MOST DEADLY: German War Trains WW2 - Forgotten History
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- Опубліковано 6 сер 2024
- During WW II the Allies were in the process of planning their strategic target prioritization. During the Casablanca Conference in January 1943, they devised what became known as the Pointblank Directive. This placed all primary targets in German occupied Europe according to priority, such as aircraft industry, shipbuilding ports, U-boat pens, petroleum, and rail networks including marshalling yards. Trains were a primary target, as they moved materiel and troops and were given priority for tactical fighter bombing and strafing. But Germany had a plan to combat the allies and protect their trains. Written and Hosted by Colin D. Heaton. Forgotten History is a 10th Legion Pictures Production.
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About us: Host/Military Historian/Film Consultant/US Army and USMC Veteran - Colin Heaton
www.heatonlewisbooks.com
Screenwriter/Director/Producer/US Marine Corps Veteran - Michael Droberg
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-COPYRIGHT DISCLAIMER UNDER SECTION 107 OF THE COPYRIGHT ACT 1976
- Copyright Disclaimer Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976,
allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing. #forgottenhistorychannel
Sources:
Colin Heaton and Anne Marie Lewis, The German Aces Speak. Minneapolis, MN: Zenith Press, 2011, p. 209. Falck interview.
Interviews with Wolfgang Falck, Josef Kammhuber, Curtis E. LeMay.
Colin Heaton, Night Fighters, Annapolis, MD, Naval Institute Press, 2008.
U.S. War Department publication Tactical and Technical Trends.
Interviews with Hans-Joachim Jabs.
My father was on B-24s with the 8th. He told me a story of their return from a bombing run over Germany. They had known anti-aircraft concentrations mapped and would avoid those areas. On this mission, the Germans pulled in a flak train on them and really had them zero'd in. He said that was the one mission where he really thought they weren't going to get back. They got shot up really bad, and the reason they got back was 10 young men working together to keep that airplane in the air. The airplane went to salvage after they limped it home. This story was typical of the Greatest Generation
Makes you respect James Stewart even more as he flew multiple missions with bombers over these kinds of skies.
Yes, Major James Stewart had to jump through many hoops in order to serve his country. One of them was his height. He flew combat missions over Europe. I believe he mainly flew in the B-24 but I could be mistaken. He was quite a man and despite his valor never drew attention to himself. We could use more of his character in our leadership positions today. He is missed.
He flew 22 missions
Vertigo.
I didn't know about some of those trains. I can only imagine the nerves of steel it took to attack a train where every car had anti aircraft guns. Thank you Forgotten History. You're the man Dr Heaton!
Both of my grandfather's were in WW2. One took 5 slugs on Omaha Beach and lived. The other was a pilot. First he had a P-40 and then a P-51 Mustang. He told me he loved straiffing trains. He refused to shoot men in parachutes also. He said there was no honor in it. He took out dozens of trains and miles of tracks. He also shot down a jet by going into a freefall and catching it. He was a good man who really cared for his fellow pilots. One is still alive and we're pen pals. PLEASE do a video of when Americans and Germans teamed up to free that castle. I tell people about it and I get "bullshit Will, it never happened".
It was called the Battle for Castle Itter, I believe.
Several people have made videos about castle itter. Mark Felton to name one.
Slugs? Ok, internet liar
Your grandfather's sounded like good men. They are part of the greatest generation. You were very lucky to have known them.
Shooting parachutes of ejecting pilots is a war crime according to the geneva convention. So I doubt that he didn't like shooting them. Just it was prohibited.
You have met some fascinating players in this drama of life. Can’t get any more reliable source than those who lived it.
1:09
My family lived near an important railway line in Germany, I was told there was a mobile flak unit on the Railway with heavy guns ( AFAIK 105 mm ) and they shot down a lot of the passing bombers.
Once a train was strafed near the village by fighter bombers, some of the victims of this attack are buried on our cemetery and most of them where civilians.
This is a subject rarely talked about. Than you for discussing this. I've only heard about Big Bertha myself
It really gets me when I put down thank you and I end up getting than you. Thanks spell checker. Or should I thank U TUBE.
Excellent and informative video about a seldom-discussed aspect of the war. Thanks for providing this!
Thank You Colin for covering another interesting subject. Best Wishes to You and Your Family.
Thanks Colin for another great video and for sharing the pilots' stories.
Brilliant episode. I had only recently learned of flak trains when reading about the 2nd Marine (Kriegsmarine) Division's defence of Hamburg in 1945.
Thanks for watching
@@FORGOTTENHISTORYCHANNEL👍👏
one of these armour trains was in the film ...the train staring burt lancaster brilliant ww2 movie check it out@@FORGOTTENHISTORYCHANNEL
@@FORGOTTENHISTORYCHANNEL
Thanks Colin, that was great! I’d like to know more ab their air defense in depth and what they should’ve done differently- (which is almost certainly to have had their own long range strategic bomber). Don’t know if you’ll get this as my comms are being held in T.O. then either released or Yeeted into Winston’s Memory Hole. Cheers
There are books devoted to this subject,it wasn’t just the Germans that employed such weapons
Interesting -- thanks for posting. Videos like this help me fill in a lot of the many gaps in my knowledge of the war.
Very interesting lesson. It amazes e what pilots were able to do as they dealt with various forms of ground fire.
A very interesting aspect of the war thats not often covered or even mentioned in history.
You're right. No one ever talks about the railways and their role in WWII.
I think everything important has already been commented, but I do appreciate former and active military people talking with respect in regards of their former or current enemies or adversaries. Kind of the warrior poet. I appreciate that highly. As for the rest, great mini documentary. Thank you, will subscribe!
PS: I'd love to see real or dramatized footage (movie, series?) about a train defending properly, couldn't find out in YT just yet, all train attack videos are successful and full of winning glory kind of propaganda stuff, nobody retaliates them back. It must've been a terrified experience to get answered like that.
Très bon reportage bien renseigné,avec beaucoup de références et précisions fort à propos,visiblement la suite! Tchuss,pierro 😊
Professor Heaton, I thought I had a decent knowledge level of WWII history, but I had never heard of this.
You never fail to impress.
Thanks!
Another banger episode mr Colin. I guess it’s just old habits but I just enjoy your episodes on the channel a bit more
Incredible that we can still talk to veterans from WWII. It seems so far away from modern society. They won't be around for much longer.
Wow! Incredible! I'm not sure if General George S. Patton really said it, but George C. Scott said it in the movie, "Compared to war, all of man's endeavors pale to insignificance." Thanks for sharing this incredible video! What an distinct privilege to have met all these warriors.
My father hated the Nazis. But he was a ME109 fighter. So he was not shot from the Gestapo.
He was send in Rumainia from 1941 to 1943.
So he shot down americans Bombers in the operation "Tital Wave" .
Enjoyed the video , great content well delivered .
Great video! Thanks! Nice way to start my day!!
Glad you enjoyed it!
How refreshing to hear an American acknowledge that other countries, especially the Commonwealth, took part in WW2. Even British programs like to say Britain "stood alone" when in fact a vast Empire fought to help stop the Nazis and the genocide. And then America joined in.
British, Canadian and Australia stood together from 1939. American joined after the pearl harbour fiasco, only 23 days away from 1942.
America had joined in by supplying y’all despite the fact that the public was extremely adverse to our involvement in yet another GB v Germany pissing match. Without lend lease there’d have been a very different outcome, even Soviet generals have admitted this. Without FDR being as fanatically rabid for war with Germany as Churchill, we may have managed to avoid it. I’m proud of what we did, believing what we were told, but know not to believe a word about Hitler-Putin, Hitler-Trump, the apoplectic frenzy to supply Ukraine- a lose LOSE situation.
And btw, you ought to look into a memo circulated by the Ministry of info to the parsons, BBC, et al, re that alleged unforgivable, as well as into the Firebombing of non military civilian targets and Churchill’s obsession with trying to find any excuse to begin terror bombing German civilians, if your going to praise Holy Wars and use one as the excuse for the other, just before you get so high and mighty self righteous. The victors always write the script for how History is “remembered”. Patton wouldn’t have said what he said after liberating such places had he believed what you do. There’s boxcar trains worth of research, including admissions from the people running those places caught on video by Jewish researchers, that has long debunked this, but, don’t get off your adze and do any non biased research, just assume your right, and be smug in the comfort of your false paradigm like I was. Till I finally did and wasn’t.
I knew literally nothing about this at all. This is super interesting
Curtis LeMay has an interesting and rather troubling connection with the unorthodox manner in which the AR15 and M16 was introduced as the next US combat rifle. With McNamara pushing the issue, long established standards and procedures of the US Army were circumvented and the first batch of AR/M16's were actually purchased by the USAF.
Thanks for watching
Concise, informative and no wasted time.Just how I like it! New subscriber.
Awesome, thank you!
Very good history lesson. I look forward to watching more from you.
Awesome, thank you!
Always learning something new.
Great information. Loved the video. Thank you.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Great video Colin, learned something I didn’t know, and I have read about 150 different history type books in 30years or more.
Fantastic!
Colin,i am so glad you showed the german radar guided flak cannons.A lot of people told me germans did not have such tech.Very,very, few people know of the radar guided flak cannons the germans had,and they were very deadly.Thanks for clearing that up,once and for all.
My pleasure!
When I am driving this truck is get a notification of a new episode on here from forgotten history it makes my day brighter
Video caught me off guard so have not double checked but seem to recall another personality who am sure also flew multiple bombing missions, Hall of Fame coach Tom Landry.
That was a not much mentioned fact of WWII: German trains in the antiaircraft defence of the III Reich. Most grateful for it!
Love how you stuff in a photo of British GWR Pannier tanks and other locos as damaged German trains.... and a BR Shunter.
That was a photo layout error
Watched a doco yesterday about a bomber raid coming in at low level trying to hit a oil plant in the Caucasus taken out by a flack train.
Awesome
Is that the famous B24 Liberator photo over the chimney top in Ploesti, Romania?
@@androidemulator6952 It was a doco not photo, I think that may of been the target if the raid left Africa and was seen by German spies & they knew they were coming. Pretty sure it was Ploesti.
Another informative story thanks Colin. I am so glad that you do the narration yourself and haven't gone the way of channels who use AI voices, voices that cannot pronounce a myriad of words correctly to the point where I immediately move to another channel as soon as I hear the AI voice, I HATE it!
Nicely done,,thanks for sharing this history..😊
Thanks for watching
G’Day Colin. Nice to be back to the Most Deadly series (I’m so sick of Most Corrupt). Sorry to hear about Hermann. BTW can I inquire if you could be so nice as to do a show on the German V3 cannon please.
Hey Croc. We have a few things lines up, and we have to try and figure out which topics will generate the most views.
Great vid. I've heard that on the D day beaches the main reason for success was due primarily the numbers of troops. German soldiers were shooting so much that barrels melted. So basically the allies just through troops at the beach until they overwhelmed the Germans. Scary tactics. Can you make a vid covering just how brutal the fighting was?
that had been covered pretty heavily.
It was a numbers game. if every 4th or 5th car was a flak car the carrying capacity of the train was down by 20%. Not every train was attacked so that’s a big decrease in capacity. Strategic win!
Thank you again Colin, for presenting history with the truth.
Thanks for watching
No longer forgotten history 😊
Can u do a video about the tankbattle at Brody Ukraine during WW2? It is said to have been a larger battle then Kursk. Maybe you can investigate this Colin? Thnx for this great video!
We will consider. Thanks for the suggestion
Good video, not many videos about WW 2 war trains on youtube.
Thanks for watching
I still enjoy playing those 16-bit games which incorporated these hardware.
Thanks for watching
Amazing considering the Radar of Nazi Germany was less effective or advanced than the Allies had , trains are indeed a fast way to move detection equipment especially at night.
Thank you for this amazing history Sir.
Thanks for watching
Except Germans invented phased array radar...and everyone uses it nowadays.
I had family on both sides in Europe WW2. One grandfather was a company comander 2nd SS panzers.
Great video about trains! Mike from Missouri
Thank you very much!
9:37 the follow through after your hiccup shows your dedication! 😜
Love you content and honesty your appreciation for ww2 history and your willingness to share your knowledge, makes me consider myself lucky for finding your channel.
And sorry just had to give you a hard time. Keep up the great work! I hate I became interested in this period of history so late in my life. Because boy oh boy there’s a lot to know and learn. But I enjoy learning new stuff everyday, thanks to people like you!
Thanks for that. Never knew about the" black knight train" .
My great grandfather won 5 medals during the North African campaign & later the invasion of Italy. Very cool person.
My dad was awarded the silver star. When I was young he educated me that you don't " win" medals! It wasn't a game or contest. Just a kind heads up about your choice of words. And I salute your grandfather's service!
@@richardgallagher913 your father sounds like a great man. thank you for the info, i appreciate it. if you don't mind me asking, which theater did your dad fight in?
Europe Admiral. I have a pic of him receiving the medal in France, And Thank You! The Greatest Generation!@@admiraleveleigh8573
@@richardgallagher913your absolutely right, and I commend your gracious, humble response to the original poster! Just thought that was a really kind but precise way to correct, rather educate, the young man/lady on the verbiage of his statement! Kudos to you sir! Medals are never won, War is never a game. Most Medal recipients in reality had lost or sacrificed more than your average was willing to bargain, and so for this they are recognized & then awarded for those selfless actions. Ironically, losing- what matters the most- is what gets the Medals!
Please do a video on 30th ID during the great wars mostly ww2 I think we should shine a light on the reserve component of our military we give the spotlight to the spec ops community and we forget the struggle and lack of support for the other components and we should be more aware of what they do if it wasn’t for the guard the GWOT war’s would have needed a draft but the reserve component was used and forgotten
Another banger, sir!!
Appreciate it!
This the best channel sir thank you for all your hard work 🇺🇸
Never heard of this German AA weapons operations with a dedicated train. Thanks a lot!
Heavy AA gun is very impractical to move, and the allied did plane the bomber rout to avoid concentrations of heavy AA guns, the train did give the heavy AA guns a ability to move and "ambush" the bombers.
Very interesting video Colin. Do you have the text/audio/video of interviews those interviews. The thing I liked about The World at War series was the interviews with those who were actually there. Anyway, cheers.
I have a few cassettes that survived time, many lost during divorce, but many just did not survive time. All were transcripted though.
Really interesting!
great vid
great video
Really enjoyed this episode. Thanks.
Our pleasure!
Thank you
Welcome!
Finally,a clear and concise account of a little known piece of military history.
And also, I must commend you on your mastery of communication. Almost all of the dialogue in the videos are unable to follow using CC. Being half Def, I thank you for your professionalism.
PS: especially the lack of fillers.
Thank you kindly
Mr. Heaton, knew you back when you were Sargent Heaton. Henderson Hall. Glad to see you are doing well.
Thanks for watching
The diesel train at 11:14 is a POST WW2 V200. The DESIGN started in the 1950s. It has no place in stuff about WW2
Thanks for the correction
Deutsche Bahn is post war - Reichsbahn during and later in the GDR.
Hey prof. Heaton, did you utilize footage from any movies or tv series in your presentation this time? If so, which one(s)? Some of the footage you incorporated into this episode looked incredible... i need more sir!! Semper Fi
We outsource the editing. Thanks for watching. Semper Fi
@05:21 is a picture of a British Railways Class 03 Diesel shunter which entered service on 12th of February1958 at Cambridge depot.
Trouble locating shots
Talk about multitasking...fly n a plane on a battle of gun fire and still have thought enough to use a new system and come out alive much respect
Thanks for watching
They were defenseless, when on the move.. rendering them useless.
Only worth something, in the minds of enemies
Thank you for a most informative video. Yo have earned a sub from me . :)
Awesome, thank you!
Good stuff !
Thanks!
Thank you for the informative video. I didn't know that the Germans employed trains like this. I knew of Hitler's personal train and 1 or 2 others of the high command until your video. Your work is much appreciated. Been liking every video of yours I've watched.
WOW! I just thought I knew about German armor trains? The radar trains are a new one on me! The info on this channel is crazy!
the ww2 move ....THE TRAIN staring burt lancaster had one of these armour trains in it brilliant movie
@@eamonnquigley2125 that was a good movie!
yes mark its one of my favourites ..i read somewhere i forget lancaster said it wasone off his best movie .... ...brilliant@@DarkTerritory71
04:30 it is not AA gun, it is a 10,5 cm howitzer on the panzer 38 base
08:19 it is not AA train, it is captured soviet A-train
Thanks for the corrections
Beautiful Train
Those German 88’s was one mean weapon
The 88 is the most famous but not the most deadliest,the Krupp 128 was a much more of a monster than the 88 and was very capable of bringing down high level bombers combined with radar tracking systems that existed,also the Krupp 105 was also deployed as anti tank guns when American & British tanks began to penetrate into Germany and the wide open fields were a killing ground for them …..
Colin, one of these trains was depicted in "Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny".
Speaking of historical armored train have you covered Britain’s smallest armored train that was in action during WW2?
No just focused on flak trains
The Chinese also had them ….
That looks like a growth weapons industry product line, war trains.
I feel like the armored trains where mainly used in the east
A literal mobile flak battery, how cool!
Maybe do a vid about the Port Chicago disaster of 1944
That is a good subject, thanks.
Interesting.
the ww2 movie THE TRAIN ... had a brilliant german armour train in it .. check it out brilliant
Dr Heaton's story is very interesting. Sadly the video is repeatedly let down by totally inept choice of video and stills. To give but three examples: at 5:24 D2009 was not German but a British Railways diesel shunter built in 1957; at 8:01 (and elsewhere) 30493 was not German but a British Railways 4-8-0T shunter; at 10:48 the carriage shown is clearly not German - it says "sleeping car" on the side.
I dont think a Boulton Paul Defiant would have been used yet alone a BR Diesel locomotive , note the late BR crest on the side
Readily available images.
Thanks for watching
As I recall, (past life memories) I ran the railway in southern Germany during the war. My name was "Wulfmeiser" as best I can remember. I was definitely a commanding officer, possibly a colonel. So I was involved with supporting the southern campaigns, Switzerland, Italy, and so forth. I was executed at war's end, the charge was "hindering the war effort" but really the Nazis were just covering their tracks, as I knew to much, and was regular army (Grey) not a Nazi (black), and therefore expendable. I was reborn a Canadian in this life, so remembrance day is always interesting for me.
😊
Thanks for watching
This reminds me of von Sturmgeist's armored train level from Medal of Honor: Frontline.
Thanks for watching
I have never seen a military train in a World War movie. It would be cool if they had one... With modern technology (drones for land/sea/air) I'm surprised that nations haven't created new military trains form the ground up, because they would be more capable of defending themselves and their tracks then ever before.
It was customary in German trains to camouflage the loco and put a dummy "loco" in front of the train. In which a few Hitler youth and a smoke generator were placed. The American fighter usually pounded the unfortunate youth in the "locos" to mincemeat, whereas the engineer of the real loco had a lid cover so as to dampen the smoke emission. The death toll of the Hitler youth was appalling. Years later the North Koreans adopted that stratagemn too. They also added concealed flak on railcars.
North Korea!
A random selection of German, British and American train pictures.
Super
Thanks
Even when not full of weapons. German trains 1940-1945 were lethal. Especially the cattle trains saw a lot deaths
True
They also carried either an armored car or tank to deal with resistance or partisan attacks……
@ 2:55 there is what appears to be a clock with a representation of the world on it. Does anyone know more about this?
No info on it
if they just space out the train cars so they not bunch up as one big target like tank drivers do from air air 75 mm
...👏🎉🎯💯👍❗ also for the algorithm.
Thanks for watching
...I always save them to my history and science playlist.
Flak trains?? RAF Bomber Command fought the skies over Germany single handed all the way to mid-1944 as the USAAF couldn't fly in cloud, or over Germany, or without 100s of escort fighters until the last year of the war. This put a huge additional burden on the RAF.
RAF did not try precision bombing and did not fly in formations, they area bombed and flew in streams