Warhammer 40,000 vs Star Wars/Star Trek Who Would Win? The Horror Of The Imperium
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- Опубліковано 25 вер 2018
- Something that seems to get overlooked a fair bit when it comes to these Imperium vs Empire vs Federation showdowns is the psychological aspect of the kind of war that the Imperium wages, which is, by and large, a horrendous, nightmarish flood of devastation and a callous approach to the life of their troops.
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"Too Cool" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
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#warhammer #warhammer40000 #warhammer40k #gamesworkshop - Ігри
Star trek: 8 million dead.
Call it a massacre.
40k: 8 billion dead.
Call it a Thursday.
we both know this is a meme, i'm just surprised HALO wasn't included to a degree.
Axza95 the only things from any other Sci Fi franchise I can think of that can sort of thrive or something in 40k are The Flood, and the DoomSlayer.
@@allenrosales9738 I mean most thing's in HALO could, the forerunners kerb stomp everything in 40K though unfortunately. 40K is about mid-mid teir with the likes of HALO and Star Wars canon
Axza95 Necrons can beat Forerunners tho, well at least when they’re fully awakened anyway. Star Wars canon gets curbstomped so hard that it would look even more unrecognisable than the face of the Grey Knight Justicar that got punched by Khârn the Betrayer.
@@yokgor4675 necrons fully awakened would hardly be able to touch forerunners, the only time they'ed have a chance is during the war in heaven with all the C'Tan backing them and even then that's a maybe.
"Do the deaths of you soldiers mean so little to you? are you that mad!?" "Do the deaths of yours mean so much to you alien? are you that weak?" - Davian Thule to tau commander
Barrel Wimp sickest burn since Prospero, maddest roast since the Salamanders.
TheDeceptiveMoss Respect for watching thunder psyker!
"The fuck are talking about, human? You just send million of soldiers to die in a pointless front charge against our heavily fortified trench despite our weapons having far longer range. I am calling you mad for using such a ineffective tactic"
@@user-unos111 Longer range? Lol, superior firepower is the way to go pleb. You can only dream of being as expendable.
Superior firepower means shit if you cannot hit your enemy. Also, "dream of being as expendable" is like telling your opponent he should envy your patheticness.
Are you Zapp Brannigan, by the way?
lightsabers - an elegant weapon from a civilised time.
chainswords - a sword wound is not messy enough.
WYT Fish what about the power maul or chainaxe?
@@williamward4117 What about the shovel?
@@reinoo.d6181 when a rusty poisoned sword isnt toxic enough
@@reinoo.d6181 The Imperium can only take so much power my dude. We can't just give the shovel to anyone.
merely explaining what The Death Korps Of Krieg are about to storm or clone troopers would cause a fatal error in their testicles. I see you Dark Side... and raise it by 40,000
”3 million dead. A clean victory!”
"T'was but a small skirmish"
But a passing memory
90% mortality rate. Victory
@@lucianfrostbane sounds like a land slide victory to me. Didnt even hit 95% casualties, I think we need to break out some wine on the way to the next deployment zone, chers.
For a small fee
The mentality question:
Star Wars: evasive maneuvers/block their hyperspace jump.
Star Trek: raise shields.
Warhammer: RAMMING SPEED! Deploy boarding torpedoes!
FORWARD I WISH TO HIT THEM WITH MY SWORD
THINDER HAMMER WITH JUMP PACKS
This is so stupid comment...
*Imperial-I Star Destroyer* acceleration: 2300 G, *Lunar-class Cruiser* : 2.5 G
Plus particle shield will destroy all boarding torps...
@@WadcaWymiaru true
Star Trek: raise shields.
Tau Navy, Fire the planetoid sized railcannon that fires solid slugs of titanium the size of skyscrapers.
The Empire has been known to shoot cowards. But no way in the same way the commissars do for the guard.
If an empire solider runs from battle, he may get unlucky and run into a nasty officer who will shoot him, but he could just as easily run to the back line where he is court marshaled and shot the next day, and there is not always a guarantee of death, he could be lashed or beaten instead.
When a Guardsmen runs he is instantly shot in the face with a bolt pistol by a angry man with a sword. Hell some Commissars will shoot a Guardsman who looks like he is about to run, just to remind everyone else not to.
It is generally true but it would depend on the decision of the commissar and situation. Examples would be Caiphas Cain and Gaunt
They will execute someone just to show what will happen if you even think of falling back or staying put in cover, let alone outright running away.
“If you will not serve in combat, then you will serve on the firing line”.
@@ItsStevieBoy Unless you can justify such action such as finding a gap in the lines flanking the enemy or being ordered to another location mid battle. Commissars generally won't shoot willy nilly if you tell them that. Besides they are more likely to be fighting as well to inspire the men through actions as well as words not just hanging back waiting to kill retreating soldiers unless requested to.
@@elliotyourarobot don't get me wrong, I don't mean all of them are like that, but some certainly are. I remember in a death korp book I read, a commisar shot a guy for "cowardice" for staying in cover for about 5 seconds after he reloaded. 😅 then again the korp aren't exactly known for their kind hearted nature. 😜
@@ItsStevieBoy To be fair, the Commisars in Kreig armies aren't provided by the Kreigers normally. They are from outside of the unit, and not there to inspire fanatical devotion and die in combat. They are there to try and rein in the Kreigers and stop them from dying needlessly.
I mean, its a joke, but not, that the Kreigers will totally be willing to charge the guns and die to take an objective in a training exercise. To the actual horror of all the officers around them.
And that's for the "good guys". Wait till the Empire/Federation meet the Chaos Space Marines or the Tyranids.
Kraken well that’s just the issue. The Empire are meant to be the bad guys but the worst they have to fight is a largely reasonable and human enemy (or at least with human morals). The imperium is the way it is because it deals with xenomorphs dialled up to 1,000,000%, ancient space elf slavers crossed with sado masochist pin head who literally feed off your suffering and then there’s the living embodiment of hell itself slowly pouring into the material universe. Good luck with your sanity Jedi...
Kraken not to talk about the orks!
@@alexenter1162 the word of Lorgar shall enlighten them to the *TRUTH*
Not mention Ork or Necrons.
you mean the guys the imperium keeps defeating?
The federation: "we lost 50 ships!"
The empire: "we lost 500k stormtroopers!"
The imperium: "those are rookie numbers."
correction
The Imperium: "3 billion guardsman dead dear god... A LANDSLIDE VICTORY BUST OUT THE WINE BOYS"
Imperium: Abaddon the Despoiler has busted through the immaterium and turned trillions of people into corpses and daemons. This is now a moderate concern.
@@manictiger moderate is a bit of a stretch
@@Burger19985
It's somewhere between mild and moderate, I think. I'll have to check 10 quadrillion records to make sure I classified it correctly, one moment, please.
@@manictiger i would say a mild moderate too just send a trillion or so flashlight holders
Stormtrooper: ‘They got Alex!!!’
Imperial Guardsmen: ‘Well Alex is dead.’
Cody Connor more like "sweet, more spare mags."
They wouldn’t even remember her name. ...or really notice in general.
And yes, "her" the imperium is... amusingly egalitarian while also grimdark as fuck 😂
Imperial Guardsman: rummages through Alex's pockets for their ration of Amasac
Yep. And so is Timmy, Dave, Bob, Steve, Alpha Company, Bravo Company, at least 3 battalions, and like 3 million other guardsman from more units than I care to make names up for.
It's been 5 minutes on a Tuesday.
@@lordfrostdraken mostly iho sticks and probably power packs more likely. I've not seen much reference of troopers drinking amasec on the field, officers? Sure. But the grunts will drink whatever homemade crap they brewed in a trench somewhere and it's probably just recaf.
*Alexius
On the Space Marine thing....not only are your mates dying hideous, horrific deaths - but your foe just isn’t. And they’re not even trying to hide, or take cover. If you’re hunkered down in a building, a squad will just Robocop through the walls.
They’re weapons of terror. They’re designed to lack all subtlety. They’re designed to play merry Hell with enemy morale.
There’s a brilliant bit in the Nightbringer novel. Single Space Marine (albeit a commander) is in a hover carriage. They happen to simply travel past a protest that’s getting a bit nasty. One look at the Marine, and the plebs just knock it off. He doesn’t stop. Doesn’t slow down. Just goes past them in a non-military vehicle. That is the impact they have on actually loyal, just angry, citizens.
Lol I read that book too.
You forgot the part in that book when that same Space Marine jumped down a mine shaft, landing on a defending soldier below, and completely obliterating the guy
Yeah i just finished that one. It was good, ending was a bit meh, but the assault at the end was clutch
Everyone focuses on the Imperium when it comes to "Series vs 40k" fights. Nobody seems to consider, say, what if it was instead the Necrons, or Chaos Daemons, or the Tyranids. ESPECIALLY the 'Nids! Star Wars would be utterly doomed if the Tyranids arrived, as A) there are so many verdant worlds that are virtually undefended and easy to convert into biomass (Dagobah, anyone?), and B) the entire galaxy is so cosmopolitan with varied alien species that genestealers could walk around openly with barely anyone batting an eye.
Kimarous - I don't think you've thought this Nid thing through very well. The Empire would have a much easier time dealing with them than the Imperium does. Given that the Empire wouldn't care about the shadow in the warp and that hyperdrive is so fast they'd easily be able to reinforce any planet threatened. Dagobah, really? The example of the verdant world of biomass you give is the desert planet?
Genestealers could cause some problems until they were figured out, but once they were, genetic screening would root them out pretty rapidly.
??? Dagobah is Yoda's SWAMP WORLD! That's the OPPOSITE of a desert! What planet are you thinking about - Tattooine or Jakku?
Also, might I remind you that "an entire legion of (the Emperor's) best troops" were taken out by half-pint primitives using weapons of rock and wood. You think the Empire can handle the relentless swarms that the 'Nids pump out, let alone Carnifexes, Hive Tyrants, and the like?
Kimarous Ah, yes I was thinking of Tattooine. That's my bad. The Ewoks didn't fight a legion of storm troopers they fought a few dozen and the Ewoks were losing. Remember they attacked the hidden rear entrance. It didn't turn around until Chewie captured that scout walker when they decided to open the hatch. Even then the rebels would have still lost if the bunker commander hadn't opened the door for them. Pretty much all the defeats the Empire suffers in the OT is due to someone having a stroke and making a really stupid decision
.
I think they could handle Nid ground troops just as well as the Imperium could, but the point I was making is that they would have a space fleet for defence so the Nids may not land any significant troops anyway.
@@brandonvaughn7255 The Tyranid ground troops stomp. They overwhelm bigger armies of better armed soldiers, Ork WAAAGH!s and have their own Titans. Remember how the Zillo Beast couldn't be stopped on Corusant? Now imagine having a couple dozen of them with full air and infantry support.
Isabel Page - I looked up the Zillo beast and found it had apparently magically invulnerable scales, and they did stop it by poisoning it. Tyranids would just be shot. If the Imperium's weapons can kill Nids so can the Empire's.
The Imperium would probably be seen as the bad guys in most other universes
MN N that just goes to show had horrifying the universe is if the Imperium of man would be the bad guys in most of others universes hell the empire is not as bad them in the way it Treats it’s own Civilians and they were Designed to be bad guys
i would say that even tau are looking bad guys in star wars (mind manipulation by the etherials, occasional forced sterilisation, absolutely no right to choose your way of life or even partner to create a family, oh democracy is also unavailable)
The beauty of 40K is that there *are no good guys*
@@the_inquisitive_inquisitor there are worse guys
@@music79075 I mean, in that sense, the Orcs would probably considered to be the less evil of the factions. Think about it, they are a race that has zero morals, zero ideologies, they literally want to kill every single faction on the universe, but in the end though? Its just in their nature really, orcs just wanna have fun, and by fun is to be a race fully devoted to war. Not to spread their own beliefs, religion etc. but just to wage war, and thats it.
People seem to forget that space marines are not slow or bulky too. They move at incredible speed, with insane precision and intelligence. There is a discussion in the horus heresy about "post-human dread" which is the terror of a being moving and fighting with a speed that is disproportionate to his size.
It's often been stated that "something that big should not be able to move that fast"
If you've played Inquisitor (the tabletop one), take a look at the stat line for a Space Marine. They break the game system; they can do things like splatter you to pulp by throwing their bolter at you and nail you in the head with a grenade from 300m away. Now, Space Marines are probably not _quite_ that overpowered, but they are probably close. I imagine a Space Marine could easily topple a building just by being careless as he moves through it, and that one of them running into you would be like a car hitting you at 40kph. They canonically can accidentally kill a human by pushing them aside.
Their very mass and inertia is a weapon, an Assault Marine landing in a tightly packed squad of soldiers would be _very_ messy. Imagine a Space Marine taking a run up and leaping into a building, imagine how hard he'd land. When a Space Marine is moving at full speed and power, in the heat of battle, he's tearing the place apart. These guys cut a swathe of destruction just by advancing on the enemy.
It _would_ be terrifying to see; that much mass, moving that fast, smashing through stone and metal like it's cardboard. It'd be like Zod vs Superman in Man of Steel without the flying.
@@dmgroberts5471all I could picture is Ty Eros the red wake just sprinting as fast as flash
@@dmgroberts5471tyberos* the chapter master of the carcharions just auto correct tripping
@@Botinfinit 😆
Imagine some Chaos cultists summoning Angron on Coruscant
so what he'll have to stop and build shrines again or get cast back in to the warp that was his unding
Coruscantulaba
@@venomstar6789 I mean, so long as he keeps killing, Khorne keeps using his power to keep Angron there, and Coruscant is VERY densely populated
8:35 except when it's men of Krieg, then the commissars have to stop the guardsmen from being too suicidal :3
It is said that one time, a Krieg Guardsmen executed a Commissar for cowardice when he ordered a retreat.
@@Jalip07 considering Krieg guardsmen retreated only once, against Death Guard, and they retreated only one trench line it's highly plausible that they would execute commissar
Ally Krieg are frikkin mad. I heard that most of them are only around 10-19.
@@allenrosales9738 that's highly possible considering noone can actually tell their ages most of the time
@@allenrosales9738 and they almost takes of their mask i read somewhere that Kreigsman stuffed ration bars in his mask to prevent him from opening the mask
If I remember correctly a space marine charging a normal person induces “post-human dread”, as the fact that an 8 foot tall “human”, in what would be considered tank armor to most people, charging at you personally, it is enough to make even the most grizzled veteran second guess his position on the battlefield.
Charging at you at speeds that SHOULD be impossible for something of its size
"40k is silly because the scale is ridiculous!"
That's basically what everyone on earth thought about WW1 then it happened and the planet shat itself at the length of the war, the endless mountains of casualties, the famines, the diseases, the endless trainloads of ammunition and clothing needed to keep their guys alive and fighting. The scale was ridiculous.
40k makes perfect sense to me because it's so far in the future.
And if you're referring to the magic and daemons and stuff, well Star Trek and Star Wars both have ridiculous space ghosts in their settings so w.e
Because totally tactics haven't changed since then to avoid similar meatgrinders, right?
@The Wolf of Justice and Truth I know I'm 4 months late, but yeah I'm on the same page, kudos to you man.
@The Wolf of Justice and Truth I'm not trying to come across as a Troll, but to be honest I think Star Trek has a much higher level of power than most people give it credit for. Their personal weapons can disintegrate a modern day main battle tank, or level a small building. A single starship can completely destroy the surface of a planet like Earth in minutes. They even have a General Order 24 just for the occasion. Those same ships have shields which can repel that same firepower that they can unleash on a planet.
@@pyerack
I have not seen the new SW movies and don't care for them but the Star Wars fandom in specific has always been known as ridiculously obssessive.
As the actor who played young Anakin can testify
@@pyerack oh no...
The Slaaneshi's of R34
The Federation would be one of the strands of Humanity encountered during the Great Crusade that would be brought to compliance (one way or another) in such a quick manner that it would barely be a footnote in the logs of the Expeditionary Fleet.
The Hammer,
They tend to be talking about the latest incarnation of the Imperium in these match ups through, so most likely people are not thinking of it being during that time period within the lore. Also for both the Federation and the Imperium to exist simultaneously, they would have to be in two separate universes, because Earth is the capital of both the Imperium and the Federation, so how would that work, if they were in the same universe? The only way that that could work that I can think of, would be if the universe was large enough were there were two copies of the Milky Way, one that developed along Star Trek lines and one that developed into the 40k universe. Also its hard to imagine humans becoming as xenophobic and bigoted against aliens, as the Imperium as long as it was common for humans and aliens to peacefully co-exist as equals in the same society, like they do in Star Trek or Star Wars.
To be fair, I think I remember something about a “Second Terra” with someone pretending to be the Emperor and everything during Imperial compliance. I think Horus or one of the other Primarchs stomped his shit in... Yeah it was something like “the battle of six three nineteen”. So it’s not impossible for “another Earth” or anything to be retconned.
@@GargamelGold in the book horus rising set during the great crusade the luna wolves find themselves pitted against an empire which believed that it's capital planet was where humanity began so to integrate the federation in such a setting would be easy, the planet they call earth will be in a system encountered by an expeditionary fleet
@@rrichards4957 ,
Except in the Star Trek universe, they don't just think that the capital of The Federation is Earth, the capital of the Federation is Earth. Also The Federation would not even exist in Star Trek cannon, had they never encountered the Vulcans and that's just one alien race that The Federation assimilated into its multi planet civilization, not to mention other aliens that they encountered that to some degree or another influenced the development of their society, also the vast number of planets that the federation controls, while maybe not as numerous as the number that the Imperium controls, would be too many for them not to notice before they came across their capital which would be an exact replica of Earth prior to the "age of strife.
Like I said, outside of parallel universes, or a universe big enough to have two copies of the Milky way in it, its hard to imagine how both the Imperium and the Federation could be real. Also since The Federation is not just Earth, the Imperium encountering another Earth all by itself would not be the same as them encountering the Federation.
the federation has time travel, they could use that.
I laughed so much at this so true. Finn turned traitor in star wars seeing a few people rounded up and shot and got a bit of blood on his helmet. the imperium is horrific in every way. great rant
Xeelee sequence.
Lol
And he then went on to slaughter the only family he had ever known and laughed about it a minute later
I don't know what you're talking about. Who's this Finn you speak off?
He wasn’t a clone tho as some other legions of the first order. Probably these clone legions were more rare but in the age of Darth Sidious they were probably al clones and none recruited as a child
The Siege of Vraks about sums it up about the mind set of the Imperium.
The defense of Tarsis Ultra against the Tyrinids is a good one too.
The Death Korps of Krieg sum up the Imperium very, very well. Literally ready to die at a moment's notice, and not just ready, hoping it happens so that they may give their lives in the name of the Emperor... Willingly charging our worst nightmares turned up to a million with nothing but glorified flashlights, bayonets, and occasionally a shovel....
By the Emperor, I love 40k.
Have yall forgotten Armageddon??
@@Fluffy52600 man i really don't want to remember armageddon that had one of the dumbs plots i have every read about
Ah yes, the old 'throw bodies at them until the line breaks' strategy
Fighting the Imperium is like being a demon in DOOM when the Doom Slayer enters the room, ripping and tearing everything I'm front of him.
I don't know how true this is (it's supposed to be) but I read a story once about a Chinese general who loudly announced to his enemy that his soldiers have no fear of death, as he announced this a regiment of his own soldiers marched towards the enemy & slice their own throats on his command, then a second did the same & a third. Apparently they were actually P.O.W's who'd been given the choice to either kill themselves on the battlefield or be tortured.
The opposing army panicked & fled the battle without any fighting ever actually taking place.
I believe the Imperium has described the term regarding the mental stress of
"normal" troops having to fight against a Space Marine/Chaos Space
Marine quite well. I give the following example of "transhuman
dread":
[Book Excerpt] Aximand describes "transhuman dread". - "Transhuman dread. Aximand had heard iterators talk of the condition. He’d heard descriptions of it from regular Army officers too. The sight of an Adeptus Astartes was one thing: taller and broader than a man could ever be, armoured like a demigod. The singularity of purpose was self-evident. An Adeptus Astartes was designed to fight and kill anything that didn’t annihilate it first. If you saw an Adeptus Astartes, you knew you were in trouble. The appearance alone cowed you with fear."But to see one move. Apparently that was the real thing. Nothing human-shaped should be so fast, so lithe, so powerful, especially not anything in excess of two metres tall and carrying more armour than four normal men could lift. The sight of an Adeptus Astartes was one thing, but the moving fact of one was quite another. The psychologists called it transhuman dread. It froze a man, stuck him to the ground, caused his mind to lock up, made him lose control of bladder and bowel. Something huge and warlike gave pause: something huge and warlike and moving with the speed of a striking snake, that was when you knew that gods moved amongst men, and that there existed a scale of strength and speed beyond anything mortal, and that you were about to die and, if you were really lucky, there might be just enough time to piss yourself first."
the federation offecirs have literarly fought a god.
@johnymustacio the emperor of man is literally holding all of the Gods at bay with the power of his will alone while simultaneously holding the ftl system for a galactic empire intact while being a corpse. Beyond thanos snap power
Love the presentation, completely agree with the content.
Psychology rules in warfare.
especially when your facing giant mentally conditioned murder zealots
In the Grim Darkness of the 41st Millenium ....There....Is....No......Coffee!!!
But there is Coca Cola. the only surviving technology from the Golden age xD
Edward Cullen
Until you fight with someone who has no emotions.
@@nobleman9393 or the guy that feels emotions but is genetically and psychologically conditioned to ignore them entirely. I think it's worse to face something that knows what you are feeling but just doesn't care than something that doesn't feel at all.
Star trek " send in the Borg we have no other options"
Adeptus mechanicus " ROFL hold my beer"
hold my toaster*
you are do know that there might be trillions of borgs in the star treck uni right?
@@venomstar6789 trillions how cute
@@venomstar6789 laughs in Nova Cannon
Hold my wd40
Imperial Guard have held the line against millions of demons and tyranids time and time again. Storm troopers surrender to ewoks. Troops in 40k are an order of magnitude more resolved than troops in Star Wars and Start Trek.
Bellicose Pariah 🤣😂🤣😂🤣 I FORGOT ABOUT THE SURRENDER TO EWOKS. BAHAHAHA! ....yeah. Like, 12 Guards could have defended that fort on endor. Not even kasrkins or scions or anything, just boring enlisted gropos. LOL. As much as I adore KOTOR (it’s... really the only truly great star wars story/lore/etc) ...fuck star wars XD stars, yes. Wars? Pfffft.
And the death korps of krieg has the greatest weapon ever known to man
SHOVEL
Fine Wine Cadia Stands!
To be fair that's plot armour. But aside from some units(like the 501st) most stormtroopers act more like/have a similar role to SWAT and Military Police than military troops so they'd be fucked against guardsmen.
@@allenrosales9738 Planet broke before the guard did!
It has the potential to be a blockbuster at the movies but everyone is too chicken to do it.
You couldn't do 40k without minimum an R rating.... the violence in the fluff alone would weaken the knees of a soft constitution.
Justin Avery This is true, but there are many blockbuster movies that do very well despite high levels of violence and gore, if it had a good story and was well acted etc. then i see no reason it wouldn't be very popular.
I'd love to see it done believe me. Been a fan since the 80s. At the least a "japanamation" style or like the care given to the animated Helsreach story on youtube. The lore is very deep and has lots of angles/stories you could cover.
40k, Horus Heresy, Rogue Traders, the Titanicus story ( with better ending haha)... etc
@@justinavery8664 It would be a challenge to have an authentic 40k film with any combat that wasn't 3 solid hours of murder-porn.
@@LeadSkillets a bad thing?
I love the idea of this bright-eyed federation soldier, fighting for what he thinks is right, friends in arms, only to come for a Flesh-Tearers Riever squad to come out of no-where, tear his friend and comrades into strips of flesh, blood everywhere, and as he lays there, crying in his own faeces and tears, they just leave him
Let's not forget he might have to watch couple of his friends get eaten in front of him, depending on the Flesh-Tearer's mood that day.
Mikazuchi Yep.
Losing 50 ships and all its crew is only a problem if mankind is not as numerous as it is in 40K. If a species ranges in the hundreds of trillions, individual lives are not going to be that special or valuable. It's the reason why we care about pandas and tigers but not ants.
Spacepilot Pirx that ending statement was a prime example of "it’s funny because it’s true." 😂 and the ants don’t give a shit about ants either!
Tigers and pandas taste better than ants.
The imperium has gotten to a point where human life is the biggest resource they have access to.
Another example of the psychological aspect of the Imperium: The Death Korps of Krieg. Imagine if the Empire or the Federation had to deal with those guys...
Enemy: *starts rolling up with walkers and tanks*
Krieg: "AFFIX BAYONETS!"
@@sev1120 F**k the bayonets, break out the 9-70's.
@@Princess_Celestia_ SHOVEL!?>
Did you guys forget the jem'hadar? Like yeah it's a difficult ground war but the federation's solution is to outsource that to the klingons and those guys have literally made stars super nova to take out enemy systems.
@@stephenjames2159filthy klingon xenos would have long since been exterminated with virus bombs.
A guardsmen although represented in the 40k as weak is only due to them fighting impossibly lethal enemies like tau, chaos space marines, tyranids, necrons and orks but still win against the odds so to fight a less than lethal force like the Empire or federation they should excel
I know the Bolter tends to get all the fame for how insane it is, but lasguns are definitely nothing to sneeze at either.
I know a lot of people call them “flashlights”, but considering lasgun shots are hot enough to flash boil water that’s pretty deadly.
Imagine fighting next to someone and in a sudden eruption is steam and blood, their arm is blown off their shoulder. They then lie there screaming in agony and if they’re very lucky the shot won’t have cauterized the wound so they’ll die of massive blood loss a few seconds later.
@@MrRight-xd4vt yup, a GE stormtrooper is the equivalent of a Kasrkin, nothing more.
SonsOfLorgar If even that. Kasrkin get helguns and they're, as you might expect, ridiculous.
@@rantymcrant-pants9536 yeah, I would considder GE stormtrooper armor to be equivalent to IG carapace and a Kasrkin hellgun equivalent to a GE E-web or other semi-portable automatic blaster.
As for their role, GE stormtroopers are more like Adeptus Arbites enforcers deployed as ad-hoc IoM stormtrooper/IoM Navy boarding parties.
Esp. due to the extreme lack of AFVs and heavy support elements in the GE stormtrooper corps.
I used to run an IG armored regiment on the table-top. Then they were enlightened and defected to follow the TRUE gods as the anvil of my Dark Apostle's irresistible grand host with it's core of 17th legion colchisian veterans.
SonsOfLorgar Your opinions are invalid due to HERESY!!!! BUUUUUURNNNNN IIIIITTTTTT!!!
I feel that the Stormtroopers are getting wrecked by the Kasrkin every time.
Enemies in 40K also make Imperium what it is. You should talk about that too. How would Star Trek & Star Wars would survive against them. Brutal Orks how would they fight against them, enemy that looks for fight and need it. Corrupting Chaos, warp rift opens and people in planet goes insane and start killing each others. Not mentionings demons. Tyranids Hive Fleet what consume entire planets. And Rising Necrons, with weapons that can rip you apart atom by atom.
Those are enemies that Imperium fight against.
Yeah, a lot of these comparisons focus too much on the Imperium and doesn't factor in at all the dangers and enemies that the Imperium faces every single day.
The imperium is literally clinging to life Post heresy there are few to no more crusades of expansion. All the battles and wars are to maintain what they have. I would even say the current time in 40k is looking at the death throws of the imperium of man. The galaxy itself and time conspire against all life in the 40k universe. Look at the timeline this wouldn’t be the first time human civilization had fallen. Heck this isn’t the first civilization that has has been ground into dust. Double heck this wouldn’t be the first time the galaxy was ripped of all major galaxy spanning sentient life forms.
to be honest i believe star wars would do well against orks or tyranids tyranids use telapathy do block out communication which is't a promblem in star wars orks there's jedai's that can toss hole navy fleets in to other solor system
@@venomstar6789 first one is still a problem. If you can't communicate, you can't summon reinforcements to your position. And while there may be Jedi or sith capable of tossing fleets into different solar systems, they would be pretty rare, and it isn't just one Ork fleet, it's a couple dozen or hundred of them.
@@venomstar6789 the problem is Orks and Tyranids are infinate the Orks came out of spores and Tyranids literally surrounded the galaxy by their numbers not to mention they most likely already consumed other galaxy aswell
Half a million troops dead in a battle-
Star Wars: "we cannot afford these losses, Lord Vader".
Halo: "Chief, we need you!".
Star Trek: "Set phasers to kill!"
Imperium of Man: "Oh well that was an old batch anyway."
Imperium : We call that breakfast.
Send in the next wave!
so
I absolutely adore vs matchups, but unfortunately they just usually go "well my side has ____ton starship weapons, checkmate!" "Well my side has _____ertons! And some poor wording+extrapolation means my star destroyers are BEYOND OMNIPOTENT111!1"(I'm not joking google "beyond omnipotent star destroyers some time). But yeah you are on point here, 40k is very different from most universes thematically and that would grate on them as a campaign wore on. I'm not sure if you have looked into other franchises after being in 40k, but what usually strikes me is how....clean, for a lack of the better word, the warfare is. Theres mud sometimes, yeah, and some injuries or maybe a bioweapon, but most of the time its "pew pew" and they fall over. There are high ideals, a story with a happy ending, and rather clear heroes and villains. Sometimes they try to make it grey but really that just makes things dumb or makes nuanced villains they call "ambiguous morally". At the end of the day most, if not all the heroes go home and they do eventually win. Its not like that in 40k, you aren't a hero, your one of quintilions even if you are a big name like The Stormlord or The Despoiler or Creed and so to win a battle you don't seek out a villain and have a climactic showdown that leaves the world cheering and the enemy surrendered/convinced with no one of import dying. You don't walk in and out of the war, with a life and friends and downtime and moments of respite. You don't get that clean battle. Instead you bleed in the organ splattered mud, because your friends are dead. You commit high tempo operations, not sleeping more than 3 hours and always on the move because either you don't have orbital superiority and will be pounded flat by ships if you don't keep moving or when you do rest the enemy knows somehow, they always do, and your comrades are butchered in their sleep. So you sit awake in the rain at a fresh 1 o clock in the morning, trying to figure out if that is a bush waving in the wind or a callidus/lictor/sorcerer/necron/stealthsuit/etc fucking with you. And then the call to moveout comes at 4 am with a fresh batch of corpsestarch that maybe you knew the name of, and you keep you head low in you transport as artillery flattens whatever the ships haven't. Then you get your climactic battle. Maybe in a city, running low on rations, holding out for months in the hopes that command will send someone to save you. They never do, and you fight with you broken bones and empty ammo casings on a belly of wallpaper and boiled wood in the home of some poor civy who starved 6 weeks ago because you and your comrades might be willing to die for the emperor, but not starve for the civies and thus their shares of the food were "appropriated". Or maybe you fight in the dark, dank places beneath the soil, hearing one squad go dark after another, not knowing, not wanting to know what hunts you. Or maybe you get that full IMAX 3D movie experience and fight in a pitched battle in no mans land, with your comrades dieing in their millions wherever you look and the commissar is dead because he tried to be a hero and rally the troops and got a snipers bullet for his troubles. So you fight in the mud, and the dirt, and the corpses of your comrades and maybe, just maybe, you live. So with your broken body and shattered mind you slink back to the ship you were deployed from and sit in one of many empty bunks and get to think about all you saw, and did, and those that didn't get back as the ship lurches off to take you to your next fight that you might, might, just survive. And that is what it means to be in 40k. You don't get your happy ending, just and unending slog until you die. You don't hunt criminals and monsters, you ARE the criminal and a monster, though it may take a while for you to understand this. No matter how high you are, the galaxy does its best to drag you down and from the mightiest necron to the lowest cultist you all fight and die in the same mud so that you dream can persist just a little longer. Maybe you were even lucky enough to be born into the big boy trio and have a shot at actually winning it, but you'll either die long before its achieved or you'll be a necron and perhaps wish you did. Either way, you are in for the constant stream of loss, warcrimes, and mud slogs no matter your rank or race, with no home to go back to, either because you are in the guard for life, because its a cloud of expanding debris, or because it too is filled with war. The 40k galaxy itself is the horror show, to all factions (except orks of course), and it would BREAK anyone who faced it. Because at the end of the day even storm troopers plan to go home. They have lives. They have families. They have hopes and dreams. They can think of something better and maybe even retire. No one in 40k can do that. Lets just look at the guardsman. They are told they are worth nothing, believe dieing for the emperor is their lot in life, and are shot for things as minor as uniform violations. They don't fight in the clean walkways of star destroyers or the metropolis of courascant, they fight in broken cities on piles of the corpses of children who lived their against enemies who want their bodies, minds, and souls. The grim, unending nature of 40k, its intrensic cruelty, would break most factions. The stormtroopers and rebels would pale at the sheer disreguard shown for the lives of combatants and at how easily they are spent. The UNSC and covanent would be horrified by the sheer, intrinsic malice ingrained into every aspect of the universe, even humans who say so gleefully: "Hate! Hate! Hate!
An emotion as pure as it is deep! Hate! Hate! Hate! Let it flow, let it run free!" (inspiring prayer that). And the Federation could be present to weep over the injustice, the oppression, and the corpses of the million billion children fed into cadian whiteshield regiments to keep the arch enemy at bay. Because 40k is an eternal nightmare they would find, and there is no waking up.
Gloriously well framed.
Your eloquence and attention to each excessively gory detail will certainly grant you the personal attention of a Keeper of secrets. Perhaps even the graceful Zarakynel or the master of excess theirself!
Praise be the pantheon of *TRUTH*
This is a very good description
Well said, eloquently framed.
If I may add to that, aside from warfare, imagine any other sci-fi universe stumbling upon a hive city, and trying to live there. Anywhere in the the hive, from the palace of the governor down to the underhive. The callous disregard of life and criminal negligence of the lack of the most basic amenities of life would break most citizens of any other universe long before any actual combat would. And that would be before coming into contact with the law in a hive. On another, more horrifying note, you also have things like the NightLords who casually crucify the inhabitants of entire cities as part of their strategy. Imagine the reaction of Stormtroopers or Redshirts having to fight the force that did something like that.
No offence, I felt compelled to add my two cents to your excellent argument.
Panos Kalaigidis Its good of course, and I hank you for your contribution. i just didn't want to get into things because If I got into every nitty grity horror in 40k (or even 1 in 100 of them) the comment would contain more words than the entirety of the encyclopedia Britannica series. But just to summarize as I said before, the universe is just to much of a depressing slog through a horrifying rendition of what might yet be. It would destroy the morale of any force that invaded it just by exposure, nevermind by the actions of its inhabitants.
Nemesor Xanxas Agreed 100%.
There's a line in the Imperial Guard codex that says more or less with regards to friendly fire from artillery: "while the loss of life is regrettable, the misspent ammunition is inexcusable" The Imperium's cheapest commodity in war are the lives of their soldiers. They will gladly sacrifice millions for essentially worthless ground, so long as it's ground taken from the enemy... and they'll lose the same number tenfold before relinquishing said ground. It's attrition pure and simple. With a million worlds or more each giving up a tithe of soldiers each year there is no end to the onslaught.
Once the Imperium is goaded into war somewhere it's a never ending, perpetually escalating war until victory is bought through application of brute force, and that's without any mention to special regiments, marines or titans.
Numbers. They have more.
With the scale of the Imperium they probably repopulate faster than you can kill em xD
@@baron_222 For every one of them that falls, 10 more takes his place.
I love these discussions!
The big difference between the Imperium vs most other factions from other franchises is a matter of scale. It's not unreasonable to imagine an empire that spans the galaxy and utilizes over a million worlds, their local resources and population. Raw numbers of the Imperium will outstrip by an insane margin any numbers put forward by any faction from Star Trek, Star Wars, Halo, etc. In the BattleFleet Gothic rulebook it talks about how a FERAL world was able to slowly build a Lunar class attack cruiser as a tithe to the Navy. That is a 3km long warship... and a virtually tech-less world was just sourced for the materials and the Imperial forces in orbit built the thing. If the lowest tech level worlds of the Imperium can crank that out, and there's over a million of planets in total.... Almost everything is a footnote by comparison.
The Federation: ~ 150 worlds
Halo Covenant: ~ "Hundreds of worlds" per Halo Alpha
Halo Humans: ~ over 800 colonized worlds, moons, asteroids and outposts
The Galactic Empire in all fairness at it's height was listed as having 1.5 million worlds under its banner. With that in mind, they did use their military to maintain order with the majority of those worlds being non-core worlds and tacitly under the banner of the Empire. Once again though, as Kirioth has pointed out before, the scale of 40k is still insane.
Largest standard warship in the GE: Imperial Star Destroyer. 1.6km length. Fighter compliment of around 72 TIE line fighters including 12x Bombers, 12x Interceptors, and the remainder being Fighters
Largest and most common standard warship in the IoM: Lunar class cruiser. ~3km in length. No fighters, but packs 6x torpedo tubes that launch missiles the size of buildings. Macro batteries and Lances in the broadsides. Multiple overlapping point defense weapons.
Add to that all the points in this video. The Imperium is 100% geared towards a war led by zealotry and founded on the utter devaluing of human life beyond the function they can serve in the war effort. The Imperium doesn't fall to paltry rebellions, it just burns whole worlds without a huge resource sink like the Death Star as a giant target.
Not gonna lie, read it as "honour of the imperium". Seems fitting
Works both ways. The Imperium is a target for Orks, Traitor Marines, Tau, Necrons, Tyranids or Daemons. These are the horrors that harass the Imperium's citizens, soldiers and Space Marines.
As op as Astartes are compared to Star Wars and star trek
Astertes can and do get one shotted on their own universe , WH40k is a utterly huge mess of opness and shenanigans
@@Schinak they can tho and i do believe they have, full charge laz blast in the eye will kill them and can eventually penetrate weak points like joints, as once said: no astartes can match a wall of a trillion lazguns
@@Schinak lascannon by a heavy weapons team in an infantry squad :P
@@Schinak guardsmen outnumber space marines by a big big number, it's basically 2 soldiers to kill the space marine.
@@Schinak 2 guardsmen and a lascannon can kill a marine, I don't say they will, I say they can.
Guardsmen are not dumb, they know about ambushes and such.
The Lascannon alone is worth 10 times that of a single guardsman. Plus, if you're using a Lascannon to fire at a single marine and not the predator tank rolling besides him, you deserve that bolt to the face.
One of my favorite little vignettes from 40k was from the Last Chancers series. It involved an Fleet Admiral talking to an Imperial Guard General. The Admiral was reporting how wasteful loosing millions of guardsmen was to take a mountain that was hollowed out into a fortress, and he offered to use his fleet to level the mountain from orbit, but the General wouldn't do it because as long has the fortress stood, his regiment couldn't be deployed off world, even though it was currently held by rebels, because of the regiments privileged position as a ceremonial guard to the planet. Then the Admiral shrugged and said, "Well, that is your stupidity, and not my responsibility." , and just let the futile killing go on. 40k in a nutshell.
The mentality of the Imperium is something else. In the First Ork war of Armageddon, the civilians of the hives were given numbers then those who numbers were called got to have a seat on one of the very few transports leaving system. Those who were not lucky enough to get a seat had their numbers turned into their Imperial Guard Conscript number and were inducted into the Hive defence forces. Be they man woman or child. Everyone pulled their weight.
There was also a tactic where they put explosives in hive hab blocks then defended them. Once the green skins butchered them all a single person at the top locked in a fortified room would be sitting with a shrine to the Emperor and the detonator to blow the whole damned block apart killing all the green skins inside. And this became doctrine.
An ATAT would be a pet dog to an emperor class titan.
More like a pet cat
JHONNO il meme perduto lolol I actually immediately thought of a Yorkie or chihuahua. 🤣 scale and uselessness would be about right.
Cuz remember, cats are actually amazing predators. Atats are fucking silly.
@@kungfuskull when a domestic animal is more more useful than an house size warmachine *LOLOLOLXDXD*
A mouse.
There’s a quote from Han Solo in A New Hope, immediately after they get to Alderaan, or at least where Alderaan used to be. It goes something like “There’s no way they could have destroyed it, it would have taken the firepower from every star destroyer in the entire navy.” Contrast that with how often the inquisition conducts exterminatus.
I now have the image in my head of a Klingon running up to an Ultramarine, and wacking him with his bat'leth several times until it breaks, and the Ultramarine nonchalantly turning said Klingon into liquid with his Power Fist.
That but with a Blood Raven with a bag of "Reclaimed Relics" slung over his shoulder
John Stark the blood raven ‘recovered’ the Bat’leth or the ‘sword of Xenos plight’ a sword made by the 7th company blood raven captain. Based on Xeno origins and meant to kill a specific and forgotten alien race
(This is fake
I would like to see a comparison of how the Federation or Empire would fare against Chaos or Orks. Now THAT, would be a good discussion 😂 or how psykers would compare between them (jedi/sith in case of SW). Give us a video on that Kirioth 😉
Psykers are not like the force wielders at all. I dont believe it would be any fairer than comparing space marines to master cheif, or the god emperor to jesus.
The horror of the Imperium can be summed by the great Gabriel Angelos:
"I fear no evil, for I am fear incarnate!"
Empire loses 100 thousand troops:
"This is a great disaster"
The guard lose 3 million troops:
"Seventh wave fix bayonets! We'll give them the Emperor's steel!"
Radio silence when ICoG loses 100million planets
I dont have to watch this vid to know warhammer would win hands down. Comparing these three is like comparing Disneyland and Disney World to World War 2.
in 40k the good guys seem much more terrifying and evil than the evil empire in star wars
Star Wars Fans: we have a Death Star
40k Fan: we have a glass ball
HH readers know what I’m talking about
"godemperor": *laughs with primarch children as one redirects the deathstar beam with a warp*
It's super crazy of how it can be, also if you wish to add the other thing from TFA then its probably gonna be a hilariously show of primarchs are some interesting terrifying powerful beings.
I mean 5 terminators with lightning claws or thunder hammers and shields teleporting like an inch infront of you shruging of canonballs and everything els you might have and then walk/charge you most be the stuff of nightmare for most other universes. In 40k we call it monday. And think of the horror of faceing night lords. They are even worse then ”normal” marines!
And just the air displacement of the teleportation itself would blow out the windows of any SW ship bridge
SonsOfLorgar yep. And Imperium space forces (Militarum and Astartes) are actual SPACE forces and remember to wear helmets and be sealed up and insulated. 🙄
Not to mention the World Eaters or the Emperor's Children...
In any other universe, the Emperor of Mankind would be seen as a full-blown, world-ending super villain. But in the 41st Millenium, he is exactly what was needed most.
he would be nothing to the q
@@johnymustacio We're honestly not sure of that. The q's military and capabilities are not very detailed and it was only after they subjugated the humans that they were able to turn them into the all-tomorrows. The Emperor and his primarchs, and even the 30k Astartes were absolutely nuts power-wise, and their tech contained many dark age of technology weapons as well.
As a certain meme poster goes, star trek is the ideal world we want as a kid, 40k is the world we know is most likely to actually come true based on our history.
Mitch Verr,
Not really, Star Trek, may not be the most plausible idea for the future, but War Hammer 40k, has things like actual literal demons, psychic powers, and not to mention a guy who started a Galactic wide empire that had been around since the dawn of human civilization, yet somehow went unnoticed. No medical scientist even bothered to asked him if they could study him to determine how he lived so long. Its also hard to believe that something didn't kill the "Emperor of Mankind" long long before he rose to power. Even if you won't die of old age, its hard to believe that nothing else would kill you before your ten thousandth birthday. Also in Imperium has done things that in real life would probably make it too stupid to exist as long as it has in the 40k universe. You can make the case that the Imperium among other things is largely anti technological progress, and doesn't even understand how much of the technology they do have works. That would be a pretty big weakness in real life, if your survival depended on fighting endless wars.
mitch verr yeah, when I saw that meme it was a "....shit, that’s too true." Moment.
GargamelGold you... utterly missed the point of both the meme and this video, and, well, 40k? 40k is Nihilistic philosophy. In brief: humans will still be human. Brutal, hateful, fearful, awful creatures. We’ve seen this for all recorded history. The POINT of 40k’s grimdark is "that isnt going to change. Technology may improve, (and incidentally, tech basically ALWAYS surpasses even the wildest expectations) but people will still be people. And people suck."
Or to use a real quote: "no, people don’t change. Times: they do."
Not to mention that boarding a ship in 40k is absolutely bonkers. You thought those chainsaw wielding motherfuckers were scary on an open battlefield? Try fighting them in the narrow hallways of your standard sci-fi ship.
Look at the seige of Vraks for a great example. 10 years was the initial estimate for the seige. The Galactic empire only lasted for about 20 years.
In the Star Trek TNG episode "Yesterday's Enterprise", an alternate timeline was created when the Enterprise-C was pulled into the future, rather than suffer its destruction saving a Klingon outpost. In this new timeline, the Federation had been at war 20 years and was nearing defeat and was planning to surrender to the Klingon Empire within 6 months.
StarWars seemed like it might be capable of putting up a stiffer fight with thousands of planets in the Republic/Empire, but their fractured Senate and demands for democracy and representation would undermine any military effort. Also, the Rebellion lasted for just 22 years until Vader killed the Emperor and the second Death Star was destroyed.
Meanwhile, the Imperium of Man is held together by a religious zeal forced on the common Imperial citizen and soldiers. Commissars, you gotta love them, or they'll shoot you on charges of cowardice. Even the Space Marines (who do not to worship the Emperor as a God) still venerate him as the Immortal-Emperor of Mankind.
If you ever get a chance, read World War Z. In Chapter 2: Blame, General Travis D'Ambrosia explains that under totalitarian governments, popular support is mandated and wars can be maintained without any risk of political repercussions. In democracies, the opposite is true and war efforts rely on popular support from the people. "Public support must be husbanded as a finite national resource." The Federation, the Galactic Empire and Republic all relied on popular support. The Imperium of Man couldn't care less if the people want to support them. Their support is mandated by Imperial Law and enforced whether or not they're happy.
DarkLight523,
In real life through, even dictatorships can be broken, and they do require support and at least some of it has to be willing support, otherwise they would not have anyone willing to murder anyone who wasn't willing to go along. Its one of the reasons why totalitarian governments censor everything that isn't state approved propaganda. Religious Zeal can also be lost. Europe eventually gave up trying to win the Crusades.
WWZ? Good book, reads nicely. Shame about the movie. I hate Hollywood.
@@GargamelGold I agree, that Europe gave up on the Crusades, but the Muslim nations of the Middle East maintained their religious zeal to this day. The Muttawa is the official state police in many Islamic nations who regularly beat women for not being properly dressed, for not being accompanied by male members of their own family, for trying to drive cars, for being alive, really. So while religious zeal can be lost, the zeal in the Islamic states has held for over 1000 years.
DarkLight523,
Its actually not that simple. Iran for example was at least somewhat democratic for a short period of time, before the US installed the Shah, who was than overthrown, and the country become an "Islamic republic." The most infamous theocracy in the Middle East, Saudi Arabia, also hasn't existed for centuries. It only came into existence in the Early twentieth century. Before that, the Islamic world was dominated by the much more moderate Ottoman Empire. Also even the most fanatical Islamic state doesn't seem willing, or eager to actually invade countries like the US, or France. In addition Saudi Arabia recently gave into international pressure and allowed women to vote and drive for the first time. Its far from enough, but it is progress.
Also speaking of empires who's people gave up their religious zeal, Japan during WW2 had soldiers who were utterly fanatical, would rather die than surrender ( even through of course some of them did in fact surrender ) and people over there literally believed their emperor was literally a God. However, the war quickly came to a close after two atomic bombs were dropped.
Palpatine Empire fall ONLY because of tons of plot armor, PIS and...because they were EVIL.
If Imperium from War40k were evil...they would fall in that same way in...similar time.
I remember reading somewhere that the whole thing about armies and unit's claiming worlds through right of conquest was created by the adminstratum to explain how they just forget/loose entire armies. Leaving them permanently stranded on random world, I have a hard time seeing any other Scifi universe just loosing a four million man army or hell even an army that's only a few hundred thousand strong because of a clerical error....
Alright colonel the adminstratum said there's not enough ships left to transport you all. Just stay here, more ships will come and take you to the next world. 1000 years later........
The concept of loosing an entire army sounds hilarious.
Just imagine the conversation when someone notices that entire guard regiment is just not there.
Most other sci-fi civilizations actually have the admininstrative capacity to properly govern their holdings.
For all the territory and population it nominally controls, the Imperium is so hindered by a bloated, inefficient beaurocracy and infighting among its various internal factions that the Emperor's transhuman demigod son created with beaurocratic talent as his Primarch power can't get get the Imperium moving in the same direction in the face of a literal galaxy threatening crisis.
Whenever you're imagining any versus debate that involves the Imperium actually being able to leverage its resources against an opponent, you aren't imagining the Imperium in that debate at all.
Also at the fall of Cadia it’s said that like 10% of the Astra Militarum was lost , those are casualties that are ESAY on the Trillions maybe a quadrillion in casualties , and it was labeled as a glorious victory at the end of the 13th Black crusade
So there is that yes ...
THE PLANET BROKE BEFORE THE GUARD DID!!!!!
In a ground war nothing touches the Imperium.
Just Imagine the Flesh tearer's Chapter on Coruscant... Empire got no chance
Imagine first captain Sevatar or even Konrad himself plus a small bodyguard on Coruscant... ;)
All I hear is the screams as the death company is unleashed and a malicious smile crosses my face.
Thousands of Coruscant spaceships will gun-down them.
Plus planet has VERY STRONG shields...many of them.
Do not count the defense instalations...
Deploy a few squads of marines on the death star to deal with the stormtroopers stationed there, a couple of grey knights with a space marine each behind them. The grey knights with their two marines head up to the throne room. The two knights deal with palpatine and vader (if he's there) while the two marines accompanying them gun down palpatine's guards. Meanwhile the other squads cut through the death star's personnel like butter and within a couple of hours it's theirs. It probably wouldn't even take a whole company to capture the DS with 2 or 3 grey knights.
Either that or destroy it. A farm boy did it so the imperium can capture the plans and do the same. That's their main weapon gone. Leaderless, the empire becomes scattered like they were after ROTJ and the imperium mop them up.
*Lion El Jonson*
And you think Death Star will just wait for them?
Superlaser one-shot battlebarge...do not mind 15 000 turbolasers.
P.S. How something that heavy as terminator or grey knight can be lift by elevator:
ua-cam.com/video/FdsXggne6sA/v-deo.html
"Cadia broke before the guard did."
It's basically like comparing a full scale NATO mobilisation to a paintball league
I would say this is why sooooo many of the armies in 40K are as crazy as they are. The war hungry Orks, mindless robots Necron, mindless Killing machines Tyranids, total Psychos Chaos, sadistic monsters Dark Eldar. TAU AND craft World Eldar are the 2 real stand outs they are just trying to andvance themselves/ survive.
And thats why space goatmen and space elves are dumb and stupid and dumb
ERE WE GO ERE WE GO ERE WE GO WAAAAAAAAAAAAGH!
Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaagh💪
Imagine if orks actually looted death star.
somewhere there is a fanfic of orks v star wars empire in an orbital engagement. the imperial radio was jammed by the orks. not deliberately, but simply filled with ork warcries, trash talking and a lot of giggling.
can you show me the link
when the situation is so bad that the commissioner starts shooting at the enemies
I wanna see a movie of Night Lords fighting Empire or any SW faction really
Praise be to the Primarch, let it be so!!
Dominus Nox
That’s just cruel and unusual
@@henrymilner7061 exactly how Konrad wants it XD
@@SonsOfLorgar good point
You're forgetting it's a GRIMDARK universe on a scale that literally dwarfs every other sci fi universe, filled with so many factions that are simply bigger, faster, scarier, and MORE OP than even a Space Marine. 1,000,000 dead troops may sound like a lot in star wars but in 40k that's merely a drop in an ocean.
God, I love 40k.
Hear, hear. If I could pick a universe to live in I'd pick 40K anyday. Don't care that I'd probably be dead before my first day in the 40K universe comes to an end. For the Emperor!
Halo
No God here, only the Emperor
Reading the accounts of the Siege of Vraks really shows how little the imperium cares about lives lost. Exactly what you describe. 5 million troops? Eh, that was what we estimated we'd loose at this point.
"If you will not serve in combat, you will serve in the firing line! " Every IG Commissar ever.
"you will serve on the front, on the firing line, or out of this can. Is that understood, soldier!" -commissar, encouraging their troops after their breakfast of recaf and corpse starch
You were only slightly off target, the imperium would be upset about losing the ships they couldn’t be bothered about the personnel.
On a hot and sun kissed planet, on the frontiers of civilized space, we came. Strange sightings have set ablaze the whole galaxy, paranoid nations finding burnt hulks of their patrols with occasional fields of large Gothic statues or architecture floating in the vastness of the void. We are the 322nd rear-guard deployed far away from the lush agri worlds many of us came from, the kiss of such heat being totally unknown to us simple farm boys. Rumors of a large green ship gave the federation cause to quietly raise troops to defend a host of planets closest and most valuable to the most recent set of sightings. Everyone had a different idea of whats been skulking around, first rumors of Klingons arise from their infamy, due to a sudden quiet as of late upon the nature of these sightings. Rumors consistently coming from traders or others passing through of planets set ablaze, or of stations being brutalized if it didn't end up a graveyard with not a soul aboard. The galaxy was mystified and terrified at the displays of carnage, The Borg where considered as a potential threat, yet when did Borg create Art? When did the collective ever act with such brutality and when have they ever had such resources for such a massive scale? Upon the wind picking up I started to smell a something burned and sickly-sweet from the east where the horizon met the sun, I thought myself mad but others started to notice similarly. There was a sound of rolling thunder, and the smell of charred flesh upon the wind. Far to the horizon we beheld an ocean that formed and began pooling towards us. Colors of sickly green, blood red, proud gold and bone white. Such colors indicated not water, but life. Such sounds where thought of as vehicles mere engines. We where being attacked! With orders going out quickly, men prepared mounted weapons and sandbags, quickly counting rounds and grenades, when our collective vision gazed upon our quarry someone spoke up. "Those... Those are Men!" "Wh-WHAT?" an officer quickly swiped the rangefinder from a gawking soldier and inspected the ever-growing tide. And so his eyes did behold visions of men marching, not driving, narry a vehicle could be seen within the ranks of men, least near the start of the march, and that noise as it drew closer it sounded less and less like thunderous engines or the roar of a great machines of War. Nay that was the men marching in step. Voices could be made out when the waves of men got close enough for all to behold their foe, orders where being give, soldiers threatened with being burned alive if they look like they where going to run. And on this day I beheld The God Emperors Finest.
Can you please make more stories like this.
I recomend making this into a series where it's just these journal entries of soilders in different universes fighting the Empierium.
Blood Ravens Battle Brother
*happy comisar noises*
*BLAM*
That's just the local pdf...
@@agrowthnerd Damn PDF toy soldier knock offs, wait till the Guard rolls up with a battalion of Baneblades and a Deathstrike missile platform, or worse, the Mechanicum and their horrors of flesh and metal.
William Wallace their are a few things off lore wise
i agreem psychological warfare from the imperium of man doesnt really get talked about alot, especially since in the 40k universe there are MUCH WORSE Things than even the imperium that do stuff like that on another level, however, that doesnt meant that the imerium arent pros themselves, they just have a diffrent standard in 40k for that stuff that makes it seem less... "bad" when isolated
despite better technology the star trek federation would probably go PTSD by simply winning again the Imperial guards. it was a big deal for them against the Jem hadddar and boy are they far softer than the imperium...
I would argue that Star Trek is on average less technologically advanced. I’m terms of ship interstellar speed they are a bit better and it is safer and that is basically it. Also teleporters and the magical create everything machines.
In everything else 40k is higher tech. A phaser can maybe burn to your inner organs without armor the lasgun generally is able to greats at least fist sized holes. Against Infantry armor.
Star Trek ships are a few hundred meters long and fight a few hundred meters away from each other. 40k warships are atleast a kilometer long, often much longer and are engaging over hundreds of kilometers. Most likely multiple AU away.
when the Empire intrudes into the 40k verse. i could see them barely surviving an engagement with the Imperium, so the next order of business for the GE is to make an ally or subjugate one. i see them doing this with that tau. I could imagine Palpatine would make a pact with the tau and then screw them over and take over their economical and technological standing in the 40k verse, which isnt much tbh but it's more or less a good start. :)
Btw Kirioth you make it sound like the Flesh Tearers are doing something wrong lol
Wrong is relative....
#Horusdidnothingwrong
@@SonsOfLorgar Filthy fucking heretic.
When the God-Emperor is our Eternal Lord and Imperial Father Who has your soul in His sacred charge, is it so surprising that tens of millions would gladly lay down their lives? All those who fight under His banner only seek to safeguard and expand His Imperium. We all understand that a single human life is as naught compared to the Great Work of our Lord Father.
The Emperor's Light is in our eyes. The Emperor's Truth is on our lips. The Emperor's Fury rages within our hearts. Our Sovereign and Eternal Lord Emperor Protects!
Imagine a Galaxy-Class being boarded by a squad OF Carcharodons
Omnomnom?
Welp at least the ship will get a brand new red Coat of paint for free
for those that don't know
"Space Sharks" - vicious as hell.
Random survivor one hour later: "why did they take the time to paint the walls red? And why is the floor still sticky?" *Sees Tyberos stood over the boots of the ship's captain, and immediately begs for mercy, realising the walls are painted not with any normal red, but with the captain themself*
Well....even the Battle Droids of Star Wars have morale that can be compromised (for some reason.)
Because the last time they had a hive mind, the central control computer got blown up by a child who knew how to spin.
Also, supposedly, a lot of tech (such as droids) in Star Wars was based off of the tech of some other advanced precursor-esque race and isn't completely understood. Take that with a grain of salt, since I got that it from a Star Wars lore video (I think it was by Geetsly's, but it might have been someone else).
Id send the angels of death into the Startrek universe as they just could not deal with the horror of that type of war.
I'd drown the star wars universe in guardsmen and ADmech.
They empire seems at best a ineffective governance that 'somehow' is in charge.
The imperium would grind it down and then start on the xenos.
Treck are even smalled than Tau.
Single splinter of Nids fleet would destroy them all...
Even Thrawn would be shocked of how The Imperium fights with such ferocity and zealousness.
Stormtrooper commander: “Get the injured to the back, retreat!!”
Any Commissar: “YOUR WOUNDS MEANS NOTHING, STAND!!!”
I mean bionics and prosthetics are ubiquitous in 40k. If you survived with a missing leg, chances are it'd be replaced before you got back to the ship you deployed from.
Plus, there's a few heroes who every guardsman knows, mostly the famous commissars. The two big ones are Cain (hero of the imperium) and Yarrick (the hero of armageddon, holding off three separate ork invasions). Many commissars, and even non-commissar officers, try to follow their example after all. And I mean, look at them. You have the universe's most chiselled jawline that would make Lion El'johnson kneel and offer the crown if "universe's biggest chad" (in Cain), and you have an old bastard commissar who was a legend amongst the orks, and just refused to die
I mean the simple fact is this: Star Trek is first and foremost about an exploratory crew on an adventure, not war. Star Wars, despite the name, is first and foremost about the adventures of a core group and they save the day, not a war. Halo, though about a war generally, is more about one man’s incredible role in that war and basically soloing. All these require that there is ONE group or person so amazing that they can solve nearly all the problems in their galaxy. Warhammer IS war. On every level there is no one man, army, ship, crew, or even race that can save the day or even be the singular spearhead. Warhammer’s battle front is in constant flux, a constant arms race, to gain a small advantage they never really holds. Even looking at gods there’s no ONE that can really be called an end all beat all character. No ONE can win it all. Someone may be central to a single front but they’d never be enough to win a whole war. TLDR the guard codex sums it up best when they say ‘the imperium gains and loses hundreds of worlds a day’. No ONE front or campaign makes a huge difference while in all these other scifi realms ONE battlefield on ONE world can end a galactic war. The guard lost Cadia and they’re Still a pain in the ass.
Man, I really love your content. I laughed out loud several times during this video. And no matter what you talk about, no matter how rambly it gets, I always stick around for the "toodaloo" part. And I always find myself saying it out loud. I love it^^
It's a shame that rules wise Commissars got demolished by the nerf bat
Please talk about this stuff more! It’s morbidly Fascinating to listen to
To when it comes to ground combat, none of the star trek forces dedicate too many people to infantry and have very little armour.
Every ounce is accounted for on their ships.
A few thousand ground troops is devastating to them.
One imperial regiment on the ground would wipe out all on comers.
Imagine an Imperitor Titan. The Federation would ONLY be able to engage it from orbit. Can you imagine their reaction to one just being deployed?
Gob-smacked faces, people going ghost-white and sweating buckets with fear.
too bad that star trek blaster beam can penetrate Emperor ass inside out...
@@bruvamichal7437 assuming the person holding the blaster isn't mind-read and psychically mind wiped or killed before they get a chance to try...
Dude the emperor of mankind is a perpetual AKA the dude is literally immortal due to his insanely OP psychic power ..... Shooting his head off with a blaster beam will only result in his head regenerating while he simultaneously proceeds to rend the attackers mind asunder leaving them as gibbering vegetables asuming he is feeling generous that particular day.
@@Phenixtri I'm just thinking of TTS Emperor getting uber annoyed and deleting the idiot who shot him
Love these videos - as an idea, would be super fun to see you and lore youtubers from other universes discuss the topic from each side. Someone from star wars, etc..
This was a great video. Well done!
Hey, what about that legion of space marines that were literally terror weapons? I hear they always came in midnight clade...
the 8 legeion the night lords are there names
It's not just the battles that are extreme. The whole galaxy is filled with body-horror concepts - even how you make a space marine is brutal and cruel, the Dark Eldar are utterly gruesome and don't think of looking up the daemonculabae if you're squeamish. 40k always wins because it's prepared to go further.
That was an utterly fascinating video and I'll tend to agree with your conclusions 🙂
A very extremely awesome video as always KiriothTV.
I can just see an Astartes literally ripping a Klingon in half
Astartes killing an ordinary person, what a feat.
Erich von Jingoism well, Klingons are supposed to be the most metal and hardcore dudes in startrek. And yes it would be great.
Erich von Jingoism and @TheDeceptiveMoss yeah, klingons actually have a lot of the genetic perks of astartes: redundant organs and extra bones and higher gravity planet evolution etc, but are still nowhere near as OP as Astartes
I always see people in sci fi forums talking about the culture and time war time lords/daleks being on the highest tier and capable of destroying everything but nobody ever mentions what I'm about to mention now.
the orks have a gift, if a large enough number of them all think the same thing then that thing will happen. In that case, can't the orks just simply all believe that the time lords and daleks are no threat and/or say that a potato can destroy their entire armies?
The orks can believe in anything and it will happen but they are never placed on any tier list. People always talk about technology in particular and think that just because time lords can time travel they can destroy anything. If the orks wanted to time travel, they could. If they wanted to completely wipe out the time lords and daleks empire they could... not with super weapons or time travel, just by believing in it.
And as for AI controlled culture ships that can apparently end engagements in milliseconds, they have no power within the warp and again, the orks can just simply believe that gork and mork will wipe out their ships and they're done.
There's a lot more to 40k than tyranids and the imperium.
I am a bet late but i want to say that the time lords has shields that protect them from reality warping and has a prison that holds the actual embodiment of time, and literal multiversal gods will think twice before attacking the time lords
In the Imperium, litterally drowning a planet in the blood of your soldiers is a legitimate strategy.
Taking what you said and ignoring the difference in scale between universes, the Imperium would very likely still win a war with the Empire or the Federation.
Speaking of morale, the Klingon Empire is highly conflict-oriented though not to the extent of the Imperium, in the case of ground assault and close combat while they couldn't hold a candle to Space Marines, they revel in fighting impossible odds and would welcome such a ridiculous challenge. My thoughts on that subject anyway, feel free to disagree.
Sounds about right up until they go against dark eldar or night lords
So... They're Orks?
Let's be honest, the only matchup we really wanna see is Johnny Rico becoming a space marine and killing bugs.
The Death Korps of Krieg never runs! But it tends to outzeal its commisars 😃
Also would want to see the face of a Star Trek Captain when he sees the body of one of his men explode right in front of him by Bolterfire
This reminds me of a debate I had with a mate who was taking the position that a Thousand Son Exulted sorcerer could just enter a Imperial Star Destroyer and mindmurderfuck all the crew to death in seconds. But just thing of being a storm trooper walking round the ship and just seeing your friend being elevated in the air screaming having limbs growing out of every part of his body, his spine becoming his new 18th limb and just turning into a sack of flesh that then just rips your other mate in half effortlessly.
Great video. The sheer insanity of the way the imperial guard operate would be demoralizing to any foe in these verses. Excluding the Mandalorians/Jedi/Borg/Klingons