Oh my goodness! When i realized that was Oakwood. Haha i was freaking out. Nice to see another lefty showing me how it's done. Im a little bit of a beginner but your videos are fantastic! You've got my subscription.
Haha glad you enjoyed!!! I can tell you I normally do not take those lines 😅. Usually just a forehand (hole 13 I think it is at least). Thank you for the support!!
I love watching your videos. I'm a lefty and I also live in the Twin Cities. It's great to watch you test discs left handed on the exact holes I play. Anyway you were playing Oakwood, which I play at least once a week, weather permitting. My buddy plays the Heat on most of the holes there and swears by it. I have a Titanium Avenger SS that I mainly use for a roller disc and never use it at Oakwood. Your video makes me want to give it a try on 13 and 18.
I will say the line I took on 13 is definitely not one I’ll take normally (if I’m thinking of the right shot). It took let’s just say a couple takes to get the correct turnover lines 😂. I mostly will just go flat FH and crash through the trees to the basket.
@@CheatingLeftyDiscGolf My normal play on 13 is an anhyzer Thunderbird. I get a decent flex line. I still end up near the woods on the right side though. I'm hoping to figure something out that'll put me more left.
Funny the avenger ss was one of my first disc and i remember when the heat came out i got it in ace race plastic which i feel its zflx. Abd i had it in z flex and big z and z. I got out my avenger ss out of tge closet its been almost 10 years since i used it got my heat out 3 months ago. Out of the 2 i got to go with the heat. Its more forgiving and feels better in my big hands. It seems more stable,more glide,and just a Awsome disc
I've been re-training my body to throw correctly as possible for 9 months now. I am maxed out at 310-340 right now. I am training with 8 Heats (Z,ESP) 8 Avenger ss(Z,ESP) and 8 Axiom Virus Neuton plastic. I love them all. I get the most S curve shots from the Virus and Heat for my arm spread. I'm also training with 8 Axiom Proxy Putters( Firm, Neutron, R2, Glow). Love your channel bro.
@@juiceboxxtm9848 Virus #1 Heat #2 Avenger ss #3. The Axiom discs just have that little extra spin with the weight on the outer rim. The virus is a flat disc also. The Z plastic Heat and Average are a domed top that are the most understandable for that plastic line. The ESP plastic are flatter and a tad more stable that Z. I love all three discs.
i have a bit more confidence throwing the AvengerSS over the Heat. The Heat is finicky to nose angle, making it a bit of a pain to launch, but has a bit more glide and turn, which is great unless you have a tunnel shot. That slow late turn really makes the AvengerSS a great disc to work slow turns and late gaps you encounter.
So fun! Anecdotal facts i bag three avenger SS's and one of them is in the x-soft plastic, which is by far my favorite. It will turn and burn if you've got enough arm speed. No questions asked. However, for my slow arm it gives me a beautiful ass curve and pops up every time in the woods
That is very true, and honestly I throw the Heat over the Avenger SS as well. But while I feel the Heat is better for specific shots (rollers, backhand), the Avenger SS offers more shot selection for slower arms (backhand and forehand)
I bought an esp scorch a couple weeks ago and it's domey and stiff. Very touchy give it Annie and it turns over and hyzer it barely stands up. So I bought esp heat yesterday and it's flat and what I was looking for. Give it hyzer stands up and turns but comes back. Hades turns over and never comes back. 375ft. Scorch is good on flat 4hand
@@CheatingLeftyDiscGolf mine is flying perfect now esp beats in a little very fast but stays there for a long time. Heat flys alota like my mamba did. Hyzer flip to a big glidey turn but finishes on Lil hyzer angle so it don't get away from me
@@CheatingLeftyDiscGolf Big z vulture has become my workhorse. It's like my star firebird with a little more glide. I can flex it skip it flip it to flat.
Great video...I received a Ledgestone Metallic Avenger SS in the Trash Panda disc swap...liking it so far! But I have also thrown an ESP Heat and liked it for my noodle arm...just easy to get it to go right for rhbh! Merry Christmas to you and your family!!
Thank you! Hope you had a great Christmas!! I forgot about the recent Ledgestone run! I bet in that plastic it would have some great stability to it. Love how you can get such a range of shots just from changing plastics!
Great review thank you CL! I have a stack of titanium heats; they have a really nice stability to them. Seem like a more stable version than what someone might expect just fyi happy holidays !
Sometimes at a hole, Instinct would say Heat. Avenger ss in the bag during these instances. But it wasn't until I've seen you compare them that the WHY my adaptive unconscious was like. Nope,, this isn't an Aventer ss straight shot, where's the Heat? This is a great video and thanks
I agree with you about how these lovely discs compare. I don't own either right now, but my underworld flies similar to a heat, and the sidewinder isn't too different from the A ss
the Underworld is technically a 9speed, but sometimes manufacturers will down the speed category so that it's not compared to peers that get more distance (River is another example of this, and many more out there, but no one manufacturer has a monopoly on this practice). 7 speed with a super impressive 6 glide sells so much better than a 9 speed with 4 glide, doesn't it? And you advanced players will never know the difference, because you have the arm speed to throw a 9s with ease - so if it doesn't go as far as other 9 speeds for you, you'll just chalk it up to being limited by your armspeed and the disc being a "7'. However, beginner players will notice, when their "7 speed" inexplicably hyzers out - and yet they can throw a Leopard3 or something like that just fine.
Amazing insight! I always thought it was weird that the underworld is a "7 speed" for how far it goes. I really like underworlds, but they're expensive and I lose a LOT of discs I'll really buy any of these Understable 6 - 9s... never know exactly how they're going to fly, it's kinda specific to each individual disc, not just the model. I do like beefy individuals of understable molds because they have amazing glide for something (relatively) OS, so it's never a loss getting a stable sidewinder, Avenger ss, heat, etc
You throw lefty and Righty over 300ft? That's awesome!. I'm from Hutchinson here in MN too. I'm a noodle arm and the Avenger SS has been my go to distance driver pretty much ever since it came came out. Straight as an arrow for me. I will throw a Heat if I want to throw a turnover because it will hold an anny line a lot better than an Avenger SS but I don't throw the Heat that much. I will say that the glide the Heat has can make it amazing with a tailwind. How would you compare an Avenger SS to a Thrasher?
I wish I could throw righty that well!!! I just mirror the lefty throw to get get righty perspective. Thrasher is faster and more low speed fade then the Avenger SS. Depending on arm speed the Thrasher will go a bit longer, but if one is a slower arm they will go about the same distance. Avenger SS might even get more for slower arms since it is easier to get up to speed. I know for myself they are about equal distance wise. Maybe one out of 10 throws I get a noticeable 20-30ft increase with the Thrasher.
I have a beat in flat 167g Z Heat and it’s stupid stable. I’m at 5k feet, but still. Can’t get it to flip. 176g Sting turns way more. My Z Avenger SS turns more than this Heat I’ve had for two years and used as my primary driver for a long time.
What disc weight would you recommend for a beginner player trying a distance driver like the heat for the first time. I’m over 50 my arm speed for backhand is terrible considering I played competitive ball. I can throw a forehand over 275 but backhand it’s awful. Should I just keep throwing putters or maybe try discs from divergent discs which are very under stable to work on my backhand.
nah man try backhands even though youre forehand dominant. I did the same thing [fh dominant] and went from 200 to 330 this year backhand. My suggestion is get a mako3 for your first backhand thrower. You learn angles and how to throw hard. Then I moved to the avenger SS for easy S throws, but I love my very neutral essence as well. I mostly play wooded courses.
ESP Heat 165 to 170 is money and will help you get your backhand up to speed and help you learn how to hyzer flip and throw turnovers. The Innova Sidewinder and Infinite Sphinx are very similar to a heat also. You could also start with a 7 speed like a Westside Underworld or DGA Vortex easier to get up to speed and similar flights to the heat as well.
Would love to see a latitude 64 Fury vs Heat. {(Westside disc's?) Underworld or Tursas} vs Lat 64 Maul Kastaplast Lots vs Falk If I had 3 cheating lefty disc golf wishes
Lattitude 64 vision is a awesome disc. I still bag it but sadly it's out of production. The vision is very accurate just a nice disc for my back hands and I can also go forhand with it.
Let's be honest: us beginners won't need these discs to hold a hyzer line, as we've all got discs in our bag that do that just fine. That's not what we'd buy this disc for. (edit: and we don't have the arm-speed to hyzer-flip a 9-10 speed)
A very underrated shot in disc golf is the hyzer flip to not quite flat that pushes forward instead of just dumping. Knowing how a disc will react for you on any angle you release it on is very important. One might buy a disc to be understable and to use for turnovers, but knowing how to utilize all your discs in any situation improves one’s game immensely.
@@CheatingLeftyDiscGolf indeed. but a "beginner" doesn't have the arm-speed to hyzer-flip a 9 speed (btw I measured my Heat, it's a 19.5mm rim, so one might even argue it to be a 9.5speed), These are targeted at beginners who are looking for a 'cheat code' to up their distance. You could counter that an advanced player might get one for longer anhyzer lines, and that' possiblebut they're probably throwing more -2 1 on an anny line. And when not, side-arming something stable.
Was the Heat 😂😅😉 Heat is better for specific situations, while Avenger SS would be better in a 1 disc challenge since for most players it can hit more overall lines.
@@youblowtubes there is one posted from this summer. Just search for Cheating Lefty In the Bag 2022. It will definitely be different in 2023, but I’ll do an updated one in the late Spring/early Summer.
Great video. Short, sweet,and answered about everything I needed to know thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
Heat over avenger ss here. Of course that might have something to do with my first ace being with a heat.
Great disc to get an ace with!!!
Oh my goodness! When i realized that was Oakwood. Haha i was freaking out. Nice to see another lefty showing me how it's done. Im a little bit of a beginner but your videos are fantastic! You've got my subscription.
Haha glad you enjoyed!!! I can tell you I normally do not take those lines 😅. Usually just a forehand (hole 13 I think it is at least).
Thank you for the support!!
btw, this vid is super well done. showing all the shots and lines (not in an open field) was great, and a nice complement to the lefty-lines part
Thank you! Hoping to get more out like this in the near future!
I love watching your videos. I'm a lefty and I also live in the Twin Cities. It's great to watch you test discs left handed on the exact holes I play. Anyway you were playing Oakwood, which I play at least once a week, weather permitting. My buddy plays the Heat on most of the holes there and swears by it. I have a Titanium Avenger SS that I mainly use for a roller disc and never use it at Oakwood. Your video makes me want to give it a try on 13 and 18.
I will say the line I took on 13 is definitely not one I’ll take normally (if I’m thinking of the right shot). It took let’s just say a couple takes to get the correct turnover lines 😂. I mostly will just go flat FH and crash through the trees to the basket.
@@CheatingLeftyDiscGolf My normal play on 13 is an anhyzer Thunderbird. I get a decent flex line. I still end up near the woods on the right side though. I'm hoping to figure something out that'll put me more left.
timberwolf is the beeest, love the way u show the discs next to eachother, better then most
Thank you!!!!
Funny the avenger ss was one of my first disc and i remember when the heat came out i got it in ace race plastic which i feel its zflx. Abd i had it in z flex and big z and z. I got out my avenger ss out of tge closet its been almost 10 years since i used it got my heat out 3 months ago. Out of the 2 i got to go with the heat. Its more forgiving and feels better in my big hands. It seems more stable,more glide,and just a Awsome disc
I've been re-training my body to throw correctly as possible for 9 months now. I am maxed out at 310-340 right now. I am training with 8 Heats (Z,ESP) 8 Avenger ss(Z,ESP) and 8 Axiom Virus Neuton plastic. I love them all. I get the most S curve shots from the Virus and Heat for my arm spread. I'm also training with 8 Axiom Proxy Putters( Firm, Neutron, R2, Glow). Love your channel bro.
Best of luck in the training and thank you for the support!!! Now that I’m not Discraft exclusive, I should take a look at the virus
Which of the 3 do you find your most accurate with and which one gets you max distance for your current arm speed.
@@juiceboxxtm9848 Virus #1 Heat #2 Avenger ss #3. The Axiom discs just have that little extra spin with the weight on the outer rim. The virus is a flat disc also. The Z plastic Heat and Average are a domed top that are the most understandable for that plastic line. The ESP plastic are flatter and a tad more stable that Z. I love all three discs.
i have a bit more confidence throwing the AvengerSS over the Heat. The Heat is finicky to nose angle, making it a bit of a pain to launch, but has a bit more glide and turn, which is great unless you have a tunnel shot. That slow late turn really makes the AvengerSS a great disc to work slow turns and late gaps you encounter.
So fun! Anecdotal facts i bag three avenger SS's and one of them is in the x-soft plastic, which is by far my favorite. It will turn and burn if you've got enough arm speed. No questions asked. However, for my slow arm it gives me a beautiful ass curve and pops up every time in the woods
X-Soft Avenger SS!?!???!? That sounds amazing!!!
Such a good review. Super helpful. Comparison reviews are the best. Thanks
Glad it was helpful!
Thanks for the comparison info.
Mn courses for the win!!
Some of the best out there!!! We are lucky!
As the goat dropped it from his signature discs list
That is very true, and honestly I throw the Heat over the Avenger SS as well. But while I feel the Heat is better for specific shots (rollers, backhand), the Avenger SS offers more shot selection for slower arms (backhand and forehand)
I bought an esp scorch a couple weeks ago and it's domey and stiff. Very touchy give it Annie and it turns over and hyzer it barely stands up. So I bought esp heat yesterday and it's flat and what I was looking for. Give it hyzer stands up and turns but comes back. Hades turns over and never comes back. 375ft. Scorch is good on flat 4hand
I've bought alota discraft lately. Esp Zeus is my favorite other than the meteor. Zeus is glidey and flys pretty straight on slight hyzer release
Try a Z or Glo Scorch.
Flat Heats are the best! Older Z flat ones are like a mini Raptor for me 😅
@@CheatingLeftyDiscGolf mine is flying perfect now esp beats in a little very fast but stays there for a long time. Heat flys alota like my mamba did. Hyzer flip to a big glidey turn but finishes on Lil hyzer angle so it don't get away from me
@@CheatingLeftyDiscGolf Big z vulture has become my workhorse. It's like my star firebird with a little more glide. I can flex it skip it flip it to flat.
Great video...I received a Ledgestone Metallic Avenger SS in the Trash Panda disc swap...liking it so far! But I have also thrown an ESP Heat and liked it for my noodle arm...just easy to get it to go right for rhbh! Merry Christmas to you and your family!!
Thank you! Hope you had a great Christmas!!
I forgot about the recent Ledgestone run! I bet in that plastic it would have some great stability to it. Love how you can get such a range of shots just from changing plastics!
Great review thank you CL! I have a stack of titanium heats; they have a really nice stability to them. Seem like a more stable version than what someone might expect just fyi happy holidays !
TI Heats sound amazing!!!
The Heat is just the greatest.
A true glide 6.
They are so good! Doubt I’ll ever be able to replace it.
@@CheatingLeftyDiscGolf yes my dude
Sometimes at a hole, Instinct would say Heat. Avenger ss in the bag during these instances. But it wasn't until I've seen you compare them that the WHY my adaptive unconscious was like. Nope,, this isn't an Aventer ss straight shot, where's the Heat?
This is a great video and thanks
I agree with you about how these lovely discs compare. I don't own either right now, but my underworld flies similar to a heat, and the sidewinder isn't too different from the A ss
When I used to throw Trilogy I loved the Underworld! I’ll have to give it a toss again!
the Underworld is technically a 9speed, but sometimes manufacturers will down the speed category so that it's not compared to peers that get more distance (River is another example of this, and many more out there, but no one manufacturer has a monopoly on this practice).
7 speed with a super impressive 6 glide sells so much better than a 9 speed with 4 glide, doesn't it? And you advanced players will never know the difference, because you have the arm speed to throw a 9s with ease - so if it doesn't go as far as other 9 speeds for you, you'll just chalk it up to being limited by your armspeed and the disc being a "7'. However, beginner players will notice, when their "7 speed" inexplicably hyzers out - and yet they can throw a Leopard3 or something like that just fine.
Amazing insight!
I always thought it was weird that the underworld is a "7 speed" for how far it goes.
I really like underworlds, but they're expensive and I lose a LOT of discs
I'll really buy any of these Understable 6 - 9s... never know exactly how they're going to fly, it's kinda specific to each individual disc, not just the model.
I do like beefy individuals of understable molds because they have amazing glide for something (relatively) OS, so it's never a loss getting a stable sidewinder, Avenger ss, heat, etc
You throw lefty and Righty over 300ft? That's awesome!.
I'm from Hutchinson here in MN too.
I'm a noodle arm and the Avenger SS has been my go to distance driver pretty much ever since it came came out. Straight as an arrow for me. I will throw a Heat if I want to throw a turnover because it will hold an anny line a lot better than an Avenger SS but I don't throw the Heat that much. I will say that the glide the Heat has can make it amazing with a tailwind.
How would you compare an Avenger SS to a Thrasher?
I wish I could throw righty that well!!! I just mirror the lefty throw to get get righty perspective.
Thrasher is faster and more low speed fade then the Avenger SS. Depending on arm speed the Thrasher will go a bit longer, but if one is a slower arm they will go about the same distance. Avenger SS might even get more for slower arms since it is easier to get up to speed. I know for myself they are about equal distance wise. Maybe one out of 10 throws I get a noticeable 20-30ft increase with the Thrasher.
I like both but when it comes to hand feel I prefer the Heat. I guess I would have normal to larger hands.
For backhand I definitely like the Heat as well!(main reason I use it).
I have a beat in flat 167g Z Heat and it’s stupid stable. I’m at 5k feet, but still. Can’t get it to flip. 176g Sting turns way more. My Z Avenger SS turns more than this Heat I’ve had for two years and used as my primary driver for a long time.
Some of the older Z Heats were like that! I have a flat Z I used back in 2019 that I could never get to turn unless tossed on an anhyzer line.
I am a beginner but bag an avenger and man that thing flies straight as an arrow with slight hyzer fade at end.
They are sooo gooood!!!
What disc weight would you recommend for a beginner player trying a distance driver like the heat for the first time. I’m over 50 my arm speed for backhand is terrible considering I played competitive ball. I can throw a forehand over 275 but backhand it’s awful. Should I just keep throwing putters or maybe try discs from divergent discs which are very under stable to work on my backhand.
Try in the 168-170g range.
nah man try backhands even though youre forehand dominant. I did the same thing [fh dominant] and went from 200 to 330 this year backhand. My suggestion is get a mako3 for your first backhand thrower. You learn angles and how to throw hard. Then I moved to the avenger SS for easy S throws, but I love my very neutral essence as well. I mostly play wooded courses.
ESP Heat 165 to 170 is money and will help you get your backhand up to speed and help you learn how to hyzer flip and throw turnovers. The Innova Sidewinder and Infinite Sphinx are very similar to a heat also. You could also start with a 7 speed like a Westside Underworld or DGA Vortex easier to get up to speed and similar flights to the heat as well.
I’ve never thrown the heat, but I use my z avenger ss every round.
Heat
Would love to see a latitude 64 Fury vs Heat.
{(Westside disc's?) Underworld or Tursas} vs Lat 64 Maul
Kastaplast Lots vs Falk
If I had 3 cheating lefty disc golf wishes
I have a couple of those discs, so could probably make this happen!
Lattitude 64 vision is a awesome disc. I still bag it but sadly it's out of production. The vision is very accurate just a nice disc for my back hands and I can also go forhand with it.
Avenger over heat.
Latitude 64 Maul
Let's be honest: us beginners won't need these discs to hold a hyzer line, as we've all got discs in our bag that do that just fine.
That's not what we'd buy this disc for. (edit: and we don't have the arm-speed to hyzer-flip a 9-10 speed)
A very underrated shot in disc golf is the hyzer flip to not quite flat that pushes forward instead of just dumping. Knowing how a disc will react for you on any angle you release it on is very important. One might buy a disc to be understable and to use for turnovers, but knowing how to utilize all your discs in any situation improves one’s game immensely.
@@CheatingLeftyDiscGolf indeed. but a "beginner" doesn't have the arm-speed to hyzer-flip a 9 speed (btw I measured my Heat, it's a 19.5mm rim, so one might even argue it to be a 9.5speed), These are targeted at beginners who are looking for a 'cheat code' to up their distance.
You could counter that an advanced player might get one for longer anhyzer lines, and that' possiblebut they're probably throwing more -2 1 on an anny line. And when not, side-arming something stable.
Whats in your bag?
Was the Heat 😂😅😉 Heat is better for specific situations, while Avenger SS would be better in a 1 disc challenge since for most players it can hit more overall lines.
@@CheatingLeftyDiscGolf your whole bag. wheres the in the bag video
@@youblowtubes there is one posted from this summer. Just search for Cheating Lefty In the Bag 2022. It will definitely be different in 2023, but I’ll do an updated one in the late Spring/early Summer.