RuPaul & Lahoma discuss the philosophy of drag with Fenton Bailey
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- Опубліковано 11 вер 2011
- This discussion took place in the studio of photographer Liz Lizzard during a photo shoot for an article about the "Queens of New York" Fenton Bailey was writing for the Canadian magazine "Graffiti"
How fabulous is it that they are having a philosophical discussion on the art of drag in a bathroom! SO fascinating to see Rupaul back in the 80s, she has come a LONG way!
The most beautiful quote - "This was never just drag, this was art first and then drag second"
I'm so in love with that bob haircut on Ru. We hardly see him in short hair but when he does it I ADORE it.
Yeah, he looks egyptian. Bring back Nefertiti wig Ru
yes and love it with the earrings
"It was art 1st, and drag second." --not just pretty words.
I was waiting for Ru to say, “We’re born naked the rest is drag”🤣
Womanhood is not drag and that is something gay men don't understand.
Omfg, ME TOOOOO I thought for sure this is where it started, I felt it in this video.
@@vikingsong2068 are you kidding? These people did more to break down barriers for gay people and gender roles then you could ever imagine. They have more NERVE on their pinky finger then you’ve ever had in your whole life wonderbread. These are proud gay male drag queens who are using drag as a creative art form and the fact that you don’t listen to the words of this conversation and feel positive feelings shows that you are the exact people they are talking about in this LATE 80’s video clip!
@@tula1433 PERIOD!! 🙏
@@JRS814 there is another video from this time of ru actually saying it back then ! I believe it’s “ru teaches Nelson how to be a drag queen”
Lahoma is such an intelligent and wonderful person
I adore her so much
I think that also so kind and so classy.
@@frankfontaineofficial It's a HIM
@@TheJoshA Girl!, why u mad ?
@@frankfontaineofficial don’t think he’s mad .. there’s two genders plain and simple he has a dick which makes him a guy and no amount of makeup and wigs he puts on is gonna change that .. I respect how brave these people are that Nelson hung around with they weren’t afraid to be who they are .. but this new generation? They Confused
It’s so amazing how they are actually listening to one another and respectful when one is talking. I can’t stand chatter among my coworkers, they’re all young and just talk right on over one another to the point it sounds like a chicken hen. I often can’t join conversation because it moves around so fast.
You will get used to it.
South Oz ok boomer, back in your day it was illegal people of different skin color to drink from the same fountain 🙄 but hey, it’s MY generation that’s selfish and entitled 👍🏻
Same!! I start talking, then someone else does straight away. In the end I just give up!!
Omg I loved this untucked
I love how they mentioned Cristina.
who is Cristina? I was wondering who she was.
I feel like this conversation was before it's time. and they covered so many questions we still ask ourselves now. We say "oh well it's 2016, why do (blank) still happen? or why do we still think like that?). and it just goes to show that we're have mans and we wonder about the "unknown". like what makes makeup feminine? such good topics.
I've been binge watching these, its given me a view of the struggles and hardships of the culture.
I just can't get enough!!!
Wow. 35 years ago and this was the topic of conversation 😮😮. And people make it out like this is all new.
Lahoma is so smart and cute here!
This is the very first WOW production meeting.
"12 super ferocious drag queens" sounds like RuPaul's Drag Race!!! Love this
Yeah! that's what I thought
Got it in one - yellow t-shirt guy gave him that idea right there and then! Ru just ran with it!! Too marks for him!!
@@LisaMarie-xp4ymyellow t-shirt guy is Fenton Bailey, one of the producers of the show who's been there since season 1
Ru Paul looks amazing! This is so interesting, hard to believe it’s the 80s! They were so ahead of their time.
I agree!!! I'd also counter that, unfortunately, the powers that be would have us think that this conversation is new.
@@user_kH9bw3ns1 yes!!! a lot of the conversations the newer gay people are having today we've had them at least 15 years ago for people my age and 35 years ago for people older than me. nothing under the sun is "new" but somehow we constantly keep going backward.
Someone could write a dissertation on this fucking conversation. That was beautiful.
What makes "makeup" female?? Very good question. I think it is one of the most interesting questions during this entire conversation.
Men in the middle east have worn kohl around their eyes for thousands of years. The official explanation for this is that it was believed to have medicinal properties, but it seems unlikely that that was the only reason for the application. People will have inevitably noticed how it accentuates the eyes and been attracted to it for that reason also. Its not as popular now, and that could be because of western cultural influence, but im not entirely sure.
Males already have bright plumage and fins.
Females must use artificial enhancements to achieve the same effect.
What makes a man think he can magically become a woman simply through applying make-up? Womanhood is not a costume.
@@vikingsong2068 or a practice - it’s natural!!
@@vikingsong2068 females don’t own femininity. Aren’t your radical feminist friends all butch dykes in male tee shirts? 😂😂😂
Amazing on so many levels. Nelson's use of ONE freakin camera, natural light, angles, content, honesty and showing real respect and love for his subjects/friends on and off camera. 8 min and 33 seconds. As a film maker, i take my hat off to him. RIP my friend. ❤🔥💯🙏
This is incredible. Thank you for sharing this, Nelson!
Nelson is dead.... He actually died along time ago. I wonder who posted these videos??
MadMike Nelson isn’t “dead”, how disrespectful. He’s an angel in another dimension. And without Nelson, we wouldn’t even have this footage. So it is a thanks to Nelson. His close friend posts these videos for him.
This makes me miss the days of my youth when bunches of us would ponder and philosophy about everything under the sun all afternoon or all night.this warms my heart hearing how drag queens felt and feel about the world
Back then they didn’t have cell phones to stare into so conversation was key!
Albert 7.28 "Lahoma can get a smile out of a statue". Love it!
I love Jon and Jon as Lahoma, would have loved to know him!!!
This video hits so different now that drag or art has evolved.
Homegirl in the black dress with the up-do is due her royalties from the Kim Kardashian PAPER magazine cover...
Always good to see another video featuring Lahoma!
I love how Ru was so damn down to earth. Oh and the confidence, I f*ckin it.
Dear lord...society has actually gone backward. This convo is amazing, but knowing how much we've regressed is just sad.
how has it?
Konga 5000 you singlehandedly brought civilization back a decade by ordering Boston market through Uber eats
True btw I like your pfp
@@rkoistheman did you just come for my Boston market Uber eats habit ! 😂
How has it? Lol. They aren’t using correct pronouns which idk if you’ve heard but thats now totally justification for your life to be ruined.
6:11 Awwwe so cute if only they knew what Drag would become today :')
OMG I love this... You can tell in this video that Ru is starting to find her way out of that 80's androgonous look and starting to really come into a cohesive drag look, because she really looks great here. Even though she hasn't come into her trademark blonde look yet here, I still like this dark wig here, it looks good. Watching all these old videos of Ru though, one thing stands out. Ru's personality is so sweet and so charming and KIND!
*His. He's not a woman.
Yes you call a drag queen in drag “she” it’s just a social courtesy. We also call boats and vehicles “she” relax.
@@vikingsong2068 she is used for drag queens all over the earth.
it's a HE
@@tula1433 great point.
This is fascinating for a straight, white female to watch. Throughout these videos I have grown fond of all these guys, but especially of Lahoma (Jon). He makes a very interesting point about his almost unique dual perspective - that of being seen through the eyes of straight men as just an ordinary man, and also as a man identifying as female. Not many of us get to experience being perceived as one thing, and then another entirely, in the same context, and it's an interesting insight in to their world.
Could anyone explain what she means by "in the same context"? Perhaps it's b/c I only slept 15 minutes this morning, or maybe b/c I'm not the smartest, but I can't figure out it. Do you mean he's a man both times?
I'm one of those ppl who's perceived in different ways, but it's usually when ppl get new information.
Does it not bother you that gay men think they can experience "womanhood" simply by wearing make-up, wigs and dresses? Do you not think that's offensive and regressive to actual women? And what does race have to do with anything?
@@vikingsong2068, nope it's in line with the socialization of privileged women in western society. They love to be told what femininity or womanhood is from 'enlightened' men/transwomen.
@@vikingsong2068 I’m a fully passable homosexual transsexual and I am biologically male. I live my life every single day being perceived by society as a woman. So yes I do know what it’s like to be perceived as a woman. The difference is that when I was being abused and assaulted by men growing up I couldn’t say “I’m a girl you can’t hit me” like you could. You’re a delusional social constructionist feminazi male hater. Rupaul and crew have more feminine energy in this clip then you could ever have with your hateful homophobic views. Homosexuals have been presenting as the opposite sex and bending traditional gender roles since the days of the catamites and eunuchs. I’m sure you’re quite butch yourself if you’re a feminist 😂
No men mistook him for a woman, that's ridiculous
OMG this is my favorite look for Albert!!! Cawwwfeeee!
I think being in drag makes you vulnerable in men's eyes, just like real women are. What's the one thing producers look for when they want to make some female a "star?" They look for beauty for sure, but it's vulnerability that sets it all in motion. That helplessness, the "little girl" attitude who is defenseless and needs protecting. You want to go to bed with her but at the same time you want to protect her. That's stardom. When straight men see men in drag, it's like denying their own manhood because they see how quickly macho can be changed to vulnerability and most men do not like to be perceived as vulnerable in any situation. So they lash out at men who make them see how easy this transition could be for any one of them at any time. We are all more alike than we care to admit. Does this make sense.....?
J kK ..... yeeeeeeeeeeeeeas 😁😀😊
Aye. Men (straight ones) are very 'identified', but also quite easily intimidated by other men they perceive as not, in case they're going to be pursued by them, perhaps? Or maybe they're afraid of their reaction...
Damn. I think you just summed up why I tend to act more meek and vulnerable than I actually am around guys I like. Some shit I need to unpack lol
Men are terrified of their own possible homosexuality. Like they said in this clip. Men have been trained to be 100% heterosexual and any deviation from that is not okay. So when they see a drag queen that they find attractive it makes them question their entire life. Men will literally screw a blowup doll of course they will find anything feminine attractive. We’ve just all been socialized into believing that we’re not actually mammals/animals. We are! In the absence of females, heterosexual males start screwing weaker more feminine males. It’s nature. Haven’t you heard of prison culture?
Ru & Lahoma dropping wisdom hunty!
What an insightful conversation! I ❤ it!
Where is my Lahoma??? What a great person...
Love these videos 🙌 so good
Did they know they were pioneers of what happened later? These very courageous women and their words will never cease to inspire me and to teach me
I love this conversation with my whole heart. Its philosophical but in an environment that is authentic with out regurgitated talking points..compared to today's society.
I'm in love with John.
RuPaul was just as gorgeous back in the 80's..... And I love the Audrey Hepburn look.... The all look fabulous. Too bad Nelson passed. He would have loved youtube
Lahoma is charismatic
Omg every video from Nelson makes me so Happy! This is one of my fav videos!!!! RuPaul is the Love of my Life!💞
i love this look on rupaul
so amazing
Is that Albert?? He looks so pretty. Everyone looks great! It's pretty cool them talking about the 12 queens & Ru has 12 in drag race.
You could absolutely see the wheels turning in Fenton Baileys head that he was going to take drag and make it acceptable for the straight masses when LaHoma was telling the story of how she fronted the band she was in as a girl and won over straight fraternity boys by the end of the night.....The drag queen franchise was born at this meeting and LaHoma deserves the credit.....NOT RU PAUL
I just adore Lahoma. ❤️
thank you very much.
Y”ALL !!! I ACTUALLY JUST GOT A COPY OF THE MAGAZINE THIS PHOTO SHOOT IS FEATURED IN !!
GRAFFITI MAGAZINE 1988 !!! WoW !!! If I could post pictures, I, oh so would ! 🌺🌸🌺🌼
Where is Michele Visage in all these videos?
I am guessing this is before her lifelong friendship with Ru
These videos are all amazing and I love the friendships of all of these people as a family
We're all one. =) love this convo.
Fenton Bailey is there and later made the movie “ party monster “
The 12 apostles of drag, right there.
Hot boxing the bathroom. Relatable
Thank you! This was a most informative discussion. I think it being in a very small bathroom is important as this is a well protected, highly personal, totally honest place. Everybody is totally real in the bathroom. But all that is about the honesty of the talk, what is being said is important. There is something beyond the performance and something behind the performance, there is the person wanting to be more Human than just one sex, one gender or one cultural identity. Drag is an exaggeration of the Woman Image, a Kabuki expression. Cross dressing is different, I think, being Male but appearing Female, or vice versa, reflects something different, not just "A Woman born in a Man's body", kind of thing, but a desire to, as one of the Queens said, "To feel the looks a Man gives a Woman, from the Woman's perspective." or to be "One of the Boys", a highly desirable position according to our Male dominant culture.
Thing is, I'm hitting all around the enlightenment but missing the mark. Understanding, "Why Drag? Why cross dress? Why need to be something else? Is it like becoming a excellent soldier or powerful Politician, being submerged in your Art or hiding from the World, while revealing yourself to the World? I simply don't understand. I am not drawn to Drag but want to understand more about being Human. I have asked similar questions to real Soldiers and Politicians, Black people and American Indians, White people, Men and Women and they all have a hard time answering, as do I. I want to understand what it is to be human!
what happened to lahoma?
They are sooooo ahead of their times,like they saw into the future !
This convo was very interesting.
This is such good stuff 😎
And look at us now its so cool.
love is something else
Lohoma is the best
I think they might have been misinterpreting women a bit. But that's understandable.
RuPaul is giving me serious Tyra vibes here.
6:12 YES - because you and the human sitting beside you on the bathtub rail will create it. This is incredible to watch.
1:43 Jump forward a couple decades later and you have the story of Courtney Act and Andrew Brady blossoming their platonic friendship in Big Brother...because Andrew reacted to Courtney with the whole fantasy, he pretty much was infatuated with her even though it was all a fantasy.
2020 HERE !! !!
This is that deep, cocaine conversion.
The stains on the bottom of RU's coat are WONDERFUL!
I know! LOL 🤣
I know! LOL 🤣
Lahona! Tell me what is doing now! 😻
Stomp, stomp, stomp, stomp! Ru sure knows how to walk in those heels. Better than I ever could.
Lahoma forgot to shave her arms- lol
ERIKA DOWDY humans are hairy, we're mammals, it's part of the territory.
GENTLE FOLK
going deep
That pipe tho :)
SICK....
That drag in black dress is a bit misogynist, he basically said that "males are more beautiful species". IMO, The man in the blonde wig that sat down likes woman a lot and understands women more, which is why he has more feminine energy than all of them.
you know wheres Lahoma to be right now?
Not nearly discussed enough.
And just how popular it became...
Let's not forget Nelson.
It’s all in the accessories
I think the last thing Lahoma did was for Rupaul's Starrbooty film a few years ago. He ame out of drag retirememnt to be in the film. You cna find clips on UA-cam and buy the dvd on Amazon.
Such a great video. Who's the cutie Nelson keeps focusing on in the bright shirt sitting on the bath tub?
chad allen Fenton Bailey
Fenton Bailey, apparently. No nothing about him, but he crops up in other vids. He's An Englishman In New York, darling!
Fenton Bailey he owns World of Wonder who produces Drag Race for VH1
😍🎈🎈
Fenton is such a baby in this!
Rupaul is serving Naomi in this hair
Rupaulبحبك انا بموت فيك 😍😭
Where was Lahoma from?
Who is the person in the yellow shirt ?
TheSleepy Teacher Fenton Bailey.
Could someone tell me the name of the guy next to RuPaul in the tub?
Migue Skoka Yellow sweater? That’s Fenton.
Phill Greenland thank you :)
Oliver Cromwell mentioned lol
i have had four kids two including twins but it dont matter what i am in they way i feel .
If you can get on the subway and get home with no blood on your face.......the femme realness queens....says Dorian Corey. When you are a pretty girl who can pass, you meet and attract a whole different type of man......not every queen can do it. We all have different gifts......yeeeeeeeeeeeeeas!!!!!
Is that Albert with the updo I love Albert he's so cute
Ikr. Pretty sure that's him. Always liked him & his personality.
Seriously, did Lahoma ever shave her arms or legs? Just asking.
I wonder if Ru looks back on these videos
nah he said it haunts him
Who were the 12?
Ru sitting there like a bad bitch 😍😍
Is Lahoma still around?