on this combo, I'd suggest some practice ascents from say 60', 80' and then 100' (not back to back of course) and check the 19's pressure at the end of each.
Solo diving is no more risky than regular NDL buddy diving. If you're trained and properly equipped.
Very useful video 👍🏻
Glad you think so!
Is the steel 100 The same diameter as the aluminum 80?
Yes Sir !, and evr so slightly shorter bottom boot to top of valve by a hair or two. Regards Bob C.
@@DiversSupplyYT thanks so much! Somehow I missed that you said that the first time watching the video, but saw that you actually mentioned the second time. Thanks again!
and these days ... do not buy a used 20 year old or older Aluminum tank !
some Dive shops are now refusing to service or air fill them and I am told that the entire state of Florida will not service or air fill them anymore .
You are so right DiverDave, Be very careful about used tanks... Regards Bob C
@@DiversSupplyYT My 3 tanks were made in 1979 and I use them a lot and keep the Hydro and Visual up to date .... well this year I walked into a local dive shop with two of them and the owner nearly POOPED his pants as if I was pointing a gun at his head !!! He goes on to tell me that its too dangerous to service or air fill them because the might EXPLODE !!! He said to toss them in the garbage ... So I took them to another shop and they gladly took my money and did visuals eddie's hydros and air fills ..
@@diverdave4056 Some shops will do fills if they did the Hydro work. I know the Jacksonville store does in house Hydros/VIPs and will then fill the tanks.
Lots of places say no, even if the Hydro/ VIP is current and of course that's their choice.
People saying this video is great...WTF?
1: The sound quality is awful. Okay, that's not technical but if you want to make a video, get good sound.
2: In a video titled "basic" and explaining the simplest things, he jumps from "This tank is 31 lbs" to "This tank is -4.2" without ANY mention of how that happened.
3: He jumps topics from amount of air, to valve type, to using Nitrox, to size, to weight -- Focus!
4: He says a 100 cubic foot cylinder will give you 20% more air than an 80. It's 25%. No big deal but you're the expert. Just get it right.
It's the right concepts to be focused on but the presentation is horrible.
Gary thanks for your comments. Now am I a subject matter expert on video product and tank manufacturing, well that is subjective, just look at your comments, among all the others.
Can I except criticism, you bet, I’m reading yours, as well as the others I receive.
I strive, since I began diving in 1970 (still have my original dive card) , enjoying photography at 9 and 3 years ago being involved in video production not to believe I know it all, because I don’t.
My grandfather told me, “the person that thinks they know it all, has got a lot to learn”.
As I say in many of my videos, I accept ALL comments positive or negative, so thanks for yours.
@@DiversSupplyYT That's a wonderful attitude. I try to remember to be that open to criticism and fail more than I succeed, so GOOD ON YOU!! >>> I'm sure you are an absolutely great diver and a wonderful human being. Even in the video it comes through how honest and kind you are. >>> It's very hard to be both good at something and good at explaining something. They are not at all the same thing. >>> I think you have the manner, knowledge, and care to be an excellent instructor. As I said, just try more to pick a focus and to keep in mind what level audience any particular video is going for. >>> If you ever want help looking at a script or reviewing a video before posting, I'd be happy and honored to help!
Change your tampon, Gary.